Etiquette Hell

General Etiquette => Life...in general => Dating => Topic started by: Redneck Gravy on January 03, 2012, 09:27:39 AM

Title: Not only did you strike out while hitting on me - you hit a BINGO (long)
Post by: Redneck Gravy on January 03, 2012, 09:27:39 AM
I'm not sure there is an etiquette issue here, just thought I would share what I thought was a humorous experience for me...Thanksgiving Day in line at a buffet restaurant.

My DD, grandson and I are in line, an adult man & his parents get in line behind me and he immediately starts a conversation with me.  I am very big on being polite to strangers in line everywhere and I think it truly does expand my (not so great) social skills and it never hurts to be kind and friendly.  We discuss the weather, the drought, our ages, simple chitchat.   He is obviously hitting on me, which my DD asks about, I whispered,"I'm just trying to be polite". 

He asks where I'm from, I tell him I am a native of our city.  He says, "I'm from here too, but first thing I did was move to AnotherCity where they are more free thinking."  I ask how he liked that and he said he had to move back home to help take care of his parents.  I mention that I nursed my parents prior to their death many years ago.  He says, "I've already told them that when it is time I will be putting them in a facility."   :o 

He asks about my grandson's father and I say that he is very good at participating in his life even though they (he & my daughter) are not together anymore.  I offer the information that my DD's have not heard a word from their father in years - he basically abandoned both my girls after the divorce.  He says, "yes after my divorce I let my ex raise our kids, I don't know anything about raising kids."

He asks where I went to college and I say that I am actually finishing up my degree locally - at the age of 50.  He says, "why bother?"   

He says, "I don't believe in organized religion."  I say, "I am a devout Baptist, we attend XYZ Baptist Church.  Perhaps you would like to visit ABC Church (a local nondenominational church), I think you will find that churches are much more open minded and relaxed than when we were younger." He says that is not for him.   I respect this, church is not for everyone. 

He offers me a business card with his cell phone written on the back and asks if I have a card, I say "no, I don't."  He says well give me a call if you are interested and don't if you aren't. 

I said, "quite honestly I probably won't.  I work 60 hours a week and take classes as the local college plus run our household and play golf/tennis regularly, right now I just don't have time for a relationship."  He doesn't seem offended by this.   

It has now taken an hour to get to the actual buffet choosing portion.  We part ways and when I get home I throw his card away.  I didn't think he was rude, I didn't think I was either, I just don't think that we would have much in common from this conversation.   

My daughter said, he really struck out with you didn't he?  And I said it was more like a bingo.

Comments?
Title: Re: Not only did you strike out while hitting on me - you hit a BINGO (long)
Post by: Petticoats on January 03, 2012, 10:14:50 AM
An hour to get to the food? At first I was a little taken aback that you were having such a wide-ranging conversation with a guy you were just being polite to, but I guess if you're stuck next to each other for an hour, it makes sense to keep things pleasant.

I'm with you on the striking out--it's like he found the exact wrong thing to say in each instance if he wanted to get anywhere with you. :)
Title: Re: Not only did you strike out while hitting on me - you hit a BINGO (long)
Post by: Sterling on January 03, 2012, 11:11:35 AM
Wow I can't believe you told him so much about your life.  I am friendly with strangers but I would never tell anyone so much information.

Title: Re: Not only did you strike out while hitting on me - you hit a BINGO (long)
Post by: LadyL on January 03, 2012, 11:29:01 AM
I think I would have forfeited my place in line rather than deal with such a painful conversation! For me that's the stuff of panic attacks - feeling trapped/cornered by someone who is making me uncomfortable.
Title: Re: Not only did you strike out while hitting on me - you hit a BINGO (long)
Post by: Surianne on January 03, 2012, 11:39:55 AM
I think I would have forfeited my place in line rather than deal with such a painful conversation! For me that's the stuff of panic attacks - feeling trapped/cornered by someone who is making me uncomfortable.

Sounds like the OP was giving as good as she got -- I'd have left the line when she tried to convince me to join her church! 

Clearly, it wasn't a match for either of you, OP.  I don't think anything he said or the way he acted was rude.  I think it was quite reasonable of him to give you his number, since you spent a great deal of time talking to him and gave him quite a bit of personal information.  It's pretty normal to assume someone is interested in that case, I'd feel.
Title: Re: Not only did you strike out while hitting on me - you hit a BINGO (long)
Post by: penelope2017 on January 03, 2012, 11:52:19 AM
Yeah, it doesn't sound like you guys were compatible in either direction, and I have to agree I'm surprised you entertained a stranger for as long as you did and provided him so much personal information - telling him about your daughter's relationship with her ex?

I don't see that he was rude either.
Title: Re: Not only did you strike out while hitting on me - you hit a BINGO (long)
Post by: Beyond The Veil on January 03, 2012, 11:59:40 AM
I'm not really seeing where he "struck out" at every sentence -- sometimes people cannot give their elders proper care at an older age and thus arrange a facility for them that can, it's a very kind thing to do instead of doing it haphazard. If he felt like he can't take care of kids, it probably was better that he gave them over to his ex.

The college comment was certainly very strange and definitely would have ruffled me, and I think the organized religion bit was dipping into the pot so to speak to test your views. Just turned out you weren't really all that compatible!
Title: Re: Not only did you strike out while hitting on me - you hit a BINGO (long)
Post by: Addy on January 03, 2012, 12:03:42 PM
Sounds like the OP was giving as good as she got -- I'd have left the line when she tried to convince me to join her church! 

