Etiquette Hell

General Etiquette => Family and Children => Topic started by: POF on April 21, 2014, 07:57:51 AM

Title: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - wedding update #12
Post by: POF on April 21, 2014, 07:57:51 AM
Thinking about the recent thread where how much of an obligation do you have if you want guests to attend your wedding. 

If you pick a venue thats difficult to get to, ( I would think more than a 2 hour drive ) - then I think you need to understand that some people may not be able to attend.


Lakhouse Sally's son is getting married this fall to a really nice girl.  I'm very happy for them. 

Unfortunately the date they gave out for the wedding is on a weekend where DS14 has a major athletic event.  As a freshman he was a breakout in this event and will probably do very well this coming year.

The wedding is going to be held at a location probably 7 hours away from where we ( and the rest of DH's family) lives .  The bride is from another region of the US, we are not sure why they are picking this venue which is a long drive for the grooms family and airline distance for the bride's family.  But I am a big advocate of doing what you want for your wedding... because hey ... it is your wedding.

However if you pick a destination that is far away - then you need to make sure you are going to be OK with an RSVP of no. 

The time frame coupled with the location is going to make it very difficult if not impossible for us to go.  I think Nephew will be OK with it .... but Lakehouse Sally will not. 

She started to push DH about if we will be there  because we did not attend her daughters wedding.  ( The wedding date conflicted with our year in advance, planned, booked and paid for Disney vacation )  Sally really thought we should have rebooked or cancelled our trip. 

Dh said - you know, what we might be able to do - is leave sporting event early - drive straight up, go to evening wedding ( assuming it is an evening wedding - we don't know details yet ) , stay for some of the reception and head home.  ( Stopping midway to sleep and freshen up). Head out next AM.

Lakehouse Sally says - but you need to bring Mom to the rehearsal dinner and the wedding and the reception.  I need yo uto bring her and take care of her that weekend.  DH said - I don't think that 93 year old, mobility limited , slighty confused Mom is going to be OK with a 7 hour trip ,coupled with a hotel stay.  Plus we won't be able to come up on a Friday.  POF will not be able to take off work that week ( big board meeting is the following Monday ! ).

DH also said - we weren't planning on the rehearsal anyway since we aren't in the wedding.  Sally responds with - you just need to see that mom gets there.  DH said - you can't really assume that we will be available all weekend - you need to make some other arrangements.

If the wedding was local, we could easily get mom to the wedding.  Even if DH and I split up at times, we would be able to work it out.  But at a 7 hour away venue.  not going to happen. 
It was ver difficult getting her to my son's confirmation which was local and wheelchair accessible. .  She' s just very frail.

its going to be very interesting.



 


Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding
Post by: ladyknight1 on April 21, 2014, 08:10:33 AM
In that case, I would probably go with DS to the sporting event and ask DH if he wanted to attend the wedding alone.

I don't think having a wedding more than two hours away from the area where an invited guest lives is a problem, and I do agree the HC and their parents should accept RSVPs of no gracefully.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding
Post by: CakeEater on April 21, 2014, 08:13:17 AM
Sounds like your DH is saying all the right things.

Really, if it was important to them that you guys were available to get your MIL there and look after her (and I can understand why they don't want to do that given hosting duties), then you should have been involved in choosing the date.

Good luck!
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding
Post by: JenJay on April 21, 2014, 08:18:30 AM
She wants her 93 year old mother to sit in a car for 14 hours to go to a wedding? There's no way I'd do that to my Mom. I mean sure, if she was physically up for it and wanted to go, but it doesn't sound like that's the case here. Has Sally even asked Mom if she wants to be brought for the weekend?

As for you, I agree with LadyKnight1. I'd plan to take my son to the event and support DH in going to the wedding instead if he decided that's what he needed to do. I don't see how you could possibly make it to both with a 7 hour drive between events (actually at least 8 when you factor in stops for food and bathroom breaks, even if you keep them brief).
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding
Post by: POF on April 21, 2014, 08:25:05 AM
I have no problem with long distance or destination weddings as long as the happy couple ( or in this care the parents )  realize that it may make it impossible to for some people to go.  Instead of asking folks to block out a Saturday night - now you are asking for an entire weekend - which can be  more complicated .  It would involve DH and I taking at least one vacation day.

No way on earth - do I think MIL should be in a car 14 hours.  Its ridiculous.  but common sense is no ones strong point in this group of people.  I also am NOT going to responsible for her.  She is vert frail , prone to falls and doesn't want to use her walker.  In unfamiliar territory  she could fall and get really hurt.  Plus  - she could not be in a hotel room by herself. 

Not me - not doing it.  DH will just have to say no or take it on himself.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding
Post by: SamiHami on April 21, 2014, 08:33:27 AM
It sounds like going to this wedding is going to be problematic for your family. It seems to me you have already made a commitment to your son to be at his event. I would simply skip the wedding entirely, send a nice gift and be done with it. The decision of whether or not to attend should not be based on how unhappy or inconvenienced Sally is going to feel.

As for the elderly MIL, not only would I not take her to the event, I would do everything in my power to stop anyone else from taking her. She sounds too frail and infirm to tolerate a trip like that. Sally is being a selfish jerk for wanting to put her through that.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding
Post by: Winterlight on April 21, 2014, 08:42:33 AM
I think if DH wants to go, fine. But I would not. It isn't fair to your son.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding
Post by: cicero on April 21, 2014, 08:50:22 AM

DH also said - we weren't planning on the rehearsal anyway since we aren't in the wedding.  Sally responds with - you just need to see that mom gets there.  DH said - you can't really assume that we will be available all weekend - you need to make some other arrangements.


its going to be very interesting.
Ummm no. Not POF- family responsibility, it's lake house Sally's responsibility.

( Is the mother even able to sit in a car for seven hours? I understand she is frail, but even frail people can take trips).
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding
Post by: Twik on April 21, 2014, 09:06:25 AM
Lakehouse Sally undoubtedly has little realization of her mother's health. I agree with SamiHami that the OP's husband should actively work to make sure his mother is NOT pestered into making a trip she's not physically capable of doing without risk to her wellbeing.

Otherwise, they have a previous engagement, and LHS will just have to accept that.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding
Post by: JoyinVirginia on April 21, 2014, 09:07:21 AM
I agree with SamiHami that dh should handle any requests from Lake house sally by saying that mil should not go at all. If Sally wants mil there she should hire a nursing assistant or companion to bring jet and care for her the entire weekend. if mil is confused now, who knows how she will be at time of the wedding. Or how her health will be.  You both should let the happy couple know that you cannot attend now, and with Sally just repeat the same info: we will not be able to  attend.
Edited to add: I used to take my mother on short trips before she became too frail and demented. Even a car ride of an hour was difficult. We had to have timed bathroom breaks that made the trip longer,  sitting to long in the car was painful, I had to make sure everywhere was wheelchair accessible, she got tired quickly. And very elderly frail people are very upset by changes in routine. Being away from familiar living situation for even a couple of days may result in increased confusion.
You can ask Sally does she really want elderly mother sitting there in the front row asking loudly who is that? Why are we here?
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding
Post by: MrTango on April 21, 2014, 09:13:02 AM
I would tell your DH that he can choose to RSVP yes or no for himself, but that you will be attending your DS's sporting event and will not be attending the wedding.

Let him do what he wants from there, and don't give Lakehouse Sally any more space in your head than that.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding
Post by: JoyinVirginia on April 21, 2014, 09:19:06 AM
You know you have been on ehell a while when you get really excited to see a Lakehouse Sally post!
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding
Post by: guihong on April 21, 2014, 09:24:13 AM
In your shoes, I would go to my son's event and not let Sally live in my head or feel one iota of guilt.   I would carefully explain to DH that "going to the wedding" means taking his frail mother 14 hours in the car-more, actually-and being responsible for her care on the trip and during the weekend.  I wouldn't want to do that kind of drive with that kind of turnaround even with someone who could look after themselves just fine.  That's ridiculous.

I would stick to my guns, and Sally will either get over it or die mad. 
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding
Post by: Venus193 on April 21, 2014, 09:38:25 AM
It sounds like going to this wedding is going to be problematic for your family. It seems to me you have already made a commitment to your son to be at his event. I would simply skip the wedding entirely, send a nice gift and be done with it. The decision of whether or not to attend should not be based on how unhappy or inconvenienced Sally is going to feel.

As for the elderly MIL, not only would I not take her to the event, I would do everything in my power to stop anyone else from taking her. She sounds too frail and infirm to tolerate a trip like that. Sally is being a selfish jerk for wanting to put her through that.

This.

I forgot; how is Lakehouse Sally related to your DH?  It almost sounds like this location was chosen for maximum inconvenience and I also think you and your husband's primary duty is to your son.  I'd just decline, send a gift, and be done with it.

No way should your MIL have to endure this trip, either.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding
Post by: pierrotlunaire0 on April 21, 2014, 09:49:10 AM
I think Lakehouse Sally has confused the concept of invitation with a Royal Summons.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding
Post by: Luci on April 21, 2014, 09:50:45 AM
You know you have been on ehell a while when you get really excited to see a Lakehouse Sally post!
I think Lakehouse Sally has confused the concept of invitation with a Royal Summons.

 :)! I've been wondering how she is doing. Thanks for letting us know she is still herself.

Poor woman is going to be so sad that the Aunt, Uncle, and grandmother will not be at the wedding.

Well, I'm putting myself (when I am really feeling my age) in MIL's place. I would send the very nicest gift I could, regrets, well wishes, reminders to send photos, and be grateful I didn't have to spend 14-16 hours in a car/ minivan, attend a probably loud party, and overnight in a strange place, though the service would be nice. "Ouch!" is pretty much all I can say about the prospect.

No way would I want to be responsible for the comfort and health of someone in a strange situation, so you, POF, have my understanding, too.

Also, I wouldn't miss my kid's important  sporting event. The child is likely to remember your being there far better than the nephew will remember who came to his wedding. As an example, a young man I know remembers that his mom went to his little league all star game, but he has to do the math or look at photos to remember which grandparents attended his wedding. He was too busy to interact with anyone much except his wife and the photographer.  >:(

Best wishes to your son on his sporting event!
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding
Post by: Sophia on April 21, 2014, 09:53:03 AM
It sounds like she really doesn't give a hoot about you guys showing up.  You were just the planned chauffeur for you MIL. 
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding
Post by: Lady Snowdon on April 21, 2014, 10:55:25 AM
DH's 93 year old grandmother barely made it to her daughter's house for Easter dinner - and that was less than a 10 min drive!  She also left after 2 hours, because the stimulation was just too much for her.  I can't see her doing a 7 hour drive at all, much less overnighting in a hotel, etc.  Lakehouse Sally will, in ehell parlance, have to get over it or die mad.  It's not anyone's "job" to make someone attend a wedding. 

I was incredibly grateful that a large chunk of my family all drove 14 hours to make it to my wedding.  It meant so much to me that they were there.  I would have been sad, but totally understood, if any of them had said, "LadySnowdon, I'm sorry, but it's just not going to work". 
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding
Post by: TootsNYC on April 21, 2014, 11:00:14 AM
You know you have been on ehell a while when you get really excited to see a Lakehouse Sally post!


Yeah, right?


Thanks for the post, POF! Best of luck to you all.

Remember the lesson from a similar situation here at EHell--the MOB was mad, mad, mad that the family couldn't attend (was that you? it seemed so similar). And the bride completely understood and wasn't fazed at all.

Reach out to the bride and groom directly, and ignore ignore ignore the MOB. Manage your own relationship w/ niece and nephew, and refuse to allow Irrational Mom to be the one who defines it.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding
Post by: Minmom3 on April 21, 2014, 01:19:29 PM
We live in the San Francisco Bay Area.

DD#3 just got married a week ago, in a tiny ceremony with her parents, her sisters, her best friend, her husband's good friend who was also the officiant, and a photographer.  That's it. Locally done at a small but pretty public venue, over in 20 minutes.  Then we went out for burgers and DH paid the tab.  They wanted it tiny because my new SIL has some social anxiety, and is mostly estranged from his family, so she restricted who could know and come from our side of the family.  Lots of baggage, not my department, and I'll blab about it on FB when she gives me the all clear.  No idea when that will be, but I'm not holding my breath.

DD#2, who got engaged pretty much the same weekend, wants to get married at Burning Man in 2015.  DH has health issues, and I have NO desire to go to the Nevada desert in August, and camp on the playa.  In fact, that's pretty much my idea of Hell.  Nor can I really afford to pay for two tickets to BM, or incur the costs necessary to camp there reasonably comfortably.  Her DF is a really nice man, and I like what I've seen of his parents (Thanksgiving, so not a lot of in depth interaction) - but DD#2's choice of location is a deal breaker for our side.  Nor can her sisters afford to take time off or camp for a week - and it's our understanding that BM does not allow a quickie weekend visit (which we'd swing if we had to).  If she'd move it to Vegas the weekend before or after, we'd all be there in a heart beat.  In the desert, with a mandatory week?  Not so much.  There's going to be hurt feelings when she actually realizes this.  Picking the time to TELL her that her choice of venue precludes all her immediate family from attending is our tricky point.

I won't see her until Mother's Day (May 11th) and I'm not bringing it up then, and I'll do my best to Duck And Cover if she brings it up that day!   
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding
Post by: bopper on April 21, 2014, 01:59:15 PM
For Mom:  People often think "Of course Mom will want to come! We don't want to leave her out!"  but sometimes you have to think "What would mom want"...is that much traveling too much? Will she get over-stimulated? Will she know what is going on? Will she get too tired?
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding
Post by: lakey on April 21, 2014, 02:16:26 PM
People are entitled to have any kind of wedding they want. However, assuming that people are obligated to drive 7 hours each way to attend the shindig is a bit self-absorbed.

Most 90 year olds I've known could not comfortably hand a 7 hour drive. If it is that important for the 93 year old grandma to attend, then they should hold it closer to their home. I would not haul that poor woman to this event.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding
Post by: lkdrymom on April 21, 2014, 02:37:39 PM
So LHS wants you to travel 7 hours one way and care for an elderly relative the entire time too. It would be hard fro an able bodied adult to do this, I cannot imagine taking a 93 year old on this trip. Does your DH realize that if he does go he will not get to enjoy any of it if he has to play caretaker to his mother?  SO what is the point of going?  Especially since MIL most likely won't enjoy it either.

A few years back I had a similar problem. I wanted to attend a wedding in Southern Georgia. I live in NJ. The problem was I assumed everyone would expect me to bring my 84 year old father with me. He was having 'issues' and there was no way I would feel comfortable taking him so far from home. I would be worried sick something would go wrong...then what would I do so far from home?  And if I was worried sick my entire visit, what was the point of going? I went without him, just took my daughter and had a nice time.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding
Post by: TootsNYC on April 21, 2014, 02:42:25 PM
So LHS wants you to travel 7 hours one way and care for an elderly relative the entire time too. It would be hard fro an able bodied adult to do this, I cannot imagine taking a 93 year old on this trip. Does your DH realize that if he does go he will not get to enjoy any of it if he has to play caretaker to his mother?  SO what is the point of going?  Especially since MIL most likely won't enjoy it either.


Well, "enjoying the wedding" may not be the highest priority for a person. "Helping Mom stay connected to our family" may be the highest priority. It's not necessary to enjoy everything one does.
   Sometimes the satisfaction of doing something that benefits someone else may be complete and total justification for doing it.

That's something only POF's DH can decide. And it's also something that only the 90-year-old grandma can decide as well.
    Your decision was the right one for you. But "having a nice time" is not the only reason to do something.

My grandma had very bad arthritis in her knees. And she went to things even if they hurt. Because it was important to her. It wasn't always about enjoyment. It was about the messages she was sending and receiving, etc.

There are ways to help a 90-year-old woman travel 7 hours away to be there when her beloved grandson marries. Grandma will want to think about whether she wants to go, and how she will be able to make it happen if she wants to.
    Maybe POF's DH will not be part of the solution. Maybe there won't be a solution.

Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding
Post by: lkdrymom on April 21, 2014, 03:26:57 PM
So LHS wants you to travel 7 hours one way and care for an elderly relative the entire time too. It would be hard fro an able bodied adult to do this, I cannot imagine taking a 93 year old on this trip. Does your DH realize that if he does go he will not get to enjoy any of it if he has to play caretaker to his mother?  SO what is the point of going?  Especially since MIL most likely won't enjoy it either.


