Etiquette Hell

General Etiquette => Life...in general => Topic started by: Lexophile on October 09, 2012, 05:37:42 PM

Title: The. Very. Nerve. (BG in Post #15, Updates in post 66 and 68 [!])
Post by: Lexophile on October 09, 2012, 05:37:42 PM
I posted some time ago about a babysitter that wasn't working out. I can't post a link to the original thread because I asked a Mod to remove it. Long story short, the person was needy, entitled, and immature to the point where it was starting to become burdensome to keep her around.

Right before a major transition in my DD's life, she quit with no warning. It was a mixed blessing because, while it solved the problem of dealing with an increasingly uncomfortable situation that was quickly coming to an inevitable end, I didn't know she was quitting until 11 pm the night before the transition for my daughter. She had sent an email and because I rarely check the account, it was only by dumb luck that I received notification in time to save my work week.

After a stressful transition to a new school and a difficult and intense search for a new caregiver, we have finally settled into a much better situation. We were able to find someone who so far has been a perfect fit and is the picture of reliability and stellar work ethic. She's been with us for almost three weeks now and I couldn't be happier with her.

Well, today, I received an email from old babysitter. After a detailed description of recent events in her life, she wants to apologize now for putting us in a difficult position. All of this seems reasonable.

Until we get to the fifth paragraph of her email. She wants to continue tutoring my daughter (she speaks a specific foreign language we are trying to expose DD to), but is only offering to do so if we agree to do it close to her home. She wants to pick up DD from school and spend an afternoon with her every week, then meet me later on to pick her up. If that plan doesn't work for us, then she still wants to meet with us one more time "to say goodbye and make the transition less painful for everybody."

Um, NO.

I won't even begin to say what's on my mind about the whole "making it easier for everyone" bit. This happened a month ago. The only person that would benefit emotionally from one more visit is her. And I am DONE stroking her ego at my DD's expense. She up and left without so much as a by-your-leave right when we needed help the most, didn't even acknowledge that my 3yo was attached to her and had to deal with her sudden disappearance, and now wants to spend unsupervised time with her every week *on her terms*?

Am I overreacting to be upset about this? I plan on writing back the following email:

"Babysitter:

Thank you for the update. I'm glad to see that things are calming down and that you and yours are doing well. We have established a routine and DD is doing great in her new school.

I appreciate that you had a special friendship with her; however, our new situation is only now beginning to settle, and I do not want DD to get mixed messages. While we understand why you could no longer be available to help us, I think it's better for DD if we don't complicate the current situation with any visits.

We wish you all the best."

I have also notified the school and my DD's teachers that, if she comes to the school and asks to see DD, I want her nowhere near my daughter. I don't think she's dangerous, but I wouldn't put it past her to "happen by" one day just to get closure for herself.

Any suggested changes for my response? Am I right to be angry?

Edited for typos.
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve.
Post by: NyaChan on October 09, 2012, 05:42:07 PM
You are definitely not overreacting, but honestly that email is way too friendly and open to communication.  If you are so worried about her that you think she might try to do an end run around you and get to your child at school, your response should be way more short and business-like.

"Babysitter,  We have already made arrangements for our child with other service providers.  Thank you for your years of service, we wish you the best of luck."

Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve.
Post by: Betelnut on October 09, 2012, 05:43:08 PM
Eh, I would ignore her email altogether.  People who are willing to put you in that position (quitting with no notice) don't deserve a response.

Susan
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve.
Post by: Ceallach on October 09, 2012, 06:12:33 PM
I don't think she deserves a response seeing your relationship has been terminated.   But the problem then is that she's likely to contact you again if she doesn't hear anything, so I personally find it's easiest to address things.  (And I think you did the right thing notifying the school that she is no longer involved in your DDs life and should not be given access).

I think what you've written is fine although I would suggest being slightly firmer in your wording, perhaps:


Babysitter,

Thank you for the update. I'm glad to see that things are calming down and that you and yours are doing well.

Since you quit we have made other arrangements for DD and now have an established routine in place.  DD is doing great in her new school and has spent the past few weeks adjusting to the changes.   Therefore we will not be requiring your services and don't want her to have any further disruption.   

We wish you all the best.
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve.
Post by: JoyinVirginia on October 09, 2012, 06:26:26 PM
I like nyachans brief and to the point email. You can expose your child to a language in many other ways.
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve.
Post by: Ginya on October 09, 2012, 06:30:52 PM

I think what you've written is fine although I would suggest being slightly firmer in your wording, perhaps:


Babysitter,

Thank you for the update. I'm glad to see that things are calming down and that you and yours are doing well.

Since you quit we have made other arrangements for DD and now have an established routine in place.  DD is doing great in her new school and has spent the past few weeks adjusting to the changes.   Therefore we will not be requiring your services and don't want her to have any further disruption.   

We wish you all the best.


POD to this. It's firm and leaves little room for additional communication. I suspect she'll reiterate her request for a closing meeting and in that case I'd go with "I'm afraid that won't be possible.".
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve.
Post by: JenJay on October 09, 2012, 07:02:54 PM
I think your email is spot-on!
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve.
Post by: bonyk on October 09, 2012, 07:14:43 PM
"Babysitter,  We have already made arrangements for our child with other service providers.  Thank you for your years of service, we wish you the best of luck.

I vote for this one.  The less said on your part, the better.
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve.
Post by: TootsNYC on October 09, 2012, 07:43:34 PM
I think that's way too much verbiage. I hope it felt good to type it out, though!

I would either say:
1) this is basically junk marketing email, so don't respond at all
or
2) Just say, "sorry, we're pretty busy lately. Glad to hear things are better. Best of luck."

And leave it at that.

I do like Ceallach's, though.
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve.
Post by: johelenc1 on October 09, 2012, 07:56:48 PM
As a former nanny, I am close to this one.  I think if her reasons for her sudden departure were real and reasonable, then offering a bit of grace and understanding would be a kindness.  She is clearly regretting her decision and struggling with her loss of your daughter.  Not having a chance to say goodbye will be something she will regret the rest of her life.  I can honestly say, it's probably keeping her up at night.

Is any of this your problem?  Not really.  But does this young person, who appears to have had some kind of major stress in her life at the time deserve an act of grace?  I would say yes.

I agree your primary concern is your daughter.  However, she's 3.  Unless she was seriously traumatized by her leaving, your daughter might enjoy seeing the babysitter again and after the "one last goodbye", a simple, "babysitter is really busy and we haven't been able to make a playdate" should hold her off until she forgets about her.

I do agree there's no reason to do the language classes or have her pick her up from school, but I personally have a hard time not wanting to let her say good-bye.
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve.
Post by: yokozbornak on October 09, 2012, 07:57:11 PM
Dear Babysitter,

Oh, E-Hell no!

Lexophile
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve.
Post by: still in va on October 09, 2012, 07:58:23 PM
"Babysitter,  We have already made arrangements for our child with other service providers.  Thank you for your years of service, we wish you the best of luck.

I vote for this one.  The less said on your part, the better.

Lex, if you were open at all to a possible continued relationship down the road (wayyyyyy down the road), i would use Ceallach's.  if the door is closed and you want no further contact, use Nya's response.  and has already been posted, if she comes back again, then you resort to the "That's not possible" response.  your DD is 3, this person is an adult.  she can just deal with it.  no need to stir up your little one now that she's settled.
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve.
Post by: still in va on October 09, 2012, 08:04:11 PM
As a former nanny, I am close to this one.  I think if her reasons for her sudden departure were real and reasonable, then offering a bit of grace and understanding would be a kindness.  She is clearly regretting her decision and struggling with her loss of your daughter.  Not having a chance to say goodbye will be something she will regret the rest of her life.  I can honestly say, it's probably keeping her up at night.

Is any of this your problem?  Not really.  But does this young person, who appears to have had some kind of major stress in her life at the time deserve an act of grace?  I would say yes.

I agree your primary concern is your daughter.  However, she's 3.  Unless she was seriously traumatized by her leaving, your daughter might enjoy seeing the babysitter again and after the "one last goodbye", a simple, "babysitter is really busy and we haven't been able to make a playdate" should hold her off until she forgets about her.

