Author Topic: s/o Sharing an appetizer - What about dessert?  (Read 9466 times)

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bloo

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Re: s/o Sharing an appetizer - What about dessert?
« Reply #45 on: March 25, 2013, 05:55:02 PM »
Quote
but I would think the reason some people refer to docking tips is that the waiter is putting the person who ordered dessert in the awkward position of explaining that they don't want share. If the had wanted to share they would have asked for extra cutlery.

This. With the announcement that I'm going to share, it puts me in a weird spot. If it were just putting the extra forks quietly on the table beside me, it's still wrong, but it's not quite as bad. It's the automatic assumption that my dessert isn't just mine but the table's that irritates me.


  This  - I don't share food, ever and if someone who takes the waiters que and digs into my dessert, I end up with out one. I really hate it when a 3rd party decides that *of course* I am sharing - as an adult I expect to make those decisions myself. Docking the tip is how waiters will get the message most clearly.
 Worst experience I ever had with this was when I took a friend s out to eat and ordered myself a dessert - the waiter TOLD her I was sharing and when I told them no I wasn't he looked at me and said "My aren't we selfish". his tip was a hand written note ( so he knew why I tipped so low) and a less than half the normal tip on dinner.  I spoke to the manager on the way out so he knew what  happened and why I would not be back anytime soon.

You know I really appreciate this thread bringing this to my attention. Having worked at the type of restaurants (in my misspent youth) that served yummy but gargantuan desserts, I never minded the extra spoons and was glad to share. I still am and am not at all phobic about germs but the different PP's have enlightened me to the thinking behind those that would prefer not to and how understandable it is to be offended at what appears to be innocent presumption.

RoseRose

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Re: s/o Sharing an appetizer - What about dessert?
« Reply #46 on: March 26, 2013, 02:10:07 AM »
Typically, when I eat out, it's with my husband, and he knows that if he wasn't told we're sharing, he gets a bite, unless I decide I don't want the whole thing.  I have gotten vaguely irritated when I order a dessert, and it's put halfway between myself and my husband, with two spoons.  Same thing has happened in reverse, but not as often (usually if only one of us is getting a dessert, it's me).

I haven't seen a server say it was for sharing, but I have seen them give each of us our own silverware, and put the dessert in the middle, and indicate it's for the both of us ("Here you two go" or something on those lines.)  I don't dock tip on it, but then, it usually isn't as blatant as Dotty's situation because it's either myself and my husband, or myself, my husband, and my brother in law, or my brother.  People I don't have any problem defending my dessert with, basically, rather than an obvious gathering of non-related individuals.

I doubt that makes it any better, but it does mean it doesn't register as much, due to the fact all the individuals at dinner know better than to go for my dessert without at least asking first.



CrochetFanatic

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Re: s/o Sharing an appetizer - What about dessert?
« Reply #47 on: March 26, 2013, 04:19:35 AM »
I don't mind sharing a dessert if the other person and I both want to do this.  If we're both in the mood for something sweet, and if we're almost full, it makes sense to just order one and split it. 

There was only one time when I had no say in the matter, and while it really annoyed me I didn't say anything.  I'm still not sure if I could have spoken up, because it was a rehearsal dinner for a wedding, and it was a set menu.  The way it was done was, there were long tables in a party room at the restaurant, and for dessert we were supposed to share a large (that is, big enough for two) slice of chocolate cake with the person sitting across from us.  That isn't the part that I minded.  I would have been happy to share.  What totally put me off was that we weren't given individual plates so that we could divide the large slice in half and take our share, and we were expected to eat from the same plate like a couple.  The person sitting across from me was an 8-year-old boy (a relative, but one I didn't know) who misunderstood and pulled the whole piece towards himself and immediately began to eat all of the icing off the top.  I was taken aback, and a little grossed out.  His parents corrected him (waaay too late, as he had already eaten most of the icing), and he cheerfully offered to share, but I didn't really want it after that.  :-\  I honestly wouldn't have minded if we'd been told beforehand.  And I would have asked the waiter for an extra plate to put my half on.  I don't know if that's rude or not, but...germs!

