Author Topic: When are 2nd time showers okay?  (Read 9997 times)

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snowdragon

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Re: When are 2nd time showers okay?
« Reply #45 on: March 06, 2013, 11:57:51 AM »
The understanding is that a first time parent needs a lot, but subsequent pregnancies have fewer needs, thus, the shower is really just a "Hey, congrats on the new kid, have some diapers" kind of thing.

In my experience, baby showers are not to provide the parents to be with items they cannot afford on their own.  Every shower I have ever been to (wedding or baby or otherwise) has been like this.  People go because they want to celebrate the event, and generally gifts are given but that has never been the focus in my experience.  To me, if I were judging someone for having a "gift grab" I probably would not be friends with them and it just wouldn't affect me because either I would not be invited or I would RSVP no.  I think that is why I struggle to understand the intensely negative and judgmental attitudes when it comes to "showers."  It might be a matter of wording, but I really don't get it.  I had a bridal shower and a baby shower and I certainly wasn't given anything I couldn't afford to buy myself - that wasn't the point of the event.  The point was to celebrate that I was getting married and having a baby, respectively.  Honestly, I don't think I have ever been to a shower where the point was to give gifts to the guest of honor because she needed the help.

You could just run in different circles.  In certain circles - yes it is THE way to out fit a kid.   And I am not just  talking poverty stricken parents,,,,,there are people who think every baby needs new stuff and this is the way to get it.  I have a cousin like this - she just had her 5th kid and wants everyone in the family to throw her a shower, and will be frightfully insulted when folks decline the invite to the shower she throws herself.  She was like this for all her kids.  I the first there were only about 28 months apart and she had showers for each one ( along with #4 who was a little later) and wanted things like cribs and car seats bought brand new for each kid FOR her.  She was very upset when no one bought her a new crib for #2 and she had to buy it herself.  Her facebook status the evening of her 2nd shower was about how she was hurt and insulted  because "no one  bought her the things this child will need, they expect me to do this by myself".  Third shower was much the same - 4th she was even asking for diaper wipe warmers. 
    She the worst example of this I can think of but I've gotten several over the past few years where the attendees were expected to outfit the kid so the parents don't have to. 

Lynn2000

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Re: When are 2nd time showers okay?
« Reply #46 on: March 06, 2013, 12:40:20 PM »
While I hope I wouldn't stay friends with a total gimme pig either, sometimes they are relatives so there's family pressure to contribute. Also, my friend Amy has this attitude that people ought to provide other people with new baby stuff, at least the first time around and maybe more often--she wants to receive it from people, and she also wants to give it to people. So at least she's willing to give back, but she'll say stuff like, "They/we can't afford to pay for everything on their/our own." That to her seems a perfectly good reason, for herself and others. I disagree...

ETA: I mean I think of it more as a celebration where people give gifts because it's fun and they want to, but I think there shouldn't be an obligation to give gifts for any reason. It's just that "shouldn't be" is very different from reality sometimes, IME. And some other people are fine with the gifts being obligatory.
« Last Edit: March 06, 2013, 05:18:09 PM by Lynn2000 »
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Mammavan3

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Re: When are 2nd time showers okay?
« Reply #47 on: March 06, 2013, 04:50:50 PM »
The understanding is that a first time parent needs a lot, but subsequent pregnancies have fewer needs, thus, the shower is really just a "Hey, congrats on the new kid, have some diapers" kind of thing.

In my experience, baby showers are not to provide the parents to be with items they cannot afford on their own.  Every shower I have ever been to (wedding or baby or otherwise) has been like this.  People go because they want to celebrate the event, and generally gifts are given but that has never been the focus in my experience.  To me, if I were judging someone for having a "gift grab" I probably would not be friends with them and it just wouldn't affect me because either I would not be invited or I would RSVP no.  I think that is why I struggle to understand the intensely negative and judgmental attitudes when it comes to "showers."  It might be a matter of wording, but I really don't get it.  I had a bridal shower and a baby shower and I certainly wasn't given anything I couldn't afford to buy myself - that wasn't the point of the event.  The point was to celebrate that I was getting married and having a baby, respectively.  Honestly, I don't think I have ever been to a shower where the point was to give gifts to the guest of honor because she needed the help.

I have to disagree. The very point of a shower is to give gifts; whether the parents can afford the gifts or not is immaterial.

There are many different ways to celebrate a birth, such as a meet-the-baby party, and I thought the wedding reception was the celebration of the wedding.

TurtleDove

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Re: When are 2nd time showers okay?
« Reply #48 on: March 06, 2013, 05:00:38 PM »
I have to disagree. The very point of a shower is to give gifts; whether the parents can afford the gifts or not is immaterial.

