Author Topic: No, I don't want him to be here. ***Update pg 5***  (Read 11860 times)

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Aeris

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Re: No, I don't want him to be here.
« Reply #30 on: March 09, 2013, 01:00:09 AM »
I think the child is a bit of a red herring. She's asking to bring two uninvited people to another person's house. That's not cool. And the age doesn't matter.

I disagree.  The age and who it is matter very much here and to me this is not a red herring situation at all.

Et - who is the second uninvited person?

The friend's DH who would be coming to the set up to watch the child.  So the OP would have two uninvited people at her house for the set up.  It sounds to me that the OP can handle the set up with her DH and the friend would be better off not coming until her parents get home to watch the toddler, but it seems that is not acceptable to the friend.

1) The friend has not indicated that "this is not acceptable". Don't add things that haven't happened. The friend "wasn't thrilled". I'm 'not thrilled' about lots of things I don't have tantrums about.

2) The OP did not indicate that she had any particular problem with the friend's husband joining for the pre-party. I don't see any reason to make this a bigger issue than the OP has.

Lindee

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Re: No, I don't want him to be here.
« Reply #31 on: March 09, 2013, 01:22:12 AM »
I don't think you are being unreasonable at all.  I share your misgivings about having a toddler there while you are setting up. He is used to being able to help himself to food from tables and there is little chance he'll be happy staying quietly in another room with his father instead of being where the action (and food and decoration) is. It is a long time since I had toddlers but I have a good memory.  You already know the grandparents are likely to be late and will want to chat with you while you are trying to greet your invited guests and where will the two year old be then? Climbing all over the tables is my guess.

I don't see it as asking your friend for a favour or trying to make her do the work without recognition as someone was implying. She enjoys helping set up with you but sadly this year it is not going to work out.  She has already decided that Church the next day is more important to her than spending the extra time with you at the party  but it is not then your obligation to make up the time by stressing yourself out worrying about the toddler.

Pen^2

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Re: No, I don't want him to be here.
« Reply #32 on: March 09, 2013, 01:34:03 AM »
I don't think you are being rude or unreasonable at all, OP. It's your house, and therefore, your choice as to who is allowed to come in. Nothing remotely unreasonable about that. The only possible rude thing here is if your delivery was nasty, and it doesn't sound like that at all.

As for me, I would be stressed to have a child in a house that was not child-proof or child-ready at all, let alone while trying to set up for a major party. No thank-you. And as others have pointed out, the friend's DH looking after the child could easily be different to what the OP or other people see as 'looking after'. The child may be allowed to run riot in the house with the father following behind, only there to ensure the child doesn't get hurt, and nothing more (I've seen this a lot). The father may be great and keep the child entertained off quietly in another room, on the other hand. But it is a gamble that one doesn't want to take at the last minute while stressfully preparing for a big annual event.

It sounds like the friend could easily work around this (many people have made good suggestions), but doesn't want to. I feel that this isn't because the friend is being difficult, but rather, it's because she is used to having a toddler around and doesn't realise that other people don't see it as the normal everyday thing that she does. And let's be honest, we're all guilty of this at time in various small areas. Just because we don't see something as a problem, we have difficulty accepting that something so simple and harmless is apparently abhorrent or impossible for others, and can start assuming that they are being silly or something, when in fact, they just don't see the world as we do, and aren't acclimatised to the same types of things.

Slartibartfast

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Re: No, I don't want him to be here.
« Reply #33 on: March 09, 2013, 02:27:39 AM »
Is there a park nearby, or a library, or somewhere else a child might find interesting?  Your friend's DH could drop her off at your house and take the kid to the park/library/whatever until the grandparents can come get the kid.  That would solve the car issue and the getting-to-see-each-other issue.

I'm normally pro-kids-as-long-as-they're-behaving, but setting up for a party is a stressful time.  You have to be able to put something down or get something ready and have it still be there even without constant supervision - which you can't do with a two-year-old around!  If it were me, I'd say the house really isn't toddler-proofed.

Aeris

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Re: No, I don't want him to be here.
« Reply #34 on: March 09, 2013, 02:32:54 AM »
Is there a park nearby, or a library, or somewhere else a child might find interesting?  Your friend's DH could drop her off at your house and take the kid to the park/library/whatever until the grandparents can come get the kid.  That would solve the car issue and the getting-to-see-each-other issue.