I do agree there's no reason to do the language classes or have her pick her up from school, but I personally have a hard time not wanting to let her say good-bye.

jolene, i don't really remember clearly the circumstances of the babysitter leaving suddenly.  but i also don't know that this babysitter was young. 

since i can't go back and reread the original post, i don't know what the issues were.  i think there are times when it's not necessary for the babysitter to have the chance to tell the child good-bye.  it sounds to me like the babysitter didn't have any trouble walking away before. that she now regrets that decision, and wants "closure" really isn't Lex's problem. 

Lex has just gotten her daughter settled into a new routine.  she'd know better than i do if it would be upsetting for her daughter to have a "goodbye" with the former sitter.  if the sitter really cares about the child, she'll accept a "no way in E-Hell" from Lex.
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve.
Post by: SuperMartianRobotGirl on October 09, 2012, 08:17:31 PM
I think I personally would send an email, and I would keep it polite but I wouldn't make it sound at all friendly because I'm afraid that might send a message you don't want to send. Polite doesn't have to be friendly.

Something like: "Thank you for the email. DD has already transitioned into another care situation and we don't wish to confuse her her by establishing contact again. We won't need you to tutor her again either." You could add a "we wish you the best" to have a closing that makes it sound less harsh, but I'd keep it fairly cold and I might not include that so she doesn't get it in her head she's going to have a relationship with your daughter again.
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve.
Post by: MrTango on October 09, 2012, 08:37:38 PM
I'd just delete the email without response.
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve.
Post by: Lexophile on October 09, 2012, 08:40:41 PM
As a former nanny, I am close to this one.  I think if her reasons for her sudden departure were real and reasonable, then offering a bit of grace and understanding would be a kindness.  She is clearly regretting her decision and struggling with her loss of your daughter.  Not having a chance to say goodbye will be something she will regret the rest of her life.  I can honestly say, it's probably keeping her up at night.

Is any of this your problem?  Not really.  But does this young person, who appears to have had some kind of major stress in her life at the time deserve an act of grace?  I would say yes.

I agree your primary concern is your daughter.  However, she's 3.  Unless she was seriously traumatized by her leaving, your daughter might enjoy seeing the babysitter again and after the "one last goodbye", a simple, "babysitter is really busy and we haven't been able to make a playdate" should hold her off until she forgets about her.

I do agree there's no reason to do the language classes or have her pick her up from school, but I personally have a hard time not wanting to let her say good-bye.

jolene, i don't really remember clearly the circumstances of the babysitter leaving suddenly.  but i also don't know that this babysitter was young. 

since i can't go back and reread the original post, i don't know what the issues were.  i think there are times when it's not necessary for the babysitter to have the chance to tell the child good-bye.  it sounds to me like the babysitter didn't have any trouble walking away before. that she now regrets that decision, and wants "closure" really isn't Lex's problem. 

Lex has just gotten her daughter settled into a new routine.  she'd know better than i do if it would be upsetting for her daughter to have a "goodbye" with the former sitter.  if the sitter really cares about the child, she'll accept a "no way in E-Hell" from Lex.

Extra BG (for clarity's sake):

This person basically used me as a dumping ground for her trainwreck of a life. She stopped showing up on time. She kept asking for more and more favors (pay advances, schedule changes, a shoulder to cry on when things went wrong - and they constantly went wrong). It all boiled down to one thing - it wasn't about my DD anymore. It was about keeping the babysitter afloat regardless of how it was affecting everybody else involved. I began to worry about the influence that all the extra drama was going to have on my child.

Her age was never an issue. To me, that's irrelevant. The problem was unprofessional behavior that bordered on toxicity. She was self-centered, emotionally immature, and somehow got it in her head that it was my responsibility to be her friend. The bile rises in my stomach at the thought of EVER having contact with her again. When I saw that she'd sent me an email, my blood pressure ticked up just reading her name. In my head, I had the same thought that I did when she was working with us and she sent me a text or started a sentence with, "Would it be possible ..." I always immediately thought, "What NOW?"

ETA: Anyone reading this notice my e-hell signature quote? I picked this one specifically because of her.   \/
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve. (more background in Post #15)
Post by: AmethystAnne on October 09, 2012, 08:49:17 PM
From the extra background, this e-mail is par for the course: it's all about the babysitter and making her feel better.

"Babysitter,
DD is doing wonderfully well. We have no need of your services. Do not contact us again.
Lexophile "

The above may be a little harsh.

Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve.
Post by: still in va on October 09, 2012, 08:49:40 PM
As a former nanny, I am close to this one.  I think if her reasons for her sudden departure were real and reasonable, then offering a bit of grace and understanding would be a kindness.  She is clearly regretting her decision and struggling with her loss of your daughter.  Not having a chance to say goodbye will be something she will regret the rest of her life.  I can honestly say, it's probably keeping her up at night.

Is any of this your problem?  Not really.  But does this young person, who appears to have had some kind of major stress in her life at the time deserve an act of grace?  I would say yes.

I agree your primary concern is your daughter.  However, she's 3.  Unless she was seriously traumatized by her leaving, your daughter might enjoy seeing the babysitter again and after the "one last goodbye", a simple, "babysitter is really busy and we haven't been able to make a playdate" should hold her off until she forgets about her.

I do agree there's no reason to do the language classes or have her pick her up from school, but I personally have a hard time not wanting to let her say good-bye.

jolene, i don't really remember clearly the circumstances of the babysitter leaving suddenly.  but i also don't know that this babysitter was young. 

since i can't go back and reread the original post, i don't know what the issues were.  i think there are times when it's not necessary for the babysitter to have the chance to tell the child good-bye.  it sounds to me like the babysitter didn't have any trouble walking away before. that she now regrets that decision, and wants "closure" really isn't Lex's problem. 

Lex has just gotten her daughter settled into a new routine.  she'd know better than i do if it would be upsetting for her daughter to have a "goodbye" with the former sitter.  if the sitter really cares about the child, she'll accept a "no way in E-Hell" from Lex.

Extra BG (for clarity's sake):

This person basically used me as a dumping ground for her trainwreck of a life. She stopped showing up on time. She kept asking for more and more favors (pay advances, schedule changes, a shoulder to cry on when things went wrong - and they constantly went wrong). It all boiled down to one thing - it wasn't about my DD anymore. It was about keeping the babysitter afloat regardless of how it was affecting everybody else involved. I began to worry about the influence that all the extra drama was going to have on my child.

Her age was never an issue. To me, that's irrelevant. The problem was unprofessional behavior that bordered on toxicity. She was self-centered, emotionally immature, and somehow got it in her head that it was my responsibility to be her friend. The bile rises in my stomach at the thought of EVER having contact with her again. When I saw that she'd sent me an email, my blood pressure ticked up just reading her name. In my head, I had the same thought that I did when she was working with us and she sent me a text or started a sentence with, "Would it be possible ..." I always immediately thought, "What NOW?"

ETA: Anyone reading this notice my e-hell signature quote? I picked this one specifically because of her.   \/

the extra background that you provided has clarified my vote.  go with Nya's response.  then block her e-mail address.  it will be better for your blood pressure.

also, Cynical stillinva thinks this is an attempt for the babysitter to get her foot back in the door.  she must still need a "friend".  slam the door.  your DD is settled, and you're happier to no longer need to support this person.
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve. (more background in Post #15)
Post by: still in va on October 09, 2012, 08:50:30 PM
From the extra background, this e-mail is par for the course: it's all about the babysitter and making her feel better.

"Babysitter,
DD is doing wonderfully well. We have no need of your services. Do not contact us again.
Lexophile "

The above may be a little harsh.

it's actually working really, really well for me.
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve. (more background in Post #15)
Post by: AmethystAnne on October 09, 2012, 08:54:49 PM
From the extra background, this e-mail is par for the course: it's all about the babysitter and making her feel better.

"Babysitter,
DD is doing wonderfully well. We have no need of your services. Do not contact us again.
Lexophile "

The above may be a little harsh.

it's actually working really, really well for me.

:D
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve. (more background in Post #15)
Post by: LeveeWoman on October 09, 2012, 09:05:54 PM
*crickets*
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve.
Post by: wallaby on October 09, 2012, 09:16:09 PM
As a former nanny, I am close to this one.  I think if her reasons for her sudden departure were real and reasonable, then offering a bit of grace and understanding would be a kindness.  She is clearly regretting her decision and struggling with her loss of your daughter.  Not having a chance to say goodbye will be something she will regret the rest of her life.  I can honestly say, it's probably keeping her up at night.

Is any of this your problem?  Not really.  But does this young person, who appears to have had some kind of major stress in her life at the time deserve an act of grace?  I would say yes.

