Author Topic: Is 7am-8pm too long of a favor to move? UPDATE #49  (Read 7576 times)

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RegionMom

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Is 7am-8pm too long of a favor to move? UPDATE #49
« on: December 27, 2012, 07:23:05 PM »
bg-
fun-loving, happy-go-lucky, never on time, home-schooled family that I have known for over a decade, is moving the dad's mom to their neighborhood from neighboring city.
Their kids, all teens, were asked to round up some of their friends for a pre-move clean-out last Saturday.
They were told, "$10/hour, about 5 hours."

Instead of moving, DS painted (had to borrow a paint shirt) and DD cleaned out a filthy fridge to trade out for another fridge going to g-ma's house.  She and another girl had to take out the shelves and hose them off in the backyard- it was very dirty.  Think, not quite bad enough of a mess for Hoarders, but getting there.  Seriously, we have been over there before, and you do NOT want to stay too long, or eat there.  The kids sleep on bare mattresses wherever there is room on the floor.

btw-there were only two couches and one fridge to move, and a few empty shelves to assemble in the new house.  Nothing else was ready.

After seven hours, I went over to pick up the kids.  I knew from lunch time texts (lunch was ordered in-yeah!) that they were needed longer than originally planned, but figured two more hours was enough. 

Well, the dad hemmed and hawed, but did pay the "$50, as arranged, but you really owe me a full day's work." to each child.

And he requested that both kids work Thursday, arriving at 7am, being driven 60-90 minutes to g-ma's mobile home in neighboring city, and coming back to unload into the new house. 

DD begged off, and a good thing since she is coughing and snuffly today.  DS said that he needed to be back by 5pm so he could teach karate at 6pm.  No problem!

ok, end bg.

Well, is it now almost 6pm, and they are STILL in city 60-90 minutes away.  DS texted me an hour ago to say so, and the karate place will be ok without him.  But...
I am pretty sure the dad will still only pay $50. 
The dad warned a girl that was driving herself, "I may pay for gas, but not drive time."  He also told the non-driving teens, "I am not paying for your time to sit in the truck."

I told DS this morning, as he packed his bag of gatorade and granola bars, that he should look at this as a service project, more than a job.  He nodded.

We knew what we were getting in to. 

Even though we knew all of this going in, if DS is only paid $50 as we suspect, should I say anything?  And if so, how and what?

(btw- I home schooled for a while, and DD's best friend is home schooled.  This family can NOT get things done- has a junior in HS who is still in -pre-algebra when she needs three years of different levels math to graduate (not one year stretched into three), has dropped any dance or sport classes b/c cannot keep a steady attendance, could not meet testing deadlines for a part-time private school or any standardized testing, etc...  they kind of give the name to Hippy Home schoolers.  Yes, they are sweet.  But they have never done any favors for us...)
In fact, some of you may remember the girl that brought over a breakfast treat just before lunch for DD this summer, and then would. not. leave. so we had to re-arrange our movie and lunch plans?  Yup, that is this family.

Ok, back to my question--
I guess DS gets what he gets, and count it as service instead of a job.  And never never "work" for this family again!!!

Right?




« Last Edit: December 28, 2012, 09:38:33 AM by RegionMom »
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snowdragon

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Re: Is 7am-8pm too long of a favor to move?
« Reply #1 on: December 27, 2012, 07:29:35 PM »
I would say something to that father. If he is only willing to pay $50, then he only gets them for  5 hours. Period. Taking advantage of people is not cool.
And you will teach your kid that not only will you stick up for him, he can also speak up for himself.

nuit93

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Re: Is 7am-8pm too long of a favor to move?
« Reply #2 on: December 27, 2012, 07:29:42 PM »
I wouldn't do anything for them again!

Amara

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Re: Is 7am-8pm too long of a favor to move?
« Reply #3 on: December 27, 2012, 07:30:37 PM »
I could feel my blood pressure rising as I read this.

You may already realize this but I think your children are being thoroughly ripped off, and I think you--probably not intentionally--are contributing to that. It  would have been best if the payment and hours had been worked out in advance and written into a simple one-page contract. And, yes, the kids should be paid for their travel time at the same rate as their working time. Also, there is no way I would let children work more than the legally-mandated eight hours. This is just all wrong. I would make the father pay the full time the children were under his supervision, and that includes the travel time. Something like this should never be called service. It is far worse than that.


otterwoman

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Re: Is 7am-8pm too long of a favor to move?
« Reply #4 on: December 27, 2012, 07:32:27 PM »
I'm betting that the dad pays nothing and considers this day as the "full day's work" he mentioned last time. Tell your son that he is free to never work/volunteer for these people again.

AustenFan

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Re: Is 7am-8pm too long of a favor to move?
« Reply #5 on: December 27, 2012, 07:32:56 PM »
Anything you're paid to do isn't a favor, and I can't figure out why, knowing how the first day went, your son agreed to go back. It sounds to me like he knew what he was getting into.

I also can't figure out what the homeschooling situation and your thoughts on their methods have to do with the situation.

NyaChan

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Re: Is 7am-8pm too long of a favor to move?
« Reply #6 on: December 27, 2012, 07:33:39 PM »
I'll be honest - I would never let my kids if I had them/friends/or anyone who I could advise get involved this way.  He offered 10/hr for 5 hours.  Either he gets 5 hours of work or he pays extra for more hours.  After the first day, I would have been speaking to the father and explaining your position and working out the details.  He is taking advantage of kids by virtue of his relative position of authority.  I think you should speak up on your kids' behalf and get your son home as soon as you can.