There are many different ways to celebrate a birth, such as a meet-the-baby party, and I thought the wedding reception was the celebration of the wedding.

I am not certain how you can disagree with my experience. At any rate, please be assured that my experience is real.

bah12

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Re: When are 2nd time showers okay?
« Reply #49 on: March 06, 2013, 06:56:00 PM »
The understanding is that a first time parent needs a lot, but subsequent pregnancies have fewer needs, thus, the shower is really just a "Hey, congrats on the new kid, have some diapers" kind of thing.

In my experience, baby showers are not to provide the parents to be with items they cannot afford on their own.  Every shower I have ever been to (wedding or baby or otherwise) has been like this.  People go because they want to celebrate the event, and generally gifts are given but that has never been the focus in my experience.  To me, if I were judging someone for having a "gift grab" I probably would not be friends with them and it just wouldn't affect me because either I would not be invited or I would RSVP no.  I think that is why I struggle to understand the intensely negative and judgmental attitudes when it comes to "showers."  It might be a matter of wording, but I really don't get it.  I had a bridal shower and a baby shower and I certainly wasn't given anything I couldn't afford to buy myself - that wasn't the point of the event.  The point was to celebrate that I was getting married and having a baby, respectively.  Honestly, I don't think I have ever been to a shower where the point was to give gifts to the guest of honor because she needed the help.

You could just run in different circles.  In certain circles - yes it is THE way to out fit a kid.   And I am not just  talking poverty stricken parents,,,,,there are people who think every baby needs new stuff and this is the way to get it.  I have a cousin like this - she just had her 5th kid and wants everyone in the family to throw her a shower, and will be frightfully insulted when folks decline the invite to the shower she throws herself.  She was like this for all her kids.  I the first there were only about 28 months apart and she had showers for each one ( along with #4 who was a little later) and wanted things like cribs and car seats bought brand new for each kid FOR her.  She was very upset when no one bought her a new crib for #2 and she had to buy it herself.  Her facebook status the evening of her 2nd shower was about how she was hurt and insulted  because "no one  bought her the things this child will need, they expect me to do this by myself".  Third shower was much the same - 4th she was even asking for diaper wipe warmers. 
    She the worst example of this I can think of but I've gotten several over the past few years where the attendees were expected to outfit the kid so the parents don't have to.

I think, though, that in any situation you're going to find people that use the event to either take advantage of others or get things for free.  Does the fact that there are people who expect elaborate birthday parties every year and expensive gifts make anyone throwing a birthday party (even every year) rude?

I'm sure there are plenty of moms to be out there who think that everyone needs to "shower" each of their babies with brand new stuff and expect showers so they can get necessities without having to fund it themselves.  But there's also plenty of mom's to be out there, along with her friends and family, that just enjoy celebrating the occasion. 

Like I said I don't have a hangup about second showers but I think it's the word that throws people off.  If it were called a celebratory party and people brought gifts because they wanted to, it may not be as big of an issue.

For the original question, when are second showers ok?  I say it's when friends and family want to do it on their own accord (not because of expectations or demands) and the Mom to be is agreeable to it. 

snowdragon

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Re: When are 2nd time showers okay?
« Reply #50 on: March 06, 2013, 07:10:50 PM »
The understanding is that a first time parent needs a lot, but subsequent pregnancies have fewer needs, thus, the shower is really just a "Hey, congrats on the new kid, have some diapers" kind of thing.

In my experience, baby showers are not to provide the parents to be with items they cannot afford on their own.  Every shower I have ever been to (wedding or baby or otherwise) has been like this.  People go because they want to celebrate the event, and generally gifts are given but that has never been the focus in my experience.  To me, if I were judging someone for having a "gift grab" I probably would not be friends with them and it just wouldn't affect me because either I would not be invited or I would RSVP no.  I think that is why I struggle to understand the intensely negative and judgmental attitudes when it comes to "showers."  It might be a matter of wording, but I really don't get it.  I had a bridal shower and a baby shower and I certainly wasn't given anything I couldn't afford to buy myself - that wasn't the point of the event.  The point was to celebrate that I was getting married and having a baby, respectively.  Honestly, I don't think I have ever been to a shower where the point was to give gifts to the guest of honor because she needed the help.