Clearly, it wasn't a match for either of you, OP.  I don't think anything he said or the way he acted was rude.  I think it was quite reasonable of him to give you his number, since you spent a great deal of time talking to him and gave him quite a bit of personal information.  It's pretty normal to assume someone is interested in that case, I'd feel.

I don't think the bolded is fair, Surianne, as the OP mentioned a non-denominational church, not her own. It was also in response to the...erm...gentleman's  ::) comment about organized religion, so he brought up the subject first.

Also, I think if someone says they don't believe in organized religion, it kind of implies a belief in God, just not through an organized religion. In this case, I don't think an invitation to a particular church is out of line.

Also, she dropped the subject right away when he wasn't interested.
Title: Re: Not only did you strike out while hitting on me - you hit a BINGO (long)
Post by: DuBois on January 03, 2012, 12:08:18 PM
Yeah, it doesn't sound like you guys were compatible in either direction, and I have to agree I'm surprised you entertained a stranger for as long as you did and provided him so much personal information - telling him about your daughter's relationship with her ex?

I don't see that he was rude either.

To be fair, I don't think the OP was saying he was rude, just that the whole thing was a little odd. That said,  agree that the conversation was very personal. I would probably have tried to drop it sooner, and I certainly wouldn't have been comfortable either hearing or sharing all those details.
Title: Re: Not only did you strike out while hitting on me - you hit a BINGO (long)
Post by: Surianne on January 03, 2012, 12:12:25 PM
Sounds like the OP was giving as good as she got -- I'd have left the line when she tried to convince me to join her church! 

Clearly, it wasn't a match for either of you, OP.  I don't think anything he said or the way he acted was rude.  I think it was quite reasonable of him to give you his number, since you spent a great deal of time talking to him and gave him quite a bit of personal information.  It's pretty normal to assume someone is interested in that case, I'd feel.

I don't think the bolded is fair, Surianne, as the OP mentioned a non-denominational church, not her own. It was also in response to the...erm...gentleman's  ::) comment about organized religion, so he brought up the subject first.

Also, I think if someone says they don't believe in organized religion, it kind of implies a belief in God, just not through an organized religion. In this case, I don't think an invitation to a particular church is out of line.

Also, she dropped the subject right away when he wasn't interested.

Sorry I'm not quite getting it...what isn't fair about my post?  It was a simple statement of fact: I'd have left the line at that point. 

I don't see his comment about religion as any worse than the OP's request for him to visit her church.  Is that what you mean isn't fair?  I also think that asking someone to convert for you (or try a new religion) is a pretty big hint that you're interested, so again, I don't see why it was odd or rude or whatever for him to think she would welcome his phone number.
Title: Re: Not only did you strike out while hitting on me - you hit a BINGO (long)
Post by: Reason on January 03, 2012, 12:13:35 PM
Now, if the man happens to be a sociopath (not saying that he is, just that he could be) he can easily park outside of XYZ church, wait for the OP and follow her home.

I understand the impetus to practice social skills, but it pays to be a little more restrained with personal information until a reasonable relationship is established. Also, most people do not bring up religion or politics until at least the 2nd or third date, never mind in a line at the buffet with a complete stranger, but to each his own.
Title: Re: Not only did you strike out while hitting on me - you hit a BINGO (long)
Post by: Redneck Gravy on January 03, 2012, 12:27:42 PM
He says, "I don't believe in organized religion."  I say, "I am a devout Baptist, we attend XYZ Baptist Church.  Perhaps you would like to visit ABC Church (a local nondenominational church), I think you will find that churches are much more open minded and relaxed than when we were younger." He says that is not for him.   I respect this, church is not for everyone. 

Wow, here I am wondering how I asked him to join my church when I suggested VISITING a different one?
Title: Re: Not only did you strike out while hitting on me - you hit a BINGO (long)
Post by: Surianne on January 03, 2012, 12:31:42 PM
He says, "I don't believe in organized religion."  I say, "I am a devout Baptist, we attend XYZ Baptist Church.  Perhaps you would like to visit ABC Church (a local nondenominational church), I think you will find that churches are much more open minded and relaxed than when we were younger." He says that is not for him.   I respect this, church is not for everyone. 

Wow, here I am wondering how I asked him to join my church when I suggested VISITING a different one?

Is this directed at me?  I'm sorry if I misinterpreted.   I don't know a lot about church and the differences between visiting and joining.  No need to shout at me. 

Clearly I've upset some people here and to be honest I don't understand why, so I'm just going to offer a blanket apology.  Nothing I said was intended to be offensive in any way, and I am very sorry and to be honest, baffled.   
Title: Re: Not only did you strike out while hitting on me - you hit a BINGO (long)
Post by: penelope2017 on January 03, 2012, 12:34:13 PM
He says, "I don't believe in organized religion."  I say, "I am a devout Baptist, we attend XYZ Baptist Church.  Perhaps you would like to visit ABC Church (a local nondenominational church), I think you will find that churches are much more open minded and relaxed than when we were younger." He says that is not for him.   I respect this, church is not for everyone. 

Wow, here I am wondering how I asked him to join my church when I suggested VISITING a different one?

I'm guessing Surianne is pointing out that the stranger said he didn't believe in organized religion, and your comment could be construed as trying to convince him to change his mind regardless of which church you were suggesting he attend.

