Author Topic: Schenanigans?  (Read 28667 times)

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strangetimes

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Re: Schenanigans?
« Reply #30 on: September 11, 2011, 05:14:27 AM »
Sometimes it is glaringly apparent that a post or story is a creative writing exercise rather than a true happening. I understand that calling it out is frowned upon and I will not do that but I'm curious: are fake stories that are represented as true no big deal or is that something that is unwanted too?

How do you know a story is "glaringly apparent" that it is fiction?  I've published some extraordinarily outrageous stories in prior books that would leave the reader questioning the storytellers' credibility but I have signed documents verifying the authenticity of the events.  Absolutely nothing surprises me anymore.  The thread you are obliquely referring to in this thread doesn't come close to fantastically unbelievable when compared to real life stories that are far more bizarre.

And what if it was fiction?  Can you not extract the etiquette (or lack thereof)  of the tale as  a learning experience?

A handful of members were placed on 14 day gag for their behavior in that thread and several others *just* barely missed moderation.   Several of the newly gagged already had a record of prior gags for similar behavior which means that following someone else's lead in a thread can be a very bad idea as they may be a troublemaker with a history on this forum or a troll trying to get as many people in trouble as possible (they know they are going bye-bye and they'll try to take as many with them as they can).

Is there a way for us to hear about that? Like maybe a moderator stepping into a thread and giving a warning?

I was going through that thread and feeling like it was sounding a little "mean girls" to me, but had you not said this, I wouldn't have known that people were being moderated and even put on hiatus for that.

I've often considered asking posters about situations from my own life, but I hesitate to do that, because I'm afraid of precisely these types of reactions. (I lurked here for a long time before registering, so this isn't just a recent thought)

I feel like I've seen the mods address this before, but I can't remember where. I know there are arguments against it (it lends more attention to the malefactors, it has an air of public stoning to it...) but while I don't need to know that someone has been gagged, I do feel a note saying, "blah blah blah is not acceptable forum behavior" would be useful so users will know that it's been addressed and can learn from the experience. YMMV.

Your suggestion sounds better than mine- I think it would give posters a heads up that the  behaviour is unacceptable, so they don't get caught up in it themselves and it would also keep the forum feeling a little more civi

Hollanda

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Re: Schenanigans?
« Reply #31 on: September 11, 2011, 05:39:07 AM »
Can I ask a question please, without seeming out of line? I have noticed that some of the posts I have made have been picked apart and scrutinized. Possibly, it was the way I worded things, but in the past (not so much recently), but I felt that I was "under suspicion" for something. I don't want to appear rude, but surely there is a difference between asking pertinent questions and constantly questioning a post just because of a phrase used that may be misinterpreted? Is it fair for a new poster to be quoted time and time again, with one line in bold, questioning "what that means" and being made to feel like a SS through a difference of opinion or difference of culture (if what happened took place in another country)?
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Spoder

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Re: Schenanigans?
« Reply #32 on: September 11, 2011, 06:03:32 AM »
Well, it doesn't sound fair to me, but then again I'm getting confused by this whole thread! Would it be possible to be more specific about what you said that has been  picked apart, Hollanda?

Hollanda

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Re: Schenanigans?
« Reply #33 on: September 11, 2011, 06:13:05 AM »
Well, it doesn't sound fair to me, but then again I'm getting confused by this whole thread! Would it be possible to be more specific about what you said that has been  picked apart, Hollanda?

Sure! :) Ok, there was one yesterday which is a pretty good example. Discussing pregnancy (which was an issue in the post) and I stated I don't like being unnecessarily barged into or barged past.  Maybe my wording on that was not great, but after trying to explain what I meant three or four times, I became a little frustrated until a long-time poster came to my rescue and suggested to others what I may actually mean (which was correct BTW!). There were also other posts previously in which my wording was questioned several times. I appreciate I am from the UK and maybe we do things differently over here, and I appreciate my wording sometimes is not altogether clear. I am  willing to explain myself further when the need arises, but I did feel a little "criticized".

Maybe I am just being a little sensitive at the moment!!
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Joeschmo

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Re: Schenanigans?
« Reply #34 on: September 11, 2011, 07:23:44 AM »
Hollanda I saw the post you're referencing and thought the questioning of you was a little extreme. I love reading the board but rarely post because unless it's in the off topic boards I usually end up feeling like a jerk.
 I've read on here the sentiment just because one's feelings are hurt doesn't mean anyone was rude but I think it also holds true that just because someone is within the boundaries of etiquette doesn't mean they are nice.

