Help in Dealing With Sister !~ LONG

[cicero]

hugs gena, this sounds like a really difficult situation.

Is your sister really criticizing you ? or is she stating fact? because when i read:

" It became increasing obvious to all of us when DD arrived here that she had little to know understanding of -blank blank, she had a flat affect, she was stunted in -blank blank, she had little to know understanding on how to read street signs or any basic life skills."

while i can understand how it may hurt you to hear this, these sound like facts to me. and in fact, you say that now, at age 20 (?) your DD doesn't seem to have basic life skills (from what you say in your later posts). this isn't a criticism of you or of anyone - it is a fact. My DS has issues - he cannot at this point in his life be on his own, he barely scraped through HS and hasn't gone to college and he is 26. This isn't about *me* being a bad parent, it is about *his* issues.  and while it hurts me to see him this way, it's not an attack on me when someone says "what's going on with DS".

I think that etiquettely speaking, you do not have to continue conversations with yoru sister if you don't want to.  just don't have *those* conversations with her.

[LeveeWoman]

hugs gena, this sounds like a really difficult situation.

Is your sister really criticizing you ? or is she stating fact? because when i read:

" It became increasing obvious to all of us when DD arrived here that she had little to know understanding of -blank blank, she had a flat affect, she was stunted in -blank blank, she had little to know understanding on how to read street signs or any basic life skills."

while i can understand how it may hurt you to hear this, these sound like facts to me. and in fact, you say that now, at age 20 (?) your DD doesn't seem to have basic life skills (from what you say in your later posts). this isn't a criticism of you or of anyone - it is a fact. My DS has issues - he cannot at this point in his life be on his own, he barely scraped through HS and hasn't gone to college and he is 26. This isn't about *me* being a bad parent, it is about *his* issues.  and while it hurts me to see him this way, it's not an attack on me when someone says "what's going on with DS".

I think that etiquettely speaking, you do not have to continue conversations with yoru sister if you don't want to.  just don't have *those* conversations with her.

How can that be a "fact"? Her sister is not a professional. She is nothing but a trouble-making jerk.

[cicero]

hugs gena, this sounds like a really difficult situation.

Is your sister really criticizing you ? or is she stating fact? because when i read:

" It became increasing obvious to all of us when DD arrived here that she had little to know understanding of -blank blank, she had a flat affect, she was stunted in -blank blank, she had little to know understanding on how to read street signs or any basic life skills."

while i can understand how it may hurt you to hear this, these sound like facts to me. and in fact, you say that now, at age 20 (?) your DD doesn't seem to have basic life skills (from what you say in your later posts). this isn't a criticism of you or of anyone - it is a fact. My DS has issues - he cannot at this point in his life be on his own, he barely scraped through HS and hasn't gone to college and he is 26. This isn't about *me* being a bad parent, it is about *his* issues.  and while it hurts me to see him this way, it's not an attack on me when someone says "what's going on with DS".

I think that etiquettely speaking, you do not have to continue conversations with yoru sister if you don't want to.  just don't have *those* conversations with her.

How can that be a "fact"? Her sister is not a professional. She is nothing but a trouble-making jerk.

Look, this is a very sticky situation.

but if the 17 YO girl had specific issues A, B, and C - those are facts. you don't have to be a professional to notice if a 17 YO cannot read street signs or had little understanding of X. again, it doesn't mean that the OP was a bad parent; all I'm saying is that it doesn't necessarily mean that the sister was being judgmental or critical of OP's parenting skills.

And I do think that from an etiquette POV, again, the OP should *not* discuss these things with her sister.

[LeveeWoman]

Fact: the sister is not a professional. Gena said she is "an arm chair psychiatrist".

[gena264]

hugs gena, this sounds like a really difficult situation.

Is your sister really criticizing you ? or is she stating fact? because when i read:

" It became increasing obvious to all of us when DD arrived here that she had little to know understanding of -blank blank, she had a flat affect, she was stunted in -blank blank, she had little to know understanding on how to read street signs or any basic life skills."

while i can understand how it may hurt you to hear this, these sound like facts to me. and in fact, you say that now, at age 20 (?) your DD doesn't seem to have basic life skills (from what you say in your later posts). this isn't a criticism of you or of anyone - it is a fact. My DS has issues - he cannot at this point in his life be on his own, he barely scraped through HS and hasn't gone to college and he is 26. This isn't about *me* being a bad parent, it is about *his* issues.  and while it hurts me to see him this way, it's not an attack on me when someone says "what's going on with DS".

I think that etiquettely speaking, you do not have to continue conversations with yoru sister if you don't want to.  just don't have *those* conversations with her.

I don't consider those to be facts because most of the things my sister has said were 'wrong' with DD are not true, or exaggerated. For example my DD can in fact read street signs. She used to walk all over our (small) town, to friends houses, school, library, work. It is true my DD is a bit behind in social skills but no where near where my sister was implying. DD had many friends, a boyfriend, worked as a waitress for almost a year, volunteered at an animal shelter and was in drama at school. She wasn't a 'cheerleader out going type", but she certainly wasn't antisocial. Lastly, my sister DIRECTLY told me that all of DD's faults were mine and my DH's fault.

