Babysitting and Haircuts

[LifeOnPluto]

Grandma was doubly rude. Firstly, for presuming to cut her grand-daughter's hair without checking with the parents first. And secondly, for blatantly lying about it afterwards.

I think FSIL needs to be the one to talk to the grandparents (because they are her parents). She needs to state clearly that she is on her husband's side, and that there is absolutely no reason for her husband to be apologising to them.

And yes - no more "fun days" without the parents around. 

[dawbs]

Grandma doesn't get to pretend she doesn't know she did wrong--if she felt she had the right to behave in that way, she would't have lied.

IF the parents in question wish to have any contact with grandma (not sure they need to, but that's their choice), I would approach it as "mom, until you actually talk to ME, not sis, about what you did and display that you understand why it was inappropriate, I'm afraid we have nothing to talk about.  There will be no apology forthcoming from us.  "

[snowdragon]

If it were  me that grandmother would not be seeing, much less babysitting my child for a very long time

[kareng57]

No, they should not have done this without permission, and they should not have lied about it.

That said - I've seen quite a few toddlers with bangs (fringes) so long that it was apparent that the hair was often in their eyes, and they seemed/looked uncomfortable, and I wondered why the parents hadn't done anything about it.  IMO if the grandparents had said "we're sorry, we didn't mean to upset you but her hair was really in her eyes"........well, that's not great, but I wouldn't throw them under the "you will never see your grandchildren again" bus, either.

[zyrs]

Grandmother's conduct would make me livid.  I certainly wouldn't apologize to her, she better be apologizing to me.  It's the lying about what happened that bothers me the most, especially when she is watching a child.  There would be no visiting until she apologized and never would be non-supervised visits.

[Shoo]

No apology and no more time spent alone with my child.

Even WITH an apology, I'd be wary of leaving the child alone with them.

[TootsNYC]

That said - I've seen quite a few toddlers with bangs (fringes) so long that it was apparent that the hair was often in their eyes, and they seemed/looked uncomfortable, and I wondered why the parents hadn't done anything about it. IMO if the grandparents had said "we're sorry, we didn't mean to upset you but her hair was really in her eyes"........well, that's not great, but I wouldn't throw them under the "you will never see your grandchildren again" bus, either.

Because we are waiting for them to grow out, so they'll be long enough to put in a ponytail, and then we'll NEVER have the "hair in the face" problem again!!!!!!!!!

We were about .75" away from that point when my MIL decided to get 4yo DD's bangs cut. I was so mad! It had taken a long time to get to that point, and DD and I had JUST said, "Pretty soon you can have it all back in the ponytail!"

All our waiting, all her patience--throw right out the window.

I gave up--I was not willing to go through that again. So we stuck with bangs. Which meant that every 5 weeks I had to take her to get a haircut. And pay for it (because getting bangs right is too hard to DIY). Instead of simply being able to trim the ends of her hair myself every 3 months or so.

I didn't throw Grandma under the "never see my child again" bus, but I did make it clear that I wasn't happy. (I'm not sure why DD didn't say anything, but she was a very biddable child, so shee probably figured Grandma knew best--or didn't realize quite what was happening.)

I was really pissed off.

There is a rule, and grandparents should know it: No Grandparent May Get a Grandchild's Hair Cut Without the Express, Direct, and Wholehearted Approval of the Mother. (No, Not Even Dads Are Allowed to Permit This--Only Moms.)

The lying is the bad part, because it sure indicates that she KNEW she shouldn't have done it.

I think if I were in this situation, I'd simply cut off all contact and conversation for a while. I'd let everything cool down. If contact did happen for some reason, I'd be Teflon--vague, "oh no we're just so busy."

And then after about two weeks of radio silence, I'd say to my mother, "I'm upset with the fact that you got my daughter's hair cut without my permission. The logistics of managing her hair are MY problem; and you stepped over the line. And you KNOW you were over the line, because when you were asked about it, you flat-out lied.
   "And I'm also mad that you lied. Really mad. You owe both us parents an apology for usurping our parental authority; for making our lives more difficult because now we have to deal with the hair mess; and for lying to our faces about it."

[Danika]

When I first joined EHell, I had the same exact issue!

Here's the post.

In the end, I realized that my mother (she's the one who cut my children's hair against my express wishes) would never learn. She'd never respect my authority as a parent. She was always undermining me. I didn't know where it would stop. Was she going to get their ears pierced and do other things in the future too? I was sure she would.

I stopped letting my parents babysit because I didn't trust either of them.

And that upped their craziness. They got more hostile because they felt they had a right to make parenting decisions. They got more aggressive and a few months after my post, they earned the cut direct.

[rabbit_woman]

Reading these replies, i realise I have an opposite view, but here it goes.......

Firstly, regarding the haircut - it doesn't seem too strange to me that a grandparent, who does a lot of childcare and helps the parents a lot, would take it upon themselves to 'help out' or 'surprise' the parents by getting a grandchild's hair cut - my mum looks after my nephew and it would not seem strange for her to take tim to get his hair cut, to help out my sister. I don't have kids but if i did, it would not really bother me at all unless i had SPECIFICALLY said 'please don't get their hair cut, we are trying to grow it/ we like it like that, etc'

When i was little, my nan looked after me. one day, when i was four, she took me to have my ears pierced. i suppose my today's standards, that seems crazy, but it was all fine. in fact, considering my nan was horrible and really nasty to me, i think it was probably teh only nice thing she ever did for me, and i still remember the experience fondly.

if you trust your parents to look after your children regularly, for long periods of time, then don't you also trust them to make a few decisions ? Or even do something as a favour or a surprise for you?