I agree your primary concern is your daughter.  However, she's 3.  Unless she was seriously traumatized by her leaving, your daughter might enjoy seeing the babysitter again and after the "one last goodbye", a simple, "babysitter is really busy and we haven't been able to make a playdate" should hold her off until she forgets about her.

I do agree there's no reason to do the language classes or have her pick her up from school, but I personally have a hard time not wanting to let her say good-bye.

jolene, i don't really remember clearly the circumstances of the babysitter leaving suddenly.  but i also don't know that this babysitter was young. 

since i can't go back and reread the original post, i don't know what the issues were.  i think there are times when it's not necessary for the babysitter to have the chance to tell the child good-bye.  it sounds to me like the babysitter didn't have any trouble walking away before. that she now regrets that decision, and wants "closure" really isn't Lex's problem. 

Lex has just gotten her daughter settled into a new routine.  she'd know better than i do if it would be upsetting for her daughter to have a "goodbye" with the former sitter.  if the sitter really cares about the child, she'll accept a "no way in E-Hell" from Lex.

My response is influenced by the fact my mother was a live-in nanny for many years and has told me many stories about that time of her life. To that end I agree with the sentiments expressed by johelenc1.

I think OP is neither 'right' nor 'wrong' to feel how she feels about the babysitter now. OP is evidently very angry. However, I'm a bit confused by the idea that allowing the babysitter to say goodbye shouldn't be entertained. Saying goodbye to important people in our lives is inherently upsetting. There are also many upsides to goodbyes in helping us move on - without some kind of goodbye, I would worry daughter might grow up with a lingering sense she was abandoned/forgotten by a caregiver she was evidently very attached to.
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve.
Post by: LifeOnPluto on October 09, 2012, 09:37:03 PM
As a former nanny, I am close to this one.  I think if her reasons for her sudden departure were real and reasonable, then offering a bit of grace and understanding would be a kindness.  She is clearly regretting her decision and struggling with her loss of your daughter.  Not having a chance to say goodbye will be something she will regret the rest of her life.  I can honestly say, it's probably keeping her up at night.

Is any of this your problem?  Not really.  But does this young person, who appears to have had some kind of major stress in her life at the time deserve an act of grace?  I would say yes.

I agree your primary concern is your daughter.  However, she's 3.  Unless she was seriously traumatized by her leaving, your daughter might enjoy seeing the babysitter again and after the "one last goodbye", a simple, "babysitter is really busy and we haven't been able to make a playdate" should hold her off until she forgets about her.

I do agree there's no reason to do the language classes or have her pick her up from school, but I personally have a hard time not wanting to let her say good-bye.

jolene, i don't really remember clearly the circumstances of the babysitter leaving suddenly.  but i also don't know that this babysitter was young. 

since i can't go back and reread the original post, i don't know what the issues were.  i think there are times when it's not necessary for the babysitter to have the chance to tell the child good-bye.  it sounds to me like the babysitter didn't have any trouble walking away before. that she now regrets that decision, and wants "closure" really isn't Lex's problem. 

Lex has just gotten her daughter settled into a new routine.  she'd know better than i do if it would be upsetting for her daughter to have a "goodbye" with the former sitter.  if the sitter really cares about the child, she'll accept a "no way in E-Hell" from Lex.

My response is influenced by the fact my mother was a live-in nanny for many years and has told me many stories about that time of her life. To that end I agree with the sentiments expressed by johelenc1.

I think OP is neither 'right' nor 'wrong' to feel how she feels about the babysitter now. OP is evidently very angry. However, I'm a bit confused by the idea that allowing the babysitter to say goodbye shouldn't be entertained. Saying goodbye to important people in our lives is inherently upsetting. There are also many upsides to goodbyes in helping us move on - without some kind of goodbye, I would worry daughter might grow up with a lingering sense she was abandoned/forgotten by a caregiver she was evidently very attached to.

In these circumstances, I would NOT meet up with this babysitter to say goodbye. If this happens, I suspect the babysitter will ask a favour of the OP (eg cash or something), or at least try to wheedle her way back into a babysitting gig.

I like NyaChan's wording. Short and sweet, with no meet-ups.
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve.
Post by: still in va on October 09, 2012, 09:47:15 PM
As a former nanny, I am close to this one.  I think if her reasons for her sudden departure were real and reasonable, then offering a bit of grace and understanding would be a kindness.  She is clearly regretting her decision and struggling with her loss of your daughter.  Not having a chance to say goodbye will be something she will regret the rest of her life.  I can honestly say, it's probably keeping her up at night.

Is any of this your problem?  Not really.  But does this young person, who appears to have had some kind of major stress in her life at the time deserve an act of grace?  I would say yes.

I agree your primary concern is your daughter.  However, she's 3.  Unless she was seriously traumatized by her leaving, your daughter might enjoy seeing the babysitter again and after the "one last goodbye", a simple, "babysitter is really busy and we haven't been able to make a playdate" should hold her off until she forgets about her.

I do agree there's no reason to do the language classes or have her pick her up from school, but I personally have a hard time not wanting to let her say good-bye.

jolene, i don't really remember clearly the circumstances of the babysitter leaving suddenly.  but i also don't know that this babysitter was young. 

since i can't go back and reread the original post, i don't know what the issues were.  i think there are times when it's not necessary for the babysitter to have the chance to tell the child good-bye.  it sounds to me like the babysitter didn't have any trouble walking away before. that she now regrets that decision, and wants "closure" really isn't Lex's problem. 

Lex has just gotten her daughter settled into a new routine.  she'd know better than i do if it would be upsetting for her daughter to have a "goodbye" with the former sitter.  if the sitter really cares about the child, she'll accept a "no way in E-Hell" from Lex.

My response is influenced by the fact my mother was a live-in nanny for many years and has told me many stories about that time of her life. To that end I agree with the sentiments expressed by johelenc1.

I think OP is neither 'right' nor 'wrong' to feel how she feels about the babysitter now. OP is evidently very angry. However, I'm a bit confused by the idea that allowing the babysitter to say goodbye shouldn't be entertained. Saying goodbye to important people in our lives is inherently upsetting. There are also many upsides to goodbyes in helping us move on - without some kind of goodbye, I would worry daughter might grow up with a lingering sense she was abandoned/forgotten by a caregiver she was evidently very attached to.

Lex's daughter is 3.  she has just gotten settled into a new routine with new caregivers and teachers.  if the old babysitter pops in now, to say "goodbye", it's liable to confuse and upset her just when she's adjusted to the old babysitter being gone. 

add in that the old babysitter sounds a bit on the unstable side, and i don't see any good coming from any kind of contact with her.

if the child was older when this happened, i might have a different view.  but at 3?  i just see that as confusing and possibly upsetting.  Lex's daughter isn't old enough to understand the whole "i just wanted to say goodbye" thing.  as far as she's concerned, it's already happened. 
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve. (more background in Post #15)
Post by: MyFamily on October 09, 2012, 10:10:24 PM
I'm not a doctor, just a mom of 3.  IMO, the immediate transition of losing the babysitter had to be hard for her, at this point, she is now past this.  Is there a chance at some point it will affect her in the future? Yep, but the damage has already been done - the babysitter was there one day and out of her life the next day.  A good-bye this far down the road is not for the daughter, it is for the babysitter.  If she'd been someone who'd been reliable and truly seemed to be the child first, and the exit was due to an emergency, I'd say get together.  But it sounds like the exit was due to the babysitter not taking the responsibility of her job seriously, and this good-bye is for her.  Unfortunately, she's asked too much of the OP and the door that was open to being there for her has closed.  I'd delete the email, block the address and move on.
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve. (more background in Post #15)
Post by: doodlemor on October 09, 2012, 10:12:54 PM
Cynical stillinva thinks this is an attempt for the babysitter to get her foot back in the door.

Cynical doodlemor thinks the same thing.  This person likely has run through several hosts victims by now, and wants to attach herself back to Lexophile.

I think that Lexophile should be as brief as possible, if she decides to answer the email at all.



Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve. (more background in Post #15)
Post by: GSNW on October 09, 2012, 11:32:51 PM
While it's nice to think of closure for the ex babysitter, OP knows her daughter best and if he has moved on, then she has moved on.  It's not as though OP and her husband callously dropped the babysitter with no notice, this was the SITTER'S choice.  And not letting her have closure isn't punitive, it's about honoring the feelings of OP, who has a right to decide who hangs out with her daughter for any amount of time.  I wouldn't want to revisit things with someone this flaky and inconsiderate either.
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve. (more background in Post #15)
Post by: Roses on October 09, 2012, 11:40:40 PM
I vote for the short sweet response as well. 

