Author Topic: Dear Prudence: sibling "stealing" wedding date  (Read 18491 times)

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bah12

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Re: Dear Prudence: sibling "stealing" wedding date
« Reply #150 on: March 01, 2013, 02:52:28 PM »
The problem is DH publicly said they would work with the date even though it wasn't the best.  Privately upset or not I would say that there really is no question - they do what DH said they would do.  Now I am unclear if his comment also included the engagement party but it sounds like they have decided not to attend that regardless of whether his comment initially meant they would attend.

I think that "working with the date" would still allow them to miss the engagement party and go to the wedding.  I don't think that "It's not the best, but I'll work with it and see what I can do" necessarily equates to "Yes, absolutely, I'll be available for all things at all times."  A heads up phone call on dates for future events is not the same as RSVPing to the actual invitation (which I'm assuming the engagement party will have as well).  And as much I think it would be SS of someone to insist that other family members not get married on their wedding anniversary, I would think it's equally as SS to insist that someone spend their first wedding anniversary at their engagement party.  Hopefully, this could all go down without any fuss.  The couple misses the engagement party and celebrates their first anniversary in the way they choose and then attend the wedding the following year without any flack from the HC.

lowspark

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Re: Dear Prudence: sibling "stealing" wedding date
« Reply #151 on: March 01, 2013, 02:53:56 PM »
Considering the wife's woe about this whole situation, the husband's response is starting to sound PA to me.
Sort of like, well, ok, we'll be the martyrs and show up. And now they're unhappy that the brother took them at their word and didn't change the date. And now they are "confused" as to what to do?

Really, regardless of whether I agree with the LW about how she feels about her wedding date/anniversary being picked, I think they should have come right out and said how they felt instead of expecting the brother to guess. I would not assume that the brother remembers the actual date. "he did not even mention that it had been our wedding date" -- probably because he didn't remember!

And I would not agree that you have to get approval from your whole family when you pick your wedding date. (I would bet LW didn't check with brother when they picked their wedding date originally.)

lowspark

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Re: Dear Prudence: sibling "stealing" wedding date
« Reply #152 on: March 01, 2013, 02:57:22 PM »
The problem is DH publicly said they would work with the date even though it wasn't the best.  Privately upset or not I would say that there really is no question - they do what DH said they would do.  Now I am unclear if his comment also included the engagement party but it sounds like they have decided not to attend that regardless of whether his comment initially meant they would attend.

I think that "working with the date" would still allow them to miss the engagement party and go to the wedding.  I don't think that "It's not the best, but I'll work with it and see what I can do" necessarily equates to "Yes, absolutely, I'll be available for all things at all times."  A heads up phone call on dates for future events is not the same as RSVPing to the actual invitation (which I'm assuming the engagement party will have as well).  And as much I think it would be SS of someone to insist that other family members not get married on their wedding anniversary, I would think it's equally as SS to insist that someone spend their first wedding anniversary at their engagement party.  Hopefully, this could all go down without any fuss.  The couple misses the engagement party and celebrates their first anniversary in the way they choose and then attend the wedding the following year without any flack from the HC.

But the quote from the letter isn't "work with it". It's "...we would make it work...". To me that means they will be there. I'm not sure if they are referring to the wedding or the engagement party but for whatever they are referring to, I'd say that's an acceptance.

cass2591

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Re: Dear Prudence: sibling "stealing" wedding date
« Reply #153 on: March 01, 2013, 04:23:44 PM »
Poppea, you've been rather argumentative and confrontational in this thread and there's really no need for it.
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VorFemme

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Re: Dear Prudence: sibling "stealing" wedding date
« Reply #154 on: March 01, 2013, 05:11:02 PM »
I can see telling everyone that there are already plans for the night/weekend of the engagement party and "we just aren't able to reschedule".  Doesn't matter if the plans are for a special meal at home with wedding cake from the freezer for dessert; dinner out; or a weekend at the same place that they had their honeymoon (or at least wedding night).  They have already made plans for the night of the engagement party and they can not, will not, and are not going to change them.

Wedding the next year (and the rehersal lunch or dinner) is two years after the LW's wedding.  They might want to hold off making other plans for that weekend (or set up plans for the weekend before or after, if they have to make reservations early) because a wedding is kind of a trump card.

