Author Topic: Exchanges with People that Make Your Brain Hurt  (Read 1055720 times)

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lowspark

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Re: Exchanges with People that Make Your Brain Hurt
« Reply #7635 on: March 14, 2013, 10:17:46 AM »
In fact, Texas, when it joined the union, reserved the right to, at any future date, break up into five states for this exact purpose. It would increase our representation in the Senate from two to ten.

Except no it wouldn't,  unless you think those five separate states would forever after vote in lockstep with each other instead of going their own way and looking out for their own interests. Sure, those interests would be similar because they're in the same geographic area, but that in no way guarantees political cooperation on all important issues.

That's exactly the point! Right now, we have two senators representing the entire state. A state which has diverse needs and opinions on different issues. Break up the state and now you have ten senators, each two representing a much smaller area. Granted, even those smaller areas would still have diverse needs and opinions. But the point is that each of those areas would be much better represented by their two senators than by the two who currently represent the entire state.

The idea is not for all ten senators to vote in lockstep. The point is for everyone in what is now the entire state to have better representation in congress.

lowspark

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Re: Exchanges with People that Make Your Brain Hurt
« Reply #7636 on: March 14, 2013, 10:20:13 AM »
In fact, Texas, when it joined the union, reserved the right to, at any future date, break up into five states for this exact purpose. It would increase our representation in the Senate from two to ten.

Except no it wouldn't,  unless you think those five separate states would forever after vote in lockstep with each other instead of going their own way and looking out for their own interests. Sure, those interests would be similar because they're in the same geographic area, but that in no way guarantees political cooperation on all important issues.

And while, as a whole, they may get stronger in the Senate, they'd individually get weaker in the House.

Since representation in the House is based on population, they would not get weaker in the House. The population wouldn't change. The population distribution wouldn't change either. Representation in the House would remain essentially the same. There may be some slight realignment depending on where the state were divided, but total representation would remain pretty much the same.

Diane AKA Traska

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Re: Exchanges with People that Make Your Brain Hurt
« Reply #7637 on: March 14, 2013, 10:57:26 AM »
In fact, Texas, when it joined the union, reserved the right to, at any future date, break up into five states for this exact purpose. It would increase our representation in the Senate from two to ten.

Except no it wouldn't,  unless you think those five separate states would forever after vote in lockstep with each other instead of going their own way and looking out for their own interests. Sure, those interests would be similar because they're in the same geographic area, but that in no way guarantees political cooperation on all important issues.

And while, as a whole, they may get stronger in the Senate, they'd individually get weaker in the House.

Since representation in the House is based on population, they would not get weaker in the House. The population wouldn't change. The population distribution wouldn't change either. Representation in the House would remain essentially the same. There may be some slight realignment depending on where the state were divided, but total representation would remain pretty much the same.

Hence why I said individually... each state would represent 20% of the state population, on average.
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LibraryLady

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Re: Exchanges with People that Make Your Brain Hurt
« Reply #7638 on: March 14, 2013, 11:12:39 AM »
I think it would depend upon how Texas was split up.  Have you seen the way the state was gerrymandered in the last redistricting?  You can go to
www.tlc.state.tx.us/redist/redist.htm and see how the state is split up into districts.  They aimed for an ideal with 698,000 person in each district.

Anyway, it won't ever happen. 

lowspark

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Re: Exchanges with People that Make Your Brain Hurt
« Reply #7639 on: March 14, 2013, 11:56:07 AM »
In fact, Texas, when it joined the union, reserved the right to, at any future date, break up into five states for this exact purpose. It would increase our representation in the Senate from two to ten.

Except no it wouldn't,  unless you think those five separate states would forever after vote in lockstep with each other instead of going their own way and looking out for their own interests. Sure, those interests would be similar because they're in the same geographic area, but that in no way guarantees political cooperation on all important issues.

And while, as a whole, they may get stronger in the Senate, they'd individually get weaker in the House.

Since representation in the House is based on population, they would not get weaker in the House. The population wouldn't change. The population distribution wouldn't change either. Representation in the House would remain essentially the same. There may be some slight realignment depending on where the state were divided, but total representation would remain pretty much the same.

Hence why I said individually... each state would represent 20% of the state population, on average.

Since representatives in the house are elected by geographic districts, assuming for the moment  that the state were divided along those same lines so that no district were split, the representation in the house would remain identical to what it is now. Assuming that some of these districts did get split when the state divided, then yeah, some of the represenation would change. But again, only slightly.

So in other words, my Senator would now represent the (on average) 20% of the state that I live in instead of representing the 100% that s/he represents now, (in theory) better representing my views. But my Representative in the House would pretty much be the same -- based on population and based on my district as it is now.

But yeah, this is all just academic as it probably won't ever happen. My original point was that when you combine or eliminate states (as was being discussed upthread) you are actually advocating for less representation in the Senate.

