Author Topic: When Emergency Services Are Needed  (Read 17183 times)

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Winterlight

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Re: When Emergency Services Are Needed
« Reply #75 on: April 13, 2013, 11:29:03 AM »
Basically, if the wife was concious and coherent, she could have refused the ambulance. Since she didn't, I suspect she was still in a non-coherent state.

That still doesn't necessarily mean she needed to go to hospital. People who have epileptic seizures are often very confused when they come round.

That's fine for people who are familiar with her medical history. In this case, the people who called the ambulance were not. If they had not called for immediate medical care, and the woman was, say, suffering a stroke instead, they would likely be subject to lawsuits for huge amounts.

Or if she'd had a stroke in addition to a seizure.

I am asthmatic. I had several attacks in college and didn't need an ambulance for them, though one was usually called. Except one day, the attack got worse, and worse, and the meds didn't work. The ambulance took me in, and I discovered that not only was I having an asthma attack, one lung had spontaneously collapsed. Yeah, glad I went to the hospital.
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SingActDance

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Re: When Emergency Services Are Needed
« Reply #76 on: April 13, 2013, 12:04:37 PM »
I agree the husband was out of line, but he might be wondering why he wasn't called by the school at all. If a student has a medical emergency, I would think that their emergency contact should be notified immediately once proper medical personnel have been summoned.

Depends on the school, but my school does not have an emergency contact for their students.

Plus it's not like elementary school, where the kids aren't that far from the front office. Bystanders may not even know who she is.

Sorry, I thought from the OP that it was faculty/staff who called 911. I may have misinterpreted.
Most people look at musical theatre and think "Why are those people singing and dancing in the street?" I'm sort of the opposite. I see a street full of people and think, "Why aren't they?"

artk2002

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Re: When Emergency Services Are Needed
« Reply #77 on: April 13, 2013, 12:08:55 PM »
I agree the husband was out of line, but he might be wondering why he wasn't called by the school at all. If a student has a medical emergency, I would think that their emergency contact should be notified immediately once proper medical personnel have been summoned.

Depends on the school, but my school does not have an emergency contact for their students.

Plus it's not like elementary school, where the kids aren't that far from the front office. Bystanders may not even know who she is.

Sorry, I thought from the OP that it was faculty/staff who called 911. I may have misinterpreted.

You're correct, but that doesn't make TootsNYC wrong in this context. Just because they are faculty/staff, it doesn't mean that they would know quickly who the husband was and how to contact him. They are, effectively, bystanders. In a medical emergency, time is of the essence and figuring out who she was, contacting whoever has next-of-kin information to get the husband's phone #, contacting him (assuming he's available) would put her at great risk. How should they wait on the phone for the husband to answer before they decide that they have to take action and call 911? Ten minutes? Fifteen? She could be dead in that time, or so brain-damaged that there isn't much difference.
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mmswm

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Re: When Emergency Services Are Needed
« Reply #78 on: April 13, 2013, 12:10:23 PM »
I have a severe food allergy, so I've had 911 called on my behalf a couple of times.  I hate that ambulance rides cost so much, but I have a tendency to have a rebound reaction (the epipen wears off and the reaction starts up again) so I always let the take me in.  One particular incident made me smile.  Rescue responded and of course they want to take me into the ER for observation. At that time I was uninsured, and I hesitated.  The crew realized what my objection was and proceeded to tell me about their city's solution to my problem.  You see, they had one particular ambulance and crew that was set up for stable patients who really need need to go in for observation, but were afraid of the cost of an ambulance ride.  This car was one of their older ones and set up with very basic equipment, not fully decked out like a regular ambulance, and it was offered for transport at no cost.  I thought that was a great idea.

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mmswm

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Re: When Emergency Services Are Needed
« Reply #79 on: April 13, 2013, 12:14:43 PM »
I agree the husband was out of line, but he might be wondering why he wasn't called by the school at all. If a student has a medical emergency, I would think that their emergency contact should be notified immediately once proper medical personnel have been summoned.

Depends on the school, but my school does not have an emergency contact for their students.

Plus it's not like elementary school, where the kids aren't that far from the front office. Bystanders may not even know who she is.

Sorry, I thought from the OP that it was faculty/staff who called 911. I may have misinterpreted.

