Someone Else's Child (a bit long, sorry)

[ShadesOfGrey]

In order to protect yourself, your dogs, and the child, you should probably talk to the parents.  Although the parents might react like your friend would, you would have at tried to inform them about their child's dangerous behavior.    If possible, it might be a good idea to have a friend go over the parents' house with you so you can have a witness who will testify that you did at least try to warn the parents.  You might want to have a friend walk with you and your dogs so that you can have a witness to the kid's behavior and your response to this behavior.     

These are good ideas. Especially good if you think something more serious might come from these encounters and some type of authority needs to be involved. 

[ZipTheWonder]

Her belief is that it is the parents' business how their kids behave, not anyone else's.

That's exactly why you should make it their business and not yours.  So far, YOU have been managing behavior THEY should be managing.

My vote is to speak to them, unless you fear the kind of reprisal your friend has suggested.  In that case, find another walking route if you can!

[Slartibartfast]

Definitely talk to the parents, and present it as a safety issue.  YOU know your dogs are well-behaved, but let the parents know that the dogs are scared when this boy rushes them and demands to pet them, and often dogs will bite when frightened or threatened, even if they're otherwise well-behaved.  Hopefully they can teach their son about how to ASK before petting a dog.  Also, say you are worried when the boy starts throwing things - he could hit you or your dogs, and you will not be tolerating this behavior.  If it happens again after you talk to the parents, you are definitely justified in calling the police non-emergency number and asking them to send an officer out to drive the message home.

[fklwmn]

time to throw my 2 cents in...

You should definitely approach this child's parents. I have no idea why your friend was so horrified. Of course how their child behaves is their business, but it's likely they have NO IDEA he is doing these things, therefore cannot correct him.

I think what is 'not done' is to tell the parents HOW to correct his behavior. But you certainly should tell them about it!


-said as a parent who would want to know

[minnaloushe]

But I mentioned this to someone else last night and she was horrified. She feels that it is simply "not done", to talk to parents about their kids if you don't know them (and many times even if you do). Her belief is that it is the parents' business how their kids behave, not anyone else's. She'd tell someone to shove off if they knocked on her door to talk about her sons.

Um, what? If the police showed up at her door to inform her that her kids were arrested for oh, let's say shoplifting, she'd tell them to shove off?  If a neighbour came over to tell her he caught her kids torturing an animal she's say that's none of their business?

Be afraid, be very afraid.

You've been given some pretty good advice about your dogs, so I'll leave it at that.

[Alida]

Since this is directly affecting you and your dogs, I would most certainly speak with the parents.  If he's doing this to you and your dogs, you're probably safe in assuming that he's doing it to others, too.  Eventually, that child is going to find himself facing some pretty sharp teeth and claws.  It's better for the parents to know NOW what he's doing than to find out when Little Bratty is in the hospital and some poor dog is paying for the brat's actions.

[Twik]

But I mentioned this to someone else last night and she was horrified. She feels that it is simply "not done", to talk to parents about their kids if you don't know them (and many times even if you do). Her belief is that it is the parents' business how their kids behave, not anyone else's. She'd tell someone to shove off if they knocked on her door to talk about her sons.

Um, what? If the police showed up at her door to inform her that her kids were arrested for oh, let's say shoplifting, she'd tell them to shove off?  If a neighbour came over to tell her he caught her kids torturing an animal she's say that's none of their business?

Next time you discuss this (if you ever do), ask her if her 7-year-old was seen darting in and out of traffic, would she prefer to be told by the neighbours or the coroner?

[Bijou]

Okay, here's a modern etiquette question: is it a no-no to speak with parents these days about their child's inappropriate behavior, when you don't know the family?

Backstory:
While walking my dogs, I have had a couple of run-ins with a boy who lives a street over. He is inevitably on a scooter (must really love it) and drives it top speed right at us, then stops in front of us and demands to pet my dogs. One of my dogs is afraid of scooters at the best of times, but NO dog enjoys getting rushed like this. I have explained to him before that the dogs are afraid of his scooter and it's not okay to do this, and then attempt to keep walking, but he will either block our path (!) or follow us, pestering and demanding. Rushing up behind us, rushing past us and then circling back, shouting at us. Meanwhile, my dogs are getting a bit freaked. So then I'm trying to navigate the street while keeping my dogs calm, while trying to get it through his thick little skull, in the nicest way possible (I happen to love kids) that this is not okay to do with my dogs and to just let us walk. It happened again yesterday before supper and it was the worst time yet. At one point he picked up a stick and was shouting DO THEY LIKE STICKS? As he's doing all this he's completely oblivious to cars.

Truth be known, my dogs do meet other people and kids and dogs in the neighborhood. A nice "may I meet your dogs?" is fine. But if someone has not been taught how to approach an animal (and its owner, for that matter) in a safe manner, then I opt not to interact with them. My prerogative. This kid's approach is definitely not pet-friendly.

This boy is about 7 or 8 years old, by the way. I have never seen an adult supervising him. I have seen an older gentleman working in their driveway from time to time, but he has never been friendly. For all I know he's a contractor or handyman. Because I think this behavior is inappropriate, and because it could be dangerous for this child one day when he does it with someone whose dogs finally snap, I thought I might knock on their door this weekend and talk it over with the parents. Not a "your kid is a brat!" conversation, but rather explaining the situation (they're never out there so they may not know what's happening) and maybe explaining why it's so important for him to know how to behave in the street. Perhaps suggest some supervision...

But I mentioned this to someone else last night and she was horrified. She feels that it is simply "not done", to talk to parents about their kids if you don't know them (and many times even if you do). Her belief is that it is the parents' business how their kids behave, not anyone else's. She'd tell someone to shove off if they knocked on her door to talk about her sons.

