The Family Photograph That Excludes, Part 2

by admin on September 8, 2013

I had to think long and hard about whether to post the second half of this story.   Frankly, MIL sounds like an internet troll and DIL “Tami” her willing accomplice to play an interesting spoof on Ehell readers. So many opinions touch on inflammatory themes trolls love to exploit, i.e. anti-Catholicism, homophobia, anti-breastfeeding, etc.   Can someone really be that obnoxious?  Yes, I’ve met a few over the  years.   Second, assuming this story is true, I realized that the pages of Ehell had become a battleground between these women who apparently have no ability to constructively resolve their issues face to face.   Some serious family counseling is needed.  Therefore, I’ve decided that I have let both women say their peace (Tami’s statements can be read in the comment section of the first part) and I will not be approving any further messages from these two embattled women.

I’m the woman who posted the story about my daughter in law crashing my family photo.

Some background on her.
She and my son got together when they were teenagers. They ‘fell in love’ and now they’ve been ‘married’ for 3 years.  When my son was 13 he decided he wanted to own his own contracting firm. He helped my husband on some of his jobs and realized her liked the work. However he was a bit more ambitious. However now he’s 29 and still works for someone else. He does make good money but she is the one who told him to stay in his current position.  After they got together she was over here or he was over at her house. I’d come home and there they were, on my couch, hogging the TV, and eating junk food constantly. I had to turn Sunday into family days just to spend some time without her there. She of course decided to retaliate with having my son over to spend time with HER family once a week.  Then they wanted to get an apartment together while they were in college. However I put a stop to that since my husband and I footed the bill for my son’s schooling. He did a trade school in two areas-contracting and landscape. Then he also took some economics and business courses at a community college. She got an art degree and is now a high school art teacher. She doesn’t make much yet she just bought a new car. My son must have paid for it.

Then their sham of a wedding took place. Completely tacky and on a beach. They had no bar whatsoever because she has relatives who would have taken advantage and gotten drunk. But they had a non-denominational service on a beach instead of a Catholic ceremony in a Catholic church so their marriage doesn’t even count. Now she’s pregnant and refuses to baptize the babies when they get here. Some nonsense about letting them choose their own faith when their older. I’m going to have to find a way to convince my son or take them myself. I’m not letting MY grandbabies go to hell because their mother is a heathen. It’s bad enough that they will be bastards in the eyes of god since their parents aren’t really married. 0905-13

Another thing! She won’t let me in the delivery room to see MY grandbabies come into the world. Her mother is upset too, she’s not allowed in either. In fact, she’s said she won’t even let us know when she’s in labor, they’ll tell us when the babies are born. THEN we have to wait at least TWO WEEKS to meet them. Too bad. She might be able to keep me out of her hospital room but i’m camping out in front of their house and will see those babies the second they get home. She’s also being completely selfish and breastfeeding just so I can’t feed them. She won’t name either baby after me. Not even a middle name. Some nonsense about giving the babies their own identity. That doesn’t even make sense. She refused a baby shower because she thinks they are ‘greedy’. She is having a party a few weeks after the babies get here instead with immediate family only. As in parents, grandparents, and siblings. I already invited my sister and her family as well as a few of my friends. If she has a problem with that then she can leave. To top it all off my granddaughters will have a green nursery. I warned my daughter in law that she was going to turn my grandbabies into tomboys or maybe even lesbians but she just laughed and said, ‘Well, what’s wrong with that?”
She’s practically forcing my grandbabies to be huge sinners on top of being unbaptized bastards. 0905-13

{ 156 comments… read them below or add one }

acr September 9, 2013 at 1:57 pm

ITA with Kate: “I agree that this is a troll, and it seems that someone went back and read every story on this website and included all of the controversial issues that come up between mothers in law and daughters in law. Did they also happen to get married on the Titanic?”

I almost wonder if the first letter was real, and the second letter is actually from the DiL.

The OP of the second letter sounds foaming-at-the-mouth crazy. While there are people who are like that, they usually have “justifications” for their behavior. There is usually a thin “veneer” of decency to hide the spite.

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girl_with_all_the_yarn September 9, 2013 at 2:18 pm

I am inclined to think this is a troll. If it’s the same email and IP address, that’s relatively easy to spoof online and even easier to get your hands on.