Well, "enjoying the wedding" may not be the highest priority for a person. "Helping Mom stay connected to our family" may be the highest priority. It's not necessary to enjoy everything one does.
   Sometimes the satisfaction of doing something that benefits someone else may be complete and total justification for doing it.

That's something only POF's DH can decide. And it's also something that only the 90-year-old grandma can decide as well.
    Your decision was the right one for you. But "having a nice time" is not the only reason to do something.

My grandma had very bad arthritis in her knees. And she went to things even if they hurt. Because it was important to her. It wasn't always about enjoyment. It was about the messages she was sending and receiving, etc.

There are ways to help a 90-year-old woman travel 7 hours away to be there when her beloved grandson marries. Grandma will want to think about whether she wants to go, and how she will be able to make it happen if she wants to.
    Maybe POF's DH will not be part of the solution. Maybe there won't be a solution.

Not everyone can afford to make such a big trip just to make someone else happy.  I had saved for years to take my kids to Disney World. My father wanted to go along and he did. It was not the trip I had envisioned and it was not easy having him keep up with us. He was content just sitting someplace while we went off but I felt bad about doing that. In the end I spent alot of money on our one and only Disney trip and I did not enjoy myself.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding
Post by: POF on April 21, 2014, 03:45:58 PM
I also think that we should have been asked - not told to bring MIL to wedding.  Honestly - she most likely won't want to go.  Lakehouse Sally likes to have everyone at everything. 
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding
Post by: TootsNYC on April 21, 2014, 03:52:16 PM
Everyone has to make these decisions for themselves. And as you point out, it's important to be clear and honest about what the trip is going to be like.

I know that personally I'd place much more value on "enjoying myself" with a trip to Disney than I would with a family wedding.

I was just saying, it's not always about enjoying oneself. People decide "what's the point?" for their own reasons. Maybe for someone with an elderly parent, the point would be to help his mom.

And I agree with you, POF, it's really rude to tell people what they should do.

But Lakehouse Sally is big on control, isn't she?
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding
Post by: CakeEater on April 21, 2014, 04:21:43 PM
IIRC, Lakehouse Sally hasn't ever put much priority on getting to your family's events. You might feel differently about putting in a huge effort if that had been the case.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding
Post by: POF on April 21, 2014, 04:23:49 PM
Everyone has to make these decisions for themselves. And as you point out, it's important to be clear and honest about what the trip is going to be like.

I know that personally I'd place much more value on "enjoying myself" with a trip to Disney than I would with a family wedding.

I was just saying, it's not always about enjoying oneself. People decide "what's the point?" for their own reasons. Maybe for someone with an elderly parent, the point would be to help his mom.

And I agree with you, POF, it's really rude to tell people what they should do.

But Lakehouse Sally is big on control, isn't she?

Infinite Infinite universe of control.  Honestly - I don't usually enjoy weddings ... don't know why .... but they usually just do nothing for me.  if it were closer or her health were better - I'd have no problem taking her for the day.  She has no brain to mouth filter and is fun to be around.

  I worry about a health situation happening or a fall and we are away from home and then what do we do.

DH's family doesn't think things through and if they WANT something to happen a certain way - then the heck with common sense or anyone else's impact.

DH is that way at times and the standard phrase is that " oh it will be OK"   well - we recently bought a car and he wanted to sign the papers before all the legowrk was done. I objected he told me .... it will be OK .... and it wasn't .... and I refused to deal with it.



Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding
Post by: gramma dishes on April 21, 2014, 04:26:47 PM

Lakehouse Sally cannot dictate what you and your family do as far as deciding that you are going to be the Grandmother's transportation and keeper for a whole weekend. 

If it would make you feel better, you could always discuss this with Grandma and remind her that it will be seven hours of driving each way, a rehearsal dinner, wedding and reception and at least one overnight in a hotel room.  (By the way, are you also expected to pay for Grandma's hotel room, non wedding related meals and other expenses?)   Even if she says she'd like to go, she might change her mind at the last minute. 

Chances are, Grandma would actually prefer to get photos or a videotape that she can look at/watch afterward at her own leisure in the comfort of her own home.

You and your family already have definite plans for that weekend.  I think I would just simply RSVP "Sorry, but no", send a gift and really nice card and be done with it.  Lakehouse Sally will not like that response, but I doubt if her son, the groom, really would care all that much one way or the other.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding
Post by: AvidReader on April 21, 2014, 04:46:03 PM
It really is up to you and your DH.  If you issue regrets on behalf of both of you, then send a nice gift, wish the HC well and enjoy your son's sporting event.....very important....guilt-free.   Imagine how nice a gift you can send because you won't have the expenses of travel.

Just stop LHS in her tracks when she starts in between now and then.  EH has an entire forum on "I'm afraid that won't be possible." 

I have concerns about the 93 y/o.  Some might be spry and totally up for it, others just confused and exhausted by the experience.  You all know her best.  If it is that important to LHS for grandma to be there, let her take on that responsibility. 
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding
Post by: ladyknight1 on April 21, 2014, 05:09:28 PM
I would also have to say that in the last few years of my DH' grandmother's life. We could only drive her in a wheelchair capable van.

We found an RV rental with a wheelchair lift and that way she could lie down if she wanted and it had it's own restroom, so that was very helpful. However, we needed at least three other adults so that one could be driving, one sitting with DH' grandmother and one doing whatever else was needed. Most of the time, people came to her as it was too much to coordinate that many schedules, outlay the funds necessary and everyone was exhausted for a few days afterwards.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding
Post by: VorFemme on April 21, 2014, 06:41:18 PM
Grandma's doctor may have something to say about her getting into a vehicle for a seven hour drive to go to a wedding and a seven hour drive back - no matter how long she spends at the wedding location!

Sitting still very long can lead to clots forming in the veins - which can break free and migrate to various BAD places to be.  Cutting back on liquids to reduce the number of stops can lead to UTIs (been there, done that to myself) or pushing just a few minutes further down the road can lead to a need for a change of clothes.  Sticking to a diet while on the road is harder.  Seven hours is a full days of driving - even if you only stop once or twice for food, bathroom, and fuel.   Stopping more often is going to take a LOT more than seven hours...

If she can't sleep or sleeps too much during the drive - she is not going to be at her functional best in a strange location with a lot of people to see - at least some of them from the other side of the Happy Couple - probably strangers...depends on how well Grandma deals with strangers in strange locations after sleeping in strange positions in the car and lots of stops for whatever reason...

Good time to state that YOU already have all you can deal with taking your kid to the sporting event and let your DH deal with his sister (or is it his SIL?) and his mother's doctor, before trying to ask Grandma if she wants to go.  He might be better off showing up with a container for a slice of cake and a video camera - then take a big slice of cake and the resulting photos back to Grandma.

Or set up a Skype account & let her watch it "live" on a computer screen, while recording it for watching again later.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding
Post by: thunderroad on April 21, 2014, 07:31:59 PM
You know you have been on ehell a while when you get really excited to see a Lakehouse Sally post!
;D my thoughts, exactly!
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding
Post by: doodlemor on April 21, 2014, 08:14:55 PM
Grandma's doctor may have something to say about her getting into a vehicle for a seven hour drive to go to a wedding and a seven hour drive back - no matter how long she spends at the wedding location!

Sitting still very long can lead to clots forming in the veins - which can break free and migrate to various BAD places to be.  Cutting back on liquids to reduce the number of stops can lead to UTIs (been there, done that to myself) or pushing just a few minutes further down the road can lead to a need for a change of clothes.  Sticking to a diet while on the road is harder.  Seven hours is a full days of driving - even if you only stop once or twice for food, bathroom, and fuel.   Stopping more often is going to take a LOT more than seven hours...

If she can't sleep or sleeps too much during the drive - she is not going to be at her functional best in a strange location with a lot of people to see - at least some of them from the other side of the Happy Couple - probably strangers...depends on how well Grandma deals with strangers in strange locations after sleeping in strange positions in the car and lots of stops for whatever reason...

Good time to state that YOU already have all you can deal with taking your kid to the sporting event and let your DH deal with his sister (or is it his SIL?) and his mother's doctor, before trying to ask Grandma if she wants to go.  He might be better off showing up with a container for a slice of cake and a video camera - then take a big slice of cake and the resulting photos back to Grandma.

Or set up a Skype account & let her watch it "live" on a computer screen, while recording it for watching again later.

Very wise post.  The bolded is a great compromise.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding
Post by: YummyMummy66 on April 22, 2014, 08:25:03 AM
Grandma's doctor may have something to say about her getting into a vehicle for a seven hour drive to go to a wedding and a seven hour drive back - no matter how long she spends at the wedding location!

Sitting still very long can lead to clots forming in the veins - which can break free and migrate to various BAD places to be.  Cutting back on liquids to reduce the number of stops can lead to UTIs (been there, done that to myself) or pushing just a few minutes further down the road can lead to a need for a change of clothes.  Sticking to a diet while on the road is harder.  Seven hours is a full days of driving - even if you only stop once or twice for food, bathroom, and fuel.   Stopping more often is going to take a LOT more than seven hours...

If she can't sleep or sleeps too much during the drive - she is not going to be at her functional best in a strange location with a lot of people to see - at least some of them from the other side of the Happy Couple - probably strangers...depends on how well Grandma deals with strangers in strange locations after sleeping in strange positions in the car and lots of stops for whatever reason...

Good time to state that YOU already have all you can deal with taking your kid to the sporting event and let your DH deal with his sister (or is it his SIL?) and his mother's doctor, before trying to ask Grandma if she wants to go.  He might be better off showing up with a container for a slice of cake and a video camera - then take a big slice of cake and the resulting photos back to Grandma.

Or set up a Skype account & let her watch it "live" on a computer screen, while recording it for watching again later.

just wanted to add, I had one of my senior clients do exactly this.  One of his daughters brought her IPAD to him, and while the ceremony was happening, someone else on that end was videoing the event with their IPAD. So, Grandpa got to see one of his grandchildren getting married and the actual ceremony at the same time as everyone else.  He loved it.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding
Post by: POF on April 22, 2014, 09:53:48 AM
Would it help put in in perspective that last year they INSISTED ( Lakehouse and her daughter Betty ) that MIL attend one of Bett's children's birthday party at a BOWLING ALLEY ! .  She seriously did not want to go - but they kept insisting on it. She hated it
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding
Post by: JenJay on April 22, 2014, 10:00:08 AM
  >:(

Can your husband get between his Mom and his sister and insist that LHS stop being such a selfish idiot where Mom's health is concerned?! I'd go so far as to call or visit Mom's doctor and confirm that she ought not take a 14 hour round-trip car ride and then put my foot down on those grounds.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding
Post by: SamiHami on April 22, 2014, 12:22:48 PM
I agree with JenJay. LHS can insist all she wants, but insisting on this foolishness can result in serious illness or injury for your MIL. I really think that someone-your DH? needs to drop the hammer on LHS and flat out tell her that MIL will not be coming to the wedding, it's a selfish, foolish and dangerous idea. I wouldn't hesitate to go to MIL's doctor about this as well. LHS doesn't get to endanger others.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding
Post by: mime on April 22, 2014, 02:04:27 PM
POD to SamiHami's suggestion of talking to MIL's doctor. While I can't imagine my 91-year old grandmother making a 30 minute trip anywhere without getting confused and exhausted, her brother was the exact opposite and very capable until just the last few months of life in his mid 90s. Their doctor (the same woman for both of them) would have known the limits of either patient, and made recommendations according to that expertise.

As for missing the wedding: I had two uncles (not great-uncles, but 1-generation 'uncle'). They travelled from Arkansas and South Carolina to my wedding in Minnesota in winter and I will always remember and be very grateful for that. *But* my uncles were the only two people besides DH and my parents who were so important that we cleared the date with them before setting it. With all other guests, we were prepared for the possibility of schedule conflicts, and we accepted their "no" RSVPs gracefully.

Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding
Post by: Luci on April 22, 2014, 02:12:37 PM
Would it help put in in perspective that last year they INSISTED ( Lakehouse and her daughter Betty ) that MIL attend one of Bett's children's birthday party at a BOWLING ALLEY ! .  She seriously did not want to go - but they kept insisting on it. She hated it

Aside from physically coming and getting her and taking her in and out of the vehicle, how could they make her go?

Am I too stubborn? I had a terrible, terrible headache one Easter and finally talked Lucas and the kids into going to the family get together without me. They were reluctant and argued, but I won.

I think we have all been saying the trip doesn't sound like a good idea.
 
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding
Post by: blarg314 on April 23, 2014, 08:55:00 PM
Would it help put in in perspective that last year they INSISTED ( Lakehouse and her daughter Betty ) that MIL attend one of Bett's children's birthday party at a BOWLING ALLEY ! .  She seriously did not want to go - but they kept insisting on it. She hated it

Aside from physically coming and getting her and taking her in and out of the vehicle, how could they make her go?


It sounds like this is what Sally wants the OP and her husband to do.

And I can see how a frail 93 year old could be bullied into going by a forceful and selfish younger relative.

Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding
Post by: PastryGoddess on April 23, 2014, 11:49:08 PM
Just because LHS wants you to do something doesn't mean you have to do it.  No is a complete sentence right?  So what if she's unhappy, it doesn't mean you're doing something wrong. 

Didn't someone already say she'll get over it or die mad? 
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding
Post by: sammycat on April 23, 2014, 11:59:20 PM
I wouldn't drive 7 hours for anyone's wedding (except for that of my own child).

I wouldn't expect a 90+ year old person to travel that distance, for any reason.

I wouldn't miss out on my child's special event for anyone's else's activity.

I wouldn't give LHS the time of day.

I would RSVP 'no' to this wedding, send a nice present, and be done with it. The HC seem ok with that; LHS's wants don't enter into it.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding
Post by: RooRoo on April 24, 2014, 12:07:23 AM
How close is DS's event to you? Would your Mom like to go to that? (or be able to?)

I think Lakehouse Sally wouldn't know a hint - or just a polite refusal - if it ran over her in a bus. Perhaps it is time to go off on her.

Would E-hellions approve of something like "Sally, you are not thinking this through. You are asking a 93 year old woman to do something that will cause her a lot of pain! ...and if you had called us when you were setting the date, you would have known that we will be attending DS's event."
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding
Post by: Venus193 on April 24, 2014, 06:29:54 AM
How close is DS's event to you? Would your Mom like to go to that? (or be able to?)

I think Lakehouse Sally wouldn't know a hint - or just a polite refusal - if it ran over her in a bus. Perhaps it is time to go off on her.

Would E-hellions approve of something like "Sally, you are not thinking this through. You are asking a 93 year old woman to do something that will cause her a lot of pain! ...and if you had called us when you were setting the date, you would have known that we will be attending DS's event."

I favor that.  Some people just don't get subtlety.... or manners.  You have to be direct with them.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding
Post by: POF on April 24, 2014, 06:40:12 AM
Thanks everyone - the wedding is quite a bit away - so I am sure the issue will rise and fall over the summer.  I personally am not planning to drive 7 hours to this wedding.  I think wewill prevail not to take MIL - but there will be pushback from LHS.

The thing with LHS is that she is not belssed with any common sense  - she is seriously dense.  When confronted with logical facts - she just won't comprehend. 

I think if she had asked about MIL - that would be one thing .... but to assign it to us ... that didn't work. 

I'll update if/when any new developments occur.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding
Post by: YummyMummy66 on April 24, 2014, 07:38:01 AM
As someone who works with seniors in their home(s), I can tell you that if your MIL is not in the best of health, at age 93, a seven hour drive is a big no-no.  Your mil will not enjoy the festivities at all.

Sally wants yours MIL at this event, but does not want to have to deal with her at said event.  I don't think she realizes all that will entail.

Like others stated, you will have to be blunt.  Sally, we will not be attending the event.  We already have other plans that weekend.   And then state why you think MIL would not want to go or should not attend, but let her know, that if she feels she should be there, then it is up to her to make the arrangements for her to be there. Travel to event, hotel for two nights, because she will need to arrive a day early due to the drive, rest over night and the same on the day of event, rest overnight to travel home and she will need a paid attendant to be with her to help take care of her. 

Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding
Post by: Amara on April 24, 2014, 11:30:28 AM
Quote
The thing with LHS is that she is not belssed with any common sense  - she is seriously dense.  When confronted with logical facts - she just won't comprehend. 

Then it seems to me that any time you are dealing with Sally the best--and the only--response should be "No" with absolutely no JADEing. Anything else just wastes your breath.

