Author Topic: Asking a "Neighbor" about their primary place of residence  (Read 11169 times)

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WillyNilly

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Re: Asking a "Neighbor" about their primary place of residence
« Reply #45 on: April 05, 2013, 03:39:23 PM »
As I mentioned, reporting this woman (regardless of whether she is a pauper or a millionaire) is merely, at most, going to spark an investigation as to her & her kid's legal, primary, residence. If her kids do not live in the district, her kids should not be going to the school.

In most states, it's not quite that simple.  There are a variety of situations that may lawfully place a child in a school outside the district or zone in which they are living.  In my opinion, that's between the State, the school, and the family, and any family who attends a school, even if they live elsewhere, should be treated with the same dignity and grace as any other.

Well an investigation via the appropriate channels will discover that, won't they?
The point is, the OP reporting the issue isn't going to cause any immediate reaction, its going to at most cause someone looking into the situation. In some cases, the issue being reported, it might even be ignored. But reporting the issue isn't going to = immediate expulsion of the kids and immediate legal action against the mother. Reporting the issue will bring it to the attention of the powers that be, and they can handle it as they see fit, and they might find the kids are attending school legally just as viably as they might find the opposite. Either way, by reporting the situation, it will be handled by the appropriate persons or legal entity, which takes it out of the gossip mill into the correct investigative forum.

nuit93

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Re: Asking a "Neighbor" about their primary place of residence
« Reply #46 on: April 05, 2013, 03:45:37 PM »
When someone tells you they are say, a cashier at Target, or a public employee like a teacher or a cop, its really not so difficult to form a truthful idea of what their income is - its pretty much public info. OP says the woman mentioned her job. Sure maybe OP doesn't know what the future holds for this woman, but its not a stretch or gossip to say she has a good idea of the current situation.

Reporting the woman won't result in immediate expulsion of the child from school or imprisonment of the mom. Reporting her would at most do one thing: start an investigation. That's it. The results of the investigation might result in the kid getting kicked out of school or repercussions for the mom, but they would be due to the mom's actions, not the person who reported her.

I don't agree. You might have a general idea of the person's current salary, but you have no idea what their total income is. They could have investment income, or an inheritance, or a structured settlement, or be receiving alimony. Just knowing someone's job does not mean you know their entire financial situation.

This is what I was about to say--unless you know all her financial records, it's impossible to know what her actual money situation looks like.

Mikayla

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Re: Asking a "Neighbor" about their primary place of residence
« Reply #47 on: April 05, 2013, 03:47:14 PM »
I'm sorry, you're about to report a woman because you assume she can't afford the school and doesn't live in the district? Do you have any proof? Why on earth would you butt in at all?

And everything in your post reminds me of how desperately awful school finances are handled in the US - how dare a whole district be obviously better because the parents can afford higher taxes? How dare other children be given less of a chance at a public school because families are lower income? How on earth is that equal? ?

And how dare another mother, who snobbishly points out that a woman cannot (in her own mind) afford to live in a district, try to bar another child from what is seen as obviously a better education, again, at a public school? Infuriating.

I think this is over the top and unfair.  It's also a borderline rant.  The issue involved here has nothing to do with your second paragraph.

I may be in the minority, but the OP has stated that this is based on more than gossip.  At some point, I think it's fair to accept the statement at face value, and answer the etiquette question.  And my take on that is no, you don't give prior warning.

ETA:  I agree with Willy Nilly.

Redneck Gravy

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Re: Asking a "Neighbor" about their primary place of residence
« Reply #48 on: April 05, 2013, 03:55:08 PM »
We purchased a home in a very highly sought after school district.  We chose to spend more on a house than paying the tuition of a private school.  Due to the success between a prestigous Ivy league university and the local elementary school, there are not enough spots for all the district's kindergarten-aged students.  As a result, parents line up outside the school prior to registration day.  This past January, parents began lining up 4 days prior to registration. 


Clearly, there are not enough spots in the district for their own children, much less for children brought in from OUTSIDE their district. 