Some might find that objectionable and an unwanted solicitation to attend any church. I don't have a problem with it, but just trying to say how it could be interpreted.
Title: Re: Not only did you strike out while hitting on me - you hit a BINGO (long)
Post by: DuBois on January 03, 2012, 12:34:56 PM
He says, "I don't believe in organized religion."  I say, "I am a devout Baptist, we attend XYZ Baptist Church.  Perhaps you would like to visit ABC Church (a local nondenominational church), I think you will find that churches are much more open minded and relaxed than when we were younger." He says that is not for him.   I respect this, church is not for everyone. 

Wow, here I am wondering how I asked him to join my church when I suggested VISITING a different one?

Is this directed at me?  I'm sorry if I misinterpreted.   I don't know a lot about church and the differences between visiting and joining.  No need to shout at me. 

Clearly I've upset some people here and to be honest I don't understand why, so I'm just going to offer a blanket apology.  Nothing I said was intended to be offensive in any way, and I am very sorry and to be honest, baffled.

I am baffled along with you, I interpreted the OP as her trying to get the man to come along to the church, as well.  I am a little confused as to OP's intent-I get that this story wasn't ragging on the man, exactly, but I'm not sure what purpose it did serve.
Title: Re: Not only did you strike out while hitting on me - you hit a BINGO (long)
Post by: Surianne on January 03, 2012, 12:35:59 PM
He says, "I don't believe in organized religion."  I say, "I am a devout Baptist, we attend XYZ Baptist Church.  Perhaps you would like to visit ABC Church (a local nondenominational church), I think you will find that churches are much more open minded and relaxed than when we were younger." He says that is not for him.   I respect this, church is not for everyone. 

Wow, here I am wondering how I asked him to join my church when I suggested VISITING a different one?

I'm guessing Surianne is pointing out that the stranger said he didn't believe in organized religion, and your comment could be construed as trying to convince him to change his mind regardless of which church you were suggesting he attend.

Some might find that objectionable and an unwanted solicitation to attend any church. I don't have a problem with it, but just trying to say how it could be interpreted.

Yes, that was what I meant!  Thanks Penelope, and sorry again for misinterpreting, OP (and everyone else!). 
Title: Re: Not only did you strike out while hitting on me - you hit a BINGO (long)
Post by: Addy on January 03, 2012, 12:36:15 PM
Sorry I'm not quite getting it...what isn't fair about my post?  It was a simple statement of fact: I'd have left the line at that point. 

I don't see his comment about religion as any worse than the OP's request for him to visit her church.  Is that what you mean isn't fair?  I also think that asking someone to convert for you (or try a new religion) is a pretty big hint that you're interested, so again, I don't see why it was odd or rude or whatever for him to think she would welcome his phone number.

Oops, sorry, Surianne, I guess I bolded too much! I meant to say that it wasn't fair to say that she tried to convince him to join her church.
Title: Re: Not only did you strike out while hitting on me - you hit a BINGO (long)
Post by: Virg on January 03, 2012, 01:04:28 PM
Lost in Translation wrote:

"I am a little confused as to OP's intent-I get that this story wasn't ragging on the man, exactly, but I'm not sure what purpose it did serve."

I agree that something did get lost in...ahem.  Sorry.  Anyway, it's not a bad example of how two people who turned out to be completely incompatible could still have a polite and civil conversation.  I suspect the original intent was to tell about encountering someone that hit all the low points in hitting on her as an amusing anecdote, but as I said above there's still some example to be taken from it so it's still germane to relationship etiquette.

Virg
Title: Re: Not only did you strike out while hitting on me - you hit a BINGO (long)
Post by: DuBois on January 03, 2012, 01:12:46 PM
Lost in Translation wrote:

"I am a little confused as to OP's intent-I get that this story wasn't ragging on the man, exactly, but I'm not sure what purpose it did serve."

I agree that something did get lost in...ahem.  Sorry.   Anyway, it's not a bad example of how two people who turned out to be completely incompatible could still have a polite and civil conversation.  I suspect the original intent was to tell about encountering someone that hit all the low points in hitting on her as an amusing anecdote, but as I said above there's still some example to be taken from it so it's still germane to relationship etiquette.

Virg

 ;D
Title: Re: Not only did you strike out while hitting on me - you hit a BINGO (long)
Post by: Really? on January 03, 2012, 01:16:40 PM
HI

LOL RNG - after reading your ordeal I don't think you were rude. But all I can think is that no matter how old we get, or guys get, they still try to use the stupiest lines at times.

Onlyme
Title: Re: Not only did you strike out while hitting on me - you hit a BINGO (long)
Post by: Auntie Mame on January 03, 2012, 01:28:41 PM
Why would you tell a total stranger so much about your life and your duaghter's personal business?  I would not be happy if my mother started telling all my personal business to a stranger.
Title: Re: Not only did you strike out while hitting on me - you hit a BINGO (long)
Post by: WillyNilly on January 03, 2012, 01:37:52 PM
He says, "I don't believe in organized religion."  I say, "I am a devout Baptist, we attend XYZ Baptist Church.  Perhaps you would like to visit ABC Church (a local nondenominational church), I think you will find that churches are much more open minded and relaxed than when we were younger." He says that is not for him.   I respect this, church is not for everyone. 

Wow, here I am wondering how I asked him to join my church when I suggested VISITING a different one?

