Author Topic: S/O PD Student Darwinism  (Read 211695 times)

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Garden Goblin

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Re: S/O PD Student Darwinism
« Reply #390 on: April 05, 2013, 03:36:51 PM »
Was this "picture of a filled-out answer sheet" or "picture of test questions" or "picture of an otherwise blank answer booklet?"  Because that would definitely affect whether I thought this was "cheating" or not.  (It's definitely breaking the rules, if no cameras/phones were allowed, but IMHO breaking the rules and cheating on the test are two overlapping but not identical sets.)

I've seen the pic.  Anyone who could manage to cheat off that pic deserves the A.

AngelicGamer

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Re: S/O PD Student Darwinism
« Reply #391 on: April 05, 2013, 04:04:41 PM »
Was this "picture of a filled-out answer sheet" or "picture of test questions" or "picture of an otherwise blank answer booklet?"  Because that would definitely affect whether I thought this was "cheating" or not.  (It's definitely breaking the rules, if no cameras/phones were allowed, but IMHO breaking the rules and cheating on the test are two overlapping but not identical sets.)

I've seen the pic.  Anyone who could manage to cheat off that pic deserves the A.

I agree! 

This link explains the story and shows the pic the student took: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/04/02/kyron-birdine-student-tweets-yolo-suspended_n_3000138.html




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VorFemme

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Re: S/O PD Student Darwinism
« Reply #392 on: April 05, 2013, 05:26:27 PM »
Okay - no questions were compromised in the photo that he tweeted.

But there is the question of "why did you have to show off that you broke the rules by bringing your internet capable camera equipped cell phone in there with you and USING it?"  Because simple logic says that you can protest LATER, using that same piece of equipment outside the testing environment and not have any splash back on breaking the rules impacting the rest of your life.  Which, as has been pointed out in that twitter post - you only get one life.  And being a thoughtless twit who twittered at the wrong time from the wrong place (a place not intended to have cell phones in it) about something controversial - will have an impact on that one life.

Now, it may be that the name will live on in the law books as part of a precedent setting legal ruling.....or it may be that the name will live on in a rather less imposing way, as verbal shorthand for someone exposing that they did something that they weren't supposed to do at all, at the wrong time, in the wrong place, and then sent photo evidence out intentionally...... 
Let sleeping dragons be.......morning breath......need I say more?

JustEstelle

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Re: S/O PD Student Darwinism
« Reply #393 on: April 06, 2013, 03:05:48 AM »
I gather from the information given that this particular test was in Texas.  I'm familiar with Texas law regarding this (having taught in public schools here for many years). 

It wouldn't matter if he tweeted the picture from the testing room or waited until he got home to do so; taking a picture of the testing materials in any shape, form, or fashion violated Texas laws regarding the testing and invalidated his test results.  In other words, he would have automatically failed.  The teacher proctoring the exam (and Texas law mandates that the proctors be licensed teachers) likely got sanctioned by the Texas Education Agency which could have included having his/her teaching certificate pulled for the kid having a cell phone in his possession during testing.  The state of Texas does not play about these matters.

Jocelyn

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Re: S/O PD Student Darwinism
« Reply #394 on: April 06, 2013, 11:32:53 AM »
After having had the 'academic suspension' talk with an advisee earlier this week (explaining the bitter truth that no, you cannot keep flunking your classes and continue as a student in this department or at this university) and identifying the steps he needed to take to avoid that unpleasant consequence, which included preparing himself for the exam I was giving Friday morning:

I looked at his corner of the room to see him flip his notebook with his thumb. As if subtly opening it to access answers. I then noticed that his cell phone was in plain sight, too.
About 2 minutes later he noticed that my eye was directly fixed on him, and it stayed there for the rest of the hour. I have never seen a student squirm so much during an exam. I don't know if it was because he realized I'd observed him (and that he'd just lost an ally he'd desperately need to be retained in the program) or because he'd realized how poorly he'd prepared to pass the exam without outside assistance, but he was the last student to turn in his exam.
And then I went back to grade the paper he'd turned in earlier...and found it was not the correct paper, but a paper he'd prepared for a colleague. I'd write it off as simple error, except that this is a common enough cheating technique: if you haven't completed the paper, turn in any old thing, and continue to work on the paper until the professor notifies you you turned in the wrong thing.

