Author Topic: But I haven't been invited  (Read 27596 times)

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mrkitty

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Re: But I haven't been invited
« Reply #45 on: August 19, 2013, 11:01:16 PM »
I'm going to go against the grain, also, and defend the OP a bit here. I can more than understand her feeling irked about not receiving a direct invitation (even though it was claimed - through an unreliable third party), especially considering the embarrassment that occurred last time. I, too, would be reluctant to show up, trusting that I was invited, even though that might very well not be the case.

I'm especially irked on her behalf that the father of the new parents - who is facebook friends with the OP - can't even take two minutes to confirm that she's invited to attend. I think the idea of driving up there and acting as chauffeur is a good one on paper, but in reality it would be not only a huge inconvenience but downright hurtful. Not only that, but that's half a state away, if I know my geography. It's not like popping around the corner to drop him off for a couple of hours. This is a huge chunk of time and driving and gas money. I know gas ain't cheap up in New Jersey. I probably wouldn't feel terribly enthusiastic about any of the options - whether it be to suck it up and just drive him up there, or risk attending with him, knowing that I may very well not be welcome, or contacting the hosts or a family member to find out the status.

My father was like this too. He would assume things, and pass them on as fact, and if you took his word for it, you had a one-way ticket to Awkward City. I learned quickly not to take at face value anything he said, because he was so optimistic and didn't have an ounce of guile, that he naturally assumed his beloved children were welcome anywhere he was. Which was simply not the case at all. After a while, I learned to either confirm it for myself (awkward in itself, so not very often!) or just skip it with my regrets sent through him. Of course, he didn't rely on any of us for his transportation, so that wasn't an issue. But I can understand where the OP is coming from. I don't think it's stubbornness, really (well, maybe a tiny, little bit...but with good reason imho).

OP, I'm wondering, how would you handle things (or your Dad, for that matter) if you wanted/intended to drive him down there - but couldn't because you had to work or had other pressing obligations that you couldn't cancel? Would he simply not go? Would you try to make other arrangements?

I suppose one thing you could do, if you were so inclined, (and this is honestly how I would handle the situation; I just don't know if it's the eHell approved way to do it) would simply be very honest, and contact the friend of yours on facebook (probably by phone, if possible) and let him know really wants to attend, and could he help you figure out a way to get him down there (if you're not invited)? That way, if he says "oh, but you are invited" that takes care of that, and if you're not invited, you're not assuming and he's not extending it - then you can place the responsibility on your hosts to work out your father's travel arrangements - I mean, I think this is a little more subtle than calling up and saying "I haven't been invited!"

Would that work?
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Aeris

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Re: But I haven't been invited
« Reply #46 on: August 19, 2013, 11:05:57 PM »
OP, how often does your Dad get to visit his family? I think that would impact my decision on whether I wanted to assist him in getting to the event. I wouldn't attend though.

I know I'm odd about driving, but an hour and a half drive is nothing to me. I'd drop him off, grab lunch, do some shopping or see a movie, or visit am museum for a couple of hours and then come back to get him.

And evil me would make sure to come in to get him when I knew the majority of family was still there. So when Aunt Agatha asks "why are you just arriving?" I'd say in a cheery voice "oh, I wasn't invited but it was important to Dad to attend so I drove him down and then piddled around town for a few hours. I'm just here to pick him up. Did you have a nice time"

I also agree that the family probably didnt think that as a second cousin you'd have an interest in attending and didnt consider your dads transport needs. So once he called and it was said "of course she's welcome" they might consider it all set.

What purpose would this serve if the OP was actually invited, but her invitation was lost in the mail (which is what she was told at some point)?

Or even if your last paragraph is true, and from the family's perspective the OP has now, in fact and for real, been invited?

The above advice would do nothing but make her look like a massive drama queen.

katycoo

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Re: But I haven't been invited
« Reply #47 on: August 19, 2013, 11:09:52 PM »
Sometimes we have choose to do things that inconvenience us all to hell-and-back in order to help out someone close to us.

I've been there, done that.

It's called "sucking it up and driving on."

Fixed that for you.  The OP doesn't have to do anything.

