The courteous way to oust my mother from my home *Update?

[fluffy]

Whileyfool,

I didn't see that she wrote it "broke up" her marriage as you put it...that's taking a liberty in stretching what she said....but the thing about her helping to "raise her son" ...(I certainly hope nobody would even want to downplay such an act, then we would have to minimize the importance of what devoted stay at home moms do

I wonder why you only highlighted "and it benefited her financially " but didnt highlight the more weighty part of her statement that the care grandma provided "was invaluable"

The op told us, the care was " invaluable"

Certain things people do for us, even if we pay them some amount, whatever money we may offer them can't really compare with the value of what they did. Its kind of downplaying the value of what she did.....She says her helping raise her son was invaluable....
Its kind of insulting to downplay the act of a grandparent helping raise a grandchild...

I would hope anyone would see the value in a grandparent helping to raise their grandchild ...there are many grandparents who won't do anything more than occasionally babysit. And some wont even do that much...i feel like the value of what she did got yotaly overlooked and thats pretty sad.....Helping rasie a grandchild is imvaluable, Especially more so if the parent is on their own as a single parent the value is so much more

The OP said in an earlier post that the living situation is now getting to the point where even her son notices that Grandma is grumpy and somewhat unpleasant. I agree that the loving care of a grandparent can be invaluable for a child (my own parents are helping us out with daycare and I love that my daughter is getting that quality of care from them). But, it will very likely undo all of that loving care if the living situation is allowed to get so toxic that the OP's son starts resenting his grandmother.

[Virg]

Ladybugs wrote:

"I would hope anyone would see the value in a grandparent helping to raise their grandchild ...there are many grandparents who won't do anything more than occasionally babysit. And some wont even do that much...i feel like the value of what she did got yotaly overlooked and thats pretty sad.....Helping rasie a grandchild is imvaluable, Especially more so if the parent is on their own as a single parent the value is so much more"

You've spent a number of posts reiterating this idea, but in your turn you seem to be missing a very important part of Autumn Rose's post.  To quote her: "I am over it.   My husband  (and only through his generosity has it lasted THIS long) is over it. Even my darling son, (who adores his grandma)  is now old enough to recognize that she is constantly nagging."  Notwithstanding any value that her mother provided in the past, her present has put every member of her family including the grandson who benefitted from her efforts in the mind that the situation is unlivable.  She's spent the currency she earned to the point where Autumn Rose is asking for advice in getting her to leave, and discounting that because of the "invaluable" service she may have provided is going to lead to huge resentment, as evidenced by the fact that it already has.  This is hardly a snap decision, as she's been in their house "temporarily" due to her own financial mismanagement for six months now, isn't living up the the agreement established when she moved in, isn't working to find someplace on her own, and living with her is, in Autumn Rose's own words, a chore.  After all of this, simply addressing it as payback duty and suggesting that she try to find ways to make it work is more than a little insulting, as though she hasn't been trying for months already.  Autumn Rose herself said that she's reached her limit, so we should really try to take her at her word in that.

Virg

[Avant-Garde 1]

Autumn rose

Given her advanced age, I think the most realistic replies are the ones that frame their advice in the context of her advanced age...since you said you want advice on ways to help her, Rather than just quick advice on how to oust her, I would

** ask if she's willing to see a doctor to be screened for any possible underlying issue that is age related, such as depression, early stage of Alzheimer's etc etc and then address those if any apply

** frame whatever help you provide within the context of her age, make sure its relevant to her age. If she was 48 it would be reasonable to simply get her into apartment. At 78, that is a whole other thing. She is in need of something beyond just a pad to live. Sme others here have addressed this really well....even if she seems healthy now, things can change fast at that age. If your dead set against her continuing to live out the remainder of her years with you, The recommendations to help her fnd senior housing is excellent advice. I know someone who's parents run a senior agency, they are advocate for seniors well being and protection, and have tons of info and resources on housing, healthcare, end of life issues, etc. others recommended getting the help of one of these elder care agencies as you navigate your way in the process
This will help avoid a disaster of making some quick plan that fails later bc it was not relevant to her old age

Ladybugs, I think we understand your stance on the situation. I don't know that shooting down everyone else's suggestions is fair.