Hollanda

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Re: Schenanigans?
« Reply #35 on: September 11, 2011, 07:33:29 AM »
Well...keeping things in perspective, maybe I was a little oversensitive, and maybe it was genuine misunderstanding. I just felt and still do, that when questioning fellow posters, a little bit of leeway should be used.  I have read something once and thought one thing, and then read it back later and thought "Hey, that could mean something totally different!!" Then I feel like a jerk :( So maybe that's what happened, it was all just misunderstanding!?!
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POF

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Re: Schenanigans?
« Reply #36 on: September 11, 2011, 08:58:29 AM »
Well...keeping things in perspective, maybe I was a little oversensitive, and maybe it was genuine misunderstanding. I just felt and still do, that when questioning fellow posters, a little bit of leeway should be used.  I have read something once and thought one thing, and then read it back later and thought "Hey, that could mean something totally different!!" Then I feel like a jerk :( So maybe that's what happened, it was all just misunderstanding!?!

Hollanda - there is also a very bad habit here of dogpiling ... so when one person chimes in A LOT more will echo that thought. I had a situation where upon getting feedback on a post- I realized that I was the person worhty of E- Hell. My actions  were definitely rude - although I had the best of intentions.  After a few people posted - I responded that  YES - I see it and I have apologized to the person I was posting about. I had probably 20 more posts after that where people where saying how awful, rude, and just a thoughtless human being I was. Regardless of how many times - I said YES .. I agree it was bad ... I've apologized can we move on..... more people chimed in. I felt like I was getting a public flogging. 

I found it very frustrating. So - it happens to all of us.  In the past - I've used etiquette hell as a mirror at times to look at my actions and to get objective feedback and suggestions on how to improve.  I'm much more hesitant to start topics because of some of the dogliling / snarkiness that crops up and then takes off.

Redsoil

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Re: Schenanigans?
« Reply #37 on: September 11, 2011, 09:19:41 AM »
Maybe Scritzy's Coke Rule could be employed at times like these? 

I do think that stories which are later shown to be fake can drag people down emotionally, which is extremely nasty, in my opinion.  Someone who may just be posting for reactions (and getting them) can be a direct cause of emotional harm to others, who sincerely believe the lies the poster is spinning.  Especially if those posters (who are often offering support and/or prayers etc) have faced similar crises themselves - it's particularly egregious.
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Miss March

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Re: Schenanigans?
« Reply #38 on: September 11, 2011, 09:44:27 AM »
Quote
I found it very frustrating. So - it happens to all of us.  In the past - I've used etiquette hell as a mirror at times to look at my actions and to get objective feedback and suggestions on how to improve.  I'm much more hesitant to start topics because of some of the dogpiling / snarkiness that crops up and then takes off.

I have been seeing a lot of this in recent threads too. That, or someone seems to take a fairly straightforward statement made by another poster, and then they twist the words into something else. Or there are certain posters who often seem to end up at odds with each other. I had thought things would improve when we moved to the new forum and got the much discussed "ignore" button, but I guess that hasn't panned out. I hope the mods are still looking for a way to add that feature. I think a lot of us on Ehell do more lurking and less posting of topics for precisely the reasons you state above, POF.
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LadyL

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Re: Schenanigans?
« Reply #39 on: September 11, 2011, 11:36:40 AM »
Well...keeping things in perspective, maybe I was a little oversensitive, and maybe it was genuine misunderstanding. I just felt and still do, that when questioning fellow posters, a little bit of leeway should be used.  I have read something once and thought one thing, and then read it back later and thought "Hey, that could mean something totally different!!" Then I feel like a jerk :( So maybe that's what happened, it was all just misunderstanding!?!

Hollanda - there is also a very bad habit here of dogpiling ... so when one person chimes in A LOT more will echo that thought.

Yes, this. Sometimes someone chimes in with an opinion that is (IMO) on the extreme end, but then a bunch of people echo that sentiment, and it seems like it's the majority opinion. Often it's not - when this has happened in threads I've posted, I will often get a PM or two (or three sometimes) from people who strongly disagree with the dog pile but didn't want to get into it on the thread because they felt it had gotten one sided and a bit hostile. Sometimes, an equally strong opposite opinion will get posted, and the dogpile swings back in a different direction (this is usually around page 3 of the post).

IMO it's a combination of people feeling emboldened to support a poster who took a strong position, and the "opposition" to that opinion staying silent (until someone posts a strongly worded post about that view, and then the pendulum often swings back).

So it often looks like this:

OP: I was passing by the lost and found at my work on my way home, and saw what looked like my coworker's sweater sitting there. I wasn't sure if it was hers so I didn't claim it, and by the time I told her about it the next day the lost and found was closed for a few days. Was I rude?