Marbles

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Re: But I haven't been invited
« Reply #48 on: August 19, 2013, 11:14:48 PM »
I would not count on this telephone game to assure myself that I had been invited, especially when you know one of the players is unreliable.

VorFemme posted what I was thinking. Call the hosts to see what they can help arrange to help your father get there. There's a strong possibility that they'll say "aren't you bringing him?" At that point, you can say you never received an invitation, which is fine, so you were not going to come.

Or, maybe, they will tell you that Cousins A and B are coming from your area, as is Aunt C. Maybe one of them can bring him, or split the drive with someone else.

LeveeWoman

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Re: But I haven't been invited
« Reply #49 on: August 19, 2013, 11:26:59 PM »
Sometimes we have choose to do things that inconvenience us all to hell-and-back in order to help out someone close to us.

I've been there, done that.

It's called "sucking it up and driving on."

Fixed that for you.  The OP doesn't have to do anything.


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LifeOnPluto

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Re: But I haven't been invited
« Reply #50 on: August 19, 2013, 11:30:19 PM »

I suppose one thing you could do, if you were so inclined, (and this is honestly how I would handle the situation; I just don't know if it's the eHell approved way to do it) would simply be very honest, and contact the friend of yours on facebook (probably by phone, if possible) and let him know really wants to attend, and could he help you figure out a way to get him down there (if you're not invited)? That way, if he says "oh, but you are invited" that takes care of that, and if you're not invited, you're not assuming and he's not extending it - then you can place the responsibility on your hosts to work out your father's travel arrangements - I mean, I think this is a little more subtle than calling up and saying "I haven't been invited!"

Would that work?

I think this is a great idea.

My personal view is that from what the OP wrote, she is NOT invited to this event. I do think she would be rude if she directly asked for an invitation, or worse, simply rocked up.

And I don't want to sound harsh, but the OP's father has made a choice to live in an area with no public transportation. Such choices have consequences - sometimes if you can't get a ride, you have to accept that you might miss out on some things.

buvezdevin

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Re: But I haven't been invited
« Reply #51 on: August 19, 2013, 11:40:03 PM »
I think the matter of whether or not the OP was or wasn't meant to be invited by the hosts is a bit of a red herring, in that OP does not seem perturbed by being invited or not, except that her father is pushing her to attend in order to be his transport, and she does not wish to attend an event she has not received *any* communication or invitation to except what her father has communicated, and he has been unreliable in passing on information in the past.

My suggestion is heavily colored by OP's prior posts regarding her father's expectations/demands on her time and assistance, combined with her posting about her father's habit of canceling on his plans with her when he gets better offers.

OP, in your shoes, I would explain to dad that you will not be attending the baptism as you have other plans, and if dad will be speaking with nephew again in the near future, dad may want to ask whether any other guests may be traveling from dad's area and could give him transport.

I see it more as setting boundaries with OP's dad than with extended family.  Care of family members, including receiving transport and assistance is not a right held by any family member, but rather is wonderful to do or receive - when the actions and the person providing assistance are appreciated and respected, and there is a *mutual* consideration extended, beyond only demands and expectations.

ETA:  fix sentences.
« Last Edit: August 19, 2013, 11:48:08 PM by buvezdevin »
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sammycat

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Re: But I haven't been invited
« Reply #52 on: August 19, 2013, 11:53:30 PM »
Would it be possible for you to drop off Dad and dink around in the area for a while before picking him back up again? Even if said dinking is reading a book in a local park? I think that's what I'd do in the circs.

I don't agree.  There is no reason whatsoever for her to give up at least a minimum of half a day and use her car and gas and precious time just to become an unpaid taxi driver who isn't "good enough" to be invited to the event and therefore has to entertain herself and provide her own food between runs! 

I personally wouldn't be willing to do that.


I agree with gramma dishes. I doubt I'd drive 1 1/2 hours for a christening I was invited to, let alone one I wasn't.

If dad wants to attend, and the family members want him there so badly, it's up to them to figure out a way to get him there.  I'm sure OP is not the only person in the family with a car, so one of the invited guest can transport him, or dad can pay for a taxi. I don't see how it's any of the OP's concern. Just because she drives him to other events/places doesn't mean she has to this time.