You could just run in different circles.  In certain circles - yes it is THE way to out fit a kid.   And I am not just  talking poverty stricken parents,,,,,there are people who think every baby needs new stuff and this is the way to get it.  I have a cousin like this - she just had her 5th kid and wants everyone in the family to throw her a shower, and will be frightfully insulted when folks decline the invite to the shower she throws herself.  She was like this for all her kids.  I the first there were only about 28 months apart and she had showers for each one ( along with #4 who was a little later) and wanted things like cribs and car seats bought brand new for each kid FOR her.  She was very upset when no one bought her a new crib for #2 and she had to buy it herself.  Her facebook status the evening of her 2nd shower was about how she was hurt and insulted  because "no one  bought her the things this child will need, they expect me to do this by myself".  Third shower was much the same - 4th she was even asking for diaper wipe warmers. 
    She the worst example of this I can think of but I've gotten several over the past few years where the attendees were expected to outfit the kid so the parents don't have to.

I think, though, that in any situation you're going to find people that use the event to either take advantage of others or get things for free.  Does the fact that there are people who expect elaborate birthday parties every year and expensive gifts make anyone throwing a birthday party (even every year) rude?

I'm sure there are plenty of moms to be out there who think that everyone needs to "shower" each of their babies with brand new stuff and expect showers so they can get necessities without having to fund it themselves.  But there's also plenty of mom's to be out there, along with her friends and family, that just enjoy celebrating the occasion. 

Like I said I don't have a hangup about second showers but I think it's the word that throws people off.  If it were called a celebratory party and people brought gifts because they wanted to, it may not be as big of an issue.

For the original question, when are second showers ok?  I say it's when friends and family want to do it on their own accord (not because of expectations or demands) and the Mom to be is agreeable to it.


 And I still say never,  if the friends and family want a shower the mom should be refusing and steering towards something where gifts are not the focus.

turnip

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Re: When are 2nd time showers okay?
« Reply #51 on: March 06, 2013, 07:12:41 PM »
The understanding is that a first time parent needs a lot, but subsequent pregnancies have fewer needs, thus, the shower is really just a "Hey, congrats on the new kid, have some diapers" kind of thing.

In my experience, baby showers are not to provide the parents to be with items they cannot afford on their own.  Every shower I have ever been to (wedding or baby or otherwise) has been like this.  People go because they want to celebrate the event, and generally gifts are given but that has never been the focus in my experience.  To me, if I were judging someone for having a "gift grab" I probably would not be friends with them and it just wouldn't affect me because either I would not be invited or I would RSVP no.  I think that is why I struggle to understand the intensely negative and judgmental attitudes when it comes to "showers."  It might be a matter of wording, but I really don't get it.  I had a bridal shower and a baby shower and I certainly wasn't given anything I couldn't afford to buy myself - that wasn't the point of the event.  The point was to celebrate that I was getting married and having a baby, respectively.  Honestly, I don't think I have ever been to a shower where the point was to give gifts to the guest of honor because she needed the help.

I'm with you TurtleDove!

I like my friends and relatives.   This sometimes seems to put me in a minority position on this forum ;-)  If you are having a baby, I'm getting you something.   If you are getting married, I'm getting you something.   If you invite me to a party - I'm coming!   IMHO, modern life is isolating enough without coming up with more reasons to turn down chances to socialize with friends.

hobish

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Re: When are 2nd time showers okay?
« Reply #52 on: March 06, 2013, 07:13:00 PM »
Even after how long on this board, and this thread popping up for four pages, i saw it and thought, "I dunno, i might be out playing with horses or shoveling dog poo or something ... sometimes a second shower is really neccessary..."  ::)

Except for in extreme circumstances, i am anti-second shower. I think in the last few years people have made up their own definition of a shower to mean that every kid needs a shower because every baby deserves to be welcomed (as if they know ???) ... i don't get it, i don't care, and i don't go. That's a lie. I was sort of guilted into co-hosting a second shower for a friend and to this day i wish i had stood up and said No, No, Nuh-uh, No. I feel like the tacky is all over me in a bad way (not in a good way like cheap plasic parrot earrings).


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Lynn2000

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Re: When are 2nd time showers okay?
« Reply #53 on: March 06, 2013, 08:13:18 PM »
I'm with you TurtleDove!

I like my friends and relatives.   This sometimes seems to put me in a minority position on this forum ;-)  If you are having a baby, I'm getting you something.   If you are getting married, I'm getting you something.   If you invite me to a party - I'm coming!   IMHO, modern life is isolating enough without coming up with more reasons to turn down chances to socialize with friends.

Honestly, I agree with you. (Well, actually I don't like parties much, but anyway...) I even get gifts for friends and relatives when they just announce they're pregnant! For someone I'm close to, it could easily be 1) pregnancy announcement gift, 2) shower gift, 3) actual baby is born gift, 4) going to visit the baby for the first time gift... I like giving gifts.

