Author Topic: S/0 taking food for kids: taking food for vegetarians  (Read 19118 times)

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miranova

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Re: S/0 taking food for kids: taking food for vegetarians
« Reply #135 on: October 02, 2013, 08:59:16 PM »
It would never occur to me that different sized plates or different sized servings "meant" anything in particular.  It certainly wouldn't scream "this food is special!" to me.  I don't think anything is nearly as obvious or clear as some people think it should be.  At a buffet, people should wait in line politely, take small servings of whatever suits their fancy and wait until everyone has gone through the line once before they get seconds.  That covers them from an etiquette standpoint, in my opinion.  But looking at the relative serving sizes of everything and trying to guess which guests want which foods?  Unreasonable.  I know plenty of vegetarians and vegans but I admit unless they tell me outright, it might take me months to notice that they never seem to be eating meat, because I don't scrutinize what people eat, and I don't even think I should. 

It also is very frustrating sometimes as an omnivore for so many foods that are just, to me, regular foods, to be labeled as "vegetarian", aka " you can't have this unless the vegetarians don't want it".  Many people like pizza, and pasta, and mushrooms, and peppers, and rice and beans, and so on without actually being vegetarians.  If the food is that good and so many people enjoy it, more should be made and offered!  As a host, I would much rather deal with leftovers than have things run out before people get to try them.  I hosted a big meal for my husband's employees recently and oh the leftovers!!!  But you know what, they all wanted them the following Monday still, because my husband brought them in to work and they were thrilled to have more.  There are always ways to get rid of leftovers (or freeze them).  In fact, I don't think I've ever not had a ton leftover.  I just consider it part of hosting.

LifeOnPluto

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Re: S/0 taking food for kids: taking food for vegetarians
« Reply #136 on: October 02, 2013, 11:11:13 PM »
I haven't read all the responses yet, so forgive me if this point has already been made.

To me, there is a difference between "dishes that happen to be meat-free" (such as potato salad) and "dishes with meat substitutes" (such as veggie sausages and veggie patties). I don't think it's rude of omnivores to help themselves to the first - as those meat-free foods tend to be for everyone - vegetarians and omnivores alike. But I do think it's rude of the omnivores to help themselves to the second, since those types of foods are usually intended to be just for the vegetarians. Plus, there is usually a limited amount.

So in short, I do think the omnivores at this BBQ were rude for taking the veggie sausages and veggie patties. I think it would have been fine for one of the vegetarians to have spoken up, and said "Hey guys, we don't have that much to eat. Do you mind if we get first dibs?"


Hmmmmm

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Re: S/0 taking food for kids: taking food for vegetarians
« Reply #137 on: October 02, 2013, 11:14:32 PM »
I haven't read all the responses yet, so forgive me if this point has already been made.

To me, there is a difference between "dishes that happen to be meat-free" (such as potato salad) and "dishes with meat substitutes" (such as veggie sausages and veggie patties). I don't think it's rude of omnivores to help themselves to the first - as those meat-free foods tend to be for everyone - vegetarians and omnivores alike. But I do think it's rude of the omnivores to help themselves to the second, since those types of foods are usually intended to be just for the vegetarians. Plus, there is usually a limited amount.

So in short, I do think the omnivores at this BBQ were rude for taking the veggie sausages and veggie patties. I think it would have been fine for one of the vegetarians to have spoken up, and said "Hey guys, we don't have that much to eat. Do you mind if we get first dibs?"
Yes, it has been discussed that there are lots of reason a meat eater may choose to not eat the meat provided.

miranova

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Re: S/0 taking food for kids: taking food for vegetarians
« Reply #138 on: October 02, 2013, 11:21:24 PM »
Plus, there is usually a limited amount.



Which begs the question, why?  If everyone keeps eating it, just make more next time.

The pizza stories on this thread just boggled my mind.  If there is a continual problem with not enough veggie friendly pizza, the simple and gracious solution is to order more of the pizza people like the most, not to try to guilt people into eating meat pizza "because they can".  It's not like meat pizza must be ordered. 

Yvaine

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Re: S/0 taking food for kids: taking food for vegetarians
« Reply #139 on: October 02, 2013, 11:24:32 PM »
Plus, there is usually a limited amount.



Which begs the question, why?  If everyone keeps eating it, just make more next time.

The pizza stories on this thread just boggled my mind.  If there is a continual problem with not enough veggie friendly pizza, the simple and gracious solution is to order more of the pizza people like the most, not to try to guilt people into eating meat pizza "because they can".  It's not like meat pizza must be ordered.