I'm normally pro-kids-as-long-as-they're-behaving, but setting up for a party is a stressful time.  You have to be able to put something down or get something ready and have it still be there even without constant supervision - which you can't do with a two-year-old around!  If it were me, I'd say the house really isn't toddler-proofed.

I like this suggestion a lot. The distances involved could preclude the friend's DH from driving all the way back home after dropping her off, but if there's somewhere in the area to go that could solve all the problems neatly.

sammycat

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Re: No, I don't want him to be here.
« Reply #35 on: March 09, 2013, 03:10:13 AM »
I don't think you are wrong at all OP. When I was setting up for parties when my children were younger, I didn't even want my own toddlers around, let alone anyone else's.

My reading of the situation. OP, please correct me if I'm wrong:

1.  Rather than OP roping Friend in as a favour, Friend has volunteered for this each year, for whatever reason (eg. loves setting up; gets to spend extra time with OP).
2.  OP's DH also helps set up. Friend's help is a bonus, not essential.
3.  Friend seems to want to have her cake and eat it too - help/spend more time with OP, visit church in the morning (what that has to do with the party I have no idea), and have her toddler in tow as well.
4.  Friend seems to be unwilling to compromise with OP's very reasonable requests.

I like a pp suggestion of Friend's DH taking the baby to a nearby park or attraction if there's one nearby.

Bottom line, Friend's parent's in law's plans, unusable second vehicle, desires to go to church the next day, are not the OP's concerns, and shouldn't have any bearing on OP's party.

Aeris

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Re: No, I don't want him to be here.
« Reply #36 on: March 09, 2013, 03:33:10 AM »
I don't think you are wrong at all OP. When I was setting up for parties when my children were younger, I didn't even want my own toddlers around, let alone anyone else's.

My reading of the situation. OP, please correct me if I'm wrong:

1.  Rather than OP roping Friend in as a favour, Friend has volunteered for this each year, for whatever reason (eg. loves setting up; gets to spend extra time with OP).
2.  OP's DH also helps set up. Friend's help is a bonus, not essential.
3.  Friend seems to want to have her cake and eat it too - help/spend more time with OP, visit church in the morning (what that has to do with the party I have no idea), and have her toddler in tow as well.
4.  Friend seems to be unwilling to compromise with OP's very reasonable requests.

I like a pp suggestion of Friend's DH taking the baby to a nearby park or attraction if there's one nearby.

Bottom line, Friend's parent's in law's plans, unusable second vehicle, desires to go to church the next day, are not the OP's concerns, and shouldn't have any bearing on OP's party.

Ok, I agree that the OP doesn't need to change her stance on this. But where in the world are you getting that the friend is "unwilling to compromise"? The friend suggested one plan to get together that worked best for her, the OP said that wouldn't work for the OP, and the friend seemed disappointed. That's all we've got. I don't see any substantial 'unwillingness to compromise' from this friend. She's probably disappointed because she *gasp* likes the OP and would like to spend time with her and is trying to figure out how to do that with competing obligations and logistical difficulties. She thought she'd come up with a workable solution and then it turned out it wasn't, and she's back at square one. And she's disappointed. That doesn't make her entitled.

And when did we start characterizing a friend wanting to spend time with us as 'having her cake and eating it too'? That's a phrase I use for people trying to get more than they deserve, or get things that benefit only or primarily themselves. Is it really awful that the friend wants to spend time with the OP? So many posters keep making it sound like the only one who gets anything out of hanging out is the friend, and being so entitled to try to figure out how to make it happen.

I really don't know why people keep characterizing the friend in this wildly negative way.

The OP is perfectly reasonable to not want the kid there. The friend is perfectly reasonable to be trying to maximize the time they get to spend together. The OP came here asking for validation that she wasn't being a jerk. And she isn't. But just because SHE's not being a jerk doesn't mean the friend IS being a jerk. No one is being a jerk so far. Not every story has a bad guy.

Scuba_Dog

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Re: No, I don't want him to be here.
« Reply #37 on: March 09, 2013, 04:11:07 AM »
No one is in the wrong as far as I'm concerned. 

Sounds like it's not going to work out this year to spend time together before the party.  I'd just let it go and look forward to next year.