The part where it gets sticky for me is being asked for a gift. I think people have to be careful about that. And inviting people to a "shower" is asking them for a gift, IMO, because a "shower" is a gift-giving occasion. It's just a word, yes, but to me that word means "bring a gift," and other words--like bridal luncheon or meet-the-baby party--don't necessarily mean "bring a gift."

I could understand if some people don't feel that's an important distinction. My friend Amy, for example, in discussing reasons for giving her cousin's wife a shower for her fourth child, said, "Everyone would be getting them a baby gift anyway." It's true, I'm sure every single person she's planning to invite to the shower (mainly relatives) would have given the couple a baby gift anyway... spontaneously and with no prompting from anyone, in their own time and without much opportunity for the gifts from different people to be compared and judged. Now, they're being prompted, there's a deadline, and the gift will be announced, described, and set alongside everyone else's gift, so most people will probably spend more than they'd originally planned so they don't look cheap.

If this way of thinking seems really weird to you, good! :) I hope that means you've had only good experiences at these things. This is just the way I've experienced things, and I think they can be awkward sometimes. To me the difference between asking someone for a gift, and them getting you a gift of their own accord, is pretty big, and I think the former has to be used carefully--first baby only, for example. Otherwise things can start to get a rude feeling to them. Totally IMO, of course.
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fountainof

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Re: When are 2nd time showers okay?
« Reply #54 on: March 06, 2013, 08:13:52 PM »
I would be okay with a second shower for close friends/family where the relationship is pretty even overall , the event was more like a party rather than a traditional shower and the event was kept small and not some hundred people event.  However, if I knew someone was just an attention/gift seeker I wouldn't go and would think it tacky.

In my circle showers just provide modest gifts no one except the grandparents buy things like strollers or cribs, it is just clothes, diapers, blankets, etc.

Tabby Uprising

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Re: When are 2nd time showers okay?
« Reply #55 on: March 06, 2013, 08:34:24 PM »
The understanding is that a first time parent needs a lot, but subsequent pregnancies have fewer needs, thus, the shower is really just a "Hey, congrats on the new kid, have some diapers" kind of thing.

In my experience, baby showers are not to provide the parents to be with items they cannot afford on their own.  Every shower I have ever been to (wedding or baby or otherwise) has been like this.  People go because they want to celebrate the event, and generally gifts are given but that has never been the focus in my experience.  To me, if I were judging someone for having a "gift grab" I probably would not be friends with them and it just wouldn't affect me because either I would not be invited or I would RSVP no.  I think that is why I struggle to understand the intensely negative and judgmental attitudes when it comes to "showers."  It might be a matter of wording, but I really don't get it.  I had a bridal shower and a baby shower and I certainly wasn't given anything I couldn't afford to buy myself - that wasn't the point of the event.  The point was to celebrate that I was getting married and having a baby, respectively.  Honestly, I don't think I have ever been to a shower where the point was to give gifts to the guest of honor because she needed the help.

I'm with you TurtleDove!

I like my friends and relatives.   This sometimes seems to put me in a minority position on this forum ;-)  If you are having a baby, I'm getting you something.   If you are getting married, I'm getting you something.   If you invite me to a party - I'm coming!   IMHO, modern life is isolating enough without coming up with more reasons to turn down chances to socialize with friends.

This is exactly how I am too!  I relish any opportunity in life for a celebration!  And I'm sure part of my mentality is shaped by the fact I've never been in a situation I'd describe as a "gift grab".  I don't have any friends or family who I'd ever see in that light.  Yet  ;D    My thoughts might be different if I suddenly got caught up in a greedy circle of friends or family, but I certainly hope that never happens. 

If someone told me they were owed a shower and demanded I throw one for them and give them a gift, I would think they were crazy.  They can't force me to comply. 

TurtleDove

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Re: When are 2nd time showers okay?
« Reply #56 on: March 06, 2013, 10:00:47 PM »

I like my friends and relatives.   This sometimes seems to put me in a minority position on this forum ;-)  If you are having a baby, I'm getting you something.   If you are getting married, I'm getting you something.   If you invite me to a party - I'm coming!   IMHO, modern life is isolating enough without coming up with more reasons to turn down chances to socialize with friends.

This perfectly states my perspective on this, especially the bolded!  I think that is why I have such a difficult time understanding the negative judgmental perspective from posters.   

AngelBarchild

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Re: When are 2nd time showers okay?
« Reply #57 on: March 06, 2013, 10:23:56 PM »

I like my friends and relatives.   This sometimes seems to put me in a minority position on this forum ;-)  If you are having a baby, I'm getting you something.   If you are getting married, I'm getting you something.   If you invite me to a party - I'm coming!   IMHO, modern life is isolating enough without coming up with more reasons to turn down chances to socialize with friends.

