Etiquette Hell

A Civil World. Off-topic discussions on a variety of topics. Guests, register for forum membership to see all the boards. => Time For a Coffee Break! => Topic started by: Softly Spoken on March 01, 2013, 09:57:57 PM

Title: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Softly Spoken on March 01, 2013, 09:57:57 PM
I have been following the snowflake thread, and I also read the notalwaysright websites, and I have noticed a pattern - apparently we of eHell are not the only ones who complain about rudeness. The only ones who are more vigilant than us are the people who are so quick to recognize 'rudeness' because they veritably live it! ???

To these people, "You are being rude" actually translates to "You are not doing what I say / Giving me what I want / Meeting my expectations / Kowtowing to my whims, etc." :o

I would like to hear about your most "Bizzaro (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bizarro_World)" experiences, in which you found yourself wondering if it was Opposite Day, or thinking you must have fallen into a different dimension because you were accused of being rude when you were not. Was it a cultural or generational misunderstanding, or a matter of meeting a very Special Snowflake? Were you ever vindicated or is this the first time you've had a chance to vent about the injustice you have suffered?

I think I felt like this often as a child when I was forced to go through the motions and "perform" for strangers, but when I was shy I was told "don't be rude." :-\

The only instance I can think of from my adulthood is when my father took offense that I did not want his new GF (who at the time he claimed was "just a friend" and as of last year is now his wife), who I had not even met at this point, at my 30th birthday party. Apparently there was a section in the new etiquette book that states "Even though it is your birthday (and a milestone one at that) and the celebration has traditionally been restricted to family and very close friends, you must accept the last minute addition of a veritable stranger (who you should have been introduced to way before now) and pretend that you are not uncomfortable meeting them for the first time in a very intimate setting." Yeah, I was the rude one. >:(

So what about you guys? What horrors have you experienced, and what horrors have you been accused of, in the name of (perverted or outdated) "etiquette"? Also, to keep us from wallowing in too much vitrol, I would also be interested in hearing the times when you thought you were being polite and because of an innocent misunderstanding you were not seen as such. For example I recently read that while in one culture it is polite to clean your plate, in another culture you must always leave a bite of food on your plate or else you are insulting your hosts by suggesting they did not give you enough. What faux pas can you only excuse with "I didn't know"? :-\
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette injustice and hipocrasy
Post by: Piratelvr1121 on March 01, 2013, 10:19:58 PM
Years ago I worked in an adult day care with 3 other women who had very entitled attitudes and the fact that they were of a different race than myself meant they often played the race card with me and accused me of being racist because "All you people are racist against ours because your people had slaves!!!"

I pointed out that my people were poor Irish potato farmers who could barely afford to feed themselves let alone buy and keep up slaves, which is why they came to America...after slavery was abolished.  (found out later that was just one branch of the family.  My paternal grandmother's mother and uncle came over before the civil war and he fought for the union...didn't have slaves either, but that's not the point)

Anyway, for the longest time these girls would pick on me and pester me and not having much of a backbone, I'd try to do nice things hoping killing them with kindness would get them to leave me alone.  This included giving them rides to the train station, as I was the only one with a car.  It didn't help and finally I got fed up and told them "Nope. Not getting a ride today or ever again."

I was rather proud of myself for standing up to them but when I made the mistake of talking about it with my parents I was told I was "Rude and should turn the other cheek because being nice might change their minds if you do it long enough."  ::)
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette injustice and hipocrasy
Post by: Erich L-ster on March 01, 2013, 10:31:21 PM
Most of the time I've encountered this was at work when a customer wanted me to do things that amounted to them getting a service for free (which was definitely against the rules).

I would tell them as nicely as possible, "I can't do X because we charge for that service. If you want me to do X, it would cost $X." Of course I was mean and rude for not giving away service for free.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette injustice and hipocrasy
Post by: Joeschmo on March 01, 2013, 11:11:58 PM
I try to live by the concept that if someone wrongs me today my hurt feelings are their fault hut if it still bothers me a year later its my fault so I don't have any stories to add other than I quit holding onto perceived injustices.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette injustice and hipocrasy
Post by: CrochetFanatic on March 01, 2013, 11:20:42 PM
I had a customer get angry with me and accuse me of being rude because I wouldn't let him take some free bananas.  I was taking the ones that were bruised and beginning to turn brown, counting them, writing them off on a clipboard and throwing them away to make room for the fresh shipment.  Personally, I wouldn't have cared.  They were bad, we couldn't sell them.  But if he got free bananas, he wouldn't be buying the stock and the store would lose money.  I wasn't losing my job over a lousy banana...
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette injustice and hipocrasy
Post by: nuit93 on March 02, 2013, 12:31:43 AM
I was frequently labeled rude and disrespectful by my stepfather for not finding his racist jokes funny or for (hidden for descriptions of abuse)not becoming anorexic 'like all the other teenage girls' because I was a teensy bit overweight and dared to eat my share of food.

He later would complain that I didn't appreciate enough that he wasn't one of those stepfathers who r@ped their stepchildren.  Because the other abuse apparently didn't mess me up enough...

Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette injustice and hipocrasy
Post by: Hawkwatcher on March 02, 2013, 02:46:39 AM
Salespeople have told me that I a rude because I have said "no thank you" to them.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette injustice and hipocrasy
Post by: Thipu1 on March 02, 2013, 06:14:57 AM
I haven't encountered much personally but the library where I worked got it all the time.

We were a high level research library with closed stacks. Although we would take drop-ins, appointments for anything more than quick reference were strongly encouraged.  Readers had to leave a picture ID at the front desk and also check everything but pencils and notebooks before going into the reading room. 

Of course, all this was extremely rude.  We were also told that we weren't open on weekends or evenings , 'out of spite'. 
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette injustice and hipocrasy
Post by: kherbert05 on March 02, 2013, 08:16:09 AM
I was racist and rude for


1. Not nominating a student for G&T - Except I had nominated her. she didn't want to be in the G&T group away from her friends so she kept intercepting and destroying the paper work. (We sent it certified mail - the carrier let a 10 yo sign for the paper work).


2. Not allowing a student to use ebonics in class. According to this mom ebonics included cursing out teachers.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette injustice and hipocrasy
Post by: Jocelyn on March 02, 2013, 09:38:20 AM
I was frequently labeled rude and disrespectful by my stepfather 
So your stepfather wanted to be praised for adhering to the minimal standards one has to adhere to, to aspire to be a decent, law-abiding human being?
That he could even think that thought, much less voice it! I hope you are taking steps to protect yourself and any children you might have.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette injustice and hipocrasy
Post by: Outdoor Girl on March 02, 2013, 09:52:28 AM
I had a customer get angry with me and accuse me of being rude because I wouldn't let him take some free bananas.  I was taking the ones that were bruised and beginning to turn brown, counting them, writing them off on a clipboard and throwing them away to make room for the fresh shipment.  Personally, I wouldn't have cared.  They were bad, we couldn't sell them.  But if he got free bananas, he wouldn't be buying the stock and the store would lose money.  I wasn't losing my job over a lousy banana...

See, I would pay 1/2 price for those bananas.  Because those are the best ones to use for banana bread.  Your store wasn't very smart - I can never find bananas on the reduced rack because they get snapped up so quickly.

My story:  I was in the middle of selling my house because I was moving to a city 1.5 hours away.  I had several people interested word of mouth so I was doing the sale myself, if I could, before calling an agent.  I had plans with a friend later in the day but was showing the house to the eventual buyer in the morning.  Friend called while I was showing the house.  In retrospect, I shouldn't have answered the phone but I did.  I let her know what I was doing and that I'd call her back as soon as they left.

The people finally left and I called her back.  And called her back... And called her back...  She never answered the phone.  When she finally deigned to answer the phone she chewed me out for hanging up on her and called me rude.  What?!?!?

Needless to say, she is now an ex-friend because of this and many other instances.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette injustice and hipocrasy
Post by: Acadianna on March 02, 2013, 10:30:10 AM
I was in the grocery a couple months ago.  Two women, one older and one younger, were shopping together, and their basket blocked the part of the shelves I needed to reach.  I was in no hurry at all, so I waited patiently and quietly about ten feet away (big aisle).  I promise, no frowning, no sighing, no eye-rolling -- EHell is a very good influence!

When they finally moved their basket back a bit.  I ducked into the space and got the one item I'd been waiting to reach.  This took (literally) all of about 3 seconds.  The older woman glared at me and said, "If you'd just waited, you could have gotten there."  The younger woman smiled at me rather sheepishly.

I said nothing to them (again, that good EHell influence), but I wanted to reply, "M'am, I did wait!"
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette injustice and hipocrasy
Post by: siamesecat2965 on March 02, 2013, 11:02:52 AM
I posted about this in the SS thread, but I had a customer tell me I was being soooo rude to her simply because she needed information I did not have access to (tracking number for something being sent from my store).  And I dont think she liked the fact I had to take her info, have the manager get the info and call her back.  and I had the unmitigated gall to politely let her know that as we were very busy, it may not be tonight hat we get back to her, but definitely first thing in the am.  I got the feeling she is not told no very often, and the fact I couldn't tell her what she wanted right that very instant made me rude. For the record, I was nothning but polite and professional.   She was the rude one.

Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette injustice and hipocrasy
Post by: Reika on March 02, 2013, 11:18:05 AM
The only people I can remember offhand calling me rude are the customers calling my company and not getting their way. It's usually because they couldn't be bothered to read their policies with us to see what was actually covered.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette injustice and hipocrasy
Post by: mbbored on March 02, 2013, 11:29:33 AM
I posted this a few years ago, but I feel it belongs in this thread. I was invited to a dinner party in honor of a long distance friend coming back to town. After I RSVP'd the hostess called me back to say my assigned dish was dessert and she liked chocolate! Because I wanted to see our mutual friend, I swung by the grocery store to pick up ingredients where instead I found their super yummy brownies were on special so I just bought a pan of those instead.

After the party, she called me up to scold me about bringing brownies which are not a "dinner dessert" and to tell me I was a cheapskate to bring a on-sale store bought contribution.

Uh yeah, those who do a bait and switch get pot luck and it's definitely not polite to criticize somebody's contributions that you DEMANDED they bring to your party.

Also, she put bananas in the salad and sliced them on top of my brownies and I hate bananas.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette injustice and hipocrasy
Post by: Emmy on March 02, 2013, 01:38:30 PM
A telemarketer called my parents house and started with her spiel.  My dad said "no thanks, we are not interested" a few times, but she kept continuing to push whatever she was trying to sell.  He said "good-bye" and hung up the phone while she was still talking.  She called back and as soon as he answered said "Don't you know it's rude to hang up one people", then hung up.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette injustice and hipocrasy
Post by: CrochetFanatic on March 02, 2013, 02:05:00 PM
I had a customer get angry with me and accuse me of being rude because I wouldn't let him take some free bananas.  I was taking the ones that were bruised and beginning to turn brown, counting them, writing them off on a clipboard and throwing them away to make room for the fresh shipment.  Personally, I wouldn't have cared.  They were bad, we couldn't sell them.  But if he got free bananas, he wouldn't be buying the stock and the store would lose money.  I wasn't losing my job over a lousy banana...

See, I would pay 1/2 price for those bananas.  Because those are the best ones to use for banana bread.  Your store wasn't very smart - I can never find bananas on the reduced rack because they get snapped up so quickly.

My story:  I was in the middle of selling my house because I was moving to a city 1.5 hours away.  I had several people interested word of mouth so I was doing the sale myself, if I could, before calling an agent.  I had plans with a friend later in the day but was showing the house to the eventual buyer in the morning.  Friend called while I was showing the house.  In retrospect, I shouldn't have answered the phone but I did.  I let her know what I was doing and that I'd call her back as soon as they left.

The people finally left and I called her back.  And called her back... And called her back...  She never answered the phone.  When she finally deigned to answer the phone she chewed me out for hanging up on her and called me rude.  What?!?!?

Needless to say, she is now an ex-friend because of this and many other instances.

I agree with you.  It's very rare that I find bananas that are anywhere near ready for banana bread, and when I do I snap them up.  Depending on how cold or warm it is, it could take up to a week and a half for bananas to get ripe enough for it.  We were specifically told not to give them away (nobody mentioned half-price, though), so I sympathized with the guy until he called me rude and selfish.

Having people hang up on me is one of my pet peeves even though it doesn't happen often, but it didn't sound to me like you were rude.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette injustice and hipocrasy
Post by: Outdoor Girl on March 02, 2013, 02:59:04 PM
^ Another friend (Louise) called me that morning, too.  I called her back when they left (after trying ex-friend) and we chatted for quite a while.  I said the exact same thing to Louise when I said I'd call her back so I asked her if she thought I was rude.  Louise said I was completely fine - and she is also the type of person to be very blunt so if Louise thought I'd been rude, she'd have told me.

A trick for bananas:  When I buy a bunch and the last one or two get over ripe, I peel them, break them up and throw them in a container in the freezer.  I make banana bread when the container is full.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette injustice and hipocrasy
Post by: Katana_Geldar on March 02, 2013, 03:22:56 PM
I used to do reception and data entry for a conference organising company it was run from home by a husband and wife. One of the conferences was for financial advisers and insurers and a semi-major bank (not one of the big four though) was a partner of the conference.

I was going through the various registrations seeing who still owed money, and I noticed the delegates from this bank had only paid about half as much as they needed to. I thought that was a bit odd and gave them a call and was put through to a rather snooty PA.

She told me that as partners for the conference they were entitled to pay the partners rate and get a discount. Now, the partners rate was for people going to the conference but didn't attend the sessions or lectures. They just went to the meals and presumably did something else during the day.

Now I knew that she was wrong and has to pay more money, but as they were a partner I gave her the benefit of the doubt. I told her that I would check and call her back.

One of the owners was sitting right next to me when I made the call so when I hung up I asked him. He took it directly to the client and the client confirmed what both he and I knew, that the partner rate was for people attending the meals and that they owed us the rest of the full rate.

So I got on the phone and talked again to the snooty PA. She tried to wheedle out of it, saying this was a special case but I had  confirmation directly from the client and I said they had to send the rest of the money to us. I was as nice as possible, saying that the partners rate was a bit confusing but anyone could make that sort of mistake and only ending the call when I had convinced her to send us a cheque.

One of the owners had been there for the entire call and commended me on how I handled it.

But two days later, his wife said she had a call from that bank and a woman was saying she had talked to a rude person from our office that had demanded they send us more money. I was shocked, as if anything the bank woman was rude and I had been polite of possible inspite of that. And I even had her husband as a witness as he heard everything I said and said I had handled it well.

All she said was I wasn't to talk to sponsors again and that she would deal with them direct.y and the matter wasn't raised again. I didn't last much longer in that job, but that's a different story...
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette injustice and hipocrasy
Post by: nuit93 on March 02, 2013, 05:39:34 PM
I was frequently labeled rude and disrespectful by my stepfather 
So your stepfather wanted to be praised for adhering to the minimal standards one has to adhere to, to aspire to be a decent, law-abiding human being?
That he could even think that thought, much less voice it! I hope you are taking steps to protect yourself and any children you might have.

Well, apparently us kids weren't deserving of respect, because we didn't pay the bills.  Among his other 'beliefs'... :o

He's actually my *former* stepfather, mom divorced him when I was in college.  Why it took her that long, I still don't know...but he's no longer in my life or his bio-children's lives.  Last time I saw him was when we had to call the police on him, and that was over decade ago.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette injustice and hipocrasy
Post by: PeterM on March 02, 2013, 05:41:30 PM
A telemarketer called my parents house and started with her spiel.  My dad said "no thanks, we are not interested" a few times, but she kept continuing to push whatever she was trying to sell.  He said "good-bye" and hung up the phone while she was still talking.  She called back and as soon as he answered said "Don't you know it's rude to hang up one people", then hung up.

I had someone I assumed was a telemarketer call me once. As soon as I said hello they said, "Hold on" and put me on hold.

So I hung up.

Same number called me back a few minutes later and the same voice berated me for being rude. Not even quickly before getting to his reason for calling. This guy was clearly going to spend some time on telling me how rude I was.

So I hung up.

I never did find out who it was or why he called.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette injustice and hipocrasy
Post by: Katana_Geldar on March 02, 2013, 06:11:04 PM
A telemarketer called my parents house and started with her spiel.  My dad said "no thanks, we are not interested" a few times, but she kept continuing to push whatever she was trying to sell.  He said "good-bye" and hung up the phone while she was still talking.  She called back and as soon as he answered said "Don't you know it's rude to hang up one people", then hung up.

I had someone I assumed was a telemarketer call me once. As soon as I said hello they said, "Hold on" and put me on hold.

So I hung up.

Same number called me back a few minutes later and the same voice berated me for being rude. Not even quickly before getting to his reason for calling. This guy was clearly going to spend some time on telling me how rude I was.

So I hung up.

I never did find out who it was or why he called.

I once got a call from a telemarketer asking If I was happy with my bank. I said "Yes" and hung up. Then he called me back.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette injustice and hipocrasy
Post by: weeblewobble on March 02, 2013, 06:25:11 PM
Katana_Gelder, oh the joys of administrating for a "professional agency."  ;D

My old employer ran continuing education conferences for medical professionals.  I have never seen people behave so irrationally or rudely in a professional setting as when we organized our annual national conferences. Two examples:

Example 1: We gave out official tote bags containing registration information and goodies and soon as the participants signed in.  That meant that a lot of people were carrying matching bags all week.  The participants would put their wallets, phones, keys, etc. in the bags, so you would THINK they would keep them with them at all times.  But one afternoon, one of the participants came up to the registration desk and SLAMMED his tote bag on the registration tables, nearly whacking one of my coworkers in the head.  (She ducked.)  and the following conversation ensued:

Rude Participant: THIS ISN'T MY BAG!

My Boss (calm): OK, whose bag is it?

Rude Participant: (Yanking out the wallet inside and tossing it at us, actually hitting the coworker who ducked before.) I don't know. YOU look at the ID.

My Boss looks at the ID and takes the bag behind the registration desk while the Rude Participant rants, "I left my bag in one of the session rooms and went to the lunch buffet.  When I got back, it was on a different chair.  I just opened it and someone else's stuff is inside!"

Please keep in mind that lunch was hours before, so this guy had carried around someone else's bag for about five hours.

My Boss: "First, this is a huge hotel in the middle of a major city.  We can't control who walks through this area, so we definitely don't recommend leaving a bag with a wallet and phone in it unattended.  And second, when you couldn't find your bag why would you take someone else's and walk off with it?"

Rude Participant: (shocked and appalled) "Well, there's no reason to be RUDE about it!"

We finally got the guy to calm down and take his bag, which had been turned into the Lost and Found.  And then a half-hour later, another participant (the one whose ID was in the "misappropriated" bag walked up to the desk, fuming, "Where the hell is my bag?!"

I swear, I thought my boss was going to thump her head against the registration desk.

Example 2: Our conferences were generally intended for our members, but non-members were allowed to attend - paying a much higher registration fee than members.  (There had to be some incentives to membership!)  Also, most people registered for the conferences months beforehand, and we offered a discounted "early bird" price for those who registered by a certain date.

Extremely Rude Participant (ERP for short) who was not a member, demanded on-site registration, but he didn't want to pay the higher non-member price. He also wanted the early bird discount, which had expired two months before.  Now, keep in mind, the hotel sold out a month before, so if he had a hotel room (which he did) he knew he was going to attend the conference months before.  He just didn't bother to register for the conference. He handed us a check already filled out for the member discount and early bird registration price and when we told him that wouldn't cover his registration, he commenced hollering obscenities.

My boss, whom I LOVED, immediately took over the situation to shield us employees from this guy's screaming.

ERP: I can't believe this BULL----!  Just take my check! That is your job, isn't it?  Or do I need to go to (Uber Boss, who supervised Boss) to report your incompetence?  Uber Boss is a close personal friend, you know!

Trust me, we knew all of Uber Boss's close personal friends. ERP was not one of them.

Boss: Sir, I'm happy to help you, but you have to stop abusing me and my employees.  Now, I can't give you the early bird price, because that expired two months ago.  But if you want to sign up for membership here and now, I can give you the discounted membership registration price.  Membership is $XXX per year.  (About the same price difference between the non-member and member registration prices.  So if he paid the membership fee and the discounted registration fee, he really wasn't going to save any money.  He was pretty much going to pay the same amount either way.  But if he attended other events, he would benefit.)

ERP: So I pay the membership fee, and that includes the registration for the conference?

Boss: No, you would pay $XXX for the membership fee and then $XXX for the discounted registration fee.

ERP: But I don't want to pay that! I just want to pay the member registration price!

Boss: That won't be possible.  We reserve that price for our members.

ERP: (slamming his fist down on the desk) But I JUST want to pay the member registration price!

Boss: We'd be happy to charge you the member registration price, after you pay the membership fee for the year.

ERP: (slamming his fist down on the desk) But I JUST want to pay the member registration price!

Boss: That won't be possible.

ERP: (slamming his fist down on the desk) But I JUST want to pay the member registration price!

Boss: You can either pay the non-membership registration price, or you can leave.

ERP: Fine, but I want the early bird discount.

And convincing him that we wouldn't do that either, was a whole nother screaming match.  Keep in mind, he was doing this in front of a room full of his peers. People he would want to network with, possibly author journal articles with, etc.  You would think he would want to behave civilly.

ERP ended up causing another huge scene in the hall a few days later when he was not allowed to attend a special session that was not included in the overall conference package.  You had to sign up for the special session months in advance because it filled up quickly.  We were already at capacity, but ERP refused to accept that and stood in the hallway screaming "this close" to my boss's face because she wouldn't add him to the session.  She finally just walked away from him.

Later, Uber Boss said ERP had approached him and asked why UberBoss's staff was so terribly rude to him. Uber Boss said we should try to be nicer.  :o :o :o 

We all kind of hoped Boss would thunk ERP's head into the registration desk.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette injustice and hipocrasy
Post by: Katana_Geldar on March 02, 2013, 06:37:08 PM
Thankful didn't have rude people like that. Worst I had was a couple who turned up without a hotel room as they didn't book one before.

Thankfully I knew a hotel still had spare rooms and sent them there!
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette injustice and hipocrasy
Post by: mmswm on March 02, 2013, 06:49:02 PM
My most recent experience with this type of behavior was in a parking lot.  I've told the story here, and it was featured on Not Always Right, so I'll just post the link.

http://notalwaysright.com/not-all-knights-are-in-shining-armor/24174
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette injustice and hipocrasy
Post by: weeblewobble on March 02, 2013, 06:53:22 PM
Oh my gosh, mmswm!  I read that story on NAR and I was horrified!  How on earth could that man not think you needed a handicapped space when he DROVE over your WALKER? A walker definitely indicates a need for a handicapped space! Thank goodness for those two men.  I'm so glad there are still good people out there.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette injustice and hipocrasy
Post by: Shalamar on March 03, 2013, 09:27:50 AM
Background about me:   I hate being startled.   My husband occasionally scares me by accident (entering the room quietly and suddenly saying something, for example), and it always makes me mad, even though I know he didn't mean to.  End background.

