young adults learning the hard way - update post #29

[Lynn2000]

I cannot and will not discuss job-hunting difficulties of any kind with my father.  He LOVES to repeat the story of how, when he got his first job, he applied at a shop that told him they weren't hiring.  So he went back and asked again the next day, and the next day, and the next, ad nauseum.  Then one day it snowed, so he showed up and instead of asking "Are you hiring now?" he asked, "Where's your snow shovel?"  And what do you know, they hired him on the spot because he was showing his determination and willingness to work.

I tell him that these days, pulling a stunt like that is likely to do nothing but get you firmly escorted from the property, if not cited for harassment, but he thinks this is a perfectly legit way to go about getting hired.

Yeah, that could be my dad.  I mean, if it works, it works, and it makes a good story. But it's far from universally applicable.

I recently went through interviewing and helping to hire a couple of new college-student interns for our university office. One young woman, instead of filling out the application (a Word document) and sending it back to me as an email--as every other person had done, and as the instructions stated--printed it out and walked it into our office by hand. I happened to not be there and the people who met her said it seemed like she really did it hoping to meet me (as opposed to having some bizarre technical reason why she couldn't just email it back).

I was not impressed by this. Not only did she not follow the instructions--kind of vital to show you can do that for this job--she knocked herself out of my "pipeline," which is all electronic. I would've had to do extra work to incorporate her paper into the system, and I just wasn't willing to do that, not when I had over 80 applicants for two positions. (She also never followed up with an email at any point.)

I'm sure she thought she was going to make a good impression by doing something different, but in fact she just got herself knocked out of the running entirely.

[Piratelvr1121]

I remember hearing that "That's just teasing to get your attention. They probably like you and don't know any better way to show it without risking rejection!"  And I always thought "No thanks, if that's the only way they know how to show attraction, by hurting someone's feelings, I'm not interested."

I was rather picky through adolescence and that's probably why I didn't have a boyfriend till I was 19.

Yeah, boys would ask me out as a joke (trust me, when you and all your friends are laughing, I know it's a joke), and I would turn them down. The boy's friends would always say, "Ohhh! You got turned down by violinp!" because clearly, I'm such a horrible, desperate loser that my standards should be "is showing signs of life." Um, no thanks; I'd rather date a guy who wants to be with me and doesn't treat me like a punchline.

That sounds all too familiar...

[ladyknight1]

I cannot and will not discuss job-hunting difficulties of any kind with my father.  He LOVES to repeat the story of how, when he got his first job, he applied at a shop that told him they weren't hiring.  So he went back and asked again the next day, and the next day, and the next, ad nauseum.  Then one day it snowed, so he showed up and instead of asking "Are you hiring now?" he asked, "Where's your snow shovel?"  And what do you know, they hired him on the spot because he was showing his determination and willingness to work.

I tell him that these days, pulling a stunt like that is likely to do nothing but get you firmly escorted from the property, if not cited for harassment, but he thinks this is a perfectly legit way to go about getting hired.

Yeah, that could be my dad.  I mean, if it works, it works, and it makes a good story. But it's far from universally applicable.

I recently went through interviewing and helping to hire a couple of new college-student interns for our university office. One young woman, instead of filling out the application (a Word document) and sending it back to me as an email--as every other person had done, and as the instructions stated--printed it out and walked it into our office by hand. I happened to not be there and the people who met her said it seemed like she really did it hoping to meet me (as opposed to having some bizarre technical reason why she couldn't just email it back).

I was not impressed by this. Not only did she not follow the instructions--kind of vital to show you can do that for this job--she knocked herself out of my "pipeline," which is all electronic. I would've had to do extra work to incorporate her paper into the system, and I just wasn't willing to do that, not when I had over 80 applicants for two positions. (She also never followed up with an email at any point.)

I'm sure she thought she was going to make a good impression by doing something different, but in fact she just got herself knocked out of the running entirely.

The same goes for not so young adults. My FIL was laid off February 1st. He is a computer simulation technician. You would think that applying for jobs and completing necessary documents would be easier for him, but no. He is constantly complaining that different firms refuse to accept walk-ins and they don't have paper applications to complete! I tried to help, but he was resistant to every idea, so  .

[Virg]

ladyknight1 wrote:

"Carrie of Mythbusters got her job much the same way. She showed up all the time, and they hired her."

