Author Topic: Save The Manners! - Etiquette dying out that we need to protect (or not?)  (Read 6009 times)

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Emmy

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Men rising when  woman gets up or enters a room is a (welcome, I think) remnant of more formal manners. And not only men but women also once rose to acknowledge a newcomer - excepting grandmoms and such to  whom the  just arrived might be presented or introduced.  Nowadays  I rarely see this and am always glad when I do.  A respectful rise when a woman gets up is a tacit offer of help with the chair, etc., and can smooth over possible awkward exits.

It is most certainly not welcome for me.  I do not need help with my chair just because I am female and the assumption is insulting.

I think this rule made some sense when woman more commonly wore unwieldy and awkward to maneuver in gowns.  I dont mind it now if I'm wearing some dresses it can be helpful.

If my fiance wants to help me because I told him before hand I may need help, that's OK, and if someone sees me struggling and wants to help, that's OK, too.  However, to stand simply because I am female under the presumption that I need help simply because I am female is sexist, outdated, and not OK.

In shorter words: if the situation suggests my need for help, great, thank you; if my gender suggests my need for help, emphatically no thank you.

I agree that this rule seems outdated and am wondering in what situations it would be used.  It is hard to think of many modern day contexts where it would be appropriate or practical.  The only situation I can think of is a celebration of a guest of honor, such as guest applauding when a wedding party enters the reception or grandma enters the room where her birthday party is being held.  I can't imagine all the men rising when any newcomer or woman walks in to the dentist's waiting room, a crowded restaurant or ball room, the meeting room at work, or a casual get together of friends.  Women don't wear big dresses with hoops anymore and women can even easily sit down in formal wear so helping with awkward dresses isn't an issue these days.  I would find a whole table rising if I wanted to get up and use the restroom during dinner very awkward.



 

Pen^2

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Men rising when  woman gets up or enters a room is a (welcome, I think) remnant of more formal manners. And not only men but women also once rose to acknowledge a newcomer - excepting grandmoms and such to  whom the  just arrived might be presented or introduced.  Nowadays  I rarely see this and am always glad when I do.  A respectful rise when a woman gets up is a tacit offer of help with the chair, etc., and can smooth over possible awkward exits.

It is most certainly not welcome for me.  I do not need help with my chair just because I am female and the assumption is insulting.

I think this rule made some sense when woman more commonly wore unwieldy and awkward to maneuver in gowns.  I dont mind it now if I'm wearing some dresses it can be helpful.

If my fiance wants to help me because I told him before hand I may need help, that's OK, and if someone sees me struggling and wants to help, that's OK, too.  However, to stand simply because I am female under the presumption that I need help simply because I am female is sexist, outdated, and not OK.

In shorter words: if the situation suggests my need for help, great, thank you; if my gender suggests my need for help, emphatically no thank you.

I agree that this rule seems outdated and am wondering in what situations it would be used.  It is hard to think of many modern day contexts where it would be appropriate or practical.  The only situation I can think of is a celebration of a guest of honor, such as guest applauding when a wedding party enters the reception or grandma enters the room where her birthday party is being held.  I can't imagine all the men rising when any newcomer or woman walks in to the dentist's waiting room, a crowded restaurant or ball room, the meeting room at work, or a casual get together of friends.  Women don't wear big dresses with hoops anymore and women can even easily sit down in formal wear so helping with awkward dresses isn't an issue these days.  I would find a whole table rising if I wanted to get up and use the restroom during dinner very awkward.

When I was at school, we used to have to stand when the principal entered whatever room we happened to be in. Of course, the principal eventually retired and we had a new one. We had to stand for both, even though one was male and one female. I don't know if other schools do this anymore. I used to wonder what it was like to be the principal, having to wait for 10 seconds while everyone struggled to their feet at short notice whenever you walked into a new room. It must have been very annoying.

MissRose

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I'd like to remind people that thank you notes are especially important when someone sends you a gift and you can't thank them in person. Thank you notes are polite and also function as a confirmation that the gift was delivered and received. It's rude to leave a gift-giver wondering if you ever received the gift.

I'd like to say farewell to the rule that one can not mention gifts on an invitation, even to say "Please, no gifts." If I don't want gifts, I do want to be able to tell people in a clear way, but according to official etiquette rules, I can't. Ridiculous.

When I went to NYC for my milestone birthday and met up with several long time friends, I sent thank you notes to all those I had addresses for after I got home as they did give me gifts and attend my birthday dinner party.  Several of them helped me organize outings or other things too which were also mentioned.  One of my friends tweeted to tell me she got my card (as she hosted me in her home), and was surprised to get one as she knows thank you note writing is not something people tend to do much these days.

camlan

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I think it was in the Sue Barton, Student Nurse, books where the nursing students were told they had to stand when a doctor entered the room. The students were puzzled, because they were all female and the doctors were all male (the books were written in the 1930s-1950s). The reason given is that it is a sign of respect to the doctors. I think that's the only instance I know of where women were to stand up for men.

At restaurants, the entire restaurant would not stand up if a woman entered. It was only if a woman stopped at your table that a gentleman would have to stand.

And the context was key. In a huge ballroom, men would stand if a woman stopped near them, but not if someone entered the room 50 feet away. In a house with a small living room, probably every man would stand up if a lady entered. But in a house with a huge living room, probably only the men near the door would stand.
Nothing is impossible, the word itself says, Im possible! Audrey Hepburn


Library Dragon

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This one annoys me sometimes... When you are at any kind of venue whatsoever, if you are able-bodied, give up your seat to someone who is less able to stand (e.g. someone who is obviously tired, elderly, massively pregnant, etc). I've seen wedding receptions where the elderly grandparents of the wedded couple have been forced to leave because they physically couldn't stand for too long, and the other guests commandeered their chairs. It's awful
.

Similarly, don't start eating/drinking until you're sure everyone has food, especially people who might not be able to easily get food/drink for themselves (e.g. elderly, stiff person at a buffet). Unless you're somewhere where the meals will be so staggered as to make this impractical, wait a few minutes to ensure that no-one gets left out before you start your feeding frenzy, or they might go hungry and no-one notice.

At a large party we threw we had standing cocktail tables to encourage people to mingle and talk.  We had two tables of 12 with chairs for those we knew could not stand.  Our friend recovering from knee replacement, another just getting out after back surgery, etc.  We had large reserved signs on the tables. 

We had to ask those more able bodied to move after plopping themselves at the table.  These folks didn't have invisible disabilities.  A few were leaving the next day for a rock climbing trip.  They just didn't think beyond "oh there's a chair, get it quick." My friend with one lung opted to stand so she could better mingle.

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