That's not to say don't post more stories. They are fun.  ;)
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding
Post by: TootsNYC on April 24, 2014, 12:08:15 PM
Quote
The thing with LHS is that she is not belssed with any common sense  - she is seriously dense.  When confronted with logical facts - she just won't comprehend. 

Then it seems to me that any time you are dealing with Sally the best--and the only--response should be "No" with absolutely no JADEing. Anything else just wastes your breath.

That's not to say don't post more stories. They are fun.  ;)


yep, yep, yep--to both points!

It really is nice of you to share Lakehouse Sally with us. It must be very bemusing to deal with her.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding
Post by: gingerzing on April 24, 2014, 01:14:19 PM
We went to a wedding last summer that they Skyped/recorded for the Bride's dear friend who was a missionary in Germany.  It was really sweet and the pastor gave a "shout out" to the friend at the beginning of the service. 

Another thought about your poor MIL with all the travel and hubbub.  Weddings are horrible to spend any meaningful time with anyone.  A quick hug and maybe a 5 minute conversation with the couple is about all anyone really can expect. 
Perhaps someone ( 8) ) should put a bug in the Happy Couple's ear that it probably would be more meaningful for MIL if they stop by for a visit after the wedding with the video and wedding pictures to spend the afternoon just with grandma.  Give her the time she deserves and be comfortable in her own place. 

(Also posting just so I can get notified when there are updates.)
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding
Post by: lakey on April 24, 2014, 01:49:43 PM
TootsNYC,
I think that you mean well, but I have to say, this is  a lot more than DH not being able to enjoy the event. There has to be a reality check as to what an ordeal this will be for a 93 year old, frail woman. There is a 7 hour drive there, along with who knows how many stops necessary, going to the rehearsal dinner, getting around at the wedding  ceremony, getting around at the reception, staying in a strange hotel, and getting around there, then a 7 hour drive back. I'm sure there are people in their nineties who could handle this, but this is a 93 year old who is mobility limited and confused. When elderly people are confused, putting them into strange situations makes them more confused.
I spent a year taking care of my 93 year old mother before she died, and 4 years taking care of my 96 year old father. I cannot imagine a woman who has the problems that this woman has been described as having, without it having major effects on her. My father is worn out after being taken to the eye doctor, and he is in a wheelchair the entire time. What happens if they get there and the woman is too tired to enjoy any of it or just doesn't feel well? This just seems like a really bad idea.

You're right the most important thing isn't whether DH enjoys the event, but there needs to be a realistic view of what it will be like for the grandmother, and I don't feel that asking her if she can handle it is a guarantee of anything. She won't know whether she can handle it until she is 7 hours from home.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding
Post by: TootsNYC on April 24, 2014, 02:14:50 PM
I'm so sorry if I implied that I thought this 90-plus-year-old grandmother should attend!

I was addressing a relatively narrow point--that "enjoying" the event was the only thing that mattered for the DH. I felt that people in the DH's position (not even necessarily the OP's DH specifically--just people in his position, with an elderly parent who needs help to attend a wedding)--and even people in the elderly grandmother's position (again, not even her specifically; just elderly people with a wedding they want to attend)--are entitled to put "enjoyment" way down on the list of reasons they go to the wedding.

I don't know anything about this particular family; I completely believe the OP when she says that *her* elderly relative is probably too frail to travel.

I'm not in the position of making decisions (or even recommendations) to the OP, bcs I don't know her personally. I would imagine her family will make the decision that's right for them.

I was only addressing the idea that "enjoyment" trumps everything else. And that just as Lakehouse Sally shouldn't get to dictate that her frail mother come to this wedding, neither should other people think it's right to decide for someone else whethe they'll "enjoy" the wedding enough to go through whatever it takes to go to the wedding.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding
Post by: Aquamarine on April 24, 2014, 02:34:37 PM
Thanks everyone - the wedding is quite a bit away - so I am sure the issue will rise and fall over the summer.  I personally am not planning to drive 7 hours to this wedding.  I think wewill prevail not to take MIL - but there will be pushback from LHS.

The thing with LHS is that she is not belssed with any common sense  - she is seriously dense.  When confronted with logical facts - she just won't comprehend. 

I think if she had asked about MIL - that would be one thing .... but to assign it to us ... that didn't work

I'll update if/when any new developments occur.

I would pointedly remind LHS that she or her husband are certainly free to pick the elderly grandmother if they really want her to attend and I would remind her of this fact every time she said something about it.  "Oh the wedding is too far for us to drive so of course we won't be there, but there's no reason you or your DF can't pick up grandmother so she can attend.  Yes, 7 hours is a long drive to pick her up, but it's a 7 hour drive for us as well and you thought that was reasonable."  "Of course GM can still come to your wedding, you just need to arrange transportation for her since we are not going to be attending."

This is the sort of problem you have when you choose a venue so far away.  It is not reasonable to expect others to drive that distance just to go to a wedding.  The only wedding I would drive that amount for would be for one of my two children and I would be flying at that.  Anyone else would get my regrets with the explanation that the distance is just too great for me to be able to make it.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding
Post by: Elfmama on April 25, 2014, 01:29:39 PM
People are entitled to have any kind of wedding they want. However, assuming that people are obligated to drive 7 hours each way to attend the shindig is a bit self-absorbed.

Most 90 year olds I've known could not comfortably hand a 7 hour drive. If it is that important for the 93 year old grandma to attend, then they should hold it closer to their home. I would not haul that poor woman to this event.
My parents are also in their 90s.  A trip to Walmart exhausts them so much that they have to take a nap afterward.  They can manage maybe 2 hours sitting and visiting at my sister's house, and again have to be driven home (10 minutes by car) and nap. 

There are some people in their 90s who still run marathons or hike the Grand Canyon or even just go for a nice hour's walk around the neighborhood, but they're few and far between, and it certainly sounds like your MIL is not one of them.  Your DH needs to contact his mother.  I really think that she will not want to go, and if she isn't "there" enough to understand what's going on, then he'll need to make that decision for her.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding
Post by: catwhiskers on April 26, 2014, 09:15:41 AM
Another thought about your poor MIL with all the travel and hubbub.  Weddings are horrible to spend any meaningful time with anyone.  A quick hug and maybe a 5 minute conversation with the couple is about all anyone really can expect. 
Perhaps someone ( 8) ) should put a bug in the Happy Couple's ear that it probably would be more meaningful for MIL if they stop by for a visit after the wedding with the video and wedding pictures to spend the afternoon just with grandma.  Give her the time she deserves and be comfortable in her own place.

Totally agree with this.

My granddad was 80 and in a nursing home following a series of strokes when I got married. We would have loved him to be there. Our wedding was in the same town as the nursing home, so minimal travel, and was fairly small, close family and friends. Even so, after discussing it with my dad and a senior member of staff at the nursing home, we decided it was not in granddad's best interests since he easily became confused and we didn't want to cause him any distress. Instead, we went to the nursing home after the (lunchtime) reception with wedding cake and other goodies from the reception.

He died the following year. I'm so glad I have that memory of being able to include him in the day without overwhelming him.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding
Post by: Hopefull on April 26, 2014, 08:02:40 PM
You had me at Lake house Sally!!!


Seriously that long of a day would be terrible for this older woman. Why not suggest someone use a tablet and face time or Skype during the wedding so that she can watch from the comfort of her own home?
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding
Post by: Hopefull on April 26, 2014, 08:27:04 PM
POF I thought of something else.

My oldest recently got married. The week leading up to it was pure chaos. But it got me to thinking. Time goes by so very fast. Kids grown and before you know it they are out on their own.  :'( :'(

I cherish every single moment I had with my daughter. She was VERY good with a certain sport. That meant traveling to the next state at ungodly hours of the morning and watching sometimes 4 or 5 games in one day. It was AWESOME!! I looked forward to the games and the practices. Now she is out of the house and is married. No more games. It is a different season in my life. If I had missed an important game I would have really regretted it.

If this game is important to you and to your son go to it! You will not regret going and spending time with your child because all too soon it will end. LHS's son's wedding will be lovely but think about what you would regret more...........missing your son's game or the wedding??? Do not apologize for not going. As others have said send your regrets and a gift/card and call it a day. If LHS is bent out of shape let her be. Enjoy your time with you son!
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding
Post by: POF on April 27, 2014, 06:12:40 AM
POF I thought of something else.

My oldest recently got married. The week leading up to it was pure chaos. But it got me to thinking. Time goes by so very fast. Kids grown and before you know it they are out on their own.  :'( :'(

I cherish every single moment I had with my daughter. She was VERY good with a certain sport. That meant traveling to the next state at ungodly hours of the morning and watching sometimes 4 or 5 games in one day. It was AWESOME!! I looked forward to the games and the practices. Now she is out of the house and is married. No more games. It is a different season in my life. If I had missed an important game I would have really regretted it.

If this game is important to you and to your son go to it! You will not regret going and spending time with your child because all too soon it will end. LHS's son's wedding will be lovely but think about what you would regret more...........missing your son's game or the wedding??? Do not apologize for not going. As others have said send your regrets and a gift/card and call it a day. If LHS is bent out of shape let her be. Enjoy your time with you son!


Oh - I know ! oldest is looking at colleges youngest turned 15 today.  Where did it go !  I agree 100% - if it were a usual track meet - than - I might miss one.... but this one is a big deal and we already know the date....
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding
Post by: tinkytinky on May 06, 2014, 10:28:04 AM
This is a situation that needs to be taken up with Nephew and the bride (after the invitations are issued). If you think he will be OK with it, that is where you direct this. LHS can get upset all she wants, but ultimately this is their decision. and just because it is LHS's son, doesn't mean that ANY family will be invited (although you may already know if you are). They may not expect grandma to come with the location being so far away. And they may have an idea for grandma to participate, whether it be skype, or just a recording with a special visit later on maybe bringing her a piece of wedding cake.

one of my SIL went to a small wedding venue a few hours away. although we knew about the date, time and location, they didn't want anyone there. Just a small shower/reception when they returned home.
 
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding
Post by: TheaterDiva1 on May 06, 2014, 12:58:06 PM
Has anyone asked MIL herself what she wants to do? She may not even want to go - in which case, it's a moot point.

If she does want to go/feels up to it (and the doctor okays it), you can help come up with a plan to get her there - hire a nurse, for example. LHS should pay for that if she wants her there.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding
Post by: POF on May 06, 2014, 03:11:14 PM
Do ya really want to know what my 93 year - no brain to mouth filter left MIL said when the wedding recently came up as a topic ?    Doesn't matter - maybe I'll be dead by then.   (no she is not depressed .... she just matter of factly doesn't like to make plans to far ahead becasue she might be dead   :o).  I actually like her practical no - nonsense manner.

When asked what she would like for her 90th birthday - she didn't know .... she might be dead by then.  I replied - OK - I'll be sure to get a gift receipt in case I need to return your gift. her response ... good thinking..  everyone else ..... very horrified at our conversation.

She would seriously be entertaining at a wedding.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding
Post by: gramma dishes on May 06, 2014, 03:16:53 PM
Sounds like your MIL is just stating facts.  She hasn't said anything negative or offensive about other people or even events.  "Just the facts, Maam" -- as she sees them.  Personally I think that's delightful and refreshing.   :)
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding
Post by: wolfie on May 06, 2014, 03:19:25 PM
Has anyone asked MIL herself what she wants to do? She may not even want to go - in which case, it's a moot point.

If she does want to go/feels up to it (and the doctor okays it), you can help come up with a plan to get her there - hire a nurse, for example. LHS should pay for that if she wants her there.

on the other hand it really isn't for the OP to solve this problem. If LHS wants her mom there then LHS can figure out how to get her there and make sure that she is taken care of. It is her child's wedding after all.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding
Post by: Mergatroyd on May 06, 2014, 06:51:25 PM
Do ya really want to know what my 93 year - no brain to mouth filter left MIL said when the wedding recently came up as a topic ?    Doesn't matter - maybe I'll be dead by then.   (no she is not depressed .... she just matter of factly doesn't like to make plans to far ahead becasue she might be dead   :o).  I actually like her practical no - nonsense manner.

When asked what she would like for her 90th birthday - she didn't know .... she might be dead by then.  I replied - OK - I'll be sure to get a gift receipt in case I need to return your gift. her response ... good thinking..  everyone else ..... very horrified at our conversation.

She would seriously be entertaining at a wedding.

I like her already.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding
Post by: JoyinVirginia on May 06, 2014, 10:10:16 PM
I can picture it now. Grandma at the wedding.  lake house Sally says she is so glad mom is there. Grandma says don't celebrate too soon, I might be dead before the day is out. I almost hope grandma does get to the wedding to spread cheer!
The more I hear about grandma, the more I like her.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding
Post by: siamesecat2965 on May 07, 2014, 12:20:25 PM
DH's 93 year old grandmother barely made it to her daughter's house for Easter dinner - and that was less than a 10 min drive!  She also left after 2 hours, because the stimulation was just too much for her.  I can't see her doing a 7 hour drive at all, much less overnighting in a hotel, etc.  Lakehouse Sally will, in ehell parlance, have to get over it or die mad.  It's not anyone's "job" to make someone attend a wedding. 

I was incredibly grateful that a large chunk of my family all drove 14 hours to make it to my wedding.  It meant so much to me that they were there.  I would have been sad, but totally understood, if any of them had said, "LadySnowdon, I'm sorry, but it's just not going to work".

I have an 89 year old neighbor, who still has all her marbles, is mobile, and still drives locally. That being said, she has family within an hour's drive in either direction. She isn't comfortable driving to her daughter's so they come get her for holidays etc. She will drive the other way to her son's but when her grandaughter's baby's christening was happening, she politely declined, as despite the fact she's not an invalid, sometimes social gatherings are a bit much for her. Everyone was fine with it.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding
Post by: Nuala on May 07, 2014, 06:21:43 PM
Lake House Sally thinks she is both the star and the director, and that the rest of you are there to support her vision. She thinks it will look good for her 93 year old mother to be at the wedding, so of course her brother will bring mom. He exists only to support her production.

Remember that you are the stars of your own show and it needn't overlap with hers. The athletic event is where you want to be and where you need to be. LHS will have to find other supporting actors or put on a smaller production.

Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding
Post by: POF on May 07, 2014, 08:03:09 PM
Lake House Sally thinks she is both the star and the director, and that the rest of you are there to support her vision. She thinks it will look good for her 93 year old mother to be at the wedding, so of course her brother will bring mom. He exists only to support her production.

Remember that you are the stars of your own show and it needn't overlap with hers. The athletic event is where you want to be and where you need to be. LHS will have to find other supporting actors or put on a smaller production.

You NAILED it.  That is exactly it ....
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6
Post by: POF on June 05, 2014, 10:04:39 AM
Small update:

Venue has been booked and is 3 1/2 hours away.  So considering that most X-country meets are over by noon - then we could do both if it is an evening wedding.

We will need to stay overnight and will need two rooms - since I don't think MIL can stay by herself in a hotel room. - so this will run $$ since it is peak foliage / tour season in this area. ( We would book the boys and DH and I into one room - it would be crowded - but OK for one night )

As far as bringing MIL, I told DH very firmly that I felt it was a mistake and that she is too frail for that long of a drive and to stay all night in a hotel.  I also told him - she hates commotion and noise - so how is she going to manage a wedding reception for any length of time.  I also told him that I really do not want to be appointed her caretaker.  She's nice - but very demandig with me.  I will be expected to be at her side entertaining her the entire trip.

DH - tells me not to worry about it .... which means that he doesn't want to deal with it. He hates conflict and thinks if he ignores it - it will all work. 

I also told him that I consider a wedding where we have to drive more than 2 hours and stay over a destiation wedding and I will be adjusting down the gift.  Actually - it would be fine and fun - but I will have custody of a frail cranky old gal :) 

So ----- we will see .........
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6
Post by: MrTango on June 05, 2014, 10:14:28 AM
Given your update, and especially given your DH's aversion to conflict, I'd be pretty firm with him about how he will be responsible for entertaining and caring for his mother during the trip and that you are not going to let him dump that task on you.

Basically, don't let his aversion to conflict cause you to have to take on additional responsibilities.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6
Post by: JenJay on June 05, 2014, 10:17:33 AM
Why would you have to pay for MIL's hotel room? That needs to come from your SIL, the one who is insisting you bring MIL in the first place.  :-\
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6
Post by: ladyknight1 on June 05, 2014, 10:19:59 AM
Given your update, and especially given your DH's aversion to conflict, I'd be pretty firm with him about how he will be responsible for entertaining and caring for his mother during the trip and that you are not going to let him dump that task on you.

