Please help me draft an email to the Principal

[gramma dishes]

Yes, but an adult driver shouldn't expect an 11 year old to be able to describe a full bus route. So, there would really be no difference between deliberate and accidental misinformation.

You're right, of course.  No doubt about that.

But it may be that that was her only recourse if she wasn't provided appropriate information to begin with.  It has happened that substitute drivers really are called in just minutes before the bus is loaded to take the kids home.
 
And there are eleven year olds who would be able to guide a driver through a bus route without hitches, so she may have assumed all kids could. 

[Sophia]

Good luck.  When I was in High School, the bus driver played chicken with an oncoming small car on a barely 2-lane road.  The road was paved but country-ish and sloped on both sides to ditches.  (This was pre-cell phones. so no proof)  Nothing was done.

Although, my parents did make an exception for school on the (4 A's and 2 B's to drive my car for the next 6-weeks rule), so it wasn't all bad.  Although, the driver of the small car probably had to go home and change his pants. 

[Sharnita]

Honestly, I couldn't have done it even when I was 18.  I got on the bus and zoned out.  I knew some of the stops but not all.  Also, there were some "hidden" reasons for why we did what we did.  There were times when the bus went ways that seemed illogically long ways around because of this or that regulation that a non-busdriver wouldn't know about (or wouldn't care about).

[artk2002]

Yes, but an adult driver shouldn't expect an 11 year old to be able to describe a full bus route. So, there would really be no difference between deliberate and accidental misinformation.

You're right, of course.  No doubt about that.

But it may be that that was her only recourse if she wasn't provided appropriate information to begin with.  It has happened that substitute drivers really are called in just minutes before the bus is loaded to take the kids home.
 
And there are eleven year olds who would be able to guide a driver through a bus route without hitches, so she may have assumed all kids could.

Her proper recourse was to go back to the people who put her on the bus without proper directions. I can't believe that someone would get on a bus that has a designated route, and not ask/demand for that route before starting off. If the driver thought "oh, I'll get directions from one of the kids," then she's incompetent. If someone told her to get directions from a kid, then both she and the other person are incompetent.

Some 11yo may be able to give good enough directions, but not all (or even most.) She was extremely fortunate that there was a kid who knew it fairly well and lived at the end of the route. What would the driver have done if OP's kids got off in the middle of the route? Continued with a 6yo? Forced the 11yo to stay on the bus?

[JenJay]

Yes, but an adult driver shouldn't expect an 11 year old to be able to describe a full bus route. So, there would really be no difference between deliberate and accidental misinformation.

You're right, of course.  No doubt about that.

But it may be that that was her only recourse if she wasn't provided appropriate information to begin with.  It has happened that substitute drivers really are called in just minutes before the bus is loaded to take the kids home.
 
And there are eleven year olds who would be able to guide a driver through a bus route without hitches, so she may have assumed all kids could.

Her proper recourse was to go back to the people who put her on the bus without proper directions. I can't believe that someone would get on a bus that has a designated route, and not ask/demand for that route before starting off. If the driver thought "oh, I'll get directions from one of the kids," then she's incompetent. If someone told her to get directions from a kid, then both she and the other person are incompetent.

Some 11yo may be able to give good enough directions, but not all (or even most.) She was extremely fortunate that there was a kid who knew it fairly well and lived at the end of the route. What would the driver have done if OP's kids got off in the middle of the route? Continued with a 6yo? Forced the 11yo to stay on the bus?

Exactly

Like I've said, there have been other substitute drivers who've needed a bit of help from the kids. I don't love it, but I sympathize with the driver and I don't have a problem with that. This driver apparently needed step by step directions AND yelled at the kids for not being able to provide them. Now we have a problem.

[Roe]

Yes, but an adult driver shouldn't expect an 11 year old to be able to describe a full bus route. So, there would really be no difference between deliberate and accidental misinformation.

You're right, of course.  No doubt about that.

But it may be that that was her only recourse if she wasn't provided appropriate information to begin with.  It has happened that substitute drivers really are called in just minutes before the bus is loaded to take the kids home.
 
And there are eleven year olds who would be able to guide a driver through a bus route without hitches, so she may have assumed all kids could.

Her proper recourse was to go back to the people who put her on the bus without proper directions. I can't believe that someone would get on a bus that has a designated route, and not ask/demand for that route before starting off. If the driver thought "oh, I'll get directions from one of the kids," then she's incompetent. If someone told her to get directions from a kid, then both she and the other person are incompetent.

Some 11yo may be able to give good enough directions, but not all (or even most.) She was extremely fortunate that there was a kid who knew it fairly well and lived at the end of the route. What would the driver have done if OP's kids got off in the middle of the route? Continued with a 6yo? Forced the 11yo to stay on the bus?

Absolutely!  I couldn't agree more.

[katycoo]

I'm pretty sure I could have directed the bus driver around my school bus route at that age - I knew it well enough.  But the pressure of having to get it right or being relied upon can make ANYONE second guess themselves.