And unless you know how all the funding goes for school districts from state to state, city to city, you can't possibly imagine all that goes into getting your kid into a good school.  I agree public education is a nightmare but until we get someone involved with a REAL plan that everyone can agree on; we are stuck with the mediocre education available in some districts.

ladyknight1

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Re: Asking a "Neighbor" about their primary place of residence
« Reply #49 on: April 05, 2013, 03:56:13 PM »
We have that problem in my district.  We border a district with a sub par schools and ours is constantly in the top 5 of the state and has received national recognition, so there are people who scam a relative or friend into using their address and drop the kids off at the school bus stops in the morning.  While it is a mostly upper class district, there are rentals but they are more than the district with the interlopers .  To me, it is plain and simple theft.  I moved here specifically for the schools and it galls me when my tax money is paying for kids who do not live here.  Live here if you want out services, otherwise figure out how to make your district better.  I know I had to show a current ID with my address and picture, plus tax bills/deeds/leases as required.  They don't accept utility bills anymore, and I think it is because anyone can get a utility turned on in their name anywhere.  I have reported 2 families that I knew for sure were not living in our district.  After an investigation, their scheme fell apart, the kids were kicked out of school and the district pursued a judgement against the parents and the people who helped them out by providing an address were charged with fraud too.  nrb80, if it were your child who might not get into the school because someone was scamming their kids in, how would you feel?  I know I would spit nails if I lost on a lottery after spending the money to buy a house in a high end neighborhood and paid taxes, to someone who wanted the benefit of an education without actually living there.  I do feel for people who are of lower economic situations who do not have the best schools in their neighborhoods (I am by no means rich myself), but either work to make your district better or scrimp and save to find a place in a better district like I have.

When we moved, we specifically chose our rental because of the school zone. We are not in the best area, but the schools are good. We have people drive from across the highway (another zone) to bring their children to our complex to catch the bus.

Proof here is a lease or mortgage paperwork, plus a DL showing that address. I see people with out of state license plates though, dropping off their children at DS' high school.

TurtleDove

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Re: Asking a "Neighbor" about their primary place of residence
« Reply #50 on: April 05, 2013, 03:57:08 PM »
I think the OP should report the situation and allow the district to handle it.  No need to give the woman a heads up or even to follow up after that.  If the district is fine with the situation, the OP should be too.  If the district is not okay with it, then I am certain the district will do something about it.

Tabby Uprising

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Re: Asking a "Neighbor" about their primary place of residence
« Reply #51 on: April 05, 2013, 03:57:41 PM »
I'm sorry, you're about to report a woman because you assume she can't afford the school and doesn't live in the district? Do you have any proof? Why on earth would you butt in at all?

And everything in your post reminds me of how desperately awful school finances are handled in the US - how dare a whole district be obviously better because the parents can afford higher taxes? How dare other children be given less of a chance at a public school because families are lower income? How on earth is that equal? ?

And how dare another mother, who snobbishly points out that a woman cannot (in her own mind) afford to live in a district, try to bar another child from what is seen as obviously a better education, again, at a public school? Infuriating.

If you're outraged by the system, the right thing to do is actively lobby for its overhaul with specific recommendations for how the new system will be structured, how to implement it, how to handle the logistics and of course, how it will be paid for.  Fraudulently claiming a residence to get your child in the school is the wrong way to do things.  What if everyone did that?  How would that be fair?  How could schools accommodate the influx of students? The overcrowding?  Public schools do have rules about who is eligible to attend, despite the moniker of "public".  They also cost money: structure, teachers, equipment, insurance, etc.  People pay for that!  That money has to come from somewhere, like school taxes. 

Look, Fountainsoflettuce did not create this system.  It's not her fault.  She didn't dare create this scenario.  She wants to report someone who could be abusing the system.  I don't know of any other situations here on ehell where a suspected abuse of a system is shrugged off and people are shamed for even entertaining the notion of reporting it. 

WillyNilly

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Re: Asking a "Neighbor" about their primary place of residence
« Reply #52 on: April 05, 2013, 04:03:52 PM »
I'm sorry, you're about to report a woman because you assume she can't afford the school and doesn't live in the district? Do you have any proof? Why on earth would you butt in at all?

And everything in your post reminds me of how desperately awful school finances are handled in the US - how dare a whole district be obviously better because the parents can afford higher taxes? How dare other children be given less of a chance at a public school because families are lower income? How on earth is that equal? ?

And how dare another mother, who snobbishly points out that a woman cannot (in her own mind) afford to live in a district, try to bar another child from what is seen as obviously a better education, again, at a public school? Infuriating.

If you don't like the system, there are ways to work to change it. Proper channels.
Breaking the rules just because you* find them unjust is not the solution. Neither is gossip.

The OP is asking about her social obligations while following the proper channels - she wants to take herself out of the gossip ring and put the issue into the hands of those deemed in charge of the situation. That is the absolute right way to solve things. She should not be attacked for it.

If you have a problem with how things are run in your county, city, state or country, I absolutely urge you to join with your neighbors, speak up, write to politicians, make yourself heard and propose better ideas and methods. I know in my community, my local Civic Association has to beg people to get involved, even though we fight hard for the betterment of our schools. We'd be thrilled to have more people, passionate people, get involved!


