Author Topic: The SPECIFICALLY not-invited guest - UPDATE #219  (Read 28818 times)

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JoieGirl7

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Re: The SPECIFICALLY not-invited guest (who was brought along, nonetheless)
« Reply #135 on: December 13, 2013, 07:56:57 PM »

Many family groups quite regularly coordinate amongst themselves for annual holiday events without forcing anyone to do all the work, or to come alone.  They work together to plan it.  And hosting means having the gathering at your home not doing everything yourself and making all the rules for everyone else.

For me and folks like me, its not about things not changing, its about how they change-- people coordinating with each other, not one person issuing edicts.

But they did coordinate! The aunt said, "I'd like to host, because it's probably the last time I'll be able to do so, since I'm getting old and my new place won't have room. But if I'm going to, I have to limit the guest list."

And they all said OK. Everybody but Larry.

She had announced to her extended family that she simply did not feel up to hosting as large a group as she had in the past, so this year, she was limiting her invitation to family members only.  No girlfriends or boyfriends, no lonely neighbors, no old family friends this year, just family members.

I don't look at that as "coordination."

AnnaJ

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Re: The SPECIFICALLY not-invited guest (who was brought along, nonetheless)
« Reply #136 on: December 13, 2013, 09:01:13 PM »
The point, however, is that everyone but Larry agreed to the invitation on Aunt's terms.  Maybe some were disappointed, or maybe not, but for whatever reason - they love Aunt and wanted to make her last hosted Thanksgiving happy, no one else wanted to host, they all thought it would be cool to have a 'just family' holiday - they agreed with Aunt's idea. 

Larry was rude and thoughtless, and the fact that multiple people told him so before the holiday just magnifies his rudeness.

baglady

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Re: The SPECIFICALLY not-invited guest (who was brought along, nonetheless)
« Reply #137 on: December 13, 2013, 09:42:22 PM »
I'm not one to do the math (must be together X years) or make arbitrary rules (must live together/be engaged/be married) about social units. Bagman and I have been together for many years, although we don't live together, and our friends and his siblings invite us to events as a couple.

However, he spends Thanksgiving and Christmas with his ex's family, because that's where his daughters and granddaughter spend it (ex's mom is their last surviving grandparent), and I don't go along because even though I get along well with his ex, and I'm Facebook friends with her sister, it would be awkward. I spend those days with friends, and enjoy the heck out of them.

I think Larry would have the right to be miffed if he was living with his girlfriend, and she was excluded while live-in SO's of other cousins weren't. However, that doesn't seem to be the case. Aunt made a rule, and he decided on his own that he should be the exception to that rule. Not cool.

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BarensMom

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Re: The SPECIFICALLY not-invited guest (who was brought along, nonetheless)
« Reply #138 on: December 14, 2013, 02:45:24 AM »
You know, people, those posters that think that an elderly lady does not have the right to determine who she hosts in her own home, under the circumstances recounted in the original post, are making me very angry.

As was mentioned in the original post, this is an 89-year-old woman who can no longer live independently and is having to give up her home and most of her possessions to live in an assisted living situation.  She wanted a family-only Thanksgiving, perhaps because she needed assistance and she didn't want a total stranger to see that. Perhaps she didn't want a total stranger in her house if she got emotional at the thought of its being the last family dinner in her home.  Her house may be in the process of packing up and she didn't want a total stranger to see its condition.  She may have wanted only family present because she was going to pass out family heirlooms and having a total stranger present would be inappropriate.

With the elderly people I have known (and there have been many), when they make a request like the above, they always have a good reason.  No one has any right to pass judgement on a woman, that barring any toxicity issues, deserves only our respect and admiration for attempting to make one last meal for her family under difficult circumstances.

« Last Edit: December 14, 2013, 02:47:46 AM by BarensMom »

sammycat

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Re: The SPECIFICALLY not-invited guest (who was brought along, nonetheless)
« Reply #139 on: December 14, 2013, 02:50:39 AM »
You know, people, those posters that think that an elderly lady does not have the right to determine who she hosts in her own home, under the circumstances recounted in the original post, are making me very angry.

As was mentioned in the original post, this is an 89-year-old woman who can no longer live independently and is having to give up her home and most of her possessions to live in an assisted living situation.  She wanted a family-only Thanksgiving, perhaps because she needed assistance and she didn't want a total stranger to see that. Perhaps she didn't want a total stranger in her house if she got emotional at the thought of its being the last family dinner in her home.  Her house may be in the process of packing up and she didn't want a total stranger to see its condition.  She may have wanted only family present because she was going to pass out family heirlooms and having a total stranger present would be inappropriate.

