Author Topic: Bringing back a banned cheer  (Read 11657 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

MOM21SON

  • Hero Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 3019
Re: Bringing back a banned cheer
« Reply #15 on: September 16, 2013, 06:33:50 PM »
Hmm!  I can see both sides to this one.  It seems reasonable to continue to use the cheer as it's unoffensive and separate from who the coach was as a person. 

But if the cheer brings back bad memories for people who hear it -- especially for the girls who were victimized or their parents -- then I think it's worth talking to the current head coach about it.  It may be too soon for the cheer to resurface, especially if the young ladies whose privacy was violated are on the team and hear it.  The cheer itself isn't offensive or upsetting, but for some people it's still associated with a pretty heinous act, and I think it's reasonable to find it upsetting in that sense.

The "main" girl is still very much involved and remains very upset, but quiet about it.

In that case I think if you're still involved with the team or friendly with the head coach, I'd give him a heads up about the problematic cheer.  She may not feel comfortable bringing it up herself.  Holding off on using the cheer for a few years won't hurt anyone, but continuing to use it may hurt the girl quite a bit.

If you're not involved at all anymore, it's a bit harder, so I'm curious to see what other posters say.   I'm not sure what I'd do in your shoes.  It seems like a "mind your own business" situation but...it wouldn't sit well with me if I suspected a young girl were upset.

I am no longer involved with the team but friends with the girl, her family and many others from the team.  I am on good terms with the head coach.

Personal FB.  I sure it will soon be posted to the teams page.  Anyone can post on it.

MyFamily

  • Hero Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 4556
Re: Bringing back a banned cheer
« Reply #16 on: September 16, 2013, 06:36:43 PM »
Is the girl upset about what happened to her (which seems obvious to me) or is she upset about the use of the cheer?


"The test of good manners is to be patient with bad ones" - Solomon ibn Gabirol

MOM21SON

  • Hero Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 3019
Re: Bringing back a banned cheer
« Reply #17 on: September 16, 2013, 06:49:28 PM »
Is the girl upset about what happened to her (which seems obvious to me) or is she upset about the use of the cheer?

Both.  His crime severely broke the team for quite awhile.  And now its like he is being made out to be some kind of hero.

jedikaiti

  • Swiss Army Nerd
  • Hero Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 2675
  • A pie in the hand is worth two in the mail.
Re: Bringing back a banned cheer
« Reply #18 on: September 16, 2013, 06:53:19 PM »
Yea, I think a few words with Head Coach are in order.
What part of v_e = \sqrt{\frac{2GM}{r}} don't you understand? It's only rocket science!

"The problem with re-examining your brilliant ideas is that more often than not, you discover they are the intellectual equivalent of saying, 'Hold my beer and watch this!'" - Cindy Couture

Surianne

  • Super Hero!
  • ****
  • Posts: 10744
    • Prince ShimmerShine Moondream's Blogging Adventure
Re: Bringing back a banned cheer
« Reply #19 on: September 16, 2013, 07:09:46 PM »
I am no longer involved with the team but friends with the girl, her family and many others from the team.  I am on good terms with the head coach.

Personal FB.  I sure it will soon be posted to the teams page.  Anyone can post on it.

In that case, it sounds as though the coach would welcome hearing from you.  I think it's worth a mention to the coach, without getting into a back-and-forth if s/he disagrees.  I'd leave any battle to the girl's family and other current team members if the coach isn't responsive -- it sounds like you're giving this a lot of thought and consideration so I don't think it will be a problem, just something small to note. 

If the girl herself told you anything specifically about her own feelings, check with her before passing that information on to the coach, in case she'd prefer to keep it private.   

kherbert05

  • Super Hero!
  • ****
  • Posts: 10201
    • Trees downed in my yard by Ike and the clean up
Re: Bringing back a banned cheer
« Reply #20 on: September 16, 2013, 08:07:56 PM »
I think the head coach needs to get with the boys/males that were on the team at the time of the inappropriate behavior explain that the cheer is BANNED. If they use it, post it, teach it to younger players they are suspended for x games. 2nd violation means they are banned not just from playing but being at any team event. If this is a school team I would enforce the penalties for scrabble related harassment after 1 warning.