Basically, don't let his aversion to conflict cause you to have to take on additional responsibilities.

POD. Not to mention that it is unfair to everyone if you have to spend all of your time catering to MIL.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6
Post by: Luci on June 05, 2014, 10:53:20 AM
Given your update, and especially given your DH's aversion to conflict, I'd be pretty firm with him about how he will be responsible for entertaining and caring for his mother during the trip and that you are not going to let him dump that task on you.

Basically, don't let his aversion to conflict cause you to have to take on additional responsibilities.

But, in real life, someone saying he will be responsible and coming through are two quite different things. If he does dump it  on her, POF is still going to take over. The alternative would be the nice woman sitting by herself, whining and being ignored and miserable. POF would not let that happen!
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6
Post by: PastryGoddess on June 05, 2014, 12:13:52 PM
It's much easier for your DH to make you unhappy than it is to make someone else unhappy.  Why is that?

Honestly, your DH doesn't really matter at this point.  What do you want to do?  If you don't want to be stuck caring for MIL, then you need to state that fact to both your husband and SIL.  You haven't told SIL that you aren't doing it, so of course she's assuming that you are.  You've discussed it with your husband, but you know he's not going to touch it with a 10 ft pole. 

If they really want you to do it, then there need to be significant concessions to your wants and needs or else, it doesn't happen. 
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6
Post by: MrTango on June 05, 2014, 01:17:38 PM
Given your update, and especially given your DH's aversion to conflict, I'd be pretty firm with him about how he will be responsible for entertaining and caring for his mother during the trip and that you are not going to let him dump that task on you.

Basically, don't let his aversion to conflict cause you to have to take on additional responsibilities.

But, in real life, someone saying he will be responsible and coming through are two quite different things. If he does dump it  on her, POF is still going to take over. The alternative would be the nice woman sitting by herself, whining and being ignored and miserable. POF would not let that happen!

If that's the case, then POF is a far kinder person than I am.

Maybe the best solution would be for POF to just stay home and if her husband wants to take his mother to the wedding, he can do so without POF.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6
Post by: POF on June 05, 2014, 01:41:01 PM
Given your update, and especially given your DH's aversion to conflict, I'd be pretty firm with him about how he will be responsible for entertaining and caring for his mother during the trip and that you are not going to let him dump that task on you.

Basically, don't let his aversion to conflict cause you to have to take on additional responsibilities.

But, in real life, someone saying he will be responsible and coming through are two quite different things. If he does dump it  on her, POF is still going to take over. The alternative would be the nice woman sitting by herself, whining and being ignored and miserable. POF would not let that happen!

If that's the case, then POF is a far kinder person than I am.

Maybe the best solution would be for POF to just stay home and if her husband wants to take his mother to the wedding, he can do so without POF.

Thats where I am leaning.  This is in the middle of my busy season at work - so time off is at a huge premium.  I don't want to spend it in inlaw hell.  I do think that SIL should pay for the room, but in reality - MIL will need to be with us.

I will dump it on DH - in fact - I will suggest to him that we take separate cars - so that I can make an excursion of the drive up with the boys( stop and see things - do a bit of sightseeing ) and he can actually go up on Friday and take his mother to the rehearsal.

I will meet him at the church on Saturday.  Honestly - he chooses his mother over me a lot  - so let him spend the weekend with her.  if she needs to leave reception early - he can take her back to hotel.

A couple of years ago - Sally insisted that MIL come down to the Lake House for the annual cocktail fundraiser.  OK, well Sally abandoned MIL in a chair and MIL did nothing  but keep telling me - why are you mingling - I want you to sit here with me .  I went over to DH and Sally and said ... its your mother, I told you she's hate this - she needs your attention and I went to visit with my friends. 


You are all correct - I was raised that yo urespect elderly people and you make their lives easier - but it happens too much at my expense. 
 


Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6
Post by: ladyknight1 on June 05, 2014, 01:44:25 PM
I have to say that I love this update. I've been in your shoes and it is not an easy situation.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6
Post by: mime on June 05, 2014, 02:17:55 PM
I'm glad to see your second update because the one on the prior page was a little troubling. I can imagine how easy it will be for you to fall into the role of 24/7 caregiver if DH just remains unresponsive and takes no action. It is easy for him to go along with what Sally demands because it only puts a burden on you, not him.

I really like the idea that you go in a separate car and arrive later or leave earlier than the rest of the family, for work or sightseeing or whatever reason that works.

 
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6
Post by: CharlieBraun on June 05, 2014, 02:21:48 PM
POF, I totally agree with you and with the other PP.   

You have no control over how long the meet will last, and if it goes over, you are the one ending up doing the Big Scramble to make it all work - to get the rest of the family to Sally's Big Event.  You.

If MIL comes along and based on past history, you are the one who will end up dealing with her.  You.

If I were in your shoes, I would decline to go at all, staying home with your kids and making it a Mom's Weekend With Her Kids.  Which, ironically, you would be giving as a gift to your MIL - Mom's Weekend with HER Kids.

Going up Saturday would be my own second choice, but if you are OK with it - then run with it.  My concern for that is that, immediately upon arrival, MIL is placed on your hands while DH and SIL go prancing to the party.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6
Post by: Luci on June 05, 2014, 02:40:11 PM
After all of this, I'm still of the surety that I would not take the trip, and I'm "only" 70 and we travel quite a bit. But I can get up and walk around, have a restroom handy, and in sort of control.

We drove 2 1/2 hours, spent 8 hours with grandson, and then 2 1/2 hours home in a comfortable van yesterday. I'm beat! without all of the activity and confusion of a wedding and an overnight stay.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6
Post by: POF on June 05, 2014, 04:12:24 PM
After all of this, I'm still of the surety that I would not take the trip, and I'm "only" 70 and we travel quite a bit. But I can get up and walk around, have a restroom handy, and in sort of control.

We drove 2 1/2 hours, spent 8 hours with grandson, and then 2 1/2 hours home in a comfortable van yesterday. I'm beat! without all of the activity and confusion of a wedding and an overnight stay.

I just think if they are going to browbeat a 93 year to be an ornamentation at a wedding .... then Sally can deal with it.  I do feel bad for MIL, she's elserly, she deserves to be respected and treated with care.  I thinktaking a separate car will give me the ability to distance myself a bit.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6
Post by: Maude on June 05, 2014, 05:38:30 PM
As an aside...
Who benefits from the annual cocktail FUNDRAISER?
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6
Post by: POF on June 05, 2014, 06:25:41 PM
As an aside...
Who benefits from the annual cocktail FUNDRAISER?

Our Neighborhood Association.  We all bring an Appetizer and sell beer / wine and a special Lake cocktail ( which I really think is all the old booze in various houses mixed together ! )
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6
Post by: gramma dishes on June 05, 2014, 06:29:31 PM
Has it actually even been established that MIL actually wants to go to this wedding? 
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6
Post by: Luci on June 05, 2014, 06:38:56 PM
After all of this, I'm still of the surety that I would not take the trip, and I'm "only" 70 and we travel quite a bit. But I can get up and walk around, have a restroom handy, and in sort of control.

We drove 2 1/2 hours, spent 8 hours with grandson, and then 2 1/2 hours home in a comfortable van yesterday. I'm beat! without all of the activity and confusion of a wedding and an overnight stay.

I just think if they are going to browbeat a 93 year to be an ornamentation at a wedding .... then Sally can deal with it.  I do feel bad for MIL, she's elserly, she deserves to be respected and treated with care.  I thinktaking a separate car will give me the ability to distance myself a bit.

I weep for the lady.

My grandmother at 87 couldn't make it to our wedding, 2 hrs away.  I was sad, so we visited her on our honeymoon. It was best for all of us. She fixed a dinner for us! Better than her traveling and Lucas got to meet her!

The woman deserves respect. Now that I think about how our children would handle a situation like this, I am positive it would be with respect and dignity.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6
Post by: blarg314 on June 05, 2014, 07:02:42 PM

I definitely think that letting your husband do the trip while you handle the sports event is the way to go.

It's easy for your DH to prioritize his mother when he doesn't have to actually deal with any of the unpleasant stuff. Let him handle *all* the work, and his approach may well change.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6
Post by: Tea Drinker on June 05, 2014, 07:24:16 PM
I would agree that sending your husband to be with his mother, and staying home with the kids, is probably the easiest.

If you do go, it would be neither disrespectful of the elderly, nor rude, to answer each and every one of your MIL's requests with "I'll go get Husband for you," doing so, and telling him "Your mother needs help/company." Telling her "too bad" or walking away without a word would be rude: telling her "I'll go get your son" is both polite and appropriate.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6
Post by: POF on June 05, 2014, 08:28:52 PM
Has it actually even been established that MIL actually wants to go to this wedding?

Not yet ----- her response ( and she is actually quite funny and I really do love her ) would be to say .. " I might be dead by then ".  She is not depressed, just seriously ready to go when they call her stop.

I don't think she wants to go, lately - I have been having her  to our house for individual smaller holidays, Mothers day, easter etc. She finds it difficult when the entire clan is together.  And she likes me a lot, but at her age - that means she likes me to be with her all the time at events.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6
Post by: gramma dishes on June 05, 2014, 08:34:25 PM
It seems like the family just wants her to be there so they can brag that their Grandmother came all this way to share "our special day" without regard as to how difficult this trip would be for her.

What would she say if you said "You know, I'm not going to be able to go to this wedding because of our son's track meet.  But DH will be happy to take you with him if you want to go!"?
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6
Post by: Luci on June 05, 2014, 09:10:16 PM
I would so love to be able to stay with MIL over the weekend! Stiffen up her spine against Sally and let you have a fun family event. Skype with gramma dishes. Sigh. I know..........Luci

PS Glad you can be with your son's event no matter what!
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6
Post by: gramma dishes on June 05, 2014, 09:19:12 PM
I would so love to be able to stay with MIL over the weekend! Stiffen up her spine against Sally and let you have a fun family event. Skype with gramma dishes. Sigh. I know..........Luci

PS Glad you can be with your son's event no matter what!

LOL!  Now that would be fun!!   ;D

But then the rest of them would want to come and be with us! 
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6
Post by: Luci on June 05, 2014, 09:46:47 PM
I would so love to be able to stay with MIL over the weekend! Stiffen up her spine against Sally and let you have a fun family event. Skype with gramma dishes. Sigh. I know..........Luci

PS Glad you can be with your son's event no matter what!

LOL!  Now that would be fun!!   ;D

But then the rest of them would want to come and be with us!

Yup. Anything to avoid Sally and see MIL!

Oh, wait! The Happy Couple are important and as I see it, quite innocent! Can we all go for a quick visit then beam over to MIL?

Again, best wishes and hugs to our POF.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6
Post by: blarg314 on June 06, 2014, 12:50:11 AM

I agree that letting your husband handle all the unpleasant and inconvenient parts of this is the best way to go. It's easy for him to say yes when he doesn't actually have to deal with the details. I'd be inclined to go all out and let DH and MIL attend the wedding while you stay home and handle the sports event and your work.

I still feel sorry for MIL if she's being pressured into a trip she doesn't really want, though, but I think you have a limited ability to actually stop it.

Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6
Post by: Margo on June 06, 2014, 05:45:13 AM
It seems like the family just wants her to be there so they can brag that their Grandmother came all this way to share "our special day" without regard as to how difficult this trip would be for her.

What would she say if you said "You know, I'm not going to be able to go to this wedding because of our son's track meet.  But DH will be happy to take you with him if you want to go!"?

I actually like this - it may be that if she knows you won't be attending she may feel it gives her 'permission' to say no if she would rather not go.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding
Post by: crella on June 06, 2014, 07:21:45 PM
Do ya really want to know what my 93 year - no brain to mouth filter left MIL said when the wedding recently came up as a topic ?    Doesn't matter - maybe I'll be dead by then.   (no she is not depressed .... she just matter of factly doesn't like to make plans to far ahead becasue she might be dead   :o).  I actually like her practical no - nonsense manner.

When asked what she would like for her 90th birthday - she didn't know .... she might be dead by then.  I replied - OK - I'll be sure to get a gift receipt in case I need to return your gift. her response ... good thinking..  everyone else ..... very horrified at our conversation.

She would seriously be entertaining at a wedding.


She sounds hilarious!

I've written about this elsewhere here, but we had the same type of situation. Our son for now, lives in Tokyo and we were attending his wedding from Kobe, 3.5 hours by bullet train and then a 15 minute taxi ride to the venue. MIL was in Stage 4 or 5 of Alzheimer's (we thought-she's been re-diagnosed but that was the info we were acting on then) , with short-term memory of about 2 minutes plus some sundowning.

MIL really wanted to go, when she could remember about the wedding. As she was physically Ok (she just needed a wheelchair for doctor's visits, shopping etc involving distances) and we just had to worry about the sundowning, we took her. We hired a nurse that we knew, and whom she likes very much, so that we could be in the receiving line, see people off etc and have someone to be with her. Before the trip we had her rest, kept her home from day care (she was going 2x a week to see her old friends) and kept all prep/packing out of sight (so she didn't think she had to 'do something' and get in an anxious mood).  She was 84 then. To keep anxiety at a minimum, we didn't have her attend the rehearsal dinner, she had dinner with the nurse so we could keep her on her usual dinner at 5, bed at 8 routine.  The morning of the wedding we just took her to get her hair done and then had her rest more.

She did start to sundown right on schedule, in part because they had dimmed the lights in the hall for the newlyweds to come around to each guest table and light a candle...dark isn't good for AD patients in the evening. We handled it with distraction, and lots of hugs and picture taking with the kids when they got to our table. In her hotel room she did have a mini-meltdown as she was past her bed time, and she didn't recognize any of the scenery from her window, but we were able to calm her down. As short as her memory was, for a while afterwards she told people 'I went to my grandson's wedding!'.

POF, your MIL has just some confusion, I think you said, so you would not have to think ahead for tactics to avoid sundowning and things like that. The thing is, as you know, that the elderly get tired from just having their routines changed. If she goes, she should probably attend the wedding, period. A series of events that she has to dress for and be 'on' for (talk to many people, participate in more conversation than she's used to daily) would likely knock her out.

If your MIL wants to go, and if they want her there so badly, they all need to make it possible. We had a nurse, and the hotel staff made someone available to us if we needed help and it was still a bit hectic. Lakehouse Sally and any others insisting that you bring her need to (in my humble opinion) step up and take an active part in MILs attendance, taking turns with her, making a concerted effort not to completely overwhelm her, and to take some of the burden off of you and your DH.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6
Post by: POF on June 06, 2014, 08:53:19 PM
OK - so MIL is going to go - but will room with Sally.  DH's other sibling will drive her up on Friday , we will drive her home on Sunday.  Sally has agreed to be caretaker and I agreed to help.  She actually behaves very well for me and I take the comments with a grain of salt.

DH did tell me that the ceremony is at the top of a mountain and you have to take an aerial tram there.  MIL is not going to do that.  Neither am I - I will vomit from fear , vertigo and/or motion sickness.  ( Another SIL has already said - nope not taking an aerial tram either! ) Plus I think there is a bit of a hike to  the site.

So the three of us will find something to do and then attend the reception  (which is at the hotel ) . ( I am sure it will be more than three of us - there are several mobility impaired folks who would find this difficult ).

Please keep in mind -  I do care about MIL, I was just concerned about being responsible for her in a hotel room and for the entire weekend. I don't mind being on duty for a few hours.   DH already booked the rooms and decided to get two rooms - so that he and I can relax a bit away from the teens ( that was a nice surprise ).

Thanks for your advice, I am sure it will get much crazier as the times get closer.



Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6 and #7
Post by: JenJay on June 06, 2014, 09:01:16 PM
Great update! And I don't think anyone thought you don't care about MIL. In fact, I think you were the only one considering how she might feel at all! Sometimes the kindest thing you can do for someone is say "Nope, I will not participate in that. You're all out of your minds."  ;)
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6
Post by: crella on June 06, 2014, 11:24:30 PM

Please keep in mind -  I do care about MIL, I was just concerned about being responsible for her in a hotel room and for the entire weekend. I don't mind being on duty for a few hours.   DH already booked the rooms and decided to get two rooms - so that he and I can relax a bit away from the teens ( that was a nice surprise ).

Thanks for your advice, I am sure it will get much crazier as the times get closer.

