Author Topic: I was insulted at school - should I complain?  (Read 6962 times)

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Poppea

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Re: I was insulted at school - should I complain?
« Reply #15 on: September 28, 2013, 01:30:59 PM »
I'm actually wondering if this wasn't taken out of context by you because of the situation. I can think of a dozen ways in which this could be said as a way of offering help, assistance or advice. I might consider following up with the person who said it instead of filing a complaint. After all, you also *did* have your, in your words, OTT misbehaving child in an inappropriate situation.

This occurred to me too.

gramma dishes

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Re: I was insulted at school - should I complain?
« Reply #16 on: September 28, 2013, 01:37:38 PM »
I totally agree with Toots.  I don't think she meant it as an insult to either you or your child. 

She was simply acknowledging that she understood it was a tense situation, not in any way your fault as a parent nor your child's fault as an autistic child.  I think she was recommending that you allow him to spend time in a place where the staff is quite expert at dealing with children with autism and they CAN and DO make a difference.  Not only can they help on their own premises, but they can also offer you suggestions for how to deal with him at home and out in public. 

I see no evidence that she or he meant the comments to be critical of either you or your child in any way.  Of course I didn't see the accompanying facial expression or hear the tone of voice, but I honestly believe the person was trying to give you some helpful information.

RingTailedLemur

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Re: I was insulted at school - should I complain?
« Reply #17 on: September 28, 2013, 01:41:17 PM »
She may have made a poor choice of words because she was frightened and/or upset by your child's behaviour.  That doesn't make what she said okay, but it does make it a little more understandable.

shhh its me

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Re: I was insulted at school - should I complain?
« Reply #18 on: September 28, 2013, 02:10:38 PM »
I totally agree with Toots.  I don't think she meant it as an insult to either you or your child. 

She was simply acknowledging that she understood it was a tense situation, not in any way your fault as a parent nor your child's fault as an autistic child.  I think she was recommending that you allow him to spend time in a place where the staff is quite expert at dealing with children with autism and they CAN and DO make a difference.  Not only can they help on their own premises, but they can also offer you suggestions for how to deal with him at home and out in public. 

I see no evidence that she or he meant the comments to be critical of either you or your child in any way.  Of course I didn't see the accompanying facial expression or hear the tone of voice, but I honestly believe the person was trying to give you some helpful information.

I'm going to agree and add that as you're immigrating "the government will provide daycare"  may have been meant as information.  I don't have any idea if it is the norm for everyone to use the government provide daycare in Quebec but if it is bringing children to an adult class registration may be much more inappropriate then a place where there is not day care.  Also I think advising immigrate  of the norms is appropriate for a director of a adult education school(or if she knew what and why you were taking classes)

So the only word I take is with is "Fix"  which if she was fluent but not a native English speaker I would chose to assume was a poor choice.  If I understand french Quebec , its possible for a person born there to not learn English until adulthood and then only as a choice?  I would also ask you OP are you sure she said fix and not just implied it/you inferred it in the heat of the moment.

cicero

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Re: I was insulted at school - should I complain?
« Reply #19 on: September 28, 2013, 02:16:33 PM »
I'm actually wondering if this wasn't taken out of context by you because of the situation. I can think of a dozen ways in which this could be said as a way of offering help, assistance or advice. I might consider following up with the person who said it instead of filing a complaint. After all, you also *did* have your, in your words, OTT misbehaving child in an inappropriate situation.
i sort of agree with this.

I totally understand where *you* are coming from - i do think that her choice of words was not ok. your child is not a tv that needs to be "fixed".

However, you did bring a child to a place where the child shouldn't have been - and now from your update i understand that you came with two children? - and your child wasn't quiet, he was touchign everything, he was yelling, you had to hold him down. while you have my sympathy (I have a son with Asperger's and as a single mom i had to sometimes drag him with me to work/errands), I also look at it from *her* POV - you brought your son into *her* office and caused a distruption. it's not your son's fault that he is behaving that way, but neither is it *her* fault.

I wouldn't say anything at this point. I would practice "stock phrases" that you can use next time.

and hugs - i know how difficult this is.

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shhh its me

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Re: I was insulted at school - should I complain?
« Reply #20 on: September 28, 2013, 02:34:25 PM »
I'm actually wondering if this wasn't taken out of context by you because of the situation. I can think of a dozen ways in which this could be said as a way of offering help, assistance or advice. I might consider following up with the person who said it instead of filing a complaint. After all, you also *did* have your, in your words, OTT misbehaving child in an inappropriate situation.
i sort of agree with this.

I totally understand where *you* are coming from - i do think that her choice of words was not ok. your child is not a tv that needs to be "fixed".

However, you did bring a child to a place where the child shouldn't have been - and now from your update i understand that you came with two children? - and your child wasn't quiet, he was touchign everything, he was yelling, you had to hold him down. while you have my sympathy (I have a son with Asperger's and as a single mom i had to sometimes drag him with me to work/errands), I also look at it from *her* POV - you brought your son into *her* office and caused a distruption. it's not your son's fault that he is behaving that way, but neither is it *her* fault.