Any one around 10 - 13 who doesn't get why what the assistant coach did was a crime needs some serious conversations with an appropriate adult until they get it. To me that is a huge red flag (if they were much older than that I would keep them as far away from girls as I could. Those type of attitudes is why Steubenville type situations happen.
Don't Teach Them For Your Past. Teach Them For Their Future

Millionaire Maria

  • Hero Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 3347
  • Truth and Happiness create each other.
Re: Bringing back a banned cheer
« Reply #21 on: September 16, 2013, 08:46:13 PM »
Any one around 10 - 13 who doesn't get why what the assistant coach did was a crime needs some serious conversations with an appropriate adult until they get it. To me that is a huge red flag (if they were much older than that I would keep them as far away from girls as I could. Those type of attitudes is why Steubenville type situations happen.

I agree. The fact that these boys think it was no big deal is a HUGE DEAL!!!! I don't know how, but somebody needs to make them see why what the coach did was so terrible. It would surprise me if this girl speaks up about the cheer bothering her. If her teammates don't even have her back when she's been violated in that way, they certainly won't have her back when they find out she doesn't want them using the cheer.
People everywhere enjoy believing in things they know are not true. It spares them the ordeal of thinking for themselves and taking responsibility for what they know. –Brooks Atkinson

GSNW

  • Member
  • **
  • Posts: 548
Re: Bringing back a banned cheer
« Reply #22 on: September 16, 2013, 08:54:21 PM »
Any one around 10 - 13 who doesn't get why what the assistant coach did was a crime needs some serious conversations with an appropriate adult until they get it. To me that is a huge red flag (if they were much older than that I would keep them as far away from girls as I could. Those type of attitudes is why Steubenville type situations happen.

SO MUCH THIS!  The attitude of the older boys, combined with the feelings of the girl and the origin of the cheer, is what makes this not OK in my book.  This girl should be allowed to continue on as if this thing was not done to her, and if not hearing this cheer shouted by a group of guys that think she's overreacting helps, that is NOT an unreasonable request by any stretch. 

I agree that the head coach needs to make this crystal with the older boys ASAP, but I do fear that they will retaliate against the girl if they lose their beloved cheer/chant.  I guess that since OP doesn't have a true stake in this (aside from concern for a friend), her involvement should be an informational email/message to the coach and nothing further.

But I understand OP's level of concern.  What a sad situation.

LifeOnPluto

  • Super Hero!
  • ****
  • Posts: 6455
    • Blog
Re: Bringing back a banned cheer
« Reply #23 on: September 16, 2013, 11:27:56 PM »
Given the circumstances - especially that the main victim is still involved - bringing back the cheer is grossly insensitive, to say the least.

Someone should definitely talk to the head coach about this.

Queen of Clubs

  • Hero Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 1789
Re: Bringing back a banned cheer
« Reply #24 on: September 17, 2013, 09:04:20 AM »
Any one around 10 - 13 who doesn't get why what the assistant coach did was a crime needs some serious conversations with an appropriate adult until they get it. To me that is a huge red flag (if they were much older than that I would keep them as far away from girls as I could. Those type of attitudes is why Steubenville type situations happen.

SO MUCH THIS!  The attitude of the older boys, combined with the feelings of the girl and the origin of the cheer, is what makes this not OK in my book.  This girl should be allowed to continue on as if this thing was not done to her, and if not hearing this cheer shouted by a group of guys that think she's overreacting helps, that is NOT an unreasonable request by any stretch. 

I agree that the head coach needs to make this crystal with the older boys ASAP, but I do fear that they will retaliate against the girl if they lose their beloved cheer/chant.  I guess that since OP doesn't have a true stake in this (aside from concern for a friend), her involvement should be an informational email/message to the coach and nothing further.

But I understand OP's level of concern.  What a sad situation.

