Author Topic: Getting what you want through annoyance  (Read 13407 times)

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Coralreef

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Getting what you want through annoyance
« on: August 14, 2013, 10:11:23 AM »
I'm reading this Slate article and the first thing that popped to my mind is "What would EHell think about this?"

http://www.slate.com/articles/life/culturebox/2013/08/the_kindly_brontosaurus_the_amazing_prehistoric_posture_that_will_get_you.html?wpisrc=flyouts

Short story : if you want something that isn't yours to have, just stand there, close to the person who can make it happen and eventually, they'll give it to you just to get rid of you.  What really got to me was the repetitive use of the word "polite".  Being a pest is not polite!

So, fellow EHellions, what do you think? Good way to get results or just one more annoyance to inflict on the rest of humanity?  Am I wrong in thinking this is rude?

[/right

Cami

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Re: Getting what you want through annoyance
« Reply #1 on: August 14, 2013, 10:22:40 AM »
It's horribly manipulative and rude.

It's also incredible timing. We belong to the Purple religion and this recommendation came up recently. Our pastor read a passage from the manifesto of Purple religion that basically said to make a pest of yourself to get what you want. The specific example was that you have guests show up at night and have no food. So you go to a friend's house and pound on the door. When the friend comes to the door and says, "Go away. We're all asleep", you should not apologize and go away. Nope, you keep pounding and yelling and eventually the friend will give you some bread to make you go away. I turned to my dh and said, "No wonder they keep asking us for more money. They're being taught that if you keep bothering people, they'll give you what you want to make you go away."

Not a fan of the idea or the practice.

MrTango

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Re: Getting what you want through annoyance
« Reply #2 on: August 14, 2013, 10:24:30 AM »
Nope, that wouldn't work with me.  Acting like that would only strengthen my resolve not to give in to their unreasonable demands.

I'd sooner call the police and have the annoying person given a trespass warning and removed from the establishment.

TootsNYC

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Re: Getting what you want through annoyance
« Reply #3 on: August 14, 2013, 10:25:58 AM »
You're hearing that parable completely wrong.

The person who originally told that parable wasn't saying that you should do that to other people.

He was saying, "If the guy who's in bed doesn't give his neighbor what he wants just because he's a friend, the fact is that he will probably get up and give the annoying neighbor what he wants, just to make him go away. If that's true of people, then how much more will Diety do for you (since he loves you) if you are persistent in asking him?"

Basically, it's an example of how the story-teller wants you to interact with Diety. Not with other human beings.

But yeah, it would be rude for someone to treat another human being that way.
« Last Edit: August 14, 2013, 10:58:23 AM by TootsNYC »

cwm

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Re: Getting what you want through annoyance
« Reply #4 on: August 14, 2013, 10:30:12 AM »
Nope, that wouldn't work with me.  Acting like that would only strengthen my resolve not to give in to their unreasonable demands.

I'd sooner call the police and have the annoying person given a trespass warning and removed from the establishment.

Me too. Someone stands up in my business and waits patiently? Well, they're either going to be escorted away or waiting patiently for a long time. I have amazing powers of ignoring ignoramuses.

siamesecat2965

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Re: Getting what you want through annoyance
« Reply #5 on: August 14, 2013, 10:35:44 AM »
Oh no. no no no no no. I don't agree with any of this. Its essentially promoting SS behavior. Someone says no, well, if i ask enough times, or make a big enough (albeit polite) pest of myself, I will magically get what I want.

I hate this. Working in retail, i've had customers ask me sometning, I say I'm sorry, no, I can't do that, I don't have that item in the size you want, etc. I then watch them go and ask another CW, and another, and another. Who all give the same response. We did have one manager who would not know the backstory, and say, well, let's see waht we can do, giving the customer hope, only to discover that I was indeed correct, and we can't accomodate their request. Thankfully, she then had to deal with them!

I think its rude and entitled. Rules and policies are in place for a reason, and I really hate it when someone comes along, and tries to get them bent, for their own benefit.

Goosey

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Re: Getting what you want through annoyance
« Reply #6 on: August 14, 2013, 10:47:30 AM »
This would be a bad idea because like others say, the more you try and push me to do something, the harder I dig my heels in. You ask once. Maybe a follow up. But if I say "no" no amount of banging on my proverbial door is going to get you handouts. It's incredibly rude.

Sedorna

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Re: Getting what you want through annoyance
« Reply #7 on: August 14, 2013, 10:56:29 AM »
It's horribly manipulative and rude.

