Author Topic: Overgifting  (Read 4747 times)

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Yvaine

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Re: Overgifting
« Reply #15 on: December 17, 2012, 03:39:56 PM »
Didn't say you had to like the rule!  I'm just the messenger.

For instance, from Miss Manners (who doesn't live in 1912):

Quote
All presents are laden with symbolism, Miss Manners warns you, but jewelry is explosive with it, and never more so than when given by a gentleman to a lady or relative to one of the next generation.
 
Ladies should never confuse gentlemen by accepting jewelry if not prepared to accept the gentleman who offers itónor by criticizing a proffered ring when intending to take the gentleman himself.


Is that "accept for marriage," though? I would say that gifts of jewelry are meaningful, in general, but that the meaning is not always marriage. Certainly, that's the meaning of an engagement ring, and one shouldn't accept an engagement ring unless one accepts the engagement. But I think other pieces of jewelry can have other, intermediate meanings.

For example, I know that in some times and places it has been a big deal to get the guy's fraternity pin (don't know if people still do this), but it didn't mean you were engaged, it was more like going steady. I would say, in general, that if you accept jewelry of value from a guy, you're conveying the message that you accept him for a relationship, but not necessarily for marriage, depending on the context and the type of jewelry.

(And of course this is also subject to common sense; none of us are required to marry a boy who gave us a jelly bracelet in grade school.)

ETA: And I looked up the column, and the context from which she's jumping off is actually a piece of jewelry given by a father to a daughter, and her main point is that the daughter shouldn't criticize the gift to the father's face unless she's prepared to face negative relationship consequences. The romantic aspect is kind of a tangent she went off on and didn't go into great detail about.
« Last Edit: December 17, 2012, 03:53:00 PM by Yvaine »

rose red

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Re: Overgifting
« Reply #16 on: December 17, 2012, 03:43:12 PM »
It's too soon to give or receive jewelry in the LW's case, but it is outdated that a lady shouldn't receive jewelry from a man unless they are engaged or married.  I can't imagine anybody being offended if a woman receive earrings, a necklace, or a bracelet from a guy she's been dating for year or two.

onyonryngs

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Re: Overgifting
« Reply #17 on: December 17, 2012, 03:48:18 PM »
It's too soon to give or receive jewelry in the LW's case, but it is outdated that a lady shouldn't receive jewelry from a man unless they are engaged or married.  I can't imagine anybody being offended if a woman receive earrings, a necklace, or a bracelet from a guy she's been dating for year or two.

I think it's odd that there's the unwritten 3 date rule for relations, but you still have to wait until engagement to get a gift.  By 6-8 weeks, there are quite a number of relationships that are at the "friendly" stage.
« Last Edit: December 17, 2012, 03:51:31 PM by onyonryngs »

thedudeabides

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Re: Overgifting
« Reply #18 on: December 17, 2012, 03:53:12 PM »
Hmm, I wonder what Miss Manners would think of me for that charm necklace I gave my seventh grade girlfriend.  Or my seventh grade girlfriend, for that matter.

Yvaine

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Re: Overgifting
« Reply #19 on: December 17, 2012, 03:54:40 PM »
Hmm, I wonder what Miss Manners would think of me for that charm necklace I gave my seventh grade girlfriend.  Or my seventh grade girlfriend, for that matter.

My ninth grade self thinks you must have been quite the charmer, as my ninth grade self's boyfriend only gave her jewelry that someone else's monogram was scratched off of.  ;D

Calypso

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Re: Overgifting
« Reply #20 on: December 17, 2012, 03:58:24 PM »
Dude--please tell me the charm bracelet wasn't dripping with diamonds and emeralds....I'll be a bit worried about where your 12-13 year old self was working!  8)

Judah

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Re: Overgifting
« Reply #21 on: December 17, 2012, 04:04:32 PM »
It's too soon to give or receive jewelry in the LW's case, but it is outdated that a lady shouldn't receive jewelry from a man unless they are engaged or married.  I can't imagine anybody being offended if a woman receive earrings, a necklace, or a bracelet from a guy she's been dating for year or two.