Emmy

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Re: s/o Sharing an appetizer - What about dessert?
« Reply #48 on: March 26, 2013, 05:00:12 AM »
Just the other day I went out to dinner with 4 friends. Two ordered fried ice cream, the rest of us each specficaly said "none for me" or "no thanks" to the waiter when theorder was placed. A minute or two later he put extra napkins and 5 spoons in the middle of the table. Then he came back with the two desserts.

For me, there's a few inherent differences to shared appetizers vs desserts. First off appetizers, at least the sharable kind, tend to be more finger food or easily divisable, whereas dessert is often utensil food. For me sharing utensil food has a much higher ick factor. But also with appetizers everyone is hungry, with dessert, some people have officialy declared their meal is over (by declining to order more food) while others have announced they are still hungry (by ordering dessert).

I imagine the waiter has gotten flagged down for utensils in similar situations from people who didn't order dessert, but just wanted a bite of their friend's dessert.  If this happens several times, it just makes sense for the waiter to leave a few extra spoons 'just in case'.  I certainly wouldn't dock a tip or expect a waiter to read everyone's mind.  However, if I ordered dessert without specifying sharing and a waiter put a spoon by everyone's place and my dessert in the middle or made an announcement about the 'table's dessert', I would be a bit put off.

When I intend to share a dessert, I will let the waiter know when placing the order.  I usually find that we get two forks and the dessert in the middle if DH and I order one dessert.  The non-orderer usually takes a taste if we don't share and I imagine that it is pretty common with couples.  Besides, I have no problem telling DH to back off of my dessert.

doodlemor

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Re: s/o Sharing an appetizer - What about dessert?
« Reply #49 on: March 26, 2013, 09:41:21 AM »
I revived this thread to share Miss Manner's take on the topic, which was in her column today in the Buffalo News.  Here is the link - it is the first letter:

http://www.buffalonews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20130325/CITYANDREGION03/130329448/1057

Basically Miss Manners said that if the waitperson brings forks for everyone at the table the dessert orderer might say,  "Thank you, but this looks so good that I'll want to devour it all.  Does anyone else want to order one?"

I think that this handles the situation well because everyone else is immediately aware that the person ordering doesn't want to share, and everyone has a chance to order a dessert before the wait person leaves the table.

I do think that Judith Martin's comments would work well in this situation.

snowdragon

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Re: s/o Sharing an appetizer - What about dessert?
« Reply #50 on: March 26, 2013, 11:26:48 AM »
Just the other day I went out to dinner with 4 friends. Two ordered fried ice cream, the rest of us each specficaly said "none for me" or "no thanks" to the waiter when theorder was placed. A minute or two later he put extra napkins and 5 spoons in the middle of the table. Then he came back with the two desserts.

For me, there's a few inherent differences to shared appetizers vs desserts. First off appetizers, at least the sharable kind, tend to be more finger food or easily divisable, whereas dessert is often utensil food. For me sharing utensil food has a much higher ick factor. But also with appetizers everyone is hungry, with dessert, some people have officialy declared their meal is over (by declining to order more food) while others have announced they are still hungry (by ordering dessert).

I imagine the waiter has gotten flagged down for utensils in similar situations from people who didn't order dessert, but just wanted a bite of their friend's dessert.  If this happens several times, it just makes sense for the waiter to leave a few extra spoons 'just in case'.  I certainly wouldn't dock a tip or expect a waiter to read everyone's mind.  However, if I ordered dessert without specifying sharing and a waiter put a spoon by everyone's place and my dessert in the middle or made an announcement about the 'table's dessert', I would be a bit put off.

When I intend to share a dessert, I will let the waiter know when placing the order.  I usually find that we get two forks and the dessert in the middle if DH and I order one dessert.  The non-orderer usually takes a taste if we don't share and I imagine that it is pretty common with couples.  Besides, I have no problem telling DH to back off of my dessert.


