Author Topic: multilingual rudeness (vent)  (Read 6857 times)

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gadget--gal

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multilingual rudeness (vent)
« on: January 06, 2007, 01:12:58 PM »
You'd think people would know that it's rude to speak about another person when they're right there in front of them. Just because you're speaking in another language (and you think they can't understand) does not make it permissible!!

I've noticed that a particular "people" do this a lot. (Of course, the name of this group is neither here nor there). I've spent most of my life in this part of town with a lot of these people and I picked up a couple of words in primary school from kids of said people. So I cant tell when they're talking about me.

On one occasion, I had some computer printouts to give to a neighbour. (I was passing her these printouts because she had confided in me about some dire circumstances in which she had found herself and was enquiring about whether I could give some advice from a professional perspective). So, when I got to their house, her father was outside. I ask if his daughter is around. He put his head in the front door and calls for her. He doesn't say "there's someone here" he says "there's a [gadget-gal's ethicity] person here" (!) I doubt he'd have said that if he thought I had had understood.

On another occasion, I'm on my way home and a little girl (about 4 or 5) on my street starts making racial remarks again, in said language. She's staring right at me. Right then and teenage girl comes out of the house (but she's not taking much notice of the kid.) I asked her "is that your sisters?" she says "yeah" So I just said "well, teach her some manners" and left it at that.

Last night, I stopped at a convenience store on my way home. As I'm paying ofr my items some other guy who's sitting down starts talkign about people od my race, my country etc. and he keeps going on and on. Silly me I was looking at him thinking he'd somehow get a clue. If I wasn't mid-transaction, I'd have walked out of the shop.

My first language is English but my mum and the rest of my family don't do this. When there's a third party in the room, they either end the conversation or switch to English. It's only polite!
« Last Edit: January 07, 2007, 05:39:22 AM by gadget--gal »

Ko-Ko

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Re: mutilingual rudeness (vent)
« Reply #1 on: January 06, 2007, 01:47:11 PM »
That is so rude! My mother had a related problem at her former workplace. She worked with three other women, they all spoke Hindi. They would speak Hindi to each other all day, and my mother could join in the conversation because she did not know what they were talking about. Needless to say, she did not feel very welcome.

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blue_bunny_paz

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Re: mutilingual rudeness (vent)
« Reply #2 on: January 06, 2007, 04:10:18 PM »
I agree that it's just not on. I grew up in a Welsh speaking part of Wales and from a very early age we had it drummed into us to not speak in Welsh in front of people who would not understand. Saying offensive things is really not on.

I used to have a flatmate at uni from country Y. all her friends would come round and speak Y-ian, often obviously about us. Until I learnt the Y-ian for "that's not a nice thing to say."

It's one thing, for example, to talk to a group of people in your own language if you are in a public place where you are not excluding anyone and you are not commenting on people around you. For example, if I were on holiday in France shopping I wouldn't feel guilty pointing out cheese rather than fromage to someone I was with. But I certainly wouldn't start pointing out how stupid everyone around me was.

Alida

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Re: mutilingual rudeness (vent)
« Reply #3 on: January 06, 2007, 04:15:29 PM »
My husband was raised in a foreign country.  Now, he doesn't look like most people seem to expect people from this country to look, but he's as fluent in that tongue as a native.  I speak it, also, but not to the detgree he does.

Maybe I'm going to eHell for this, but I will step into conversations like that, especially if the people are speaking in that language for the sole purpose of being rude.

DollyPond

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Re: mutilingual rudeness (vent)
« Reply #4 on: January 06, 2007, 04:37:25 PM »
Gadget-gal,

Since you can understand and to some extent speak their language just learn the phrase for "I can understand what you are saying.  Please stop."  I have learned this phrase in Spanish because, although not bi-lingual, I've learned enough Spanish to travel to Spanish speaking areas.  The phrase works very well on the random people (usually shopkeepers) who start to talk about "La tourista".  You don't need to engage in any further conversation with them.

Hope this helps.
Dolly

Edited to add: I don't mean this as any slur to the Latin community - I actually love to travel to these areas.  The incident reminded me of the time that I was in a shop and overheard the shopkeeper say " Charge her double. She's a tourist."  The above phrase along with " I don't pay double (No pago doble)" and walking out of the shop made an impression.
« Last Edit: January 06, 2007, 10:28:57 PM by DollyPond »

Tagy

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Re: mutilingual rudeness (vent)
« Reply #5 on: January 06, 2007, 04:48:40 PM »
I am an English-only speaker, but my best friend since college is an American raised mostly in XXXXX so she is fluent in both English and XXXXXXXX.