I wouldn't say anything at this point. I would practice "stock phrases" that you can use next time.

and hugs - i know how difficult this is.

Could any more appropriate word sound like fix , I'm thinking assist  if someone had an accent (I'm going with the possibility that the director is french Canadian.  since OP speak English and is immigrating to Quebec) or a french word that means provide therapy  , treatment , assistance  that might be mistranslated as "fixed".

Someone from Canada might be able to answer if the day care provides help for children with different needs. 

OP you said "day care is not enough to deal with this" (I'm paraphrasing)  I'm not sure that's completely correct.  In that the day care may be much more willing and equipped then in other countries to provide the therapy your doctor proscribes.

EllenS

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Re: I was insulted at school - should I complain?
« Reply #21 on: September 28, 2013, 02:58:08 PM »
I think the exact translation of "Fix" or whether or not the factual information about government daycare capabilities was correct, is a red herring and irrelevant.

It is not the place of a total stranger to tell ANY parent what they "SHOULD" do with, for, or about their child.  This person was completely out of line.  I don't care if she was frustrated.  Any school that has adult students, and certain/limited registration hours, is going to see some parents bringing children into the registration line.  This was not a class - this was registration.

"Please take him outside, he is disrupting the line" would be ok.  "Please come back another time" would be OK - the director has a right to set limits on what is allowed to happen in the office.  I could even stretch to, "you need to leave", as being within the director's rights, for really out of control behavior.  "Do you need a hand?" would be better.  "I'll take your form, so you can take him home" would be better still. It is the director's job to control and manage the office, NOT to control or manage the OP and her kids.

You SHOULD do x,y, or Z for/to/with/about your child, because I know better than you how to parent YOUR kids.  Not okay.  I would definitely contact this person's supervisor, and/or the student resource office, to complain about this treatment.

PS.  You weren't imagining it.  That was a really rude and insulting thing to say.

Joeschmo

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Re: I was insulted at school - should I complain?
« Reply #22 on: September 28, 2013, 03:00:57 PM »
I am a native English speaker but I could see myself becoming flustered and using poor word choice if someone came in for an appointment with me and was literally holding their child down because the child's behavior was out of control.  Both the child's behavior and the use of physical restraint would leave me trying to get the appointment over as quickly as possible.  If you have had other positive interactions with her I wouldn't make a complaint because she was also trying to deal with a stressful situation just as you were.

sparksals

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Re: I was insulted at school - should I complain?
« Reply #23 on: September 28, 2013, 03:05:00 PM »
Quebec is unique to the rest of Canada in that it provides day care to children for next to nothing for free.  If it isn't free, it is VERY cheap.  I don't know if they provide services for special needs children as part of that govt programme. 


I have to agree with Toots.  The director may be fluent in English, but if her mother tongue is French, she may still have difficulty with word usage.  I think she was also trying to convey that the govt provided day care is available for you when you don't have a babysitter and perhaps she was worried if you brought your children to register, you would also think it alright to bring them to class. 


OP you should check out the daycare options available to you. 

Rosewater

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Re: I was insulted at school - should I complain?
« Reply #24 on: September 28, 2013, 03:12:26 PM »
I'm actually wondering if this wasn't taken out of context by you because of the situation. I can think of a dozen ways in which this could be said as a way of offering help, assistance or advice. I might consider following up with the person who said it instead of filing a complaint. After all, you also *did* have your, in your words, OTT misbehaving child in an inappropriate situation.
i sort of agree with this.

I totally understand where *you* are coming from - i do think that her choice of words was not ok. your child is not a tv that needs to be "fixed".

However, you did bring a child to a place where the child shouldn't have been - and now from your update i understand that you came with two children? - and your child wasn't quiet, he was touchign everything, he was yelling, you had to hold him down. while you have my sympathy (I have a son with Asperger's and as a single mom i had to sometimes drag him with me to work/errands), I also look at it from *her* POV - you brought your son into *her* office and caused a distruption. it's not your son's fault that he is behaving that way, but neither is it *her* fault.

I wouldn't say anything at this point. I would practice "stock phrases" that you can use next time.

and hugs - i know how difficult this is.

POD.  What the OP did is make the problems he has with his children into everyone else's problem by taking them to a place where children do not belong unless the children themselves are enrolling.  It sounds like the children were disruptive of the registration process others were going through and that is not cool.  This is a time people need to think, plan, communicate without distraction and are spending large sums of money for the privilege of doing so.  I can understand the other person's sense of frustration and exasperation though their choice of words could have been chosen more carefully.

Partly motivating the other person's frustration could have been the thought that if OP will bring their kids to registration then perhaps they also think it would be OK to drag them along to class if they didn't have a sitter.  I have heard of this happening, and as a student if it ever happened I would take steps to see that it did not ever happen again.

