When Emergency Services Are Needed

[EllenS]

Lawsuit, shmawsuit.  It's the right thing to do.  Some stranger is unconscious/incoherent, you call for medical help.  Since there are no "house calls" to a GP anymore, that means calling 911.

The daughter of a friend of mine has had severe epilepsy her whole life.  Every once in a while she would have a Grand Mal seizure out in public - once when she was standing at a bus stop.

You know what her lovely, thoughtful passers-by did?  They spared her the cost of an ambulance - and mugged her while she was unconscious.

[Cami]

That still doesn't necessarily mean she needed to go to hospital.

and is doesn't mean she didn't.  Co-workers are not qualified to make medical diagnoses and assessments, and it's not their responsibility.  Their responsibility is to get medical help for her immediately.

Exactly. I'm not interested in playing god, nor should I since I'm not omnisicent.

If someone is conscious, but confused, I'm calling 911. How do I know she didn't get a concussion when she fell down when she had her seizure?  How do I know she didn't have a stroke in addition to having a seizure? 

Not worth the risk in any way.

If you have a chronic condition that may cause you to become unconscious, you must accept that 911 is going to be called. My sister has a tendency to faint when she gets overheated. 99% of the time, she comes right out of it. 1% of the time, she doesn't. She's had 911 called on her frequently. It's never occurred to her to be angry that people were concerned about her life, nor to expect that people shouldn't call 911.

[newbiePA]

I work in healthcare.  I have for many years.  If someone is having a serious medical complaint at our office, WE call 911. I have had a person actively having a stroke and another person having a heart attack in my office.  Both wanted to drive themselves to the ER ( about 1 mile away). I still called 911.  Better safe than sorry.  Just because that woman had a history of epilepsy, that day could have been the day an undiagnosed anurysm burst.

[ladyknight1]

What horrible people. 

[ettiquit]

My mother is epileptic, and gets pretty mad when we call 911 when she has a seizure because all they really end up doing is checking her BP and stuff like that.  However, she has then so rarely (about every 5 years, maybe?), that we're just not comfortable assuming that it's just a normal seizure.  Family rule.

I would be baffled if my mom had a seizure in public and the staff at wherever she happened to be opted not to call 911. 

However, if I witnessed someone have a seizure and they had a "Don't call 911 - Epileptic" bracelet on, I'd respect it. 

Unless they were my mother, of course.

[Kaesha]

As a seizure sufferer myself, they did the right thing.  I am also a student and my professors are aware that I have them.  I have asked them that if I do seize in class, to let me wake up and I will decide whether I need ES.  However, if I had a seizure in a hallway or while outside and no one knew who I was, it is definitely the right thing to do to call 911.  I really don't need to go, and can't spare the expense either, but when someone is having a medical emergency, it seems unethical to just ignore their distress!

[Syrse]

This may be a bit off topic, but... if someone else calls you an ambulance and you refuse to ride, you still have to pay for it? How odd! Suppose someone prank calls? Or gets hysterical over a paper cut? 

[*inviteseller]

This poor woman has a seizure surrounded by people she doesn't know and who don't know her so they could not make an assessment other than "oh no, she's having a seizure! Call 9 1 1"  And the husband, instead of worrying about his wife, is busy calling and berating people, who very well may have saved her life.  I wouldn't have been afraid of him, I may have just given him an earful.  I get he is mad they are going to incur hospital/ambulance bills, but she had a seizure!!  And hospitals will work with you on bills, as will ambulances.  I just paid of a nasty sprained ankle/torn ligaments from 2 1/2 years ago..it is not easy.  But if I were him and my choice is paying something to a hospital/ambulance each month or a dead or permanently impaired wife because no one stepped in to help her, I would take the bills

[kherbert05]

If you have chronic condition that can threaten your life or cause you to be unresponsive - it is your job to educate those around you how to respond.


Every year I go over what to do if I'm exposed to peanuts with my teammates. They and the office have my sister's information. She happens to work for  the same hospital I would go to from school but different campus. If she and her husband wanted to have this handled a different way - they should have made sure her friends on campus knew what to do.


Even when you have insurance, getting them to pay is hard. We had to have an ambulance take mom to the hospital at the end of her illness. The insurance said that she had to pay because she could have been transported by private car. Except NO WAY. She was in massive pain and suffering from dementia, she thought we were trying to kill her and fighting us tooth and nail. She obeyed the EMT's and they were able to lift her up and put her on a gurney.  Thankfully sis's job means she knows the rules and regs - the insurance paid up as soon as they made the connection with Sis's job.