We can see how much you care, and she's a happy lady for it, I'm sure! I understand completely. A whole weekend away as sole caregiver would just be too much! That would be really unfair to you, even though you too are close. It's intense to care for an elderly person. The plan sounds excellent, I am really happy for you!
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6 and #7
Post by: Sophia on June 07, 2014, 06:34:48 AM
Amazing update.  I am truly shocked that Sally is having MIL in her hotel room.  Maybe she isn't a complete toad.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6 and #7
Post by: aussie_chick on June 07, 2014, 06:34:55 AM
Wait...
Have I got this right? She is insisting that MIL attend the wedding that she physically can't get to the ceremony of? Seriously?
If it was so important for her to be there, then perhaps the HC should have picked a location that was more accessible.
Agree with others who said it sounds like MIL is a wedding ornament!
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6 and #7
Post by: lkdrymom on June 07, 2014, 08:11:58 AM
Why do I not believe that MIL will be staying in Sally's room will happen? What will you do if this turns out to be a bait and switch?
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6 and #7
Post by: weeblewobble on June 07, 2014, 09:24:58 AM
Why do I not believe that MIL will be staying in Sally's room will happen? What will you do if this turns out to be a bait and switch?

Yep, I would make sure DH got a room with ONE BED.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6 and #7
Post by: livluvlaf on June 07, 2014, 12:43:10 PM
MOB is supposed to look after her mother during the wedding day? I haven't attended a wedding in a while, but MOB is usually pretty busy as co-host.

This means the secondary person scheduled to look after MIL will really be the primary!

Best of Luck!
 
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6 and #7
Post by: o_gal on June 09, 2014, 09:33:26 AM
MOB is supposed to look after her mother during the wedding day? I haven't attended a wedding in a while, but MOB is usually pretty busy as co-host.

This means the secondary person scheduled to look after MIL will really be the primary!

Best of Luck!

That was my first  :o reaction. You've been had, POF. There are 2 people who should be stepping up to the plate instead of you - DH and Sally. So far, DH has effectively dumped her on you because he's going to the top of the mountain, leaving her with you. And by getting 2 rooms, you've left a way for Sally to dump her on you so that she stays in the 2nd room and you get the teens in yours (I'd cancel that second room right now.) And there's no way in e-Hell that Sally is going to be looking after her at all. No one even in normal situations would anyone expect the MOB to do something like this.

Unfortunately, it looks like the update to this one after the wedding (which we fully expect you to provide  >:D ) doesn't look like it's going to be good. My betting money is on Sally calling you up and claiming some last minute crisis for the other sibling so that you have to drive her up as well.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6 and #7
Post by: lkdrymom on June 09, 2014, 10:01:15 AM
MOB is supposed to look after her mother during the wedding day? I haven't attended a wedding in a while, but MOB is usually pretty busy as co-host.

This means the secondary person scheduled to look after MIL will really be the primary!

Best of Luck!

That was my first  :o reaction. You've been had, POF. There are 2 people who should be stepping up to the plate instead of you - DH and Sally. So far, DH has effectively dumped her on you because he's going to the top of the mountain, leaving her with you. And by getting 2 rooms, you've left a way for Sally to dump her on you so that she stays in the 2nd room and you get the teens in yours (I'd cancel that second room right now.) And there's no way in e-Hell that Sally is going to be looking after her at all. No one even in normal situations would anyone expect the MOB to do something like this.

Unfortunately, it looks like the update to this one after the wedding (which we fully expect you to provide  >:D ) doesn't look like it's going to be good. My betting money is on Sally calling you up and claiming some last minute crisis for the other sibling so that you have to drive her up as well.

I totally agree. MIL will be in your hotel room. Cancel that second room now!!! I understand you don't mind watching her for a bit, but really your DH needs to step up and take over for you if Sally bails. He is making his problem yours.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6 and #7
Post by: Quiltin Nana on June 09, 2014, 10:30:41 AM
MOB is supposed to look after her mother during the wedding day? I haven't attended a wedding in a while, but MOB is usually pretty busy as co-host.

This means the secondary person scheduled to look after MIL will really be the primary!

Best of Luck!

That was my first  :o reaction. You've been had, POF. There are 2 people who should be stepping up to the plate instead of you - DH and Sally. So far, DH has effectively dumped her on you because he's going to the top of the mountain, leaving her with you. And by getting 2 rooms, you've left a way for Sally to dump her on you so that she stays in the 2nd room and you get the teens in yours (I'd cancel that second room right now.) And there's no way in e-Hell that Sally is going to be looking after her at all. No one even in normal situations would anyone expect the MOB to do something like this.

Unfortunately, it looks like the update to this one after the wedding (which we fully expect you to provide  >:D ) doesn't look like it's going to be good. My betting money is on Sally calling you up and claiming some last minute crisis for the other sibling so that you have to drive her up as well.

I totally agree. MIL will be in your hotel room. Cancel that second room now!!! I understand you don't mind watching her for a bit, but really your DH needs to step up and take over for you if Sally bails. He is making his problem yours.

I thought that Sally was the Mother of the Groom, not the bride. 
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6 and #7
Post by: POF on June 09, 2014, 11:05:34 AM
MOB is supposed to look after her mother during the wedding day? I haven't attended a wedding in a while, but MOB is usually pretty busy as co-host.

This means the secondary person scheduled to look after MIL will really be the primary!

Best of Luck!

That was my first  :o reaction. You've been had, POF. There are 2 people who should be stepping up to the plate instead of you - DH and Sally. So far, DH has effectively dumped her on you because he's going to the top of the mountain, leaving her with you. And by getting 2 rooms, you've left a way for Sally to dump her on you so that she stays in the 2nd room and you get the teens in yours (I'd cancel that second room right now.) And there's no way in e-Hell that Sally is going to be looking after her at all. No one even in normal situations would anyone expect the MOB to do something like this.

Unfortunately, it looks like the update to this one after the wedding (which we fully expect you to provide  >:D ) doesn't look like it's going to be good. My betting money is on Sally calling you up and claiming some last minute crisis for the other sibling so that you have to drive her up as well.

I think I am OK.  Another sibling is supposedly bringing her up to venue.  Sally has a 2 room suite at hotel and MIL will be there.  During the ceremony - there are several people who can't manage the tram.  We will probably just hang at the hotel or do something easy. 

I have no problem being in charge of her at the reception. I am sure we will be at a family table and my 2 teenage sons adore her - she is under 5 feet tall and they are huge.

 She can walk around with a cane/ walker and feed herself.  If it is a buffet - one of us will need to handle her plate.  She can manage restroom on her own - but usually someone walks with her.

There will be lots of family to entertain her there.  If she wants to leave early - Sally will have to deal with it.  Next AM, we pick her up at 11:00 and drive her back with us.

My biggest concern was the hotel room and getting her around places.  Now she can stay at the hotel where the reception is - so once we get her there she is pretty good.

Of course - I'll get roped into something - but DH and I have had a few stern talks about he needs to be dancing attendance on her.  Problem is she likes me ....

Of course Sally will pull something - I'd be disappointed in some way if she didn't ! 

Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6 and #7
Post by: Venus193 on June 09, 2014, 11:59:35 AM
I completely recommend that you pull a fast one of your own before Sally has the last laugh once again.  I have a bad vibe about this.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6 and #7
Post by: POF on June 09, 2014, 12:56:02 PM
I completely recommend that you pull a fast one of your own before Sally has the last laugh once again.  I have a bad vibe about this.

Well - I think what will happen is that

a) I'll get a ton of grief about not wanting to ride the aeril tram to the top of the mountain. If that stuff starts - then I will just bypass the wedding.

b) Sally's daughter Betty will try to coerce me to help with her badly behaved kids. No thanks - not doing that - not negotiable. they have tried this with me at the Lakehouse and I have ended it very quickly.  I'd rather have MIL any day of the week.

c) There will be some complicated thing about the timing of bringing MIL home - but by 11:00 the next day - she will be glad to head out as will I.

d) If stuff starts to look to complicated - I will drive myself and the boys and DH can take his mother.  That way I have transportation and can leave when I need to.

e) MIL will be a pill and complain -  I will disappear :)

I am thinking out my escape hatches ...... 



Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6 and #7
Post by: Luci on June 09, 2014, 12:58:50 PM
I'm on the wagon going the "this is going to turn on you, somehow", however, I'm sending you a large supply of eHell Spine Polish and hoping for the best for you.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6 and #7
Post by: wyliefool on June 09, 2014, 01:15:42 PM
Maybe I'm an old fogey but what kind of maniac invites the whole family to a mountaintop wedding that involves a chairlift and a hike?!?!? That's precisely the sort of situaiton that receptions-after-the-fact were invented for!!

I don't have vertigo issues when it comes to enclosed trams on mountains, and i like hiking, but I'd be laughing at the notion of attending. Bahahahaaaa, I'll see you at the reception. Have fun!

(Sorry for my grammar; I just got back from Italy and am hugely jetlagged. And living off a 20-oz coffee buzz.)
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6 and #7
Post by: POF on June 09, 2014, 01:31:48 PM
Maybe I'm an old fogey but what kind of maniac invites the whole family to a mountaintop wedding that involves a chairlift and a hike?!?!? That's precisely the sort of situaiton that receptions-after-the-fact were invented for!!

I don't have vertigo issues when it comes to enclosed trams on mountains, and i like hiking, but I'd be laughing at the notion of attending. Bahahahaaaa, I'll see you at the reception. Have fun!

(Sorry for my grammar; I just got back from Italy and am hugely jetlagged. And living off a 20-oz coffee buzz.)

Seriously - although to be fair - I think it is a bit of a walk down a path as opposed to a hike. DH is hoping this means casual clothes for the wedding.  I doubt it. 

Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6 and #7
Post by: gramma dishes on June 09, 2014, 01:45:03 PM
It rather sounds like this couple is trying to make it as difficult and hazardous as possible for guests to actually be able to ... you know ... witness the actual wedding!!   :o

"Sure!  Dress up in your nicest clothes and wear high heels, then board a tram and take a little hike.  Then you get to watch us get married.  It'll be worth it, we promise!"
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6 and #7
Post by: Amara on June 09, 2014, 02:20:13 PM
I keep trying to picture how a full bridal gown and veil along with the flowers and everything else will not get dirty, torn, etc.  8)
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6 and #7
Post by: lmyrs on June 09, 2014, 03:26:05 PM
Just because it's on a mountain doesn't mean it's a "hike". I think that some of the posters here are getting unfairly hung up on that. The OP, herself, said it's a walk down a path. That's hardly a "hike". It's no different than if someone got married on a beach or at a picnic shelter in a park. There's a tonne of venues that you're not driving right up to the ceremony and parking. If the OP can't handle the train, that's fine and completely understandable But it's hardly unreasonable of the couple. I'm picturing something like a restaurant/location at a ski resort, even in the summer where one would take a gondola. That's not every person's cup of tea but it's hardly rude. And, I doubt it's any more difficult to keep anyone or anything clean than it is when you get outdoor photos done.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6 and #7
Post by: bloo on June 09, 2014, 04:02:42 PM
It rather sounds like this couple is trying to make it as difficult and hazardous as possible for guests to actually be able to ... you know ... witness the actual wedding!!   :o

"Sure!  Dress up in your nicest clothes and wear high heels, then board a tram and take a little hike.  Then you get to watch us get married.  It'll be worth it, we promise!"

"...oh and don't forget that after the rehearsal dinner there will be a quick tutorial on BASE jumping for the directly-after-ceremony activity. Here are your parachutes!"
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6 and #7
Post by: POF on June 09, 2014, 05:02:20 PM
Just because it's on a mountain doesn't mean it's a "hike". I think that some of the posters here are getting unfairly hung up on that. The OP, herself, said it's a walk down a path. That's hardly a "hike". It's no different than if someone got married on a beach or at a picnic shelter in a park. There's a tonne of venues that you're not driving right up to the ceremony and parking. If the OP can't handle the train, that's fine and completely understandable But it's hardly unreasonable of the couple. I'm picturing something like a restaurant/location at a ski resort, even in the summer where one would take a gondola. That's not every person's cup of tea but it's hardly rude. And, I doubt it's any more difficult to keep anyone or anything clean than it is when you get outdoor photos done.

I am pretty sure that's it.  I have anxiety issues with heights and enclosed spaces. I tend to get motion sickness.  This is NOT a match for me ! I think most people are OK with it though.  Yeah - I think its a easy walk - except if you are elderly and need a walker.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6 and #7
Post by: wyliefool on June 10, 2014, 11:49:00 AM
Just because it's on a mountain doesn't mean it's a "hike". I think that some of the posters here are getting unfairly hung up on that. The OP, herself, said it's a walk down a path. That's hardly a "hike". It's no different than if someone got married on a beach or at a picnic shelter in a park. There's a tonne of venues that you're not driving right up to the ceremony and parking. If the OP can't handle the train, that's fine and completely understandable But it's hardly unreasonable of the couple. I'm picturing something like a restaurant/location at a ski resort, even in the summer where one would take a gondola. That's not every person's cup of tea but it's hardly rude. And, I doubt it's any more difficult to keep anyone or anything clean than it is when you get outdoor photos done.

I am pretty sure that's it.  I have anxiety issues with heights and enclosed spaces. I tend to get motion sickness.  This is NOT a match for me ! I think most people are OK with it though.  Yeah - I think its a easy walk - except if you are elderly and need a walker.

Hike, path, whatever, it doesn't sound like the sort of event one expects one's elderly relatives to attend. That is, if one is reasonable.

Heck, we took my MIL to Utah a few years ago. She was early 80s and able to walk w/ a cane but not over rough ground or long distances. We pushed her transport chair up some (well-kept, flattish) trails because we were into having a fun vacation. The hill at the end of the riverside walk at Zion was a bit much but it was short. If we were expected to do this in good clothes and attend a wedding at the end of any of these walks we all would have laughed and said 'see you at the bar later'. Or, maybe we would have gone ourselves and left her behind. She certainly wouldn't have gone.

OT: The Featherlight brand of transport chair is awesome. It's been over the aforementioned trails, beaches in the Carolinas, and cobbled streets in London and Italy. Starting to squeak a little but in fine shape still. Alas, she's now getting too frail for these trips. I think this last one was the last one.  :'(
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6 and #7
Post by: lmyrs on June 10, 2014, 12:31:59 PM
We clearly have a very different idea of where this wedding is actually happening. I'm picturing something like this:

http://kickinghorseresort.com/summer-main/the-resort/groups-and-wedding-information/weddings/
http://kickinghorseresort.com/winter-main/the-resort/groups-and-wedding-information/weddings/wedding-venues/

I've never been to a wedding at this venue, but I have been skiing at it. The gondola goes to the top of the mountain and then you have to walk about 100 feet to get to the restaurant. Having been here, myself, in the past, I can guarantee that it is much more accessible than the small town church that my sisters got married at. It's also more accessible than many weddings in busy downtown cores with limited parking. My grandmother/grandfathers would have had a much easier time getting to this mountaintop than to either of those other places. (Assuming the mountaintop wasn't a plane ride away which this particular one is.) Heck, my cousin's wedding, which was at her in-laws farmyard required walking about 200 feet from where we parked to where the ceremony was across grass. And, most people's yards are less well groomed than a path to a major tourist venue.

Is the venue above suitable for the OP? No. Because she is terrified of heights and can't get on the gondola. It has nothing to do with it being inaccessible to the mobility impaired. Sure, if the wedding in question is happening at a location that is genuinely difficult to get to for people in wheelchairs, then they shouldn't expect the mobility impaired to attend their wedding. But there is less than zero indication of that from the OP and I find this constant picking at the couple for their choice of venue to be rather unpleasant and rude of it's own accord. We're assigning some pretty mean traits to this couple and then blowing them all up when we talk about "hikes" and "base jumping" when really, the main concern here seems to be the gondola/train. Not the "hike".

 I just cannot buy in to this idea
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6 and #7
Post by: POF on June 10, 2014, 12:57:01 PM
We clearly have a very different idea of where this wedding is actually happening. I'm picturing something like this:

http://kickinghorseresort.com/summer-main/the-resort/groups-and-wedding-information/weddings/
http://kickinghorseresort.com/winter-main/the-resort/groups-and-wedding-information/weddings/wedding-venues/

I've never been to a wedding at this venue, but I have been skiing at it. The gondola goes to the top of the mountain and then you have to walk about 100 feet to get to the restaurant. Having been here, myself, in the past, I can guarantee that it is much more accessible than the small town church that my sisters got married at. It's also more accessible than many weddings in busy downtown cores with limited parking. My grandmother/grandfathers would have had a much easier time getting to this mountaintop than to either of those other places. (Assuming the mountaintop wasn't a plane ride away which this particular one is.) Heck, my cousin's wedding, which was at her in-laws farmyard required walking about 200 feet from where we parked to where the ceremony was across grass. And, most people's yards are less well groomed than a path to a major tourist venue.