Just an FYI, to a non-religious, non church goer, there is little to no distinction between "joining" or "visiting"  a church.  Heck I only learned in my 30's that people actually officially "join" churches.  I honesty my whole life thought "joining a church" meant you went to church.  Just walked though the door and sat down; aka "visited it".  There you go, you walked in so therefore you joined the crowd to listen to the sermon, you joined the church, just like you 'join the audience' when you go to the movies or you 'join the crowd' when you board a train.
Title: Re: Not only did you strike out while hitting on me - you hit a BINGO (long)
Post by: LadyL on January 03, 2012, 01:52:42 PM
Why would you tell a total stranger so much about your life and your duaghter's personal business?  I would not be happy if my mother started telling all my personal business to a stranger.

I was going to say the same thing upon further contemplation - and it also occurred to me that if I were the granddaughter I'd be mortified to have my (lack of) relationship with my parent being discussed right in front of me.
Title: Re: Not only did you strike out while hitting on me - you hit a BINGO (long)
Post by: Winterlight on January 03, 2012, 02:15:48 PM
Think of it this way; you just saved yourself from a potential lousy date. ;)
Title: Re: Not only did you strike out while hitting on me - you hit a BINGO (long)
Post by: Redneck Gravy on January 03, 2012, 03:01:30 PM
HI

LOL RNG - after reading your ordeal I don't think you were rude. But all I can think is that no matter how old we get, or guys get, they still try to use the stupiest lines at times.

Onlyme

Well this wasn't my goal, but you are right on the money. LOL   

I just wanted to share what I thought was an odd, yet amusing encounter.  Thus far I've been accused of trying to convince someone to join my church and of sharing too much of my personal business.  I didn't know that mentioning the church my family attends, that my parents are deceased or that I am still finishing my college degree were such big secrets. 
 
As for my daughter, she was also part of this conversation referring to her s/o. I certainly wasn't discussing her business in front of her as if she wasn't there.   I'm sorry if I wasn't clear on that part.

I can see where a non-church goer might not understand the difference between joining and visiting a church.  I visited several churches before we joined this one and it became our church home.  That is why I suggested he visit a non-denominational church, still organized religion I guess, but less restrictive.  This particular church is also known for it's singles activities (which I thought might interest him, imagine that).   

I've always liked getting differing opinions on this board but this is a post I really didn't expect to get snarled at so much.  I truly did not know that someone would be so offended that if someone suggested a church to visit that they would get out of line rather than be near them, WOW! 

But I won't stop being polite to strangers I get trapped in line with, so he wasn't my type, it was still a pleasant conversation and even though it was odd it didn't hurt me any to be kind to a stranger or for him to be kind to me.  It certainly made the hour go faster !
   
Title: Re: Not only did you strike out while hitting on me - you hit a BINGO (long)
Post by: LadyL on January 03, 2012, 03:18:38 PM
HI

LOL RNG - after reading your ordeal I don't think you were rude. But all I can think is that no matter how old we get, or guys get, they still try to use the stupiest lines at times.

Onlyme

Well this wasn't my goal, but you are right on the money. LOL   

I just wanted to share what I thought was an odd, yet amusing encounter.  Thus far I've been accused of trying to convince someone to join my church and of sharing too much of my personal business.  I didn't know that mentioning the church my family attends, that my parents are deceased or that I am still finishing my college degree were such big secrets. 
 
As for my daughter, she was also part of this conversation referring to her s/o. I certainly wasn't discussing her business in front of her as if she wasn't there.   I'm sorry if I wasn't clear on that part.

I can see where a non-church goer might not understand the difference between joining and visiting a church.  I visited several churches before we joined this one and it became our church home.  That is why I suggested he visit a non-denominational church, still organized religion I guess, but less restrictive.  This particular church is also known for it's singles activities (which I thought might interest him, imagine that).   

I've always liked getting differing opinions on this board but this is a post I really didn't expect to get snarled at so much.  I truly did not know that someone would be so offended that if someone suggested a church to visit that they would get out of line rather than be near them, WOW! 

But I won't stop being polite to strangers I get trapped in line with, so he wasn't my type, it was still a pleasant conversation and even though it was odd it didn't hurt me any to be kind to a stranger or for him to be kind to me.  It certainly made the hour go faster !
 

I guess one way to read your post is "look at all the spectacular gaffes this guy made while trying to pick me up." He crossed several boundaries of polite small talk IMHO - what he said to you about going back to school was pretty offensive. I would not share any even quasi-personal info with a stranger who demonstrated such poor interpersonal skills. I wouldn't trust how they would interpret it or what they would do with it. I definitely would side step any conversation about religion with such a person and I wouldn't make any recommendations of a religious nature as I also consider that an extremely personal subject.

I guess without a specific question to direct our attention we are just commenting on what we might have done differently or how we might have felt in your shoes, your daughters' shoes, or his shoes. I hope it doesn't come across as "snarling" as in my case it was merely meant as discussion point.
Title: Re: Not only did you strike out while hitting on me - you hit a BINGO (long)
Post by: hobish on January 03, 2012, 03:25:42 PM

Telling someone they should try church after they say they donít believe in organized religion Ö itís kind of like the old standard:
ďI donít like meat loaf.Ē
ďSure you do, youíve just never had my meat loaf,Ē but on a grander scale.
But hey, at least you didnít say it was sad  ;) :D
I don't see anyone accusing you of anything ... maybe i am missing the point here if you weren't expecting some commentary. It sounds kind of funny to me; you probably both walked away thinking "NOt for me."