Yesterday I drove to the grocery store with a pounding headache.   I was sitting in my car in the parking lot, quietly reviewing my list before entering the store, when suddenly something slammed against the driver's side of the car and yelled "YAAAAAGGGGH!".    I literally screamed in terror.

It turned out to be my extremely immature friend who thinks it's funny to scare me on purpose.   As he laughed like a loon, I jabbed my middle finger at him (not E-Hell approved at all, I know).   My only excuse is that I was furious and shaking with fright.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette injustice and hipocrasy
Post by: suzieQ on March 03, 2013, 10:24:14 AM
A telemarketer called my parents house and started with her spiel.  My dad said "no thanks, we are not interested" a few times, but she kept continuing to push whatever she was trying to sell.  He said "good-bye" and hung up the phone while she was still talking.  She called back and as soon as he answered said "Don't you know it's rude to hang up one people", then hung up.

I had the same type of thing happen to me. I was on the phone with a good friend, consoling her. Things were intense and I got a call. I put her on hold to prevent the constant "beep" you get with call waiting, and the other line was a salesman. He wouldn't let me get a word in edgewise, so I put him on hold to go back to intense conversation with friend. A few minutes later, salesman called back to yell at me that I was rude for putting him on hold! So, I put him on hold again.  >:D
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Thipu1 on March 03, 2013, 10:33:57 AM
This thread is very interesting and useful.     

Sociopaths and manipulators have the attitude that simply saying 'You're rude' will make the object of their manipulation cave.  After all, the last thing that people who are trying to help want to please.   Manipulators can play on that and make the most of it.  If they bluster, blow and threaten enough, they'll put the fear of the deity into you and you'll cave. 

At least 90 percent of the time, the one charging rudeness is the one being not only rude but bullying as well. They're nasty, they're often cheap and they know exactly what they're doing. 

The best defense is to let them know that you know what they're doing and, in a nice way, call them out on it. 

   

Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Venus193 on March 03, 2013, 11:28:33 AM
This is small stuff compared to the other items so far in this thread, but we all encounter the idiots who sort-of hold the door open for you when you're entering and they're leaving (or whatever) and before you even have time to say a gracious "Thank you" they're saying a sarcastic "You're welcome."
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: rachellenore on March 03, 2013, 11:43:06 AM
This is small stuff compared to the other items so far in this thread, but we all encounter the idiots who sort-of hold the door open for you when you're entering and they're leaving (or whatever) and before you even have time to say a gracious "Thank you" they're saying a sarcastic "You're welcome."

Gosh, I'm glad I've never had that happen to me.

Maybe it's too off-topic, but I had an actually nice story like that. I work at a retail store and was leaving after my shift ended and was carrying a bunch of stuff in my hands and would have had to back into the door to open it. There was a family leaving but they were rather far ahead of me so I started to turn around when their young son came back and held the door open for me with a smile on his face. His little sister even yelled "Come on!" but I said "Thank you!" and he said "You're welcome!" and ran to catch up with them. Made my day.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Octavia on March 03, 2013, 01:18:49 PM
My birth unit (doesn't deserve to be called a mother) used to hold me back at family events so I would be the last person to get food. With buffet-style service being the norm, by the time I would get in line the best dishes had been picked over. Her explanation was that the guest of honor always goes first, and of course the older people always go before the younger people. Fine, I accepted that. I was very excited when my uncle hosted my high school graduation party for me, and I realized that I would be first through the line. My birth unit dug her fingernails into my arm and said "not so fast, it's rude for the host to go first, you know." She made me sit in a chair watching the buffet line while everyone else helped themselves. The beautiful fruit trifle that I desperately wanted to try disappeared in front of my eyes, along with piece after piece of the graduation cake that I had designed. Seems as though these bullies make up the rules as they go along. The joke was on her though. My new family (college friends) and I threw our own graduation party for college graduation, and I finally got cake and everything else!
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Adelaide on March 03, 2013, 01:20:10 PM
-I ended up giving the Cut Direct to a guy I've talked about on here before. He was a pathological liar and a narcissist (and I suspect actually diagnosed, as he had talked about his parents making him go to therapy before) and I told my parents that I wasn't going to talk to him anymore. They and my brother said I should still be "nice" to him and that it would be rude not to attend a gathering of mutual friends just because this guy wasn't going to be there. In order for them to see things my way, I had to list off: the fact that he said "Adelaide, your parents love me. They think I'm awesome", and the fact that he started snickering when I told him our dog died. At the last one my brother wanted to fight him, but I managed to talk him down.

-My ex-friend from high school was and is dating a guy who has been rude to my face before. I have told her several times that I didn't want to ever see him and couldn't stand him, but if she could then that was fine as long as I didn't have to deal with him. One day she drove down from her college (a few hours away from my house) and pulled into my driveway unannounced with this guy in tow. I wasn't there, thankfully. She stood in the driveway with her horrible boyfriend for about 30 minutes  talking to my parents and then called me "rude" because I didn't want to see him.

-ETA: The same ex friend had a habit of commenting on what I was wearing whenever we went somewhere. For instance, a group of teenagers would go to a decent restaurant and afterward would walk around town. For an outing like this, I'd wear a sundress, heels, and some makeup. Nothing overdone, but not jeans and a t-shirt either. I was always relatively dress-code conscious and almost none of my friends (save one guy) were. Ex friend liked to comment on what I was wearing to the point of making people uncomfortable. I only see now that she was trying to make me feel rude for dressing appropriately for where we were going, while she was usually wearing something off-the-wall that was far too casual.

-I have told my parents that I am studying something of a sensitive/polarizing topic in addition to law school and I do not want anyone from back home to know what it is for various reasons. I have told my parents what to tell people when they ask. We have been over it. One day I came home and my mother casually said "Oh yes, Mrs. Smith wanted to know what you were studying and where you wanted to work, so I told her [exactly what I'm doing]." I asked her why she would do that when we had been OVER what she should say, and my mother snapped back that she had forgotten and it would have been rude not to tell Mrs. Smith something. She continued by saying "I'm not going to lie for you" and insisted that it would be "rude" to lie or fudge the truth to random people who wanted to know. I now tell her that my dream in life is to study international law and work for Coca-Cola.  ::) (My brother, who's in the Marines, was literally speechless at this exchange.)
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Katana_Geldar on March 03, 2013, 02:28:47 PM
This is small stuff compared to the other items so far in this thread, but we all encounter the idiots who sort-of hold the door open for you when you're entering and they're leaving (or whatever) and before you even have time to say a gracious "Thank you" they're saying a sarcastic "You're welcome."

My sisters are like that, and not just about doors. It's as if they have some arbitrary clock that times the appropriate time to say thank you and treated annoyed when I don't say it in time. How can I, they only gave me 15 seconds.

You only say those sort of things to a young child who is learning manners.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Library Dragon on March 03, 2013, 04:56:42 PM
In a previous position I was the youth services librarian.  The library had a strict no skateboard or roller skates in the library. We had a holding area for them.  One evening a boy of 10ish was popping out the heelies on his shoes and roller skating near the $$$$$$$ expensive security gates. I went over and explained that he wasn't allowed to roller skate in the library and the gates could easily fall on him if knocked into them.

I walked away and 2 min later he was doing it again.  I again explained that there was no roller skating in the library and pointed out the sign. 

I went to my desk and who should come whizzing by me?  Yes, the same boy. I put my hand up and said, 'Please stop now.  Why don't you wait for your mother at this table.' I could see her checking out their books.  Instead he ran over to her. 

OK. I help other patrons and work on other things.  The mother comes over and asks if I was the person who told her son not to roller skate.  Silly me, I expected an apology.  No, I was told that I needed to apologize to her son for hurting his feelings.  I reviewed the events (as mentioned elsewhere I am one of the world's easiest criers, so I'm trying to keep a very calm face). She starts screaming about my rudeness.  It was so bad that I have patrons coming over and interrupting to thank me for my help in an attempt to break the flow of her rant.  I calmly refuse to apologize as I had asked more than once not to roller skate.  She responds that I cannot do that because it won't hurt the carpet.

She finally leaves and I have patrons coming over and offering to write a statement about the woman's behavior. I thank them and take their names.  I write up the whole incident with patron's names as witnesses and give it to my director the next day.  The woman comes in and who is hauled in and expected to apologize?  Yes, me.  I gave one of those, gee I'm sorry you're mad statements that I hate.  But, I knew I would end up paying for it with the PA director who would do things to undermine me.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Katana_Geldar on March 03, 2013, 05:10:46 PM
What stupid woman! I'll bet if the kid did run into the gates and they fell on him she would sue the library.

No skating in the library does seem like common sense though. Would you sake at home, in your living room?
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Library Dragon on March 03, 2013, 05:49:21 PM
POD Katana_Geldar!

What also threw me was when she asked where I went to church.  Since I belong to a denomination that is viewed by some as the seat of the Antichrist I was trying to keep the whole thing short. I had already had a woman who complained because we had a magic show during the summer program.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Katana_Geldar on March 03, 2013, 06:08:37 PM
POD Katana_Geldar!

What also threw me was when she asked where I went to church.  Since I belong to a denomination that is viewed by some as the seat of the Antichrist I was trying to keep the whole thing short. I had already had a woman who complained because we had a magic show during the summer program.

Next time someone asks that, tell them "I go in xxxtown." It's none of her business where you to to church.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: snappylt on March 03, 2013, 06:36:35 PM
Years ago I was doing a paid internship as part of making a career change.  I was working at a non-profit organization that had many teenage clients.  I made a point of being very polite to our clients, addressing them as Mr. LastName or Ms. LastName, sir or madam, etc.  I did that partly because it's my nature to be polite and also because I had seen some other employees of the non-profit being downright rude and disrespectful to clients, and I wasn't about to treat teenagers that way.

Well, one day when I was taking a turn at the front desk there was a line of maybe 5 or 6 teenagers waiting to be helped.  One boy demanded that I do something for him that was against our rules.  I politely refused, explaining why I couldn't do what he wanted.  Well, he started in on me, claiming that was I saying no to him only because his ancestors were from a different part of the world than mine.

What surprised (and pleased) me was that the teenage girl standing in line behind him interrupted him at that point and told him to cut it out, that she'd been dealing with me for several months and that she knew from experience that I was fair to the kids.  Then the other kids in line started agreeing with her, and the boy at the front of the line backed down.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Library Dragon on March 03, 2013, 06:37:21 PM
I tried that, and it's true, but the director told her.  >:(  I ended up making a formal complaint against the director to the Board, not about me, but the manner in which she violated other staff member's religious rights (no you cannot demand that a member of church lalalala wear makeup and put it in her evaluation).

Fortunately it turned out that the complaining mother's best friend is a member of my HOW.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: MariaE on March 04, 2013, 01:20:11 AM
-I have told my parents that I am studying something of a sensitive/polarizing topic in addition to law school and I do not want anyone from back home to know what it is for various reasons. I have told my parents what to tell people when they ask. We have been over it. One day I came home and my mother casually said "Oh yes, Mrs. Smith wanted to know what you were studying and where you wanted to work, so I told her [exactly what I'm doing]." I asked her why she would do that when we had been OVER what she should say, and my mother snapped back that she had forgotten and it would have been rude not to tell Mrs. Smith something. She continued by saying "I'm not going to lie for you" and insisted that it would be "rude" to lie or fudge the truth to random people who wanted to know. I now tell her that my dream in life is to study international law and work for Coca-Cola.  ::) (My brother, who's in the Marines, was literally speechless at this exchange.)

I can kind of see her point in the bolded. I do think it's rude to lie.

However, being vague is not rude. Nor is saying, "You know, I'm not sure of the details, you should ask daughter."

Now, I don't know what you asked your parents to say, so perhaps it was some variation of exactly that, in which case your mum was waaaay off. But if you asked her to lie on your behalf, then I think you were rude to put her in that position.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: iridaceae on March 04, 2013, 03:00:33 AM
I have been told on occasion that I am rude and "ruining the party " because I don't drink alcohol. I don't tell others not to, I don't explain at length why I don't (alcohol has a supremely nasty *to me* aftertaste,  that's why) ; I just grab a coke or a water and don't mention that I'm not drinking.

But no someone finds out and lectures me. Seriously.

Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: CrochetFanatic on March 04, 2013, 05:09:56 AM
I have been told on occasion that I am rude and "ruining the party " because I don't drink alcohol. I don't tell others not to, I don't explain at length why I don't (alcohol has a supremely nasty *to me* aftertaste,  that's why) ; I just grab a coke or a water and don't mention that I'm not drinking.

But no someone finds out and lectures me. Seriously.

I think you'd only be rude in this situation if you had the Coke stashed in a pocket or something.  ;D Whether you drink alcohol or not is your business in any case.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Venus193 on March 04, 2013, 05:23:39 AM
-I have told my parents that I am studying something of a sensitive/polarizing topic in addition to law school and I do not want anyone from back home to know what it is for various reasons. I have told my parents what to tell people when they ask. We have been over it. One day I came home and my mother casually said "Oh yes, Mrs. Smith wanted to know what you were studying and where you wanted to work, so I told her [exactly what I'm doing]." I asked her why she would do that when we had been OVER what she should say, and my mother snapped back that she had forgotten and it would have been rude not to tell Mrs. Smith something. She continued by saying "I'm not going to lie for you" and insisted that it would be "rude" to lie or fudge the truth to random people who wanted to know. I now tell her that my dream in life is to study international law and work for Coca-Cola.  ::) (My brother, who's in the Marines, was literally speechless at this exchange.)

I can kind of see her point in the bolded. I do think it's rude to lie.

However, being vague is not rude. Nor is saying, "You know, I'm not sure of the details, you should ask daughter."

Now, I don't know what you asked your parents to say, so perhaps it was some variation of exactly that, in which case your mum was waaaay off. But if you asked her to lie on your behalf, then I think you were rude to put her in that position.

I disagree in this particular case.

If Adelaide's reason for not wanting the truth revealed was to avoid flack -- whether directed at herself or her parents -- it was rude of her mother to go against her wishes.  How does that lie impact Mrs Smith other than avoid telling her something that was none of her business?
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: MariaE on March 04, 2013, 06:13:01 AM
-I have told my parents that I am studying something of a sensitive/polarizing topic in addition to law school and I do not want anyone from back home to know what it is for various reasons. I have told my parents what to tell people when they ask. We have been over it. One day I came home and my mother casually said "Oh yes, Mrs. Smith wanted to know what you were studying and where you wanted to work, so I told her [exactly what I'm doing]." I asked her why she would do that when we had been OVER what she should say, and my mother snapped back that she had forgotten and it would have been rude not to tell Mrs. Smith something. She continued by saying "I'm not going to lie for you" and insisted that it would be "rude" to lie or fudge the truth to random people who wanted to know. I now tell her that my dream in life is to study international law and work for Coca-Cola.  ::) (My brother, who's in the Marines, was literally speechless at this exchange.)

I can kind of see her point in the bolded. I do think it's rude to lie.

However, being vague is not rude. Nor is saying, "You know, I'm not sure of the details, you should ask daughter."

Now, I don't know what you asked your parents to say, so perhaps it was some variation of exactly that, in which case your mum was waaaay off. But if you asked her to lie on your behalf, then I think you were rude to put her in that position.

I disagree in this particular case.

If Adelaide's reason for not wanting the truth revealed was to avoid flack -- whether directed at herself or her parents -- it was rude of her mother to go against her wishes.  How does that lie impact Mrs Smith other than avoid telling her something that was none of her business?

Adelaide would be rude to ask somebody to lie (if that is indeed what she did - I'm still not sure). She would not be rude to say "Please refer people to me if they ask me what I do."

If Adelaide did the latter, and her mother went ahead and told Mrs. Smith anyway, then I agree that she (the mother) was rude.


I'd compare it (in idea although not in severity) to parents wanting their kids to believe in Santa. If a kid comes up to me and asks "Is Santa real?" I'm not going to lie and say "Yes". I'm not going to be blunt and say "No" either though. I'll say something along the lines of "You should really ask your parents that."

If Adelaide asked her parents to say "Yes" - then I think she was rude, no matter what her parents ended up answering.
If she asked them to say "Ask Adelaide" and her parents then said "No", then I think her parents were rude.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: dietcokeofevil on March 04, 2013, 07:02:35 AM
I was in charge of product sales for my daughter's girl scout troop.  All the date information was included in the sales packet, plus I sent constant email reminders about it.  I got called rude and racist, because I wouldn't accept one girls orders a week after the deadline.   
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Adelaide on March 04, 2013, 07:17:10 AM
-I have told my parents that I am studying something of a sensitive/polarizing topic in addition to law school and I do not want anyone from back home to know what it is for various reasons. I have told my parents what to tell people when they ask. We have been over it. One day I came home and my mother casually said "Oh yes, Mrs. Smith wanted to know what you were studying and where you wanted to work, so I told her [exactly what I'm doing]." I asked her why she would do that when we had been OVER what she should say, and my mother snapped back that she had forgotten and it would have been rude not to tell Mrs. Smith something. She continued by saying "I'm not going to lie for you" and insisted that it would be "rude" to lie or fudge the truth to random people who wanted to know. I now tell her that my dream in life is to study international law and work for Coca-Cola.  ::) (My brother, who's in the Marines, was literally speechless at this exchange.)

I can kind of see her point in the bolded. I do think it's rude to lie.

However, being vague is not rude. Nor is saying, "You know, I'm not sure of the details, you should ask daughter."

Now, I don't know what you asked your parents to say, so perhaps it was some variation of exactly that, in which case your mum was waaaay off. But if you asked her to lie on your behalf, then I think you were rude to put her in that position.

I disagree in this particular case.

If Adelaide's reason for not wanting the truth revealed was to avoid flack -- whether directed at herself or her parents -- it was rude of her mother to go against her wishes.  How does that lie impact Mrs Smith other than avoid telling her something that was none of her business?

Adelaide would be rude to ask somebody to lie (if that is indeed what she did - I'm still not sure). She would not be rude to say "Please refer people to me if they ask me what I do."

If Adelaide did the latter, and her mother went ahead and told Mrs. Smith anyway, then I agree that she (the mother) was rude.


I'd compare it (in idea although not in severity) to parents wanting their kids to believe in Santa. If a kid comes up to me and asks "Is Santa real?" I'm not going to lie and say "Yes". I'm not going to be blunt and say "No" either though. I'll say something along the lines of "You should really ask your parents that."

If Adelaide asked her parents to say "Yes" - then I think she was rude, no matter what her parents ended up answering.
If she asked them to say "Ask Adelaide" and her parents then said "No", then I think her parents were rude.

My parents have been very vocal about always wanting to know what my brother and I do for a living and want to do. I told them that I would only tell them on the condition that they would tell the general public that I was actually doing something else, which is similar. So I told them to say international law. Plain, simple, not a complete fiction. It just boggles my mind that, in the beginning, they went along fine with it and seemed to understand. But when my mother forgot the words "international law", suddenly it would have been rude to lie to some random person at the church I don't even have contact with and will never see again?

If she pulled the same thing with my brother's profession, someone from the Marines would be at our door to have a chat about how loose lips sink ships. I'm not saying that it's okay to put anyone on the spot and ask them to lie for you right then and there. But when said person explicitly consented to lying as a consequence of being told the truth...you'd think they could manage an "I can't remember" or "you'll have to ask her" instead of just blurting out the exact thing I begged them not to tell anyone.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: MariaE on March 04, 2013, 07:26:40 AM
If she pulled the same thing with my brother's profession, someone from the Marines would be at our door to have a chat about how loose lips sink ships. I'm not saying that it's okay to put anyone on the spot and ask them to lie for you right then and there. But when said person explicitly consented to lying as a consequence of being told the truth...you'd think they could manage an "I can't remember" or "you'll have to ask her" instead of just blurting out the exact thing I begged them not to tell anyone.

I completely agree with you there :) I tried to put enough disclaimers into place, but may have failed. If she consented to lying (or being vague or whatever) and then didn't then she's definitely rude.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Adelaide on March 04, 2013, 07:38:58 AM
If she pulled the same thing with my brother's profession, someone from the Marines would be at our door to have a chat about how loose lips sink ships. I'm not saying that it's okay to put anyone on the spot and ask them to lie for you right then and there. But when said person explicitly consented to lying as a consequence of being told the truth...you'd think they could manage an "I can't remember" or "you'll have to ask her" instead of just blurting out the exact thing I begged them not to tell anyone.

I completely agree with you there :) I tried to put enough disclaimers into place, but may have failed. If she consented to lying (or being vague or whatever) and then didn't then she's definitely rude.

Yeah, her explanation was that it would have sounded weird if she didn't know what I was doing, or why I had moved across the country for school. Internally I was thinking "Oh hey, remind me never to tell you anything important again."  ::)
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Tini on March 04, 2013, 07:48:24 AM
I used to run the register for a local pre-school. The place was a charity, so a lot of the jobs were done by volunteers, including mine. The job mostly involved keeping the waiting list, allocating places to new members and allocating more hours as and when they became available. Because children under three required a higher staffing density, we could only have a certain number of them coming each day. Order of preference was strictly by birth date and not by how long you'd been on the register because it could easily ended up being unfair to an older child.

Anyhow, so this one mother called me one evening right in the middle of supper and kept me on the phone for an hour going on and on how her child only had two days so far and how other children had more, but she never came out and actually said what she wanted. I explained repeatedly how the system worked and that as soon as I had more days available for her boy I would gladly give him more. Then she'd start over again and I'd woefully look at my congealing supper.

I got the feeling that she thought if she kept me on the phone long enough I would magically find more days for her boy (like customers always seem to think that the magic back room will provide their heart's desire if they bug the saleswoman long enough). As much as anything else, I kinda resented the implication that I would hold back time slots for special people. In the end, I said to her "Look, I really don't understand what exactly you want from me right now. Are you expecting me to throw someone else out so that your child can have more days, because that is the only way I could make this happen."
And she said "You're so rude!" and hung up on me.

I still don't know what exactly she wanted from me.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Venus193 on March 04, 2013, 08:41:32 AM
Adelaide, we had a discussion long ago on the issue of White Lies.  I think we mostly agreed that telling a lie to spare someone's feelings or to avoid an argument or controversy is not rude as long as there are no dangerous or harmful consequences.  If the OP's profession is something Mrs Smith would strongly disapprove of, there is no good reason to tell her the truth.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Adelaide on March 04, 2013, 09:16:32 AM
Adelaide, we had a discussion long ago on the issue of White Lies.  I think we mostly agreed that telling a lie to spare someone's feelings or to avoid an argument or controversy is not rude as long as there are no dangerous or harmful consequences.  If the OP's profession is something Mrs Smith would strongly disapprove of, there is no good reason to tell her the truth.