blue2000

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Re: S/O PD Student Darwinism
« Reply #395 on: April 06, 2013, 01:07:19 PM »
After having had the 'academic suspension' talk with an advisee earlier this week (explaining the bitter truth that no, you cannot keep flunking your classes and continue as a student in this department or at this university) and identifying the steps he needed to take to avoid that unpleasant consequence, which included preparing himself for the exam I was giving Friday morning:

I looked at his corner of the room to see him flip his notebook with his thumb. As if subtly opening it to access answers. I then noticed that his cell phone was in plain sight, too.
About 2 minutes later he noticed that my eye was directly fixed on him, and it stayed there for the rest of the hour. I have never seen a student squirm so much during an exam. I don't know if it was because he realized I'd observed him (and that he'd just lost an ally he'd desperately need to be retained in the program) or because he'd realized how poorly he'd prepared to pass the exam without outside assistance, but he was the last student to turn in his exam.
And then I went back to grade the paper he'd turned in earlier...and found it was not the correct paper, but a paper he'd prepared for a colleague. I'd write it off as simple error, except that this is a common enough cheating technique: if you haven't completed the paper, turn in any old thing, and continue to work on the paper until the professor notifies you you turned in the wrong thing.

Why did I never think of these things?!?

Oh, right. Because it was easier to just write the paper without cheating. :P
You are only young once. After that you have to think up some other excuse.

Jocelyn

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Re: S/O PD Student Darwinism
« Reply #396 on: April 06, 2013, 02:05:01 PM »
After having had the 'academic suspension' talk with an advisee earlier this week (explaining the bitter truth that no, you cannot keep flunking your classes and continue as a student in this department or at this university) and identifying the steps he needed to take to avoid that unpleasant consequence, which included preparing himself for the exam I was giving Friday morning:

I looked at his corner of the room to see him flip his notebook with his thumb. As if subtly opening it to access answers. I then noticed that his cell phone was in plain sight, too.
About 2 minutes later he noticed that my eye was directly fixed on him, and it stayed there for the rest of the hour. I have never seen a student squirm so much during an exam. I don't know if it was because he realized I'd observed him (and that he'd just lost an ally he'd desperately need to be retained in the program) or because he'd realized how poorly he'd prepared to pass the exam without outside assistance, but he was the last student to turn in his exam.
And then I went back to grade the paper he'd turned in earlier...and found it was not the correct paper, but a paper he'd prepared for a colleague. I'd write it off as simple error, except that this is a common enough cheating technique: if you haven't completed the paper, turn in any old thing, and continue to work on the paper until the professor notifies you you turned in the wrong thing.

Why did I never think of these things?!?

Oh, right. Because it was easier to just write the paper without cheating. :P
A related technique is to submit a jpeg file as a docx document. It automatically comes in 'corrupted', so that the professor believes you suffered a misfortune in the uploading.
Unless the professor knows to try to open the document in a program that will open jpeg files.  >:D

Sirius

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Re: S/O PD Student Darwinism
« Reply #397 on: April 06, 2013, 02:52:03 PM »
Med Student Darwinism:  Don't talk about other patients in front of other patients, and don't leave your clipboard full of notes about private patient data on the meal tray of a random patient.  These aren't good things to do when patient privacy is important.

These are huge no-nos even if you aren't a student.  I worked at a teaching hospital, and residents would often get on the elevator with me and be talking about patients.  I guess they figured that since I was wearing an employee badge it was safe to talk in front of me.  They shouldn't have been, though, because I wasn't involved in the patient's care. 

Acadianna

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Re: S/O PD Student Darwinism
« Reply #398 on: April 06, 2013, 03:24:06 PM »
I gather from the information given that this particular test was in Texas.  I'm familiar with Texas law regarding this (having taught in public schools here for many years). 

It wouldn't matter if he tweeted the picture from the testing room or waited until he got home to do so; taking a picture of the testing materials in any shape, form, or fashion violated Texas laws regarding the testing and invalidated his test results.  In other words, he would have automatically failed.  The teacher proctoring the exam (and Texas law mandates that the proctors be licensed teachers) likely got sanctioned by the Texas Education Agency which could have included having his/her teaching certificate pulled for the kid having a cell phone in his possession during testing.  The state of Texas does not play about these matters.