You're correct, but that doesn't make TootsNYC wrong in this context. Just because they are faculty/staff, it doesn't mean that they would know quickly who the husband was and how to contact him. They are, effectively, bystanders. In a medical emergency, time is of the essence and figuring out who she was, contacting whoever has next-of-kin information to get the husband's phone #, contacting him (assuming he's available) would put her at great risk. How should they wait on the phone for the husband to answer before they decide that they have to take action and call 911? Ten minutes? Fifteen? She could be dead in that time, or so brain-damaged that there isn't much difference.

I worked for a college that had 165,000 students at the time (it's grown since then), spread out over 8 campuses. Students had a "home" campus but often took a class or two at another campus. If I had a student with a medical emergency, there's no way I would be able to figure out who he/she was, get into the student database, and get that information, even if I was right next to a computer that was able to get into said database in any reasonable amount of time.
Some people lift weights.  I lift measures.  It's a far more esoteric workout. - (Quoted from a personal friend)

ClaireC79

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Re: When Emergency Services Are Needed
« Reply #80 on: April 13, 2013, 12:16:19 PM »

I agree the husband was out of line, but he might be wondering why he wasn't called by the school at all. If a student has a medical emergency, I would think that their emergency contact should be notified immediately once proper medical personnel have been summoned.

 Just because they are faculty/staff, it doesn't mean that they would know quickly who the husband was and how to contact him. They are, effectively, bystanders. In a medical emergency, time is of the essence and figuring out who she was, contacting whoever has next-of-kin information to get the husband's phone #, contacting him (assuming he's available) would put her at great risk. How should they wait on the phone for the husband to answer before they decide that they have to take action and call 911?

But she didn't say call the husband instead, she said after calling an ambulance let the next of kin know

SingActDance

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Re: When Emergency Services Are Needed
« Reply #81 on: April 13, 2013, 01:10:23 PM »

I agree the husband was out of line, but he might be wondering why he wasn't called by the school at all. If a student has a medical emergency, I would think that their emergency contact should be notified immediately once proper medical personnel have been summoned.

 Just because they are faculty/staff, it doesn't mean that they would know quickly who the husband was and how to contact him. They are, effectively, bystanders. In a medical emergency, time is of the essence and figuring out who she was, contacting whoever has next-of-kin information to get the husband's phone #, contacting him (assuming he's available) would put her at great risk. How should they wait on the phone for the husband to answer before they decide that they have to take action and call 911?

But she didn't say call the husband instead, she said after calling an ambulance let the next of kin know

Exactly. I'm not saying it should be the first thing they do. But it seems if there are more than a couple bystanders, sending someone to contact her spouse wouldn't put her in grave danger.
Most people look at musical theatre and think "Why are those people singing and dancing in the street?" I'm sort of the opposite. I see a street full of people and think, "Why aren't they?"

Hillia

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Re: When Emergency Services Are Needed
« Reply #82 on: April 13, 2013, 02:20:34 PM »

I agree the husband was out of line, but he might be wondering why he wasn't called by the school at all. If a student has a medical emergency, I would think that their emergency contact should be notified immediately once proper medical personnel have been summoned.

 Just because they are faculty/staff, it doesn't mean that they would know quickly who the husband was and how to contact him. They are, effectively, bystanders. In a medical emergency, time is of the essence and figuring out who she was, contacting whoever has next-of-kin information to get the husband's phone #, contacting him (assuming he's available) would put her at great risk. How should they wait on the phone for the husband to answer before they decide that they have to take action and call 911?

But she didn't say call the husband instead, she said after calling an ambulance let the next of kin know

Exactly. I'm not saying it should be the first thing they do. But it seems if there are more than a couple bystanders, sending someone to contact her spouse wouldn't put her in grave danger.

Again, that assumes that someone knows who her spouse is and how to contact him.  The school might not have emergency contact info for him; the place where I did my grad work didn't have any on me (or if they did, it was at the main campus and inaccessible during the evenings when I was in class).  If she was not concious/coherent until she got to the hospital, she couldn't have relayed that info.

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SingActDance

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Re: When Emergency Services Are Needed
« Reply #83 on: April 13, 2013, 03:00:27 PM »

I agree the husband was out of line, but he might be wondering why he wasn't called by the school at all. If a student has a medical emergency, I would think that their emergency contact should be notified immediately once proper medical personnel have been summoned.