LeveeWoman

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Re: Is 7am-8pm too long of a favor to move?
« Reply #7 on: December 27, 2012, 07:34:08 PM »
I could feel my blood pressure rising as I read this.

You may already realize this but I think your children are being thoroughly ripped off, and I think you--probably not intentionally--are contributing to that. It  would have been best if the payment and hours had been worked out in advance and written into a simple one-page contract. And, yes, the kids should be paid for their travel time at the same rate as their working time. Also, there is no way I would let children work more than the legally-mandated eight hours. This is just all wrong. I would make the father pay the full time the children were under his supervision, and that includes the travel time. Something like this should never be called service. It is far worse than that.

It's as if he's never heard of the 13th Amendment!

Enkidu

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Re: Is 7am-8pm too long of a favor to move?
« Reply #8 on: December 27, 2012, 07:39:49 PM »
Why you would allow your son to go "help move" a second time after the original terms had already been violated?

In my opinion, the time to speak up (politely) would be then, not now. I would stay quiet and decline any future jobs. It isn't an act of service to allow yourself to be taken advantage of and then complain afterwards.

I would speak with son privately, apologize for not helping him stand up for himself appropriately at the right time, and role-play words to use next time the situation comes up. "I'm afraid that won't be possible" might be a good one. It would probably be good practice for both of you. It's hard standing up for yourself, but you'll find yourself less resentful in the end (and so will son).

MorgnsGrl

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Re: Is 7am-8pm too long of a favor to move?
« Reply #9 on: December 27, 2012, 07:43:57 PM »
Well, the dad hemmed and hawed, but did pay the "$50, as arranged, but you really owe me a full day's work." to each child.

Am I right in understanding that the dad paid $50 for *7* hours of work, and was referring to those 7 hours as NOT a full day's work? I don't understand why the kids would go back for a second day. They'd already "donated" two unpaid hours each on the first day, and instead of being thanked for their help, were told that they somehow "owed" the dad more unpaid work? It would be one thing if the dad was grateful for their help, but it sounds like he's very entitled. Not cool.

HoneyBee42

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Re: Is 7am-8pm too long of a favor to move?
« Reply #10 on: December 27, 2012, 07:45:36 PM »
I agree--I would *NOT* have allowed my son to go the second day, and I would also have informed the father that he *HAD* gotten more than the agreed upon amount of labor the first day, and that at $10/hr he owed my son $70 after 7 hrs on the first day.  I realize that the additional time may have been due to failure to prep beforehand, but you do *NOT* treat moving assistance that way.  I fully agree w/ others that the rip-off artist needs to be stood up to now (better late than never).


jedikaiti

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Re: Is 7am-8pm too long of a favor to move?
« Reply #11 on: December 27, 2012, 07:48:49 PM »
I would say something to that father. If he is only willing to pay $50, then he only gets them for  5 hours. Period. Taking advantage of people is not cool.
And you will teach your kid that not only will you stick up for him, he can also speak up for himself.

BINGO. He said, $10/hour. He said about 5 hours. This is WAY more than 5 hours.
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RegionMom

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Re: Is 7am-8pm too long of a favor to move?
« Reply #12 on: December 27, 2012, 07:57:22 PM »
OP here-

yeah, that is about what I figured. 

DD knew to "be otherwise engaged" but DS is pulling the "I am a man of my word and I will not lie that I have other plans when I do not."  Never mind that he had planned to teach karate tonight. 

He has not been texting since before nightfall, so I assume they are eating dinner or his phone is off.  I do not know if they are still in 60-90 minute away city, or on the road.  DS will NOT be helping unload. 

And, I guess losing this friendship would not be too bad.  I do like the family, but the kids are not really even friends anymore. 

Oh, as to the homeshool details, it seemed the best way to explain this crazy family.  I could have detailed an attempted camping trip, a failed b-day party, or a bizarre non-yard sale, but the overall pattern was best summed in their way of (not) home schooling their children. 

So, I guess I will have DH pick up DS and have a chat with the dad, no matter what, since "time is money" and DS's day is completely shot. 

DS was asked to be there by 7am.  He was.  They were not even awake, and did not leave till well after 9am.  Good thing DS brought a book to read while he waited on them!



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Surianne

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Re: Is 7am-8pm too long of a favor to move?
« Reply #13 on: December 27, 2012, 07:57:56 PM »
Anything you're paid to do isn't a favor, and I can't figure out why, knowing how the first day went, your son agreed to go back. It sounds to me like he knew what he was getting into.

I agree.  This is a job, not a favour.  Your son should have asked after 7 hours' work.  If he wasn't paid that, I have no idea why he went back.  How old is your son?  If he's a teenager, then I wouldn't get involved -- this is his lesson to learn.


Quote
I also can't figure out what the homeschooling situation and your thoughts on their methods have to do with the situation.

Yeah, I'm not sure what your judgements about their homeschooling have to do with anything here.  Is there more background you didn't share, that relates to their moving and your children being paid?

gramma dishes

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Re: Is 7am-8pm too long of a favor to move?
« Reply #14 on: December 27, 2012, 08:01:25 PM »
...   fun-loving, happy-go-lucky, never on time, home-schooled family that I have known for over a decade ...

Hmmm ... funny.  After reading your story, that's not quite how I would describe them.