Is the venue above suitable for the OP? No. Because she is terrified of heights and can't get on the gondola. It has nothing to do with it being inaccessible to the mobility impaired. Sure, if the wedding in question is happening at a location that is genuinely difficult to get to for people in wheelchairs, then they shouldn't expect the mobility impaired to attend their wedding. But there is less than zero indication of that from the OP and I find this constant picking at the couple for their choice of venue to be rather unpleasant and rude of it's own accord. We're assigning some pretty mean traits to this couple and then blowing them all up when we talk about "hikes" and "base jumping" when really, the main concern here seems to be the gondola/train. Not the "hike".

 I just cannot buy in to this idea

I agree - they are acutally a pretty nice couple. 
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6 and #7
Post by: AngelicGamer on June 10, 2014, 01:00:00 PM
I think the OP said that they're getting up to the site by chair lift, not gondola.  I have no fear of heights and even I'm a bit leery of getting on a chair lift because I don't ski / snowboard.  I'd be fine if it was a nice enclosed gondola where you look at the pretty scenery where you go up.  My impression of chair lifts is that you wait for the chair to come and pick you up to carry you up the mountain.  Which... no.  :)  I'd be afraid I'd fall off.

However, the rest of your post about making the couple into villains?  I completely agree with you that it's not cool, lmyrs.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6 and #7
Post by: bloo on June 10, 2014, 02:16:05 PM
We're assigning some pretty mean traits to this couple and then blowing them all up when we talk about "hikes" and "base jumping" when really, the main concern here seems to be the gondola/train. Not the "hike".

Yikes. I was just kidding about the BASE jumping.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6 and #7
Post by: LadyL on June 10, 2014, 02:26:31 PM
I think the OP said that they're getting up to the site by chair lift, not gondola.  I have no fear of heights and even I'm a bit leery of getting on a chair lift because I don't ski / snowboard.  I'd be fine if it was a nice enclosed gondola where you look at the pretty scenery where you go up.  My impression of chair lifts is that you wait for the chair to come and pick you up to carry you up the mountain.  Which... no.  :)  I'd be afraid I'd fall off.

However, the rest of your post about making the couple into villains?  I completely agree with you that it's not cool, lmyrs.

She referred to it as an airial tram. Typically those are enclosed and the ride is very smooth. I'm picturing something like the tram in Palm Springs, CA which is definitely as accessible as any sort of public building, but does involve views of heights:
http://www.pstramway.com/
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6 and #7
Post by: tinkytinky on June 10, 2014, 02:31:06 PM
We're assigning some pretty mean traits to this couple and then blowing them all up when we talk about "hikes" and "base jumping" when really, the main concern here seems to be the gondola/train. Not the "hike".

Yikes. I was just kidding about the BASE jumping.

Now all I can picture is the  bride and groom on a cliff and when they are announced as husband and wife - they kiss and - and proceed to jump off the cliff in their special-made tux and gown - and they look like  flying squirrels.......(I don't know why....I am not picturing parachutes or hang gliders).

sorry....off topic......back to your regularly scheduled programming.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6 and #7
Post by: AngelicGamer on June 10, 2014, 07:00:00 PM
I think the OP said that they're getting up to the site by chair lift, not gondola.  I have no fear of heights and even I'm a bit leery of getting on a chair lift because I don't ski / snowboard.  I'd be fine if it was a nice enclosed gondola where you look at the pretty scenery where you go up.  My impression of chair lifts is that you wait for the chair to come and pick you up to carry you up the mountain.  Which... no.  :)  I'd be afraid I'd fall off.

However, the rest of your post about making the couple into villains?  I completely agree with you that it's not cool, lmyrs.

She referred to it as an airial tram. Typically those are enclosed and the ride is very smooth. I'm picturing something like the tram in Palm Springs, CA which is definitely as accessible as any sort of public building, but does involve views of heights:
http://www.pstramway.com/

Ah, thank you, LadyL!  Perhaps I got a crossed wire with a different poster than the OP or something.  I'd love to go on the tram - it looks amazing.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6 and #7
Post by: ladyknight1 on June 10, 2014, 07:02:08 PM
It all depends on the people involved. We have family members who can't go on trams like that, or fly in an airplane due to fear of heights.

Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6 and #7
Post by: carol1412 on June 12, 2014, 02:43:00 PM
Even a 100ft walk can be tiring if it's at a higher elevation than you're used to. Especially if you're out of shape or - you know - 90 years old. ;)
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6 and #7
Post by: POF on June 27, 2014, 08:43:58 AM
Some new information :

a) We booked lodging - it was around $200 for the night.  Check in time is actually after the start of the ceremony and the checkout is pretty early the next AM ( 10:30 )

b) It isn't a tram, it's actual ski lift chairs.  Apparently they will come to a complete stop ( unlike in ski season ).  Nope - not for me - how would I do that in dress ?  What if my shoes fell - oh wait a minute - its high in the air and my are dangling... nope nope nope. 

c) MIL is very ambivalent about going. DH is going to talk to her and Sally  closer to the date. MIL will not be able to see the ceremony, I bet she will spend 2 hours at the reception.  I want DH to tell me - who will be going back to the room with MIL when she wants to leave.  Because if it is either of us, I am not going.  I can't see the point in driving 3 to 31/2 hours, paying several hundred dollars for the room and missing the ceremony and most of the reception.

I also want to know what is the expected dress, are people really riding a lift in suits and dresses ?  How long is it going to take to ferry people up and down the mountain ?

I am really going to suggest that MIL not attend, she will miss the vows, whe will hate the reception  (cause she doesn't like loud parties ) and she will wnat us to leave at the crack of dawn on Sunday to bring her home.

Oh well - I looked at the registry and it was actual very reasonable.  I like them - I do - but this whole adventure is not well thought out.

Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6 and #7 and #9
Post by: Venus193 on June 27, 2014, 09:06:31 AM
I'd love to know who thought up this idea involving ski lift chairs.  I can't see that being a good combination with people dressing for a wedding.  A wedding and reception should not be an endurance test.

If I were you, I'd decline this altogether.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6 and #7 and #9
Post by: Outdoor Girl on June 27, 2014, 09:11:39 AM
I'd wear nice walking shorts and a nice blouse, with my hiking shoes, for the the ceremony and then put on my finery for the reception.  But then, I don't have a problem with ski lifts, since I ski all winter.

And that doesn't solve the MIL problem about wanting to go back to the m/hotel early.  I wouldn't want to cut my evening short, either.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6 and #7 and #9
Post by: Twik on June 27, 2014, 09:18:18 AM
She wants people to take ski lift chairs to her wedding site?  :o Truly bizarre.

But yes, this does put an entirely different spin on MIL going. I really can't see the point of putting an elderly, frail person through a long trip when she cannot actually see the ceremony.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6 and #7
Post by: mime on June 27, 2014, 09:20:09 AM
When a ski lift is involved, I'd assume casual attire is expected. Riding a ski lift in something like a pencil skirt and pair of pumps sounds ridiculously inconvenient. The seat on the lift may not even be kind to fancy fabrics. I'd probably wear a tea-length casual dress or maxi skirt with strappy shoes that don't slide on or off.

Oh, and an aside comment related to this...
Oh well - I looked at the registry and it was actual very reasonable.  I like them - I do - but this whole adventure is not well thought out.
It is definitely possible that the B&G understood that their choices would create limits on who could and would attend, and were prepared to accept that. They could be equally surprised that MIL is being dragged along to the celebration. It sounds likely that Sally is the one insisting people push themselves beyond their comfort zone (or ability) to be there.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6 and #7
Post by: knitwicca on June 27, 2014, 01:29:20 PM
Some new information :

a) We booked lodging - it was around $200 for the night.  Check in time is actually after the start of the ceremony and the checkout is pretty early the next AM ( 10:30 )

b) It isn't a tram, it's actual ski lift chairs.  Apparently they will come to a complete stop ( unlike in ski season ).  Nope - not for me - how would I do that in dress ?  What if my shoes fell - oh wait a minute - its high in the air and my are dangling... nope nope nope. 

c) MIL is very ambivalent about going. DH is going to talk to her and Sally  closer to the date. MIL will not be able to see the ceremony, I bet she will spend 2 hours at the reception.  I want DH to tell me - who will be going back to the room with MIL when she wants to leave.  Because if it is either of us, I am not going.  I can't see the point in driving 3 to 31/2 hours, paying several hundred dollars for the room and missing the ceremony and most of the reception.

I also want to know what is the expected dress, are people really riding a lift in suits and dresses ?  How long is it going to take to ferry people up and down the mountain ?

I am really going to suggest that MIL not attend, she will miss the vows, whe will hate the reception  (cause she doesn't like loud parties ) and she will wnat us to leave at the crack of dawn on Sunday to bring her home.

Oh well - I looked at the registry and it was actual very reasonable.  I like them - I do - but this whole adventure is not well thought out.


If you decide to go...can you do a late check-in? Tell the hotel staff that you are attending a wedding and will arrive later. Often you can request a later check-out as well.
The ski-lift does not sound as if it is a possibility for you at all. Maybe you could go to the hotel, check in, relax for a bit then join the reception? Or is it also up the mountain?

As for the entire MIL issue, the OPs are right.  From your description, MIL would not enjoy herself.   It would be incredibly stressful for her, for you, for anyone helping with her care.

I believe someone above had suggested Skype for MIL to watch the ceremony.  Less stress and cost all the way around.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6 and #7 and #9
Post by: Luci on June 27, 2014, 01:58:23 PM
As for what to wear, I would wear new comfortable slacks that look kind of dressy, a comfortable but not too casual blouse, as in no T shirt or polo shirt - crepe button down? - and new black shoes that look like the shoe part of boots (SAS is my favorite brand) with black socks. Really! I could handle the ski lift, but wouldn't put my life or dignity in danger even if the darn thing stops. It's still clumsy

At best for the reception, dressier shoes (flats) and knee highs and at best a flowier top. Are you planning to redo your hair and make-up? I would, but I have crummy old lady hair.

I'm still hoping MIL will bow out. Too long a confined ride for no wedding and only dinner at the reception, and I still think she is aware of how much people go out of their way to care for her. I might even post a picture of her next to the memorial section of the reception with a nice note from her.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6 and #7 and #9
Post by: Twik on June 27, 2014, 03:13:13 PM
I'm sorry, but if I'm expected to climb on board a ski chair (not a tram) to get somewhere, I'm wearing my "we're having an outdoor adventure" garb. Hiking boots, cargo shorts and a t. Trying to get on one of those things while dressed nicely is a surrealist's dream.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6 and #7 and #9
Post by: bopper on June 27, 2014, 03:22:25 PM
a) I'll get a ton of grief about not wanting to ride the aeril tram to the top of the mountain. If that stuff starts - then I will just bypass the wedding.

"Well, I am sure everyone will have a much better time without me vomiting in the tram."
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6 and #7 and #9
Post by: POF on June 27, 2014, 03:38:24 PM
Especially on an open chair on a windy day ......   :o
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6 and #7 and #9
Post by: Venus193 on June 27, 2014, 03:47:45 PM
All I know is that attending a wedding in clothes suitable for a ski lift chair would make me very angry with the person who planned it; I actually enjoy formal clothing more than casual.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6 and #7 and #9
Post by: Winterlight on June 27, 2014, 03:55:24 PM
I don't think I'd be comfortable on a chair lift, especially if it's windy.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6 and #7 and #9
Post by: menley on June 27, 2014, 04:00:51 PM
Gosh. I don't even enjoy being on ski lifts when I go skiing. I can't imagine having to take one in wedding attire.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6 and #7 and #9
Post by: sammycat on June 27, 2014, 05:06:58 PM
This definitely sounds like one of those cases whee the bride and groom have prioritised the value of the location over the value of their guests. I wouldn't attend this at all and I'd laugh in the face of anyone who suggested I drag an elderly lady along as no one in their right mind could possibly be serious about that.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6 and #7 and #9
Post by: Venus193 on June 27, 2014, 05:08:53 PM
This definitely sounds like one of those cases whee the bride and groom have prioritised the value of the location over the value of their guests. I wouldn't attend this at all and I'd laugh in the face of anyone who suggested I drag an elderly lady along as no one in their right mind could possibly be serious about that.

I don't go looking for this sort of stuff, but could that have been planned to guarantee that nobody looks better than the bride?
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6 and #7 and #9
Post by: POF on June 27, 2014, 05:13:17 PM
This definitely sounds like one of those cases whee the bride and groom have prioritised the value of the location over the value of their guests. I wouldn't attend this at all and I'd laugh in the face of anyone who suggested I drag an elderly lady along as no one in their right mind could possibly be serious about that.

I don't go looking for this sort of stuff, but could that have been planned to guarantee that nobody looks better than the bride?

Not at all - she is actually really nice. They just like things to be NEAT and COOL and FUN and HIP and we are SPORTY and OUTDOORSY.

So the adventure type wedding does fit them and probably most of their.  Stick in the mud POF will be sick on a ski lift though. 

I will probably end up entertaining the oldsters who won't be able to go up the lift ... and you know what - I really like elderly people.  I am much better with them than I am with children.  So what I might do is arrange for afternoon tea for MIL and I and anyone else who doesn't want to go flinging up the mountain.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6 and #7 and #9
Post by: JenJay on June 27, 2014, 05:27:27 PM
This definitely sounds like one of those cases whee the bride and groom have prioritised the value of the location over the value of their guests. I wouldn't attend this at all and I'd laugh in the face of anyone who suggested I drag an elderly lady along as no one in their right mind could possibly be serious about that.

I don't go looking for this sort of stuff, but could that have been planned to guarantee that nobody looks better than the bride?

Not at all - she is actually really nice. They just like things to be NEAT and COOL and FUN and HIP and we are SPORTY and OUTDOORSY.

So the adventure type wedding does fit them and probably most of their.  Stick in the mud POF will be sick on a ski lift though. 

I will probably end up entertaining the oldsters who won't be able to go up the lift ... and you know what - I really like elderly people.  I am much better with them than I am with children.  So what I might do is arrange for afternoon tea for MIL and I and anyone else who doesn't want to go flinging up the mountain.

You are the epitome of making the best of a bad situation. And also a very kind person!
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6 and #7 and #9
Post by: kherbert05 on June 27, 2014, 05:57:15 PM
I've done the ski lift starts and stops so people can get on and off without snow to glide away on. It was only us (Sis, BIL, Baby Loren, and me) and part way up they stopped for another group to get on. Frankly I was terrified when it stopped. I don't like heights when I'm not in control, and white knuckled it when we stopped part way  up. I would have been close to panic if it was stop every chair to get people on and off - because I felt like I was going to pitch off with the 2 stops we made. I also hate farris wheels for the same reason.  I couldn't scramble away fast enough when we got to the top - and I was in shorts and sneakers.

Also how are they expecting people to get down? Lifts aren't made for getting on and going down. On our trip the idea was to take the lift up and hike down. The hike down was great - I loved it but after a wedding and in a large group would be different - especially if it is getting toward dark.

My cousin got married on our farm. I wore smart looking pants and a very dressy tip with practical loafers. Even the most proper in the family didn't say a word. Honestly those who had been there before had sneakers in their cars and most changed by the time the sun started going down.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6 and #7 and #9
Post by: Clockwork Banana on June 27, 2014, 05:57:29 PM
The check-in time at the hotel being after the start of the ceremony creates even more logistical problems.

After one drives the three/four hours, one will not be able to check in/freshen up etc. before having to set out for the celebrations.

I would think that that would be something that a good planner would address - make arrangements with the hotel to provide earlier check-in for this special event.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6 and #7 and #9
Post by: POF on June 27, 2014, 06:08:19 PM
Yeah -  I really do not know what I plan to do about freshening up.  Hopefully not in the hotel lobby - but that is what I think will happen.

We could have booked the room for Friday night and came up on Friday / early Saturday - but then I am $$$  into this wedding. 

I am sure there was no planner involved - because it is a bit disorganized.  As far as getting down the hill..... DH tells me he is going down on the alpine slide and if the ceremony runs late - he is leaving to do it anyway   ::).  Plus in mid October - it will start getting dark early and cold. Ceremony is late afternoon, maybe lasting 45 minutes, then I don't know - I bet it takes a long time to get people on and off the lift thing ... so they may be pushing darkness. 