I think it's odd that there's the unwritten 3 date rule for relations, but you still have to wait until engagement to get a gift.  By 6-8 weeks, there are quite a number of relationships that are at the "friendly" stage.

I don't know anyone who takes the 3 date rule seriously. If the LW is uncomfortable with the gift, she should return it.  They're not even exclusive, so I can see how the gift would be really over the top to her. 

Seriousness of relationship vs length of relationship is such an individual thing that I don't think you can make hard and fast rules like this.  I've never been in a relationship where I would have felt comfortable accepting an expensive gift eight weeks in; on the other hand, my friend and her DH were engaged by six weeks.
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thedudeabides

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Re: Overgifting
« Reply #22 on: December 17, 2012, 04:05:29 PM »
It's amazing how well mowing yards paid back then...  :D

onyonryngs

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Re: Overgifting
« Reply #23 on: December 17, 2012, 04:08:16 PM »
It's too soon to give or receive jewelry in the LW's case, but it is outdated that a lady shouldn't receive jewelry from a man unless they are engaged or married.  I can't imagine anybody being offended if a woman receive earrings, a necklace, or a bracelet from a guy she's been dating for year or two.

I think it's odd that there's the unwritten 3 date rule for relations, but you still have to wait until engagement to get a gift.  By 6-8 weeks, there are quite a number of relationships that are at the "friendly" stage.

I don't know anyone who takes the 3 date rule seriously. If the LW is uncomfortable with the gift, she should return it.  They're not even exclusive, so I can see how the gift would be really over the top to her. 

Seriousness of relationship vs length of relationship is such an individual thing that I don't think you can make hard and fast rules like this.  I've never been in a relationship where I would have felt comfortable accepting an expensive gift eight weeks in; on the other hand, my friend and her DH were engaged by six weeks.

It didn't come out like I meant it.  I mean, people are much more willing to start relations earlier, it seems to make sense that the gifting rule would also be relaxed now.   

Moray

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Re: Overgifting
« Reply #24 on: December 17, 2012, 04:24:07 PM »
DottyG, serious question here. If I'm not a "real lady" by virtue of having accepted gifts from a non-fiance, what am I?

A fake lady? A trollop? A warthog?
Utah

EMuir

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Re: Overgifting
« Reply #25 on: December 17, 2012, 04:24:21 PM »
I've been in the situation of the giver at times, and I'd say she should keep it and see how he acts afterward.  If he starts acting like she owes him something, then that's a sign to give it back to him and tell him to get lost.  Maybe he just wanted to give her something nice.

thedudeabides

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Re: Overgifting
« Reply #26 on: December 17, 2012, 04:24:50 PM »
DottyG, serious question here. If I'm not a "real lady" by virtue of having accepted gifts from a non-fiance, what am I?

A fake lady? A trollop? A warthog?

Clearly you're an eel.  I've seen your profile picture.  Unless you're telling me that's not you in your picture.  In which case you're a lying trollop.
« Last Edit: December 17, 2012, 04:26:50 PM by thedudeabides »

DottyG

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Re: Overgifting
« Reply #27 on: December 17, 2012, 04:26:50 PM »
I've edited my post.  The word has been removed.  I didn't realize it would cause a stir; it wasn't intended to.


Moray

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Re: Overgifting
« Reply #28 on: December 17, 2012, 04:29:16 PM »
I've edited my post.  The word has been removed.  I didn't realize it would cause a stir; it wasn't intended to.



My first thought was the old rule that a lady never accepts jewelry from a gentleman unless they're engaged or married.  So he was wrong at the outset, and she needs to give the jewelry back.

Edited to take out a word

Well gosh! I guess I'm still not a lady. I must be a trollopy eel!  :D
Utah

SamiHami

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Re: Overgifting
« Reply #29 on: December 17, 2012, 04:37:56 PM »
I think we're getting way off track here. Clearly DottyG meant that etiquette at one time dictated that a lady should not accept a gift of an intimate nature-including jewelry included. I really don't think she was passing judgment on anyone here.

That being said, yes, she should return the jewelry to the giver since she is uncomfortable with it and it seems to indicate that he is in a different place in the relationship than she is.

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