I was not happy when our niece's wedding was planned for DD's (her cousin's) party with her bridesmaids, her own brother's 20th birthday, and the day after Uncle VorGuy got home for his first weekend after two weeks at summer camps back to back (short on sleep & long on work due to his duties at the camp).  He overslept and we missed it.  I sent our regrets, but I had also sent in a conditional RSVP due to the camp having been scheduled the year before with some twenty schools (changes not possible), with a comment that the parents of the bride might understand, as they have summer camps for their teaching subjects, as well.  (I assume that their camp schedules were considered in setting up the wedding date.)

Her brother celebrated his 21st birthday on her first anniversary and for the rest of their lives, his "big" birthdays (say, multiples of five or ten) will coincide with her "big" anniversaries (also multiples of five or ten). 

I have no idea if the date was picked due to scheduling issues with the wedding site; an important date to the happy couple; or what - but it did end up making it practically impossible for us to be there.   
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TurtleDove

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Re: Dear Prudence: sibling "stealing" wedding date
« Reply #155 on: March 01, 2013, 05:22:39 PM »
I was not happy when our niece's wedding was planned for DD's (her cousin's) party with her bridesmaids, her own brother's 20th birthday, and the day after Uncle VorGuy got home for his first weekend after two weeks at summer camps back to back (short on sleep & long on work due to his duties at the camp). 

I get that the date was not convenient for you, but what I don't understand is why you think the niece and her husband should have taken any of these "conflicts" into consideration when planning their wedding.  I really don't understand what the brother's birthday would have to do with anything, and I just cannot fathom that the niece would be worrying about your DH's camp schedule or her cousin's party?

In all of this, unless there is solid proof that a HC is trying to exclude someone, I assume they did the best they could to pick the best date possible for their wedding, all things considered.  What the HC "considered" might not be what anyone else is concerned with, but it is the HC's choice.

bah12

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Re: Dear Prudence: sibling "stealing" wedding date
« Reply #156 on: March 01, 2013, 05:28:04 PM »
The problem is DH publicly said they would work with the date even though it wasn't the best.  Privately upset or not I would say that there really is no question - they do what DH said they would do.  Now I am unclear if his comment also included the engagement party but it sounds like they have decided not to attend that regardless of whether his comment initially meant they would attend.

I think that "working with the date" would still allow them to miss the engagement party and go to the wedding.  I don't think that "It's not the best, but I'll work with it and see what I can do" necessarily equates to "Yes, absolutely, I'll be available for all things at all times."  A heads up phone call on dates for future events is not the same as RSVPing to the actual invitation (which I'm assuming the engagement party will have as well).  And as much I think it would be SS of someone to insist that other family members not get married on their wedding anniversary, I would think it's equally as SS to insist that someone spend their first wedding anniversary at their engagement party.  Hopefully, this could all go down without any fuss.  The couple misses the engagement party and celebrates their first anniversary in the way they choose and then attend the wedding the following year without any flack from the HC.

But the quote from the letter isn't "work with it". It's "...we would make it work...". To me that means they will be there. I'm not sure if they are referring to the wedding or the engagement party but for whatever they are referring to, I'd say that's an acceptance.

Ok, and I  could see where the BIL might take that and think they will be at the engagement party and the wedding. 

But, just because the husband said they would make it work, I still don't think that means they are obligated to go to the engagement party (though I agree that was an unfortunate use of words).  As long as they don't wait until the last minute to state the conflict, they are ok to say "That's our first anniversary and we have plans that weekend and won't be able to attend, but will definitely be at the wedding."  I'm also assuming the BIL isn't making any special accommodations and plan for the LW and his brother now, because he thinks they're coming later. 


LadyR

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Re: Dear Prudence: sibling "stealing" wedding date
« Reply #157 on: March 01, 2013, 06:31:35 PM »
I may not remember everyone's anniversary indefinitely, but I remember the dates of all the weddings I've been to in the last year. The LW's wedding was 8 months ago, I'm assuming the date was picked a few months ago, so yeah I think its a bit 'off'. If it was their eighth anniversary, well then, obviously it wouldn't be an issue and I wouldn't expect the BIL to remember, but since its their first, I can sort of see where the LW is coming from.

I don't think you own a date. My BIL got married on my DH's 18th birthday, he was fine with it. My cousin got married on my mom's birthday, she was fine with it. My other cousin was going to get married on my parents' anniversary and her mother (my aunt) made her change it, saying it wasn't insensitive to my mother (this was a couple years after my dad died).


