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  • April 21, 2015, 09:46:07 AM

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Author Topic: When Starbucks is out of coffee...  (Read 3346 times)

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iridaceae

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Re: When Starbucks is out of coffee...
« Reply #30 on: March 30, 2015, 06:30:14 AM »
Restaurants-including fast food- do sometimes run out before they close. It's the nature of the beast. You think you have enough but then you get a last minute run. You anticipate selling 300 creme brulees but tonight everyone wanted them and no one wanted the tiramisu.

The ground beef was never an issue at Taco Bell because you could save it and reheat it and mix it in with the new ground beef. But the chicken? Yeah that got tossed. Too much waste consistently and corporate asks why,  not unreasonably (after all the waste could be theft).

As for getting espresso from another store: how?

Wintergreen

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Re: When Starbucks is out of coffee...
« Reply #31 on: March 30, 2015, 07:01:25 AM »
I'm of the opinion that if it is during the posted open business hours then they need to do whatever is necessary to accomodate the customer (within reason). That, to me, would include brewing a pot of coffee, even if it meant risking that some would be wasted. They are a coffee shop; that is the product they sell. If they don't have everything available for some reason, then they need to make what they have on hand available and hope that they can satisfy their customers that way. It's just the cost of doing business.

And if a restaurant has turned off it's grills 1/2 hour before closing, then they are bad at business. If I show up at 9:30 and they don't close until 10, they had better be prepared to cook and serve whatever is on the menu. The cutoff point for any food service is the time the restaurant closes, not 30 minutes before. If they want to stop serving at 9:30 then they need to make that their closing time.

Actually, at least here, quite many restaurants state that the closing time is for example 20:00, kitchen will close at 19:30. I think that is quite clear way to do it. However, I do say that customer has also responsibilities. Closing time is when you are supposed to be out of door, and it is the customers duty also to make sure that their own actions allow them to be out the door at that time. Of course customers can't help if the food is taken forever before they got it. But, they should also order keeping in their mind that they are responsible of getting their butts out the door when the closing time comes.

lowspark

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Re: When Starbucks is out of coffee...
« Reply #32 on: March 30, 2015, 09:26:43 AM »
I'm of the opinion that if it is during the posted open business hours then they need to do whatever is necessary to accomodate the customer (within reason). That, to me, would include brewing a pot of coffee, even if it meant risking that some would be wasted. They are a coffee shop; that is the product they sell. If they don't have everything available for some reason, then they need to make what they have on hand available and hope that they can satisfy their customers that way. It's just the cost of doing business.

And if a restaurant has turned off it's grills 1/2 hour before closing, then they are bad at business. If I show up at 9:30 and they don't close until 10, they had better be prepared to cook and serve whatever is on the menu. The cutoff point for any food service is the time the restaurant closes, not 30 minutes before. If they want to stop serving at 9:30 then they need to make that their closing time.

I don't think that's quite fair - I have no problem with restaurants having a posted "last orders" time, as long as it actually is posted clearly. Sort of a soft close time, to allow diners to finish, with a hard close when the last diners have to be out. Otherwise you end up with diners still tying to eat after the actual closing time.

I've always been under the impression that "closing time" for a restaurant is the time at which the kitchen closes and that there is always the possibility of people still in the restaurant eating as of the official closing time. So yeah, if the kitchen closes at 10 and you order at 9:30 and the food arrives at 9:45, you might still be eating after 10. And certainly no one's going to expect you to shovel your food in hurriedly and suddenly stand up at 10:00 sharp and run out the door.

Otherwise how would it work? How could you post a closing time of 10:00 and when customers arrive at 9:30, turn them away claiming that it's too late to order food since that might entail them being there past closing?

I guess you could post a "last orders" time but I'm pretty sure I've never seen that in any restaurant I've ever been in.

I've seen that plenty of times, mostly in late-night restaurants with bars.  Usually it's worded Open til 2, dinner menu 6-10pm, bar menu until 1:30am.  And the bar menu would be smaller portions, limited choices, quick fried foods that don't take long to make. 