"If you are going through hell, keep going."
Winston Churchill

sammycat

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Re: No, I don't want him to be here.
« Reply #38 on: March 09, 2013, 04:20:22 AM »
But where in the world are you getting that the friend is "unwilling to compromise"? The friend suggested one plan to get together that worked best for her, the OP said that wouldn't work for the OP, and the friend seemed disappointed. That's all we've got. I don't see any substantial 'unwillingness to compromise' from this friend.

From the OP:

I suggested that her DH and son could stay at home while she came over early, and then her DH could wait until her parents got him and then join us, but their second car is in the shop. So then I said she didn't have to come over early and help, and they could arrive a little later to the party. She didn't want to do that because she says they only have a limited time at the party because they want to go to church in the morning. So her reasoning is to spend as much time as possible with DH and me.

This doesn't sound like the Friend trying to compromise to me. Friend wants to attend the party, attend church and bring the baby. She's been told she's (still) welcome to attend the party, either as a guest or early helper. However, the child is not welcome. It's not up to the OP to work out the Friend's logistics. She's suggested a few alternatives (baby and DH stay home till babysitter arrives, or come later), but no, the friend wants to come for the whole time and bring her unwelcome child.

auntmeegs

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Re: No, I don't want him to be here.
« Reply #39 on: March 09, 2013, 05:42:54 AM »
But where in the world are you getting that the friend is "unwilling to compromise"? The friend suggested one plan to get together that worked best for her, the OP said that wouldn't work for the OP, and the friend seemed disappointed. That's all we've got. I don't see any substantial 'unwillingness to compromise' from this friend.

From the OP:

I suggested that her DH and son could stay at home while she came over early, and then her DH could wait until her parents got him and then join us, but their second car is in the shop. So then I said she didn't have to come over early and help, and they could arrive a little later to the party. She didn't want to do that because she says they only have a limited time at the party because they want to go to church in the morning. So her reasoning is to spend as much time as possible with DH and me.

This doesn't sound like the Friend trying to compromise to me. Friend wants to attend the party, attend church and bring the baby. She's been told she's (still) welcome to attend the party, either as a guest or early helper. However, the child is not welcome. It's not up to the OP to work out the Friend's logistics. She's suggested a few alternatives (baby and DH stay home till babysitter arrives, or come later), but no, the friend wants to come for the whole time and bring her unwelcome child.

There is still nothing suggesting that the friend was unwilling to compromise. 

YummyMummy66

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Re: No, I don't want him to be here.
« Reply #40 on: March 09, 2013, 06:35:10 AM »
Her reasoning....she wants to spend as much time with you and your dh as possible...on her terms....at your home.....for your party.

No, you were not rude. 

How much time can she really spend when she is helping you, her dh is supposed to be watching the kid, (we all know how that goes), the "kid" free party starts and her kid is still there?

I think you are completely justified in your answer and should not feel guilty about it either.

YummyMummy66

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Re: No, I don't want him to be here.
« Reply #41 on: March 09, 2013, 06:38:00 AM »
Hold on, is your friend doing you a favour by coming to help set up? Is your extravaganza that you get all the glory for, but which she helps you with all the setting out of things, or is it a shared effort for which you both get recognition that just happens to be at your place, because that would affect my view of things. In the latter case, of course she should do her part, but in the former, you are asking her to put herself at an inconvience just to suit you.

It sounds to me like you haven't taken your friend's changing circumstances into account and are expecting her to turn up for what you view as a 'fun time' as if she didn't have the responsibility of a two-year-old and, to a lesser extent, a husband to worry about. And I'm afraid I strongly disagree with your twist on 'since they have a child, they don't get to do everything they want.' [b]You seem to think it means YOU can have what YOU want instead [/b] and they should be used to making sacrifices anyway, so one that happens to give you your way is going to be fine.

Sorry, but no, it doesn't work like that.

Besides, since you have a DH, who will presumably be co-hosting the party and getting at least half of the credit, what's wrong with making him do the work instead?

Her home, her party, of course she gets to do what she wants to do.  Why should someone else be able to dictate what happens in her home? 