VorFemme

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Re: Dear Prudence: sibling "stealing" wedding date
« Reply #158 on: March 01, 2013, 06:53:52 PM »
I was not happy when our niece's wedding was planned for DD's (her cousin's) party with her bridesmaids, her own brother's 20th birthday, and the day after Uncle VorGuy got home for his first weekend after two weeks at summer camps back to back (short on sleep & long on work due to his duties at the camp). 

I get that the date was not convenient for you, but what I don't understand is why you think the niece and her husband should have taken any of these "conflicts" into consideration when planning their wedding.  I really don't understand what the brother's birthday would have to do with anything, and I just cannot fathom that the niece would be worrying about your DH's camp schedule or her cousin's party?

In all of this, unless there is solid proof that a HC is trying to exclude someone, I assume they did the best they could to pick the best date possible for their wedding, all things considered.  What the HC "considered" might not be what anyone else is concerned with, but it is the HC's choice.

When planning her wedding - she did ask our DD if our DD had anything going on in a six week period when she was apparently setting up the wedding date) - DD mentioned the already planned "hen night", as it had been planned out well in advance due to school, work, and family events with her brides' maids.  Her own parents have summer camps for their school schedule, so she would have been at least slightly aware of the potential for a teacher to be exhausted after two weeks of summer camp at *camp site* (not day camp at the school campus). 

As to her own brother's birthday - I came to the conclusion that I would "assume" the best, that it was the best time to get the venue that they chose for everything to work out.  But it still stinks for her brother....
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Sharnita

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Re: Dear Prudence: sibling "stealing" wedding date
« Reply #159 on: March 01, 2013, 07:02:13 PM »
Did her brother indicate displeasure?  It would only stink for her brother if it bothered her brother.  Obviously there are people who would be bothered and people who wouldn't.  Unless he made it clear somehow that he was upset I wouldn't assume it stank for him.

TootsNYC

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Re: Dear Prudence: sibling "stealing" wedding date
« Reply #160 on: March 01, 2013, 07:06:10 PM »
I guess I'm not sure why it stinks for her brother.

His 25th b'day will be on her 5th wedding anniversary--are either of them going to have a party?

I wouldn't think so--it's sure not done in my family. He and his sis may have dinner together for his birthday, but by 25, you've given up on the idea that it has to be celebrated ON your birthday.

Maybe the family would get together for her 5th wedding anniversary, but neither of my families would do that. (Well, maybe that's not fair--my MIL might have wanted us over for dinner to celebrate, but I sort of let her know at some point that I do not celebrate my ordinary wedding anniversaries with anyone other than my spouse.)

By the time she has her 25th (which might be a party), he'll be 45. That's not "a big party" age, usually.
When he turns 50, she'll be at 30--again, 50 is "big party time," but 30 years of marriage isn't, usually.

And even if it is--there are only a few anniversaries or b'days that you really celebrate ON the day. The 21st b'day and the 1st anniversary are among them, and theirs coincided--but I sure wouldn't invite my older sister out on my 21st bday; I'd be going w/ my friends. And I wouldn't expect my newly married sister and BIL to invite us to share  the 1st-anniv. celebration with them.

VorFemme

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Re: Dear Prudence: sibling "stealing" wedding date
« Reply #161 on: March 01, 2013, 07:26:42 PM »
I guess knowing who the "golden child" is in that family is why it stunk to me - but her brother may not be bothered.  We rarely saw much of them after going back into the military some twenty years ago (we had been living in the same town), as they spent all holidays visiting her parents & siblings and would get back "home" after we had to leave for our much longer drive home (six hour drive home for them, twenty hour plus drive for us for us - depending on weather, we might end up spending the night about the halfway point).  Due both families having kids in school, sticking around until they got back would have caused ours to miss school after a two day drive home.

I did ask VorGuy what he thought about this situation and he wondered why the parents of the two brothers didn't say anything to the new bridegroom about his brother's wedding having been on that date just a few months back.  Because even if the brother wasn't the kind of guy to notice it, his mother probably isn't the kind to ignore it totally.....

Unless the LW's BIL is the "golden child" in his family *or* possibly his fiancee and her family are the ones setting things up without a lot of input from the groom's family.  There are families that don't sauce a goose the same as a gander......
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AylaM

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Re: Dear Prudence: sibling "stealing" wedding date
« Reply #162 on: March 01, 2013, 07:37:30 PM »
I think that if the LW and husband skip the wedding they'd come off as churlish.  I think that even if the wedding was on their first anniversary that they couldn't skip it without problems relationship-wise.  I'd probably be upset by it, but wouldn't miss a sibling's wedding for it. 