I have seen this happen in other places where it was not posted, such as an eat-in deli we went to shortly before close (I don't remember the exact timing).  When we went up to order, they told us they couldn't do hot sandwiches since the grill and deep fryer were closed, but any deli-meat sandwich could be made.  I was a bit surprised at first, but we were able to find something to order.  I'm not sure if this is analogous to the OP though, it'd be more like running out of bread.

I think expectations at a bar are different than at a restaurant. If your main business is drinks, then yeah, I can see closing the kitchen earlier. If your main business is food, I don't see it that way.
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lowspark

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Re: When Starbucks is out of coffee...
« Reply #33 on: March 30, 2015, 09:43:07 AM »
The café in the bookstore where I work had a broken espresso machine for a day (less than really). People were really nasty about it despite the fact that there was a Starbucks actually in the same parking lot, one building down (mall). Chances are people didn't want regular coffee and that's why there was none left. I honestly don't think the girl should have had to brew a pot for one person. Now if a lot of people had been asking for it...I could see it.

I also think people are entitled to order things as long as a business is open...but it's not a positive kind of entitled.

I'm sorry, I think it's terrible rude to come into a place really close to close and get a lot of stuff. We've had people come in at 10:55 and order complicated drinks from the café, then have to run out of the car to get their payment because they forgot it. They don't leave the store until ten minutes after we were closed. I'm sorry, that's rude. And yeah, people might get paid for staying late but it's really not worth it. The pay is normally terrible to begin with and people want to get home to their families. If it's not something quick...it's rude. Going to sit down restaurant 30 minutes before close and expecting a sit down meal...it's rude and very entitled.

The bolded is something I can't quite wrap my head around. It's rude and entitled to walk into a place of business 30 minutes before closing time and expect to patronize their primary business purpose?

I get that the workers don't want to hang around later than they have to but that goes for any place of business. I don't want to hang around at my job longer than I need to either but if something happens that keeps me there after hours, well, that's part of my job. And it's between me and my employer to work out as far as whether I'm expected to do that, if I get compensated for doing it, etc.

I used to work in retail and no matter what time the store closed, there would always be people shopping till the last minute, and beyond. As a cashier, was I annoyed? Yeah, I have to admit, I was. But were the customers doing anything wrong? Not as far as my employer (the store itself) was concerned. There's no point in them staying open until 9 pm if no one is shopping after 830. They are in business to sell things and when they make the business decision to remain open till 9 pm, they are anticipating those customers who make their final purchases right at 9 or even a few minutes after.

As an employee, I was none to thrilled but hey, that's my job. The agreement I entered into with my employer was that I remain polite and friendly with those customers. Were these customers rude and entitled? Not a bit. They were only doing what the store was encouraging them to do: shop more.
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FadingAmaranth

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Re: When Starbucks is out of coffee...
« Reply #34 on: March 30, 2015, 03:46:46 PM »
The café in the bookstore where I work had a broken espresso machine for a day (less than really). People were really nasty about it despite the fact that there was a Starbucks actually in the same parking lot, one building down (mall). Chances are people didn't want regular coffee and that's why there was none left. I honestly don't think the girl should have had to brew a pot for one person. Now if a lot of people had been asking for it...I could see it.

I also think people are entitled to order things as long as a business is open...but it's not a positive kind of entitled.

I'm sorry, I think it's terrible rude to come into a place really close to close and get a lot of stuff. We've had people come in at 10:55 and order complicated drinks from the café, then have to run out of the car to get their payment because they forgot it. They don't leave the store until ten minutes after we were closed. I'm sorry, that's rude. And yeah, people might get paid for staying late but it's really not worth it. The pay is normally terrible to begin with and people want to get home to their families. If it's not something quick...it's rude. Going to sit down restaurant 30 minutes before close and expecting a sit down meal...it's rude and very entitled.

The bolded is something I can't quite wrap my head around. It's rude and entitled to walk into a place of business 30 minutes before closing time and expect to patronize their primary business purpose?