However, should this not be a troll but, in fact, a horrible person who thinks they will get internet support with this… then I must say that they are deluding themselves if they think they will receive any support from the denizens of the internet.

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Lisatoo September 9, 2013 at 2:20 pm

Sarah Jane, admin said she wouldn’t let new submissions from OP/Tammi through, so that might be the reason for the silence.
Also, I think a poster upthread misunderstood: not ‘both posted from the same computer’, but ‘each posted from the same (but different) IP they originally used.

Could very well be a troll, but I DO know somebody like this. You have NO idea how hateful some people can be, and also the level of narcism they have -in the sense that they see absolutely nothing wrong with some of the things they say, hence their eagerness to display their stupidity and general horrible behaviour-.
So if it’s real: Tami, only cutting off this person will help. She will slowly poison you, your husband, your life. Get a restraining order if you have to. It is justified.

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Gail September 9, 2013 at 2:37 pm

Is it possible that in the first letter, MIL was restrained, and simply trying to show what a grievous error in ettiquette her DIL had made? Not that I side with her in the slightest, MIL sounds like the worst MIL ever. Then, after reading all the negative comments about herself, the dam just broke and she spewed all of her hatred in a frenzy? Just cut loose and let it all rip?

I hope this whole thing is fake. I’ll sleep better tonight.

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ciotog September 9, 2013 at 2:39 pm

Tami posted this “Then my husband logged on to her email from his phone (he set it up for her) and then gave the url” in the comments below. So it could conceivably be her or her husband submitting this.

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Cerise September 9, 2013 at 2:58 pm

Having been no-contact with my own IL’s from Hades for well over 15 years and heard variants of all the same arguments, I tend to believe this is, unfortunately, real.

The tales I could tell would leave you all thinking I simply *had* to be making this stuff up. Nobody could be *that* bad – but they are. We do suspect MIL has some issues with mental health and SFIL, who passed away, may possibly have been a sociopath.

I post on another site where those of us who have people in our lives with personality disorders (both diagnosed and suspected) try to reclaim our lives and put up boundaries – the stylistic change is more or less *standard operating procedure* when a disordered person (suspected or diagnosed) is questioned as to truthfulness or told no.

It’s pretty typical for a person whose correspondence is impeccable in regard to grammar, punctuation, spelling, and sentence structure to fire off something that makes you wonder if it was even written by the same person. It means you hit a nerve and either angered or upset them. The gloves come off and the response is usually gruff, sometimes vulgar, self-serving and often riddled with mistakes.

I do hope the DIL finds the DIL Society or the Out of the Fog Forum.

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Ashley 2 September 9, 2013 at 3:21 pm

I really believe this is a troll as well; I refuse to believe there are people that are truly THIS clueless. It’s like they’re trying their hardest to make internet strangers laugh and cringe at them.

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AIP September 9, 2013 at 3:28 pm

Surely nobody could be this foul and not run over by everyone they’ve ever met- twice! This has to be trolling, surely.

However, being Catholic in a Catholic country I know plenty of nasty, vicious, hypocritical Holy Marys like this. They are so hell bent on being “good Catholics” that they make rotten Christians. Ironically enough I would struggle to grant them forgiveness, unless there was real contrition on the part of the “MIL”, which is highly unlikely.

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TimeLady September 9, 2013 at 3:34 pm

I’m joining in the other eHellions in crying “Troll!”, mainly because there are points brought up by “MIL/OP” are things that other people said in the comments section of the previous post*. Smells preeetty fishy to me.

*Eg: Commenter Ann, #181 September 6, 2013 at 5:08 pm –
“When we had children she was offended that she wasn’t in the delivery room, but my mother wasn’t either. It was a moment for just my husband and I.”

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AIP September 9, 2013 at 3:35 pm

“Another thing! She won’t let me in the delivery room to see MY grandbabies come into the world.”

Frankly I’m happy that this one isn’t on the same continent as me, nevermind in the delivery room with legs akimbo and pushing out *her* heathen-bastard-lesbian grandchildren!

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Michelle C Young September 9, 2013 at 3:58 pm

Tina – I tend to agree with you. Had someone written in, saying, “You won’t believe my MIL. Over the course of my relationship with my husband, she has said all of the following:” and then listed each of the OP’s complaints, one by one, perhaps in bulleted form, then we all would have believed the tale. Because we have all seen it.