With regards to making it work:
I think if the husband said they'd "make it work" he isn't really saying that they will come to both events.  In the end the "make it work" might obligate them for the wedding.  In all actuality I can't see that as being a blanket statement affirming that they'll be there for both events.

Another perspective on the date:
Could easily be an honest mistake and even if LW had protested the couple isn't being unreasonable for having the wedding then and wanting the LW to be there.  Engagement party is different though.  In the end my take on the date was that maybe the brother and SIL chose a wedding date based on the venue and other wedding stuff.  And then the engagement party date was chosen because "how cool, it is exactly a year before the wedding!" (which I could see myself doing).  So part honest mistake and part deliberate.

Tilt Fairy

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Re: Dear Prudence: sibling "stealing" wedding date
« Reply #163 on: March 01, 2013, 08:44:05 PM »
Apologies if another poster has mentioned it but perhaps we have all forgotten that it is not just the groom (the brother in this case) that has planned the wedding and engagement party on that date but also (and maybe even likely more so) his fiancÚ. She has also picked that date. LW even says that her and her husband barely know the fiancÚ. Therefore the date LW and husband got married will have even less significance to her brothers bride-to be than her brother. As they barely know her, maybe she didn't even attend their wedding in the first place or if she did, I doubt the date would have stuck in her mind. There might be 1001 reasons the couple as a couple (or maybe even just the bride!) picked this particular date for their wedding and engagement. At least 50% (assume for simplicity) of the decision making for the date will have come from the bride and the date might have been picked for reasons on the brides side that we have no clue about. There are two lots of family considerations and guest conflicts to consider. Even if the brother did remember, it might not (understandably)be important enough to his bride to pick a different date. She barely knows these people and they are not close to her.

I'm with the people that do not understand why a certain even has to be celebrated on a specific exact date. Surely it is about the sentiment, the gesture, the milestone rather than the specific date or exact time itself? I actually doubt the majority of adults and children celebrate their birthdays, valentines day, anniversaries with a "celebratory event" on the exact day as there are more weekdays than weekend days. I think most people celebrate to the nearest Friday or Saturday night either side. In fact, you can "celebrate" actual day itself by perhaps exchanging presents then and having an extra passionate kiss, but leave the "celebration event" e.g. dinner and dancing, for the day before or after. If anything, it prolongs the romance!

Whatever the LW feels, she should be sincere and polite with her BIL. If they really really want to celebrate their first anniversary on that exact date and decide that it would not be as special celebrating it the day before or after then they should politely decline the engagement party. If I was the LW I would be sincere with my BIL and tell him that I was very sorry I had to decline but that the first anniversary date was very significant to me. If I was the BIL, I'd rather have this than a guest show up reluctantly who wouldn't enjoy the night or celebrate fully because they clearly preferred to be somewhere else.

However with regards to the Second Anniversary vs The Wedding, it would be extremely hurtful, immature, churlish, consequential etc.. etc.. not to attend. I think they would also end up regretting it down the line. I don't think there's anything wrong with celebrating a second anniversary if it's important to them, but to celebrate in lieu of BILs wedding would be a very bad idea.

kareng57

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Re: Dear Prudence: sibling "stealing" wedding date
« Reply #164 on: March 01, 2013, 10:41:14 PM »
I was not happy when our niece's wedding was planned for DD's (her cousin's) party with her bridesmaids, her own brother's 20th birthday, and the day after Uncle VorGuy got home for his first weekend after two weeks at summer camps back to back (short on sleep & long on work due to his duties at the camp). 

I get that the date was not convenient for you, but what I don't understand is why you think the niece and her husband should have taken any of these "conflicts" into consideration when planning their wedding.  I really don't understand what the brother's birthday would have to do with anything, and I just cannot fathom that the niece would be worrying about your DH's camp schedule or her cousin's party?

In all of this, unless there is solid proof that a HC is trying to exclude someone, I assume they did the best they could to pick the best date possible for their wedding, all things considered.  What the HC "considered" might not be what anyone else is concerned with, but it is the HC's choice.


I don't understand this, either.  Unless the guest-list is very small (perhaps under 20) I truly don't see the need to screen the guest-list re other commitments they might have at that time.  If they can attend, then great.  If they can't, they can't.  If both the bride and groom have several siblings, it could be unavoidable to have a conflict with a sibling's birthday.

Some time ago on this board, there was a post from a more-distant relative (aunt or cousin, I think) complaining about a HC that had picked the same wedding date that they had, 20+ years ago.  How dare they!