*inviteseller

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Re: But I haven't been invited
« Reply #53 on: August 20, 2013, 12:17:37 AM »
I think a lot of people, including the OP, are putting far FAR too much weight on 'but we've asked twice, and STILL no invitation was forthcoming!'.

The OP said that etiquette was a bit foreign to this side of the family. It also sounds like they are just super casual. Add in that the hosts are sleep-deprived parents of an infant. With all that information, let's try to see this from the hosts' possible perspectives. Also, do note that at some point "the story" was that the OP had in fact been sent a direct invitation that had been lost in the mail.

Possible Scenario #1: Host sends an invitation to his great uncle that is *intended* to include his daughter. Host assumes (wrongly) that everyone will know this. At some point host's father calls and says "Hey, did you mean to invite great-uncle's daughter?". Host replies "Of course! She's part of great-uncle's invite, duh!". Host believes their work is done.

If at that point, when the host feels they've been quite clear that the daughter was intended to be invited, the daughter were *still* to insist she hadn't actually been invited, host might reasonably feel like she was making a mountain out of a molehill and wonder why this was causing so much angst.

Possible Scenario #2: Host actually mails invitation directly to dad's cousin. It gets lost in the mail. At some point Host's father calls to ask if the daughter is invited. Host replies "of course she is, we mailed an invitation. If she didn't get it, it must have been lost in the mail. Make sure she knows." Host believes their work is done.

If at that point, when the host has actually invited the father's cousin, AND has sent communication through the family channels that an actual, physical, for real invitation was mailed to her, she were to still insist that since she'd never *received* an invitation that she wasn't *really* invited, I think it's quite likely that the host would be reasonably annoyed.


A few weeks before my cousin's wedding, my brother indicated that he had not received an invitation. I texted my cousin's fiancee to check. Her immediate response was that of course he was invited, she had sent his invitation out at the same time as everyone else's including a plus one. I relayed the information to my brother, who from that point forward operated as if he had received a physical invitation. If he had insisted that he wasn't *really* invited until either my cousin and his fiancee, who were completely frazzled and underwater with work stress and last minute wedding details, called him personally or sent a new physical invitation, I would have called him out for being a giant special snowflake.

If he had not believed my information (or version of it), and had thus called my cousin himself to check, that would have been totally fine. Or if he'd simply decided not to come even though he was invited - also fine. But if he'd indicated that he *would* go if he'd *really* been invited, but since he never received an invitation, he just wouldn't... I would have rolled my eyes so hard they fell out of my head.



OP, if you don't want to go regardless of whether you're invited that's one thing. But you actually have a reasonable amount of evidence that you likely *were* intended to be invited. If you want to find out for sure if you're invited, that's cool. And you can decline to go in any case, but declining to go because you weren't "actually invited" seems disingenuous here and honestly, may come off to others as drama. If I were the host and I *had* invited you, I would likely feel like you were just trying to Make A Point, and I would not be impressed.

Host has NOT invited OP in any way shape or form.  Host's father told OP's father sure she was invited but the actual host, who sent the invitations and is FB friends with OP has NOT sent her any invitation or attempted to contact OP through FB to invite her.  To me, that means OP has NOT been invited.  Maybe they don't realize OP's dad needs a ride for that distance or maybe it was a courtesy invite as a favor to the host's dad and they really aren't expecting him to come.  But I would not go if I were OP.  I think OP is taking a lot of unnecessary heat for doing exactly what we advocate against here..either 'fishing' for an invite or assuming she is invited.  As far as saying OP should suck it up and take a day to play taxi for her dad..this isn't a trip to get medicine or groceries or go to the Dr's she is denying him.  She is being told to spend time and money (both precious commodities I am sure) to be his chauffeur and either amuse herself while the family has a party she was not invited to or crash a party she was not invited to.  My sister and I bend over backwards to help our elderly parents but sometimes there are things that are not going to happen..just because it is something her dad wants to go to should not mean OP pushes aside her life to cater to him.  If the cousins want him there, they will do what they can to get him there (thus the reason I think it was a courtesy invite and why OP didn't get invited).

DottyG

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Re: But I haven't been invited
« Reply #54 on: August 20, 2013, 12:28:05 AM »
this isn't a trip to get medicine or groceries or go to the Dr's she is denying him.