This perfectly states my perspective on this, especially the bolded!  I think that is why I have such a difficult time understanding the negative judgmental perspective from posters.

I'm with you guys. I love parties and giving gifts, and have never in my life ever seen anyone be gift grabbie.

kareng57

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Re: When are 2nd time showers okay?
« Reply #58 on: March 06, 2013, 10:30:15 PM »
I'm with you TurtleDove!

I like my friends and relatives.   This sometimes seems to put me in a minority position on this forum ;-)  If you are having a baby, I'm getting you something.   If you are getting married, I'm getting you something.   If you invite me to a party - I'm coming!   IMHO, modern life is isolating enough without coming up with more reasons to turn down chances to socialize with friends.

Honestly, I agree with you. (Well, actually I don't like parties much, but anyway...) I even get gifts for friends and relatives when they just announce they're pregnant! For someone I'm close to, it could easily be 1) pregnancy announcement gift, 2) shower gift, 3) actual baby is born gift, 4) going to visit the baby for the first time gift... I like giving gifts.

The part where it gets sticky for me is being asked for a gift. I think people have to be careful about that. And inviting people to a "shower" is asking them for a gift, IMO, because a "shower" is a gift-giving occasion. It's just a word, yes, but to me that word means "bring a gift," and other words--like bridal luncheon or meet-the-baby party--don't necessarily mean "bring a gift."

I could understand if some people don't feel that's an important distinction. My friend Amy, for example, in discussing reasons for giving her cousin's wife a shower for her fourth child, said, "Everyone would be getting them a baby gift anyway." It's true, I'm sure every single person she's planning to invite to the shower (mainly relatives) would have given the couple a baby gift anyway... spontaneously and with no prompting from anyone, in their own time and without much opportunity for the gifts from different people to be compared and judged. Now, they're being prompted, there's a deadline, and the gift will be announced, described, and set alongside everyone else's gift, so most people will probably spend more than they'd originally planned so they don't look cheap.

If this way of thinking seems really weird to you, good! :) I hope that means you've had only good experiences at these things. This is just the way I've experienced things, and I think they can be awkward sometimes. To me the difference between asking someone for a gift, and them getting you a gift of their own accord, is pretty big, and I think the former has to be used carefully--first baby only, for example. Otherwise things can start to get a rude feeling to them. Totally IMO, of course.


I agree that this is where it gets kind of tricky.  Quite possibly, the majority of guests who are invited to a second-or-subsequent-baby shower would have given a gift, no matter what.

But even today, we keep up the polite fiction that a marrying HC needs help to outfit their new household - even though most might have been living independently, whether together or apart, for years and already have the household-basics.  People give showers anyway.

For second babies - if the parents want to give a baby-welcome party that's fine.  It's when the word "shower" is used that could be the problem.  "Showers" are gift-giving occasions, and anyone who couldn't give a gift (or chose not to) probably would just not attend.  Welcome-baby parties are a bit different - probably most guests would bring a gift anyway, but the focus is on meeting the new baby.  There's a subtle difference.

Calistoga

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Re: When are 2nd time showers okay?
« Reply #59 on: March 07, 2013, 09:34:14 AM »
The understanding is that a first time parent needs a lot, but subsequent pregnancies have fewer needs, thus, the shower is really just a "Hey, congrats on the new kid, have some diapers" kind of thing.

In my experience, baby showers are not to provide the parents to be with items they cannot afford on their own.  Every shower I have ever been to (wedding or baby or otherwise) has been like this.  People go because they want to celebrate the event, and generally gifts are given but that has never been the focus in my experience.  To me, if I were judging someone for having a "gift grab" I probably would not be friends with them and it just wouldn't affect me because either I would not be invited or I would RSVP no.  I think that is why I struggle to understand the intensely negative and judgmental attitudes when it comes to "showers."  It might be a matter of wording, but I really don't get it.  I had a bridal shower and a baby shower and I certainly wasn't given anything I couldn't afford to buy myself - that wasn't the point of the event.  The point was to celebrate that I was getting married and having a baby, respectively.  Honestly, I don't think I have ever been to a shower where the point was to give gifts to the guest of honor because she needed the help.

Ours isn't so much about giving people stuff they can't afford. First time parents have actual uses for things like strollers and car seats etc, so any time the shower is for the first baby, people are more conscious of those things. The second time around it's usually more of a clothes and diapers thing. I don't know of any time when a pregnant lady in my immediate circle of family/friends wasn't given a shower, no matter how many kids she had before then. The gifts changed, but people still wanted to gather, eat cake, and celebrate babies.