I do remember that, but I got the (probably mistaken) impression that some people thought this was more serious than a white lie, or different than the ones we were talking about. Usually no one coaches you about telling your friend her haircut looks good, after all.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: snowflake on March 04, 2013, 01:42:37 PM
I think this qualifies as one thing that drives me up the wall! :D  Here are my favorite stories here:

1) When a toddler slammed into me as I walked off a plane.  The plane was very late and I was sleep-deprived but I was in the "lane" where other travelers were getting off.  I had heard her screaming and running around, but because it didn't occur to me that she'd just run into walking people and didn't watch for her.  (And I wasn't exactly motivated to be extra aware at the time.)  I was told I was rude for not watching for her.  I'm not proud of this but I told the mother to "parent already."  As I walked away I heard her tell her daughter that "It's OK, her mommy didn't teach her to be polite."  Thankfully I recovered myself enough to not turn around and say that my mommy was severely depressed and negligent but there is no way in heck she would be negligent enough to let her daughter go running into people! 

2) When I asked someone to "keep it down" at a camp site.  They were being very loud at 1 am.  They complained that I had "spoiled everything."  Well sorry for the other 100 people here who are encroaching on your family time.

3) When I tried to get past a woman talking on a cellphone on one of those moving sidewalks at the airport.  I said "Excuse me." But she just blithely kept wandering from side to side and jabbering away.  My husband had been ahead of me and we were both moving fast to catch a flight.  I called up to him, "Tell them I'm coming!"  She turned around and berated me for talking loud when she was trying to have a conversation.

4) When someone was holding up a line at a store while berating the cashier for something that wasn't her fault.  He refused to talk to a manager because, "You'd better just fix it!"  Someone else in line said, "Could you speak to a manager?  The rest of us would like to be served as well."  Of course that person was told off for being "rude."  Which made all of us in line snicker a little.  He realized that all of us where smiling at the irony and told us we were all rude.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Queen of Clubs on March 04, 2013, 02:20:15 PM
I used to sell on eBay.  I'm in the UK, and I stated in my auctions that I would only accept payments from non-UK places if the payment was made by PayPal.

One auction, the winner was not in the UK.  She emailed me to say she'd post the payment.  I emailed her back, explaining about PayPal and offered to cancel the bid.  No, no, she wanted the item, but had to post the payment to me.  Foolishly, I let it go and emailed the details she'd need plus how much the item and postage was in my currency and in hers.

When her payment arrived it was a cheque made out to the wrong name, made out for the wrong amount and in her own currency (so worth even less in my currency).  I emailed her to let her know the cheque had arrived but I couldn't cash it and explained why.

But *I* was the rude one for refusing to take her payment.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: QueenofAllThings on March 04, 2013, 02:37:21 PM
Driving down a one way street, I see a car headed towards me.  :o she slows to let me pass. Thinking that perhaps she isn't aware it's a one-way, I roll down my window and tell her.

The response? "Get a $)&@$ing life, b$&@h!

Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: 2littlemonkeys on March 04, 2013, 03:04:35 PM
I've posted about my favorite story before but I'll share it again.

I was dating a guy who rubbed elbows with some rather wealthy people.  He was not wealthy on his own, nor was I but he had these connections through his well-to-do parents.

So we were invited to a pool party at the home of one of these friends.  I'd just bought a new bathing suit and was excited to wear it.  It was a fun party.

A few weeks later, we received an invitation to another pool party.  My boyfriend was completely and utterly appalled that I was going to wear the same suit to the party.  How RUDE!  Was I raised in a barn?  How could I even THINK about embarrassing him like that?  It was so strange.  He cut me loose before the party but I wasn't exactly crying in my (domestic) beer. 

Another time, I was out walking with my then toddler daughter.  She was in the stroller and we were walking down a park path.  A giant dog and his owner were coming from the opposite direction.  The dog was off his leash (illegally, I might add) and was making a beeline for my kid.  I instinctively put myself between the dog and DD.  The dog jumped on me a bit and I gently redirected him back down again.  The owner, instead of apologizing for his ill mannered dog, started going on about how I was so rude and that his behemoth wasn't going to hurt DD and how dare I touch his dog and if I was going to live in the city, I'd better get used to this sort of thing.

Well, that may be true but I didn't know this dog and I didn't want to find out he was the aggressive sort the hard way.  But this guy was just so put out that I would do such a thing. ::)  And even if I didn't think he was going to bite DD, he was a jumper and might have whacked her in the face with his paw.  So...yeah.

And finally, this story still cracks me up.  I was at Borders one night after work.  There was a man there, arguing with someone on his phone.  He was getting louder and louder and also getting pretty creative with language.  Eventually he realized everyone was noticing him.  He put his phone down and snapped, "This is a PRIVATE CONVERSATION!  Mind your own business!"

Honey, nothing about that conversation was private...



Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: PastryGoddess on March 04, 2013, 03:26:40 PM
Driving down a one way street, I see a car headed towards me.  :o she slows to let me pass. Thinking that perhaps she isn't aware it's a one-way, I roll down my window and tell her.

The response? "Get a $)&@$ing life, b$&@h!



Our mailperson used to do this on our street.  One day, I just put my car in park and sat there until she moved.  I pulled a book out and got through about half a chapter before she reversed and went the correct way up the street.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Shalamar on March 04, 2013, 03:33:31 PM
2littlemonkeys, your dog story reminds me of when I was out for a walk once.  I don't really like dogs that much, but I don't mind them if the owners keep them from lunging at me.  This owner did not.  Her little mutt tried to jump on me, so I backed off (apart from everything else, I was afraid of accidentally kicking the dog).  As I continued on my way, I overheard the owner say "There, there, Fifi.  Never mind.  SOME people just don't like dogs."
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Katana_Geldar on March 04, 2013, 03:40:42 PM
Some people are afraid of big dogs, which is why I always got my parents golden lab to sit when kids wanted to pat him. I told them he'd have to say hello by sniffing them, but he would accept their pats much better sitting. He was gentle, but boisterous and will jump when excited.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: mmswm on March 04, 2013, 03:53:57 PM
Some people are afraid of big dogs, which is why I always got my parents golden lab to sit when kids wanted to pat him. I told them he'd have to say hello by sniffing them, but he would accept their pats much better sitting. He was gentle, but boisterous and will jump when excited.

My Mastiff is of the opinion that everybody in the world is adores him and wants to pet him. The problem is that, at 135lbs (and still growing...he was 120 just two months ago) there are a lot of people who are afraid of him.  As such, I have trained him to sit down and "ask" if he can approach a stranger.  I have encountered more than once person who are put off by my dog sitting down and looking at me when the stranger is trying to approach us.  Yes, I do understand that lots of people love my dog, but I feel this way is safest for all of us, and most importantly, those people who are afraid of very large dogs.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Layla Miller on March 04, 2013, 04:06:27 PM
And finally, this story still cracks me up.  I was at Borders one night after work.  There was a man there, arguing with someone on his phone.  He was getting louder and louder and also getting pretty creative with language.  Eventually he realized everyone was noticing him.  He put his phone down and snapped, "This is a PRIVATE CONVERSATION!  Mind your own business!"

Honey, nothing about that conversation was private...

Well, obviously everyone within a fifty-yard radius was supposed to cover their ears and yell "LA LA LA!" at the top of their lungs.   ;)
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: EllenS on March 04, 2013, 04:08:47 PM
Some people are afraid of big dogs, which is why I always got my parents golden lab to sit when kids wanted to pat him. I told them he'd have to say hello by sniffing them, but he would accept their pats much better sitting. He was gentle, but boisterous and will jump when excited.

My Mastiff is of the opinion that everybody in the world is adores him and wants to pet him. The problem is that, at 135lbs (and still growing...he was 120 just two months ago) there are a lot of people who are afraid of him.  As such, I have trained him to sit down and "ask" if he can approach a stranger.  I have encountered more than once person who are put off by my dog sitting down and looking at me when the stranger is trying to approach us.  Yes, I do understand that lots of people love my dog, but I feel this way is safest for all of us, and most importantly, those people who are afraid of very large dogs.

From my very limited knowledge, mostly based on shows like "Dog Whisperer", my understanding is that dogs jumping on people for affection is actually a form of dominance behavior - dogs show affection to each other this way, but only to those lower in the pack.  Low-status dogs do not jump on the alpha dog.  From what I gather, well trained dogs who are respectful of people are actually far less likely to become overexcited or aggressive, and are therefore much safer.

Please correct me if I am wrong.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: mmswm on March 04, 2013, 04:18:47 PM
I'm honestly not sure about the link between "low status" dogs and jumping, but I will agree with the assertion that well-trained dogs are safer for everybody.  Let's take my dog, for example.  He's huge and very friendly, unless he thinks you're a threat to my kids (but that's another story).

Situation A: 135lb dog comes bounding up to you, trying to jump on you to get attention.

Situation B:  135lb dog sitting down, with a little bit excited tail-wagging and butt-wiggling, looking at his owner.  Owner looks at you and asks if the dog can approach for ear scritches.  If you say yes, dog walks gently over to you, sits down at your feet and looks up.

Obviously situation B is best for everybody.  Dominance or not, the calm, well-behaved and well-trained dog is safest for everybody in the area.


ETA:  Since I'm an owner of a "giant" breed that's known for being very protective, I take training very seriously.  Brazilian Mastiffs are actually banned as dangerous dogs in some countries, and need special licences in others, so I take my responsibility very, very seriously and have gone well beyond basic obedience in his training.  Yet I still have people claim that I'm rude when it comes to his public interactions and keeping him from just being able to go up and greet people without permission.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: dawnfire on March 04, 2013, 04:20:41 PM
And finally, this story still cracks me up.  I was at Borders one night after work.  There was a man there, arguing with someone on his phone.  He was getting louder and louder and also getting pretty creative with language.  Eventually he realized everyone was noticing him.  He put his phone down and snapped, "This is a PRIVATE CONVERSATION!  Mind your own business!"

Honey, nothing about that conversation was private...

Well, obviously everyone within a fifty-yard radius was supposed to cover their ears and yell "LA LA LA!" at the top of their lungs.   ;)

nah that would interrupt his conversation   ;)
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: weeblewobble on March 04, 2013, 05:08:19 PM
My birth unit (doesn't deserve to be called a mother) used to hold me back at family events so I would be the last person to get food. With buffet-style service being the norm, by the time I would get in line the best dishes had been picked over. Her explanation was that the guest of honor always goes first, and of course the older people always go before the younger people. Fine, I accepted that. I was very excited when my uncle hosted my high school graduation party for me, and I realized that I would be first through the line. My birth unit dug her fingernails into my arm and said "not so fast, it's rude for the host to go first, you know." She made me sit in a chair watching the buffet line while everyone else helped themselves. The beautiful fruit trifle that I desperately wanted to try disappeared in front of my eyes, along with piece after piece of the graduation cake that I had designed. Seems as though these bullies make up the rules as they go along. The joke was on her though. My new family (college friends) and I threw our own graduation party for college graduation, and I finally got cake and everything else!

Absolutely.  Particularly bullying parents.  They keeping moving the goal - the goal being the kind of approval and love the child dreams of getting from their parents - around so just when the child thinks they're getting close WHAM! suddenly the target moves. They couldn't let the child REACH the goal, afterall.  That would be spoiling the child.  And it's not THEIR fault that the child never reached the goal!  Clearly, the child wasn't trying hard enough!

It's like Cinderella.  The stepmother tells her, "Oh sure, you can go to the ball.... after you complete this eighty-three foot long list of chores I've concocted.  Oh, you didn't complete the list of chores?  Oh, you lazy girl.  Well, it's not my fault you didn't try hard enough.  Afterall, I was generous to allow you to attend the ball!"

It's rough with bio-birth units, as you put it, because those people are supposed to be the ones who offer endless, unconditional love.  And for them to withhold that, is just cruel and insidious and says so much more about what is wrong with THEM and not what is wrong with the child.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: baglady on March 04, 2013, 05:25:45 PM
Quote
(like customers always seem to think that the magic back room will provide their heart's desire if they bug the saleswoman long enough).

It's been two or three years, but I still remember the woman who stood at my group's fundraising food sale complaining that we didn't have anything she liked/could eat. As if complaining would make some food she liked magically appear. Thing is, our little volunteer food operation was just one of many sources of sustenance at the event she was attending. In a tourist town with restaurants, delis and other food places up the wazoo.


Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Piratelvr1121 on March 04, 2013, 05:58:25 PM
I used to be nervous around large dogs, especially German Shepherds.  I knew about 3 at the time, one was my aunts and part of a K-9 unit (she's a cop) so we weren't even really allowed near him and anytime he could see us from his large kennel in her backyard he'd bark-loudly.  The other two belonged to a friend's parents and while they were playful, they were big and a bit aggressive in their play so they made me nervous. 

Also friends of ours had a Malamute that was extremely boistrous and aggressive in his play, and he'd scare my older two boys when they were younger and smaller. The dog even knocked down Pirateboy2 when he was about 4 and scared him to death.   He was crying, Dh and I were trying to settle him down and the guy was saying "He was just PLAYING!!!!!! Sheesh!! He wasn't trying to hurt him!" said to his wife who told him to put him in his crate, which she ended up doing. 

We're still friends with her, but not him and eventually they re-homed the dog, which in all truth was probably a lot better for the dog. 
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: mmswm on March 04, 2013, 06:02:09 PM
I used to be nervous around large dogs, especially German Shepherds.  I knew about 3 at the time, one was my aunts and part of a K-9 unit (she's a cop) so we weren't even really allowed near him and anytime he could see us from his large kennel in her backyard he'd bark-loudly.  The other two belonged to a friend's parents and while they were playful, they were big and a bit aggressive in their play so they made me nervous. 

Also friends of ours had a Malamute that was extremely boistrous and aggressive in his play, and he'd scare my older two boys when they were younger and smaller. The dog even knocked down Pirateboy2 when he was about 4 and scared him to death.   He was crying, Dh and I were trying to settle him down and the guy was saying "He was just PLAYING!!!!!! Sheesh!! He wasn't trying to hurt him!" said to his wife who told him to put him in his crate, which she ended up doing. 

We're still friends with her, but not him and eventually they re-homed the dog, which in all truth was probably a lot better for the dog.

This is exactly what I intend to avoid with Baxter's training.  He knows not to jump and lunge at anybody.  Thankfully, one of his breed traits is to be even more protective of little people, but I still train him to sit and wait for permission to approach, and then to approach gently.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: KB on March 05, 2013, 05:19:32 AM
I have been told on occasion that I am rude and "ruining the party " because I don't drink alcohol. I don't tell others not to, I don't explain at length why I don't (alcohol has a supremely nasty *to me* aftertaste,  that's why) ; I just grab a coke or a water and don't mention that I'm not drinking.

But no someone finds out and lectures me. Seriously.

I get this, too, and it steams me up a bit. What really got me, though, was how I would get shocked faces from people at work when I mentioned on one occasion that I don't drink. (They often do on Fridays after work and I said no when they tried to push me to have a beer with them. Note that I sat and chatted, I just didn't drink.) One guy just would not give up on the fact that I didn't drink, and kept going on about it while I bean-dipped continually, until I finally said my goodbyes and left.

A week later, the guy who had been nagging me came up with an article from a guy who 'survived' Febfast.

This, for the uninitiated, is a challenge whereby people don't drink alcohol for a whole 28 days and donate the money they have as a result to charity. You can also have people sponsor you and add that money to your total. Come March 1, there were heaps of articles in the paper about how amazing people felt having been without alcohol for all that time, how they were sleeping better and had saved so much money and lost weight, etc.

This guy in the office was saying how amazing the people were who were doing this, it was so great for them, he was thinking about trying going without for a week to see how he felt, etc, even though it was just IMPOSSIBLE for people to go without drinking forever.

I couldn't help myself (not ehell approved, I know!) and pointed out the obvious - that it was quite possible for people not to drink.

He looked at me and said, "Yeah, but you're weird."

 >:( >:( >:(
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: iridaceae on March 05, 2013, 05:28:57 AM
Drinking is so ingrained in the US culture that *choosing* not to drink seems to be almost literally incomprehensible to a large chunk of the population.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: athersgeo on March 05, 2013, 06:01:44 AM
Drinking is so ingrained in the US culture that *choosing* not to drink seems to be almost literally incomprehensible to a large chunk of the population.

My father was once interviewed by a journalist working for one of the mainstream British tabloids. They met up in a bar at lunch time and, because my father had to get back to work afterwards, dad only ordered a tomato juice rather than anything harder. The interview was done and he thought nothing more about it.......until the next day when someone showed him the article which contained the immortal line "Athersgeo's Father, teetotal, had this to say about [some hot political topic of the day]"
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Shalamar on March 05, 2013, 06:30:12 AM
I read an article on Cracked by a recovering alcoholic (John Cheese) about how awkward it is to be offered a beer by a neighbor.    Saying "I don't drink" is tough enough; saying "I don't drink because I'm a recovering alcoholic" is much tougher.  (He didn't owe anyone an explanation, of course, but he kept getting "Aw, c'mon, just one beer!" until he couldn't stand it.)
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: hermanne on March 05, 2013, 07:36:26 AM
The priest at the church I went to as a kid was a recovering alcoholic. The "wine" he used during mass was really grape juice.

/threadjack
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: KB on March 05, 2013, 01:25:08 PM
Drinking is so ingrained in the US culture that *choosing* not to drink seems to be almost literally incomprehensible to a large chunk of the population.

Oh, it's completely the same in Australia. In fact, most surveys and studies suggest that it's worse.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Asharah on March 05, 2013, 01:49:06 PM
My birth unit (doesn't deserve to be called a mother) used to hold me back at family events so I would be the last person to get food. With buffet-style service being the norm, by the time I would get in line the best dishes had been picked over. Her explanation was that the guest of honor always goes first, and of course the older people always go before the younger people. Fine, I accepted that. I was very excited when my uncle hosted my high school graduation party for me, and I realized that I would be first through the line. My birth unit dug her fingernails into my arm and said "not so fast, it's rude for the host to go first, you know." She made me sit in a chair watching the buffet line while everyone else helped themselves. The beautiful fruit trifle that I desperately wanted to try disappeared in front of my eyes, along with piece after piece of the graduation cake that I had designed. Seems as though these bullies make up the rules as they go along. The joke was on her though. My new family (college friends) and I threw our own graduation party for college graduation, and I finally got cake and everything else!

Absolutely.  Particularly bullying parents.  They keeping moving the goal - the goal being the kind of approval and love the child dreams of getting from their parents - around so just when the child thinks they're getting close WHAM! suddenly the target moves. They couldn't let the child REACH the goal, afterall.  That would be spoiling the child.  And it's not THEIR fault that the child never reached the goal!  Clearly, the child wasn't trying hard enough!

It's like Cinderella.  The stepmother tells her, "Oh sure, you can go to the ball.... after you complete this eighty-three foot long list of chores I've concocted.  Oh, you didn't complete the list of chores?  Oh, you lazy girl.  Well, it's not my fault you didn't try hard enough.  Afterall, I was generous to allow you to attend the ball!"

It's rough with bio-birth units, as you put it, because those people are supposed to be the ones who offer endless, unconditional love.  And for them to withhold that, is just cruel and insidious and says so much more about what is wrong with THEM and not what is wrong with the child.
Well, for the record, when we have a family event where the food is set up as a buffet, the parents usually feed the small children first, just so we can have them sitting and eating instead of running around. After that it's first come, first serve. Although my family knows better than to take all of everything on the first round, before everyone gets through the line.
Octavia, your birth unit was several things I can't repeat on this board, and I sincerely hope you don't have to share a buffet meal with her ever again. And your family sounds like a bunch of pigs with no consideration for those behind them in the line.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: snowflake on March 05, 2013, 03:35:49 PM
I've heard the "You're so rude because you won't drink" before. 

I don't drink socially in front of people I need to respect me.  Because for me, there isn't really much of a margin between "having a drink" and passing out and/or dancing and singing on the table.  I've had people tell me I was rude when I didn't come up with a nice, easy reason why I wouldn't drink.  Well, it's sort of embarrassing! 

Or sometimes I will explain that I had better just have water and lemon and everyone will explain that they drink very responsibly and later say they felt judged.  Um, I didn't ask you to explain yourself.  No did I ever say the phrase, "You irresponsible lush, you!"
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Daquiri40 on March 05, 2013, 04:39:26 PM
-- the man at the gym who came in and used the circuit machines and refused to move for everyone using the circuit properly.  We were rude and needed to get lives so what he did would not be such a big deal to us.

-- the woman talking on her cell phone and staring into oblivion near the vending machines.  When I put my money in and was walking away before she even moved, she called me a rude b$%^ for cutting in front of her.

-- the elderly lady who rushed in front of me to the pharmacist and then proceeded to ask a billion questions and slowly conduct her business.  She muttered about rude young people who were in too much of a hurry.  I had not said a word.

-- my ex-friend who yelled at a cruise ship worker because my ex-friend didn't like the signage on the map.  The cruise ship worker was rude for not taking the ex-friend by the hand and walking her to her destination.

-- the person at the snow crab leg buffet who stood digging into the bottom of the pan for the "hottest" crab legs while everyone waited.  SHE said only rude people cannot wait their turn.  SHE deserved the best crab legs.  I guess we were all chopped liver.

Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Wulfie on March 05, 2013, 05:23:32 PM
I've heard the "You're so rude because you won't drink" before. 

I don't drink socially in front of people I need to respect me.  Because for me, there isn't really much of a margin between "having a drink" and passing out and/or dancing and singing on the table.  I've had people tell me I was rude when I didn't come up with a nice, easy reason why I wouldn't drink.  Well, it's sort of embarrassing! 

Or sometimes I will explain that I had better just have water and lemon and everyone will explain that they drink very responsibly and later say they felt judged.  Um, I didn't ask you to explain yourself.  No did I ever say the phrase, "You irresponsible lush, you!"

If it is any help, even telling people that you are allergic doesn't work. You just get them saying "well, that reaction was when you were a kid, maybe you grew out of it" Sorry, mom and dad having to do CPR because I stopped breathing is not something I want to subject on myself or anyone else on a "maybe"
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: nyarlathotep on March 05, 2013, 06:10:36 PM
Drunk dude groped me during a street party once. I told him to "eff off" (not my finest hour). Dad told me off because it "wasn't a nice thing to say".

EXCUSE ME?

(Disclaimer: In all other aspects my dad is awesome, he's just a bit clueless when it comes to anything in the remit of feminism)
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Asharah on March 05, 2013, 06:43:11 PM
Drunk dude groped me during a street party once. I told him to "eff off" (not my finest hour). Dad told me off because it "wasn't a nice thing to say".

EXCUSE ME?