OP does not owe the babysitter any opportunities for closure if this is not what is best for her daughter.
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve. (more background in Post #15)
Post by: FauxFoodist on October 09, 2012, 11:54:40 PM
I vote for no response.  Delete the e-mail and continue your post-babysitter lives.
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve. (more background in Post #15)
Post by: cicero on October 10, 2012, 03:44:26 AM
Cynical stillinva thinks this is an attempt for the babysitter to get her foot back in the door.

Cynical doodlemor thinks the same thing.  This person likely has run through several hosts victims by now, and wants to attach herself back to Lexophile.

I think that Lexophile should be as brief as possible, if she decides to answer the email at all.
cynical cicero thinks the same. in fact, when i started reading the OP i thought "OK, when is she going to ask for her job back".

I don't think you have to reply, but if you do - i would simply say 'no thank you'. you can use Amethyst Anne's wording, but honestly - i wouldn't even say "DD is doing well" - it's none of her business!

"Babysitter,
DD is doing wonderfully well. We have no need of your services. Do not contact us again.
Lexophile "

Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve. (more background in Post #15)
Post by: QueenofAllThings on October 10, 2012, 06:28:05 AM
The Queen has been around the block a few times, and the Queen feels this is less about closure and more about salary (hence the tutoring offer).
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve. (more background in Post #15)
Post by: still in va on October 10, 2012, 06:37:10 AM
The Queen has been around the block a few times, and the Queen feels this is less about closure and more about salary (hence the tutoring offer).

the Queen and still in va apparently wander around the same block. 

it occurs to me that the "one last meeting to say goodbye" would be an excellent opportunity for the former babysitter to show Lexophile just how much her DD has missed the FB.  so of COURSE Lex will be happy to pay for her time one afternoon a week.  obviously, former babysitter is not familiar with the concept of burning one's bridges.
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve. (more background in Post #15)
Post by: ClaireC79 on October 10, 2012, 06:38:10 AM
DD has already transitioned and we have no need for your services, therefore there is no need to meet up
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve. (more background in Post #15)
Post by: WillyNilly on October 10, 2012, 07:19:37 AM
When I was about 2.75 years old, my family moved. Before that I had a regular babysitter. I did remember her in snippets for years. But I *know* I didn't remember a "goodbye" because I remember asking my mom many times as a kid what happened to her and my mom aswering "we moved away." I assure everyone, I was not scared or hurt by that at all. It was in fact I think a good experience for me, in that it taught me that people sometimes come & go from life. Lex, your kid will be fin. And that really all that should matter to you... well no, in fact not seeing this woman means you will not have that stress either, which is also important. Its all good, send one of the colder 'just the facts' blow-off emails and never open one from her again.
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve. (more background in Post #15)
Post by: lowspark on October 10, 2012, 07:38:12 AM
It seems to me that the point of the letter is to get you to hire her back as a language tutor. All the rest is just commentary. The request to meet up again for a final good bye is an attempt at manipulation on her part to get you to agree to hire her back if you say no.

Cicero said it first but my thought is to reply a very short, very curt, and very plain:
No thank you.

Then block her email.
I do understand the point of view of caregivers who are posting here. It can be heart wrenching to never see a child you've cared for again. But this is a case of bed, made, lie. And there's no way I'd expose my three year old to this person again if I could help it.
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve. (more background in Post #15)
Post by: SeptGurl on October 10, 2012, 08:44:35 AM
Put me in the cynical camp. It sounds like the sitter's concern isn't for your DD but for herself. OP, you don't owe her closure or anything else. If you chose to ignore her e-mail, that would be reasonable. If you chose to send one of the great responses provided in this thread, that would be reasonable as well. But you don't owe her a response.
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve. (more background in Post #15)
Post by: andi on October 10, 2012, 08:53:05 AM
I'm not a doctor, just a mom of 3.  IMO, the immediate transition of losing the babysitter had to be hard for her, at this point, she is now past this.  Is there a chance at some point it will affect her in the future? Yep, but the damage has already been done - the babysitter was there one day and out of her life the next day.  A good-bye this far down the road is not for the daughter, it is for the babysitter.  If she'd been someone who'd been reliable and truly seemed to be the child first, and the exit was due to an emergency, I'd say get together.  But it sounds like the exit was due to the babysitter not taking the responsibility of her job seriously, and this good-bye is for her.  Unfortunately, she's asked too much of the OP and the door that was open to being there for her has closed.  I'd delete the email, block the address and move on.

Parking my POD right here.
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve.
Post by: Zilla on October 10, 2012, 08:58:28 AM


Extra BG (for clarity's sake):

This person basically used me as a dumping ground for her trainwreck of a life. She stopped showing up on time. She kept asking for more and more favors (pay advances, schedule changes, a shoulder to cry on when things went wrong - and they constantly went wrong). It all boiled down to one thing - it wasn't about my DD anymore. It was about keeping the babysitter afloat regardless of how it was affecting everybody else involved. I began to worry about the influence that all the extra drama was going to have on my child.

Her age was never an issue. To me, that's irrelevant. The problem was unprofessional behavior that bordered on toxicity. She was self-centered, emotionally immature, and somehow got it in her head that it was my responsibility to be her friend. The bile rises in my stomach at the thought of EVER having contact with her again. When I saw that she'd sent me an email, my blood pressure ticked up just reading her name. In my head, I had the same thought that I did when she was working with us and she sent me a text or started a sentence with, "Would it be possible ..." I always immediately thought, "What NOW?"

ETA: Anyone reading this notice my e-hell signature quote? I picked this one specifically because of her.   \/


Based on this update, I would be blunt and email:


I am glad things are looking up for you.   Thank you for your offer to tutor but we have made other arrangements. 


Thank you,
Lex


Keep it simple and ignore the request to meet.  If she emails again, ignore.  Sorry you had to put up with this!
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve. (more background in Post #15)
Post by: wallaby on October 10, 2012, 09:55:55 AM
Ok I know I am seriously in the minority on this one  :-[, but I actually think a polite but firm, relatively detailed reply is appropriate, so there is no question of why there will be no further contact or employment. I think the babysitter really needs to be told which aspects of her work were unacceptable, and I think the OP spelling it out for her would be not only be entirely appropriate as her former employer, but therapeutic for the OP herself. I think OP is then fine to ignore any future emails.

I do think it is necessary to acknowledge the apology that was offered, and indicate whether or not it is accepted. (I don't think the OP is under any obligation to accept it). I also think it is appropriate to let the babysitter explicitly know the impact of her sudden departure (difficulties experienced in having to replace her at short notice, the distress babysitter's sudden departure caused daughter, etc). Much of this could almost be cut and pasted from the original post here. With the update, I also think it would be appropriate to spell out the specific issues with her work performance in general. It might even be worth explicitly stating you will not be able to recommend her services if you think she is likely to ask.
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve. (more background in Post #15)
Post by: KarenK on October 10, 2012, 10:11:05 AM
In the interest of full disclosure, I have no children, but I did have one unbalanced aunt. The former Babysitter reminds me very much of her.

I think the potential for manipulation of the OP's DD here is very high. "Remember all the fun we had? Don't you want me to watch you again?" That kind of stuff.

Either that, or the former babysitter will become very emotional and upset the OP's DD, who will not understand any of it. This is what my aunt did.

Add in the "I'll tutor her on my terms" bit, and overall, I don't like the sound of any of this.

I'd use one of the more brief responses suggested above. I think the OP does need to respond, but give no hint of friendship or encouragement.
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve. (more background in Post #15)
Post by: Outdoor Girl on October 10, 2012, 10:20:10 AM
OP, I think you need to look at how you respond in terms of what is best for your own sanity and well being.  This person left you high and dry so if you decide you don't want to respond at all and block her email?  Totally appropriate.  If it would make YOU feel better to respond somehow, decide what response would be best for you.  If a short and sweet 'Thank you for the offer but  DD is settled and we have no further need for your services.  Please do not contact us again' is what is best for you?  Go for it.