Virg

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Re: Exchanges with People that Make Your Brain Hurt
« Reply #7640 on: March 14, 2013, 12:22:32 PM »
Piratelvr1121 wrote:

"Which is possible, I think it's on the History Channel which isn't all it used to be."

And that, boys and girls, is pretty much the textbook definition of irony.

Virg

nutraxfornerves

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Re: Exchanges with People that Make Your Brain Hurt
« Reply #7641 on: March 14, 2013, 12:33:36 PM »
The show on the shapes of states is based on this book. How the States Got Their Shapes. I got it from the library a couple of years ago. It's great reading.

snopes on Texas dividing into 5 states. However, there is a clause in the US Constitution that requires approval from Congress if a state wants to split up.

This is more of a mondegreen, but this morning I heard a sound bite on the radio from an athlete. A newscaster immediately said "that makes no sense!" The sports reporter asked "what do you mean? It makes perfect sense to me."  She replied "I can't get my mom around his fat back. That makes sense to you?"

The sports reporter lost it, completely cracked up. What the athlete had said (and I heard it clearly) was "I can't get my mind around the fact that...."

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Midnight Kitty

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Re: Exchanges with People that Make Your Brain Hurt
« Reply #7642 on: March 14, 2013, 08:53:03 PM »
I have laughed at  that but now I'm parenting two children who have to eat everything cut up fine and in soup.  So I'm probably going to end up having the same conversation about carrots.
Someone told me that carrots scream when pulled out of the ground.  >:D
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kherbert05

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Re: Exchanges with People that Make Your Brain Hurt
« Reply #7643 on: March 14, 2013, 10:00:30 PM »


Since representation in the House is based on population, they would not get weaker in the House. The population wouldn't change. The population distribution wouldn't change either. Representation in the House would remain essentially the same. There may be some slight realignment depending on where the state were divided, but total representation would remain pretty much the same.
Except the number of representatives is limited 435 and every state gets at least 1 so you add 4 new states and that means the person per representative goes up because now you only 381 reps to divide up according to population instead of 385 we have now.


BUt the real issue was slavery. The south wanted to be able to divide up Texas into 5 slave states to counter the addition free states from areas that the Missouri compromise prohibited slavery. Texas wasn't covered in the Missouri compromise because it was not part of the Louisiana Purchase.


http://www.snopes.com/history/american/texas.asp
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Minmom3

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Re: Exchanges with People that Make Your Brain Hurt
« Reply #7644 on: March 14, 2013, 10:10:59 PM »
I have laughed at  that but now I'm parenting two children who have to eat everything cut up fine and in soup.  So I'm probably going to end up having the same conversation about carrots.
Someone told me that carrots scream when pulled out of the ground.  >:D


They must do it in a range (I typed rage...) far higher than our human ears can hear.   ::)
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Elfmama

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Re: Exchanges with People that Make Your Brain Hurt
« Reply #7645 on: March 14, 2013, 11:27:12 PM »
I have laughed at  that but now I'm parenting two children who have to eat everything cut up fine and in soup.  So I'm probably going to end up having the same conversation about carrots.
Someone told me that carrots scream when pulled out of the ground.  >:D
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ov5Jgw_Nwx4

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violinp

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Re: Exchanges with People that Make Your Brain Hurt
« Reply #7646 on: March 14, 2013, 11:29:53 PM »
I have laughed at  that but now I'm parenting two children who have to eat everything cut up fine and in soup.  So I'm probably going to end up having the same conversation about carrots.
Someone told me that carrots scream when pulled out of the ground.  >:D
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ov5Jgw_Nwx4

I love that song!
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MommyPenguin

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Re: Exchanges with People that Make Your Brain Hurt
« Reply #7647 on: March 14, 2013, 11:36:21 PM »
I have laughed at  that but now I'm parenting two children who have to eat everything cut up fine and in soup.  So I'm probably going to end up having the same conversation about carrots.
Someone told me that carrots scream when pulled out of the ground.  >:D

http://cheezburger.com/7075196160

Is it horrible that this comic makes me want to cry every time I read it?  Admittedly, I have a 5-month-old.

Bexx27

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Re: Exchanges with People that Make Your Brain Hurt
« Reply #7648 on: March 15, 2013, 09:33:58 AM »
I have laughed at  that but now I'm parenting two children who have to eat everything cut up fine and in soup.  So I'm probably going to end up having the same conversation about carrots.
Someone told me that carrots scream when pulled out of the ground.  >:D

http://cheezburger.com/7075196160

Is it horrible that this comic makes me want to cry every time I read it?  Admittedly, I have a 5-month-old.

I found it totally hilarious, but when I had a small baby I probably would have burst into tears.  :)
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Twik

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Re: Exchanges with People that Make Your Brain Hurt
« Reply #7649 on: March 15, 2013, 10:13:26 AM »
I have laughed at  that but now I'm parenting two children who have to eat everything cut up fine and in soup.  So I'm probably going to end up having the same conversation about carrots.
Someone told me that carrots scream when pulled out of the ground.  >:D

That's only the rare carrot/mandrake root hybrid.
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