(Disclaimer: In all other aspects my dad is awesome, he's just a bit clueless when it comes to anything in the remit of feminism)
You were okay. I would say that drunken dude would probably have not comprehended a more polite attempt to discourage him. This also applies to the bride's drunken Uncle George trying to grab your behind at the wedding reception.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: weeblewobble on March 05, 2013, 08:45:17 PM
My birth unit (doesn't deserve to be called a mother) used to hold me back at family events so I would be the last person to get food. With buffet-style service being the norm, by the time I would get in line the best dishes had been picked over. Her explanation was that the guest of honor always goes first, and of course the older people always go before the younger people. Fine, I accepted that. I was very excited when my uncle hosted my high school graduation party for me, and I realized that I would be first through the line. My birth unit dug her fingernails into my arm and said "not so fast, it's rude for the host to go first, you know." She made me sit in a chair watching the buffet line while everyone else helped themselves. The beautiful fruit trifle that I desperately wanted to try disappeared in front of my eyes, along with piece after piece of the graduation cake that I had designed. Seems as though these bullies make up the rules as they go along. The joke was on her though. My new family (college friends) and I threw our own graduation party for college graduation, and I finally got cake and everything else!

Absolutely.  Particularly bullying parents.  They keeping moving the goal - the goal being the kind of approval and love the child dreams of getting from their parents - around so just when the child thinks they're getting close WHAM! suddenly the target moves. They couldn't let the child REACH the goal, afterall.  That would be spoiling the child.  And it's not THEIR fault that the child never reached the goal!  Clearly, the child wasn't trying hard enough!

It's like Cinderella.  The stepmother tells her, "Oh sure, you can go to the ball.... after you complete this eighty-three foot long list of chores I've concocted.  Oh, you didn't complete the list of chores?  Oh, you lazy girl.  Well, it's not my fault you didn't try hard enough.  Afterall, I was generous to allow you to attend the ball!"

It's rough with bio-birth units, as you put it, because those people are supposed to be the ones who offer endless, unconditional love.  And for them to withhold that, is just cruel and insidious and says so much more about what is wrong with THEM and not what is wrong with the child.
Well, for the record, when we have a family event where the food is set up as a buffet, the parents usually feed the small children first, just so we can have them sitting and eating instead of running around. After that it's first come, first serve. Although my family knows better than to take all of everything on the first round, before everyone gets through the line.
Octavia, your birth unit was several things I can't repeat on this board, and I sincerely hope you don't have to share a buffet meal with her ever again. And your family sounds like a bunch of pigs with no consideration for those behind them in the line.

I wasn't talking about the buffet order in particular, just the constant rule changes.  I think "parents with small children first" for buffets actually works pretty well. 
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: CrochetFanatic on March 05, 2013, 09:14:43 PM
In general, I agree.  It didn't seem to work so well the last time we went to a popular buffet in our area.  A little boy (with a very obvious cold, and couldn't stop touching his face) reached in and started grabbing handfuls of the buttered noodles with his hand instead of using the tongs.  The mother stopped him, but didn't inform the staff.  The older lady behind her told caught the eye of someone coming out with a pan of something, and told him (very politely, I thought) that someone (not calling anyone out specifically) had put their hands in the food.  As the server was taking the noodles away to replace them with a fresh pan, the mother doubled back to yell at the lady for being "rude" and "intolerant" because he was "just a little boy, and doesn't know any better!".  They lady seemed stunned, but stated calmly that all she had done was ask for a fresh pan of noodles, and hadn't called anyone out specifically.  The mother stormed back to her table, and the lady got back in line when the noodles came out, studiously ignoring the still-fuming mother's table.

The little boy wasn't all that little, maybe seven or so.  I don't know if he had developmental issues or not, but if he did it wasn't readily apparent.  Not my business.  I just kept my head down and helped myself to some chicken wings...  :-\
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Library Dragon on March 05, 2013, 09:44:14 PM
I've had the opposite side of the drinking issue.  My city "went wet" 7 years ago.  It is illegal to sell or buy alcohol in the rest of the county. 

We had a party and invited new neighbors.  The party went well in general.  We followed our usual practice of having some beer, wine, iced tea, some soft drinks, water, and a signature cocktail for the party (kir royale I believe).  (I dont drink coffee and am sensitive having attended a good variety of coffee only events.) 

The new neighbors came and after about 15 minutes left without eating or drinking.  Odd, but okay, maybe they had someplace to go.  The next day I saw the new people and thanked them for joining us.  I was told that I should have told them that there would be alcohol served and that it was "not nice to trick us." Trick them?  I have seen this couple eat in restaurants that serve alcohol.  I know some very strict non-drinkers who won't. 

I would never expect a non-drinker to serve me alcohol, but I didn't think I had to warn all my guests that people in my home would have alcohol in it. 
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: nuit93 on March 05, 2013, 09:59:55 PM
I've had the opposite side of the drinking issue.  My city "went wet" 7 years ago.  It is illegal to sell or buy alcohol in the rest of the county. 

We had a party and invited new neighbors.  The party went well in general.  We followed our usual practice of having some beer, wine, iced tea, some soft drinks, water, and a signature cocktail for the party (kir royale I believe).  (I dont drink coffee and am sensitive having attended a good variety of coffee only events.) 

The new neighbors came and after about 15 minutes left without eating or drinking.  Odd, but okay, maybe they had someplace to go.  The next day I saw the new people and thanked them for joining us.  I was told that I should have told them that there would be alcohol served and that it was "not nice to trick us." Trick them?  I have seen this couple eat in restaurants that serve alcohol.  I know some very strict non-drinkers who won't. 

I would never expect a non-drinker to serve me alcohol, but I didn't think I had to warn all my guests that people in my home would have alcohol in it.

Recovering alcoholics, perhaps?
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Library Dragon on March 05, 2013, 11:11:41 PM
Perhaps.  You are much kinder than I.  I'll run it by my friends that are are in AA and get their take. 
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: MerryCat on March 05, 2013, 11:17:53 PM
Even if they were recovering alcoholics, you weren't "tricking" them. If they'd told you that they don't drink, you told them "Don't worry, it's a dry party" and THEN sprung the alcohol on them, they might have had a case. But I really can't imagine what they found so tricky about your actions.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: squeakers on March 06, 2013, 12:26:00 AM
I have never had someone give me guff for not drinking.  My in-laws do giggle they have never seen me drunk, though.

The last "big" party we were at I was the DD for hubby and me.  I sucked down a ton of water and the occasional pop.  While the rest of the guests got hammered. No one cared. Maybe because we are all over 30?

I can drink just about anyone under the table (I like whiskey). I just don't care to drink other than at home. Been that way since I was in my 20's. Something to do with having kids.  Can't drink when pregnant, can't drink when nursing, can't drink when you have little kids who might need attention in the middle of the night.  So when they got old enough to be coherent on a 911 call (joking) I went back to drinking when I wanted to (at home for the most part.. it's cheaper.) But that meant I missed out on 15 years of parties where drinking was part of the party.

Unless someone is holding someone down pouring a drink down their throat.. who cares what others think or do anyway?

The same goes for exercising, diet, house choices, family choices, sport team choices.  What one does individually as long as one keeps it to ones self is never rude.  Don't drink= not rude.  Proselytize for or against drinking = rude.  Don't eat puppies.. the same.

Having confidence in ones life choices = not really worrying about what others think.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: atirial on March 06, 2013, 03:45:37 AM
Sometimes etiquette between generations can vary. When we were on holiday and I was a teenager there was a gentleman who was showing rather too much interest in me. I turned down all his offers politely, including the offer of a drink, but he turned up with a bottled drink he had purchased and tried to insist I took it. When I said no again, my mother cut in, accepted on my behalf and took me off to one side insisting I drank it to be polite. When I would not, she drank it herself and told him I'd drunk it because she - in her own words - 'did not want him to think I was rude'.

She could not understand why I was annoyed with her when he was being so 'nice'. Apparently in her view you should always accept a gift and it has no connotations. Meanwhile I had trouble with him for the rest of the holiday, because accepting a drink means something very different to the younger generation.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: perpetua on March 06, 2013, 04:15:33 AM
Sometimes etiquette between generations can vary. When we were on holiday and I was a teenager there was a gentleman who was showing rather too much interest in me. I turned down all his offers politely, including the offer of a drink, but he turned up with a bottled drink he had purchased and tried to insist I took it. When I said no again, my mother cut in, accepted on my behalf and took me off to one side insisting I drank it to be polite. When I would not, she drank it herself and told him I'd drunk it because she - in her own words - 'did not want him to think I was rude'.

She could not understand why I was annoyed with her when he was being so 'nice'. Apparently in her view you should always accept a gift and it has no connotations. Meanwhile I had trouble with him for the rest of the holiday, because accepting a drink means something very different to the younger generation.

Goodness. I'm not normally big on worst case scenario dramatising but it's lucky for your mother that it wasn't spiked. I wouldn't have taken it either.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Reika on March 06, 2013, 05:36:51 AM
I've had the opposite side of the drinking issue.  My city "went wet" 7 years ago.  It is illegal to sell or buy alcohol in the rest of the county. 

We had a party and invited new neighbors.  The party went well in general.  We followed our usual practice of having some beer, wine, iced tea, some soft drinks, water, and a signature cocktail for the party (kir royale I believe).  (I dont drink coffee and am sensitive having attended a good variety of coffee only events.) 

The new neighbors came and after about 15 minutes left without eating or drinking.  Odd, but okay, maybe they had someplace to go.  The next day I saw the new people and thanked them for joining us.  I was told that I should have told them that there would be alcohol served and that it was "not nice to trick us." Trick them?  I have seen this couple eat in restaurants that serve alcohol.  I know some very strict non-drinkers who won't. 

I would never expect a non-drinker to serve me alcohol, but I didn't think I had to warn all my guests that people in my home would have alcohol in it.

Recovering alcoholics, perhaps?

My maternal grandfather was a recovering alcoholic and he never had a problem with someone serving alcohol at a party as long as they didn't force it on him.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: iridaceae on March 06, 2013, 05:53:09 AM
Maybe they were of a religion that forbids alcohol? Or else they were actually offended you didn't have enough booze and this was their lame excuse?
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Venus193 on March 06, 2013, 06:17:37 AM
Drunk dude groped me during a street party once. I told him to "eff off" (not my finest hour). Dad told me off because it "wasn't a nice thing to say".

EXCUSE ME?

(Disclaimer: In all other aspects my dad is awesome, he's just a bit clueless when it comes to anything in the remit of feminism)

Sometimes etiquette between generations can vary. When we were on holiday and I was a teenager there was a gentleman who was showing rather too much interest in me. I turned down all his offers politely, including the offer of a drink, but he turned up with a bottled drink he had purchased and tried to insist I took it. When I said no again, my mother cut in, accepted on my behalf and took me off to one side insisting I drank it to be polite. When I would not, she drank it herself and told him I'd drunk it because she - in her own words - 'did not want him to think I was rude'.

She could not understand why I was annoyed with her when he was being so 'nice'. Apparently in her view you should always accept a gift and it has no connotations. Meanwhile I had trouble with him for the rest of the holiday, because accepting a drink means something very different to the younger generation.

Egad.  I guess then my experience wasn't so unusual.

Some years ago I was the captain of my company's team at an event sponsored by a magazine we did a lot of business with.  It involved a scavenger hunt for which the magazine provided limousines for each team and uniforms so that we would be recognized by the people whom we needed to meet at each destination.  There was a pizza party at the parking lot first.  I got the bag with the T-shirts and baseball caps, drew the car number, and asked the driver to lock up the bag until my teammates got there.  Half an hour later they arrived and I asked the driver to please unlock the car so we could get the uniforms and change.  He said "Yeah; change into a nice sexy outfit."  It went downhill from there with four other examples of rudeness, including leering at my younger female teammate and addressing her in a disrespectful manner.  We did not tip him when we arrived at the finish line.

My sales rep told me to e-mail him about this the following morning.  In the ladies' room I overheard another team captain talking about similar issues she had with her driver.  I told her to talk to her rep or e-mail him/her about it.  End result was that the limousine company lost their contract with the magazine.

How did my mother react when I told her this story?  "So?  How is a guy going to get any?"  When I attempted to explain corporate rules about s3xual harassment, she acted like I knew nothing about working life.

That was when I stopped telling her anything about work.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Thipu1 on March 06, 2013, 08:03:00 AM
Drinking is so ingrained in the US culture that *choosing* not to drink seems to be almost literally incomprehensible to a large chunk of the population.

I'm surprised to find so many experiences witheople  who think that choosing not to drink is 'rude'.  Some people are recovering alcoholics.  Some are allergic.  Others have a medical problem that won't allow alcohol (a cousin is one of these) and some just don't like the taste. 

Are people also considered 'rude' if they don't eat fish or onions? 
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: MariaE on March 06, 2013, 08:05:02 AM
Drinking is so ingrained in the US culture that *choosing* not to drink seems to be almost literally incomprehensible to a large chunk of the population.

I'm surprised to find so many experiences witheople  who think that choosing not to drink is 'rude'.  Some people are recovering alcoholics.  Some are allergic.  Others have a medical problem that won't allow alcohol (a cousin is one of these) and some just don't like the taste. 

Are people also considered 'rude' if they don't eat fish or onions?

No, because there's not the same kind of implied "judgement" in not eating fish or onions. (Note: I don't agree with this, it's just been my experience that people think I judge them when I refuse a drink.)
I'm pretty sure you'd find just as many people who've been told they were rude for being vegetarians though.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Piratelvr1121 on March 06, 2013, 08:10:40 AM
I remember walking through a mall with my father and one of the pushy cart kiosk people started in on me. I said "No" but he didn't back off so I said "No" more firmly and put my hand up as we walked on.

My father said "You don't have to be rude about it!" when we were out of the guy's hearing range.  ::)
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Venus193 on March 06, 2013, 08:32:26 AM
What were you supposed to do, let the guy waste both of your time?  What if you still didn't buy anything?  Would your father also have called that rude?

[shakes head]
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: weeblewobble on March 06, 2013, 01:19:51 PM
Sometimes etiquette between generations can vary. When we were on holiday and I was a teenager there was a gentleman who was showing rather too much interest in me. I turned down all his offers politely, including the offer of a drink, but he turned up with a bottled drink he had purchased and tried to insist I took it. When I said no again, my mother cut in, accepted on my behalf and took me off to one side insisting I drank it to be polite. When I would not, she drank it herself and told him I'd drunk it because she - in her own words - 'did not want him to think I was rude'.

She could not understand why I was annoyed with her when he was being so 'nice'. Apparently in her view you should always accept a gift and it has no connotations. Meanwhile I had trouble with him for the rest of the holiday, because accepting a drink means something very different to the younger generation.

Goodness. I'm not normally big on worst case scenario dramatising but it's lucky for your mother that it wasn't spiked. I wouldn't have taken it either.

I can't believe your mom did that.  Did you ever manage to get the man to back off or did he hound you until got back on the plane?
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: atirial on March 06, 2013, 02:07:52 PM
I can't believe your mom did that.  Did you ever manage to get the man to back off or did he hound you until got back on the plane?
Nope, even finding out I was underage (UK & US) did not deter him. It was a rather uncomfortable couple of days.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Piratelvr1121 on March 06, 2013, 02:11:45 PM
What were you supposed to do, let the guy waste both of your time?  What if you still didn't buy anything?  Would your father also have called that rude?

[shakes head]

Beats me.  I think he didn't like the tone of my "No".  The guy didn't listen to me the first time but backed off the second time.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: snowflake on March 06, 2013, 02:54:47 PM
Drinking is so ingrained in the US culture that *choosing* not to drink seems to be almost literally incomprehensible to a large chunk of the population.

I'm surprised to find so many experiences witheople  who think that choosing not to drink is 'rude'.  Some people are recovering alcoholics.  Some are allergic.  Others have a medical problem that won't allow alcohol (a cousin is one of these) and some just don't like the taste. 

Are people also considered 'rude' if they don't eat fish or onions?

No, because there's not the same kind of implied "judgement" in not eating fish or onions. (Note: I don't agree with this, it's just been my experience that people think I judge them when I refuse a drink.)
I'm pretty sure you'd find just as many people who've been told they were rude for being vegetarians though.

I think this is exactly it.  There are lots of people who think "I shouldn't" because of calories or because they know they'll get slightly annoying or whatever.  But they give in and drink anyway.  They look at people like myself  and assume that we are exercising a massive amount of self-control and must be judging them.  In truth, drinking isn't that important to me and I don't do it well so I just don't bother.  Sometimes I think I need to wear a sandwich board to work parties that says, "Really, I don't care what you are drinking.  Let's drop it."

Moving on...

In my younger days I was at a club listening to a friend's band play.  I was asked to dance by what seemed like a nice guy.  I wouldn't have minded chatting or getting to know him but he was obviously just looking for some quick action.  I made it clear that I wasn't interested in proceeding down that road and figured that was the end of that.  Later I went to the restroom and he came by and pretty much said he wanted my phone number to add to his little black book.  I told him plainly no.  I was blunt, but I didn't think I was mean in my tone or words.  He told me my etiquette was lacking.  And then some complete stranger turned to me and said, "The least you could do is give him your phone number."

Let me see, a perfect stranger keeps insisting that I oblige him with a roll in the hay. So you're saying that the least I could do is give him the means by which he can keep pestering me for that?  OK, call me rude, but it's not going to happen.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: nayberry on March 06, 2013, 03:13:14 PM
*bg* if i hurt myself badly it takes a moment for me to be able to speak without swearing. 

i fell and really whacked my leg on the stairs at home recently,  as in missed a step on an up/down landing and *WHACKED* (10 weeks later, still have a bump!)

i was sat on the landing , slightly stunned and trying to not teach my self new swearwords, when my husband and mum came up to me. 
She asked what was wrong but i was biting my lip and still seeing stars whilst holding my leg. 
then she said "you need to get up if you landed on your bum"
i managed to reply "leg" in a grittedteeththishurtstohighhalos kind of way
she then flounced off saying i shouldn't be so rude and she'll never bother again, whilst i still sat there,  hubby helped me up and into our room then got me an icepack.


this is typical of her,  she also likes to prod and poke at me until she gets a reaction and then tell me to "calm down"........

 [insert un-ehell approved cursing here] 

I've been better recently at walking away without reacting but i wish she would stop blaming me for reacting to her digs.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Katana_Geldar on March 06, 2013, 03:23:09 PM
About that phone number, I remember when I was younger there was a number called the rejection line that you gave to poopadities up people you didn't want to see again.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Shalamar on March 06, 2013, 03:48:01 PM
You could always try 867-5309 (tell him your name is Jenny).  Or 1-800-Eat-xxxx.  :)
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: nuit93 on March 06, 2013, 03:52:25 PM
About that phone number, I remember when I was younger there was a number called the rejection line that you gave to poopadities up people you didn't want to see again.

It might still be around.

Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: snappylt on March 06, 2013, 04:31:05 PM
When I was early elementary age there was one boy in our neighborhood who used to try the old trick of sometimes insisting that it was polite that the guest should get to pick our activity (when we were at my house ) but that it was also polite that the host should pick our activity (when we were at his house).  There were plenty of other kids to play with in the neighborhood, so I didn't put up with that for long!
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Adelaide on March 06, 2013, 10:39:28 PM
My parents (unsolicited) used to tell me that I was rude if I didn't go out on a date with every guy who asked. I've been single for quite a long time and I never whine about it or lament that I want a boyfriend. My parents thought that I was being "too picky" and I needed to "lower my standards" and settle for a nice guy BECAUSE he was being nice. Sorry, I don't owe you anything but a polite rejection because you politely asked me out.  ???
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: nuit93 on March 06, 2013, 11:54:57 PM
My parents (unsolicited) used to tell me that I was rude if I didn't go out on a date with every guy who asked. I've been single for quite a long time and I never whine about it or lament that I want a boyfriend. My parents thought that I was being "too picky" and I needed to "lower my standards" and settle for a nice guy BECAUSE he was being nice. Sorry, I don't owe you anything but a polite rejection because you politely asked me out.  ???

 :o I'm glad you didn't listen to them!
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Asharah on March 07, 2013, 12:08:46 AM
My parents (unsolicited) used to tell me that I was rude if I didn't go out on a date with every guy who asked. I've been single for quite a long time and I never whine about it or lament that I want a boyfriend. My parents thought that I was being "too picky" and I needed to "lower my standards" and settle for a nice guy BECAUSE he was being nice. Sorry, I don't owe you anything but a polite rejection because you politely asked me out.  ???

 :o I'm glad you didn't listen to them!
Somewhere on this BB is a story where OP mentioned to her grandmother she turned down a boy who asked her to a dance because she wasn't interested in dating him. Her grandmother replied, "Just because you don't want to is no reason not to date him."  ???
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Venus193 on March 07, 2013, 06:18:01 AM
My parents (unsolicited) used to tell me that I was rude if I didn't go out on a date with every guy who asked. I've been single for quite a long time and I never whine about it or lament that I want a boyfriend. My parents thought that I was being "too picky" and I needed to "lower my standards" and settle for a nice guy BECAUSE he was being nice. Sorry, I don't owe you anything but a polite rejection because you politely asked me out.  ???

 :o I'm glad you didn't listen to them!

Somewhere on this BB is a story where OP mentioned to her grandmother she turned down a boy who asked her to a dance because she wasn't interested in dating him. Her grandmother replied, "Just because you don't want to is no reason not to date him."  ???

I was on the receiving end of some of this during high school.   My mother thought it unimportant that a boy who was calling me made me cringe.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: weeblewobble on March 07, 2013, 07:29:12 AM
My parents (unsolicited) used to tell me that I was rude if I didn't go out on a date with every guy who asked. I've been single for quite a long time and I never whine about it or lament that I want a boyfriend. My parents thought that I was being "too picky" and I needed to "lower my standards" and settle for a nice guy BECAUSE he was being nice. Sorry, I don't owe you anything but a polite rejection because you politely asked me out.  ???

 :o I'm glad you didn't listen to them!
Somewhere on this BB is a story where OP mentioned to her grandmother she turned down a boy who asked her to a dance because she wasn't interested in dating him. Her grandmother replied, "Just because you don't want to is no reason not to date him."  ???

A while back, Knitterly started a thread about a Miss Manner letter in which Miss Manners told a girl that if a boy asked her to a dance and she said no, it would be rude to accept an invitation from a boy that she actually WANTED to go with.  So basically, if you're going to go, you HAVE to accept the invitation of the first boy that asks you.

http://www.etiquettehell.com/smf/index.php?topic=114673.msg2674828#msg2674828

I think this is some of the most destructive advice I've ever seen in a column.  You cannot take away a person's power to say no. 
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: pierrotlunaire0 on March 07, 2013, 07:57:50 AM
I get it a lot at work, but it is of the variety: You told me No.  You are rude."