Title: Re: Not only did you strike out while hitting on me - you hit a BINGO (long)
Post by: Iris on January 03, 2012, 03:35:19 PM
I think it's a hilarious story  ;D

"This woman looks attrative and interesting, I might see if she's interested"
*successfully starts a conversation*
Then
"Religion" - STRIKE
"Attitudes to parenthood" - STRIKE
"Attitudes to caring for the elderly" - STRIKE
"Comment on place OP lives" - STRIKE
"OP's education" - STRIKE

What I can't believe is that at the end of it he STILL asked for your number  ;D. You must have wondered if he was at the same conversation you were.
Title: Re: Not only did you strike out while hitting on me - you hit a BINGO (long)
Post by: Ms_Cellany on January 03, 2012, 03:39:09 PM
Think of it this way; you just saved yourself from a potential lousy date. ;)

I dunno; sounds more like she HAD the lousy date.

I'm inclined to agree that the OP revealed an awful lot of very personal information about not only herself but others.
Title: Re: Not only did you strike out while hitting on me - you hit a BINGO (long)
Post by: Addy on January 03, 2012, 03:55:44 PM
But the thing is, she didn't invite him to join her church, she mentioned another church.

To use the meatloaf analogy, it wouldn't be like saying you haven't tried my meatloaf, it would be more along the lines of "hey, I've heard that meatloaf made with worcestershire sauce is really tasty, have you ever tried  that?"

Oh, and it's just an analogy, it's not like I want everyone to know that my meatloaf recipe using worcestershire sauce is so great.  >:D
Title: Re: Not only did you strike out while hitting on me - you hit a BINGO (long)
Post by: LadyL on January 03, 2012, 04:07:54 PM
But the thing is, she didn't invite him to join her church, she mentioned another church.

To use the meatloaf analogy, it wouldn't be like saying you haven't tried my meatloaf, it would be more along the lines of "hey, I've heard that meatloaf made with worcestershire sauce is really tasty, have you ever tried  that?"

Oh, and it's just an analogy, it's not like I want everyone to know that my meatloaf recipe using worcestershire sauce is so great.  >:D

He said according to the OP that he "doesn't believe in organized religion" so it's more like suggesting that a vegetarian who doesn't believe in eating meat should try your meatloaf recipe. There's a big difference to me between "I don't belong to a church/haven't liked the churches I've gone to" (which is sort of open ended) and "I don't believe in organized religion" (pretty cut and dry).
Title: Re: Not only did you strike out while hitting on me - you hit a BINGO (long)
Post by: Surianne on January 03, 2012, 04:14:05 PM
HI

LOL RNG - after reading your ordeal I don't think you were rude. But all I can think is that no matter how old we get, or guys get, they still try to use the stupiest lines at times.

Onlyme

Well this wasn't my goal, but you are right on the money. LOL   

I just wanted to share what I thought was an odd, yet amusing encounter.  Thus far I've been accused of trying to convince someone to join my church and of sharing too much of my personal business. I didn't know that mentioning the church my family attends, that my parents are deceased or that I am still finishing my college degree were such big secrets. 
 
As for my daughter, she was also part of this conversation referring to her s/o. I certainly wasn't discussing her business in front of her as if she wasn't there.   I'm sorry if I wasn't clear on that part.

I can see where a non-church goer might not understand the difference between joining and visiting a church.  I visited several churches before we joined this one and it became our church home.  That is why I suggested he visit a non-denominational church, still organized religion I guess, but less restrictive.  This particular church is also known for it's singles activities (which I thought might interest him, imagine that).   

I've always liked getting differing opinions on this board but this is a post I really didn't expect to get snarled at so much.  I truly did not know that someone would be so offended that if someone suggested a church to visit that they would get out of line rather than be near them, WOW! 


But I won't stop being polite to strangers I get trapped in line with, so he wasn't my type, it was still a pleasant conversation and even though it was odd it didn't hurt me any to be kind to a stranger or for him to be kind to me.  It certainly made the hour go faster !
 

OP, if you'll look upthread you'll see I've already apologized for offending you about your church and I have admitted my own ignorance about joining vs. visiting.   I don't think continuing to attack me is necessary in the slightest.   
Title: Re: Not only did you strike out while hitting on me - you hit a BINGO (long)
Post by: Addy on January 03, 2012, 04:18:16 PM
Ok, I see your point, LadyL, but I see it a little differently. I get the impression (but maybe I'm wrong) that someone stating that they don't believe in organized religion means that they do believe in God, that they might be a spiritual person, but that they find individual churches don't fulfill their spiritual needs.

To go back to the meatloaf, for me it wouldn't be a vegetarian, it would be more like someone who just doesn't like meatloaf, though they like beef in general. But maybe I'm mistaken in how that idiom is used.

I see it all as an organic part of the conversation though, which he started by talking about religion in the first place.
Title: Re: Not only did you strike out while hitting on me - you hit a BINGO (long)
Post by: The Ricker on January 03, 2012, 04:57:38 PM
Ok, I see your point, LadyL, but I see it a little differently. I get the impression (but maybe I'm wrong) that someone stating that they don't believe in organized religion means that they do believe in God, that they might be a spiritual person, but that they find individual churches don't fulfill their spiritual needs.

To go back to the meatloaf, for me it wouldn't be a vegetarian, it would be more like someone who just doesn't like meatloaf, though they like beef in general. But maybe I'm mistaken in how that idiom is used.

I see it all as an organic part of the conversation though, which he started by talking about religion in the first place.