* general "you"

doodlemor

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Re: Asking a "Neighbor" about their primary place of residence
« Reply #53 on: April 05, 2013, 04:10:03 PM »
.......there are not enough spots for all the district's kindergarten-aged students.  As a result, parents line up outside the school prior to registration day.  This past January, parents began lining up 4 days prior to registration. 

As a retired teacher, I'm rather surprised by this statement.  In my neck of the woods a public school has to take everyone. 

Some years the enrollment is greater than others.  My school  had to expand grade levels, and also condense them  according to the number of students.  At various times we had portable classrooms outside our main building to accommodate everyone, and for a few years our district had to rent a church hall for several classes.


If there is a great disparity between several elementary schools in the district, and the **losers** in the registration line  just have to go to another school, then the district should address this so that the schools are more equal.

As far as the original etiquette question goes, I don't think that OP should warn this woman if she decides to report her.  She shouldn't set herself or her family up for retaliation.  Not necessarily that the other woman would do something to her, but why take the chance?

kareng57

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Re: Asking a "Neighbor" about their primary place of residence
« Reply #54 on: April 05, 2013, 04:12:32 PM »
I'm sorry, you're about to report a woman because you assume she can't afford the school and doesn't live in the district? Do you have any proof? Why on earth would you butt in at all?

And everything in your post reminds me of how desperately awful school finances are handled in the US - how dare a whole district be obviously better because the parents can afford higher taxes? How dare other children be given less of a chance at a public school because families are lower income? How on earth is that equal? ?

And how dare another mother, who snobbishly points out that a woman cannot (in her own mind) afford to live in a district, try to bar another child from what is seen as obviously a better education, again, at a public school? Infuriating.
Apparently the OP does have the proof that this woman doesn't live in the district. This isn't about affording the school - it's about affording to live in the district. I don't think there is anything wrong with the lawful residents of a district reporting unlawful activity, especially when it can impact the children of the lawful residents. It's too bad about school funding, but asking an individual to sacrifice her own children for the "common good" is a bit much, in my opinion. Work to change the system, but don't blame someone for making the decision to figure out a way to work in the system in the meantime.

OP - if you are still reading, there is no reason you need to let this "neighbor" know if you plan to report her.


It was the OP who made it "about" affording the school when she mentioned having a lot of knowledge about the other parent's financial circumstances.  That made it very much the tone of we-don't-want-those-kinds-of-people-attending-our-school.

gramma dishes

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Re: Asking a "Neighbor" about their primary place of residence
« Reply #55 on: April 05, 2013, 04:13:22 PM »
It doesn't make any difference whether or not the other mother can afford to live in the better school district.  Right now at least she does NOT live in it.  That's the only thing that matters here.  It wouldn't matter if she were a multimillionaire.

If her family doesn't live in the district, her children should not be going to that school.  Period.  I think the OP should report it to the powers that be and then let it go.  The district will discover the truth and they'll either do something about it or not.  The OP will have done the right thing.

Tabby Uprising

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Re: Asking a "Neighbor" about their primary place of residence
« Reply #56 on: April 05, 2013, 04:15:32 PM »
I'm sorry, you're about to report a woman because you assume she can't afford the school and doesn't live in the district? Do you have any proof? Why on earth would you butt in at all?

And everything in your post reminds me of how desperately awful school finances are handled in the US - how dare a whole district be obviously better because the parents can afford higher taxes? How dare other children be given less of a chance at a public school because families are lower income? How on earth is that equal? ?

And how dare another mother, who snobbishly points out that a woman cannot (in her own mind) afford to live in a district, try to bar another child from what is seen as obviously a better education, again, at a public school? Infuriating.
Apparently the OP does have the proof that this woman doesn't live in the district. This isn't about affording the school - it's about affording to live in the district. I don't think there is anything wrong with the lawful residents of a district reporting unlawful activity, especially when it can impact the children of the lawful residents. It's too bad about school funding, but asking an individual to sacrifice her own children for the "common good" is a bit much, in my opinion. Work to change the system, but don't blame someone for making the decision to figure out a way to work in the system in the meantime.

OP - if you are still reading, there is no reason you need to let this "neighbor" know if you plan to report her.


It was the OP who made it "about" affording the school when she mentioned having a lot of knowledge about the other parent's financial circumstances.  That made it very much the tone of we-don't-want-those-kinds-of-people-attending-our-school.

Wait, what kinds of people?  I read it as, she can't afford to live in the district therefore she does not live in the district and therefore her child is not eligible to go to the school. 

There are a lot of neighborhoods and school districts I can't afford to reside in.  What kind of person does that make me?