Sadly, there truly are people out there who are this bad. They are just usually good at hiding most of it. But the little things add up. Over the course of several years, if one actually keeps track, the tally can become over-the-top, like this.

Why do we think this is a troll? Because it’s all put together in one vast rant.

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Katie September 9, 2013 at 4:10 pm

I feel like this is sort of plausible. There are people like this MIL who exist, unfortunately. She does manage to say EVERYTHING wrong, but then again, a truly awful person would.

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Lilac September 9, 2013 at 4:41 pm

The weird thing is that the style of this last diatribe is so not the style of the first post OR all the apparently reasonable and chatty replies Tami posted on the first entry. Very odd. Maybe someone here is off their meds.

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Jays September 9, 2013 at 4:57 pm

You know, if the OP had just resisted putting in almost EVERY hot-button bad MIL topic I’ve seen throughout the years on Ehell, I might have thought this was possible.

As it is? Troll. :/ Oh so very troll.

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babs September 9, 2013 at 5:22 pm

Yep. She’s a troll. She pulled out all the stops on this one just to get everyone riled up! T-R-O-L-L!

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Amy September 9, 2013 at 6:38 pm

This lady is either completely and utterly nuts and doesn’t realize it or this is a sham. But I know people like this who exist so I can’t rule her being a crazy nut job of a mother in law out just yet :P

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Marozia September 9, 2013 at 7:14 pm

Admin, are you testing us? This seems to me to be a test to see what we ‘out in troll-land’ will say. Is this OP for real? Weddings on a beach by a minister are still weddings, regardless of what your faith is. It makes no difference if you were married in a church or not. As for the children, OP is not the mother, so mind your own business.
If DIL believes baby showers are greedy, that’s her business, not OP’s. If she wants a green nursery, so what!!! Maybe you could go over there and paint the babies with blue, pink and yellow stripes!!
You, OP are a meddling old biddie!!! Mind your own business or it will be the worst for you. No sympathy for you here.
PS. Is this letter for REAL???!!??

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Amanda H. September 9, 2013 at 8:13 pm

My brain refuses to believe this was written by a real person, because the diatribe is just psychotic.

But seriously, green bedrooms make girls lesbians? (Assuming it means the color green and not “green” as in organic/all natural/solar-powered/etc.) Funny that, three of my sisters love green and had green wallpaper and the like in their rooms, and all three are happily married to men. Go figure.

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RooRoo September 9, 2013 at 8:41 pm

Oh, I find her utterly believable, unfortunately.

A PP posted: “They are so hell bent on being ‘good Catholics’ that they make rotten Christians.” Yes, that can be true – and certainly is of this MIL. I’m a Catholic myself, a convert. I know my faith well. She is right that the son & DIL’s marriage is not considered valid in the Church, and that (to Catholics) it is a tragedy that the girls will not be raised Catholic. HOWEVER….

She needs to take a look at her own self. We are supposed to be charitable, in its old-fashioned sense. That means we are to approach ALL people with love – like Jesus did! She should print out both letters and show them to her priest; he might just have a few words to tell her.

Who knows? Maybe if she had approached DIL back when she was in 6th grade with charity, welcomed her, and been a GOOD example of a Catholic, the kids might have married in the Church and be raising the babies Catholic. But no. She prefers to be a (expletive)-on-wheels. Her loss.

And it’s even possible that their marriage is valid. One can get a dispensation (permission) from the Bishop to be married outside the church, even with a non-Catholic minister. I’m sure DS won’t tell her if they did that. In his place, I wouldn’t. It wouldn’t make anything better.

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Pen^2 September 9, 2013 at 8:46 pm

The first part of this story only painted a picture of a very revolting woman, but this makes it crystal clear that it is a troll. I feel a lot better knowing this; thank goodness there isn’t a poor daughter-in-law out there somewhere subjected to such a horrible, nasty woman.

Unless, of course, this second part was sent by a troll pretending to be the nasty MIL from the first part. But I’m sure admin check IP addresses for such things. Or, at least, I hope so.