I agree with this interpretation.  Because so much personal information had been freely exchanged, Redneck Gravy  was on solid ground in making her suggestion; I sense that she is a very perceptive person whose aim was not to cause offense but to helpfully guide a person into something  that might be fulfilling for him.
Title: Re: Not only did you strike out while hitting on me - you hit a BINGO (long)
Post by: hobish on January 03, 2012, 05:12:41 PM
Ok, I see your point, LadyL, but I see it a little differently. I get the impression (but maybe I'm wrong) that someone stating that they don't believe in organized religion means that they do believe in God, that they might be a spiritual person, but that they find individual churches don't fulfill their spiritual needs.

To go back to the meatloaf, for me it wouldn't be a vegetarian, it would be more like someone who just doesn't like meatloaf, though they like beef in general. But maybe I'm mistaken in how that idiom is used.

I see it all as an organic part of the conversation though, which he started by talking about religion in the first place.

I agree with this interpretation.  Because so much personal information had been freely exchanged, Redneck Gravy  was on solid ground in making her suggestion; I sense that she is a very perceptive person whose aim was not to cause offense but to helpfully guide a person into something  that might be fulfilling for him.

Oh, definitely. The whole thing sounds really amusing overall, and really, if you're going to go around announcing your beliefs to people in the buffet line ya gets what ya gets :)

Title: Re: Not only did you strike out while hitting on me - you hit a BINGO (long)
Post by: ilrag on January 03, 2012, 05:31:06 PM
Ok, I see your point, LadyL, but I see it a little differently. I get the impression (but maybe I'm wrong) that someone stating that they don't believe in organized religion means that they do believe in God, that they might be a spiritual person, but that they find individual churches don't fulfill their spiritual needs.

To go back to the meatloaf, for me it wouldn't be a vegetarian, it would be more like someone who just doesn't like meatloaf, though they like beef in general. But maybe I'm mistaken in how that idiom is used.

I see it all as an organic part of the conversation though, which he started by talking about religion in the first place.

I come down on the other side of this.  If some one told you they didn't believe in organized sports would you tell them that while you played soccer they might enjoy ultimate frisbee? 
Title: Re: Not only did you strike out while hitting on me - you hit a BINGO (long)
Post by: Addy on January 03, 2012, 05:46:32 PM
ilrag, maybe that is my misunderstanding of the term "I don't believe in organized religion." To me the emphasis is on the qualifier "organized." So the person would have some interest in religion or God or spirituality.

Using your sports analogy, if someone told me they didn't believe in organized sports, but I thought they still enjoyed sports of some kind, I guess I could suggest something like a recreational league or a friendly game of tennis, or something.  ;D

Because that's more how I see the OP's suggestion. This guy doesn't like organized religion, but he might be interested in some kind of religion, so maybe she could suggest something she sees as less organized, such as the non-denominational church she suggested.
Title: Re: Not only did you strike out while hitting on me - you hit a BINGO (long)
Post by: Ms Aspasia on January 03, 2012, 07:17:49 PM
I think it's a hilarious story  ;D

"This woman looks attrative and interesting, I might see if she's interested"
*successfully starts a conversation*
Then
"Religion" - STRIKE
"Attitudes to parenthood" - STRIKE
"Attitudes to caring for the elderly" - STRIKE
"Comment on place OP lives" - STRIKE
"OP's education" - STRIKE

What I can't believe is that at the end of it he STILL asked for your number  ;D. You must have wondered if he was at the same conversation you were.
Same here.  :) 
Title: Re: Not only did you strike out while hitting on me - you hit a BINGO (long)
Post by: Twik on January 03, 2012, 10:47:12 PM
I think I would have forfeited my place in line rather than deal with such a painful conversation! For me that's the stuff of panic attacks - feeling trapped/cornered by someone who is making me uncomfortable.

Sounds like the OP was giving as good as she got -- I'd have left the line when she tried to convince me to join her church! 

Well, perhaps he should not have started by denigrating the OP's religious position. If you can't take it, don't dish it out.
Title: Re: Not only did you strike out while hitting on me - you hit a BINGO (long)
Post by: UpdatedName on January 03, 2012, 11:15:37 PM
Perhaps it would help to know of the type of church the OP mentioned? From what i know of unitarian chrches, they tend to be muvh more "let's hang out and have an open conersation about our different beliefs/lack thereof" than "let's hang out and praise God." Much more about the people than the deity, if that makes sense. So I personally don't think it's rude or off-base that the OP suggested it, in light of the fact that she didn't push the matter.

Though I do agree that you gave out more personal information than I'd personally consider safe or appropriate.
Title: Re: Not only did you strike out while hitting on me - you hit a BINGO (long)
Post by: Twik on January 03, 2012, 11:20:42 PM
Actually, if proselytizing would make an annoying and inept pick-up artist leave the line, it strikes me as a brilliant move!  ;D
Title: Re: Not only did you strike out while hitting on me - you hit a BINGO (long)
Post by: kittytongue on January 04, 2012, 09:52:20 PM
That conversation wasfull of win wasn't it? >:D

Too bad you got stuck in line with such an awkward conversation partner. I wonder if he was pulling your leg for part of it to get a rise out of you.
Title: Re: Not only did you strike out while hitting on me - you hit a BINGO (long)
Post by: crella on January 04, 2012, 11:59:04 PM
OP, I don't think anyone 'snarled'....

Many people don't like talking about religion...I myself find it intrusive, and yes, *if* a conversation along those lines continued, I would try to find a way out of it. I would be polite, but change the subject, and if unsuccessful, excuse myself. It doesn't sound as if it was a conversation about religion so much as a suggestion from you. I don't think you overdid it.