For the record, in order to avoid this street I would have to go significantly out of my way, and on a much, much busier route. And it's not like he's never anywhere else in the neighborhood.

So: is it bad etiquette to ask to speak with the parents about this? What IS the etiquette for such a situation?

Thanks for listening... sorry this was so long.

You are not going to his parents to let them know he is chewing with his mouth open, or isn't saying thank you to someone who gives him something.  The kid is acting inappropriately and is possibly endangering himself and others.  I do think his parents should somehow be made aware of it. 

[EvilAlice]

I don't know what the etiquette of this is.  But I think it's futile to talk to the parents.  If they cared how their child behaved out in the neighborhood, they would have either trained him, or they would watch him.  They didn't even train him to watch for cars, or better yet, not to ride his scooter in the STREET.  Do you think they care he is frightening your dogs or might be bitten?

Your best bet is to be firm with the child, as another poster suggested.  In very uncertain terms, forbid him to come near you or the dogs.  If he keeps coming, you turn around and go the other way and report an unsupervised child who is always playing in traffic.  Don't mention your dogs, just say that you see him out there all the time and you're afraid he'll get run over, so the cops might actually follow up. 

He doesn't sound quite right, to me.  He's not picking up any of your cues or verbal instructions.  Either no one ever gives him any kind of instruction, or he's incapable of understanding it the way you've been putting it to him.  Speak loudly and firmly and turn around if he doesn't listen.  Don't walk on that street if you can't get it through his skull. It's not worth the risk to your dogs.  If that kid gets bitten, mommy and daddy are suddenly going to care a whole lot about the kid's safety, and your dog could end up paying the price.

[hollasa]

I'd do it like this -
"Hello, my name is __, and I know your son a bit, from when I walk my dogs. I'm concerned that he might be bitten by a dog, if he keeps on rushing up to them on his scooter, and I was wondering if you might be more effective at letting him know this than I've been? Thanks for your time, and I hope you don't mind my concern, good bye!"

Whatever you say, they will probably not react too well, but I'd keep it on the level of concerned about his safety as much as possible.

Also, you could try being less polite to the boy - try telling him to back off through gritted teeth...

(I'm a parent, and I'd want to know - I would probably be somewhat defensive, though, realistically speaking).

[MineralDiva]

I don't know what the etiquette of this is.  But I think it's futile to talk to the parents.  If they cared how their child behaved out in the neighborhood, they would have either trained him, or they would watch him.  They didn't even train him to watch for cars, or better yet, not to ride his scooter in the STREET.  Do you think they care he is frightening your dogs or might be bitten?

Your best bet is to be firm with the child, as another poster suggested.  In very uncertain terms, forbid him to come near you or the dogs.  If he keeps coming, you turn around and go the other way and report an unsupervised child who is always playing in traffic.  Don't mention your dogs, just say that you see him out there all the time and you're afraid he'll get run over, so the cops might actually follow up. 

He doesn't sound quite right, to me.  He's not picking up any of your cues or verbal instructions.  Either no one ever gives him any kind of instruction, or he's incapable of understanding it the way you've been putting it to him.  Speak loudly and firmly and turn around if he doesn't listen.  Don't walk on that street if you can't get it through his skull. It's not worth the risk to your dogs.  If that kid gets bitten, mommy and daddy are suddenly going to care a whole lot about the kid's safety, and your dog could end up paying the price.

I absolutely agree with EvilAlice here.  If the parents or adults who are supposed to be supervising the child, aren't doing what they should be doing...you could be opening yourself up to difficulties that could be worse than what you're dealing with now.

Be firm with child who needs disciplining and protect your dogs...even if it means alerting the authorities to watch your walking route.  Perhaps they'll catch the him in the act, and take him to confront his parents themselves!

[sammycat]

I agree with EvilAlice that confronting the parents will probably be futile.  I think you have an extremely valid cause for complaint but somehow I get the feeling that parents are not going to care.  They obviously don't supervise him and he certainly doesn't know right from wrong, at least in matters regarding animals.  Next time you run into him, give him one more warning/chance and if he continues to harass you I'd be calling the authorities regarding a constantly unsupervised child, whether it be children's services or the non-emergency phone number (I'm not in the US and have only read about the non-emergency number on this board, so am not sure if this the right service to be calling in this instance; I guess you can be the judge of that). 

I personally would refrain from any contact with the parents as I have a feeling they could use it against you somehow.

[MadMadge43]

What about approaching the boy differently. Next time he comes up say "I can't let you pet them right now because they might bite you because they associate you with the scooter, if you go put the scooter down and approach them like I tell you I will let you pet them, otherwise they'll bite you."

It sounds like he really wants to pet them, but doesn't understand why it's not welcome. If you teach him the correct way, I bet he'll remember it forever and won't approach you on the scooter again.

And parents that don't check on their children while playing in the streets might not be the type to take to friendly to any kind of advice and might even blame the child in a less than educating manner.

[dawbs]

there has been some good advice, but I would use care if you choose to use the word "bite"

IF you tell the boy (or his parents) that certain activities may lead to being bitten, you may be setting yourself up for headache if the boy does do something egregious enough to be bitten...
If he is bitten after you have warned that "X will cause Fluffy to bite you", it could be interpreted by animal control (and or the courts if there was a lawsuit) as acknowledgment that Fluffy is vicious.

(it's the same reasons I will never put up a 'beware of dog' sign...doing so legally acknowledges a vicious dog lives there...where a sign saying 'dog on premises' does not)

[sammycat]

dawbs, I couldn't agree more.  Any admittance by the OP that her dog could bite (the boy) could come back to bite OP on the bottom (sorry, pun unintended).

I don't have a dog and therefore have never needed a warning sign, so the differences you pointed out in the wording between the two is very interesting.