If you want to write up a detailed response outlining all the reasons why you have no interest in ever seeing this woman again, do it.  But don't send it.  Write it in Word rather than Outlook to make it easier to resist the temptation to send it.  Print it and burn it if you like.
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve. (more background in Post #15)
Post by: sourwolf on October 10, 2012, 10:24:44 AM
I think you need to reply if only so that it is made absolutely clear that you don't want to have any further contact with her.  If she is so used to "no boundaries" I could see her thinking that no reply meant you didn't get the e-mail or as a tacit "ok" for her to stop by.
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve. (more background in Post #15)
Post by: bopper on October 10, 2012, 10:49:23 AM
Seeing your daughter again would only make things less painful for the old babysitter, not your daughter.
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve. (more background in Post #15)
Post by: Amara on October 10, 2012, 11:20:23 AM
First, I think you do need to respond to her message. And not because of courtesy either. If you do not not respond, she has no way of knowing you received the message. It could have easily gone astray, and she will surely try again, at least once, perhaps several times. Save yourself the trouble and answer it now.

Second, you choice of how to answer has been well addressed here. I tend to agree more with Nya and those who feel a very brief reply is the way to go. I wouldn't address your daughter in it at all. It would read more along the lines of this:

Babysitter,

It is good your life is better now, but we will not be using your services again or meeting with you. Please do not contact us ever again.

Cordially,

OP
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve. (more background in Post #15)
Post by: Lexophile on October 10, 2012, 01:00:52 PM
Thanks everyone for your advice. It only confirms my feelings and gives me confidence for my chosen course of action.

Because old babysitter left so abruptly, she left some things at our house that belonged to her. This morning, I boxed it all up and sent it back. No note. I made sure everything was in there so that she would have no logical reason to contact us ever again.

I think I will respond to the email, only to confirm that I did receive it. I also want to make good and certain that I document a clear, unmistakable message to her that I want no further contact. I'll be polite, but in the unlikely event that things escalate, I want proof that she knows our wishes.
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve. (more background in Post #15)
Post by: mj on October 10, 2012, 03:09:50 PM
Ok I know I am seriously in the minority on this one  :-[, but I actually think a polite but firm, relatively detailed reply is appropriate, so there is no question of why there will be no further contact or employment. I think the babysitter really needs to be told which aspects of her work were unacceptable, and I think the OP spelling it out for her would be not only be entirely appropriate as her former employer, but therapeutic for the OP herself. I think OP is then fine to ignore any future emails.

I do think it is necessary to acknowledge the apology that was offered, and indicate whether or not it is accepted. (I don't think the OP is under any obligation to accept it). I also think it is appropriate to let the babysitter explicitly know the impact of her sudden departure (difficulties experienced in having to replace her at short notice, the distress babysitter's sudden departure caused daughter, etc). Much of this could almost be cut and pasted from the original post here. With the update, I also think it would be appropriate to spell out the specific issues with her work performance in general. It might even be worth explicitly stating you will not be able to recommend her services if you think she is likely to ask.

I am torn between this opinion and sending no email at all.  The description of your babysitter sounds like some of the older family members of mine that never were told how unacceptable their behavior was, people just cut them out and avoided them for eternity.  Although you do not  have any obligation to respond to her, I do often think that sometimes people need to hear feedback (all of us do) and often times the people who need it the most do not get it.  If you do decide to email her back, I would keep it totally professional and devoid of any emotion. 
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve. (more background in Post #15)
Post by: O'Dell on October 10, 2012, 03:32:18 PM
Ok I know I am seriously in the minority on this one  :-[, but I actually think a polite but firm, relatively detailed reply is appropriate, so there is no question of why there will be no further contact or employment. I think the babysitter really needs to be told which aspects of her work were unacceptable, and I think the OP spelling it out for her would be not only be entirely appropriate as her former employer, but therapeutic for the OP herself. I think OP is then fine to ignore any future emails.

I do think it is necessary to acknowledge the apology that was offered, and indicate whether or not it is accepted. (I don't think the OP is under any obligation to accept it). I also think it is appropriate to let the babysitter explicitly know the impact of her sudden departure (difficulties experienced in having to replace her at short notice, the distress babysitter's sudden departure caused daughter, etc). Much of this could almost be cut and pasted from the original post here. With the update, I also think it would be appropriate to spell out the specific issues with her work performance in general. It might even be worth explicitly stating you will not be able to recommend her services if you think she is likely to ask.

I agree with what you've said.

I'm a pragmatist. I think the best way to approach this situation is to decide what outcome you want and then chose the best way to get that within the bounds of etiquette. So, Lexophile, what do you want? We know you don't want you or your daughter to have contact with her. Ignoring the email carries a high likelihood of her contacting you again...she'll justify it somehow. So I think you need to respond.

If you want closure from your end, you have the right to tell her what you need to for that to happen. If that means you tell her not to contact you again and why you want nothing to do with her and that you will not recommend her services so you don't even have to worry about calls to be a reference, that is fine. If you really just want to be rid of her, then you might choose to be icily professional in your response.

Your proposed email is fine. I think you could more firm and explicit and still be fine. Send the answer that you can feel good about sending. Don't worry too much about how she will feel when she gets it. You aren't overreacting and it's okay for her to feel the consequences of having treated you so poorly.
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve. (more background in Post #15)
Post by: GeauxTigers on October 10, 2012, 05:51:38 PM
""Arrangments are already in place with a replacement tutor. This decision is final; no further contact is needed."

Then block her.
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve. (more background in Post #15)
Post by: Ceallach on October 10, 2012, 06:28:47 PM
When I was about 2.75 years old, my family moved. Before that I had a regular babysitter. I did remember her in snippets for years. But I *know* I didn't remember a "goodbye" because I remember asking my mom many times as a kid what happened to her and my mom aswering "we moved away." I assure everyone, I was not scared or hurt by that at all. It was in fact I think a good experience for me, in that it taught me that people sometimes come & go from life. Lex, your kid will be fin. And that really all that should matter to you... well no, in fact not seeing this woman means you will not have that stress either, which is also important. Its all good, send one of the colder 'just the facts' blow-off emails and never open one from her again.

I do agree with you.  I had LOTS of different babysitters as a kid because we moved a few times.  So I'd have somebody for a year or 2 and then we'd move or they'd move.  While I fond memories of them, I don't recall feeling any trauma whatsoever at their absence from my life, nor was there any heartfelt goodbyes.   In fact, I think that a goodbye might have been more confusing!   It would have been different were it a close family member who disappeared, but even small children know the distinction between their family unit versus other close people in their life who while they may be wonderful and have deep bonds, may come and go over time.   I am grateful to them for the role they played in my life, and would happily exchange pleasantries if our lives ever crossed paths (although I doubt that would happen 30 years on!) but that's the extent of it.   So I agree that this is more about the babysitter's "needs" than the child's needs.   

Actually, thinking about it, I'm painfully aware that the kids I cared for and adored when they were wee ones don't really know nor care for me either!  I moved away when they were still small, after spending 3-4 years caring for them.    I'd like to think that I formed some permanent bond with them, but I know the fact is that despite being a positive influence in their lives I'm not anybody significant to them at all.   I did see them a couple of times when they were older, and they were polite and friendly (lovely kids actually), but barely remembered me! 
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve. (more background in Post #15)
Post by: still in va on October 10, 2012, 06:41:05 PM
Ok I know I am seriously in the minority on this one  :-[, but I actually think a polite but firm, relatively detailed reply is appropriate, so there is no question of why there will be no further contact or employment. I think the babysitter really needs to be told which aspects of her work were unacceptable, and I think the OP spelling it out for her would be not only be entirely appropriate as her former employer, but therapeutic for the OP herself. I think OP is then fine to ignore any future emails.

I do think it is necessary to acknowledge the apology that was offered, and indicate whether or not it is accepted. (I don't think the OP is under any obligation to accept it). I also think it is appropriate to let the babysitter explicitly know the impact of her sudden departure (difficulties experienced in having to replace her at short notice, the distress babysitter's sudden departure caused daughter, etc). Much of this could almost be cut and pasted from the original post here. With the update, I also think it would be appropriate to spell out the specific issues with her work performance in general. It might even be worth explicitly stating you will not be able to recommend her services if you think she is likely to ask.