What does worry me (and others mentioned it out of concern) is the amount of personal information disclosed. He now knows that there isn't a man in the house, you are all out of the house a great deal, your ex isn't around, your DD is divorced, that goes beyond my normal caution levels with strangers, and it seems that several other people thought so as well. You of course, are free to disagree, but I do think (from what I have read) the the comments were out of concern, not in castigation...I wouldn't let anyone know my house is unoccupied 60 hours a week.
Title: Re: Not only did you strike out while hitting on me - you hit a BINGO (long)
Post by: penelope2017 on January 05, 2012, 06:27:56 AM
OP, I don't think anyone 'snarled'....

Many people don't like talking about religion...I myself find it intrusive, and yes, *if* a conversation along those lines continued, I would try to find a way out of it. I would be polite, but change the subject, and if unsuccessful, excuse myself. It doesn't sound as if it was a conversation about religion so much as a suggestion from you. I don't think you overdid it.

What does worry me (and others mentioned it out of concern) is the amount of personal information disclosed. He now knows that there isn't a man in the house, you are all out of the house a great deal, your ex isn't around, your DD is divorced, that goes beyond my normal caution levels with strangers, and it seems that several other people thought so as well. You of course, are free to disagree, but I do think (from what I have read) the the comments were out of concern, not in castigation...I wouldn't let anyone know my house is unoccupied 60 hours a week.

Yes, that is what struck me about the conversation. Mentioning your parents are deceased, your church and that you are pursuing a degree, as you said, aren't big secrets. You went a bit further than that though.

I wouldn't share that type of information with some people I actually know, let alone some man who happened to be standing next to me in a buffet. Even if your daughter was there, I still don't see how sharing that her child's father wasn't around and/or his level of involvement in your grandchild's life is regular conversation fodder with a complete stranger.

I can see him posting this exact same thread to illustrate how you weren't compatible with him, is sort of what I'm saying.  I don't see how he "struck out" or hit bingo. You guys shared a whole bunch of personal info, likely with others waiting as well, that was utterly incompatible on a public buffet line.

Title: Re: Not only did you strike out while hitting on me - you hit a BINGO (long)
Post by: workerbee on January 05, 2012, 08:40:00 AM
OP are you from the south? (I'm making some assumptions based on your name, forgive me if I'm wrong!). I wonder if some of the differing opinions in this thread arise from regional differences about what constitutes 'personal information.'

I live in the south, and your conversation sounds pretty typical for two strangers striking up a conversation to pass the time. I've certainly engaged in similar conversations with strangers (thankfully, none were actually looking for my number!).  My mother, who was raised in the northeast US, would probably think that it got way too personal!

Anyway, FWIW, I thought it sounded like an amusing situation!  And I do think it was nice of you to tell him you probably wouldn't be calling....perfectly civil way to let him down easy.
Title: Re: Not only did you strike out while hitting on me - you hit a BINGO (long)
Post by: UpdatedName on January 05, 2012, 10:17:31 AM
OP are you from the south? (I'm making some assumptions based on your name, forgive me if I'm wrong!). I wonder if some of the differing opinions in this thread arise from regional differences about what constitutes 'personal information.'

I live in the south, and your conversation sounds pretty typical for two strangers striking up a conversation to pass the time. I've certainly engaged in similar conversations with strangers (thankfully, none were actually looking for my number!).  My mother, who was raised in the northeast US, would probably think that it got way too personal!

Anyway, FWIW, I thought it sounded like an amusing situation!  And I do think it was nice of you to tell him you probably wouldn't be calling....perfectly civil way to let him down easy.

Not the OP, of course, but I've lived in the South my whole life, and still find the level of information shared to be...incautious. FWIW.
Title: Re: Not only did you strike out while hitting on me - you hit a BINGO (long)
Post by: NestHolder on January 05, 2012, 10:35:31 AM
I'm going to admit to finding the conversation very amusing - the man seems to have been completely unaware of the fact he was saying some actually appalling things (left his children to his wife to raise? I see nothing admirable in that at all), and went on to give the OP his card.

It seems to have been a perfectly polite conversation on both sides.  Yes, possibly he was trying to convey "I'm an atheist" without actually saying so, but I hardly think the OP's suggestion of a possible church for him was offensive.  It's not as though she grabbed him and insisted he must attend!

But I wonder... was it the good etiquette that led the man to think he might be getting somewhere?
Title: Re: Not only did you strike out while hitting on me - you hit a BINGO (long)
Post by: gollymolly2 on January 05, 2012, 11:19:21 AM
OP,

First, I don't think anyone has snarled at you. You shared an (amusing) story but without a question to guide conversation, so naturally people are responding to what jumped out at them.

I agree that it's pretty funny that you two were a bad match on nearly every conversation topic.

I also, like many posters, thought it was a bit of an overshare. Not in the sense of "can you believe this woman told me all this TMI about herself," because even though i do think sharing information about your exhusband being a deadbeat dad and that sort of thing is waaaay too much for a first conversation with a stranger, obviously he was interested in sharing the same level of detail about his life, so it was no problem. Instead, as others have said, it's disconcerting because you've given a lot of information that could be used to hurt you. I'm not the type of person to suggest that women spend all day locked in their homes holding a can of mace and reading the Gift of Fear, but I do think giving certain types of information too freely can open you up to being a victim if you tell the wrong person.