[MamaMootz]

I know the issue is being handled but while I was reading the posts, I was wondering: in this day and age of cell phones and modern technology, does no one on that bus have GPS? If I were a substitute driver and was unfamiliar with all the routes, I'd run to Best Buy and pick myself up a cheap Garmin or something like it - so that I would not have to rely on 11 year olds to tell me where I need to go.

[Sharnita]

I know the issue is being handled but while I was reading the posts, I was wondering: in this day and age of cell phones and modern technology, does no one on that bus have GPS? If I were a substitute driver and was unfamiliar with all the routes, I'd run to Best Buy and pick myself up a cheap Garmin or something like it - so that I would not have to rely on 11 year olds to tell me where I need to go.

The problem is that GPS will tell you the best/most logical/fastest way to go.  I recall that our bus route did not go the best/most logical/fastest way to go because there were some rules or regulations they had to follow.  It has been years now so I can't remember if it was that the bus was not supposed to go down one busy highway even though it would be faster or if it would briefly cross a road that would technically require us to be driving in another district for a couple minutes.  ALl I remember is that we did a lot of backtracking and more or less zigzagging because the bus route had been laid out that way for some reason.

[Roe]

But the transportation dept. can create routes for each bus and either put a map in the bus or input the route in a GPS.  Its' not that difficult to do.  The transportation dept. failed big time.

[Sharnita]

But the transportation dept. can create routes for each bus and either put a map in the bus or input the route in a GPS.  Its' not that difficult to do.  The transportation dept. failed big time.

Yeah, but that would be a different route than you'd get from your Best Buy Garmin or some sponataneouly provided GPS.  I completely agree that the route needs to come from the Transportation Dept. for that very reason.

[MamaMootz]

Roe has an excellent point - why didn't the transportation dept provide any kind of route to the driver? Or did they, and she ignored it?

[katycoo]

But the transportation dept. can create routes for each bus and either put a map in the bus or input the route in a GPS.  Its' not that difficult to do.  The transportation dept. failed big time.

The problem with GPS is:

1. It can't store several hundred routes;
2. it can't read the traffic.  If there's a diversion, the GPS can't change its route
3. There's huge cost implications for for putting a GPS system in every bus and keeping each unit updated with new route info (assuming you could, in fact, store all routes in one unit)

A physical bus isn't allocated per route.  Buses are contantly being rotated - for servicing or repairs, or drivers are simply transferred to another route (ie. bus 259 is delayed due to a traffic accident.  We need you do go cover route 61 now as 259 won't be there for another 2 hours!)  So every bus needs to be equipped for every route.

Also - charter routes are not regular routes - they're different again.

Roe has an excellent point - why didn't the transportation dept provide any kind of route to the driver? Or did they, and she ignored it?

As I mentioned before.  She probably did have a map or left and right directions of some kind.  But you can't read directions AND drive a bus at the same time.  It simply isn't safe.

[artk2002]

Roe has an excellent point - why didn't the transportation dept provide any kind of route to the driver? Or did they, and she ignored it?

As I mentioned before.  She probably did have a map or left and right directions of some kind.  But you can't read directions AND drive a bus at the same time.  It simply isn't safe.

Then the map or directions are pretty useless, aren't they? If someone did give her a map and directions, then they are incompetent. If she had the map/directions she should have at least shared them with her "co pilot." Or pulled over at intervals to consult them. If she had them and didn't do these things... she's incompetent.

There is no acceptable excuse for what happened. None whatsoever. Somebody that ill prepared should not be driving children around. If it's too hard for her then she needs to find a different occupation.

[MamaMootz]

But the transportation dept. can create routes for each bus and either put a map in the bus or input the route in a GPS.  Its' not that difficult to do.  The transportation dept. failed big time.

The problem with GPS is:

1. It can't store several hundred routes;
2. it can't read the traffic.  If there's a diversion, the GPS can't change its route
3. There's huge cost implications for for putting a GPS system in every bus and keeping each unit updated with new route info (assuming you could, in fact, store all routes in one unit)

A physical bus isn't allocated per route.  Buses are contantly being rotated - for servicing or repairs, or drivers are simply transferred to another route (ie. bus 259 is delayed due to a traffic accident.  We need you do go cover route 61 now as 259 won't be there for another 2 hours!)  So every bus needs to be equipped for every route.

Also - charter routes are not regular routes - they're different again.

Roe has an excellent point - why didn't the transportation dept provide any kind of route to the driver? Or did they, and she ignored it?

As I mentioned before.  She probably did have a map or left and right directions of some kind.  But you can't read directions AND drive a bus at the same time.  It simply isn't safe.

If the driver felt she was lost, though, a lot of people have GPS these days in their cell phones - so rather than relying on an 11 year old for information, I'd much rather program my phone and have it talk to me while I drive.

also, even if the bus isn't allocated to a specific route every day, the routes themselves don't change based on where kids get dropped off, unless a stop is added due to new construction, so the bus folk could have given the sub something as a guide.