You're right. It's not. It's taking an 86 year old man to a gathering where he can see his family. Something even more important than getting groceries.

There have been several options given in the thread as to how to accomplish this. Are any of them doable, OP?


Aeris

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Re: But I haven't been invited
« Reply #55 on: August 20, 2013, 12:35:59 AM »
I think a lot of people, including the OP, are putting far FAR too much weight on 'but we've asked twice, and STILL no invitation was forthcoming!'.

The OP said that etiquette was a bit foreign to this side of the family. It also sounds like they are just super casual. Add in that the hosts are sleep-deprived parents of an infant. With all that information, let's try to see this from the hosts' possible perspectives. Also, do note that at some point "the story" was that the OP had in fact been sent a direct invitation that had been lost in the mail.

Possible Scenario #1: Host sends an invitation to his great uncle that is *intended* to include his daughter. Host assumes (wrongly) that everyone will know this. At some point host's father calls and says "Hey, did you mean to invite great-uncle's daughter?". Host replies "Of course! She's part of great-uncle's invite, duh!". Host believes their work is done.

If at that point, when the host feels they've been quite clear that the daughter was intended to be invited, the daughter were *still* to insist she hadn't actually been invited, host might reasonably feel like she was making a mountain out of a molehill and wonder why this was causing so much angst.

Possible Scenario #2: Host actually mails invitation directly to dad's cousin. It gets lost in the mail. At some point Host's father calls to ask if the daughter is invited. Host replies "of course she is, we mailed an invitation. If she didn't get it, it must have been lost in the mail. Make sure she knows." Host believes their work is done.

If at that point, when the host has actually invited the father's cousin, AND has sent communication through the family channels that an actual, physical, for real invitation was mailed to her, she were to still insist that since she'd never *received* an invitation that she wasn't *really* invited, I think it's quite likely that the host would be reasonably annoyed.


A few weeks before my cousin's wedding, my brother indicated that he had not received an invitation. I texted my cousin's fiancee to check. Her immediate response was that of course he was invited, she had sent his invitation out at the same time as everyone else's including a plus one. I relayed the information to my brother, who from that point forward operated as if he had received a physical invitation. If he had insisted that he wasn't *really* invited until either my cousin and his fiancee, who were completely frazzled and underwater with work stress and last minute wedding details, called him personally or sent a new physical invitation, I would have called him out for being a giant special snowflake.

If he had not believed my information (or version of it), and had thus called my cousin himself to check, that would have been totally fine. Or if he'd simply decided not to come even though he was invited - also fine. But if he'd indicated that he *would* go if he'd *really* been invited, but since he never received an invitation, he just wouldn't... I would have rolled my eyes so hard they fell out of my head.



OP, if you don't want to go regardless of whether you're invited that's one thing. But you actually have a reasonable amount of evidence that you likely *were* intended to be invited. If you want to find out for sure if you're invited, that's cool. And you can decline to go in any case, but declining to go because you weren't "actually invited" seems disingenuous here and honestly, may come off to others as drama. If I were the host and I *had* invited you, I would likely feel like you were just trying to Make A Point, and I would not be impressed.

Host has NOT invited OP in any way shape or form.  Host's father told OP's father sure she was invited but the actual host, who sent the invitations and is FB friends with OP has NOT sent her any invitation or attempted to contact OP through FB to invite her.  To me, that means OP has NOT been invited.  Maybe they don't realize OP's dad needs a ride for that distance or maybe it was a courtesy invite as a favor to the host's dad and they really aren't expecting him to come.  But I would not go if I were OP.  I think OP is taking a lot of unnecessary heat for doing exactly what we advocate against here..either 'fishing' for an invite or assuming she is invited.  As far as saying OP should suck it up and take a day to play taxi for her dad..this isn't a trip to get medicine or groceries or go to the Dr's she is denying him.  She is being told to spend time and money (both precious commodities I am sure) to be his chauffeur and either amuse herself while the family has a party she was not invited to or crash a party she was not invited to.  My sister and I bend over backwards to help our elderly parents but sometimes there are things that are not going to happen..just because it is something her dad wants to go to should not mean OP pushes aside her life to cater to him.  If the cousins want him there, they will do what they can to get him there (thus the reason I think it was a courtesy invite and why OP didn't get invited).