Also, I do think you were rude for suggesting he visit a local nondenom church. I think in the context of the conversation you were having, it would have been fine for you to respond to his statement by asking more about why he doesn't like organized religion or explaining why you like your own religion or bean dipping, but I don't think the proper response to "I don't like organized religion" is ever a suggestion that someone go to church. I think the above analogies don't totally capture the situation because religion is so much more personal/private/intrusive than meatloaf or ultimate frisbee.

There are a number of reasons a person might say they don't believe in organized religion.  For example:
1) they grew up in a Christian church and are still Christian but didn't like all the rules/strict structures
2) they grew up in a Jewish/Muslim/Hindu household and still hold some or all of the beliefs but don't like to attend (place of worship) and do (rituals of the religion) etc
3) regardless of how they grew up, they find the history of religious institutions (eg crusades) to be off putting and don't want to belong to one
4) they are interested in the idea of a God/higher being but don't think humans have found the answers and don't want to be part of a structured religion

And on and on and on. And of the wide range of reasons that someone could "not believe in organized religion," your suggestion could only be useful for someone in category 1, in my opinion.



TL;DR:  In general, suggesting that someone go to a Christian church when they tell you "I don't like organized religion" is both a rude response and not a particularly helpful one even if they're open to solutions to their dislike of religion unless you know they have Christian beliefs.
Title: Re: Not only did you strike out while hitting on me - you hit a BINGO (long)
Post by: Redneck Gravy on January 05, 2012, 02:04:43 PM
Workerbee

I'm in West Texas

My nephew calls this down South but I consider Southern states to be Louisiana, Mississippi, Alabama & Georgia.

I consider Texas and Florida to be Texas & Florida, although both are almost as south you can get while staying in the US.  Then again I consider New Mexico to be southwest with Arizona.  But California is California just like Texas & Florida.   

Did that answer help you any ?
Title: Re: Not only did you strike out while hitting on me - you hit a BINGO (long)
Post by: Beyond The Veil on January 05, 2012, 02:23:58 PM
Workerbee

I'm in West Texas

My nephew calls this down South but I consider Southern states to be Louisiana, Mississippi, Alabama & Georgia.

I consider Texas and Florida to be Texas & Florida, although both are almost as south you can get while staying in the US.  Then again I consider New Mexico to be southwest with Arizona.  But California is California just like Texas & Florida.   

Did that answer help you any ?

What happened to Oklahoma, Kentucky, Arkansas, Tennessee, Virginia, the Carolinas, Georgia, and West Virginia? I also consider Texas as Texas and Florida as Florida, but you forgot a slew of states for the south.
Title: Re: Not only did you strike out while hitting on me - you hit a BINGO (long)
Post by: SiotehCat on January 05, 2012, 02:44:21 PM
Workerbee

I'm in West Texas

My nephew calls this down South but I consider Southern states to be Louisiana, Mississippi, Alabama & Georgia.

I consider Texas and Florida to be Texas & Florida, although both are almost as south you can get while staying in the US.  Then again I consider New Mexico to be southwest with Arizona.  But California is California just like Texas & Florida.   

Did that answer help you any ?

What happened to Oklahoma, Kentucky, Arkansas, Tennessee, Virginia, the Carolinas, Georgia, and West Virginia? I also consider Texas as Texas and Florida as Florida, but you forgot a slew of states for the south.

See, I wouldn't consider any of those except Georgia to be the south. I am from deep down South Texas, and I don't consider that the south either.
Title: Re: Not only did you strike out while hitting on me - you hit a BINGO (long)
Post by: Allyson on January 05, 2012, 03:27:06 PM
Sometimes conversations can get surprising, so I'm not judging anyone for level of information disclosed. I'm normally a very private person who doesn't go beyond small-talk on the first meeting, and also someone who isn't big on physical contact. There have been two or three times where I've met people and for whatever reason, we mutually broke those rules and were behaving much more friendly by the end of the conversation than we normally might have thought. So if that can happen to someone like me, who doesn't easily warm up to others, I don't find it that strange that a first-time conversation could meander to personal details.
Title: Re: Not only did you strike out while hitting on me - you hit a BINGO (long)
Post by: Redneck Gravy on January 05, 2012, 03:42:21 PM
Workerbee

I'm in West Texas

My nephew calls this down South but I consider Southern states to be Louisiana, Mississippi, Alabama & Georgia.

I consider Texas and Florida to be Texas & Florida, although both are almost as south you can get while staying in the US.  Then again I consider New Mexico to be southwest with Arizona.  But California is California just like Texas & Florida.   

Did that answer help you any ?

What happened to Oklahoma, Kentucky, Arkansas, Tennessee, Virginia, the Carolinas, Georgia, and West Virginia? I also consider Texas as Texas and Florida as Florida, but you forgot a slew of states for the south.

See, I wouldn't consider any of those except Georgia to be the south. I am from deep down South Texas, and I don't consider that the south either.
I agree, I did forget a bunch.  Please don't take offense, just if you ask me off the top of my head - that's what I think.   I just consider those others middle states?  If you tell me you're from back East, I'll think Michigan, Ohio, Indiana, Pennsylvania-funny how we think directionally/geographically. I think of Missouri, Arkansas, Oklahoma, Kansas & Nebraska as mid-west but I think they really may be closer to the eastern side of the center of America.   
Title: Re: Not only did you strike out while hitting on me - you hit a BINGO (long)
Post by: Mental Magpie on January 06, 2012, 03:17:22 PM
I grew up in PA; to me the south started with North Carolina and ended on the west with Texas...it was only a few years ago that I learned that some people in Tennessee and Kentucky consider themselves as having had a southern upbringing and that completely perplexed me.