  See, here's the thing tho' not everyone is married, and this practice is not limited to happening to only couples and  for some of us that "taste' means I no longer can eat my dessert.  Not the waiter's issue? Well I can say the same thing it's mot my issue that the waiter has been asked for extra forks umpteen times, it costs the waiter nothing to either ask if sharing is ok before summarily deciding that it will.  By bringing it without asking, he's trying to telling me that my food is his to determine ownership - especially when I refuse and get waitstaff gets snarky  over it. If it's not his job to read my mind that I don't want to share, then it's equally not his job to read my mind that I don't.   And what my dining companion wants does not enter into the equation with my food. If they wanted dessert, or a taste - they can order their own.

Moray

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Re: s/o Sharing an appetizer - What about dessert?
« Reply #51 on: March 26, 2013, 11:45:58 AM »
Snowdragon, just a quick question: Are you saying that if someone takes even a tiny piece of your dessert, even if it's a massive portion and they use a clean fork, you "can't" eat any of it?

I mean, I definitely get being annoyed by someone taking without asking, but I'm curious as to why you wouldn't just reclaim the rest of your dessert.
Utah

snowdragon

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Re: s/o Sharing an appetizer - What about dessert?
« Reply #52 on: March 26, 2013, 11:53:16 AM »
Because it's gross.  I find the practice absolutely disgusting. After someone has done this my stomach has "turned" and I can't eat it anymore. Dessert, meal, beverage - it someone else has taken their "taste"" I don't eat/drink after them.

   

Moray

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Re: s/o Sharing an appetizer - What about dessert?
« Reply #53 on: March 26, 2013, 12:26:06 PM »
Huh. That's interesting. It never occured to me that someone would find the application of a clean fork that hadn't yet been in anyone's mouth to be a food ruiner. I see it on the same level as the knife they probably used to cut the cake, or the scoop the kitchen used for the ice cream.

Drinking from the same cup I could see.
Utah

snowdragon

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Re: s/o Sharing an appetizer - What about dessert?
« Reply #54 on: March 26, 2013, 12:34:04 PM »
Huh. That's interesting. It never occured to me that someone would find the application of a clean fork that hadn't yet been in anyone's mouth to be a food ruiner. I see it on the same level as the knife they probably used to cut the cake, or the scoop the kitchen used for the ice cream.

Drinking from the same cup I could see.

From personal experience unless they are doing several cake slices or ice creams at the same time - it the utensils get washed between orders. They can't leave dirty utensils around due to health and safety codes.  At least in any restaurants that I have worked in. 

Moray

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Re: s/o Sharing an appetizer - What about dessert?
« Reply #55 on: March 26, 2013, 12:48:33 PM »
Huh. That's interesting. It never occured to me that someone would find the application of a clean fork that hadn't yet been in anyone's mouth to be a food ruiner. I see it on the same level as the knife they probably used to cut the cake, or the scoop the kitchen used for the ice cream.

Drinking from the same cup I could see.

From personal experience unless they are doing several cake slices or ice creams at the same time - it the utensils get washed between orders. They can't leave dirty utensils around due to health and safety codes.  At least in any restaurants that I have worked in.

Right. So, a clean fork, clean knife, or clean scoop. Not something that's been in someone's mouth.
Utah

snowdragon

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Re: s/o Sharing an appetizer - What about dessert?
« Reply #56 on: March 26, 2013, 12:52:05 PM »
Huh. That's interesting. It never occured to me that someone would find the application of a clean fork that hadn't yet been in anyone's mouth to be a food ruiner. I see it on the same level as the knife they probably used to cut the cake, or the scoop the kitchen used for the ice cream.

Drinking from the same cup I could see.

From personal experience unless they are doing several cake slices or ice creams at the same time - it the utensils get washed between orders. They can't leave dirty utensils around due to health and safety codes.  At least in any restaurants that I have worked in.

Right. So, a clean fork, clean knife, or clean scoop. Not something that's been in someone's mouth.

 Nor are they going into some one's mouth - or food before getting clean.

Moray

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Re: s/o Sharing an appetizer - What about dessert?
« Reply #57 on: March 26, 2013, 12:55:28 PM »
Huh. That's interesting. It never occured to me that someone would find the application of a clean fork that hadn't yet been in anyone's mouth to be a food ruiner. I see it on the same level as the knife they probably used to cut the cake, or the scoop the kitchen used for the ice cream.

Drinking from the same cup I could see.