I get that the workers don't want to hang around later than they have to but that goes for any place of business. I don't want to hang around at my job longer than I need to either but if something happens that keeps me there after hours, well, that's part of my job. And it's between me and my employer to work out as far as whether I'm expected to do that, if I get compensated for doing it, etc.

I used to work in retail and no matter what time the store closed, there would always be people shopping till the last minute, and beyond. As a cashier, was I annoyed? Yeah, I have to admit, I was. But were the customers doing anything wrong? Not as far as my employer (the store itself) was concerned. There's no point in them staying open until 9 pm if no one is shopping after 830. They are in business to sell things and when they make the business decision to remain open till 9 pm, they are anticipating those customers who make their final purchases right at 9 or even a few minutes after.

As an employee, I was none to thrilled but hey, that's my job. The agreement I entered into with my employer was that I remain polite and friendly with those customers. Were these customers rude and entitled? Not a bit. They were only doing what the store was encouraging them to do: shop more.

We'll have to agree to disagree then. Because I think it is rude and entitled.

The store is closed at 9, that means you need to be walking out of the door at nine. Not still browsing, not just getting up from the chair you've sat in all day making a mess to go purchase things. You need to be leaving. I don't have a problem with people coming in right before close, if they're actually there for a purpose. If you came in at 8:50 to browse and we have to ask you to leave the store at 9:00...you're (general yous of course) rude. And actually, the stores usually don't encourage them to keep shopping until 9. There's a reason they start making announcements between 30-15 minutes before the store closes.

Sirius

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Re: When Starbucks is out of coffee...
« Reply #35 on: March 30, 2015, 04:20:20 PM »
I worked in a coffee shop that was open 24 hours, and I usually worked nights.  There was one dish that was not offered after 10 p.m. - an elaborate chicken dish that was cooked in a pressure cooker -  and it was stated in the menu that this dish was not available past 10 p.m.  Most people who came in that late didn't want a huge chicken dinner anyway, but if someone asked me about it I could point out that the menu stated that the dish wasn't available after 10 p.m.  I never got a lot of argument over the chicken (I mostly got it from the cooks who didn't like the way I wrote my tickets.  If I wrote it the way the one could read it, the other would holler about my large handwriting.  Nowadays I'd tell them to take it up with the manager and I'd refuse to be intimidated.  Back then I was in my early 20s and afraid of my own shadow.)


lowspark

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Re: When Starbucks is out of coffee...
« Reply #36 on: March 31, 2015, 08:20:42 AM »
The café in the bookstore where I work had a broken espresso machine for a day (less than really). People were really nasty about it despite the fact that there was a Starbucks actually in the same parking lot, one building down (mall). Chances are people didn't want regular coffee and that's why there was none left. I honestly don't think the girl should have had to brew a pot for one person. Now if a lot of people had been asking for it...I could see it.

I also think people are entitled to order things as long as a business is open...but it's not a positive kind of entitled.

I'm sorry, I think it's terrible rude to come into a place really close to close and get a lot of stuff. We've had people come in at 10:55 and order complicated drinks from the café, then have to run out of the car to get their payment because they forgot it. They don't leave the store until ten minutes after we were closed. I'm sorry, that's rude. And yeah, people might get paid for staying late but it's really not worth it. The pay is normally terrible to begin with and people want to get home to their families. If it's not something quick...it's rude. Going to sit down restaurant 30 minutes before close and expecting a sit down meal...it's rude and very entitled.

The bolded is something I can't quite wrap my head around. It's rude and entitled to walk into a place of business 30 minutes before closing time and expect to patronize their primary business purpose?

I get that the workers don't want to hang around later than they have to but that goes for any place of business. I don't want to hang around at my job longer than I need to either but if something happens that keeps me there after hours, well, that's part of my job. And it's between me and my employer to work out as far as whether I'm expected to do that, if I get compensated for doing it, etc.