Oh, please.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: weeblewobble on March 07, 2013, 08:01:57 AM
Or this gem, in which the OP's friend insists that even if the OP is married, if a man gets up the courage to send her a drink in a bar, she should accept it.  Because if she doesn't, his poor male ego will be bruised and he might never send a woman a drink again!

http://www.etiquettehell.com/?p=3426

OK, so it's better for married woman to pretend she's interested to protect the man's feelings?  And then later, when he considers that drink to be an invitation for further interaction, then what does she do?  Continue the ruse?  Date him?
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Shalamar on March 07, 2013, 10:20:56 AM
And if he slipped a roofie in it, it would be rude to not fall unconscious and wake up in his apartment!
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Piratelvr1121 on March 07, 2013, 10:35:09 AM
Going with the "nice girl" training that some of us were subject to, it does seem that women tend to be more subject to the "you didn't give me my way so you're rude!" accusations than men do. 

Not to say that men aren't subjected to it, as I know we've seen it where posters have to figure out how to deal with in-laws when their husbands were brought up to say "How high?" whenever their mother said "jump".   But it does seem that women are expected to cater to others.  Even smiling when they don't feel like it cause people don't like to see a woman frowning and we're supposed to be happy to please others.  ::)
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Venus193 on March 07, 2013, 11:37:27 AM
That should be a whole discussion of its own, but I don't know if that would be allowed on this board.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: snowflake on March 07, 2013, 12:24:09 PM
There is also the off-shoot of, "If you don't have a good enough reason, you are rude for saying no."

I kept refusing to date a guy when I was younger.  I was young and inexperienced and couldn't put into words, "You take too much enjoyment out of trying to batter my self-esteem." And he did. If I said anything, he'd mock it in a jeering voice.  That was supposed to be flattering attention and his sense of humor shining through. I just said, "You aren't my type" and left it at that.  Oh the drama!  See, if he had been an alcoholic/beater/rapist/layabout or even refused to buy me flowers I would have been OK.  But because I just thought that the way he acted was not to my liking, it wasn't a good enough reason and therefore I was rude and lacking social grace.

I loathed myself because I was told that if I was confident and had good self-esteem, his "jokes" would have slid right off my back.  I thought I was a useless jellyfish of a person for letting his jabs prevent me from dating him.

Now I can only cheer when I hear of other people doing the same.

ETA: Sometimes in retrospect I don't know if I had really bad self-esteem or surprisingly healthy, resilient self-esteem.  Just thinking about it makes my head nearly explode.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Venus193 on March 07, 2013, 12:50:38 PM
That is a classic bully tactic and nobody has to put up with it for any reason.  Refusing to put up with it is telling the bully you don't deserve this treatment, not that "you can't take it."
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: CakeBeret on March 07, 2013, 01:43:03 PM
About that phone number, I remember when I was younger there was a number called the rejection line that you gave to poopadities up people you didn't want to see again.

Ah, yes. The Rejection Hotline. :D I've never given the numbers out, but my girl friends and I had great fun giggling over it in our teen years.

http://www.humorhotlines.com/RejectionHotline.asp
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Piratelvr1121 on March 07, 2013, 01:58:14 PM
I've decided that if anyone's rude enough to insist they have my number after I've made it clear I'm not interested, they're going to get a phone number.  867-5309. ;)

I haven't had the chance to use that, but then my name's not Jenny, either. :)
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: violinp on March 07, 2013, 02:01:48 PM
I've decided that if anyone's rude enough to insist they have my number after I've made it clear I'm not interested, they're going to get a phone number.  867-5309. ;)

I haven't had the chance to use that, but then my name's not Jenny, either. :)

Ha!  ;D
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Desdemona on March 07, 2013, 02:03:24 PM
I've decided that if anyone's rude enough to insist they have my number after I've made it clear I'm not interested, they're going to get a phone number.  867-5309. ;)

I haven't had the chance to use that, but then my name's not Jenny, either. :)

That's the fake number I use!  I hope you never have to use it but if you want to be subtle about using it, I recommend adding in an area code. I've used it more often than I thought I would have to in college and no one ever realized what I was doing. But some guys were so annoying I skipped the area code because I wanted them to know how much I didn't want them to have my real one.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: otterwoman on March 07, 2013, 03:36:59 PM
My friend had the phone number for the local Planned Parenthood memorized to give to guys that wouldn't give up asking her. Since it was local, the prefix matched up with the area. The guys wouldn't know they'd been duped until they actually called.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: nuit93 on March 07, 2013, 04:16:37 PM
My friend had the phone number for the local Planned Parenthood memorized to give to guys that wouldn't give up asking her. Since it was local, the prefix matched up with the area. The guys wouldn't know they'd been duped until they actually called.

*makes a mental note to find out the phone number of a local manure supply company*
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Moray on March 07, 2013, 04:22:18 PM
I hate to be a spoil-sport, but please don't use the numbers of real businesses that will then have to deal with some guy calling one or more times to look for you. Bucky's Manure Emporium doesn't want to hear from this dude any more than you do.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Katana_Geldar on March 07, 2013, 04:49:39 PM
What about plausible random combinations of numbers? I had a DTD cale salesman who wouldn't go until I gave him a phone number. So I did, it just wasn't mine.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: mmswm on March 07, 2013, 04:57:35 PM
What about plausible random combinations of numbers? I had a DTD cale salesman who wouldn't go until I gave him a phone number. So I did, it just wasn't mine.

I've been the victim of this.  Some woman had given some man a "plausible combination of numbers", that just happened to be my phone number.  At first I was nice about it, but after a few hundred calls and texts within the span of a few days, I was ready to track him down and throw him into a frozen river.  I'm not saying that all people are like this, but just warning that those fake numbers can and do affect the lives of real people.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Piratelvr1121 on March 07, 2013, 05:08:01 PM
Reminds me of when the movie "Bruce Almighty" came out, they didn't do the usual prefix of 555 like most movies do, they used a real prefix and so people were actually calling up people's phone numbers wanting to see if they could reach God.  ::)

Because enough people complained, when the DVD released, the number's prefix had been changed to 555. 

I remember an episode of Gilmore Girls when Luke gave Lorelai a # that didn't have the 555 prefix but when people called it they reached a recording of the actor who played Luke.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: petal on March 07, 2013, 10:10:22 PM
I have been following the snowflake thread, and I also read the notalwaysright websites, and I have noticed a pattern - apparently we of eHell are not the only ones who complain about rudeness. The only ones who are more vigilant than us are the people who are so quick to recognize 'rudeness' because they veritably live it! ???

To these people, "You are being rude" actually translates to "You are not doing what I say / Giving me what I want / Meeting my expectations / Kowtowing to my whims, etc." :o

I would like to hear about your most "Bizzaro (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bizarro_World)" experiences, in which you found yourself wondering if it was Opposite Day, or thinking you must have fallen into a different dimension because you were accused of being rude when you were not. Was it a cultural or generational misunderstanding, or a matter of meeting a very Special Snowflake? Were you ever vindicated or is this the first time you've had a chance to vent about the injustice you have suffered?

I think I felt like this often as a child when I was forced to go through the motions and "perform" for strangers, but when I was shy I was told "don't be rude." :-\

The only instance I can think of from my adulthood is when my father took offense that I did not want his new GF (who at the time he claimed was "just a friend" and as of last year is now his wife), who I had not even met at this point, at my 30th birthday party. Apparently there was a section in the new etiquette book that states "Even though it is your birthday (and a milestone one at that) and the celebration has traditionally been restricted to family and very close friends, you must accept the last minute addition of a veritable stranger (who you should have been introduced to way before now) and pretend that you are not uncomfortable meeting them for the first time in a very intimate setting." Yeah, I was the rude one. >:(

So what about you guys? What horrors have you experienced, and what horrors have you been accused of, in the name of (perverted or outdated) "etiquette"? Also, to keep us from wallowing in too much vitrol, I would also be interested in hearing the times when you thought you were being polite and because of an innocent misunderstanding you were not seen as such. For example I recently read that while in one culture it is polite to clean your plate, in another culture you must always leave a bite of food on your plate or else you are insulting your hosts by suggesting they did not give you enough. What faux pas can you only excuse with "I didn't know"? :-\


I've read all the stories here and am horrified at some of them. some can be classed as outright bullying and what makes them worse is its parents doing it.

I did want to comment on your OP tho Softly Spoken because i remember reading somewhere that your father was 90?  (i think).  I honestly think that if my  90 year old father wanted to introduce me to his new "girlfriend/friend" even at my big birthday celebration I would be overjoyed at my father finding happiness again after being a widower for a while.

I actually think its wonderful that a 90 year old man can find love again with someone who loves him back.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: zyrs on March 07, 2013, 10:19:46 PM
What about plausible random combinations of numbers? I had a DTD cale salesman who wouldn't go until I gave him a phone number. So I did, it just wasn't mine.

I've been the victim of this.  Some woman had given some man a "plausible combination of numbers", that just happened to be my phone number.  At first I was nice about it, but after a few hundred calls and texts within the span of a few days, I was ready to track him down and throw him into a frozen river.  I'm not saying that all people are like this, but just warning that those fake numbers can and do affect the lives of real people.

We had a woman calling for some guy for a while.  She would not believe he didn't live here.


Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: JoW on March 07, 2013, 10:34:36 PM
What about plausible random combinations of numbers? I had a DTD cale salesman who wouldn't go until I gave him a phone number. So I did, it just wasn't mine.

I've been the victim of this.  Some woman had given some man a "plausible combination of numbers", that just happened to be my phone number.  At first I was nice about it, but after a few hundred calls and texts within the span of a few days, I was ready to track him down and throw him into a frozen river.  I'm not saying that all people are like this, but just warning that those fake numbers can and do affect the lives of real people.
Me, too.  In my case the perpetrator was a deadbeat named Michael.  He bought a car he didn't intend to pay for and gave a fake phone number on the loan application.  His fake number was my real cell phone number.   I got calls for him up to 6 times/day. 

If you want to give a fake number memorize the number for your local time & temperature service or some other recorded message.  Don't subject a real live person to harassment from your pest. 
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: bloo on March 07, 2013, 10:45:18 PM
I've heard the "You're so rude because you won't drink" before. 

I don't drink socially in front of people I need to respect me.  Because for me, there isn't really much of a margin between "having a drink" and passing out and/or dancing and singing on the table.  I've had people tell me I was rude when I didn't come up with a nice, easy reason why I wouldn't drink.  Well, it's sort of embarrassing! 

Or sometimes I will explain that I had better just have water and lemon and everyone will explain that they drink very responsibly and later say they felt judged.  Um, I didn't ask you to explain yourself.  No did I ever say the phrase, "You irresponsible lush, you!"

If it is any help, even telling people that you are allergic doesn't work. You just get them saying "well, that reaction was when you were a kid, maybe you grew out of it" Sorry, mom and dad having to do CPR because I stopped breathing is not something I want to subject on myself or anyone else on a "maybe"

Your friends were nicer than mine.

When I speak of my allergy to alcohol, I hear, "Oh Bloo, getting drunk is not an allergic reaction! HAHAHA, Lolz!"

It would take several drinks for me to actually stop breathing, but I can drink 1 or 2 drinks over the course of an evening. Whenever I've had my second or third sip of alcohol I always think the same thing, "This is wonderful! I should be drinking everyday!" By the time I'm halfway thru my 2nd, I'm like, "Ugh...this is why I hardly drink," because I start feeling lousy.

I suppose I bring it on myself by drinking very moderately instead of just teetotalling.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Venus193 on March 08, 2013, 06:23:42 AM
I have never been able to understand how anyone could be rude by refusing alcohol.  It is far more rude to question why they do.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Piratelvr1121 on March 08, 2013, 06:46:20 AM
I think it depends on how it's done.  A simple "No thanks" is fine.  Getting sanctimonious about it would be rude, implying one is more moral or responsible, or healthier than those who drink.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Venus193 on March 08, 2013, 07:33:26 AM
True, but this is an issue I've seen several times on this board and unless the OP's have omitted anything like that, they are simply declining as you describe.  They owe no explanation for their refusal of alcohol.  Whether they are recovering alcoholics, taking medication that precludes consumption, or practice a religion that forbids it is nobody's business.

I do agree that being sanctimonious is rude.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Piratelvr1121 on March 08, 2013, 07:41:39 AM
Well I was speaking in general, not just about those on the board who've had the issue. :) I'm sure ehellions would be polite about refusing alcohol. :)
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Outdoor Girl on March 08, 2013, 07:42:59 AM
If you want to give a fake number memorize the number for your local time & temperature service or some other recorded message.  Don't subject a real live person to harassment from your pest.

This is a great idea!
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: wolfie on March 08, 2013, 02:51:36 PM
I've decided that if anyone's rude enough to insist they have my number after I've made it clear I'm not interested, they're going to get a phone number.  867-5309. ;)

I haven't had the chance to use that, but then my name's not Jenny, either. :)

In college that number went to a men's dorm room. I was told they were not amused at the number of people calling and asking for Jenny.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Piratelvr1121 on March 08, 2013, 04:13:32 PM
I kinda wondered if that was an actual # or if, because of the song, someone might have gotten wise and just not issued that particular combination of #'s.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: PastryGoddess on March 08, 2013, 04:44:12 PM
I kinda wondered if that was an actual # or if, because of the song, someone might have gotten wise and just not issued that particular combination of #'s.

I think at the time of the song coming out it was an actual number in many places.  However, I think it's no longer in use because of the song
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: mmswm on March 08, 2013, 05:03:53 PM
I kinda wondered if that was an actual # or if, because of the song, someone might have gotten wise and just not issued that particular combination of #'s.

I think at the time of the song coming out it was an actual number in many places.  However, I think it's no longer in use because of the song

This discussion got me curious so I called my father, who's an expert in electronic switching.  Actually, he's testified as an expert witness in several FCC and public service commission trials.  Here's what he had to say:

On the "Jenny" song:  The telephone companies phased out the use of the number as existing customers complained. When a customer who had that number called in to get their number changed, they simply retired it as a valid number in that area code.  Over the course of the years since then, it's been completely retired to be best of my father's knowledge.

On the movie that used a non "555" number:  The movie producers were in violation of FCC regulations, and would have faced large fines, which explains why they changed the display when it came out on video. 
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: KB on March 08, 2013, 11:59:11 PM
There is a great Snopes page about this:

867-5309 (http://www.snopes.com/music/songs/8675309.asp)
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: kherbert05 on March 09, 2013, 07:13:51 AM
Drinking is so ingrained in the US culture that *choosing* not to drink seems to be almost literally incomprehensible to a large chunk of the population.

I'm in the US honestly other than my cousins (Canadian not Texans) spiking a drink to see what goodie two shoes was like drunk*  - I've never been pressured to drink.

*(My mom and her amazing Mom powers figured that one out without me saying a word - Hell was paid - they never pulled something like that again)
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Jocelyn on March 09, 2013, 10:11:48 AM
What about plausible random combinations of numbers? I had a DTD cale salesman who wouldn't go until I gave him a phone number. So I did, it just wasn't mine.

I've been the victim of this.  Some woman had given some man a "plausible combination of numbers", that just happened to be my phone number.  At first I was nice about it, but after a few hundred calls and texts within the span of a few days, I was ready to track him down and throw him into a frozen river.  I'm not saying that all people are like this, but just warning that those fake numbers can and do affect the lives of real people.
Ditto. I once had to deal with a girl who kept calling, started calling in the middle of the night, had her friends call asking for other guys...all because she was SURE I was lying when I said that the guy didn't live there, I had no idea who it was, he hadn't lived at this number in at least 5 years...I finally spoke very sternly to one of her friends who'd called with the 'Can I speak to Mike? Oh, then, is John there?' tactic. I told her neither of them lived with me, I was tired of being bothered about this, and I really suggested that they forget about John and any other man who'd give them a fake phone number rather than his own.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: iridaceae on March 10, 2013, 05:16:16 AM
I'm in the US honestly other than my cousins (Canadian not Texans) spiking a drink to see what goodie two shoes was like drunk*  - I've never been pressured to drink.
*(My mom and her amazing Mom powers figured that one out without me saying a word - Hell was paid - they never pulled something like that again)

Large chunk does not equal all.
I've run across many people who have tried to spike my drinks. I am old enough that my freshman year the drinking age was 18. One gal on my floor found out within the first week that I did not drink. From that point on she refused to acknowledge my existence. At any big party from then on continuing on tip today  "c'mon,  just one little drink. Just try it. You'll like it."
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: girlysprite on March 10, 2013, 06:46:16 AM
My brother once asked my husband what his salary was, because brother was in the process of applying for jobs. Husband didn't want to share what he earned, but did give a general indication of what was useful in their field of work. My brother kept pressing, why didn't husband share it? It's not like he would post it on facebook or something! Husband said that it was private.
Brother started mailing that he didn't understand why he didn't tell him, they were so close, it was something friends would do, and that he didn't like husbands attitude.
Two momths later when I went out to dinner with brother for his graduation, brother started interrogating me as for why husband didn't share it, And regurgitated all the arguments.

Appareantly, if he can't umderstand why people have certain boumdaries, he feels he doesn't have to respect them.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Venus193 on March 10, 2013, 06:55:23 AM
It is most unfortunate that many people feel that DNA or another close relationship is a get-out-of-E-Hell-free pass.  The truth is that this should be the opposite in the name of maintaining the relationship.

Having said that, it should also be a situation in which someone can call someone out (privately) on their faux pas.  The idea that it is never polite to do this leaves too much opportunity for the Clueless and the Aggressively Rude to insult and embarrass others in their lives.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Piratelvr1121 on March 10, 2013, 07:04:48 AM
It is most unfortunate that many people feel that DNA or another close relationship is a get-out-of-E-Hell-free pass.  The truth is that this should be the opposite in the name of maintaining the relationship.

Having said that, it should also be a situation in which someone can call someone out (privately) on their faux pas.  The idea that it is never polite to do this leaves too much opportunity for the Clueless and the Aggressively Rude to insult and embarrass others in their lives.

I completely agree with you on that one.  And I think that's just the sort of dynamic in toxic families that keeps the dysfunction flowing.  The boundary crossers constantly push them as far as they're allowed to and when someone gains a backbone and says "No more" they cry "You're being RUDE!" and if they get enough family members on their side, the one that "rocked the boat" is made to wonder if they are right to have established boundaries or not.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Venus193 on March 10, 2013, 08:14:08 AM
I've been thinking about that issue for a long time and think we need to begin taking a stand on it.  Since I don't want to derail this discussion I will post it as its own thread.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: magician5 on March 10, 2013, 09:14:54 AM
My brother once asked my husband what his salary was, because brother was in the process of applying for jobs. Husband didn't want to share what he earned, but did give a general indication of what was useful in their field of work. My brother kept pressing, why didn't husband share it? It's not like he would post it on facebook or something! Husband said that it was private.
Brother started mailing that he didn't understand why he didn't tell him, they were so close, it was something friends would do, and that he didn't like husbands attitude.
Two momths later when I went out to dinner with brother for his graduation, brother started interrogating me as for why husband didn't share it, And regurgitated all the arguments.

Appareantly, if he can't umderstand why people have certain boumdaries, he feels he doesn't have to respect them.

I wonder if this would work:

"I'll tell you my salary if you ... no, if you can get yourr wife to tell me how often you "play scrabble", what your favorite position is, and what's the most unusual place you've done it. Come on, they're simple questions, people answered them all the time on TV on The Newlywed Game."
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Venus193 on March 10, 2013, 09:25:19 AM

I wonder if this would work:

"I'll tell you my salary if you ... no, if you can get yourr wife to tell me how often you "play scrabble", what your favorite position is, and what's the most unusual place you've done it. Come on, they're simple questions, people answered them all the time on TV on The Newlywed Game."

I think we need a laughing smiley who's on his knees pounding the floor.

Is that still on the air?  Years ago when it was new I wondered how many of those coupled ended up later on Divorce Court because of that show.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: girlysprite on March 10, 2013, 09:57:32 AM
My brother once asked my husband what his salary was, because brother was in the process of applying for jobs. Husband didn't want to share what he earned, but did give a general indication of what was useful in their field of work. My brother kept pressing, why didn't husband share it? It's not like he would post it on facebook or something! Husband said that it was private.
Brother started mailing that he didn't understand why he didn't tell him, they were so close, it was something friends would do, and that he didn't like husbands attitude.
Two momths later when I went out to dinner with brother for his graduation, brother started interrogating me as for why husband didn't share it, And regurgitated all the arguments.

Appareantly, if he can't umderstand why people have certain boumdaries, he feels he doesn't have to respect them.

I wonder if this would work:

"I'll tell you my salary if you ... no, if you can get yourr wife to tell me how often you "play scrabble", what your favorite position is, and what's the most unusual place you've done it. Come on, they're simple questions, people answered them all the time on TV on The Newlywed Game."

I'm afraid she'd tell me, especially since she totally sided with my brother on that case.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: PeterM on March 10, 2013, 03:41:59 PM
There is a great Snopes page about this:

867-5309 (http://www.snopes.com/music/songs/8675309.asp)

There used to be another web page back in the 90s. Some guy called the number in every area code and had a table noting the results. Lots of not in service, lots of perfectly normal answering machine messages, and lots of messages to the effect of "If you're looking for Jenny, she's not here." There was also one "You've reached Jenny, please leave a message" in an obviously male voice.

I read an anecdote from a young adult author years ago. Can't remember who, unfortunately. He had to include a phone number in one of his books - I don't remember why it had to be included, as opposed to just "He gave me the number" or whatever, but art is a fickle mistress and is best not denied - and he didn't want to use a fake 555 number but he also didn't want to annoy the snot out of some poor sap with the misfortune to have the same number. So he used his own phone number, area code and all.

His family apparently got a fair few calls from fans, and they were happy to talk to them. They even talked a few kids through some tough times, which must've felt good. Eventually, though, he came to discover that his teenaged son was accepting collect calls from fans, and it was adding up. So he reluctantly changed future editions of the book. I don't remember exactly how, but after that they no longer had his own number in them.

I'm pretty sure it wasn't Chris Crutcher, Daniel Pinkwater or Stephen King, though those are the names that pop into my head when I think about authors who might have done something like that. It's gonna bug me now.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Layla Miller on March 10, 2013, 04:11:06 PM
Was it Robert Cormier (http://articles.sun-sentinel.com/1989-11-12/features/8902090380_1_adult-readers-book-storytelling-skills)?  That's the first page that came up in a Google search, anyway.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: PeterM on March 10, 2013, 04:19:52 PM
Was it Robert Cormier (http://articles.sun-sentinel.com/1989-11-12/features/8902090380_1_adult-readers-book-storytelling-skills)?  That's the first page that came up in a Google search, anyway.

Might've been. I've never read his stuff, for whatever reason, so he never occurred to me. I might've read the account in a collection or seen it referenced somewhere, though.