From personal experience unless they are doing several cake slices or ice creams at the same time - it the utensils get washed between orders. They can't leave dirty utensils around due to health and safety codes.  At least in any restaurants that I have worked in.

Right. So, a clean fork, clean knife, or clean scoop. Not something that's been in someone's mouth.

 Nor are they going into some one's mouth - or food before getting clean.

Wha? I am legitimately confused as to what you're saying. I asked, out of curiosity, what was "stomach turning" about someone using a clean, fresh fork (that's one that hasn't been in someone's mouth) to take a piece of dessert. I'm not talking about a wiped off fork that someone used on their entree.

Edit: Wait, I think I might be getting it. Are you saying that a fork is disgusting by virtue of the fact that it was in someone's mouth, at some point, prior to being washed for re-use? If I'm misinterpreting, please let me know.
« Last Edit: March 26, 2013, 12:59:33 PM by Moray »
Utah

snowdragon

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Re: s/o Sharing an appetizer - What about dessert?
« Reply #58 on: March 26, 2013, 01:16:58 PM »
Huh. That's interesting. It never occured to me that someone would find the application of a clean fork that hadn't yet been in anyone's mouth to be a food ruiner. I see it on the same level as the knife they probably used to cut the cake, or the scoop the kitchen used for the ice cream.

Drinking from the same cup I could see.

From personal experience unless they are doing several cake slices or ice creams at the same time - it the utensils get washed between orders. They can't leave dirty utensils around due to health and safety codes.  At least in any restaurants that I have worked in.

Right. So, a clean fork, clean knife, or clean scoop. Not something that's been in someone's mouth.

 Nor are they going into some one's mouth - or food before getting clean.

Wha? I am legitimately confused as to what you're saying. I asked, out of curiosity, what was "stomach turning" about someone using a clean, fresh fork (that's one that hasn't been in someone's mouth) to take a piece of dessert. I'm not talking about a wiped off fork that someone used on their entree.

Edit: Wait, I think I might be getting it. Are you saying that a fork is disgusting by virtue of the fact that it was in someone's mouth, at some point, prior to being washed for re-use? If I'm misinterpreting, please let me know.


Why does it matter?  It's my food and I find other people eating it disgusting and I won't eat anything that I find disgusting.  that's all anyone needs to understand.

Moray

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Re: s/o Sharing an appetizer - What about dessert?
« Reply #59 on: March 26, 2013, 01:27:30 PM »
Huh. That's interesting. It never occured to me that someone would find the application of a clean fork that hadn't yet been in anyone's mouth to be a food ruiner. I see it on the same level as the knife they probably used to cut the cake, or the scoop the kitchen used for the ice cream.

Drinking from the same cup I could see.

From personal experience unless they are doing several cake slices or ice creams at the same time - it the utensils get washed between orders. They can't leave dirty utensils around due to health and safety codes.  At least in any restaurants that I have worked in.

Right. So, a clean fork, clean knife, or clean scoop. Not something that's been in someone's mouth.

 Nor are they going into some one's mouth - or food before getting clean.

Wha? I am legitimately confused as to what you're saying. I asked, out of curiosity, what was "stomach turning" about someone using a clean, fresh fork (that's one that hasn't been in someone's mouth) to take a piece of dessert. I'm not talking about a wiped off fork that someone used on their entree.

Edit: Wait, I think I might be getting it. Are you saying that a fork is disgusting by virtue of the fact that it was in someone's mouth, at some point, prior to being washed for re-use? If I'm misinterpreting, please let me know.


Why does it matter?  It's my food and I find other people eating it disgusting and I won't eat anything that I find disgusting.  that's all anyone needs to understand.

I was just curious, because it's a viewpoint I haven't encountered before. It certainly wasn't my intent to make you so angry over a simple question. I really value the opportunity eHell gives us to encounter other perspectives, so I was hoping for some sort of productive sharing of your thought process.

I really was confused by your assertion that a clean fork is disgusting. I'm not disputing even remotely your right to feel that way (we all have our hang ups, after all!), but it really didn't make sense to me, especially in a restaurant setting where you know, beyond all shadow of a doubt, that your own fork has been in another person's mouth prior to it being washed for your use.
Utah