I've been yelled at for not calling an ambulance for myself a few times.
1. My then favorite chocolate bar changed recipies and started  using peanut products. I was driving home when I bit into the bar. Turned right instead of left and went to the ER a block away.

2. 2 different times I had been out and about. I'm driving along and realized I have really started to feel bad and my mouth tastes like I'm chewing on aluminum. I touched something with peanut traces. Again pulled off the HW into a near by ER. One doc really was mad I pointed out the nearest safe place to pull over stop and call for help had been the ER's parking lot. (literally got off freeway and pulled into their lot). This is Houston lots of hospitals along most major Highways, and docs in the box, private ER only places, and urgent care centers every couple of strip centers.

3. a couple of other times taken by friends or family directly from the restaurant that lied. It was quicker than trying to call for help - and in at least 2 occasions the restaurant ordered us off the property after the "If you make us pay for a meal we can't eat (literally 1 bite taken on my part and the LIED), you are paying for the ER bill" argument.


Dad's business once had a 2 women walk in. One of them handed the receptionist a card and laid down on the carpet. The card said she was about to have a seizure and not to call for help. She had the seizure, with her friend assuring everyone everything was ok. The seizure over they asked for some water and left. Honestly Dad's boss thought it was some type of scam and they were going to be hit up with a lawsuit. (Can't blame him everyone and their dog was going after people in similar businesses). What was really weird is it was hard to get into the business (basically at Southwest freeway and 59) The feeder road stopped north of them and restarted near them. To exit off the freeway you would have to loop around. To come from surface streets you had to know or spot this little hidden road. It's not like beer distributors get walk in business - you have to have a retail licence to buy from them.


Oh another point. If I see something like this I'm going to call 911 and while on the line or having a bystander on the line relaying information - then I'll check for Medical ID bracelets, other info, and start first aid.

[SingActDance]

I agree the husband was out of line, but he might be wondering why he wasn't called by the school at all. If a student has a medical emergency, I would think that their emergency contact should be notified immediately once proper medical personnel have been summoned.

[AngelicGamer]

This may be a bit off topic, but... if someone else calls you an ambulance and you refuse to ride, you still have to pay for it? How odd! Suppose someone prank calls? Or gets hysterical over a paper cut? 

I didn't have to with the fall with the stairs.  However, that could have been taken care of by Medicare, but I never saw a bill.  I usually do so, even when they 100 percent cover everything.

[ladyknight1]

I agree the husband was out of line, but he might be wondering why he wasn't called by the school at all. If a student has a medical emergency, I would think that their emergency contact should be notified immediately once proper medical personnel have been summoned.

Depends on the school, but my school does not have an emergency contact for their students.

[silvercelt]

This may be a bit off topic, but... if someone else calls you an ambulance and you refuse to ride, you still have to pay for it? How odd! Suppose someone prank calls? Or gets hysterical over a paper cut? 

I didn't have to with the fall with the stairs.  However, that could have been taken care of by Medicare, but I never saw a bill.  I usually do so, even when they 100 percent cover everything.

I feel like this thread was made for me, since I work in the ambulance billing industry.

Lots of ambulance companies (private and public) will bill for refusals (normally referred to as 'evals'). Those who do will normally charge the eval fee to all patients who refuse an ambulance ride after they are called, but they'll all let a patient dispute the bill.  If your neighbor called and you refused all treatment and transport, they'll normally waive the fee.  If a neighbor called and you let them check you over (and possibly patch you up, depending on the problem) but refuse the ride, they won't waive it.

So much varies depending on your area and the billing practices, though- even the amount charged.  In my state, the normal charges for ambulance range from $350-$800- it differs based on the level of care provided to you- and some states range from $1000-$1500 a ride.

I can pretty much guarantee that when you fell the ambulance company didn't charge you for it.  If there is one thing that I have learned that Medicare (and 99% of other insurances) WON'T pay for, it's an ambulance eval.

[MariaE]

I'm amazed that it costs so much for emergency medical care and thankful that we have an NHS here.

I was just thinking the same thing. I'm very grateful medical care is free here.

[TootsNYC]

I agree the husband was out of line, but he might be wondering why he wasn't called by the school at all. If a student has a medical emergency, I would think that their emergency contact should be notified immediately once proper medical personnel have been summoned.

Depends on the school, but my school does not have an emergency contact for their students.

Plus it's not like elementary school, where the kids aren't that far from the front office. Bystanders may not even know who she is.