This!

Raintree

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Re: S/0 taking food for kids: taking food for vegetarians
« Reply #140 on: October 02, 2013, 11:43:08 PM »
I "can" eat meat (I think most vegetarians "can" but choose not to for whatever reason, which is totally fine, but I wanted to explain my quotation marks). But I like vegetarian pizzas. I find most of the meat that appears on pizzas kind of grim, or too salty. I'll eat it, but I'd prefer not too much. So if a veggie option is available, I'll take it, along with a slice of meat pizza. Never occurred to me that it was rude, although I do think the strict vegetarians should have first crack at the meat-free options.

Poppea

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Re: S/0 taking food for kids: taking food for vegetarians
« Reply #141 on: October 02, 2013, 11:59:48 PM »
I'm an omnivore. I eat meat. But I'm by no means a "meat lover". I love vegetables. And I prefer cheese or spinach pizza to any other types of pizza. Just because I do eat meat doesn't mean I want every dish, or even every meal to have meat in it. And I get pretty insulted when vegetarians assume that because I do eat meat it means I always eat tons of meat to the exclusion of other foods.

As i said in the other thread, when at a buffet party people should do a quick scan of the number of people of at the event and at the number of servings of each food and only take one portion. But if all foods are presented to all the guests, every guest has equal rights to try any of the foods.

I absolutely agree. I'm talking specifically about cases where it's clear that one dish won't stretch to give everybody present a reasonable helping (e.g. 10 veggie burgers and 25 guests). Then, if you aren't veggie, I think it's rude to take a veggie burger.

So its rude for me to take the food I prefer because I'm not strict about never eating meat? Because I choose to be flexible in life I should not get my preferred foods at parties but rather should be relegated to eat what I don't want? That doesn't sound very polite.

Most vegetarians are so by choice not by necessity. And most vegetarians despite the rumors won't in fact get sick if they suddenly consume meat. So I really don't see why if someone chooses to not ever meat they should be granted things they like while the person who chooses to simply eat less meat should not get what they prefer because they are willing to compromise.

Ok, let's say there are two people, and two burgers. One is a veggie burger, one is a beef burger. Ann is a vegetarian, Bob is not, although Bob actually prefers veggie burgers to beef burgers, and doesn't really eat that much meat anyway.

Does Bob get to take the veggie burger, leaving Ann hungry? I think we'd all say that Bob was at least being inconsiderate, if not rude.

Similarly, when I eat with vegan friends I make sure that I let them have the lion's share of the vegan-friendly food, even if the tofu looks super yummy (and I do love me some tofu  ;) ), because it would be inconsiderate of me to place my tastes above their need to eat a decent meal.

ETA: I hope the bolded doesn't mean that you think that vegetarians should just suck it up and eat meat if there's no veggie food left.  :o

Why are you assuming that Bob knows Ann is a vegetarian.  I'm an omnivore and sometimes I just don't want to eat meat.  In the situation above I would eat the veggie burger because I hate hamburgers.  Should I go hungry?

LadyR

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Re: S/0 taking food for kids: taking food for vegetarians
« Reply #142 on: October 03, 2013, 12:09:28 AM »
I hosted a party this weekend that involved a hot dog bar and two of my friend's are vegetarians, so I provided a small number of veggie dogs for them. I only bought one package, so really there was just enough for the two of them, with one maybe extra (it was a 5 pack, so if they each had two, there would be one left over). I set them out on the opposite end of the table from the regular hot dogs and definitely made it clear they were for the two of them. No one else went near them, except my toddler who ate 1/2 of the left over one. I'd have been a little put out if anyone else had grabbed one before they got a chance to serve themselves, since there were just enough for the vegetarians and honestly, they were a lot more expensive than the regular hot dogs, so I had no desire to buy enough for everyone just in case.
« Last Edit: October 03, 2013, 12:11:57 AM by LadyR »


CocoCamm

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Re: S/0 taking food for kids: taking food for vegetarians
« Reply #143 on: October 03, 2013, 12:14:15 AM »
We had a catered holiday lunch at my last job one year.  There was 7 employees, boss had a nice spread ordered (enough for 2 days), including a specific entree for me, the only vegetarian.  There were 2 meat entrees and 6 sides, 2 of those sides had ham or bacon in them.  I was last to go get my food as we, of course, got busy and when I went to get my plate, my entree was gone.  Yes, for all the food that was there, one employee decided to take all of mine (and there was enough for 2 decent servings).  His excuse? "Well I knew it was specifically for you, but you can have the sides or just eat the meat because this looked good and what I was hungry for"  >:( >:( >:(  So, my holiday luncheon meal was some mashed potatoes and some broccoli, while everyone else had sirloin tips and all the sides.  Needless to say for the next holiday luncheon, I told my boss not to order anything special for me and I brought my lunch that day.