Paraprofessionals are now allowed to administer annual state testing (STAAR) -- there simply weren't enough certified teachers to cover all the rooms needed for various accomodations for two different forms of the test each day (individual or small group, oral, signed, etc.)

Everything else you said was spot on though!  In addition to invalidating his own test, it's also possible that the tests of other students who received the tweet could have been invalidated.  (Since this was a field test, fortunately, that's a moot point.)  But since it was a field test, any questions he photographed/tweeted would certainly be thrown out and never used -- possibly costing the state of Texas additional money to replace them.  Testing is not cheap; in Texas, it's a billion dollar industry.

IMO, this student behaved very childishly.  Yes, field testing is a royal pain and extra work for both staff and students alike -- but it's a necessary step in providing future test questions that are valid and fair, a purpose of which he was in apparent ignorance.  (Surprising for a high school student not to have realized this.)  There are certainly better ways to protest the requirement of field testing and the perceived misuse of his time than the one he chose.

If this were my kid, I can assure you I wouldn't be defending him, as his mother did.  He'd be apologizing to the teacher whose career he put at risk, and he'd be absolutely grounded until he understood that actions have consequences and "protesting" is not a license to hurt others.

katycoo

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Re: S/O PD Student Darwinism
« Reply #399 on: April 06, 2013, 11:17:00 PM »
Med Student Darwinism:  Don't talk about other patients in front of other patients, and don't leave your clipboard full of notes about private patient data on the meal tray of a random patient.  These aren't good things to do when patient privacy is important.

These are huge no-nos even if you aren't a student.  I worked at a teaching hospital, and residents would often get on the elevator with me and be talking about patients.  I guess they figured that since I was wearing an employee badge it was safe to talk in front of me.  They shouldn't have been, though, because I wasn't involved in the patient's care.

Even if the patient isn't identified?  Surely that's over the top.  I'm a lawyer and we disucss cases with people all the time - we just don't identify anything confidential.

JustEstelle

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Re: S/O PD Student Darwinism
« Reply #400 on: April 07, 2013, 12:14:33 AM »
I gather from the information given that this particular test was in Texas.  I'm familiar with Texas law regarding this (having taught in public schools here for many years). 

It wouldn't matter if he tweeted the picture from the testing room or waited until he got home to do so; taking a picture of the testing materials in any shape, form, or fashion violated Texas laws regarding the testing and invalidated his test results.  In other words, he would have automatically failed.  The teacher proctoring the exam (and Texas law mandates that the proctors be licensed teachers) likely got sanctioned by the Texas Education Agency which could have included having his/her teaching certificate pulled for the kid having a cell phone in his possession during testing.  The state of Texas does not play about these matters.

Paraprofessionals are now allowed to administer annual state testing (STAAR) -- there simply weren't enough certified teachers to cover all the rooms needed for various accomodations for two different forms of the test each day (individual or small group, oral, signed, etc.)

Everything else you said was spot on though!  In addition to invalidating his own test, it's also possible that the tests of other students who received the tweet could have been invalidated.  (Since this was a field test, fortunately, that's a moot point.)  But since it was a field test, any questions he photographed/tweeted would certainly be thrown out and never used -- possibly costing the state of Texas additional money to replace them.  Testing is not cheap; in Texas, it's a billion dollar industry.

IMO, this student behaved very childishly.  Yes, field testing is a royal pain and extra work for both staff and students alike -- but it's a necessary step in providing future test questions that are valid and fair, a purpose of which he was in apparent ignorance.  (Surprising for a high school student not to have realized this.)  There are certainly better ways to protest the requirement of field testing and the perceived misuse of his time than the one he chose.

If this were my kid, I can assure you I wouldn't be defending him, as his mother did.  He'd be apologizing to the teacher whose career he put at risk, and he'd be absolutely grounded until he understood that actions have consequences and "protesting" is not a license to hurt others.

I figured there might have been some changes.  I retired at the end of May 2008; over the years, I've done TABS, TEAMS, TAAS, and TAKS.  Also what my department head referred to as "son of TAKS."  Also those end-of-course exams.  We are testing the life out of our kids, but Texas is near the bottom as far as student success. 