I am torn between this opinion and sending no email at all.  The description of your babysitter sounds like some of the older family members of mine that never were told how unacceptable their behavior was, people just cut them out and avoided them for eternity.  Although you do not  have any obligation to respond to her, I do often think that sometimes people need to hear feedback (all of us do) and often times the people who need it the most do not get it.  If you do decide to email her back, I would keep it totally professional and devoid of any emotion.

mk, i really don't understand why someone who abandoned her job, with no notice, by e-mail, should need feedback that doing so would make that employer who they abandoned less than willing to give them any accommodation whatsoever.  do people really need to be told this, to have it explained that walking out with no notice as a babysitter to a working mom who depends upon your presence is a bridge-burning event? 
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve. (more background in Post #15)
Post by: wallaby on October 10, 2012, 07:18:25 PM
still in va: I know your question was posed to mj, but if I can explain from my point of view: my reading of the info provided by the OP is that the babysitter left suddenly due to some kind of personal crisis, not maliciousness or just deciding one day she didn't feel like it anymore. To me leaving in a crisis is not the same as abandoning a job. This is really pivotal in how I think about the babysitter in this situation. The OP indicates in her first post that she understands the reasons for the sudden departure.
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve. (more background in Post #15)
Post by: buvezdevin on October 10, 2012, 07:27:12 PM
While I do not think OP owed any reply email, and I almost always agree with still in va's posts, I will in this case offer the slightly dissenting view that some people do benefit from being called on, or told the collateral and direct results of their actions.

While many, and quite likely the previous child carer in this case, will not "see the light" and they either realize the impact of their actions and don't care, or will never "get" that the world doesn't stop for them as they wish - some would take a wake up call and use it to open their eyes.

I know I have personally benefitted from feedback which opened my eyes to impacts of my own actions, which I then immediately set about revising.  Nothing on the order of the OP's previous babysitter's behavior, and I don't think feedback is "owed" here.  But just as "common sense" isn't all that common to all, some folks *can* have a lightbulb moment when hearing something like "your prior actions greatly inconvenienced me, and caused a sudden change for DD without time to plan.  DD is happy with current arrangements, your previous lack of reliability would prevent me from ever hiring you again, and - as DD is now doing well - meeting with you for closure is not desirable for us."
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve. (more background in Post #15)
Post by: still in va on October 10, 2012, 07:53:50 PM
still in va: I know your question was posed to mj, but if I can explain from my point of view: my reading of the info provided by the OP is that the babysitter left suddenly due to some kind of personal crisis, not maliciousness or just deciding one day she didn't feel like it anymore. To me leaving in a crisis is not the same as abandoning a job. This is really pivotal in how I think about the babysitter in this situation. The OP indicates in her first post that she understands the reasons for the sudden departure.

wallaby, from reading the OP's posts, it seems to me that the babysitter's entire life was one long drama.  when the parents of the child being babysat by the babysitter spend more time supporting the babysitter than worrying about their child, there is a problem.  i understand why you feel the way that you do if you are basing this solely on the original post, but i would direct you to post #15, where Lexophile further explains this. 

no matter what the circumstances or the reason, the babysitter did abandon her job.  now, a month later, she's back, wanting to see the child one afternoon a week and stating that the OP must make arrangements that are beneficial to the babysitter.  um, no.  if you are my employee, it is your job to fit with my schedule and requirements, it is not my job to make it easier for you.  and i am under no illusions that the former babysitter wants to take the DD one afternoon a week from the goodness of her heart.  i'm sure she will be expecting to be paid for her time.  which i have no problem with. 

additionally, this was completely unsolicited.  Lex is not at all interested in any relationship with the former babysitter. frankly, reading all of Lex's posts, i wouldn't want anything to do with her either.
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve. (more background in Post #15)
Post by: jpcher on October 10, 2012, 08:03:07 PM
Thanks everyone for your advice. It only confirms my feelings and gives me confidence for my chosen course of action.

Because old babysitter left so abruptly, she left some things at our house that belonged to her. This morning, I boxed it all up and sent it back. No note. I made sure everything was in there so that she would have no logical reason to contact us ever again.

I think I will respond to the email, only to confirm that I did receive it. I also want to make good and certain that I document a clear, unmistakable message to her that I want no further contact. I'll be polite, but in the unlikely event that things escalate, I want proof that she knows our wishes.

I'm chiming in late on this thread, but I do think that your course of action is spot on.
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve. (more background in Post #15)
Post by: Tabby Uprising on October 10, 2012, 08:24:23 PM
still in va: I know your question was posed to mj, but if I can explain from my point of view: my reading of the info provided by the OP is that the babysitter left suddenly due to some kind of personal crisis, not maliciousness or just deciding one day she didn't feel like it anymore. To me leaving in a crisis is not the same as abandoning a job. This is really pivotal in how I think about the babysitter in this situation. The OP indicates in her first post that she understands the reasons for the sudden departure.

wallaby, from reading the OP's posts, it seems to me that the babysitter's entire life was one long drama.  when the parents of the child being babysat by the babysitter spend more time supporting the babysitter than worrying about their child, there is a problem.  i understand why you feel the way that you do if you are basing this solely on the original post, but i would direct you to post #15, where Lexophile further explains this. 

no matter what the circumstances or the reason, the babysitter did abandon her job.  now, a month later, she's back, wanting to see the child one afternoon a week and stating that the OP must make arrangements that are beneficial to the babysitter.  um, no.  if you are my employee, it is your job to fit with my schedule and requirements, it is not my job to make it easier for you.  and i am under no illusions that the former babysitter wants to take the DD one afternoon a week from the goodness of her heart.  i'm sure she will be expecting to be paid for her time.  which i have no problem with. 

additionally, this was completely unsolicited.  Lex is not at all interested in any relationship with the former babysitter. frankly, reading all of Lex's posts, i wouldn't want anything to do with her either.

I very much agree with you, still in va.  In my own experience, for whatever that is worth, I have found people in a continuous drama-loop aren't receptive to feedback.  They simply filter out what they don't want to hear and see feedback as an open invitation to further include you in their drama. 

I feel a brief response will better discourage the former sitter from further communication.  She may take the feedback as an opportunity to explain herself, defend her actions, tell her sob story, etc and continue the drama cycle with Lex.  At some point Lex is going to have to cut it off so why not just make that cut now?
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve. (more background in Post #15)
Post by: johelenc1 on October 10, 2012, 09:40:38 PM
With the update, I do understand the OP's reluctance.  I had also read the babysitter's departure as something happening in her personal life that may not have been entirely in her control:  a death in the family, break up or trying to break up a bad relationship, or mental illness needing treatment.  If the procuring event had been managed and she was trying to apologize for her behavior, then I could see giving her chance.

But, it sounds like there was a great deal going on before she even left.  I do think you should send back an email, but I don't think you need to be harsh, or mean.  "Glad to hear things are better for you now.  DD is doing great.  It was nice of you to check on her.  Best of luck to you."

If she doesn't get the hint and emails you again, then you can ignore her completely.
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve. (more background in Post #15)
Post by: HonorH on October 10, 2012, 11:53:27 PM
I like NyaChan's email. Short, sweet, to the point, and very polite. In the event that the babysitter continues to try to inveigle her way back into your life, you can send her a "Don't contact us again" email. I dunno, that's the way I'd do it.
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve. (more background in Post #15)
Post by: MamaMootz on October 11, 2012, 09:13:54 AM
I guess it's just me being older or something, but I would not mince words with this woman. She left your DD high and dry and made the transition difficult. I don't think you need to be mean, but don't be wordy. I disagree with the thought of ignoring because if she is such a Drama Llama, she will escalate contact.

Dear Ex-Babysitter,

DD has transitioned quite well. No further tutoring or contact is necessary.

Lexophile

Then block her e-mail.
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve. (more background in Post #15)
Post by: Zilla on October 11, 2012, 09:24:33 AM
Any update on this OP?  Hope it's the last of it.
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve. (more background in Post #15, non-update page 4)
Post by: Lexophile on October 11, 2012, 09:45:47 AM
I was planning on sending the email today, but I'm really mincing around about exactly what I will say.

It was a personal crisis that caused former sitter to quit, but as PPs have said, her life was one long loop of personal crises. On top of all of that, when the tables were turned (we had a series of very real, very scary things happen to our family within the space of a month), she got ugly and demanded to know how we were going to support her. I actually got a lecture from her about how I rely on her to be there, and she has to rely on me for her livelihood.

So when the chips were down, it was ok for her to have all kinds of problems keeping her end of the deal, but we were just supposed to suck it up and be flexible. But when we had a major emergency that meant we didn't need her for a day or two (I had to evacuate my house for a few days because of a wildfire), all I got is grief because it meant she was out that money. She didn't think there was anything wrong with the way she behaved.