 Just because they are faculty/staff, it doesn't mean that they would know quickly who the husband was and how to contact him. They are, effectively, bystanders. In a medical emergency, time is of the essence and figuring out who she was, contacting whoever has next-of-kin information to get the husband's phone #, contacting him (assuming he's available) would put her at great risk. How should they wait on the phone for the husband to answer before they decide that they have to take action and call 911?

But she didn't say call the husband instead, she said after calling an ambulance let the next of kin know

Exactly. I'm not saying it should be the first thing they do. But it seems if there are more than a couple bystanders, sending someone to contact her spouse wouldn't put her in grave danger.

Again, that assumes that someone knows who her spouse is and how to contact him.  The school might not have emergency contact info for him; the place where I did my grad work didn't have any on me (or if they did, it was at the main campus and inaccessible during the evenings when I was in class).  If she was not concious/coherent until she got to the hospital, she couldn't have relayed that info.

Okay. I'm aware it could be different for different places. Maybe the OP could shed some light on the info her particular institution keeps. We know this happened in the morning when (you'd think) admin buildings would be open. All I'm saying is that IF the student has emergency contact info on file, it does seem odd that they didn't use it. What's the info for, unless it's to contact someone in case of emergency?
Most people look at musical theatre and think "Why are those people singing and dancing in the street?" I'm sort of the opposite. I see a street full of people and think, "Why aren't they?"

ladyknight1

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Re: When Emergency Services Are Needed
« Reply #84 on: April 13, 2013, 03:08:47 PM »
Once again, I want to point out that many colleges do not collect emergency contact information from their students, and it would take more time to gather that information if the person in crisis is unconscious than to call 911.


Just Lori

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Re: When Emergency Services Are Needed
« Reply #85 on: April 13, 2013, 04:08:23 PM »
My FIL has a chronic illness that sometimes renders him incohent and agitated for days.  Because this is a very rare illness, the ER doctors typically assume he's having a heart attack and treat him acordingly.  Really, he just needs time to get over these spells and he'll be fine. So he's given his family strict orders - do not call 911 when he's having an episode.

A few years ago, he was having an episode.  He told his wife - no 911.  A couple of days later, he was worse.  The kids thought maybe he should go to a hospital.  His wife said no, he had told her no 911 calls.  A couple days later, he tried to get up to use the restroom and fell over.  MIL called my husband, who went over there and decided to go against dad's orders and call 911.

It turns out that it wasn't an episode.  It was a major brain bleed that was pushing his brain against his skull and almost killing him. 

I know this is anectdotal evidence, but making the wrong call (no pun intended) can be deadly.

ladyknight1

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Re: When Emergency Services Are Needed
« Reply #86 on: April 13, 2013, 04:50:08 PM »
I have three chronic conditions (asthma, migraine headaches, and type II diabetes) , each of which can trigger loss of consciousness. I want bystanders to call for emergency services if I am found unconscious. I am in good control of all three conditions with lifestyle and medication, so it would be out of the norm for me to lose consciousness.

SingActDance

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Re: When Emergency Services Are Needed
« Reply #87 on: April 14, 2013, 12:14:08 PM »
Once again, I want to point out that many colleges do not collect emergency contact information from their students, and it would take more time to gather that information if the person in crisis is unconscious than to call 911.

And once again, I said IF they have the info, they should contact the person AFTER calling 911.

ETA: Every single school I have attended or job I have had keeps emergency contact information for students & employees.
« Last Edit: April 14, 2013, 03:07:21 PM by SingActDance »
Most people look at musical theatre and think "Why are those people singing and dancing in the street?" I'm sort of the opposite. I see a street full of people and think, "Why aren't they?"

Winterlight

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Re: When Emergency Services Are Needed
« Reply #88 on: April 14, 2013, 03:34:16 PM »
Once again, I want to point out that many colleges do not collect emergency contact information from their students, and it would take more time to gather that information if the person in crisis is unconscious than to call 911.

Even if they do, the department probably doesn't have access to those records.
If wisdom’s ways you wisely seek,
Five things observe with care,
To whom you speak,
Of whom you speak,
And how, and when, and where.
Caroline Lake Ingalls

ladyknight1

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Re: When Emergency Services Are Needed
« Reply #89 on: April 14, 2013, 04:17:14 PM »
Only our police and Registrar's office would have any access to student data. I don't know of any occasions where the university has contacted the next of kin or emergency contact if there was one.