I'm not sure if your entire reply is meant to be to me, but note that I never, EVER said that she had to go, or even that she *ought* to go. I certainly never said she should play taxi to her father while not attending - I think that's a patently terrible idea, for multiple reasons. If the OP wishes to not go, then she has every right under the sun to *not* go.

However, the hosts apparently told their father that the OP had in fact been invited, and that her invitation must have been lost in the mail. That would indicate that the OP WAS INVITED. There is no other way to interpret that piece of information.

Would it be nice if they contacted her directly to tell her the exact same information they have already passed on to the OP's cousin? Sure, but failing to do so doesn't retroactively negate the fact that an invitation was apparently issued and mailed. A little sympathy for sleep-deprived parents who may not even know proper invitation etiquette may be in order here as well.

Is it possible the hosts lied to the cousin about the lost invitation? Is it possible the cousin lied to the OP's father about the lost invitation? Is it possible the OP's father lied to her about the lost invitation? I have no idea, but if we are going to say that she was not invited, then we have to assume that *someone* in that chain lied, since she has already been told that an invitation was in fact issued and mailed.

If the OP doesn't trust her source, it's reasonable to double check with the hosts. It's also reasonable to decline to go regardless of an invitation. It's not reasonable to act as though you have knowledge of an invitation that you do, in fact, have knowledge of, just because you didn't receive it in the format you desire.

DottyG

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Re: But I haven't been invited
« Reply #56 on: August 20, 2013, 12:40:11 AM »
Quote
If the OP doesn't trust her source, it's reasonable to double check with the hosts. It's also reasonable to decline to go regardless of an invitation. It's not reasonable to act as though you have knowledge of an invitation that you do, in fact, have knowledge of, just because you didn't receive it in the format you desire.

I agree with this.


As a side note to the "take him and do something else" idea, I've done that myself. Yeah, I felt that an invitation would have been nice. But I didn't have one (it was to a wedding), so I dropped the person off and went off to do something fun for myself until it was time to pick her up again. If the OP does go this route, it's not as bad as it sounds. I had a great time doing my own thing that day - caught up with some shopping, relaxed and had a nice day just for me.  I'm not saying she has to do this option. But it IS an option nonetheless.


« Last Edit: August 20, 2013, 12:45:40 AM by DottyG »

buvezdevin

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Re: But I haven't been invited
« Reply #57 on: August 20, 2013, 12:49:05 AM »
Quote
If the OP doesn't trust her source, it's reasonable to double check with the hosts. It's also reasonable to decline to go regardless of an invitation. It's not reasonable to act as though you have knowledge of an invitation that you do, in fact, have knowledge of, just because you didn't receive it in the format you desire.

I agree with this.

I agree with the spirit of this, but would add that - as all of OP's knowledge of event/invite has been through her father, a known unreliable source - it would seem best for OP to check with hosts if she wishes to attend.  I don't think it is necessary for OP to contact hosts to *decline*.
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DottyG

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Re: But I haven't been invited
« Reply #58 on: August 20, 2013, 12:52:01 AM »
Quote
If the OP doesn't trust her source, it's reasonable to double check with the hosts. It's also reasonable to decline to go regardless of an invitation. It's not reasonable to act as though you have knowledge of an invitation that you do, in fact, have knowledge of, just because you didn't receive it in the format you desire.

I agree with this.

I agree with the spirit of this, but would add that - as all of OP's knowledge of event/invite has been through her father, a known unreliable source - it would seem best for OP to check with hosts if she wishes to attend.  I don't think it is necessary for OP to contact hosts to *decline*.

I think I might agree with you on that. But we're getting into double negatives a bit, so I'm confused! :D


katycoo

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Re: But I haven't been invited
« Reply #59 on: August 20, 2013, 01:45:04 AM »
Hypothetically, if the event was not a family based event but rather, say, an old work reunion of your Dads or some such - still in the same location, he still really wanted to go, you still wouldn't be attending.

Would your feelings about making the effort to get your Dad there and back be any different?

Are you in fact being clouded by feelings of being excluded which may be making your disinclined to go out of your way?

I'm not trying to push you in one direction or the other, I just wonder if this might help you make up your own mind about what you feel about things.