[gena264]

Fact: the sister is not a professional. Gena said she is "an arm chair psychiatrist".

Exactly. My sister has always been this way for as long as I could remember. She believes something, it must be true and everyone else must believe it as well. She also likes to find 'causes', and involve others in fixing what she believes to be an issue. Sometimes some of her causes are facts. For example, my mom is obese, this is a fact. Sister decided we all must write mom a letter stating how concerned we are about her and want her to eat healthier. While of course that would be ideal for my mom to eat healthier, it is NONE of anyone's business how or what my mom eats. If sister wanted to privately share her concerns with mom that would be between them, but she always needs to involve others. I think it is like GreenBird pointed out earlier, because it is more about her than the person she is trying to fix. I never really looked at that way before, but it makes perfect sense.

[bopper]

'Thank you for your offer of mediation...I think it best to have an impartial person involved. Perhaps I will consider some family therapy."

[scansons]

hugs gena, this sounds like a really difficult situation.

Is your sister really criticizing you ? or is she stating fact? because when i read:

" It became increasing obvious to all of us when DD arrived here that she had little to know understanding of -blank blank, she had a flat affect, she was stunted in -blank blank, she had little to know understanding on how to read street signs or any basic life skills."

while i can understand how it may hurt you to hear this, these sound like facts to me. and in fact, you say that now, at age 20 (?) your DD doesn't seem to have basic life skills (from what you say in your later posts). this isn't a criticism of you or of anyone - it is a fact. My DS has issues - he cannot at this point in his life be on his own, he barely scraped through HS and hasn't gone to college and he is 26. This isn't about *me* being a bad parent, it is about *his* issues.  and while it hurts me to see him this way, it's not an attack on me when someone says "what's going on with DS".

I think that etiquettely speaking, you do not have to continue conversations with yoru sister if you don't want to.  just don't have *those* conversations with her.

I don't consider those to be facts because most of the things my sister has said were 'wrong' with DD are not true, or exaggerated. For example my DD can in fact read street signs. She used to walk all over our (small) town, to friends houses, school, library, work. It is true my DD is a bit behind in social skills but no where near where my sister was implying. DD had many friends, a boyfriend, worked as a waitress for almost a year, volunteered at an animal shelter and was in drama at school. She wasn't a 'cheerleader out going type", but she certainly wasn't antisocial. Lastly, my sister DIRECTLY told me that all of DD's faults were mine and my DH's fault.

See I think your sister's premiss is bad.  I think kids come out of the womb and the are what they are what they are.  I know mine are.  Of course mine are 4 and 7 so I could be wrong.  We can teach them manners.  We can teach them skills.  We can teach them morals.  But I don't think we can teach them to be other than what they always were. 

I think from now on your answer to her nosiness is something like "DD is an adult.  I can't change the past.  I won't discuss the past."  Repeat.   

I have two sisters and none of us turned out like our parents thought we should.  It made all of our relationships with them really hard around that 16-25 mark, depending on the daughter.  I think what you and your DD have gone through is not that strange, or uncommon.  And I think it's good that the two of you are talking.  That's a very hopeful step in the right direction. 

[LeveeWoman]

Fact: the sister is not a professional. Gena said she is "an arm chair psychiatrist".

Exactly. My sister has always been this way for as long as I could remember. She believes something, it must be true and everyone else must believe it as well. She also likes to find 'causes', and involve others in fixing what she believes to be an issue. Sometimes some of her causes are facts. For example, my mom is obese, this is a fact. Sister decided we all must write mom a letter stating how concerned we are about her and want her to eat healthier. While of course that would be ideal for my mom to eat healthier, it is NONE of anyone's business how or what my mom eats. If sister wanted to privately share her concerns with mom that would be between them, but she always needs to involve others. I think it is like GreenBird pointed out earlier, because it is more about her than the person she is trying to fix. I never really looked at that way before, but it makes perfect sense.

As I wrote earlier, she's a trouble-making jerk.

She has serious issues with boundaries.

[gena264]

I understand you had a close relationship with your sister when you were younger, but trying to reconnect with her on the basis of the past is like trying to recoup a sunk cost (money/time/merchandise that has been used and cannot be gotten back). It can't really be done.

So I'd suggest looking at your sister as she IS. NOW. And consider whether or not your sister is someone who adds benefit to your life NOW.

That's a really good point. I hadn't thought of it that way either which I know sounds silly. I was caught up in the little girl she was and how close we were. I was 13 when she was born and I adored her.  But yes, how she adds to my life NOW , is not very good.  I think maybe she is of the same mind set . She has said she wants things to be 'back like they were before'. You are right though, it can't be done.

