Author Topic: Hats at the Rodeo  (Read 3239 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

TurtleDove

  • Super Hero!
  • ****
  • Posts: 5623
Hats at the Rodeo
« on: February 03, 2013, 11:39:01 PM »
Last night, my BF, daughter and I went to the World's Toughest Rodeo. We loved it!  We noticed that during the National Anthem, the male competitors took off their hats but the female competitors left theirs on.  All of the female competitors did.  My BF said he always understood that men took their hats off and women left their on, which would jive with what we saw. 

On the WTR website there is a woman who is outraged at the disrespect shown by the female competitors who left their hats on for the National Anthem.  Does anyone know the actual etiquette here?  I cannot fathom that the World's Toughest Rodeo would condone blatent disrespect from their female riders, but my web research comes up murky. 

Anyone want to weigh in?  For the record, my BF took his hat off the anthem and my DD and I left ours on. As did the female competitors and every female in my area.

MommyPenguin

  • Hero Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 4187
    • My blog!
Re: Hats at the Rodeo
« Reply #1 on: February 03, 2013, 11:43:11 PM »
My understanding is that, yes, it's the etiquette rule that women leave their hats on when men take them off.  But it's based on the fact that women's hats tended to be decorative things held on with hatpins; not something you could easily take off.  Whereas men's weren't attached, they just sat on the head.  I believe that both men and women are expected to take off hats that aren't decorative, like winter knit hats, etc.

I'm not sure about the rules for other hats, like what you mention.  Do women softball players take off their ballcaps during the national anthem?  I don't know.  You could look for video and see.

WillyNilly

  • Super Hero!
  • ****
  • Posts: 7490
  • Mmmmm, food
    • The World as I Taste It
Re: Hats at the Rodeo
« Reply #2 on: February 03, 2013, 11:53:19 PM »
Well don't usually women leave hats on in church where men are expected to take them off?  And at a dining table, such as lunch, women leave their hats on, while men are expected to remove them?  I don't see how the national anthem is different.

To be honest so long as someone is silent and still/not doing anything distracting, I don't really care what they do during the anthem.  Basically IMO you don't need to do anything except not impede others treating it is sacred.

Yvaine

  • Super Hero!
  • ****
  • Posts: 8716
Re: Hats at the Rodeo
« Reply #3 on: February 04, 2013, 12:01:30 AM »
There are some people who go around looking for patriotic offense, just like people who go around looking for other types of offense. Without knowing what they're really talking about, they are eager to ding random strangers for "disrespecting the flag/anthem" whether any breach is really happening or not. I suspect you've stumbled across one of these.

behindbj

  • Hero Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 2088
Re: Hats at the Rodeo
« Reply #4 on: February 04, 2013, 08:47:10 AM »
This comes up a lot at baseball games.  As a woman who wears all kinds of hats, I've made sure that I've got my hatiquette (sorry...) sorted out.

If a woman's hat is a woman's hat (as in, meant to be an accessory to an outfit), it stays on.

If the hat a woman is wearing is a "man's" hat or a sports cap (like a baseball cap), it comes off. 

As someone who wears a stetson as outwear in the weather, I take mine off.  I have no idea about the cowboy hats in this one, but if it were to follow the "general" working/sports hat etiquette above, they come off.  HOWEVER, it may be perfectly acceptable in that realm of hat culture to leave them on.

Of course, I'm not going to question someone's patriotism over it. 

Sharnita

  • Super Hero!
  • ****
  • Posts: 21354
Re: Hats at the Rodeo
« Reply #5 on: February 04, 2013, 08:49:28 AM »
As far as church, there are some traditions that did (or do) require a woman cover her head.  In fact, I think that in general there is more of a historical tradition of "modest" women covering their head/hair in public. Now I doubt the women competing still live by the expectation that they never appear in public wihtou appropriate headgear but the history might still influence the current protocol of what to do when wearing a hat.


Yvaine

  • Super Hero!
  • ****
  • Posts: 8716
Re: Hats at the Rodeo
« Reply #6 on: February 04, 2013, 08:51:14 AM »
I would bet that a lot of the non-performing women do have their hats pinned on and integrated into their do's, even if the hat is a cowboy hat. I don't know how the performers do their hats, but I suspect they're following the lead of the rest of the subculture in leaving them on.

Hmmmmm

  • Super Hero!
  • ****
  • Posts: 6260
Re: Hats at the Rodeo
« Reply #7 on: February 04, 2013, 09:01:27 AM »
This comes up a lot at baseball games.  As a woman who wears all kinds of hats, I've made sure that I've got my hatiquette (sorry...) sorted out.

If a woman's hat is a woman's hat (as in, meant to be an accessory to an outfit), it stays on.