Posts  1-3: Not rude
Post 4: Wow, I would feel really awful if I couldn't get my sweater back all week because a coworker couldn't take five minutes to bring me it or at least tell me they saw it. Whatever happened to looking out for each other? OP, I think you were very rude.
Posts 4-15: POD
Post 16: Hey wait a minute, the OP said she wasn't even sure if it was this person's sweater - so if she claimed it it could be stealing from the actual owner. And she was on her way home, we don't even know if her coworker was still around in the office. I don't think she was rude at all.
Posts 17-?? POD


Giggity

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Re: Schenanigans?
« Reply #40 on: September 11, 2011, 11:59:31 AM »
Sure! :) Ok, there was one yesterday which is a pretty good example. Discussing pregnancy (which was an issue in the post) and I stated I don't like being unnecessarily barged into or barged past.

Since I was the one who "picked the post apart," I will state my position here again: there's a difference with being "barged into" - i.e., pushed and shoved - and "barged past." Your post seemed to deal with the latter, which I didn't get, since I didn't understand how I'm supposed to go through life never walking faster than those around me. For me, the the adjective is the key.
Words mean things.

Larrabee

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Re: Schenanigans?
« Reply #41 on: September 11, 2011, 12:06:49 PM »
Sure! :) Ok, there was one yesterday which is a pretty good example. Discussing pregnancy (which was an issue in the post) and I stated I don't like being unnecessarily barged into or barged past.

Since I was the one who "picked the post apart," I will state my position here again: there's a difference with being "barged into" - i.e., pushed and shoved - and "barged past." Your post seemed to deal with the latter, which I didn't get, since I didn't understand how I'm supposed to go through life never walking faster than those around me. For me, the the adjective is the key.

I think you've misunderstood the word 'barge', it does imply physical contact.  Here is a perfect example of someone barging 'past' someone, as a Brit would understand te term:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1lyu1KKwC74

RingTailedLemur

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Re: Schenanigans?
« Reply #42 on: September 11, 2011, 12:08:30 PM »
Sure! :) Ok, there was one yesterday which is a pretty good example. Discussing pregnancy (which was an issue in the post) and I stated I don't like being unnecessarily barged into or barged past.

Since I was the one who "picked the post apart," I will state my position here again: there's a difference with being "barged into" - i.e., pushed and shoved - and "barged past." Your post seemed to deal with the latter, which I didn't get, since I didn't understand how I'm supposed to go through life never walking faster than those around me. For me, the the adjective is the key.

I think you've misunderstood the word 'barge', it does imply physical contact.  Here is a perfect example of someone barging 'past' someone, as a Brit would understand te term:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1lyu1KKwC74

Agreed.  Hollanda's original post was very clear to me in that she meant physical contact.  I felt you were a bit rude in that thread Juana, you appeared to be having a go at Hollanda in a sarcastic way rather than just asking her to explain if she was referring to physical contact or not.
« Last Edit: September 11, 2011, 12:10:51 PM by RingTailedLemur »

Bexx27

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Re: Schenanigans?
« Reply #43 on: September 11, 2011, 12:11:41 PM »
Sure! :) Ok, there was one yesterday which is a pretty good example. Discussing pregnancy (which was an issue in the post) and I stated I don't like being unnecessarily barged into or barged past.

Since I was the one who "picked the post apart," I will state my position here again: there's a difference with being "barged into" - i.e., pushed and shoved - and "barged past." Your post seemed to deal with the latter, which I didn't get, since I didn't understand how I'm supposed to go through life never walking faster than those around me. For me, the the adjective is the key.

That was the source of the confusion for me, too. Also mentioning being pregnant as if that made it worse. Later it was clarified that you just meant people should pay more attention to their surroundings because they might push down someone with any type of physical limitation. With the clarifications, I don't have a problem with your post.

It's hard to read tone and posters often get asked to clarify what they intended to say. Sometimes posts can be interpreted to mean something entirely different - and possibly more offensive - than the poster actually meant. It's certainly happened to me and I know I often fail to express myself well. I think misunderstanding what a poster is saying and seeking clarification of their point is quite different from doubting that their story is true.
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Giggity

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Re: Schenanigans?
« Reply #44 on: September 11, 2011, 12:16:05 PM »
Which is why, in that post, I asked for clarification a few times. Shoving someone is always rude. Walking past them, possibly even brushing them, is not. I am still not sure what being pregnant has to do with the issue, unless it's that one should pay special attention to one's surroundings in case a neighboring human happens to be expecting.
Words mean things.