[gena264]

[/quote]

See I think your sister's premiss is bad.  I think kids come out of the womb and the are what they are what they are.  I know mine are.  Of course mine are 4 and 7 so I could be wrong.  We can teach them manners.  We can teach them skills.  We can teach them morals.  But I don't think we can teach them to be other than what they always were.   
[/quote]

That is what I attempted to tell my sister in my last email to her a few days ago, before I sought advice on this board . That DH and I could try to teach DD all the 'negative' issues that sister brought up, but at the end of the day, DD is either going to choose to learn certain 'skills' or not. If it becomes important enough for DD to 'learn to read street signs' then she will learn it. Maybe that issue wasn't important enough for DD to bother with . (this is an example )

[gena264]

'Thank you for your offer of mediation...I think it best to have an impartial person involved. Perhaps I will consider some family therapy."

I said that to her.. well I emailed to her that I see a mediator as someone who is impartial and has no emotional interest in the situation. She agreed to that and then started with her psychoanalysis of my DD , pretty much out of nowhere . I could only assume she did  that  because she didn't like the idea of being turned down as a mediator.

[gramma dishes]

It seems to me that your DD was doing just fine when she lived with you.  She was doing okay in school, had lots of friends, outside interests (drama and volunteering), a boyfriend and a waitressing job (not easy!).  Her social skills clearly were there, even if a little different perhaps than those valued by your family.

I think your whole family is very much at fault here, not just your little sister.

The only good news coming out of this thread so far is that your DD is now living on her own with a roommate, so she's at least somewhat away now from their interference and influence.  Hopefully the day will come when your DD realizes that she actually had it pretty good at home with Mom and Dad! 

I would studiously ignore your sister.  She's using your DD and your own vulnerability here to try to make herself feel important.  She and the rest of your family have accomplished nothing but making things worse -- for both you and your daughter.  I know it would be hard, maybe impossible, but I'd vote for giving the whole shebang the direct cut.  (Not your daughter, of course.)

[cicero]

hugs gena, this sounds like a really difficult situation.

Is your sister really criticizing you ? or is she stating fact? because when i read:

" It became increasing obvious to all of us when DD arrived here that she had little to know understanding of -blank blank, she had a flat affect, she was stunted in -blank blank, she had little to know understanding on how to read street signs or any basic life skills."

while i can understand how it may hurt you to hear this, these sound like facts to me. and in fact, you say that now, at age 20 (?) your DD doesn't seem to have basic life skills (from what you say in your later posts). this isn't a criticism of you or of anyone - it is a fact. My DS has issues - he cannot at this point in his life be on his own, he barely scraped through HS and hasn't gone to college and he is 26. This isn't about *me* being a bad parent, it is about *his* issues.  and while it hurts me to see him this way, it's not an attack on me when someone says "what's going on with DS".

I think that etiquettely speaking, you do not have to continue conversations with yoru sister if you don't want to.  just don't have *those* conversations with her.

I don't consider those to be facts because most of the things my sister has said were 'wrong' with DD are not true, or exaggerated. For example my DD can in fact read street signs. She used to walk all over our (small) town, to friends houses, school, library, work. It is true my DD is a bit behind in social skills but no where near where my sister was implying. DD had many friends, a boyfriend, worked as a waitress for almost a year, volunteered at an animal shelter and was in drama at school. She wasn't a 'cheerleader out going type", but she certainly wasn't antisocial. Lastly, my sister DIRECTLY told me that all of DD's faults were mine and my DH's fault.

ok. i wasnt' clear on this from your first post.

and again, i think you need to just stop discussing *this* issue with your sister.

[Yvaine]

hugs gena, this sounds like a really difficult situation.

Is your sister really criticizing you ? or is she stating fact? because when i read:

" It became increasing obvious to all of us when DD arrived here that she had little to know understanding of -blank blank, she had a flat affect, she was stunted in -blank blank, she had little to know understanding on how to read street signs or any basic life skills."

while i can understand how it may hurt you to hear this, these sound like facts to me. and in fact, you say that now, at age 20 (?) your DD doesn't seem to have basic life skills (from what you say in your later posts). this isn't a criticism of you or of anyone - it is a fact. My DS has issues - he cannot at this point in his life be on his own, he barely scraped through HS and hasn't gone to college and he is 26. This isn't about *me* being a bad parent, it is about *his* issues.  and while it hurts me to see him this way, it's not an attack on me when someone says "what's going on with DS".

I think that etiquettely speaking, you do not have to continue conversations with yoru sister if you don't want to.  just don't have *those* conversations with her.

I don't consider those to be facts because most of the things my sister has said were 'wrong' with DD are not true, or exaggerated. For example my DD can in fact read street signs. She used to walk all over our (small) town, to friends houses, school, library, work.

Actually, in my experience, you don't necessarily need to read street signs to walk around a small area you're really familiar with--you learn it by memory and landmarks. The problem would become more evident in an unfamiliar area.