If the hat a woman is wearing is a "man's" hat or a sports cap (like a baseball cap), it comes off. 

As someone who wears a stetson as outwear in the weather, I take mine off.  I have no idea about the cowboy hats in this one, but if it were to follow the "general" working/sports hat etiquette above, they come off.  HOWEVER, it may be perfectly acceptable in that realm of hat culture to leave them on.

Of course, I'm not going to question someone's patriotism over it.

Behindbj is right.  Women's hats were accesories and meant to be left on at all times other than when they were at home. 

I read an article a few years back and they had asked Ms. Manners about baseball hats and cowboy hats on women and whether they should be removed by women during the times men were expected to.  She gave similar advice ast Behindbj but said that there really hadn't been an official update of the rules for women wearing what was traditionally a male style hat. 


hobish

  • Super Hero!
  • ****
  • Posts: 18186
  • Release the gelfling!
Re: Hats at the Rodeo
« Reply #8 on: February 04, 2013, 09:25:54 AM »
I would bet that a lot of the non-performing women do have their hats pinned on and integrated into their do's, even if the hat is a cowboy hat. I don't know how the performers do their hats, but I suspect they're following the lead of the rest of the subculture in leaving them on.

Having ridden in horse shows when i was younger i would bet the competitors hats are pinned on, as well. Heck, sometimes even the guys had cornrows and a ton of bobby pins all up under there. I don't recall the anthem ever being played, we're talking small potatoes horse shows; but i can't imagine trying to get my hat off and back on again and being ring ready very quickly.


It's alright, man. I'm only bleeding, man. Stay hungry, stay free, and do the best you can.
~Gaslight Anthem

bopper

  • Super Hero!
  • ****
  • Posts: 12217
Re: Hats at the Rodeo
« Reply #9 on: February 04, 2013, 09:43:11 AM »
United States Flag Code:

Conduct During Playing: During a rendition of the national anthem:

When the flag is displayed:[14]

individuals in uniform should give the military salute at the first note of the anthem and maintain that position until the last note;

members of the Armed Forces and veterans who are present but not in uniform may render the military salute in the manner provided for individuals in uniform; and

all other persons present should face the flag and stand at attention with their right hand over the heart, and men not in uniform, if applicable, should remove their headdress with their right hand and hold it at the left shoulder, the hand being over the heart; and

when the flag is not displayed, all present should face toward the music and act in the same manner they would if the flag were displayed.

TurtleDove

  • Super Hero!
  • ****
  • Posts: 5623
Re: Hats at the Rodeo
« Reply #10 on: February 04, 2013, 09:43:22 AM »
I haven't heard back from the WTR on the issue yet, but given the general heightened level of patriotism and respect shown throughout the rodeo, I simply cannot fathom that the rodeo would condone the women showing blatent disrespect during the National Anthem (and it was obvious - all of the women competitors kept their hats on) which leads me to believe that in rodeo culture, women leave their hats on as a sign of respect.  I mean, the women competitors were holding and waving the flag along with the male competitors as this was going on. 

Redneck Gravy

  • Hero Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 2617
Re: Hats at the Rodeo
« Reply #11 on: February 04, 2013, 09:45:31 AM »
I used to travel on the rodeo circuit as an observer and women do leave their hats on.   Mine was sometimes pinned on also.

I have never heard a complaint about this before ? 

lady_disdain

  • Super Hero!
  • ****
  • Posts: 5749
    • Contemporary Jewelry
Re: Hats at the Rodeo
« Reply #12 on: February 04, 2013, 10:14:20 AM »
Yup, women cover their hair to show modesty and respect. You can see this still in a lot of the more traditional churches, where women wear shawls over their hair, or ladies visiting the Pope in Rome, where the protocol is that they wear black and hair coverings. With time, the hair coverings evolved into hats but it still remained that women wore something on their heads if they stepped outside their houses.

Men, on the other hand, uncover to show respect. This seems to come from military tradition (removing a helmet).

poundcake

  • Hero Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 1004
Re: Hats at the Rodeo
« Reply #13 on: February 04, 2013, 10:57:12 AM »
Women (generally) leave hats on, men remove them. It's also (generally) acceptable for kids to leave hats on as well.

Twik

  • A Pillar of the Forum
  • *****
  • Posts: 28299
Re: Hats at the Rodeo
« Reply #14 on: February 04, 2013, 11:01:39 AM »
The outraged woman is using logic, but not tradition. Men remove their hats as a sign of respect, women don't.
My cousin's memoir of love and loneliness while raising a child with multiple disabilities will be out on Amazon soon! Know the Night, by Maria Mutch, has been called "full of hope, light, and companionship for surviving the small hours of the night."