Docslady21

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Re: Asking a "Neighbor" about their primary place of residence
« Reply #57 on: April 05, 2013, 04:19:06 PM »
The OP already clarified in another post that the ONLY reason she brought up income was so that people here could not nitpick that maybe the woman owned extra property, had plans to move there in a few months, etc. Now, people are nitpicking on the fact that she says she knows the person's financial info.

kareng57

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Re: Asking a "Neighbor" about their primary place of residence
« Reply #58 on: April 05, 2013, 04:23:50 PM »
I'm sorry, you're about to report a woman because you assume she can't afford the school and doesn't live in the district? Do you have any proof? Why on earth would you butt in at all?

And everything in your post reminds me of how desperately awful school finances are handled in the US - how dare a whole district be obviously better because the parents can afford higher taxes? How dare other children be given less of a chance at a public school because families are lower income? How on earth is that equal? ?

And how dare another mother, who snobbishly points out that a woman cannot (in her own mind) afford to live in a district, try to bar another child from what is seen as obviously a better education, again, at a public school? Infuriating.
Apparently the OP does have the proof that this woman doesn't live in the district. This isn't about affording the school - it's about affording to live in the district. I don't think there is anything wrong with the lawful residents of a district reporting unlawful activity, especially when it can impact the children of the lawful residents. It's too bad about school funding, but asking an individual to sacrifice her own children for the "common good" is a bit much, in my opinion. Work to change the system, but don't blame someone for making the decision to figure out a way to work in the system in the meantime.

OP - if you are still reading, there is no reason you need to let this "neighbor" know if you plan to report her.


It was the OP who made it "about" affording the school when she mentioned having a lot of knowledge about the other parent's financial circumstances.  That made it very much the tone of we-don't-want-those-kinds-of-people-attending-our-school.

Wait, what kinds of people?  I read it as, she can't afford to live in the district therefore she does not live in the district and therefore her child is not eligible to go to the school. 

There are a lot of neighborhoods and school districts I can't afford to reside in.  What kind of person does that make me?


It's because she really has no way of knowing whether or not the neighbour can afford to live in the area, so why did she even bring it up here? It sounds pretty snobby to me. Conversely, maybe there are other parents who live in the area and are fairly low-income, but they inherited the house that they are in. 

I agree that the sole issue should be where the family is actually living, but OP brought up the income aspect, therefore other posters are free to comment on it.

fountainsoflettuce

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Re: Asking a "Neighbor" about their primary place of residence
« Reply #59 on: April 05, 2013, 04:26:03 PM »
I'm sorry, you're about to report a woman because you assume she can't afford the school and doesn't live in the district? Do you have any proof? Why on earth would you butt in at all?

And everything in your post reminds me of how desperately awful school finances are handled in the US - how dare a whole district be obviously better because the parents can afford higher taxes? How dare other children be given less of a chance at a public school because families are lower income? How on earth is that equal? ?

And how dare another mother, who snobbishly points out that a woman cannot (in her own mind) afford to live in a district, try to bar another child from what is seen as obviously a better education, again, at a public school? Infuriating.
Apparently the OP does have the proof that this woman doesn't live in the district. This isn't about affording the school - it's about affording to live in the district. I don't think there is anything wrong with the lawful residents of a district reporting unlawful activity, especially when it can impact the children of the lawful residents. It's too bad about school funding, but asking an individual to sacrifice her own children for the "common good" is a bit much, in my opinion. Work to change the system, but don't blame someone for making the decision to figure out a way to work in the system in the meantime.

OP - if you are still reading, there is no reason you need to let this "neighbor" know if you plan to report her.


It was the OP who made it "about" affording the school when she mentioned having a lot of knowledge about the other parent's financial circumstances.  That made it very much the tone of we-don't-want-those-kinds-of-people-attending-our-school.

Wait, what kinds of people?  I read it as, she can't afford to live in the district therefore she does not live in the district and therefore her child is not eligible to go to the school. 

There are a lot of neighborhoods and school districts I can't afford to reside in.  What kind of person does that make me?

A person who can't afford to live in that district, no more no less.  Doesn't make you a bad or good person.

As I said, I spoke to the woman when I first met her. We discussed *jobs*, *kids*, the neighborhood controversy about the new sub sandwich shop, etc.   In the course of our conversation I learned she is a city employee, divorced, no alimony, not paying child support.  We discussed the cost of daycare as I was looking into it at the time.  She told me where she went and how much.  Good, full time daycare downtown costs 4-figures a month.  She was happy kid #1 was ready for school b/c that lowered her daycare costs.    Draw your own conclusions.