OP has said she wants to help her yes, but the request is to assist in finding alternate arrangements for her mother. She knows what's best for her family and I feel we should respect her in that.

[Sophia]

Aren't the apartments that feed onto the assisted living then nursing homes more expensive?  If she is completely able-bodied and poor, it might be better to start her out in a small cheap normal apartment.  Then worry about assisted living when it really is needed. 

[rashea]

Aren't the apartments that feed onto the assisted living then nursing homes more expensive?  If she is completely able-bodied and poor, it might be better to start her out in a small cheap normal apartment.  Then worry about assisted living when it really is needed.

They can be, but they can also be covered by assistance fro the government or insurance.

[Petticoats]

Petticoats,  the fact is the op wrote as one of her highlighted bullet points that grandma "helped raise my son"  which she descrived " invaluable"  this is alot diferent than "helping babysit"  it is not what she said. A parent who sits here and there for a.couple hours when the parents go to dinner is totaly not the same as helping raise a grandchild. That diminishes the significance of what she did.

You're missing my point, Ladybugs, which is that the mother's actions in the past are less important than her effect on the OP's household in the present.

[Wordgeek]

Ladybugs, you've made the same point a number of times now so, unless you have something new to add, move on.

[Marbles]

I think it boils down to this...I love my mother.   I want to do everything I can for her  (as does my husband).
But at what sacrifice?

[snip]
3.   Offering a certain "stipend" a month to help cover her costs.  $100?   $200?     
      Anything we give is money down the drain....that is why the idea of us buying her something is more appealing.

Additional background:
   
She is 78 years old.    She rocks it out.   Some days she has more energy than me.   Seriously.   
However, I have to acknowledge that there is the elder /aging aspect that will have to be addressed in a few more years.

I have set a precedent by letting her stay with me on and off.   Her watching my son was invaluable (and it benefited her financially)
But her constant presence was not good for my 10 year relationship with DS dad.   I will not allow this to cause havoc on my marriage.

5 Years ago - I recognized that she was not in good financial shape.    She absolutely REFUSED to let me help her come up with a long term financial plan.    (I didn't force her...and now look where I am).

This is tough.   Hard.   A Mindblowing/guilt inducing scenario.   

I suppose the right answer is the one you can live with.  And I love the pp who said  "how can we HELP her"  vs.  "how can I oust her".

(heavy sigh)    What would you do?

She is an adult who has chosen not to mind her money nor to let you help her with it. She gets to live with the consequences of that mismanagement. One of those consequences is that her choices for places to live are limited. You do not have to walk her through the possibilities, nor research them for her, but it would be kind to do so.

Another consequence is that she should not be trusted with any money you chose to give to support her. Pay anything like water, gas, electric directly. (Don't take on her phone bill unless it's a cell with unlimited long distance; don't ask me how I know this.  )

She is also a person who is making no effort to be pleasant to the people who are supporting her. One consequence of this is that you want her out of your house. This is reasonable.

Have you actually sat down with her and told her how she's making you all feel? Can you come up with a code phrase ("Ma, you're doing it again.") to let her know she needs to back off with the mean comments? She may be 78, but I don't believe that she can't change her actions if she chooses to. Even if she does change, I would still pursue getting her her own place.

You may not be able to help her see what she is doing to your family. She may justify or deny that she is doing it. Tough. This is not something that your DH should have to put up with, it's not something that you want demonstrated in front of your son, it's not the memories that you want to be building with her.

You do not need her permission to make changes in your home.

[dhk]

Do not under any circumstances do the 'in law apt' or duplux option.  I follow an eldercare message board and the outcome for the carer is dreadful. 

Often the elder will not understand the concept of privacy and will be in your place all day long or call 1000 times a day wanting you to do something for them.  It's important to have a certain amount of distance between you.

[Perfect Circle]

Do not under any circumstances do the 'in law apt' or duplux option.  I follow an eldercare message board and the outcome for the carer is dreadful. 

Often the elder will not understand the concept of privacy and will be in your place all day long or call 1000 times a day wanting you to do something for them.  It's important to have a certain amount of distance between you.

That isn't universally true. I know people who share close living arrangements with their elderly parents very happily - it is very much dependant on the relationships and types of people involved. In the same vein I don't believe anyone has to accommodate their elderly parents just because "it's the right thing to do". It isn't always.