It's also incredible timing. We belong to the Purple religion and this recommendation came up recently. Our pastor read a passage from the manifesto of Purple religion that basically said to make a pest of yourself to get what you want. The specific example was that you have guests show up at night and have no food. So you go to a friend's house and pound on the door. When the friend comes to the door and says, "Go away. We're all asleep", you should not apologize and go away. Nope, you keep pounding and yelling and eventually the friend will give you some bread to make you go away.

Or the friend will call the police.

Evil Sedorna is tempted to go out and throw pieces of bread at people like that. They want to act like a bunch of seagulls, she'll treat them like a bunch of seagulls!

TootsNYC

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Re: Getting what you want through annoyance
« Reply #8 on: August 14, 2013, 11:04:18 AM »
No, no, no--you guys need to go read the article first.

This isn't about hovering so close that you're actively annoying people.

Here's a description:
Quote
“The body language of the Kindly Brontosaurus is respectful and nonthreatening,” she says. “There’s a humility, so you allow the other person to feel empowered. Since you’ve made them feel like king of the jungle, they’re more receptive to you.”


The technique:
Quote
you nod empathically, say something like “Well, I’m sure we can find a way to work this out,” and step just to the side of the agent’s kiosk.

Here is where the Kindly Brontosaurus rears amiably into the frame. You must stand quietly and lean forward slightly, hands loosely clasped in a faintly prayerful arrangement. You will be in the gate agent’s peripheral vision—close enough that he can’t escape your presence, not so close that you’re crowding him—but you must keep your eyes fixed placidly on the agent’s face at all times. Assemble your features in an understanding, even beatific expression. Do not speak unless asked a question. Whenever the gate agent says anything, whether to you or other would-be passengers, you must nod empathically.


Go read the article. THEN criticize it.

Goosey

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Re: Getting what you want through annoyance
« Reply #9 on: August 14, 2013, 11:07:38 AM »
That is still rude. Attempt to pressure or threaten (whether by body language or otherwise - and yes, hovering in silence, waiting for things to change and refusing to leave is an attempt to pressure or threaten) someone to change their mind because things should be different for YOU is rude.

Firecat

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Re: Getting what you want through annoyance
« Reply #10 on: August 14, 2013, 11:09:16 AM »
Ok, read the article. And this wouldn't make me more receptive. It would make me feel creeped out and annoyed.

Cami

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Re: Getting what you want through annoyance
« Reply #11 on: August 14, 2013, 11:11:26 AM »
You're hearing that parable completely wrong.

The person who originally told that parable wasn't saying that you should do that to other people.

He was saying, "If the guy who's in bed doesn't give his neighbor what he wants just because he's a friend, the fact is that he will probably get up and give the annoying neighbor what he wants, just to make him go away. If that's true of people, then how much more will Diety do for you (since he loves you) if you are persistent in asking him?"

Basically, it's an example of how the story-teller wants you to interact with Diety. Not with other human beings.

But yeah, it would be rude for someone to treat another human being that way.
Thank you so much for your correction, but I was not HEARING it wrong. I related it the way it was related to us by the pastor.  His interpretation may be off, but that was indeed the way it was related to us.
« Last Edit: August 14, 2013, 11:13:43 AM by Cami »

TootsNYC

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Re: Getting what you want through annoyance
« Reply #12 on: August 14, 2013, 11:13:52 AM »
It's really not about pressuring them. There's no threat.

It's about using your body language to align yourself with them, to indicate nonverbally (so that you don't interrupt them) that you are like them, that you are on their team. You stay in their peripheral vision so that your message can get through, but you *do* step away. And you wait.

While you are waiting, you use your body (not your voice) to indicate that you are a friendly, supportive presence, someone they are receiving good vibes from.

It's a common tactic in groups (and it often happens involuntarily as well)--people who agree often end up in the same body language (arms crossed). So if you want to send the message to someone that you agree with them (actively instead of passively), you can assume the same posture they have. They'll pick up on it.

That's really all it is.

So that when they do finally have an opportunity to see if there's a seat available (the example given), they will have a favorable reaction to you. It's not going to get you a seat if one isn't available.
   But it will get you consideration over others, or it can persuade the gatekeeper to do you a favor that's within their power.

I found that dwelling too much on the comments here got in the way of understanding what the author of the actual piece was saying.

TootsNYC

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Re: Getting what you want through annoyance
« Reply #13 on: August 14, 2013, 11:15:44 AM »
Thank you so much for your correction, but I was not HEARING it wrong. I related it the way it was related to us by the pastor.  His interpretation may be off, but that was indeed the way it was related to us.
[/quote]

Ah--my apologies. I have, obvs., an issue with how your pastor applied it.

Goosey

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Re: Getting what you want through annoyance
« Reply #14 on: August 14, 2013, 11:16:27 AM »
Having someone staring at you, waiting for you to change something in their favor is not threatening?