I used to work in retail and no matter what time the store closed, there would always be people shopping till the last minute, and beyond. As a cashier, was I annoyed? Yeah, I have to admit, I was. But were the customers doing anything wrong? Not as far as my employer (the store itself) was concerned. There's no point in them staying open until 9 pm if no one is shopping after 830. They are in business to sell things and when they make the business decision to remain open till 9 pm, they are anticipating those customers who make their final purchases right at 9 or even a few minutes after.

As an employee, I was none to thrilled but hey, that's my job. The agreement I entered into with my employer was that I remain polite and friendly with those customers. Were these customers rude and entitled? Not a bit. They were only doing what the store was encouraging them to do: shop more.

We'll have to agree to disagree then. Because I think it is rude and entitled.

The store is closed at 9, that means you need to be walking out of the door at nine. Not still browsing, not just getting up from the chair you've sat in all day making a mess to go purchase things. You need to be leaving. I don't have a problem with people coming in right before close, if they're actually there for a purpose. If you came in at 8:50 to browse and we have to ask you to leave the store at 9:00...you're (general yous of course) rude. And actually, the stores usually don't encourage them to keep shopping until 9. There's a reason they start making announcements between 30-15 minutes before the store closes.

OK we just see it differently.

I'm not necessarily talking about people who walked into the store 10 minutes before closing. We used to have customers who had been there for a while when closing time arrived.

And yeah, the announcements are done because if they weren't there are some people who would never leave. As to whether the store encourages late shoppers? Maybe it depends on the store. When I worked in retail, we were obligated to keep at least one register open till we were 100% sure there were no more customers. We could get in trouble for closing out early. The employees do not encourage late shoppers, but the store does. They are paying electricity and salaries until closing time so the last thing they want to do is lose a sale at 9:05 simply because the nominal closing time is 9 pm. At least, that was my experience.

Anyway, as a former employee, I tend to agree with you. By closing time in a store, you should be gone or at least walking out. But we were talking restaurants. It's not quite the same thing. At a store, even if you are browsing or trying things on or whatever, you can wrap that up fairly quickly when given the 10 or 15 minute warning.

If you're at a restaurant, and they have agreed to take your business, i.e., they have taken your food order and submitted it to the kitchen, then you should be allowed to take your time and eat at a normal pace, even if that takes you beyond the posted closing time. 
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Peppergirl

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Re: When Starbucks is out of coffee...
« Reply #37 on: March 31, 2015, 12:28:22 PM »
The old adage "Just because you can doesn't mean you should" comes to mind here.

DavidH

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Re: When Starbucks is out of coffee...
« Reply #38 on: March 31, 2015, 01:48:04 PM »
For a typical retail business, you should definitely be in line to check out by closing time.  It should go without saying, but in line should including having your method of payment at hand (not outside in your car) and having selected everything you are planning on buying. 

For a restaurant, it's a bit different, since there is the issue of waiting for food you've ordered and then consuming it.  I don't think you need to be paying and leaving at exactly closing time, but you should also avoid lingering after closing.  Once it's closing time, you should finish your meal, not order another course, and pay your bill and leave.  If a restaurant accepts orders up until closing time, then they have to accept that they will need to stay longer for people to finish their food.  In the example of ordering a complicated drink just before closing, that seems fine to me, but having to run to your car to get payment, that is definitely rude.  If orders end a a certain time, then it will take some time for the staff to clean up, during which time the customer can finish their drink or food.  If the intent it for staff to leave at exactly closing time, then the business needs to plan accordingly and not accept orders less than X minutes before closing.

For a Starbucks not to brew a pot of coffee 30 minutes before closing seems problematic unless they post something stating the rule.  After all, many customers are coming to Starbucks for coffee, so it's a pretty reasonable thing to expect them to order.  It's one thing to limit the menu after a certain time or say that certain items are not available after a certain time, but to cut off one of the key items seems a bit much.  For the employee, she's stuck in the middle so there is not point in taking ones frustration out on her.  On the other hand, a complaint to the manager or corporate is perfectly fine.