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Anna Wood September 9, 2013 at 8:48 pm

I do not think this is a “Troll”. If it wasn’t that my ex MIL is dead I would say this was written by her. Nothing any one who married into her family did was ever good enough and all we “Out-Laws” were barely tolerated. Fortunately for Tami, her DH is standing up for her. Mine never did. That is why he is my ex. My current MIL is an angel.

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JosieJames1019 September 9, 2013 at 9:09 pm

MIL, your son is a grown man and can decide his career for himself. If he paid for a car for his wife, great, that’s his business. It’s his money and he can spend it however he wants. I don’t think weddings need alcohol nor need to be in a church. I am Christian (not Catholic) and believe that as long as the marriage is legal they are married in God’s eyes (Romans 13:1). Your son and DIL’s babies belong to them; you had your kids and your chance to raise them how you wanted them raised. I only wanted my husband in the delivery room when I gave birth; this is not a ridiculous request. If you camp out in front of their home, I hope she calls the police and reports you for stalking. She’s not breastfeeding for the sole purpose of making you angry; lots of mothers do this for many reasons that have nothing to do with their MIL. She will be having 2 babies at once; they will be tired and definitely not in the mood to entertain more than immediate family in the beginning. If you have a problem with that, then you can leave. Who ever said that the only colors for babies were pink or blue? Tomboys, lesbians? Really? You think the color of their nursery will affect their future lives that much? That’s just funny. And to your last statement, we are all sinners that fall short of the Glory of God. If you continue acting like this, how can they ever trust you with their kids? Are you that stubborn to lose out on a relationship with your son and grandchildren?

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The Elf September 9, 2013 at 9:11 pm

I find it interesting that those who are more willing to give even a small chance that this person is NOT a troll are mostly doing so because they know somebody who behaves in a similar way. FWIW, I’m still Team Submitter-Is-A-Troll, but I do see a possibility that she isn’t.

So when AIP wonders “Surely nobody could be this foul and not run over by everyone they’ve ever met- twice!” Usually they have been – socially. When dealing with someone like this – and they do exist – over time they do manage to drive people away. Any wonder that they’re often fighting with someone in the family? That their friends are either similarly mean-spirited, short-lived, not really friends, or don’t hang out much? That they manipulate people to stay connected to them using a variety of bribes or threats? That they job hop or experience periods of unemployment more often than expected? People like this can hide their true nature behind a variety of masks, but it usually gets out eventually in some way. That makes them cling that much harder to the connections they still have, which compounds the problem.

It is often very difficult to completely cut somebody out of your life, especially when that person is a parent, child, or sibling. First, as an in-law, you have to put the real charge of the relationship in the hands of your spouse. After all, it’s *his* mother. If he’s not ready to let go, forcing the issue will only drive a wedge between the couple. The best you can often do – even if the spouse is completely on board – is set up boundaries (like banning her from the delivery room), try not to let it bother you, and sigh inwardly a lot. If you can cut them out completely, fine. But sometimes it’s either not possible under the circumstances or not a step the spouse is willing to take. Plus, cutting someone like your mother out of your life causes huge ripple effects within the extended family, and you may actually like those people. It’s just not as easy as it sounds, and take a moment to be grateful you don’t have to deal with a real-life troll.

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AliceInWonderland September 9, 2013 at 9:46 pm

Obvious troll is obvious.

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missminute September 9, 2013 at 10:15 pm

Went way too far with the “naming babies after me” and “some nonsense” part – troll. Should be ashamed, this is a great site. Get off it, please.

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Ellex September 9, 2013 at 10:20 pm

Definitely a troll.

I’m not saying that a single person can’t be this awful, (unfortunately I know one or two as well), but this letter isn’t how they sound when they justify themselves – ESPECIALLY the bit about the church and baptism.

Like I said – we got Poe’d.

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Slartibartfast September 9, 2013 at 11:38 pm

Congrats, Tami – you have created another “snakes in a restaurant” moment here on eHell!

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Pktaxwench September 10, 2013 at 12:30 am

MiL isn’t a troll.

Honestly, if my husband and I didn’t have restraining orders against his mother, and they in force for the past 9 years, I could have written this story/she written this story. But, we have never had any family pix done with her, so it wasn’t me. But this sounds like the insane Catholic drivel she spews.