I'll check it out, thanks!
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Winterlight on March 10, 2013, 04:36:09 PM
I believe Piers Anthony did something similar.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Jocelyn on March 10, 2013, 05:01:06 PM
My brother once asked my husband what his salary was, because brother was in the process of applying for jobs. Husband didn't want to share what he earned, but did give a general indication of what was useful in their field of work. My brother kept pressing, why didn't husband share it? It's not like he would post it on facebook or something! Husband said that it was private.
Brother started mailing that he didn't understand why he didn't tell him, they were so close, it was something friends would do, and that he didn't like husbands attitude.
Two momths later when I went out to dinner with brother for his graduation, brother started interrogating me as for why husband didn't share it, And regurgitated all the arguments.

Appareantly, if he can't umderstand why people have certain boumdaries, he feels he doesn't have to respect them.
My father was employed by a company that had a large wagon pulled by Clydesdales as an advertising logo. (no, not the one you're thinking of). In his youth, he and his father had raised draft horses on their ranch, so Dad had an interest in the hitch. One day, he was passing the time of day with the farrier as he was working on the horses' hooves in between shows, and a young man came up and began asking the farrier questions about his job. The farrier was agreeable to answering them, until the young man inquired how much he was paid.
The farrier dropped the hoof he was working on, and straightened up to his full 6'6", and said, 'THAT, I tell my friends and the other folks JUST. DON'T. ASK.'
The young man found urgent business elsewhere.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: rose red on March 10, 2013, 06:07:06 PM
My father was employed by a company that had a large wagon pulled by Clydesdales as an advertising logo. (no, not the one you're thinking of). In his youth, he and his father had raised draft horses on their ranch, so Dad had an interest in the hitch. One day, he was passing the time of day with the farrier as he was working on the horses' hooves in between shows, and a young man came up and began asking the farrier questions about his job. The farrier was agreeable to answering them, until the young man inquired how much he was paid.
The farrier dropped the hoof he was working on, and straightened up to his full 6'6", and said, 'THAT, I tell my friends and the other folks JUST. DON'T. ASK.'
The young man found urgent business elsewhere.

Since he was asking questions, he sounds interested in the job and perhaps meant "What salary range does this kind of job earn?"  If that's what he meant, it's a shame he used the word "you" which made him sound intrusive.  Sadly, it's a common mistake.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Jocelyn on March 10, 2013, 09:09:49 PM
My father was employed by a company that had a large wagon pulled by Clydesdales as an advertising logo. (no, not the one you're thinking of). In his youth, he and his father had raised draft horses on their ranch, so Dad had an interest in the hitch. One day, he was passing the time of day with the farrier as he was working on the horses' hooves in between shows, and a young man came up and began asking the farrier questions about his job. The farrier was agreeable to answering them, until the young man inquired how much he was paid.
The farrier dropped the hoof he was working on, and straightened up to his full 6'6", and said, 'THAT, I tell my friends and the other folks JUST. DON'T. ASK.'
The young man found urgent business elsewhere.

Since he was asking questions, he sounds interested in the job and perhaps meant "What salary range does this kind of job earn?"  If that's what he meant, it's a shame he used the word "you" which made him sound intrusive.  Sadly, it's a common mistake.

In this man's case...he was the ONLY farrier employed by the company to travel with the hitch. The earlier questions had been about how cool and fun this particular job was, rather than being about being a farrier in general. The young man was giving the impression that he wanted a cool job that was a piece of cake to do, and paid well...not a line of questioning that endears you to a man who has a Clydesdale leaning on his back while he works on its hoof. ::)
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: dawnfire on March 10, 2013, 09:29:17 PM
I believe Piers Anthony did something similar.

I always thought it just went to a pre-recorded message.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: BB-VA on March 11, 2013, 06:42:57 AM
I believe Piers Anthony did something similar.

I always thought it just went to a pre-recorded message.

I think that was the 1800 HIPIERS line.  Not sure, I never called it, but I got the impression that it was basically updates on whatever he was writing at the time.  That was before the web was really big, and vanity phone numbers were more of the thing to do. 

The only Anthony I like is the Incarnations of Immortality series, so I was not a big fan.  My daughter read some of his other stuff and was pretty interested for a while.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Kimberami on March 11, 2013, 03:11:28 PM
-- the man at the gym who came in and used the circuit machines and refused to move for everyone using the circuit properly.  We were rude and needed to get lives so what he did would not be such a big deal to us.

-- the woman talking on her cell phone and staring into oblivion near the vending machines.  When I put my money in and was walking away before she even moved, she called me a rude b$%^ for cutting in front of her.

-- the elderly lady who rushed in front of me to the pharmacist and then proceeded to ask a billion questions and slowly conduct her business.  She muttered about rude young people who were in too much of a hurry.  I had not said a word.

-- my ex-friend who yelled at a cruise ship worker because my ex-friend didn't like the signage on the map.  The cruise ship worker was rude for not taking the ex-friend by the hand and walking her to her destination.

-- the person at the snow crab leg buffet who stood digging into the bottom of the pan for the "hottest" crab legs while everyone waited.  SHE said only rude people cannot wait their turn.  SHE deserved the best crab legs.  I guess we were all chopped liver.
Slight highjack because this reminded me of an incident that happened several years ago.
My DH and I were at a buffet restaurant, and there was a couple at an table close to ours who were camping the crab legs.  They would hop up and run to the buffet as soon as the crab legs were put out and take ever single piece.  They kept making comments along the lines of "We're paying X amount for the buffet; we deserve all we can eat."  Um, everyone in the restaurant is paying X amount.  It's a buffet.
I'm not sure how many of you know that there is a fine line between enough crab and too much crab.  The female member of the party discovered that.   I didn't giggle in the restaurant, but I sure did after we left.  She got her money's worth. 
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: dawnfire on March 11, 2013, 07:48:51 PM
I believe Piers Anthony did something similar.

I always thought it just went to a pre-recorded message.

I think that was the 1800 HIPIERS line.  Not sure, I never called it, but I got the impression that it was basically updates on whatever he was writing at the time.  That was before the web was really big, and vanity phone numbers were more of the thing to do. 

The only Anthony I like is the Incarnations of Immortality series, so I was not a big fan.  My daughter read some of his other stuff and was pretty interested for a while.

I quite liked his Xanth stuff as a teen in the 90's but the puns got a tiresome after awhile.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Jocelyn on March 11, 2013, 08:34:58 PM

I quite liked his Xanth stuff as a teen in the 90's but the puns got a tiresome after awhile.
That, and the endless glee about what color someone's panties were.

I found a complete set of Xanth as an adult, and started reading it, but it was all the juvenile references to panties that did me in, rather than the puns.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Nox on March 11, 2013, 08:56:14 PM
Quote
The young man was giving the impression that he wanted a cool job that was a piece of cake to do, and paid well

What part of being a farrier looks easy to this guy?
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Jocelyn on March 12, 2013, 06:34:46 PM
Quote
The young man was giving the impression that he wanted a cool job that was a piece of cake to do, and paid well

What part of being a farrier looks easy to this guy?

Well, most any skill looks easy when you have a strong and skilled person performing it. :)
I remember learning to clean hooves; I was quite surprised at how hard it was to imitate my instructor. I learned that a big portion of it is convincing the horse that you know what you're doing. I'm sure those Clydesdales had learned that when their farrier asked for their hooves, they might as well just cooperate with the process.  >:D
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: snowfire on March 12, 2013, 08:09:45 PM
Yeah, I'm not a farrier but I've cleaned a LOT of hooves in my time.  It makes a world of difference how well trained and cooperative the horse is.  I've had horses lean on me, bite me in the butt (thankfully wearing heavy parka at the time), refuse to lift their feet, pee on me, try to take a dump on me.  Easy job? I DON'T THINK SO! 

Our farrier says he really hates doing the mini horses.  They are so tiny you really can't lift their feet very far so it's harder on his back.  I told him he needs a grooming table like they use for dogs.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Minmom3 on March 12, 2013, 08:51:48 PM

I quite liked his Xanth stuff as a teen in the 90's but the puns got a tiresome after awhile.
That, and the endless glee about what color someone's panties were.

I found a complete set of Xanth as an adult, and started reading it, but it was all the juvenile references to panties that did me in, rather than the puns.


Well, to be fair, it IS aimed at the youth market, not the adult market. 
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: MommyPenguin on March 12, 2013, 09:36:43 PM

I quite liked his Xanth stuff as a teen in the 90's but the puns got a tiresome after awhile.
That, and the endless glee about what color someone's panties were.

I found a complete set of Xanth as an adult, and started reading it, but it was all the juvenile references to panties that did me in, rather than the puns.


Well, to be fair, it IS aimed at the youth market, not the adult market.

Even as a child/teen, I *adored* the first Xanth books, through maybe around Man from Mundania or so.  But it just seemed like there was less story and more... puns.  I couldn't get through the ones much farther than that.  I'll still go back and read "The Source of Magic" or "Isle of View," but not those later books.  I do remember being disgusted at the cover art from the book with the girl who married Jonathan, the Zombie King.  Brianna, something like that?  The book made such a big deal about her being black, and her people crossing over into Xanth to escape slavery, etc.   And yet the cover art for the book had a dark-haired white girl?  I know the author has no control over that, but I was *very* annoyed at the publishers.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Jocelyn on March 12, 2013, 09:45:20 PM

I quite liked his Xanth stuff as a teen in the 90's but the puns got a tiresome after awhile.
That, and the endless glee about what color someone's panties were.

I found a complete set of Xanth as an adult, and started reading it, but it was all the juvenile references to panties that did me in, rather than the puns.


Well, to be fair, it IS aimed at the youth market, not the adult market.
I read a lot of YA fiction, and a lot of it is well-written. I think what bothered me about Xanth was how it was targeted so strongly at males. I don't know many females who think underpants are hilarious. It was a weird dichotomy...writing in a heroic female character, and then having her main function be to flash her panties at the male protagonist.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: redcat on March 13, 2013, 05:54:18 AM
I know I found them both juvenile and misogynistic.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Tini on March 13, 2013, 07:03:33 AM
Years ago when I moved to Britain, I left all my Xanth books with my BFF because I didn't have that much space in my moving van. I've borrowed them back from her now, and I cannot stand them. I have no clue what I used to see in them. She doesn't want them back, either, so I think I'll put them on the charity table in my local supermarket.

I think living in Britain cured me of my liking for puns, if nothing else.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: MommyPenguin on March 13, 2013, 07:35:15 AM
I had the same issue with my Mercedes Lackey books (Valdemar), in that I thought they were so wonderful when I was young, and then when I went to reread them as an adult, I couldn't believe how annoying and political they were, and I ended up getting rid of all of them.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Minmom3 on March 13, 2013, 08:49:48 PM
It's funny, I've had the same problems with some books I bought in my late teens and early 20's.  I loved them then, and find them uninteresting now.  I really enjoyed the first few Xanth books, but as the puns kept beating me over the head, I got quite tired of them.  He gets a LOT of them from fans who submit them, and they're too labored for my taste.  I still like the Valdemar books, though.  There are others, that currently escape my brain, that I've culled to make space for newer, more currently enjoyed books.  Amanda Quick.  I LOVED her early stuff in that name, now I'm 'meh' on them.  Some newer ones are still to my taste.  I still enjoy her Jayne Ann Krentz stuff, but I can't read too many in a row, as they're too similar.  She writes under another name, (Crystal?) that is mighty hokey.  I enjoy them from the library, but will never pay for them!
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: CrochetFanatic on March 14, 2013, 08:32:28 AM
This morning, when I was in line to pay for a cup of coffee and an apple fritter, another customer tapped me on the shoulder to get my attention.  I went, "Huh?" and turned to look, and the guy standing behind me gave a really exaggerated grin and pointed to the corners of his mouth.  My expression probably looked something like this:  ???.  He clarified, still grinning, "Smile!"  I said, "No," and turned to face forward again.  He called me rude.  I think he was rude twice; first in touching me when it wasn't necessary, then in telling me to smile when I was minding my own business and trying to wake up the rest of the way. 
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Venus193 on March 14, 2013, 08:38:05 AM
This morning, when I was in line to pay for a cup of coffee and an apple fritter, another customer tapped me on the shoulder to get my attention.  I went, "Huh?" and turned to look, and the guy standing behind me gave a really exaggerated grin and pointed to the corners of his mouth.  My expression probably looked something like this:  ???.  He clarified, still grinning, "Smile!"  I said, "No," and turned to face forward again.  He called me rude.  I think he was rude twice; first in touching me when it wasn't necessary, then in telling me to smile when I was minding my own business and trying to wake up the rest of the way. 

My reaction -- in the unlikelihood that this ever happens to me again -- will be "Your rudeness, Sir, is the epitome of presumption."  or perhaps the reverse.

Edited for a spelling error.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Piratelvr1121 on March 14, 2013, 08:46:18 AM
Evil Pirate would be tempted to stick her tongue out at them. 

I got so tired in college of one girl that lived in my suite constantly asking me what's wrong when I wasn't smiling. My nickname was "Giggles" because I was normally cheerful and laughed easily so apparently she thought that if I wasn't laughing or smiling there must be something terribly wrong.  ::)
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Morticia on March 14, 2013, 09:19:33 AM
This morning, when I was in line to pay for a cup of coffee and an apple fritter, another customer tapped me on the shoulder to get my attention.  I went, "Huh?" and turned to look, and the guy standing behind me gave a really exaggerated grin and pointed to the corners of his mouth.  My expression probably looked something like this:  ???.  He clarified, still grinning, "Smile!"  I said, "No," and turned to face forward again.  He called me rude.  I think he was rude twice; first in touching me when it wasn't necessary, then in telling me to smile when I was minding my own business and trying to wake up the rest of the way.

Wow. He sounds like what he really wants is a stir stick up the nose. Why else would he harass people trying to get their morning coffee?
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Layla Miller on March 14, 2013, 09:29:28 AM
This morning, when I was in line to pay for a cup of coffee and an apple fritter, another customer tapped me on the shoulder to get my attention.  I went, "Huh?" and turned to look, and the guy standing behind me gave a really exaggerated grin and pointed to the corners of his mouth.  My expression probably looked something like this:  ???.  He clarified, still grinning, "Smile!"  I said, "No," and turned to face forward again.  He called me rude.  I think he was rude twice; first in touching me when it wasn't necessary, then in telling me to smile when I was minding my own business and trying to wake up the rest of the way.

Would a bland "Yes, it is," be rude?  Because that's what I'd have been tempted to reply with before turning back around.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Shalamar on March 14, 2013, 10:27:20 AM
UGH.  Evil Shalamar would be tempted to make up something like "I just lost my job, so no, I don't feel like smiling."
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: bloo on March 14, 2013, 03:42:56 PM
This morning, when I was in line to pay for a cup of coffee and an apple fritter, another customer tapped me on the shoulder to get my attention.  I went, "Huh?" and turned to look, and the guy standing behind me gave a really exaggerated grin and pointed to the corners of his mouth.  My expression probably looked something like this:  ???.  He clarified, still grinning, "Smile!"  I said, "No," and turned to face forward again.  He called me rude.  I think he was rude twice; first in touching me when it wasn't necessary, then in telling me to smile when I was minding my own business and trying to wake up the rest of the way.

This experience absolutely infuriates me. You handled him perfectly.

Personally, I'd have smiled to appease him and turned around and ignored him (as I've done in a slightly similar situation) because I suppose that would be easier for me.

But I may try it your way next time.  :-\
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: violinp on March 14, 2013, 04:37:13 PM
This morning, when I was in line to pay for a cup of coffee and an apple fritter, another customer tapped me on the shoulder to get my attention.  I went, "Huh?" and turned to look, and the guy standing behind me gave a really exaggerated grin and pointed to the corners of his mouth.  My expression probably looked something like this:  ???.  He clarified, still grinning, "Smile!"  I said, "No," and turned to face forward again.  He called me rude.  I think he was rude twice; first in touching me when it wasn't necessary, then in telling me to smile when I was minding my own business and trying to wake up the rest of the way.

I would have made the sourest expression ever, just to be contrary to such a one as him.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Tabby Uprising on March 14, 2013, 06:06:47 PM
This morning, when I was in line to pay for a cup of coffee and an apple fritter, another customer tapped me on the shoulder to get my attention.  I went, "Huh?" and turned to look, and the guy standing behind me gave a really exaggerated grin and pointed to the corners of his mouth.  My expression probably looked something like this:  ???.  He clarified, still grinning, "Smile!"  I said, "No," and turned to face forward again.  He called me rude.  I think he was rude twice; first in touching me when it wasn't necessary, then in telling me to smile when I was minding my own business and trying to wake up the rest of the way.

I would have made the sourest expression ever, just to be contrary to such a one as him.

Or tell him, "Sure, I'll smile.  After I see you repeat that same routine with the next guy who walks through the door. P.S. I do not exist for your viewing pleasure."
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: starry diadem on March 15, 2013, 06:12:39 AM
This morning, when I was in line to pay for a cup of coffee and an apple fritter, another customer tapped me on the shoulder to get my attention.  I went, "Huh?" and turned to look, and the guy standing behind me gave a really exaggerated grin and pointed to the corners of his mouth.  My expression probably looked something like this:  ???.  He clarified, still grinning, "Smile!"  I said, "No," and turned to face forward again.  He called me rude.  I think he was rude twice; first in touching me when it wasn't necessary, then in telling me to smile when I was minding my own business and trying to wake up the rest of the way.

I would have made the sourest expression ever, just to be contrary to such a one as him.

Or tell him, "Sure, I'll smile.  After I see you repeat that same routine with the next guy who walks through the door. P.S. I do not exist for your viewing pleasure."

This!  His action was not about making the world a happier place, but about *control*.  He ordered CrochetFanatic to do something for his pleasure, because women (in his tiny mind) are there to please men and make themselves pretty and attractive for the men around them.  It's sexist and demeaning.  He was appallingly rude.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Tea Drinker on March 15, 2013, 09:42:46 AM
It's been a while since I got that "smile" from a stranger, but I figure that the next time it happens I'm going to say "Fifty dollars, please." I suspect he won't want to give me fifty dollars, but I won't want to smile at him, so fair's fair. (I don't actually expect to get the money, I just want to see how the next boor reacts.)
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Hillia on March 15, 2013, 11:33:42 AM
I like to give the most outrageously fake, teeth-baring grin I can muster, kinda like a chimp's aggression display, complete with dead eyes.  You want a smile?  Here ya go.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: rose red on March 15, 2013, 11:54:46 AM
I think I would say "I am smiling" while keeping the same expression that was already in place.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Tabby Uprising on March 15, 2013, 12:09:39 PM
I think I would say "I am smiling" while keeping the same expression that was already in place.

That's an awesome response!  It brings Wednesday Addams to mind  ;D
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Jocelyn on March 16, 2013, 11:19:35 AM
This morning, when I was in line to pay for a cup of coffee and an apple fritter, another customer tapped me on the shoulder to get my attention.  I went, "Huh?" and turned to look, and the guy standing behind me gave a really exaggerated grin and pointed to the corners of his mouth.  My expression probably looked something like this:  ???.  He clarified, still grinning, "Smile!"  I said, "No," and turned to face forward again.  He called me rude.  I think he was rude twice; first in touching me when it wasn't necessary, then in telling me to smile when I was minding my own business and trying to wake up the rest of the way.
If anyone tries this with me, I maintain a solemn face and offer a comment like, 'I was just diagnosed with cancer.' Then I bare my teeth at them in a big humorless grin.
I don't know how long 'just' lasts, but I'm going to get all the usefulness out of this diagnosis that I can...
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: daisy1679 on March 16, 2013, 12:11:44 PM
This morning, when I was in line to pay for a cup of coffee and an apple fritter, another customer tapped me on the shoulder to get my attention.  I went, "Huh?" and turned to look, and the guy standing behind me gave a really exaggerated grin and pointed to the corners of his mouth.  My expression probably looked something like this:  ???.  He clarified, still grinning, "Smile!"  I said, "No," and turned to face forward again.  He called me rude.  I think he was rude twice; first in touching me when it wasn't necessary, then in telling me to smile when I was minding my own business and trying to wake up the rest of the way.
If anyone tries this with me, I maintain a solemn face and offer a comment like, 'I was just diagnosed with cancer.' Then I bare my teeth at them in a big humorless grin.
I don't know how long 'just' lasts, but I'm going to get all the usefulness out of this diagnosis that I can...

I personally prefer to go the "Sheldon" route - http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://www.deviantart.com/download/162240812/Sheldon_Smiles_2_by_demaniore.jpg&imgrefurl=http://demaniore.deviantart.com/art/Sheldon-Smiles-2-162240812&h=586&w=614&sz=128&tbnid=rxfLwUOly37tDM:&tbnh=96&tbnw=101&zoom=1&usg=__wbykymqMUgX6iXO-SsdNcHBTvZ4=&docid=6lKT3BJOkp_4XM&sa=X&ei=E6dEUeT3DoPiyAG4nICQAw&ved=0CDcQ9QEwAA&dur=1993 (http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://www.deviantart.com/download/162240812/Sheldon_Smiles_2_by_demaniore.jpg&imgrefurl=http://demaniore.deviantart.com/art/Sheldon-Smiles-2-162240812&h=586&w=614&sz=128&tbnid=rxfLwUOly37tDM:&tbnh=96&tbnw=101&zoom=1&usg=__wbykymqMUgX6iXO-SsdNcHBTvZ4=&docid=6lKT3BJOkp_4XM&sa=X&ei=E6dEUeT3DoPiyAG4nICQAw&ved=0CDcQ9QEwAA&dur=1993)
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: athersgeo on March 19, 2013, 11:04:39 AM
I like to give the most outrageously fake, teeth-baring grin I can muster, kinda like a chimp's aggression display, complete with dead eyes.  You want a smile?  Here ya go.

Mine's less a chip's aggression display and more crazed-cannibal-who's-just-decided-you-look-good-to-eat. It's VERY effective and I can (as my dancing teacher discovered*) keep it up for a good two or three minutes.



*In fairness, she did have a good reason to ask me to smile as I was rehearsing for a performance, the trouble was, I *HAD* been smiling...
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: RooRoo on March 28, 2013, 04:00:54 PM
My mother had a very effective face she used to make. It was neither a grimace nor an eyeroll. The face indicated that she was demonstrating extreme patience in the presence of appalling rudeness/stupidity.

I use it in both the "Smile!" situation, and the previously-mentioned "I don't drink" problem. When someone pesters me about not drinking, after I've said I'm allergic (I'm a sober alcoholic), and they continue with "Suuure... what's you're reaction?" I give them the Look, and say, "I. Throw. Up." Perfectly true.  >:D
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Thipu1 on March 28, 2013, 06:28:08 PM
Many years ago I had a friend who had a neutral facial expression.  When told to 'smile' he could produce something that looked very much like a Byzantine icon of St. John the Baptist. 

You can be sure that he scared the Bezayzus out of anyone who asked him to 'smile'. 
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: PastryGoddess on March 28, 2013, 09:48:17 PM
Many years ago I had a friend who had a neutral facial expression.  When told to 'smile' he could produce something that looked very much like a Byzantine icon of St. John the Baptist. 