Several years ago, she and I were riding in a hotel elevator when two XXXXXXXX men got in with us.  The men were having a rather animated conversation but I didn't think of anything until my friend turned to me and started speaking XXXXXXXX.  I just gave her an off look, but the men looked at her with shocked faces, quit talking and stared at the elevator door the rest of the trip.

When we got out of the elevator, I asked her what was up with that and she told me that the men in the elevator, obviously unaware that one of us spoke their language, were making lewd comments about my friend and I.  She, in turn, was telling me, in XXXXXXXX, that only men with issues over the size of their, um, manhood, make sexual comments about strangers.

I know neither her nor the men will ever win any etiquette awards for their actions that day, but I can't help but chuckle when I remember the stunned looks on their faces.



*edited to remove the name of the country/language because I don't want to paint everyone from that country with the same brush
« Last Edit: January 06, 2007, 04:51:40 PM by Tagy »

Bijou

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Re: mutilingual rudeness (vent)
« Reply #6 on: January 06, 2007, 05:10:59 PM »
I am an English-only speaker, but my best friend since college is an American raised mostly in XXXXX so she is fluent in both English and XXXXXXXX.

Several years ago, she and I were riding in a hotel elevator when two XXXXXXXX men got in with us.  The men were having a rather animated conversation but I didn't think of anything until my friend turned to me and started speaking XXXXXXXX.  I just gave her an off look, but the men looked at her with shocked faces, quit talking and stared at the elevator door the rest of the trip.

When we got out of the elevator, I asked her what was up with that and she told me that the men in the elevator, obviously unaware that one of us spoke their language, were making lewd comments about my friend and I.  She, in turn, was telling me, in XXXXXXXX, that only men with issues over the size of their, um, manhood, make sexual comments about strangers.

I know neither her nor the men will ever win any etiquette awards for their actions that day, but I can't help but chuckle when I remember the stunned looks on their faces.



*edited to remove the name of the country/language because I don't want to paint everyone from that country with the same brush

I'd give her an award.  She really only needed to start speaking that language to you, though, and they would think both of you knew exactly what they were saying.  But maybe she had to address the content so they would know they were offending someone...she could have said, "They don't realize we know what they are saying."
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Rei-chan

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Re: mutilingual rudeness (vent)
« Reply #7 on: January 06, 2007, 05:19:58 PM »
I had a similar experience one time in a restaurant.  A friend of mine (Frank) is bilingual, and while I understand a little of his language, I don't speak it.   2 men in the booth behind us were making really lewd comments about our waitress, until Frank turned around and let them have it.  The men were so embarrassed that they paid quickly, boxed up the meal they had just gotten, and left.  I just wished I spoke the language fluently enough to say something myself!   :)

ETA:  booth is not spelled both  :)
« Last Edit: January 06, 2007, 05:24:23 PM by Willow1979 »

IndianInlaw

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Re: mutilingual rudeness (vent)
« Reply #8 on: January 06, 2007, 05:22:14 PM »
When I was in Maine, I was speaking to my mother.  Her husband has bad hearing and said (jokingly) "Are you two talking about me?"

I swear we said this in unison "No, if we were talking about you, we'd speak French".

Pixie

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Re: mutilingual rudeness (vent)
« Reply #9 on: January 06, 2007, 07:25:20 PM »
I don't know if anyone remembers my story about the German-born wife of my husband's friend.  Well, she had crashed a party at our house one night and brought her "Poopsie" along, I SWEAR that's what she calls her (then) 10 year old son!   

I heard from a friend of mine, and HER then 10 year old son, that  German Wife (GW) was standing in MY garage telling Poopsie how rude I was, how mean I was and how "all Americans act that way, so we shouldn't expect any better of them"   all in German.  She THOUGHT no one could understand her, but my friend and her son speak fairly good German, having lived there for 4 years.  I understand that GW also called me a few names, which should not be repeated ,all while accepting my hospitality.


I don't believe for a second that all Germans act like GW, in fact I know she would be considered rude in her own country.   Its just that GW makes it an issue because everything about Germany is better than anything in America and everything American is "less".    The part that just cracks me up is that she could have married anyone, but she chose to marry an American serviceman.   Guess not everything German is better, is it? 

I believe GW would be rude and obnoxious no matter where she lived, and no matter where she was raised, she's just not a nice person.  And boy, was she shocked the next time she ran into my friend and her son, who BOTH greeted GW and spoke to her in GERMAN!   I about fell over laughing, which I know was rude of me.



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Hawkwatcher

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Re: mutilingual rudeness (vent)
« Reply #10 on: January 06, 2007, 07:34:23 PM »
She called her son "Poopsie?" :o  Wow!  That poor kid is going to have some serious psychological issues when he grows up.  Can you imagine being this woman's daughter-in-law? 