I still have some very deep-seated emotions surrounding this person. I'm not in a place where I'm willing to stir all that up again. I'm seriously considering letting her box of stuff that I sent her be my message that we're done and blocking her email now without replying.
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve. (more background in Post #15)
Post by: lowspark on October 11, 2012, 09:50:22 AM
I'm seriously considering letting her box of stuff that I sent her be my message that we're done and blocking her email now without replying.

I think that's a great idea.
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve. (more background in Post #15)
Post by: Roe on October 11, 2012, 10:06:28 AM
Based on your description, I am not sure ignoring her email will let her know not to contact you again, otherwise, I'd have said to ignore it.  If you think she will recognize the lack of contact as you ignoring her, then it'll work. Otherwise, I think a quick "Thank you. We no longer need your services. Goodbye." may be needed.  But only you can answer that question.

Good luck!
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve. (more background in Post #15)
Post by: BarensMom on October 11, 2012, 10:36:02 AM
I hope you sent that box of stuff return receipt or whatever it is that makes the recipient sign for the box.  You might need the proof that it was sent and received.
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve. (more background in Post #15)
Post by: Outdoor Girl on October 11, 2012, 10:53:17 AM
Dear Ex-Babysitter,

DD has transitioned quite well. No further tutoring or contact is necessary.

Lexophile

Then block her e-mail.

If you do decide to send an e-mail, I like this one.  There are no 'nice' words in it, like thank you and please but it isn't rude and gets the message across quite well.

But if you decide to let the box of stuff be your message, I think that's fine, too.
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve. (more background in Post #15)
Post by: rose red on October 11, 2012, 11:02:43 AM
Dear Ex-Babysitter,

DD has transitioned quite well. No further tutoring or contact is necessary.

Lexophile

Then block her e-mail.

If you do decide to send an e-mail, I like this one.  There are no 'nice' words in it, like thank you and please but it isn't rude and gets the message across quite well.

But if you decide to let the box of stuff be your message, I think that's fine, too.

I like this one the best of all too.  Like you said, no nice words but no harsh ones either.  I think all this person deserves from the OP is indifference.
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve. (more background in Post #15)
Post by: Lexophile on October 11, 2012, 11:54:03 AM
I hope you sent that box of stuff return receipt or whatever it is that makes the recipient sign for the box.  You might need the proof that it was sent and received.

Yep. FedEx with a tracking number.
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve. (more background in Post #15, Update in post 66)
Post by: Lexophile on October 11, 2012, 02:38:19 PM
**UPDATE**

The package was delivered today. She sent a short email thanking me for it.

I replied with a simple email that said, "Good luck to you, <old babysitter's name>."

I hope that's the end of it.
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve. (more background in Post #15, Update in post 66)
Post by: Danika on October 11, 2012, 03:40:52 PM
Glad you sent the package.

In my experience, people like her are so self-absorbed that anything you say to them will not compute. No matter what you say, how clear, vague, long-winded, brief, shocking, polite or diplomatic, she's going to blame *you* and think *you* were rude and at fault.

I agree with the PP who said just do what's best for your mental-health. If it's therapeutic to tell her off, do it. If it's less stress on you to delete and block email and phone, do it.
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve. (more background in Post #15, Update in post 66, 68[!])
Post by: Lexophile on October 12, 2012, 02:51:44 PM
**NEW UPDATE**

The fun never ends. She's upset now at the message that we don't want to see her anymore. She says that her son (13 years old) is "devastated that we won't see DD anymore" and that she doesn't "understand our family's apparent decision to cut off contact." She even had the nerve to lecture ME on not breaking my daughter's heart. As if we are pining away for her? I don't get it!

What do I do now? She obviously doesn't get the hint that we aren't going to meet with her. Here is what I propose as my response:

"I need to think about DD now.

It wasn't easy to explain to her why you suddenly weren't there anymore. It took us awhile to settle into a good routine for her. I do not want to confuse her.

You said in your previous email that you understand if we want no further contact. Please respect my wishes. Thank you."

Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve. (more background in Post #15, Update in post 66)
Post by: NyaChan on October 12, 2012, 02:55:12 PM
I recommend not responding.  You said you didn't want to have contact with her - you have essentially given her the cut direct, now hold to it. Responding in any way tells her that you didn't mean it when you said you didn't want further contact.
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve. (more background in Post #15, Update in post 66)
Post by: rose red on October 12, 2012, 02:56:11 PM
I think you need to block her email/phone number, etc. 

Even if you'll never let her see you in person, if you emal her back, you are still giving her the attention to her drama which is what she wants anyway.  Do not respond.
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve. (BG in Post #15, Updates in post 66, 68[!])
Post by: Lexophile on October 12, 2012, 02:59:15 PM
I think I've decided to do just that. My inner eHellion is saying, "Hey, Lex, don't engage the crazy."

I'm shaking I'm so angry at her right now. She really has a pair of big ones to be incredulous with me after what she's pulled.
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve. (BG in Post #15, Updates in post 66 and 68 [!])
Post by: lowspark on October 12, 2012, 03:01:40 PM
Yes. Another vote for
-don't respond
-block her email & phone
-go have a glass of wine and forget about her. She's not worth the aggravation.
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve. (BG in Post #15, Updates in post 66 and 68 [!])
Post by: Miss Unleaded on October 12, 2012, 03:03:29 PM
Is it possible she will show up on your doorstep unannounced if she doesn't hear back from you? 
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve. (BG in Post #15, Updates in post 66 and 68 [!])
Post by: FauxFoodist on October 12, 2012, 03:04:20 PM
Yes. Another vote for
-don't respond
-block her email & phone
-go have a glass of wine and forget about her. She's not worth the aggravation.

Pod.  Don't JADE since she's obviously trying to go that route.  You'll feel much better for just cutting off contact now.
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve. (BG in Post #15, Updates in post 66 and 68 [!])
Post by: Danika on October 12, 2012, 03:39:00 PM
Her line of thinking reminds me of when little kids fight:

KidOne screams: "Yes!"
KidTwo screams: "No!"
KidOne screams: "Yes!"
KidTwo screams: "No!"

You'll get into a never-ending battle with the illogic if you try to engage. Do not engage the crazy! Step away! Save your sanity.

The others are right. Block her phone numbers. Block her email address. Keep your doors locked.

Then, go think of something nice and relaxing and play with DD.
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve. (BG in Post #15, Updates in post 66 and 68 [!])
Post by: GSNW on October 12, 2012, 03:42:02 PM
Definitely ignore and block at this stage!  You have extended as much courtesy and politeness as can reasonably expected, and you don't owe her a further explanation or rationalization.  Your DD, your family, your decision, end of story.
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve. (BG in Post #15, Updates in post 66 and 68 [!])
Post by: yokozbornak on October 12, 2012, 03:42:30 PM
I agree that you should not respond and block contact.  If she does show up at your house, call the police.  You have told her you want no contact, and it this point you don't owe her anything. 
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve. (BG in Post #15, Updates in post 66 and 68 [!])
Post by: LEMon on October 12, 2012, 04:02:31 PM
Call me 'highly cynical' but I think this has more to do with the work/money that she hopes to get from you.  Remember that awesome opportunity she offered at the beginning.  A part of me thinks she is hoping your daughter's response to her will make you take her up on that deal.

No response = the best response.
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve. (BG in Post #15, Updates in post 66 and 68 [!])
Post by: buvezdevin on October 12, 2012, 04:06:01 PM
Agree with others, but I don't see that OP ever stated/wrote the desire for no further contact in an email or other message which OP sent.  Other than an implied lack of desire to resume contact by not leaping at the opportunity to pay the woman to spend time with OP's daughter on the woman's terms.

Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve. (BG in Post #15, Updates in post 66 and 68 [!])
Post by: NutMeg on October 12, 2012, 04:24:55 PM
You didn't want to reply in the first place, but you sent a short clear message. Don't dilute that message by responding again. She has the power to upset you with just an email. Take that away from her. You are creating a more peaceful and secure environment for you and your family, and you don't need to explain that to her.
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve. (more background in Post #15, Update in post 66, 68[!])
Post by: weeblewobble on October 12, 2012, 04:42:10 PM
**NEW UPDATE**

The fun never ends. She's upset now at the message that we don't want to see her anymore. She says that her son (13 years old) is "devastated that we won't see DD anymore" and that she doesn't "understand our family's apparent decision to cut off contact." She even had the nerve to lecture ME on not breaking my daughter's heart. As if we are pining away for her? I don't get it!