I agree with both these posts.  OP, I think the head coach needs to sort this situation and quickly.

As for the mom who posted the video, maybe you could have a quiet word with her and let her know what happened?  I'd hope that would end any support she had for bringing back the chant.

TurtleDove

  • Super Hero!
  • ****
  • Posts: 5637
Re: Bringing back a banned cheer
« Reply #25 on: September 17, 2013, 09:51:06 AM »
I am a voice of dissent.  Unless I am missing something, there is nothing inherently offensive about the cheer.  What the old coach did was obviously wrong and he presumably has been or is being punished for it.  I don't think that it is necessary or even possible to prevent a team or school from using anything that coach touched - it doesn't make sense to me.  The cheer is just that - a cheer.  It isn't "turning the coach into some sort of hero."  It has nothing to do with the coach. That's how I see it, anyway.

Virg

  • Super Hero!
  • ****
  • Posts: 5878
Re: Bringing back a banned cheer
« Reply #26 on: September 17, 2013, 10:02:53 AM »
TurtleDove wrote:

"Unless I am missing something, there is nothing inherently offensive about the cheer."

Using the cheer is causing pain to someone who's still on the team  It's grossly insensitive to someone who's got a good reason not to want to hear it, and it's divisive.  Since it's a single cheer routine in what I assume is a large repertoire, I can't imagine why anyone would want to continue hurting a squadmate with it.  The fact that the boys who are teaching it to the squad consider what happened to be "no big deal" just adds to the hurt, and it's just so unnecessary.

"It has nothing to do with the coach."

I agree with this point, but as I said above, my reason for banning the cheer isn't that this coach made it up, it's that it's causing a current squad member unneeded grief.

Virg

TurtleDove

  • Super Hero!
  • ****
  • Posts: 5637
Re: Bringing back a banned cheer
« Reply #27 on: September 17, 2013, 10:09:54 AM »
I guess I see this as a slippery slope.  Various things trigger various people.  I think I've shared about how it would send me into panic soon after my husband killed himself to hear people talking about "hanging out" or asking me if I was free to "hang out."  Would it be fair to insist no one use that phrase ever because it caused me legitimate grief?  Well, no, because the word itself had nothing to do with why I was upset and it wouldn't be fair to expect everyone else to cater to me.  I know on this board various posters have their triggers for various reasons.  It would be impossible to know what specifically causes each person strife.  The girl could just as easily want to ban the school colors because the coach wore them every day, or want to ban locker rooms in general because they bring back bad memories. 

At the end of the day, if the girl herself wants to champion the cause of "banning" the cheer I think she can certainly try.  But I don't think it is the OP's place to do so.

Betelnut

  • Hero Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 3663
Re: Bringing back a banned cheer
« Reply #28 on: September 17, 2013, 10:20:09 AM »
Who "banned" the cheer in the first place?  Who "unbanned" it?

If the "banning" were official, the "unbanning" should also be official and discussed.

If there was never discussion about the cheer, I don't see how it could be banned or unbanned.

It needs to be discussed and cleared up.
"And thus the whirligig of time brings in his
revenges." -- Feste, Twelfth Night by William Shakespeare.

Native Texan, Marylander currently

TurtleDove

  • Super Hero!
  • ****
  • Posts: 5637
Re: Bringing back a banned cheer
« Reply #29 on: September 17, 2013, 10:34:12 AM »
Who "banned" the cheer in the first place?  Who "unbanned" it?

If the "banning" were official, the "unbanning" should also be official and discussed.

If there was never discussion about the cheer, I don't see how it could be banned or unbanned.

It needs to be discussed and cleared up.

Yes, this.  Since it seemed clear to me that there was no official ban, I am operating off that assumption. And unless the cheer was somthing like, "Coach Creepy is the best!  Let's spy on all the rest!" I cannot imagine banning a popular and innocuous cheer simply because a less than stellar person made it up.  Think of all the music and plays and movies and books and ____ we would have to ban!!!!!