She had a job at M5 working with Jamie before the show, so I figured she vectored in that way.  I've never heard about this story.

Virg

[ladyknight1]

Kari: "She became involved in the show after persistently showing up at Hyneman's M5 Industries workshop in a desire to get hired by his company."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kari_Byron

[Lynn2000]

I was thinking about this thread today talking with a friend about her husband. He often has to learn things by experience, rather than being told. For example, they went out to a "fancy" restaurant she really likes, and he was determined to order something she didn't think he would like. Normally I'm not much for regulating other adults' food; but it was something like "mashed potatoes" and even though he loves regular, plain, bland mashed potatoes, she was sure this fancy place would prepare them in a fancy way, which he wouldn't be expecting and wouldn't like. She tried to explain this to him, but he insisted on getting the mashed potatoes. And didn't like them. And it was actually his entree, which was somewhat expensive, and now he doesn't like the whole restaurant and doesn't want to go there for a special occasion.

Okay, not the worst scenario in the world, but I just thought it was interesting how some people don't like to take advice even as they get older. And note that his lesson was not, "Maybe I should listen when my wife makes a suggestion," it was, "This restaurant makes food I don't like."

[PeterM]

Kari: "She became involved in the show after persistently showing up at Hyneman's M5 Industries workshop in a desire to get hired by his company."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kari_Byron

I can't help but think that this strategy won't work as well if you don't look like Kari Byron and/or aren't trying to get an on-camera gig on a show aimed largely at male geeks.

[jaxsue]

I was thinking about this thread today talking with a friend about her husband. He often has to learn things by experience, rather than being told. For example, they went out to a "fancy" restaurant she really likes, and he was determined to order something she didn't think he would like. Normally I'm not much for regulating other adults' food; but it was something like "mashed potatoes" and even though he loves regular, plain, bland mashed potatoes, she was sure this fancy place would prepare them in a fancy way, which he wouldn't be expecting and wouldn't like. She tried to explain this to him, but he insisted on getting the mashed potatoes. And didn't like them. And it was actually his entree, which was somewhat expensive, and now he doesn't like the whole restaurant and doesn't want to go there for a special occasion.

Okay, not the worst scenario in the world, but I just thought it was interesting how some people don't like to take advice even as they get older. And note that his lesson was not, "Maybe I should listen when my wife makes a suggestion," it was, "This restaurant makes food I don't like."

This reminds me of my X-DH. He always expected food to be like what he was used to (southern style). I would tell him that we were in a place that didn't serve food that way (say, a french restaurant), but he often didn't get it. One time we were in Williamsburg, VA, and were eating in one of the old taverns. It featured food that the colonists would have eaten. I ordered game pie, which I loved. He ordered oysters, and I told him that they wouldn't be typical southern fried oysters - the description was on the menu. He ordered them anyway and was unhappy that they weren't what he expected. 

[Piratelvr1121]

I know someone who's probably going to have to learn something the hard way.  The guy was a friend of mine and DH's until recently.  He was always a bit irritating but we stayed friends because he could be fun and back in the day he did have times when he could be a good friend.  But as he's gotten older those moments became fewer and further between and he just really started showing his a** more and more. 

This guy's the youngest of 3, the only boy and was diagnosed with diabetes when he was 9 and I get the impression from his behavior that he was always babied because of it.   He's never been expected to take care of himself and I guess I'm biased because my brother is also a type 1 diabetic and while he was moderately babied, he has come to learn to take care of himself and watch what he eats without being told when to check his blood sugar and how to set his pump to manage the blood sugar properly.   When we've eaten with him he's always watchful of what he eats and rarely eats dessert.

His wife has, for the last 14 years they've been together, kept after him and cooked for him and told him when to check his blood sugar and give himself insulin.  And she admits she's enabled him in his refusal to take care of himself and has recently put her foot down and basically told him he's on his own and he acted like she just sentenced him to the electric chair.    So when he moves out (they're getting a divorce) maybe he'll finally learn.  Even though I don't care for the guy I hope he won't let himself get into a diabetic coma and will actually wake up.

[Virg]

PeterM wrote:

"I can't help but think that this strategy won't work as well if you don't look like Kari Byron and/or aren't trying to get an on-camera gig on a show aimed largely at male geeks."

She's also really good at what she does, which is something that the average "show up and do the job you want" people might not necessarily have.