YummyMummy66

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Re: No, I don't want him to be here.
« Reply #42 on: March 09, 2013, 06:42:29 AM »
I told my friend that I'd really prefer to not have him there because I don't want to maneuver wine glasses, candles, food, etc around a toddler. I suggested that her DH and son could stay at home while she came over early, and then her DH could wait until her parents got him and then join us, but their second car is in the shop. So then I said she didn't have to come over early and help, and they could arrive a little later to the party. She didn't want to do that because she says they only have a limited time at the party because they want to go to church in the morning. So her reasoning is to spend as much time as possible with DH and me.

It doesn't sound like OP expects her friend to help with this party. It sounds like her friend WANTS to help set up for the party (but also wants to spend as much time with her DH as she can).

So yes - it's the friend that needs to figure out what she's going to sacrifice; helping with the party or hanging out with her DH.

OP - You're not being unreasonable. Unreasonable would be demanding that your friend come help you set up the party and throwing a hissy fit when she can't do that without her child. You gave her options - either come early withOUT the child, or come a bit late withOUT the child.

For what it's worth; I don't allow children in my house for any reason full stop. People that know me and have reason to come over know better to even ask, the ones that don't are politely but firmly told it's not possible.

I'm pretty sure the friend wants to maximize hanging out with the OP and the OP's DH; not with the OP and her *own* DH. The friend isn't trying to get a bunch of things she wants here - she's trying to figure out how to maximize her time with the OP. That doesn't mean that anything and everything she does is perfectly acceptable, but it's probably a good idea for us to stop acting like she's some sort of entitlemommy who's trying to gain something here.

She's trying to figure out how to spend time with her friend, the OP. There's nothing *inherently* messed up about that. Even if the practical details make it unworkable this time.

It sounds to me like her concerns about coming to the party late were:
1) That that seriously reduces the amount of time the OP and the friend get to spend together and *possibly*
2) That if they have to both leave early AND come late - at some point that might mean that it's just not practical to attend the party at all.


These are reasonable concerns. It doesn't mean the OP is wrong, and it doesn't mean the OP is required to change her stance. But these concerns of the friend are reasonable. And the first one is a reflection of the fact that spending time with the OP is important to the friend - which ought to be an admirable trait in a friend. Instead some posters are acting as though she's trying to get something for free.

The OP states that this party is one they do every year.  I am sure there are plenty of other opportunities for this friend to spend quality time with the OP other than this party.  Which, due to preparing for the party, having the party with other guests, etc., how much time can the friend actually spend with the OP?  And second, the friend is choosing to leave early for personal reasons.  That is not the OP's problem.  I'm sorry, I don't see these as reasonable excuses on the friends' part to spend time with the OP.   

CrochetFanatic

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Re: No, I don't want him to be here.
« Reply #43 on: March 09, 2013, 07:43:39 AM »
I don't see any rudeness on either side.  As long as she doesn't get nasty or try to pull a fast one (ie, "He's here now, so he can stay...right?"), she wasn't rude to make her request.  You weren't rude to say "Adult party - no kids". 

Children that age touch everything they can get their hands on, and they aren't particularly careful.  For example, a little cousin of mine, same age, took a flat car magnet off our fridge and tore it in half with a big grin on her face.  Her parents grinned back, said, "Oh, DD!  Don't do that." as if this were the cutest thing in the world, and then got on my mom's case about how many magnets and things were on the fridge; "Well, you have too many things on your fridge anyway.".  Apology?  Nope.  And they got offended when we didn't let her in the kitchen after that. 

Now, if there are going to be glasses of wine and other things that you (the OP) don't want a child getting into or knocking over (*gasp* red wine on carpet!), there is no guarantee that even a well-behaved child won't get away from his/her minder for a few seconds and bump into something.  Accidents can happen, even under the best of intentions.  You're well within your rights to say "No kids this time", and it sounds like you did say it nicely.  I hope your party goes well!
« Last Edit: March 09, 2013, 07:45:22 AM by CrochetFanatic »

jaxsue

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Re: No, I don't want him to be here.
« Reply #44 on: March 09, 2013, 09:52:35 AM »
No need to feel guilty, OP. If I were preparing to throw a party I'd prefer that a small child not be there, too. It's stressful enough cleaning house and preparing food!

It's a shame that the friend's situation has changed her options; some of that is beyond her control and some isn't. The part she can control she won't consider changing, so she needs to accept the limitations.

No one is wrong in this case, but like you I'd stand firm on the "no child" rule in this particular matter.