I do not think it is rude or inconsiderate to choose to eat a meatless dish regardless of the reason. As long as you take a polite sized portion a guest should be able to try whatever dish they like at a party without fearing that another guest is going to call them out or silently judge them about what they eating.

I do think it is a bit entitlement minded to think that vegetarians have a greater right to a meatless dish then say someone who is on a diet, or has ethical issues with certain meats, or who just simply does not want to eat meat that particular day.

It is not entitlement minded if the hosts only put out a few servings of a meatless option for the known vegetarians and they actually hope to get some.  It is entitlement minded if the meat eaters, who are eating the meat also are scarfing the small amount of meatless food.  Would it be entitlement minded for someone with a medical dietary restriction having options that are made for them scarfed down by others just because they wanted it?  I do not whine, stomp my feet or cry.  I will eat around the meat dishes, if it means just sides, but if someone makes me a a specific dish to replace the carnivore entree and someone eats it because they just wanted it, that is rude.

I was responding to the OP who was contemplating calling out a fellow guest for eating a veggie sausage. It's no one business why a meat eater may decide to scale back on the meat and instead choose a lighter and same may argue healthier option. The idea that because someone declares themselves to be a vegetarian they have a greater right to all the veggie dishes doesn't sit well with me. I think someone on a diet or who only eats certain meat has as much of a right to the food they want to eat. It's really all about choosing what one wants to put in one's body and no one persons choice is superior.

The fail was on the part of the hosts who didn't provide enough of the lighter/veggie options. Just because I do eat meat doesn't mean thats all I eat or even the majority of what I eat.

And I think it's pretty uncharitable and bordering on rude to assume that the meat eaters were "scarfing down" any of the food. Choosing a veggie option when you eat meat doesn't automatically make someone a gluttonous pig who shovels food down their throat.

LadyR

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Re: S/0 taking food for kids: taking food for vegetarians
« Reply #144 on: October 03, 2013, 12:16:28 AM »
Plus, there is usually a limited amount.



Which begs the question, why?  If everyone keeps eating it, just make more next time.

The pizza stories on this thread just boggled my mind.  If there is a continual problem with not enough veggie friendly pizza, the simple and gracious solution is to order more of the pizza people like the most, not to try to guilt people into eating meat pizza "because they can".  It's not like meat pizza must be ordered.

This!

Because veggie dogs and veggie burgers tend to be more expensive than the normal ones. For my son's birthday a 5 pack of veggie dogs cost more than a 12 pack of regular dogs. A 4 pack of veggie burgers is the same price as an 8 pack of beef burgers. I'd rather not pay that much extra and have tons leftover/thrown out and I personally can't stand veggie burgers and dogs, so I wouldn't eat the left overs. I don't mind a little bit of left overs (I expect it), but I'm not going to buy a double serving of the more expensive product just so that people can have the option, if they want. But then I also know my circle of friends and other than the few vegetarians, most are meat-lovers to the extreme. If I was catering to a different group, or if I wasn't sure of the eating preferences, I would obviously provide some extras, but not enough to feed everyone.


Yvaine

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Re: S/0 taking food for kids: taking food for vegetarians
« Reply #145 on: October 03, 2013, 12:22:02 AM »
Plus, there is usually a limited amount.



Which begs the question, why?  If everyone keeps eating it, just make more next time.

The pizza stories on this thread just boggled my mind.  If there is a continual problem with not enough veggie friendly pizza, the simple and gracious solution is to order more of the pizza people like the most, not to try to guilt people into eating meat pizza "because they can".  It's not like meat pizza must be ordered.

This!

Because veggie dogs and veggie burgers tend to be more expensive than the normal ones. For my son's birthday a 5 pack of veggie dogs cost more than a 12 pack of regular dogs. A 4 pack of veggie burgers is the same price as an 8 pack of beef burgers. I'd rather not pay that much extra and have tons leftover/thrown out and I personally can't stand veggie burgers and dogs, so I wouldn't eat the left overs. I don't mind a little bit of left overs (I expect it), but I'm not going to buy a double serving of the more expensive product just so that people can have the option, if they want. But then I also know my circle of friends and other than the few vegetarians, most are meat-lovers to the extreme. If I was catering to a different group, or if I wasn't sure of the eating preferences, I would obviously provide some extras, but not enough to feed everyone.