It clearly isn't right for the OP, so I would suggest trying to find alternative living quarters for the mother without financially tying herself into those arrangements. If financial help is available from elsewhere, perhaps she can help her mother to try to find out all the options. I hope the situation sorts itself out.

[VorFemme]

I could do the duplex with my parents or ILs - based on having lived in the same town (at one time, two doors down the same street from my parents' house for several years).  Both mothers are introverts who would only ask for help when NEEDED.  The fathers are a little harder to figure out - DH could handle his father, I could handle mine - but as both are a good five or six hour drive away right now - we won't be the first choice of who to call.

The ILs have their daughter living in town and two of the early twenties grandkids staying with them "for now" (long story) but it seems to be working "for now".  My parents have a brother living close than I do (by about two hours) and they still drive themselves most places.

But I must admit that we are lucky that way.  Not everyone is.

[NyaChan]

Do not under any circumstances do the 'in law apt' or duplux option.  I follow an eldercare message board and the outcome for the carer is dreadful. 

Often the elder will not understand the concept of privacy and will be in your place all day long or call 1000 times a day wanting you to do something for them.  It's important to have a certain amount of distance between you.

That isn't universally true. I know people who share close living arrangements with their elderly parents very happily - it is very much dependant on the relationships and types of people involved. In the same vein I don't believe anyone has to accommodate their elderly parents just because "it's the right thing to do". It isn't always.

It clearly isn't right for the OP, so I would suggest trying to find alternative living quarters for the mother without financially tying herself into those arrangements. If financial help is available from elsewhere, perhaps she can help her mother to try to find out all the options. I hope the situation sorts itself out.

I've seen it work very well for family friends, so I wouldn't completely write it off.  Still, I think in the OP's situation, something that gives her family more distance would be better.

[BarensMom]

OP, you should really look into a senior apartment complex for your mother.  Since your mother is on a fixed income, she would probably qualify for housing assistance, which is based on her income.  Contact the housing authority in your area.

My SIL is in one of those communities and most of the cost of her rent is covered.  She only pays a "peppercorn" amount, due to her income status.

[lurkerwisp]

Aren't the apartments that feed onto the assisted living then nursing homes more expensive?  If she is completely able-bodied and poor, it might be better to start her out in a small cheap normal apartment.  Then worry about assisted living when it really is needed.

The apartments that feed into assisted living also guarantee that you will have a spot in the assisted living or nursing home that they feed into.  There are often very long waiting lists if you're not already in the system.  Rushing to find an open spot in a nursing home or assisted living place when it is very much necessary is not an ideal situation.

[trailgrrl]

Two separate scenarios.   My MIL moved in with us temporarily several years ago to escape a situation where she was being financially exploited by another family member.  We (My husband and I) got her back in control of her own finances and another family member of mine was able to get her in touch with a subsidized senior housing complex about 15 miles away and she has been happily living in what I jokingly call the 'Hen House' about 10 years now.  She neither owns a car nor drives.  The other ladies have taught her how to use public transportation, or the the ladies that do have cars drive her around.

My BFFs mother on the other hand has lived with my BFF and her family for about the same amount of time.   SHe is also on a limited income and positively delighted in causing trouble within the family.  My BFF bought a house that they were able to have modified into a bed/bath/sitting room suite for her privacy. The mother earlier this year got it into her head that my friend was dependant on her mother's goodwill and money (not so) and was invited to by all means to find another living situation. 

There is other back history here that I won't go into but suffice it to say my prediction to my friend that no way in heck was her mom going to leave voluntarily came to pass.  However the flip side is that my friend is now MUCH less accommodating of her mother's whims and mom now know that there is NO WAY that she would be able to live the lifestyle to which she has become accustomed if she moved into senior housing and has become *much* more pleasant to live with.

My advice is this.  Do what my friend did.  Tell mom that it's not working and you think *she* would be happier in her own place and then give her direction to subsidized senior housing complexes in your area (if you're in the US they should be listed on your county or township website or Area Agency on Aging Website).   You can take one of two directions, either make it clear that she is required to leave, or make it clear if she would like to stay she needs to readjust her attitude.

Good luck OP, it's a tough situation