How and when do books change for you?

[Morrigan]

And I'm still not convinced that Almanzo and Laura didn't kiss until after they became engaged.  The real Almanzo was a hottie.  I don't think I'd be able to sit demurely for, oh, three years without at least letting him hold my hand.

Wasn't that considered fairly normal in those days?  Or at least, an acceptable level of intimacy to describe in a children's book?

Actually, no, it wasn't really normal (okay, maybe it was).  What was normal was to have common-law-marraiges because it could be years before a preacher could marry a couple.  It was actually pretty normal for couples to have 'relations' on buggy rides.  To have a bunch of kids before they could get marry.

So it's pretty likely that Almanzo and Laura had at least some form of relations before they got married.

Now, to describe a children's book?  Yeah, that's completely normal!

[hobish]

If you're looking for the "real deal" about Laura, I can highly recommend "Laura: The Life of Laura Ingalls Wilder" by Donald Zochert. I'm currently in the middle of rereading it myself

  JUST as i was reading this and wishing there were some adult LHOTP books i read this. Thank you. I think i will upload it to my Kindle tomorrow.

[rose red]

*snip*

Now, to describe a children's book?  Yeah, that's completely normal!

It's very fascinating to read about things left out of the books.  Laura actually liked Cap before Almanzo started courting her.  What happened later with the school children from Laura's first class (one of them killed his brother, also another student).  Laura seemed to have such an aversion to Reverend Brown that I worry about his adopted daughter while reading the books as an adult.  And The First Four Years was not published until after Rose's death which recounts how the Boasts wanted to trade a horse for Rose.

[Just Lori]

I'm going to create a LHOTP thread spinoff in the coffee break folder ... I have a feeling there are many other passionate LHOTP fans here.

[Jocelyn]

Actually, no, it wasn't really normal (okay, maybe it was).  What was normal was to have common-law-marraiges because it could be years before a preacher could marry a couple.  It was actually pretty normal for couples to have 'relations' on buggy rides.  To have a bunch of kids before they could get marry.

That was true in an earlier era, when ministers were circuit riders. But Laura describes having a minister and church in the town, and by the 1880s ministers were common enough that a couple could plan for a wedding, even if it meant going to another town or making arrangements for a minister to come to them.  Justices of the peace were around, too.

[Piratelvr1121]

Not a book, but the last few nights Piratebabe has been a night owl, which means I've been watching some late night Friends.  I was a huge fan of this show when it first came out, had a huge crush on Chandler, though most girls I knew liked Ross and would have liked Joey if he hadn't been such an airhead.  I thought it was hilarious then, but now watching it I find myself laughing at the show more than with it.

The characters have gone from being cool to pathetic.  Ross's neuroses are even less humorous, Chandler's jokes not as funny and Phoebe's airheadedness not as cute and eccentric.

[Lynn2000]

The romance novel mentions made me think of all the romance novels I read when I was way too young, like 12. Those big, fat historical ones available by the millions (it seems) on library shelves, with titles like My Brazen Pirate and The Wolf and the Hummingbird or whatever. I used to write these really enthusiastic reviews of them, how they were so romantic and emotional and so forth, but the plots sound just horrible to me now, all about very dubious consent and terribly dysfunctional relationships.  Not to knock anyone who likes those romance novels now--I think I just read them at far too young an age and took the wrong ideas from them.

I am happy to report that Mrs. Piggle-Wiggle, which I read recently for the first time in 25 years, is still very enjoyable. Though of course somewhat dated--the moms are all stay-at-home, worrying about dinner and children while the dads work and slip off to their studies after dinner to smoke pipes--almost all of the "cures" Mrs. P-W suggests for badly-behaved children (talking back, selfish, etc.) seem reasonable to me (if comically exaggerated), and not horrible. There's some dry, absurd humor in the books, too, somewhat like Roald Dahl, which I think I appreciate more now.

I have learned through sad experience to avoid a lot of the TV shows and cartoons I loved as a child. I adored Tiny Toon Adventures back in the day, but when I recently watched some episodes, I felt they alternated between spastic and boring. Okay, granted, I'm not the target demographic anymore, but I didn't think it would be that bad...

[PastryGoddess]

You know I have to say...Bunicula still works for me after all these years

[Piratelvr1121]

I find that Animaniacs still makes me laugh quite hard, as do the Muppets.

When I was younger and read Anne of Green Gables I identified more with Anne of course, but as I've gotten older and read the books, while I still like Anne, I appreciate Marilla a lot more and understand her pov a lot more.  Especially as I have my own kids now and can see how Anne vexed her at times and made her laugh at others with the way she saw the world.

[Hillia]

I am happy to report that Mrs. Piggle-Wiggle, which I read recently for the first time in 25 years, is still very enjoyable. Though of course somewhat dated--the moms are all stay-at-home, worrying about dinner and children while the dads work and slip off to their studies after dinner to smoke pipes--almost all of the "cures" Mrs. P-W suggests for badly-behaved children (talking back, selfish, etc.) seem reasonable to me (if comically exaggerated), and not horrible.

Yes, the non-magical cures are great!  I especially loved the selfishness cure and the answer-backer cure.  One little thing that slipped by me as a child was in the table manners cure - Mrs. Piggle Wiggle sends a pig with beautiful table manners to model them for the child.  The mother is concerned about having a pig live with them, as 'it's a restricted neighborhood, you know'.

'Restricted' back in the day was code for 'housing discrimination' - no Jews or minorities were allowed to purchase homes in the neighborhood; it was written into the sales contracts.  This practice wasn't made illegal until the 60's (I think).

[Winterlight]

That is correct, Hillia. Betty MacDonald had a pretty subversive sense of humor and was tweaking people with that line.

[Adelaide]

When I read Harry Potter as a kid, I was all "Hooray, wizards and magic!" now that I'm an adult I'm kind of struck by the profundity of some of the lessons in there. Of course, I grew up with the books so my view is probably slanted, and they started moralizing quite a bit more toward the end than they did in the first couple of books.

[Piratelvr1121]

I started reading HP in college, when my mother lent me the first book and I was hooked!  At first I too was thinking "Oooh wizards and magic!" as I have always enjoyed some good books on magic.    But as I've gotten older I have definitely appreciated a lot of the lessons taught in the books, and treasure quite a few of the quotes from the books and movies.

I read an unofficial guide once, which spoke of the dementors and how they could represent self-destructive, depressing thoughts meant to make a person feel unworthy of love.   That having good memories is quite a strong charm against such nagging thoughts of inadequacy.

That and chocolate always helps when one's feeling down.

[Jocelyn]

I started reading HP in college, when my mother lent me the first book and I was hooked!  At first I too was thinking "Oooh wizards and magic!" as I have always enjoyed some good books on magic.    But as I've gotten older I have definitely appreciated a lot of the lessons taught in the books, and treasure quite a few of the quotes from the books and movies.

I read an unofficial guide once, which spoke of the dementors and how they could represent self-destructive, depressing thoughts meant to make a person feel unworthy of love.   That having good memories is quite a strong charm against such nagging thoughts of inadequacy.

That and chocolate always helps when one's feeling down.

And cats. Don't forget cats!

I read that Rowling went through a long spell of depression prior to writing about the dementors. Maybe that's why I find them one of the worst things that happen in fiction, a sort of BTDT. Ranks right up there with scenes where animals and little kids are threatened, for me.

[delabela]

You know I have to say...Bunicula still works for me after all these years

I really loved these books!  Especially Howliday Inn!  I'll have to re-read and see if they hold up.