Virg

[BabyMama]

His wife has, for the last 14 years they've been together, kept after him and cooked for him and told him when to check his blood sugar and give himself insulin.  And she admits she's enabled him in his refusal to take care of himself and has recently put her foot down and basically told him he's on his own and he acted like she just sentenced him to the electric chair.    So when he moves out (they're getting a divorce) maybe he'll finally learn.  Even though I don't care for the guy I hope he won't let himself get into a diabetic coma and will actually wake up.

My sister was dating a guy with hemophilia. He was a lovely guy and I would have loved for him to be my BIL, but she broke up with him because he refused to take care of himself and she didn't want to be his mom. He'd not take his blood clotting meds because he hated it, and then go out and do something like play touch football or ride a 4-wheeler. She said she didn't want to be there when he had a major accident made worse by his condition that he could have easily avoided.

[Piratelvr1121]

I have to admit, I would break up with someone who refused to take care of themselves.   I don't have the patience to deal with an adult that refuses to take care of themselves.

[Lynn2000]

I have to admit, I would break up with someone who refused to take care of themselves.   I don't have the patience to deal with an adult that refuses to take care of themselves.

I think I would, too. I have enough trouble being sensible about myself, I don't want to fall into the position of having to remind someone to eat properly, take their medicine, dress warmly, etc. on a daily basis when they're perfectly competent to do it themselves. If the alternative to me doing this seems to be serious injury or worse, I think I'd rather break it off before I got too attached, sorry to say. If explained, that would be a hard lesson for someone to learn, indeed; but hopefully it would stick.

[Library Dragon]

I cannot and will not discuss job-hunting difficulties of any kind with my father.  He LOVES to repeat the story of how, when he got his first job, he applied at a shop that told him they weren't hiring.  So he went back and asked again the next day, and the next day, and the next, ad nauseum.  Then one day it snowed, so he showed up and instead of asking "Are you hiring now?" he asked, "Where's your snow shovel?"  And what do you know, they hired him on the spot because he was showing his determination and willingness to work.

I tell him that these days, pulling a stunt like that is likely to do nothing but get you firmly escorted from the property, if not cited for harassment, but he thinks this is a perfectly legit way to go about getting hired.

Yeah, that could be my dad.  I mean, if it works, it works, and it makes a good story. But it's far from universally applicable.

I recently went through interviewing and helping to hire a couple of new college-student interns for our university office. One young woman, instead of filling out the application (a Word document) and sending it back to me as an email--as every other person had done, and as the instructions stated--printed it out and walked it into our office by hand. I happened to not be there and the people who met her said it seemed like she really did it hoping to meet me (as opposed to having some bizarre technical reason why she couldn't just email it back).

I was not impressed by this. Not only did she not follow the instructions--kind of vital to show you can do that for this job--she knocked herself out of my "pipeline," which is all electronic. I would've had to do extra work to incorporate her paper into the system, and I just wasn't willing to do that, not when I had over 80 applicants for two positions. (She also never followed up with an email at any point.)

I'm sure she thought she was going to make a good impression by doing something different, but in fact she just got herself knocked out of the running entirely.

POD

I was hiring someone for a position that required them to work 30 hr week flexible schedule--with health benefits and vacation, so it was a desirable position.  The instructions for the application stated that applicants would be notified by email when that we received the application, outlined the timeline, and to address any questions about the position via email. 

There were two main reasons: 
1.  I hate talking on the phone and didn't want to take multiple calls.
2.  I was going on vacation and could still answer questions from applicants. 

There was a woman who came in every day and wanted to talk to me about why she should get the job.  She refused to turn in an application until she talked to me.  The staff explained multiple times that she could email me, but she refused.  When I returned from my trip I had 15 calls on my VM.  She never did turn in an application.  The only real information she gave the staff that she was excited about working a job where she could name her own hours. 

When DH gives our DSs the call them everyday advice I gently remind him that in many cases they are taking themselves out of the running for a job.  Don't irritate the boss before you've even had a chance to be hired! 

[StuffedGrapeLeaves]

I blame all these job applicants disregarding instructions on those magazine articles or career counselors that tell people to be "proactive" and to "think outside the box." 

This happens on the job, too.  I've had staff members, usually younger ones, screwing things up because they're trying to be "proactive" and to "think outside the box."  When you are asked to make a photocopy, just scanning it and then telling me I can just print it out is not being proactive, but being a nuisance.  I wasn't impressed.