The posts you quoted are about pizza, which is roughly the same price for all sorts of varieties, unless you get one with like 6 toppings. Specifically, they're about pizza ordered for an office where even the omnivores prefer veggie pizza. At a certain point, it makes more sense to order enough veggie pizza for all the people who want it, no matter why they want it.

If you're serving something that's way more expensive, I don't see any issue with making just a few and getting it specially to the vegetarian rather than putting it out on the general buffet, which I've said elsewhere in the thread.

LadyR

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Re: S/0 taking food for kids: taking food for vegetarians
« Reply #146 on: October 03, 2013, 12:28:17 AM »
Sorry, I didn't read that clearly. Yes, for pizza I don't see why you just wouldn't have equal amount of veggie pizza to non, but for other options I do see why there is a limited amount.


CocoCamm

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Re: S/0 taking food for kids: taking food for vegetarians
« Reply #147 on: October 03, 2013, 12:29:11 AM »
Plus, there is usually a limited amount.



Which begs the question, why?  If everyone keeps eating it, just make more next time.

The pizza stories on this thread just boggled my mind.  If there is a continual problem with not enough veggie friendly pizza, the simple and gracious solution is to order more of the pizza people like the most, not to try to guilt people into eating meat pizza "because they can".  It's not like meat pizza must be ordered.

This!

Because veggie dogs and veggie burgers tend to be more expensive than the normal ones. For my son's birthday a 5 pack of veggie dogs cost more than a 12 pack of regular dogs. A 4 pack of veggie burgers is the same price as an 8 pack of beef burgers. I'd rather not pay that much extra and have tons leftover/thrown out and I personally can't stand veggie burgers and dogs, so I wouldn't eat the left overs. I don't mind a little bit of left overs (I expect it), but I'm not going to buy a double serving of the more expensive product just so that people can have the option, if they want. But then I also know my circle of friends and other than the few vegetarians, most are meat-lovers to the extreme. If I was catering to a different group, or if I wasn't sure of the eating preferences, I would obviously provide some extras, but not enough to feed everyone.

I know not everyone feels the same but I was raised that when hosting you provide enough of each option to feed all your guests. If I was at a party where not enough of a specific item was provided I would probably just chalk it up to minor error, if I realized that this happened at every event that person had I would consider them to be a poor host.

Luci

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Re: S/0 taking food for kids: taking food for vegetarians
« Reply #148 on: October 03, 2013, 12:30:43 AM »
I'm of the opinion that any and all food on a buffet is part of the buffet and that what one chooses to put on their plate from that buffet line is no one else's business.

I'm also of the opinion that if there is a small minority of guests (or just one guest) with a dietary restriction that requires a special meal, that person's meal should be given directly to them by the host or they should be the first through the buffet line.

I have read through it all, and I still think this the most concise statement of my feelings and actions.

We have a family branch with multiple allergies and conditions. Their foods are on the other side of the room and mentioned to the other diners: Don't touch until Ginny's family has gone through. Not even a "please". It's an order.

hannahmollysmom

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Re: S/0 taking food for kids: taking food for vegetarians
« Reply #149 on: October 03, 2013, 02:46:50 AM »
When I host a bbq buffet type gathering, I always count on 1 for each person, i.e. 1 burger, 1 hot dog, 1 chicken, etc. Yes, I do have left overs, but there is never anyone short of food. So 20 people equals 20 hot dogs, 20 burgers, 20 pieces of chicken. As far as specialty items, like portabella mushrooms, etc., I would probably cook 20 also. Just because people like meat, doesn't mean they don't want to try non-meat items.

I understand how veggie "meats" are more expensive, (and are copying meat that I am also cooking), so what I would probably do is set up their likes in a different area from the regular buffet, mention it to them on the side, so they can get their "meat", and then proceed to the rest of the buffet.

When having a sit down dinner, I make the same quantity of every dish, enough for each guest to have a portion, no matter what the dish is.  I would rather have leftovers (yum) than not enough food.

As far as the bbq though, I have a question: Many vegans do not want their food cooked near meat. How do you do that during a bbq? Do you use a separate grill? Just curious.