You can be sure that he scared the Bezayzus out of anyone who asked him to 'smile'. 

Of course I had to go and google it
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: diesel_darlin on March 28, 2013, 09:52:46 PM
The sad part about this is my GRANDMA does this! It drives me absolutely bonkers! If you are at her house and you dont have the look of awestruck glee on your face, she yells SMILE really loud. Ummmm if I wasnt smiling before, I sure dont want to now!


I can just imagine if some stranger did that.  >:(
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Thipu1 on March 29, 2013, 11:01:21 AM
The sad part about this is my GRANDMA does this! It drives me absolutely bonkers! If you are at her house and you dont have the look of awestruck glee on your face, she yells SMILE really loud. Ummmm if I wasnt smiling before, I sure dont want to now!


I can just imagine if some stranger did that.  >:(

MIL does this too.  When in her presence, everyone must project great enjoyment and enthusiasm at anything that is happening. It is exhausting and so totally fake that I want to plotz.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: mmswm on March 29, 2013, 11:31:13 AM
I have a very effective "teacher look" that I employ on people who tell me to smile.  It normally works to get people to back off.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Reika on March 29, 2013, 02:18:14 PM
I had an escalated call today that I think falls under this category, though I suppose it could fall under brain hurt too.

Normally when a rep transfers a caller, they give a brief blurb about the issue so we aren't going into the situation blind.  So I take over the call and say, "Hi, this is Reika, I understand you're calling on X. How can I help you today?"

The woman starts off with, "Let me say, you are incredibly rude. You shouldn't be going by what the other woman said. You should have asked me how you could help me."

Me:  :o "Er, I'm sorry about that. How can I help you?"

It went downhill from there, she said she wasn't calling on a specific policy, then she said she was calling on letters on that policy, but we hadn't sent any letters out in over a year. Ultimately I ended up giving her to my manager because she refused to verify the policy info, or even what letters she was talking about and demaned someone above me.

All my manager said was "freeze dried whackaloon". Yes, I introduced that phrase to my escalation team. :)
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: LadyClaire on March 29, 2013, 02:26:35 PM
One day at work, a co-worker looked at me and said "Geez, smile! You look like someone just died".

Well..yeah. My grandmother had just died and I'd gotten the news at work, about 5 minutes before my co-worker made the comment to me. I'm guessing she never told someone to smile again after that.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: RingTailedLemur on March 29, 2013, 02:38:36 PM
Many years ago I had a friend who had a neutral facial expression.  When told to 'smile' he could produce something that looked very much like a Byzantine icon of St. John the Baptist. 

You can be sure that he scared the Bezayzus out of anyone who asked him to 'smile'. 

Of course I had to go and google it

So did I, and I still don't understand.  Could someone explain, please?
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Yvaine on March 29, 2013, 02:40:40 PM
I had an escalated call today that I think falls under this category, though I suppose it could fall under brain hurt too.

Normally when a rep transfers a caller, they give a brief blurb about the issue so we aren't going into the situation blind.  So I take over the call and say, "Hi, this is Reika, I understand you're calling on X. How can I help you today?"

The woman starts off with, "Let me say, you are incredibly rude. You shouldn't be going by what the other woman said. You should have asked me how you could help me."

Me:  :o "Er, I'm sorry about that. How can I help you?"

It went downhill from there, she said she wasn't calling on a specific policy, then she said she was calling on letters on that policy, but we hadn't sent any letters out in over a year. Ultimately I ended up giving her to my manager because she refused to verify the policy info, or even what letters she was talking about and demaned someone above me.

All my manager said was "freeze dried whackaloon". Yes, I introduced that phrase to my escalation team. :)

Whaaaaaa? Personally, I would be thrilled if what happened during that call was more common. I get so sick of getting transferred to ten people and having to re-explain to each one because the transfer-er didn't explain what I called about.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Reika on March 29, 2013, 08:27:56 PM
Whaaaaaa? Personally, I would be thrilled if what happened during that call was more common. I get so sick of getting transferred to ten people and having to re-explain to each one because the transfer-er didn't explain what I called about.

That's our standard procedure precisely for that reason. After my post, we did some digging, the caller, and a sibling of hers, have been calling on and off for the past year bitterly complaining about paying the policy benefits to the court appointed representative for that insured's estate. I don't think the whackaloon got any letters, I think she is under the mistaken belief if she acts like she's got stuff from us she'll get us to pay her.

And my manager's comment was after the voicemail. She called the woman back, all she said is "I don't have a politically correct term to use for her."
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: VorFemme on March 29, 2013, 09:56:55 PM
Freeze dried whackaloon  8) should be politically correct - unless loons are a protected species due to endangerment or something...... >:D

Not that Snarky, Evil, or I have noticed any shortage of whackaloons in the world......

They seem to be more common, if anything, now than they were ten, twenty, or even thirty years ago.  I was still in school forty years ago, so I have to plead that I didn't NOTICE their relative numbers back then........

Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Reika on March 29, 2013, 09:57:54 PM
Freeze dried whackaloon wasn't strong enough I'm afraid.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: KB on March 30, 2013, 02:11:23 AM
I had an escalated call today that I think falls under this category, though I suppose it could fall under brain hurt too.

Normally when a rep transfers a caller, they give a brief blurb about the issue so we aren't going into the situation blind.  So I take over the call and say, "Hi, this is Reika, I understand you're calling on X. How can I help you today?"

The woman starts off with, "Let me say, you are incredibly rude. You shouldn't be going by what the other woman said. You should have asked me how you could help me."

I find that attitude fascinating because I endeavour where possible to give my co-workers a run-down of the progress of the call before transferring it to them, and it then gets my goat like mad when they start their section of the call "Hi, this is X, how may I help you?" which suggests I've told them nothing. I would love to see this issue discussed actually. Which do people prefer and why?
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: BB-VA on March 30, 2013, 05:38:18 AM
I had an escalated call today that I think falls under this category, though I suppose it could fall under brain hurt too.

Normally when a rep transfers a caller, they give a brief blurb about the issue so we aren't going into the situation blind.  So I take over the call and say, "Hi, this is Reika, I understand you're calling on X. How can I help you today?"

The woman starts off with, "Let me say, you are incredibly rude. You shouldn't be going by what the other woman said. You should have asked me how you could help me."

I find that attitude fascinating because I endeavour where possible to give my co-workers a run-down of the progress of the call before transferring it to them, and it then gets my goat like mad when they start their section of the call "Hi, this is X, how may I help you?" which suggests I've told them nothing. I would love to see this issue discussed actually. Which do people prefer and why?

I don't know about preferences, but in the call center where I work, it is required that we tell the co-worker as much as possible about the caller.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Thipu1 on March 30, 2013, 09:32:26 AM
Many years ago I had a friend who had a neutral facial expression.  When told to 'smile' he could produce something that looked very much like a Byzantine icon of St. John the Baptist. 

You can be sure that he scared the Bezayzus out of anyone who asked him to 'smile'. 

Of course I had to go and google it

I've looked for a John the Baptist but couldn't find one strong enough.  Suffice it to say that that this expression was not a smile.  It was quite close to the expression of a homicidal maniac who is coming at you with a chain saw. 
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Pen^2 on March 30, 2013, 10:40:51 AM
I've had some real shockers. At a school I once taught at, I had a year 10 student who was the very definition of delinquency. He never showed up to class, broke windows, swore, and all the rest of it. At the most expensive school in the state, I should add. His mother was constantly getting phone calls about his behaviour from his tutor (all calls had to be via the tutor, never directly from teachers). I used to wonder why, despite all the phone calls and the evidence of how much money she was pouring down the sink by paying school fees for an institution he didn't really attend, she never seemed to have done anything to change his attitude. Not that it was entirely within her control, of course, but you'd expect something, even a little. I found out the truth on the first parent teacher evening.

It's hard to talk to a parent about a student like this, especially when you can't make an assessment of how he is going in the subject when he never turns up. Considering his behavioural problems, his abilities in maths were really irrelevant. Anyway, we shake hands, I greet her warmly and introduce myself, and we sit down. I begin with something like, "well, as we both are aware, [son] has a few issues holding him back in mathematics. I'd like to discuss with you some steps which [tutor] and myself have worked out to help [son] get the most out of maths."

Mother: "Do you realise how negative you sound?"
Me: "I'm sorry?"
Mother: "It's really rude to be so negative about my son, you know. I'm very unimpressed."
Me: "I'm sorry you feel that way. How about we focus on the positive things we can do for your son?"
Mother: "There you go again: you haven't said one nice thing about him. I refuse to talk to anyone so rude."

I sit there dumbfounded as I struggle to think of any single nice thing I can say that isn't a blatant lie about the son. Nice smile? Big no. Energetic? Indolent. Friends? None within the school. Breathes well? He spits and snorts too frequently for this to ever be believed. All the while, connections are being made about this woman and her son.

Me: "Again, I'm sorry we seem to have begun on the wrong foot. However, I feel that your son has some very good potential in him for excelling at mathematics, and I'd like to talk with you about helping him achieve some of that."
Mother: "It's no wonder he's failing your class! You're just like all the other idiots who work here! With a teacher this rude and stupid, I can see why his grades are low. You probably just fail him for the hell of it, don't you? Humph! Money obviously can't buy everything: it certainly can't buy good teachers!"

She did this to every other one of his poor teachers. I guess it's easier to blame the teachers than anything else, but still, her attitude was only preventing the problem from ever being addressed and fixed. Daft woman.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Venus193 on March 30, 2013, 12:43:18 PM
Egad; what finally happened?
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Kariachi on March 30, 2013, 12:56:59 PM
Alright, so this happened Thursday, in partial reaction to all the same-sex marriage/Supreme Court stuff going on. A good portion of my family is religious, I'm openly into women, can you see where this is going?

Well, my parents' shared facebook page has been bombarded with anti-same-sex marriage stuff, repeatedly, by relatives and it was starting to wear thin. Finally, Thursday morning, my mother responded to my paternal great-aunt and maternal grandmother, asking if this meant that they'd like to be left off any wedding guest lists for me.

Cue my cousin, who we shall call Overstep 'cause anything else I can think of is unfit for polite company. Overstep responded to my mother, saying that she supports same-sex couples but that grandma is entitled to her beliefs, that we shouldn't be so mean to her and, quote,

"And grandma, I don't think you have to worry about [Kariachi] ever getting married."

End quote. Followed by another comment saying that people should think twice before they disrespect her family.  :o?!

Unfortunately, we discovered this after my sister came home, after a horrible and long day at work and hyped up on caffeine. My over-protective sister. With the worst temper in the household.

Immediately she logged in and responded, not nicely but politely, telling Overstep that grandma's beliefs don't give her immunity to potential consequences and that she may want to not make comments like that about me.

Have I mentioned loving my little sister today?

Overstep came back, saying that this discussion had nothing to do with my sister and I and everything to do with my father being rude to her grandmother.

At which point my mother responded again.

"Actually this is about her mother making a point to Her mother {cut} As for disrespecting YOUR family I'm thinking I put in enough time in it to earn that right."


At which point she tried to backpedal and began on the good old fashion "you're being rude" track.

A select portion of my mom's response.

"If you know your grandchild is [attracted to the same sex] and post something on Facebook against that child ever marrying I believe that is Rude. Something along the line of telling your grandmother she won't have to worry about [Kariachi] ever getting married"


She didn't respond. I think we won.


This is the same cousin that, when my sister posted about considering getting a tattoo on the back of her neck, commented telling her how bad an idea it was and that 'as [her] older cousin, it would be my duty to come up and knock some sense into you'.

To which my sister responded that she was welcome to come try(little sis has beat down guys who make Overstep look like a ragdoll), and that I had rank on this one and had given my support.

She didn't respond to that one either.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: artk2002 on March 30, 2013, 01:17:45 PM
Sounds like it's time to cut Overstep off from the information stream. Just because she's related, it doesn't mean she has the right to hear everything.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Kariachi on March 30, 2013, 07:06:08 PM
Sounds like it's time to cut Overstep off from the information stream. Just because she's related, it doesn't mean she has the right to hear everything.

Something that has been handled. The sister and I had to head out to get lunch while the talk was still going, but once we got home she and my mother immediately blocked her.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: TootsNYC on March 30, 2013, 10:57:23 PM
Someone I know was telling this story.

She was in the elevator of her apt. building, with a laundry bag and shopping cart.
Someone else got in and said to her, "Are you going to the basement?" When the answer was yes, the lady said, "Do you want to take my garbage down for me? It would save me a trip."

The person I know said, "No, I wouldn't like to take your garbage down."

The lady said, with a hmph, "well, it's not like it's stinky or anything, but whatever!"
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Venus193 on March 31, 2013, 06:45:50 AM
 ::)  I would call that a presumptuous request unless the woman was injured or ill. 

Wait; it's presumptuous anyway since there is an elevator involved and your friend was looking to do laundry.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Katana_Geldar on March 31, 2013, 07:40:29 AM
She asked it the wrong way and didn't act as of taking the garbage inconvenienced her.

"Do you mind taking my garbage down to the basement? I'd really appreciate it as I need to get back to my desk."
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: MariaE on March 31, 2013, 08:48:43 AM
She asked it the wrong way and didn't act as of taking the garbage inconvenienced her.

"Do you mind taking my garbage down to the basement? I'd really appreciate it as I need to get back to my desk."

Not to mention that the wording "Do you want to.." really rubs me the wrong way. Don't make it sound like you're doing me a favour when it's really the other way around.

My husband used to do this and it drove. me. nuts! No honey, you're not bestowing some honour on me by allowing me to do you a favour! I've mostly got him trained out of it, fortunately.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: CrochetFanatic on March 31, 2013, 09:06:41 AM
The problem with doing something nice once is the risk of it becoming a habit.  I would occasionally agree to give someone a ride home from work, but I quickly found out that I didn't like doing this, because once I've done it one time, a couple of my coworkers seemed to think, "Oh, I'll just skip the part of arranging a ride home before work and bum a ride off CrochetFanatic." 

On one hand, I had a couple of girls who would ask me, but would say upfront that if I couldn't do it they could find another way.  Those were the ones who got the most rides, and who accepted it gracefully if I couldn't swing it.  Besides, they were right on the way home.

On the other hand, I had someone I had only met the day before come up to me and say, "I need you to give me a ride home."  I told her I couldn't do it, and she started listing off several reasons why she needed a ride home, and it had to be me because she had already asked everyone else.  I simply "had" to do it.  I repeated that, no, I couldn't do it because I had a lot of errands to run that day (true) and because it was very short notice.  Cue the scoff, and the "Fine!  You don't have to be rude about it..." 

She got home that day.  I don't know how, and I don't care.  ;D
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: BB-VA on March 31, 2013, 01:12:49 PM
She asked it the wrong way and didn't act as of taking the garbage inconvenienced her.

"Do you mind taking my garbage down to the basement? I'd really appreciate it as I need to get back to my desk."

Not to mention that the wording "Do you want to.." really rubs me the wrong way. Don't make it sound like you're doing me a favour when it's really the other way around.

My husband used to do this and it drove. me. nuts! No honey, you're not bestowing some honour on me by allowing me to do you a favour! I've mostly got him trained out of it, fortunately.

My husband says, "I am going to let you do X for me."   It is quite irritating to me.

The real kicker is that he got it from his mother.  She still does it.  I think it was a way to get the kids to do something by making it feel like a "special event". 

Maybe it would have been ok if I was a kid - in my 50's, not so much. 
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Shalamar on March 31, 2013, 01:22:13 PM
My mother used to say "Do you want to set the table?".   She got very irritated when I said "No, but thank you for thinking of me."   >:D
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Jocelyn on March 31, 2013, 01:27:03 PM
My mother used to say "Do you want to set the table?".   She got very irritated when I said "No, but thank you for thinking of me."   >:D
Gee, I didn't realize my mother had another table that needed setting!  >:D
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: weeblewobble on March 31, 2013, 02:49:43 PM
Yesterday we took our kids to an aquarium.  There is a penguin exhibit in which the kids can crawl on their hands and knees through a u-shaped plexiglass tube that leads to an enclosed plexiglass bubble (the bubble is in the bend of the "u") within the penguin habitat.  So they can really see the penguins up close. Meanwhile, the parents stand on the other side of the glass enclosing the habitat and we can see the kids crawling through the tube.

Our DD, 8, led her brother, 4, through the tube and despite the fact that it was busy, all of the kids were waiting patiently and taking turns.  Until the Pushersons showed up.  There was a boy, bigger and older than DD, probably 11-2, a boy around 7 and another boy around 6.  They were all in the same family.  They literally crawled over other kids in the tube, shoving smaller kids out of the way and generally being too rough.  The parents had to stand by and watch because there was no way for us to get to or redirect the kids in what amounted to a human sized hamster habit surrounded by penguins and glass.

The oldest boy shoved him and DS whacked his head against the glass hard.  The oldest boy then put both hands on DD's behind and SHOVED her forward.  And while he not have meant it in "that way," it seemed awfully convenient that he decided to put his hands on her behind. Meanwhile, the younger son just crawled over them all.

After seeing DS shoved and feeling two hands on her behind,  DD turned (as quickly as she could in the tube) and grabbed the offending boy's hand, which was still clamped on her leg.   Using something her karate instructor showed her, she put a wristlock on him that put pressure on his joint.  Oldest boy dropped to the floor, calling DD some very rude names (I found out later) while telling her to let go.  DD told me she told DS to get out of the tube and get to Mommy, but DS was too distracted, crying about his injured head, to crawl out.  The other two boys took exception to a girl dropping their brother to the floor and jumped on her, knocking DS against the glass again. 

Needless to say, it was chaos.  I ran to the other end of the tube and yelled, "EVERYBODY GET YOUR HANDS OFF OF EACH OTHER AND GET OUT OF THE TUBE, NOW!!" in my scariest mom voice.

DS and DD came scrambling out. The Pusherson boys came out, yelling that DD hurt each of them. The oldest boy was yelling about his wrist hurting. DS was crying about his head hurting.  DD was prepared for further battle in defense of her behind and her brother.  DH was desperately looking for an aquarium staff member while I tried to keep everybody separated.

A woman, who seemed to be the Pusherson boys' mother, came over and said, "Hey, you can't yell at my kids!"  An aquarium staff member finally came over and asked what happened.  Mrs. Pusherson accused DD of attacking her boys without provocation.  She went on and on about how rude I was by yelling at her sons and how awful DD was. Several people - whose children were also shoved around- backed up my version of events.  The staff asked the Pushersons to stay with them while we were free to go. We ended up leaving the aquarium because we didn't want to see them again.

Yes, it was super-rude of me to yell when your children are marauding through the penguin tube.

P.S. While I am proud of DD for defending her brother and her person, I am a little worried about her going from zero to Chuck Norris so easily.  However, I don't want to tell her she was wrong for reacting that way when someone put his hands on her like that.  So we're going to run the scenario past her karate instructor and ask him if there was a better way to handle it.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Reika on March 31, 2013, 03:00:28 PM
I dunno, considering what those boys were doing, I think putting that one boy's hand into a wristlock wasn't so bad. She didn't try to kick him in the face or anything, she was trying to get his hands off of her.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: MyFamily on March 31, 2013, 03:11:03 PM
If the karate instructor suggests that she in anyway over-reacted, find a new instructor.

Your daughter's response was 100% absolutely correct and accurate.  That boy touched her in a place that was beyond inappropriate , combined with the fact that the boy also seriously injured your son - honestly, if those had been my children, I wouldn't have been looking for a staff member, I'd have been looking for a police officer.  I'm so angry right now, I'm shaking.  Good for your daughter, she did exactly as she should have and you should be proud of her instead of worrying if she over-reacted.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: weeblewobble on March 31, 2013, 03:16:23 PM
Oh, I definitely haven't said anything negative to her about he response.  I told her she was a good sister and I'm glad she stuck up for herself.  But that we should run what happened past her instructor to see if he has other recommendations for penguin tube altercations.  I'm guessing her instructor will  review her wristlock technique and give her pointers or alternate suggestions.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Elfmama on March 31, 2013, 03:19:23 PM
My MIL threw at least one hissy fit per visit was about how rude I was. One of the worst was not laughing at her favorite TV comedy.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: weeblewobble on March 31, 2013, 03:21:16 PM
My MIL threw at least one hissy fit per visit was about how rude I was. One of the worst was not laughing at her favorite TV comedy.

Because it's rude to the performers?   ???
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: JeseC on March 31, 2013, 04:56:55 PM
My mother is the queen of these.  A particular subtype especially - "you're being selfish."  This is, of course, said whenever she doesn't get what she wants.

For example, my mother has absolutely no concept of personal space existing within the family.  This is coupled with an incessant need to fix *everything* about her family's looks.  Especially anything at all about skin - she has a borderline OCD obsession with removing any sort of pimple, ingrown hair, or any other skin blemish.

Naturally, this led to an altercation.  I eventually indicated that I was highly uncomfortable with her behavior, and asked that she ask or otherwise seek permission before touching me.  Her response?  "I can't believe you're being so selfish.  Not everything is about what YOU want."  Um, so I'm being selfish for insisting that their are limits on who gets to put their hands on MY body?
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Beyond The Veil on March 31, 2013, 05:11:44 PM
-- the man at the gym who came in and used the circuit machines and refused to move for everyone using the circuit properly.  We were rude and needed to get lives so what he did would not be such a big deal to us.

-- the woman talking on her cell phone and staring into oblivion near the vending machines.  When I put my money in and was walking away before she even moved, she called me a rude b$%^ for cutting in front of her.

-- the elderly lady who rushed in front of me to the pharmacist and then proceeded to ask a billion questions and slowly conduct her business.  She muttered about rude young people who were in too much of a hurry.  I had not said a word.

-- my ex-friend who yelled at a cruise ship worker because my ex-friend didn't like the signage on the map.  The cruise ship worker was rude for not taking the ex-friend by the hand and walking her to her destination.

-- the person at the snow crab leg buffet who stood digging into the bottom of the pan for the "hottest" crab legs while everyone waited.  SHE said only rude people cannot wait their turn.  SHE deserved the best crab legs.  I guess we were all chopped liver.
Slight highjack because this reminded me of an incident that happened several years ago.
My DH and I were at a buffet restaurant, and there was a couple at an table close to ours who were camping the crab legs.  They would hop up and run to the buffet as soon as the crab legs were put out and take ever single piece.  They kept making comments along the lines of "We're paying X amount for the buffet; we deserve all we can eat."  Um, everyone in the restaurant is paying X amount.  It's a buffet.
I'm not sure how many of you know that there is a fine line between enough crab and too much crab.  The female member of the party discovered that.   I didn't giggle in the restaurant, but I sure did after we left.  She got her money's worth.