I will stay in the nice warm bar and drink tea ( with a shot of something ) - and I will get us all checked in for the room. 

The thing with this family is that will have great ideas.... but they don't think through the logistics. it will just be "fine". 
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6 and #7
Post by: Curly Wurly Doggie Breath on June 27, 2014, 06:25:57 PM
We're assigning some pretty mean traits to this couple and then blowing them all up when we talk about "hikes" and "base jumping" when really, the main concern here seems to be the gondola/train. Not the "hike".

Yikes. I was just kidding about the BASE jumping.

Well at least OP could tell Sally to go jump off a cliff........... without being rude :D
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6 and #7 and #9
Post by: CakeEater on June 27, 2014, 06:33:26 PM
I don't think I'd be comfortable on a chair lift, especially if it's windy.

And especially if they're stopping the lift every 10 metres to get that lot of people off. Jerk, stop swing around, go for 10 metres, jerk stop swing around etc for however many chairs of people there are.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6 and #7 and #9
Post by: Curly Wurly Doggie Breath on June 27, 2014, 06:40:02 PM
I agree POF is the nicest people i ever had the pleasure to meet online  :-*
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6 and #7 and #9
Post by: POF on June 27, 2014, 07:16:15 PM
Well thanks ! That is very nice. I am a much better person due to the great role models here at EH !
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6 and #7 and #9
Post by: greencat on June 27, 2014, 07:41:56 PM
Yeah -  I really do not know what I plan to do about freshening up.  Hopefully not in the hotel lobby - but that is what I think will happen.

We could have booked the room for Friday night and came up on Friday / early Saturday - but then I am $$$  into this wedding. 

I am sure there was no planner involved - because it is a bit disorganized.  As far as getting down the hill..... DH tells me he is going down on the alpine slide and if the ceremony runs late - he is leaving to do it anyway   ::).  Plus in mid October - it will start getting dark early and cold. Ceremony is late afternoon, maybe lasting 45 minutes, then I don't know - I bet it takes a long time to get people on and off the lift thing ... so they may be pushing darkness. 

I will stay in the nice warm bar and drink tea ( with a shot of something ) - and I will get us all checked in for the room. 

The thing with this family is that will have great ideas.... but they don't think through the logistics. it will just be "fine".

I foresee either a wedding remembered for serious logistical problems or one that has the logistics changed before the wedding date.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6 and #7 and #9
Post by: AngelicGamer on June 27, 2014, 08:15:10 PM
Yeah -  I really do not know what I plan to do about freshening up.  Hopefully not in the hotel lobby - but that is what I think will happen.

We could have booked the room for Friday night and came up on Friday / early Saturday - but then I am $$$  into this wedding. 

I am sure there was no planner involved - because it is a bit disorganized.  As far as getting down the hill..... DH tells me he is going down on the alpine slide and if the ceremony runs late - he is leaving to do it anyway   ::).  Plus in mid October - it will start getting dark early and cold. Ceremony is late afternoon, maybe lasting 45 minutes, then I don't know - I bet it takes a long time to get people on and off the lift thing ... so they may be pushing darkness. 

I will stay in the nice warm bar and drink tea ( with a shot of something ) - and I will get us all checked in for the room. 

The thing with this family is that will have great ideas.... but they don't think through the logistics. it will just be "fine".

I foresee either a wedding remembered for serious logistical problems or one that has the logistics changed before the wedding date.

POD.  Double so if it starts snowing.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6 and #7 and #9
Post by: gmatoy on June 27, 2014, 10:00:06 PM
Shucky darn! I just realized that we all have to wait until October to hear how this works out in real life! (Did I mention that I'm not good at waiting?)
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6 and #7 and #9
Post by: Precarious Armada on June 28, 2014, 05:42:53 AM
At least there's lots of time to make virtual popcorn.

I wonder if the happy couple would have friends who would be willing to organise a skype session for the mobility-impaired group so that they can still watch the wedding at the afternoon tea? Rustle up several Ipads/similar devices? That way, POF and co can still 'attend', even if it's from several km away :)
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6 and #7 and #9
Post by: Venus193 on June 28, 2014, 05:50:23 AM
POF, I still think there is an element of selfishness in the planning of this wedding.  How many others can manage the walk down from that hill?  How many of the guests are elderly?

I don't qualify as elderly but I'd never manage that walk down with my bad knees.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6 and #7 and #9
Post by: camlan on June 28, 2014, 07:56:35 AM
About the ski lift--I attended a wedding where the reception was at a restaurant at a ski area. The bride and groom were Olympic/professional skiers. The restaurant was up on the side of the mountain.

The ski lift was the main way of getting there. There was a bus for those who didn't want to use the ski lift, but it only ran up the mountain once or twice.

I had never been on a ski lift before. We were all dressed up, with dresses and heels.

It was fun. The groom's brothers were stationed at the top of the ski lift to help people scramble off. They did stop the lift when the bride reached the top, as getting off with her train and heels would have been a bit tricky, plus the bride and groom had packed most of their attendants (all their nieces and nephews, ages 3-7) into the lift with them.

No problems with skirts billowing up. No one lost their shoes. And because it was October, the foliage was fantastic.

But the key thing, I think, is that there was an alternative to the ski lift.

And I have a great picture of the bride and groom and all the kids in their seat on the lift, with the train of the wedding gown floating in the air, and all the reds and oranges of the trees under them.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6 and #7 and #9
Post by: Minmom3 on June 28, 2014, 10:01:45 AM
That sounds really pretty, Camlan!  Love to have seen that!
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6 and #7 and #9
Post by: wyliefool on July 02, 2014, 07:34:27 AM
Shucky darn! I just realized that we all have to wait until October to hear how this works out in real life! (Did I mention that I'm not good at waiting?)

Many ski areas already have snow in Oct. That'll be interesting.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6 and #7 and #9
Post by: Twik on July 02, 2014, 11:06:13 AM
Shucky darn! I just realized that we all have to wait until October to hear how this works out in real life! (Did I mention that I'm not good at waiting?)

Many ski areas already have snow in Oct. That'll be interesting.

Very interesting. Because places that don't get snow early tend, for some strange reason, not to get developed as ski hills.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6 and #7 and #9
Post by: Winterlight on July 02, 2014, 03:22:13 PM
I don't think I'd be comfortable on a chair lift, especially if it's windy.

And especially if they're stopping the lift every 10 metres to get that lot of people off. Jerk, stop swing around, go for 10 metres, jerk stop swing around etc for however many chairs of people there are.

Oh, dear, I hadn't even considered that. I'd probably panic. I don't do heights at the best of times, and stop and go like that? I'd need a sedative.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6 and #7 and #9
Post by: MrTango on July 10, 2014, 04:18:03 PM
Shucky darn! I just realized that we all have to wait until October to hear how this works out in real life! (Did I mention that I'm not good at waiting?)

Many ski areas already have snow in Oct. That'll be interesting.

Very interesting. Because places that don't get snow early tend, for some strange reason, not to get developed as ski hills.

Oh, my.  I can just imagine people in formal attire riding a chair lift in October in the mountains.  Formal attire, especially for women, tends not to do much to keep out the cold.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6 and #7 and #9
Post by: Arila on July 10, 2014, 05:02:51 PM
Oh, my.  I can just imagine people in formal attire riding a chair lift in October in the mountains.  Formal attire, especially for women, tends not to do much to keep out the cold.

This is why men's attire has several layers (and pockets). To make up for such short comings. :D
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6 and #7 and #9
Post by: dawbs on July 10, 2014, 05:04:35 PM
I've done the ski lift starts and stops so people can get on and off without snow to glide away on. It was only us (Sis, BIL, Baby Loren, and me) and part way up they stopped for another group to get on. Frankly I was terrified when it stopped. I don't like heights when I'm not in control, and white knuckled it when we stopped part way  up. I would have been close to panic if it was stop every chair to get people on and off - because I felt like I was going to pitch off with the 2 stops we made. *snip*

Yes--I don't mind ski lifts much, but the moment they stop, I am saying all sorts of bad words as I squinch my eyes close, because not only does it feel like inertia is going to propel you off the lift (because there isn't a safety belt), it makes you acutely aware that every bit of movement is just the chair going back and forth, you can't justify it by telling yourself "oh, it's just because we're going, yay, we'll be at the top in a minute)

I really (mostly) dont' mind ski lifts--I don't love them, but I keep my head and do OK.  I just want to breathe into a bag and flail my arms when they stop them.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6 and #7 and #9
Post by: POF on October 19, 2014, 01:25:48 PM
I had to read through all the posts before I updated, just ot refresh myself on the conversations. 

Good

** MIL decided not to attend and this was really the correct decision.  The venue ( being a ski lodge ) was really not accessible.  Lots of stairs, inconvenient elevators, plus really out in the wilderness - so nothing close for a medical emergency.

** Venue was nice, ceremony had to be held inside instead of mountain top ( CRUD MONKEYS! - was the hill with the ski lifts steep ! made me queasy to look at it ).  Organizers were organized and event ran smoothly. Room was small and acoustics were bad and we were kind of crowded in ... but it worked fine.

** Reception venue was nice and ran very smoothly. Food was delicious, served hot. Appetizer table was really elegant. Cake was fabulous !

**  It was really nice to see family members and cousins that live far away.  I was touched when my 2 nephews said I was their favorite aunt and my 20 something very smart very well educated niece told me that I was one of the strongest women she knew and that that I have great taste in books.

** My sons were the most handsome guys there.  ( OK - maybe I have a bit of prejudice ! )

** LHS is widowed, and I tried to take that into consideration with her controlling things,  We did spend time with her after the reception and it made her happy.

Not so Good

** Bride is from a fundamentalist/ conservative southern denomination.  Hometown minister preached for 40 minutes, on very conservative texts regarding alternative lifestyles ( negatively )  and the submissive role of women in a marriage.  Bride and her family seemed delighted with the service. Many people were appalled.  I have 2 gay nephews ( cousins to the groom ) one is out with a partner , one is not out.  Apparently the one nephew was not given a plus one - because his lifestyle might offend the conservatives.  I guess everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but this was awkward.

** We ( grooms extended family ) were shunted to the back of the reception.  Bride and groom never visited our table, Grooms siblings never came over to say hello to the extended family. I went over to say hello, but was rudely brushed off because they were part of the wedding party and were "busy" " I can't talk to you I have to go over here " Well OK - but this was after all the formalities had ended.

** MOB wore a white lace tight short dress.... super odd.

But overall - it was definitely the brides wedding and little to no acknowledgement of the grooms family. ( Maybe that's how weddings turn out usually )



 




Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - wedding update #12
Post by: ladyknight1 on October 19, 2014, 01:34:08 PM
Oh my goodness. Sounds like the brides family has no use for the grooms and isn't that sad!
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - small update page #6 and #7 and #9
Post by: Tea Drinker on October 19, 2014, 01:41:30 PM
I had to read through all the posts before I updated, just ot refresh myself on the conversations. 

(snip for length)

** We ( grooms extended family ) were shunted to the back of the reception.  Bride and groom never visited our table, Grooms siblings never came over to say hello to the extended family. I went over to say hello, but was rudely brushed off because they were part of the wedding party and were "busy" " I can't talk to you I have to go over here " Well OK - but this was after all the formalities had ended.

** MOB wore a white lace tight short dress.... super odd.

But overall - it was definitely the brides wedding and little to no acknowledgement of the grooms family. ( Maybe that's how weddings turn out usually )

Not in my experience: the bride's family is often more involved in planning, venue choice, etc., but if there's a "bride's family here, groom's family there" it's more likely to be for the ceremony, and it's generally one family on the left and the other on the right, not front/back.

I'm not saying it doesn't happen that way, just that it isn't how weddings usually turn out.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - wedding update #12
Post by: Mergatroyd on October 19, 2014, 01:43:21 PM
Mayb because the grooms family isn't part of that religion? I don't know. It would be interesting to hear from the groomsman that had to be somewhere else what he thought of it.

Why invite people if you're not going to allow anyone to talk to them?
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - wedding update #12
Post by: lakey on October 19, 2014, 02:22:51 PM
Quote
Mayb because the grooms family isn't part of that religion? I don't know. It would be interesting to hear from the groomsman that had to be somewhere else what he thought of it.

Why invite people if you're not going to allow anyone to talk to them?

I doubt it. I grew up in as a Catholic in an area where a significant proportion of the population are fundamentalist protestants and social conservatives. I've never heard of people being seated in the church or the reception according to whether they belong to the same religion as the host church. And as I've said, a lot of the people in my area are social conservatives because of their religious beliefs. Yet, I've never heard of controversial issues  being brought up during a wedding sermon. Most people, whatever their religion and personal views, have the good taste to not make guests feel awkward. I feel bad for your nephews.

If the groom's extended family was seated to the back, and the bride's extended family was seated toward the front, it was probably due to the bride and her family being poor hosts with no manners.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - wedding update #12
Post by: Library Dragon on October 19, 2014, 02:32:03 PM
Quote
Mayb because the grooms family isn't part of that religion? I don't know. It would be interesting to hear from the groomsman that had to be somewhere else what he thought of it.

Why invite people if you're not going to allow anyone to talk to them?

I doubt it. I grew up in as a Catholic in an area where a significant proportion of the population are fundamentalist protestants and social conservatives. I've never heard of people being seated in the church or the reception according to whether they belong to the same religion as the host church. And as I've said, a lot of the people in my area are social conservatives because of their religious beliefs. Yet, I've never heard of controversial issues  being brought up during a wedding sermon. Most people, whatever their religion and personal views, have the good taste to not make guests feel awkward. I feel bad for your nephews.

If the groom's extended family was seated to the back, and the bride's extended family was seated toward the front, it was probably due to the bride and her family being poor hosts with no manners.

Like you we're minority in the state (when we moved here Catholics were 2.5% of the population and now we're up to 3%).  I've always seen the left-right arrangement in other churches. 

Unfortunately I've seen and heard of the minister using the time to beat the drum.  DS1 came home from his friends' wedding.  The HC had been living together prior and pastor of the bride's family preached for 20 minutes on the sins of living together. 
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - wedding update #12
Post by: camlan on October 19, 2014, 07:27:45 PM
Quote
Bride is from a fundamentalist/ conservative southern denomination.  Hometown minister preached for 40 minutes, on very conservative texts regarding alternative lifestyles ( negatively )  and the submissive role of women in a marriage.

One of my cousins married a lovely young lady from a very conservative religion. The wedding was at her church and the minister must have preached for an hour, mostly on the topic of wives submitting to their husbands.

I was seated in a pew with several of my female cousins, and almost died of embarrassment when they all started giggling at one particularly strange example that the preacher gave. At least no one laughed out loud, but still . . . they should have been able to hold it together a bit better.

The rest of the sermon was about how anyone not of their religion was doomed to hellfire. That got giggles from some of the *aunts*.

Turns out the lovely young lady had bowed to parental pressure to have the wedding in that church, and she has apparently ignored every bit of the advice showered down upon us all during the wedding. They're celebrating their 20th anniversary this year. ;D
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - wedding update #12
Post by: POF on October 19, 2014, 07:51:01 PM
Quote
Bride is from a fundamentalist/ conservative southern denomination.  Hometown minister preached for 40 minutes, on very conservative texts regarding alternative lifestyles ( negatively )  and the submissive role of women in a marriage.

One of my cousins married a lovely young lady from a very conservative religion. The wedding was at her church and the minister must have preached for an hour, mostly on the topic of wives submitting to their husbands.

I was seated in a pew with several of my female cousins, and almost died of embarrassment when they all started giggling at one particularly strange example that the preacher gave. At least no one laughed out loud, but still . . . they should have been able to hold it together a bit better.

The rest of the sermon was about how anyone not of their religion was doomed to hellfire. That got giggles from some of the *aunts*.

Turns out the lovely young lady had bowed to parental pressure to have the wedding in that church, and she has apparently ignored every bit of the advice showered down upon us all during the wedding. They're celebrating their 20th anniversary this year. ;D

I was kind of surprised. it didn't really seem like the bride that I had met on several occasions.  Given that the minister really really brought up the southern vs. northern  ( and really it was more religion 1 vs. religion 2 ) during the sermon - it was just odd.

he also started off with here is what is wrong with marriages ..... which felt like a criticism of anyone who;s life was different.  I do think it was highly influenced by the brides family.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - wedding update #12
Post by: nuit93 on October 20, 2014, 12:02:45 AM
Quote
Mayb because the grooms family isn't part of that religion? I don't know. It would be interesting to hear from the groomsman that had to be somewhere else what he thought of it.