IndianInlaw

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Re: mutilingual rudeness (vent)
« Reply #11 on: January 06, 2007, 07:35:57 PM »
My stepfather delivered milk to stores.  At one mom and pop place, Pop said to Mom in Polish "better count the bottles".  My stepfather said "I speak Polish".

After that, there was no need to count the bottles.  He was a paisan.

More recently, my mom was in a bakery in Biddeford, ME.  She asked the lady at the counter if they had a certain kind of bread.  The lady said no, then spoke French to her friend. She said "I really do, just not for you."

 My mom said (naturally) "I speak French".  The lady produced two loaves from behind the counter.

My goodness, this was in BIDDEFORD ME.   Everyone speaks French.

Pixie

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Re: mutilingual rudeness (vent)
« Reply #12 on: January 06, 2007, 08:08:35 PM »
In this part of Texas there is a large percentage of Americans of Mexican descent who REFUSE to speak English. I've heard them explain that their family was here first so they will just speak Spanish.   Hello, I'm Native American, who's family was here first?   But the one that always cracks me up is when they tell me in perfect English that they don't speak English.  I always laugh and say, "You just did." 

It normally doesn't bother me, or upset me... but the day I was at The Alamo and overheard a group of Mexican-speaking people insulting the Americans who died at The Alamo.... I walked away in tears.  It  just seemed so WRONG to me. Its so very hard to live here and be treated as an outsider in my own country.

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Sandi Papaya

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Re: mutilingual rudeness (vent)
« Reply #13 on: January 07, 2007, 02:38:55 AM »
It's awfully hard for anyone to tell, at first glance, what ethnicity/nationality I might actually be, so this happens to me all the time. Until I open my mouth and fluent Spanish flies out (my family is Cuban; I was born in the U.S.). I don't really mind people speaking other languages (besides Spanish or English, that is) in front of me, nor do I really care - or assume that I am being talked about unless they are looking at me (in that way that tells you that people are talking about you). But being that my ethnicity/nationality is a little hard to pin down, I've noticed people refrain from doing this to me a lot.

The funniest thing that ever happened to me was when I was working as an assistant in the computer labs at the University Extension Center while I was in college. The Extension Center was where the foreign exchange students went to take classes, and one time, there was a group of young Argentine men looking at porn, which even in 1995ish, was against computer-lab policy. Of course, they were acting sketchy, but I knew they were up to something. I pretended to ignore it, until one of them said, "You think the lab assistant knows we're looking at nudie pictures?"

The reply from one of his buddies was, "That stupid little American? She doesn't have a clue."

I flew up from my workstation at the front of the room and said, in perfect Spanish, "Excuse me, but what do you gentlemen (HA!) think you are doing, and where do you get off calling me a stupid American?"

The stuttering response was, "We-we're sorry - we - we - we didn't know you spoke Spanish!"

My reply went something like, "I certainly do speak it, and I know you're looking at porn, and you and I all know that that is strictly against the rules. I'm going to take your names now, I'm reporting you to the dean of foreign student affairs, and I'm going to see to it that your privileges are suspended until you can learn to use the computers appropriately."

They apologized profusely, begged me not to go to the Dean, promised they would never do anything again that wasn't strictly study-related, etc. I stuck to my guns and told them no dice; what they had done was strictly against policy (there was no anti-gaming or anti-chat policy, but students who needed the computers for study got precedence - porn was a definite no-no, though) and they had insulted me on top of it.

I relented a bit and got their access privileges revoked for a week, and apparently they warned the other Spanish-speaking students that the lab proctor spoke Spanish, because I made an awful lot of friends from all parts of Latin America after that particular incident. Even the Brazilian students were pretty polite to me, because although I don't speak Portuguese, it's very similar to Spanish and I could make sense of it most of the time.

The Japanese students, on the other hand, were always unfailingly polite, didn't do anything that was against policy, and even helped me practice my Japanese, which I was studying at the time. :) Not once did I ever hear anything that I might construe as an insult, even with my limited Japanese, from any of them.
« Last Edit: January 07, 2007, 02:42:26 AM by MsMoonbunny »

MerryRaven

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Re: mutilingual rudeness (vent)
« Reply #14 on: January 07, 2007, 03:12:33 AM »
Okay, but if any of you were in a non-English speaking country, would you speak in your language only?

Most tourists from the US expect everyone, everywhere to speak English.  And often they are correct as foreign languges are taught in school in other countries. 

So many people from Finland, or Japan, or wherever know English while I can say that I would have to be rude and speak only English in Finland or Japan.