MissRose

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Re: S/O PD Student Darwinism
« Reply #401 on: April 07, 2013, 05:02:37 PM »
When I was in high school in a social studies class (a class that came easy to me), one or 2 girls tried to cheat off my assignments and tests.  I wish I had a spine back then and ratted them out for what they did, and the class itself had some SD candidates as most of them did not pay attention to the teacher among other things.  I was able to get into the same social studies class with a counselor's help but with a different teacher who had students that did not dare to pull the stunts the other class was famous for doing.

In junior high, 1 girl stole one of my homework assignments and erased my name then put hers on it.  The kicker: my handwriting and hers were completely different in style so I got credit, she did not.  I cannot remember what her punishment was as it has been too long, most likely detention.

I hated group projects most of my school years as times I was either the last to be picked for a group or if I was picked was often asked to do a lot of the work as apparently I was gullible and quiet/shy.  Those were the days I had not developed a spine to tell the teacher what happened. 

LazyDaisy

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Re: S/O PD Student Darwinism
« Reply #402 on: April 08, 2013, 06:55:31 PM »
I wish I knew what, if anything happened to the student who tried to cheat off from my work. A million years ago in junior high school, I took a class in computer programming using BASIC. At the end of the class, we would save our assignments on a 5.5" floppy (I'm a dinosaur, I know) labelled with our name and file them away in a box that was accessible to not only our own class, but any other that used that classroom. One day the teacher called me up after class to ask me a bunch of questions about my assignments. Apparently someone from another class was writing code identical to mine, line for line. According to my teacher, this was unlikely to happen accidentally. He didn't believe that I was the cheater, but he let me know that someone was using my disk so I should hand it directly to him instead.

To be honest, at the time I was a bit flattered someone would want to cheat off me. I wasn't a top student in that subject and computer programming wasn't exactly a field many women were encouraged to pursue during the 80s. I was the only female student in that hour. Whoever was cheating off me wasn't sexist like most of my classmates at least.
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Seven Ate Nine

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Re: S/O PD Student Darwinism
« Reply #403 on: April 08, 2013, 07:08:34 PM »
I wish I knew what, if anything happened to the student who tried to cheat off from my work. A million years ago in junior high school, I took a class in computer programming using BASIC. At the end of the class, we would save our assignments on a 5.5" floppy (I'm a dinosaur, I know) labelled with our name and file them away in a box that was accessible to not only our own class, but any other that used that classroom. One day the teacher called me up after class to ask me a bunch of questions about my assignments. Apparently someone from another class was writing code identical to mine, line for line. According to my teacher, this was unlikely to happen accidentally. He didn't believe that I was the cheater, but he let me know that someone was using my disk so I should hand it directly to him instead.

To be honest, at the time I was a bit flattered someone would want to cheat off me. I wasn't a top student in that subject and computer programming wasn't exactly a field many women were encouraged to pursue during the 80s. I was the only female student in that hour. Whoever was cheating off me wasn't sexist like most of my classmates at least.

Maybe they were.  Maybe he (only works if it's a he) figured that since "girls aren't as good at computer stuff as boys" that you'd take the hit for cheating and he wouldn't be suspected.   ::)

LazyDaisy

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Re: S/O PD Student Darwinism
« Reply #404 on: April 08, 2013, 07:12:27 PM »
I wish I knew what, if anything happened to the student who tried to cheat off from my work. A million years ago in junior high school, I took a class in computer programming using BASIC. At the end of the class, we would save our assignments on a 5.5" floppy (I'm a dinosaur, I know) labelled with our name and file them away in a box that was accessible to not only our own class, but any other that used that classroom. One day the teacher called me up after class to ask me a bunch of questions about my assignments. Apparently someone from another class was writing code identical to mine, line for line. According to my teacher, this was unlikely to happen accidentally. He didn't believe that I was the cheater, but he let me know that someone was using my disk so I should hand it directly to him instead.

To be honest, at the time I was a bit flattered someone would want to cheat off me. I wasn't a top student in that subject and computer programming wasn't exactly a field many women were encouraged to pursue during the 80s. I was the only female student in that hour. Whoever was cheating off me wasn't sexist like most of my classmates at least.

Maybe they were.  Maybe he (only works if it's a he) figured that since "girls aren't as good at computer stuff as boys" that you'd take the hit for cheating and he wouldn't be suspected.   ::)

Oh, you may be right  :(   I hadn't thought of that.
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