Why invite people if you're not going to allow anyone to talk to them?

I doubt it. I grew up in as a Catholic in an area where a significant proportion of the population are fundamentalist protestants and social conservatives. I've never heard of people being seated in the church or the reception according to whether they belong to the same religion as the host church. And as I've said, a lot of the people in my area are social conservatives because of their religious beliefs. Yet, I've never heard of controversial issues  being brought up during a wedding sermon. Most people, whatever their religion and personal views, have the good taste to not make guests feel awkward.

Ohhhh, I have!

I darn near walked out of my stepsister's wedding for that very reason--the officiant would not stop talking about female submission and its importance in marriage.  Lectures like that were apparently pretty normal in their wedding services, and 98% of those present at SS's wedding were nodding along in agreement.

My middle sister married a few years ago, and deliberately chose to be married by an officiant of her husband's church instead of the one she'd attended since she was a teenager because they also taught the same views, and a wedding service would have been guaranteed to include a brutal verbal attack on those who did not follow their 'traditional' values.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - wedding update #12
Post by: POF on October 20, 2014, 06:24:01 AM
I also want to clarify that the groomsman was my nephew - who just neglected to come over and speak to the other members of the family and when I approached him ... he was too busy/important to talk to me ( this is kind of in character ).

Reception area was shaped like an oval.  main events in the center, wedding party and brides family and couples friends were front and center.  Grooms family was at far end of the oval. Seemed a bit unbalanced that there were 2 tables of us - but both tables were at the far reaches of the event, ( this had nothing to do with religion )
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - wedding update #12
Post by: CakeEater on October 20, 2014, 08:16:17 AM
Quote
Bride is from a fundamentalist/ conservative southern denomination.  Hometown minister preached for 40 minutes, on very conservative texts regarding alternative lifestyles ( negatively )  and the submissive role of women in a marriage.

One of my cousins married a lovely young lady from a very conservative religion. The wedding was at her church and the minister must have preached for an hour, mostly on the topic of wives submitting to their husbands.

I was seated in a pew with several of my female cousins, and almost died of embarrassment when they all started giggling at one particularly strange example that the preacher gave. At least no one laughed out loud, but still . . . they should have been able to hold it together a bit better.

You can't do that and then not tell us what the example was!

Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - wedding update #12
Post by: rigs32 on October 20, 2014, 12:07:28 PM


I was seated in a pew with several of my female cousins, and almost died of embarrassment when they all started giggling at one particularly strange example that the preacher gave. At least no one laughed out loud, but still . . . they should have been able to hold it together a bit better.


Clearly it would be rude to laugh audibly or heckle, but as a guest I don't think I'd be required to sit in silence and take it.  If I were at that wedding, I would have quietly excused myself and waited for the HC outside the church.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - wedding update #12
Post by: Josiepug on October 20, 2014, 12:35:58 PM
I play a lot of weddings in the deep south. As in 2-3 a month for the past 20 years. I've only ever been to two weddings that devolved into a sermon by the preacher on odd topics. One was about scrabble before marriage and the other was about the wife being submissive. Talk about awkward. The weird things was that the bride in the submissive marriage ceremony was a complete jerk during the reception. She had nodded along during the ceremony and then spent the entire reception yelling at the groom, her parents, the caterers and the musicians. Very odd yet memorable.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - wedding update #12
Post by: DanaJ on October 20, 2014, 01:20:55 PM
I was seated in a pew with several of my female cousins, and almost died of embarrassment when they all started giggling at one particularly strange example that the preacher gave. At least no one laughed out loud, but still . . . they should have been able to hold it together a bit better.

You'd think, but there can be a point where things do get ridiculous. My great uncle, a widower, met his second wife in an assisted living facility (it was like a nice condo that happened to have a cafeteria and emergency medical staff, rather than a traditional nursing home). He and his new bride got married in her childhood church, but the priest her family had known was long dead. His replacement was in his 50s a good 20-25 years younger than the bride and groom.

The bulk of his overly long sermon was about how marriage was for procreation. On and on and on and on about being fertile and multiplying. By the time he said something alng the lines of "marriage, cannot be separated from the possibility of procreation, as it would not be a true picture of God and God's love" the bride and groom, 77 and 74 respectively, were barely able to contain their own giggles. So the wrinkley, silver-haired HC were standing there shaking trying to hold in their laughter, and my great aunt (maid of honor and sister to the groom) had to stand there with her legs crossed, half bent over because she was straining so hard to keep a straight face that she thought she was going to pee herself.

It was truthfully, the most unforgettable wedding sermon I have ever seen. Several people thought it was a deliberate prank on the guests.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - wedding update #12
Post by: NFPwife on October 20, 2014, 01:36:44 PM
POF - overall, it sounds like it was a very lovely event and you had a nice time. I'm glad for you.

I play a lot of weddings in the deep south. As in 2-3 a month for the past 20 years. I've only ever been to two weddings that devolved into a sermon by the preacher on odd topics. One was about scrabble before marriage and the other was about the wife being submissive. Talk about awkward. The weird things was that the bride in the submissive marriage ceremony was a complete jerk during the reception. She had nodded along during the ceremony and then spent the entire reception yelling at the groom, her parents, the caterers and the musicians. Very odd yet memorable.

For the submissive example - I wonder if the minister had seen the same earlier and decided he had a "bully pulpit" to make a point to the bride??

I've was present for a very interesting funeral service. Not only did the preacher say that everyone who hadn't been "saved" was going to hell, he put the mother of the deceased on the spot about whether she was "saved." He also mentioned that he knew mu uncle from their "drinking days" and then said he (preacher) had cleaned up his act. Implying (and maybe even outright saying) that my uncle had not. He also noted that my aunt was a great cook and loved to eat, a lovely compliment, until he linked how that didn't help with her diabetes. She died of complication of her diabetes. I whispered to DH, "Did he just blame her for her death, at her funeral??" My dad was really upset by that part. To his credit, the preacher didn't let the "unsaved" leave going to hell. He had everyone do a salvation prayer at the funeral.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - wedding update #12
Post by: LadyL on October 20, 2014, 01:53:33 PM
I have mentioned before that I attended a ceremony in a conservative evangelical church in which the sermon was summarized by the acronym "K.I.S.S." I don't remember what K and I stood for, but I definitely remember the S's: Shame and Suffering, the consequences the couple would face if they forsake their marriage vows and chose to divorce. Yep, the pastor mentioned the d-word during a wedding ceremony. I though it was in really poor taste. How little esteem must they have for the convictions of their congregants if they feel they need to remind them of the consquences of divorce while they are getting married?
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - wedding update #12
Post by: POF on October 20, 2014, 02:22:46 PM
I am an adoptive parent, medically I was unable to have a child.  This pastor also started in that the purpose of marriage is procreation.  Even now - 20 years after finding out I was infertile, it bothered me to hear that.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - wedding update #12
Post by: NFPwife on October 20, 2014, 02:35:10 PM
I am an adoptive parent, medically I was unable to have a child.  This pastor also started in that the purpose of marriage is procreation.  Even now - 20 years after finding out I was infertile, it bothered me to hear that.

I'm so sorry you had to endure that. Hugs.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - wedding update #12
Post by: POF on October 20, 2014, 03:08:26 PM
The good thing is that LHS was pretty well behaved - and she looked lovely. Her dress was stunning and appropriate.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - wedding update #12
Post by: scansons on October 21, 2014, 04:21:31 PM
See, I keep telling my husband that he his 12 minute sermons should be an advertising point.  I think this thread more than bears me out.

Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - wedding update #12
Post by: POF on October 21, 2014, 06:28:04 PM
Yes it is an advertising point.  We had a wonderful priest once who had very short and to the point sermons.  Plus he would teach us a few words of porteguese
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - wedding update #12
Post by: Outdoor Girl on October 21, 2014, 06:31:29 PM
Reminds me of a story my Mom told.  A relative of hers was a minister.  When he visited Mom's hometown, when she was a kid, he'd often be asked to preach.  He showed up one time and looked up.  'Huh.  You've taken down the clock.  I guess I'll just talk until I run out of things to say.'  He got going and was going for quite a while.  Mom and her cousins figured he'd talked enough and all of them held up their watches!   ;D

Man, if I'd pulled that stunt, I'd have never heard the end of it.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - wedding update #12
Post by: HorseFreak on October 21, 2014, 06:39:34 PM
A Catholic ex-BF of mine once asked me where atheists got married. He was completely serious when he asked, "Is there an atheist church?" I told him, "Wherever they want." He was mystified. His brother got married at an outside venue with a minister who included several faiths into the ceremony which I imagine blew his mind.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - wedding update #12
Post by: kherbert05 on October 21, 2014, 06:59:49 PM
A Catholic ex-BF of mine once asked me where atheists got married. He was completely serious when he asked, "Is there an atheist church?" I told him, "Wherever they want." He was mystified. His brother got married at an outside venue with a minister who included several faiths into the ceremony which I imagine blew his mind.
I do NOT believe the following but  have run into this idea before.

He may have been taught that if the wedding was not sanctified by an acceptable (to the speaker) member of clergy there was no marriage and the couple is living in sin. I have heard this argument before, but Catholics are usually outsiders to people making this argument. I disengage and quietly walk away from these people and stay far away.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - wedding update #12
Post by: greencat on October 21, 2014, 07:06:29 PM
A Catholic ex-BF of mine once asked me where atheists got married. He was completely serious when he asked, "Is there an atheist church?" I told him, "Wherever they want." He was mystified. His brother got married at an outside venue with a minister who included several faiths into the ceremony which I imagine blew his mind.
I do NOT believe the following but  have run into this idea before.

He may have been taught that if the wedding was not sanctified by an acceptable (to the speaker) member of clergy there was no marriage and the couple is living in sin. I have heard this argument before, but Catholics are usually outsiders to people making this argument. I disengage and quietly walk away from these people and stay far away.

I've run into many strange misconceptions about atheism from people who were raised in many different Christian sects.  The things some of the clergy preach to their congregations about atheism are hateful and small-minded at worst, and extremely misguided at best.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - wedding update #12
Post by: HorseFreak on October 21, 2014, 07:58:49 PM
A Catholic ex-BF of mine once asked me where atheists got married. He was completely serious when he asked, "Is there an atheist church?" I told him, "Wherever they want." He was mystified. His brother got married at an outside venue with a minister who included several faiths into the ceremony which I imagine blew his mind.
I do NOT believe the following but  have run into this idea before.

He may have been taught that if the wedding was not sanctified by an acceptable (to the speaker) member of clergy there was no marriage and the couple is living in sin. I have heard this argument before, but Catholics are usually outsiders to people making this argument. I disengage and quietly walk away from these people and stay far away.

He honestly just didn't know you COULD get married outside of a church. He got really excited when informed otherwise.  I have nothing bad to say about the guy at all, he was pretty much a Sunday-Only Catholic and we considered getting married before we broke up over whether or not to have kids. I'm 99% sure he got married at an outside venue himself.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - wedding update #12
Post by: FauxFoodist on October 21, 2014, 08:05:57 PM
I've run into many strange misconceptions about atheism from people who were raised in many different Christian sects.  The things some of the clergy preach to their congregations about atheism religion are hateful and small-minded at worst, and extremely misguided at best.

I've run into the same from some atheists and trying to engage in a rational discussion or agree to disagree has not worked (one person was the friend of a friend and was an FB friend; I defriended him after that when I realized how hateful and small-minded he truly was).  The hateful and small-minded are not limited to one side or one group, I'm afraid (Wouldn't life be easier if they were?  They'd be so much easier to avoid!).

Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - wedding update #12
Post by: greencat on October 21, 2014, 08:25:14 PM
I've run into many strange misconceptions about atheism from people who were raised in many different Christian sects.  The things some of the clergy preach to their congregations about atheism religion are hateful and small-minded at worst, and extremely misguided at best.

I've run into the same from some atheists and trying to engage in a rational discussion or agree to disagree has not worked (one person was the friend of a friend and was an FB friend; I defriended him after that when I realized how hateful and small-minded he truly was).  The hateful and small-minded are not limited to one side or one group, I'm afraid (Wouldn't life be easier if they were?  They'd be so much easier to avoid!).

Those same clergy members did often preach bad things about other religious groups, not just atheism.  Their preaching, generally, seems to be a message of group cohesion by banding together against outsiders, rather than the improving of oneself through faith. 
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - wedding update #12
Post by: FauxFoodist on October 21, 2014, 09:16:48 PM
I've run into many strange misconceptions about atheism from people who were raised in many different Christian sects.  The things some of the clergy preach to their congregations about atheism religion are hateful and small-minded at worst, and extremely misguided at best.

I've run into the same from some atheists and trying to engage in a rational discussion or agree to disagree has not worked (one person was the friend of a friend and was an FB friend; I defriended him after that when I realized how hateful and small-minded he truly was).  The hateful and small-minded are not limited to one side or one group, I'm afraid (Wouldn't life be easier if they were?  They'd be so much easier to avoid!).

Those same clergy members did often preach bad things about other religious groups, not just atheism.  Their preaching, generally, seems to be a message of group cohesion by banding together against outsiders, rather than the improving of oneself through faith.

That reminds me of a Catholic I know.  She decided I was not a very good person and didn't really want to know me because I wouldn't join her in feeling that non-Catholic Christians are a bad sort (I was in a bible study founded by Protestants and refused to accept her diatribe about how bad Protestants are and that I was being led astray being part of this bible study; the thing is that while I, ultimately, enjoyed the spiritual support I got from fellowship, I joined the bible study for intellectual reasons as I really had just wanted to study the bible).  Guess she changed her mind as we get along fine now (but I still refuse to rail against others Christians, never mind others as a group, just because their belief systems/viewpoints are different from mine).  Hell, even Catholics she and DH know are divided against each other because some are die-hard "traddies" (the Latin Mass enthusiasts) while others are more contemporary Catholics.  I just shake my head mentally and stay out of it.  I figure there are people who just need something to hate others about (rather than, as you point out, improve themselves through their faith).

Sorry, POF, I just realized we're getting way side-tracked here.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - wedding update #12
Post by: nolechica on October 21, 2014, 11:32:15 PM
A Catholic ex-BF of mine once asked me where atheists got married. He was completely serious when he asked, "Is there an atheist church?" I told him, "Wherever they want." He was mystified. His brother got married at an outside venue with a minister who included several faiths into the ceremony which I imagine blew his mind.
I do NOT believe the following but  have run into this idea before.

He may have been taught that if the wedding was not sanctified by an acceptable (to the speaker) member of clergy there was no marriage and the couple is living in sin. I have heard this argument before, but Catholics are usually outsiders to people making this argument. I disengage and quietly walk away from these people and stay far away.

I've run into many strange misconceptions about atheism from people who were raised in many different Christian sects.  The things some of the clergy preach to their congregations about atheism are hateful and small-minded at worst, and extremely misguided at best.

Yep and the etiquette of how to handle people raised that way is sticky.  This thread and the bridal shower thread reminded me why I don't much like either of those events anymore.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - wedding update #12
Post by: Venus193 on October 22, 2014, 06:02:03 AM
I'm not a mod but let's not go any further down this path.  I don't want to see this thread get locked.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - wedding update #12
Post by: zyrs on October 22, 2014, 06:48:19 AM
I'm glad the wedding went well.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - wedding update #12
Post by: JoyinVirginia on October 22, 2014, 07:21:24 AM
Pof, thank you so much for the update! It sounds like a very wise decision of mil to not attend.
How nice lake house sally and you and your family were just able to enjoy the event, without worrying about your mil and getting her all around the venue.
Title: Re: Lakehouse Sally and an upcoming wedding - wedding update #12
Post by: POF on October 22, 2014, 08:41:57 AM
Pof, thank you so much for the update! It sounds like a very wise decision of mil to not attend.
How nice lake house sally and you and your family were just able to enjoy the event, without worrying about your mil and getting her all around the venue.

Thanks - it was a big burden off our shoulders.  The venue while lovely was a ski resort and not really accessible ( it was - but not conveniently ).   We are planning to bring MIL down to our house this weekend to have brunch with just the 4 of us.  She enjoys my cooking and for a very tiny elderly lady - she can pack it away when she wants to .  I love to see the boys dote over her.  She told me she enjoys small easy "non-events" more than big shindigs.