I too haven’t baptized my kids, have a green nursery, and as a Recovering Catholic/atheist, will let thm choose their faith.

Creepy how similar I m to the DiL….

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Lady Macbeth September 10, 2013 at 2:54 am

If this is indeed real, even posting the second part (which I realize the admin struggled with) is inflammatory at best. Admittedly, like so many other commentators, I have known people this spiteful; I just normally don’t have to suffer through their *written* diatribes. Somehow, for me, their hate is easier on the ears than the eyes.

Like others, I hope this is a troll and nothing more so that I don’t have to spend another second reflecting on bitter souls.

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Cherry September 10, 2013 at 3:15 am

*Crossed fingers* Please be a troll, please please please be a troll… I don’t want to believe that anyone is this toxic and bile filled a person…

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Sara September 10, 2013 at 6:24 am

This can’t be real. I join the others in calling “troll”. And it’s not very well done, either–way too obvious and poorly written to boot.

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Barbarian September 10, 2013 at 6:53 am

I hope this story is fiction. It has so many elements of issues posters have discussed previosuly on this site, chapter and verse. If a troll familiar with ths site posted it, shame on you for monopolizing Admin’s time with this nonsense.

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Mabel September 10, 2013 at 7:03 am

I call troll. Whoever it is pushed a whole bunch of controversy buttons–but made the mistake of doing them all at once. Skilled trolls would do them one at a time. This letter is too ham-handed to be anything but.

If it’s not a troll, I would run like the wind as far away from this person as I could go, if she were MY mother.

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Janet September 10, 2013 at 8:23 am

My own mother could be partly like the OP in regards to the kids. My sister has 2 kids by ex hubby #1 and none by ex hubby #2. Due to my sister’s job and her 1st ex not having decent jobs, my mother had a huge hand with the kids but in the end my mother still has an issue with the way my sister does things. The kids are now 12 and 14, and are well behaved and mannered most of the time, get good grades, & well adjusted despite all of the things that have happened in their life.

My sister fell away from the Catholic Church after high school as she felt my mother was too much of a hypocrite (and still may feel that way to this day). She feels my mother does a lot of church activities to hide her faults and shortcomings too. My sister eventually gave into my mother to have her kids receive baptism, confirmation and first communion a few years ago, and will allow my mother to take them to church about 6 to 8 times in a year approximately.

My mother still loves to run our lives and telling us how to do things, and both of us are grown women. I am single with no kids, my sister is now living with a long term boyfriend with her kids with her part of a week & every other weekend (per custody arrangement with ex #1). I just wish some of the people we consider surrogate mothers would put her in her place but not sure if that would be affect for long!

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Cady September 10, 2013 at 8:43 am

If this woman is not a troll (and at this point I am certain she is), I think she’s going to be a bit surprised about who does and doesn’t get to go to heaven, should such a place exist.

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Ashley September 10, 2013 at 11:25 am

I’ll take Admin’s word for it, but I have a feeling we’re all being punk’d.

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Melissa September 10, 2013 at 1:42 pm

I hope she’s fake if only to spare the world of a ‘human’ who can have these kinds of evil opinions….

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Jones September 10, 2013 at 2:40 pm

I wish I could say she was a troll, and yes I can see the discrepancies between the two submissions; however, due to some comments I saw on a friend’s Facebook account today (and I, as a third party, called out the person for cyberbullying, the comments were later removed) I can believe this is true. Also, I have heard similar stories from my coworker about her MIL, and verification from others who know the woman better than I do, to know that MILs like her exist.

I find it sad that so many commenters here know people like the proverbial OP, whether the writer was who she claimed to be or not, they do exist and many of us have met them.

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Nancy September 10, 2013 at 2:51 pm

Regardless of whether or not it’s a troll, it makes me realize I pretty much won the Mother in Law lottery. By a lot. Been married almost 9 years, no kids, not one teeny tiny little peep about when we’re gonna have kids.

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Rebecca September 11, 2013 at 1:14 am

Definitely a troll. Nobody’s that much of a whack job. Right?

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Lex September 11, 2013 at 3:09 am

For the sake of humanity, you would hope this was a troll, but the level of inconsequential detail seems too high to be solely inflammatory. Admin, you mention that you won’t be approving more posts by MIL and DIL – have you received any? I’d be interested to know if there is more to be said here.