This post is making me snicker because of similar experience of my own from a few years ago that I posted about. (http://www.etiquettehell.com/smf/index.php?topic=42138.0) End off-topic!  ;D
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Elfmama on March 31, 2013, 09:29:02 PM
I'm honestly not sure about the link between "low status" dogs and jumping, but I will agree with the assertion that well-trained dogs are safer for everybody.  Let's take my dog, for example.  He's huge and very friendly, unless he thinks you're a threat to my kids (but that's another story).

Situation A: 135lb dog comes bounding up to you, trying to jump on you to get attention.

Situation B:  135lb dog sitting down, with a little bit excited tail-wagging and butt-wiggling, looking at his owner.  Owner looks at you and asks if the dog can approach for ear scritches.  If you say yes, dog walks gently over to you, sits down at your feet and looks up.

Obviously situation B is best for everybody.  Dominance or not, the calm, well-behaved and well-trained dog is safest for everybody in the area.


ETA:  Since I'm an owner of a "giant" breed that's known for being very protective, I take training very seriously.  Brazilian Mastiffs are actually banned as dangerous dogs in some countries, and need special licences in others, so I take my responsibility very, very seriously and have gone well beyond basic obedience in his training.  Yet I still have people claim that I'm rude when it comes to his public interactions and keeping him from just being able to go up and greet people without permission.
That is an extremely reasonable and responsible thing to do, IMHO.  No dog should be allowed indiscriminate jumping on people, whether he weighs 135 pounds or 3 pounds. 
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Elfmama on March 31, 2013, 09:36:01 PM
the mother doubled back to yell at the lady for being "rude" and "intolerant" because he was "just a little boy, and doesn't know any better!".
Would it be retaliatory rudeness to tell the mother "Then teach him better!"?
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Elfmama on March 31, 2013, 09:43:35 PM
You could always try 867-5309 (tell him your name is Jenny).  Or 1-800-Eat-xxxx.  :)
Please don't.  I've been on the end of receiving calls where some woman has pulled a number out of thin air to give to a persistent drunk.  It wasn't pretty, and ended with my buddy Steve saying "Lulu's in her room with a john.  Can she call you back in 15 minutes?"
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Elfmama on March 31, 2013, 09:58:46 PM
This morning, when I was in line to pay for a cup of coffee and an apple fritter, another customer tapped me on the shoulder to get my attention.  I went, "Huh?" and turned to look, and the guy standing behind me gave a really exaggerated grin and pointed to the corners of his mouth.  My expression probably looked something like this:  ??? .  He clarified, still grinning, "Smile!"  I said, "No," and turned to face forward again.  He called me rude.  I think he was rude twice; first in touching me when it wasn't necessary, then in telling me to smile when I was minding my own business and trying to wake up the rest of the way.
Anyone who taps me on the shoulder is going to get a scream, not a smile.  And will be lucky not to get a knee to the goolies.  Certain points on the body are EXTREMELY sensitive for a fibromyalgic; shoulders are one of them.  Even a very light touch is painful.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Piratelvr1121 on March 31, 2013, 10:02:59 PM
If anyone were to poke me in the side and then complain when I jumped, they'd be getting a growl.  I'm extremely ticklish. and everywhere.  A couple years ago my friend was helping me to see if a shirt would fit around me when I was pregnant.  She had long nails and unintentionally but ever so lightly brushed my sides with her nails and I jumped and giggled, that's how ticklish I am. 

Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Elfmama on March 31, 2013, 10:14:12 PM
My MIL threw at least one hissy fit per visit was about how rude I was. One of the worst was not laughing at her favorite TV comedy.

Because it's rude to the performers?   ???
Because it was criticizing MIL.  If I didn't laugh, it must mean that I think it's lowbrow humor that only cretins would enjoy.  None of which I ever SAID, mind you.  I was just sitting there minding my own business  and reading.  ::) 
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: PastryGoddess on March 31, 2013, 11:01:36 PM
If anyone were to poke me in the side and then complain when I jumped, they'd be getting a growl.  I'm extremely ticklish. and everywhere.  A couple years ago my friend was helping me to see if a shirt would fit around me when I was pregnant.  She had long nails and unintentionally but ever so lightly brushed my sides with her nails and I jumped and giggled, that's how ticklish I am. 



This is me.  I love and hate getting pedicures because I'm so ticklish.  New massage therapists are torture for me
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: dawnfire on March 31, 2013, 11:41:28 PM
This morning, when I was in line to pay for a cup of coffee and an apple fritter, another customer tapped me on the shoulder to get my attention.  I went, "Huh?" and turned to look, and the guy standing behind me gave a really exaggerated grin and pointed to the corners of his mouth.  My expression probably looked something like this:  ??? .  He clarified, still grinning, "Smile!"  I said, "No," and turned to face forward again.  He called me rude.  I think he was rude twice; first in touching me when it wasn't necessary, then in telling me to smile when I was minding my own business and trying to wake up the rest of the way.
Anyone who taps me on the shoulder is going to get a scream, not a smile.  And will be lucky not to get a knee to the goolies.  Certain points on the body are EXTREMELY sensitive for a fibromyalgic; shoulders are one of them.  Even a very light touch is painful.

here's the thing that gets me. If the person is behind you , how can they tell if you're smiling or not?  besides I need my coffee before i'm even human , let alone happy.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: weeblewobble on April 01, 2013, 04:36:27 AM
This morning, when I was in line to pay for a cup of coffee and an apple fritter, another customer tapped me on the shoulder to get my attention.  I went, "Huh?" and turned to look, and the guy standing behind me gave a really exaggerated grin and pointed to the corners of his mouth.  My expression probably looked something like this:  ??? .  He clarified, still grinning, "Smile!"  I said, "No," and turned to face forward again.  He called me rude.  I think he was rude twice; first in touching me when it wasn't necessary, then in telling me to smile when I was minding my own business and trying to wake up the rest of the way.
Anyone who taps me on the shoulder is going to get a scream, not a smile.  And will be lucky not to get a knee to the goolies.  Certain points on the body are EXTREMELY sensitive for a fibromyalgic; shoulders are one of them.  Even a very light touch is painful.

I am sorry about your discomfort.  However, "goolies" is an expression I've never heard before.  And it really made me laugh.  I plan on using in the future. :)
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: pwy a wyr on April 01, 2013, 07:40:22 AM

P.S. While I am proud of DD for defending her brother and her person, I am a little worried about her going from zero to Chuck Norris so easily.  However, I don't want to tell her she was wrong for reacting that way when someone put his hands on her like that.  So we're going to run the scenario past her karate instructor and ask him if there was a better way to handle it.

May I applause you for training your daughter how to go "Chuck Norris" safely and appropriately. I wish I could.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Snowy Owl on April 01, 2013, 07:56:17 AM

P.S. While I am proud of DD for defending her brother and her person, I am a little worried about her going from zero to Chuck Norris so easily.  However, I don't want to tell her she was wrong for reacting that way when someone put his hands on her like that.  So we're going to run the scenario past her karate instructor and ask him if there was a better way to handle it.

May I applause you for training your daughter how to go "Chuck Norris" safely and appropriately. I wish I could.

Add me to those who think this was an entirely appropriate reaction to someone touching her in an inappropriate and unwelcome way.  She didn't beat seven bells out of him (which would be overkill), she simply stopped him and protected her brother, using the assertiveness and skills she'd learnt in karate.  Sounds like a fantastic kid to me  ;D
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Venus193 on April 01, 2013, 09:21:00 AM
Congrats to your daughter for this.  Here's hoping that other family was banned from the place.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Kimberami on April 01, 2013, 10:03:46 AM
If the karate instructor suggests that she in anyway over-reacted, find a new instructor.

Your daughter's response was 100% absolutely correct and accurate.  That boy touched her in a place that was beyond inappropriate , combined with the fact that the boy also seriously injured your son - honestly, if those had been my children, I wouldn't have been looking for a staff member, I'd have been looking for a police officer.  I'm so angry right now, I'm shaking.  Good for your daughter, she did exactly as she should have and you should be proud of her instead of worrying if she over-reacted.
POD
Touch me, and you will be punished.  Don't like it?  Then you can keep your hands to yourself.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: mmswm on April 01, 2013, 10:17:07 AM
Add me to the list of those applauding Chuck Norris, Jr.  Good for her for being able to defend herself when touched inappropriately!  Double points for defending her brother as well.  You've got a great kid.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: MommyPenguin on April 01, 2013, 10:47:18 AM
I've always sort of chuckled at people who say, "If somebody grabbed me suddenly, I'd probably involuntarily hit them in the nose!"  And then... it happened to me.  I was getting up from a chair and my husband bussed me on the stomach/side, and I was so startled I elbowed him *hard* in the nose.  He was not happy.  Oops.  :)  I can see the daughter's reaction being part involuntary and part trained reaction from her karate training.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: hjaye on April 01, 2013, 11:22:33 AM
I think this qualifies as one thing that drives me up the wall! :D  Here are my favorite stories here:

1) When a toddler slammed into me as I walked off a plane.  The plane was very late and I was sleep-deprived but I was in the "lane" where other travelers were getting off.  I had heard her screaming and running around, but because it didn't occur to me that she'd just run into walking people and didn't watch for her.  (And I wasn't exactly motivated to be extra aware at the time.)  I was told I was rude for not watching for her.  I'm not proud of this but I told the mother to "parent already."  As I walked away I heard her tell her daughter that "It's OK, her mommy didn't teach her to be polite."  Thankfully I recovered myself enough to not turn around and say that my mommy was severely depressed and negligent but there is no way in heck she would be negligent enough to let her daughter go running into people! 

2) When I asked someone to "keep it down" at a camp site.  They were being very loud at 1 am.  They complained that I had "spoiled everything."  Well sorry for the other 100 people here who are encroaching on your family time.

3) When I tried to get past a woman talking on a cellphone on one of those moving sidewalks at the airport.  I said "Excuse me." But she just blithely kept wandering from side to side and jabbering away.  My husband had been ahead of me and we were both moving fast to catch a flight.  I called up to him, "Tell them I'm coming!"  She turned around and berated me for talking loud when she was trying to have a conversation.

4) When someone was holding up a line at a store while berating the cashier for something that wasn't her fault.  He refused to talk to a manager because, "You'd better just fix it!"  Someone else in line said, "Could you speak to a manager?  The rest of us would like to be served as well."  Of course that person was told off for being "rude."  Which made all of us in line snicker a little.  He realized that all of us where smiling at the irony and told us we were all rude.

This is where I would like to paraphrase Winston Churchill, and Ron White:

I may be rude, but you're stupid.  I can learn manners, but you can't fix stupid!  (Oh if only................ )
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: snowdragon on April 01, 2013, 11:35:40 AM
If the karate instructor suggests that she in anyway over-reacted, find a new instructor.

Your daughter's response was 100% absolutely correct and accurate.  That boy touched her in a place that was beyond inappropriate , combined with the fact that the boy also seriously injured your son - honestly, if those had been my children, I wouldn't have been looking for a staff member, I'd have been looking for a police officer.  I'm so angry right now, I'm shaking.  Good for your daughter, she did exactly as she should have and you should be proud of her instead of worrying if she over-reacted.
POD
Touch me, and you will be punished.  Don't like it?  Then you can keep your hands to yourself.

This.  Your daughter was wonderfully controlled in her response.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: siamesecat2965 on April 01, 2013, 02:41:09 PM
My mother used to say "Do you want to set the table?".   She got very irritated when I said "No, but thank you for thinking of me."   >:D
Gee, I didn't realize my mother had another table that needed setting!  >:D

Or mine!  I wish I had thought to say that to her growing up! She will still do that, :"do you want to take out the trash, or some such thing" when I visit. I love my mom, and will do anything she asks me to, but I've told her over and over, just ASK me to do it, not ask if I want to do it!

My mom is very direct, but in some ways can be very PA. 
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: mmswm on April 01, 2013, 05:57:17 PM
I couldn't figure out where to put this, but I was so amused by it I had to stick it somewhere.  I think this is the best place...

I borrowed my father's truck to go to the grocery store.  I had a lot of shopping to do and I needed the additional storage space the truck would provide over the tiny trunk in my little Civic.  Both of my parents have valid handicap parking placards and I keep one for my son in the truck as well, since he rides in both my car and the truck on a regular basis.  Now, I know you're not supposed to drive around with those things hanging on your mirror, but my parents do, and since it's their truck, I left them up.  They have all three placards hanging from the mirror.

I arrive in the parking lot, and since I don't have any of the owners of the placards in the truck with me, I bypass all the open handicap parking and pull into a regular spot about half way back. I hopped out of the truck only to be verbally assaulted by a crazy lady berating me for "abusing handicap parking".  I just looked at her like she was insane, closed the truck door and started walking into the store.  She followed me, yelling at me for at least half the walk.  I ignored her, but it seems that simply being in possession of the placards constituted "abuse" to her.  I didn't reply, only because if I dared open my mouth, I would have probably been guilty of retaliatory rudeness by busting into uproarious laughter right in her face, so I just kept my mouth shut.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Mel the Redcap on April 01, 2013, 07:37:32 PM
My husband says, "I am going to let you do X for me."   It is quite irritating to me.

The real kicker is that he got it from his mother.  She still does it.  I think it was a way to get the kids to do something by making it feel like a "special event". 

Maybe it would have been ok if I was a kid - in my 50's, not so much.

Argh argh argh this!!!!!

My mother did this to me all the time when I lived at home, especially if she visited friends and took me along. "Oh, we'll let Mel do the dishes." ARRRRRRGH!!!!!

No, it's not much better when you're a kid.  ::)
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: andi on April 01, 2013, 07:51:38 PM
the mother doubled back to yell at the lady for being "rude" and "intolerant" because he was "just a little boy, and doesn't know any better!".
Would it be retaliatory rudeness to tell the mother "Then teach him better!"?

That's what I always want to say.  Of corse he doesnt know better - that's what parents / guardians etc are put here for- to teach them!!!
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: doodlemor on April 01, 2013, 08:50:25 PM

The oldest boy shoved him and DS whacked his head against the glass hard.  The oldest boy then put both hands on DD's behind and SHOVED her forward.  And while he not have meant it in "that way," it seemed awfully convenient that he decided to put his hands on her behind. Meanwhile, the younger son just crawled over them all.


Actually, he probably did mean it "that way."  I used to teach kids that age, and unfortunately, that's how some of them think.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Twik on April 02, 2013, 09:53:19 AM
I arrive in the parking lot, and since I don't have any of the owners of the placards in the truck with me, I bypass all the open handicap parking and pull into a regular spot about half way back. I hopped out of the truck only to be verbally assaulted by a crazy lady berating me for "abusing handicap parking".  I just looked at her like she was insane, closed the truck door and started walking into the store.  She followed me, yelling at me for at least half the walk.  I ignored her, but it seems that simply being in possession of the placards constituted "abuse" to her.  I didn't reply, only because if I dared open my mouth, I would have probably been guilty of retaliatory rudeness by busting into uproarious laughter right in her face, so I just kept my mouth shut.

I wonder if she had some idea that if you display the cards, you *have* to park in a handicapped spot?
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: mmswm on April 02, 2013, 10:05:49 AM
Twik, I thought of that.  The whole situation just seemed surreal.  She was yelling at me in a combination of English/Spanish, and I was trying to ignore her, so I didn't pay too close attention to what she was saying.  I can't win for losing, apparently.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: nayberry on April 02, 2013, 10:26:47 AM
+1 to "chuck norris JR" reacting perfectly.   




i have a new one,  apparently if you are stood looking at yogurts in the supermarket you now need to be psychic and "know" that you have to move immediately when some people come along. 
that or you'll be hit by their trolley,  i still didn't move until i was done, then i heard "some people are so rude", i did reply..... "yes, shoving a trolley into someone instead of saying, excuse is rude isn't it?"
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: CrochetFanatic on April 02, 2013, 12:49:00 PM
nayberry, that bugs me to no end.  All people have to do is say "excuse me", and I'll almost always move aside.  That simple.  I had an old man clip the backs of my heels with his cart, and he responded with my loud "Ouch!" with an annoyed, "Well, couldn't you see that I'm trying to get to the shelf?"  No, sir, I did hear you coming, but I don't have eyes in the back of my head or ESP.  I expected a speech about how young people never move over for their elders anymore, but he simply sidled in front of me and got what he needed off the shelf.

A simple "Excuse me" would have resulted in an immediate, "Oh, sure." and me moving out of the way.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: nayberry on April 02, 2013, 01:32:21 PM
precisely Crochetfanatic,  if they said excuse me, i'd have moved along and gone back after they were done.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Kimberami on April 02, 2013, 03:47:41 PM
+1 to "chuck norris JR" reacting perfectly.   




i have a new one,  apparently if you are stood looking at yogurts in the supermarket you now need to be psychic and "know" that you have to move immediately when some people come along. 
that or you'll be hit by their trolley,  i still didn't move until i was done, then i heard "some people are so rude", i did reply..... "yes, shoving a trolley into someone instead of saying, excuse is rude isn't it?"
The Evil Fishy in me would have felt the need to scream very loudly...possibly fall the ground in agony.   >:D
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: snowflake on April 02, 2013, 03:48:30 PM
nayberry, that bugs me to no end.  All people have to do is say "excuse me", and I'll almost always move aside.  That simple.  I had an old man clip the backs of my heels with his cart, and he responded with my loud "Ouch!" with an annoyed, "Well, couldn't you see that I'm trying to get to the shelf?"  No, sir, I did hear you coming, but I don't have eyes in the back of my head or ESP.  I expected a speech about how young people never move over for their elders anymore, but he simply sidled in front of me and got what he needed off the shelf.

A simple "Excuse me" would have resulted in an immediate, "Oh, sure." and me moving out of the way.

I mostly get people who are checking their lists, counting coupons, etc. in the middle of an aisle.  I swoop down to get a can of beans or what not and get hissy fits because I'm "cutting in line."  Uh, there's a line to the beans?  No one was there and it's not obvious what you were doing.  If someone reaches in when I'm making up my mind or double-checking quantities needed, I figure that's because it's not my personal grocery store.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: nayberry on April 03, 2013, 06:15:47 AM
+1 to "chuck norris JR" reacting perfectly.   




i have a new one,  apparently if you are stood looking at yogurts in the supermarket you now need to be psychic and "know" that you have to move immediately when some people come along. 
that or you'll be hit by their trolley,  i still didn't move until i was done, then i heard "some people are so rude", i did reply..... "yes, shoving a trolley into someone instead of saying, excuse is rude isn't it?"
The Evil Fishy in me would have felt the need to scream very loudly...possibly fall the ground in agony.   >:D

i did say to Hub's one time that if that "darned" woman hit me with her trolley again i was screaming and doing a professional footballer's injury moment (soccer for the USA) so rolling on the ground crying and screaming in agony....  i didn't have to, but the thought was there.....
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: mmswm on April 03, 2013, 10:12:18 AM
+1 to "chuck norris JR" reacting perfectly.   




i have a new one,  apparently if you are stood looking at yogurts in the supermarket you now need to be psychic and "know" that you have to move immediately when some people come along. 
that or you'll be hit by their trolley,  i still didn't move until i was done, then i heard "some people are so rude", i did reply..... "yes, shoving a trolley into someone instead of saying, excuse is rude isn't it?"
The Evil Fishy in me would have felt the need to scream very loudly...possibly fall the ground in agony.   >:D

i did say to Hub's one time that if that "darned" woman hit me with her trolley again i was screaming and doing a professional footballer's injury moment (soccer for the USA) so rolling on the ground crying and screaming in agony....  i didn't have to, but the thought was there.....

I have been sorely tempted to do this more than once.  Fortunately, I know that my acting skills are quite bad and my better judgement ruled the day.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: sweet_basil on April 12, 2013, 09:49:01 PM
People speaking to me while I'm eating annoy me to no end. It's still rude to talk with your mouth full, yes? They get pissy when I don't respond promptly and somebody has to "helpfully" remind me that "So and So said something to you." Any suggestions for saying "My mouth is full, can't talk right now?"
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Sophie Jenkins on April 12, 2013, 09:50:18 PM
People speaking to me while I'm eating annoy me to no end. It's still rude to talk with your mouth full, yes? They get pissy when I don't respond promptly and somebody has to "helpfully" remind me that "So and So said something to you." Any suggestions for saying "My mouth is full, can't talk right now?"

I do the tight-lipped smile while pointing to my chewing mouth. Usually the reaction I get is a laugh and, "Oh, right, when you're ready."
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: EllenS on April 12, 2013, 09:51:36 PM
People speaking to me while I'm eating annoy me to no end. It's still rude to talk with your mouth full, yes? They get pissy when I don't respond promptly and somebody has to "helpfully" remind me that "So and So said something to you." Any suggestions for saying "My mouth is full, can't talk right now?"

I do the tight-lipped smile while pointing to my chewing mouth. Usually the reaction I get is a laugh and, "Oh, right, when you're ready."

I will sometimes add a vocalized "Hm Hm Hm..." as in "I'm chewing.." but with my mouth closed.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: Venus193 on April 13, 2013, 05:16:35 AM
That is a passive/aggressive power play.  It's a tactic often used at business lunches that aren't celebratory.
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: rain on April 13, 2013, 11:40:15 AM
what I usually do is hold up a finger to indicate  "wait a minute" - is shows I've heard them (boy I wish DS would do something like this) and lets them know I'll answer when I'm ready/able
Title: Re: "You're being rude" - Etiquette hypocrisy & misunderstandings
Post by: VorFemme on April 16, 2013, 07:42:39 PM
Classic at the doctor's office today.

Patient was asking about getting something (not speaking clearly - they were talking to the person at the desk and on their cell phone at the same time - so hard to understand what was being said to the person at the desk and what was being said over the phone was loud & clear - but that's not what I'm posting about HERE). 

After asking two or three times about something, the question was "why won't you release that to me?"  Receptionist finally said, clearly, that the insurance had not paid so there was an outstanding (unpaid) balance on the account for the last five months and that nothing could be done about (mumble) until that was cleared up (I wondered if the mumble was to keep anyone else in the waiting area from hearing any medical information).  Patient told her that she'd been no help.

Patient then turned and stomped through the waiting area and out the door, exclaiming over the phone that "this office is always so RUDE!" - whether to the waiting room or the person on the other end of the cell phone conversation was not clear to me.  And whether or not the patient needed to do something about contacting the insurance company instead of just demanding that the doctor ignore the unpaid balance.

I got billed several times over the last few years where a typographical error (wrong social security number, wrong name of family member listed as either patient or insured, and similar lapses that could have been caught by proof reading - but weren't until I looked it over and pointed out the error in the claim submission - or called the insurance company to find out what was going on if it was something else).  For all I could tell, the patient was being asked to call the insurance company to find out what was holding up payment, not asked to pay a huge sum of money at that moment....but the way patient reacted, paying the doctor was not their problem.

I thought that the receptionist was trying to be polite by keeping her voice down while talking to the patient, until there had been several rounds of "do what I want you to do" and "I can't do that.....".