What do I do now? She obviously doesn't get the hint that we aren't going to meet with her. Here is what I propose as my response:

"I need to think about DD now.

It wasn't easy to explain to her why you suddenly weren't there anymore. It took us awhile to settle into a good routine for her. I do not want to confuse her.

You said in your previous email that you understand if we want no further contact. Please respect my wishes. Thank you."

No response.  Every time you respond, you are prolonging this interaction.  You know you're not breaking DD's heart, so why tell the babysitter this?  She's only trying to guilt you into responding and possibly bending to her will.  She doesn't have to understand why you're breaking off contact.  Your family, your child, your decision.  If she doesn't like it, she shouldn't have behaved so flakily and selfishly.
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve. (BG in Post #15, Updates in post 66 and 68 [!])
Post by: Lexophile on October 12, 2012, 04:58:18 PM
Agree with others, but I don't see that OP ever stated/wrote the desire for no further contact in an email or other message which OP sent.  Other than an implied lack of desire to resume contact by not leaping at the opportunity to pay the woman to spend time with OP's daughter on the woman's terms.

This is the crux of my struggle right now. I was hoping to avoid coming right out and saying that she is no longer welcome in our lives. I thought my message was pretty clear, but apparently, she's going to be outraged with anything less than, "Oh! Please come back to us pleasepleaseplease!"

That's the only impetus I had for sending a response at all. I want her to understand - unequivocally - that we will never, ever want her back again. But I feel like answering her now would only incite another bombastic email and open myself up to the kind of emotional abuse I'm trying to move past.

So I guess I've elected to block and ignore. I don't think she'd show up here at the house because it's kind of far from hers, but DD's teachers are on alert not to allow her near my daughter if she "drops by" at school.
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve. (BG in Post #15, Updates in post 66 and 68 [!])
Post by: MyFamily on October 12, 2012, 05:08:17 PM
You know, somehow I thought this was a young woman, maybe in her early 20's, since she is very similar to my niece who is that age*.  Finding out she has a 13 year-old child sort of made me go 'whuhhh'.  Combine that with the idea that she was so awful when you were dealing with a wildfire near your home just makes me angry on your behalf.

I think ignoring her is the best thing to do.  She is wrong.  The best thing for your daughter is to keep her out of your lives.  And if she used her 13 year old son to try to convince you to see her again so that she can get some partial employment from you, then she is not the person to watch your child because she will use your child to achieve her own needs.  If she could do it to hers, she'll do it to yours.

Ignore and block her emails.

*And now I pray even harder that my niece actually outgrows this stage and doesn't turn into this 10 or more years down the road.
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve. (BG in Post #15, Updates in post 66 and 68 [!])
Post by: otterwoman on October 12, 2012, 05:33:53 PM
I'd send the email stating not to ever contact you again, clearly stated. Then, when she does, and you know she will, you will have the email trail to show to the police.
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve. (BG in Post #15, Updates in post 66 and 68 [!])
Post by: buvezdevin on October 12, 2012, 05:36:10 PM

...So I guess I've elected to block and ignore...

Good!  Do not feel badly about this, at least across the Internet it definitely seems best for you and your family. 
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve. (BG in Post #15, Updates in post 66 and 68 [!])
Post by: Amara on October 12, 2012, 06:36:28 PM
I agree with all the previous posters that it is best to block and ignore any and all attempted contacts from her. If you did send a final message I would keep it very, very brief and blunt: "We will not be using your services in the future. Do not contact us again." But I would still vote for the block/ignore option instead.
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve. (more background in Post #15, Update in post 66, 68[!])
Post by: still in va on October 12, 2012, 06:54:14 PM
**NEW UPDATE**

The fun never ends. She's upset now at the message that we don't want to see her anymore. She says that her son (13 years old) is "devastated that we won't see DD anymore" and that she doesn't "understand our family's apparent decision to cut off contact." She even had the nerve to lecture ME on not breaking my daughter's heart. As if we are pining away for her? I don't get it!

What do I do now? She obviously doesn't get the hint that we aren't going to meet with her. Here is what I propose as my response:

"I need to think about DD now.

It wasn't easy to explain to her why you suddenly weren't there anymore. It took us awhile to settle into a good routine for her. I do not want to confuse her.

You said in your previous email that you understand if we want no further contact. Please respect my wishes. Thank you."

i think i would have to be real honest and really strong with my reply to this, Lex.  something along the lines of:

"you will have to deal with your son's disappointment.  that is not my responsibility, it is yours.  i am not responsible for your child.  my daughter is not heartbroken in the least that you are no longer a part of her life.  she has settled in very well with the new child support system and schooling that we have put into place following your sudden departure, with no notice, a month ago.

i have returned the belongings that you left in our home, and you have admitted that you have received them.  this ends our association.  do not contact us again in any format.  do not call, e-mail, come to our home or to DD's school.  any further attempt on your part to communicate with us will be ignored.  as previously conveyed to you, we have no desire to continue our association with you."
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve. (BG in Post #15, Updates in post 66 and 68 [!])
Post by: Danika on October 12, 2012, 08:35:13 PM
I think I'm having still in va compose my email replies from now on. I try too hard to be thoughtful of others' feelings even if they've trampled all over mine. still in va's response is not rude or mean. It's just factual. If I were to reply (I don't know if I'd waste the electrons or my own energy), I would go with that.  :D
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve. (BG in Post #15, Updates in post 66 and 68 [!])
Post by: johelenc1 on October 12, 2012, 08:45:35 PM
If the babysitter had wanted to respond in a way that would have helped her situation, she could have expressed gladness that DD was doing well, sadness she wouldn't see her again,  promises to think of their time together fondly and hope that if OP changed her mind or needed anything in the future, OP could let her know.  Then she should have wished OP and DD the best and been done.

What she did is shoot herself in the foot.

I was sympathetic to the babysitter in the beginning, but now, I wouldn't respond at all.  You may get a few more emails, but I doubt she will show up at your house.
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve. (BG in Post #15, Updates in post 66 and 68 [!])
Post by: jedikaiti on October 12, 2012, 08:51:07 PM
I would ignore/block, but if you find that you MUST respond, keep it short & to the (very sharp) point.

"We are all very happy with the current arrangements and will not be requiring your services now, or in the future. Please do not attempt to contact us again."

And close the door on her. If she keeps trying to contact you after that: document, document, document.
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve. (BG in Post #15, Updates in post 66 and 68 [!])
Post by: still in va on October 12, 2012, 08:53:00 PM
I think I'm having still in va compose my email replies from now on. I try too hard to be thoughtful of others' feelings even if they've trampled all over mine. still in va's response is not rude or mean. It's just factual. If I were to reply (I don't know if I'd waste the electrons or my own energy), I would go with that.  :D

aw, thanks, Danika! 

i am always available for e-mail consultation, for a nominal fee.....kidding!!!!!

i get very irritated when someone uses their child to get their way. and if they try to use mine?  oh E-Hell NO!!!!!!  not happening.
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve. (BG in Post #15, Updates in post 66 and 68 [!])
Post by: Danika on October 12, 2012, 09:09:21 PM
I think I'm having still in va compose my email replies from now on. I try too hard to be thoughtful of others' feelings even if they've trampled all over mine. still in va's response is not rude or mean. It's just factual. If I were to reply (I don't know if I'd waste the electrons or my own energy), I would go with that.  :D

i am always available for e-mail consultation, for a nominal fee.....kidding!!!!!

I will keep this in mind, still in va.  ;)
Title: Re: The. Very. Nerve. (BG in Post #15, Updates in post 66 and 68 [!])
Post by: WillyNilly on October 12, 2012, 11:41:26 PM
I vote block & ignore.

There's no rule you have to tell someone you are cutting them out of our life.  You can just go ahead and do it.  I think it can be helpful to a tell a person "please don't ever contact me again" in some situations, but its really not required.  And in this case I think it feeding the drama by prolonging it.  There are a lot of ways the babysitter could have approached the OP is a more rational, sympathetic way.  She chose instead to behave terribly.  Its perfectly ok for Lex to cut that out of her life 100% clean break no explanation, just do it.