I do not think a complaint will do anything positive for you OP.  Let it go.  For me at least the outrage is not in what was spoken.
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shhh its me

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Re: I was insulted at school - should I complain?
« Reply #25 on: September 28, 2013, 03:17:00 PM »
I think the exact translation of "Fix" or whether or not the factual information about government daycare capabilities was correct, is a red herring and irrelevant.

It is not the place of a total stranger to tell ANY parent what they "SHOULD" do with, for, or about their child.  This person was completely out of line.  I don't care if she was frustrated.  Any school that has adult students, and certain/limited registration hours, is going to see some parents bringing children into the registration line.  This was not a class - this was registration.

"Please take him outside, he is disrupting the line" would be ok.  "Please come back another time" would be OK - the director has a right to set limits on what is allowed to happen in the office.  I could even stretch to, "you need to leave", as being within the director's rights, for really out of control behavior.  "Do you need a hand?" would be better.  "I'll take your form, so you can take him home" would be better still. It is the director's job to control and manage the office, NOT to control or manage the OP and her kids.

You SHOULD do x,y, or Z for/to/with/about your child, because I know better than you how to parent YOUR kids.  Not okay.  I would definitely contact this person's supervisor, and/or the student resource office, to complain about this treatment.

PS.  You weren't imagining it.  That was a really rude and insulting thing to say.

To the bolded , I don't know that that's true for Qubec.  It may be egregious there.

Because of the nature of a class (I'm making the assumption that the director had knowledge that OP was immigrating ) giving information about new countries norms and available services is appropriate in a school setting even just at the registration. For another type of class or student it would not be.


flickan

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Re: I was insulted at school - should I complain?
« Reply #26 on: September 28, 2013, 03:40:07 PM »
I don't know if I would go as far as complaining but I do think it was terribly rude what happened to you.

Whether your child is misbehaving or not, no matter what kind of scene is being caused, it is never appropriate to tell a parent that they are "in over their head" as a matter of blunt fact and that their child needs to be "fixed".  Some parents are in over their heads.  What's a mean comment from a stranger going to do to change that?

There are kinder and more appropriate ways of conveying one's concern about the child's behavior.  Having to restrain him sounds serious but that doesn't excuse the offense.

If someone's child was misbehaving to an extreme around me I might not be able to help judging them internally but I would certainly not say anything so crass as that.  My first response at seeing the kind of scene you had described would be to ask honestly if the child was alright and if there was something that could help to calm him down if you seemed to be struggling.  It would upset me to witness the child being so out of control but that wouldn't excuse rudeness on my part.

TootsNYC

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Re: I was insulted at school - should I complain?
« Reply #27 on: September 28, 2013, 04:07:31 PM »
I don't think that was automatically a mean comment.

And what the comment from the semi-stranger (remember--that lady knows the OP vaguely from school and has every reason to wish her well) might do is inform the OP that day care exists, and maybe wake her up to the concept that "going on as we are" is not her only option.

Quote
If someone's child was misbehaving to an extreme around me I might not be able to help judging them internally

In which case you would be much more mean-spirited than this lady.

This lady's very word choice indicated that she was NOT judging the OP.

"In over your head" is not a character flaw, or a parenting screw-up. It's facing a situation that is bigger than the skills available. This woman does not have a negative opinion of the OP. She has a sympathetic one.

I want to say--I don't think this woman behaved flawlessly. I think there are better ways to say what she said.

But I do NOT think she insulted or criticized the OP, nor did she intend to.

OP, I hope you do look into the daycare and assistance she mentioned. If only to give yourself and you poor other child a break!
« Last Edit: September 28, 2013, 04:11:08 PM by TootsNYC »

flickan

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Re: I was insulted at school - should I complain?
« Reply #28 on: September 28, 2013, 04:35:41 PM »

Quote
If someone's child was misbehaving to an extreme around me I might not be able to help judging them internally

In which case you would be much more mean-spirited than this lady.

You may be right.  I don't care for children so I tend to be predisposed to think poorly of parents when children are making a scene.  But thinking something and saying something are so different.  I would never say such a thing and this is what counts in everyday interactions so any mean spirited thoughts I have are not going to come flying out.

I can see why many believe this was only a poor wording choice.  It may have been, but it would be hard to not to take offense from the point of view of a parent who is struggling with an unruly child.  I'm trying to think of a way, "I've never seen a child like that... ...they will fix him for you" could be taken sympathetically and I'm not seeing it.  I don't think OP should complain but I think the offense taken is understandable.

Yvaine

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Re: I was insulted at school - should I complain?
« Reply #29 on: September 28, 2013, 05:27:04 PM »
I am a native English speaker but I could see myself becoming flustered and using poor word choice if someone came in for an appointment with me and was literally holding their child down because the child's behavior was out of control.  Both the child's behavior and the use of physical restraint would leave me trying to get the appointment over as quickly as possible.  If you have had other positive interactions with her I wouldn't make a complaint because she was also trying to deal with a stressful situation just as you were.

Bad wording choices do happen. I once told a customer that a pharmacist was busy "doing drugs" when I meant "filling prescriptions" because I was flustered and stressed, and that was in my native language.  ;D