Sadly, such extreme and bigoted views do exist in the world – I happened to stumble into a program on FGM the other night in which Ghanas Imam made statements that are so extreme and wrong regarding the workings of a womans private parts that I had to switch over as it made me so angry.

I was raised Catholic and not every catholic is this extreme – I think even the Pope himself would probably take issue with most of the statements made by the MIL here. People have a very warped idea of what it means to be a good Christian, regardless of which sect you practice. Personally I’ve made the choice to renounce religion entirely and am much happier for it, although that doesn’t mean that I disregard the moral and social lessons I learned at Church. It sounds to me as though MIL is more interested in interpreting the teachings of the church to her own advantage than she is in living Christian values.

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The Elf September 11, 2013 at 7:14 am

Wow, I just realized the connection! See, I had a yellow bedroom as a child – that I shared with my brother! – and grew up to be a bit of a tomboy. Oh, the humanity! If only my mother had listened to someone like the OP, then maybe – just maybe – I would today carry a purse instead of wallet. All this time, this secret shame, just because my mother thought a sunny yellow nursery would be welcoming to her daughter. No amount of pink ruffly flowered dresses and hairbows she dressed me in could make up for this travesty!

/sarcasm

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dytchdoctir September 11, 2013 at 7:58 am

It is not true that children of a non-Catholic marriage are “bastards”. Neither secular law nor church law states that such children are illegitimate.

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cattlekid September 11, 2013 at 8:13 am

Put me in the camp of “not a troll”. Between my mom and my MIL, I have heard similar statements come out of both of their mouths. My MIL said a lot of those things about seeing her grandchildren when we were first buying our home and didn’t get one with enough bedrooms so that she could stay over when we first brought our children home (surprise! We aren’t having kids, so I guess that’s a moot point MIL!) and my mom gets that wound up about the fact that my sister isn’t having my niece baptized. So I can definitely see a perfect storm of all of this attitude occurring in one person.

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Jenn50 September 11, 2013 at 12:27 pm

Ellex, thank you, that’s exactly how I feel, but couldn’t articulate! It isn’t that I don’t believe one person could believe and say all those vile and absurd things, it’s just NOT how people sound when justifying their conduct. It sounds more like a spoof of what she said, or how her DIL imagines she would write the letter. And if her son has access to her email on his phone, DIL could easily use his phone (with or without his knowledge) to post Part II. Personally, I believe Part I. It had all the hallmarks of minimizing your own misdeeds and magnifying other’s faults without being over the top. The tone and syntax of the second letter is completely different.

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JGM1764 September 11, 2013 at 3:00 pm

While there are people this horrible out there, I must agree that all signs point to
TROLL IN THE DUNGEON!!!

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MaryFran September 11, 2013 at 3:45 pm

Troll camp. The original post part 1 had some semblance of civility and an attempt by the writer to seem like they were in the right (though it was way off base). Part 2 is either something sent in a rage that the person would now regret sending to the total wrong place for sympathy, or they’re a troll. No one who has read more than a week’s worth of submissions here could use that language and expect the group not to find it completely in the wrong etiquette-wise.

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Enna September 13, 2013 at 11:28 am

Seems to me that this is a troll – as too much is going on here.

As for the wedding not being Catholic – one of my collegues converted from Catholicism to Angalism so she could marry her 2nd husband who had divorced his 1st who had had an affiar. She didn’t like the way she was told she couldn’t marry a divorced man and the priest would rather she “lived in sin”. (this was a long time ago before I was born so maybe things were different then) but like in any religion, the religion may think their wedding service is better or the best but they still recognise marraiges from other faiths – all there would be a free for all.

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twik September 13, 2013 at 1:38 pm

Troll. No one who was religious would omit the capital in the word “god”. That’s the most obvious tell, no matter how ridiculous the rest of the story is (and it is over the top).

I wonder if its the original poster, trying to role-play her MIL?

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Jess September 14, 2013 at 3:06 am

I must unfortunately lump myself in with the people who are sadly commiserating that this is not a troll. I wont get into my personal reasons why, but I will just say there are some people out there who need help. They will never get that help though, because if you try to tell them you’re even concerned about them, you’re greeted with long rants about how *they* aren’t the problem, everyone else is.

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