AS for the lying, well ,that is very poor and out of order, but sometimes when faced with someone's totally unexpected anger people panic and don't know what to say and fall back on defensiveness and denial - not everyone is brave enough to go head first into a conflict.

I would say, give the grandparents another chance. Tell them that you don't want them cutting the child's hair in the future. And then, if they don;t learn their lesson from this occassion and DO do it again, then take sterner steps.......

xx

[LadyR]

if you trust your parents to look after your children regularly, for long periods of time, then don't you also trust them to make a few decisions ? Or even do something as a favour or a surprise for you?

xx

I trust my mother to watch DS, however she is NOT his parent and thus doesn't get to make panting decisions. Cutting his hair is a parenting decision and if my mother did it without my permission I'd be furious. If my parent pierced my kids ears without my direct consent? Well there'd be one major explosion, that's for sure and she wouod never watch my kids again.

Grandparents don't make to make decisions like that. They also don't get to introduce foods for the first time (a big conflict that several of my friends have gone through). They are not parents, you can trust someone to watch your kids, but still not want them to make major decisions.

My SIL's MIL gave my niece her first hair cut. My niece was 2 at the time and had baby fine hair that took a long time to grow. My SIL had been looking forward to her first haircut. She went away for two weeks, BIL took the kids to visit his mom and one day while he was out for a few hours, niece got a haircut. SIL was livid. Se didn't do much about it since she only sees her MIL twice a year, but I know it really bothered her,

[Geekychick1984]

I would be livid.  Cutting hair is a parent's decision...no one else should do this without permission first.  Doing so crosses a huge line to me.

The fact that grandma did it and lied about it shows that she knew it was wrong, and that the parents would be upset, but did it anyway.  I would not trust her to not cross other boundaries in the future.  She's shown she'll just lie about it anyway.

Honestly, if she'd just cut the bangs and owned up to it right away and apologized, I'd be furious, but would maybe give her another chance.  But the fact that she lied about it and then demanded an apology - I would personally not trust her with unsupervised visits (unless she sincerely apologized for everything and it was apparant she'd learned ehr lesson).

[laud_shy_girl]

Reading these replies, i realise I have an opposite view, but here it goes.......

Firstly, regarding the haircut - it doesn't seem too strange to me that a grandparent, who does a lot of childcare and helps the parents a lot, would take it upon themselves to 'help out' or 'surprise' the parents by getting a grandchild's hair cut - my mum looks after my nephew and it would not seem strange for her to take tim to get his hair cut, to help out my sister. I don't have kids but if i did, it would not really bother me at all unless i had SPECIFICALLY said 'please don't get their hair cut, we are trying to grow it/ we like it like that, etc'

When i was little, my nan looked after me. one day, when i was four, she took me to have my ears pierced. i suppose my today's standards, that seems crazy, but it was all fine. in fact, considering my nan was horrible and really nasty to me, i think it was probably teh only nice thing she ever did for me, and i still remember the experience fondly.

if you trust your parents to look after your children regularly, for long periods of time, then don't you also trust them to make a few decisions ? Or even do something as a favour or a surprise for you?

AS for the lying, well ,that is very poor and out of order, but sometimes when faced with someone's totally unexpected anger people panic and don't know what to say and fall back on defensiveness and denial - not everyone is brave enough to go head first into a conflict.

I would say, give the grandparents another chance. Tell them that you don't want them cutting the child's hair in the future. And then, if they don;t learn their lesson from this occassion and DO do it again, then take sterner steps.......

xx

Using this argument, teachers, nannies and the teen who watches your child, can also pierce your child's ears or cut their hair etc. Being trusted to look after a child dose not impart parental rights.

[Hmmmmm]

Reading these replies, i realise I have an opposite view, but here it goes.......

Firstly, regarding the haircut - it doesn't seem too strange to me that a grandparent, who does a lot of childcare and helps the parents a lot, would take it upon themselves to 'help out' or 'surprise' the parents by getting a grandchild's hair cut - my mum looks after my nephew and it would not seem strange for her to take tim to get his hair cut, to help out my sister. I don't have kids but if i did, it would not really bother me at all unless i had SPECIFICALLY said 'please don't get their hair cut, we are trying to grow it/ we like it like that, etc'

snip
xx

I think the experiences you are describing may be different from the OP.  The OP stated it was a "fun day" with the GPs.  That would imply to me that the GP's are not daily babysitters.  In your post you state it would be natural for your mom to take your nephew.  But it sounds like the babysitting arrangement is a lot more often and your mom and sister probably have convesations like remarking that he's hair is getting long and your mom replies that she'll take him for a cut and your sis is very thankfull.  But I don't know many parents who would be happy to drop their child off for a "fun day" with GPs and have the child come back with a different hairstyle unless it had been implied that the GP's had the authority to do stuff like that.

[postalslave]

There is a rule, and grandparents should know it: No Grandparent May Get a Grandchild's Hair Cut Without the Express, Direct, and Wholehearted Approval of the Mother. (No, Not Even Dads Are Allowed to Permit This--Only Moms.)

Seriously? Dad's doesn't get a say? What's the rational behind that? 

[wolfie]

There is a rule, and grandparents should know it: No Grandparent May Get a Grandchild's Hair Cut Without the Express, Direct, and Wholehearted Approval of the Mother. (No, Not Even Dads Are Allowed to Permit This--Only Moms.)

Seriously? Dad's doesn't get a say? What's the rational behind that? 

What if mom's not in the picture anymore? Does that mean that noone gets to decide?