With the elderly people I have known (and there have been many), when they make a request like the above, they always have a good reason.  No one has any right to pass judgement on a woman, that barring any toxicity issues, deserves only our respect and admiration for attempting to make one last meal for her family under difficult circumstances.

Well said.

The mental energy that is required to interact with/host strangers can be very taxing for the best of us in normal circumstances, let alone when you're an elderly person having your last big shindig in your own home.

cass2591

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Re: The SPECIFICALLY not-invited guest (who was brought along, nonetheless)
« Reply #140 on: December 14, 2013, 04:08:10 AM »
Audrey, I know I said I was done with the discussion, and I wonder if that was why you continued to argue the point, but now you are being moderated. Let me be clear it is not because we disagreed but you were argumentative and just wouldn't let it go.

If you post in this thread again you will be banned. And I mean to anybody, including me defending your opinion.
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ClaireC79

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Re: The SPECIFICALLY not-invited guest (who was brought along, nonetheless)
« Reply #141 on: December 14, 2013, 07:56:41 AM »
First up - he was rude to bring someone who wasn't invited (even more so after being specifically told no) however is there a chance that he tried to bow out of the dinner 'Susie and I want to spend the day together so I won't be coming' and then received a LOT of pressure from other family members 'but you HAVE to come, it's the last time we'll ever celebrate thanksgiving together this way as a family, it just won't be the same next year'

If that is the case I can see him feeling stuck between a rock and a hard place, doesn't mean he wasn't rude though

Luci

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Re: The SPECIFICALLY not-invited guest (who was brought along, nonetheless)
« Reply #142 on: December 14, 2013, 09:00:09 AM »
You know, people, those posters that think that an elderly lady does not have the right to determine who she hosts in her own home, under the circumstances recounted in the original post, are making me very angry.

As was mentioned in the original post, this is an 89-year-old woman who can no longer live independently and is having to give up her home and most of her possessions to live in an assisted living situation.  She wanted a family-only Thanksgiving, perhaps because she needed assistance and she didn't want a total stranger to see that. Perhaps she didn't want a total stranger in her house if she got emotional at the thought of its being the last family dinner in her home.  Her house may be in the process of packing up and she didn't want a total stranger to see its condition.  She may have wanted only family present because she was going to pass out family heirlooms and having a total stranger present would be inappropriate.

With the elderly people I have known (and there have been many), when they make a request like the above, they always have a good reason.  No one has any right to pass judgement on a woman, that barring any toxicity issues, deserves only our respect and admiration for attempting to make one last meal for her family under difficult circumstances.

Well said.

The mental energy that is required to interact with/host strangers can be very taxing for the best of us in normal circumstances, let alone when you're an elderly person having your last big shindig in your own home.

BarensMom, that is so sweet and understanding. I was thinking more of energy expenditure and wanting to spend her limited  time that day with special people. I hadn't thought about how she thinks she might appear to strangers - that is something I call maintaining dignity.

This beloved aunt sounds like she was giving and generous about guests all of her life and is making what amounts to a final request about her own entertaining. Sounds simple and something that should be respected, with or without considering the etiquette and family tradition aslpects.

gramma dishes

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Re: The SPECIFICALLY not-invited guest (who was brought along, nonetheless)
« Reply #143 on: December 14, 2013, 10:29:12 AM »
You know, people, those posters that think that an elderly lady does not have the right to determine who she hosts in her own home, under the circumstances recounted in the original post, are making me very angry.

As was mentioned in the original post, this is an 89-year-old woman who can no longer live independently and is having to give up her home and most of her possessions to live in an assisted living situation.  She wanted a family-only Thanksgiving, perhaps because she needed assistance and she didn't want a total stranger to see that. Perhaps she didn't want a total stranger in her house if she got emotional at the thought of its being the last family dinner in her home.  Her house may be in the process of packing up and she didn't want a total stranger to see its condition.  She may have wanted only family present because she was going to pass out family heirlooms and having a total stranger present would be inappropriate.

With the elderly people I have known (and there have been many), when they make a request like the above, they always have a good reason.  No one has any right to pass judgement on a woman, that barring any toxicity issues, deserves only our respect and admiration for attempting to make one last meal for her family under difficult circumstances.

Sensitive observations and beautifully said. 

You know, I'm not NEARLY as old as the woman in question here, and even I no longer truly enjoy entertaining huge numbers of miscellaneous people any more. 
I kind of like things limited to the number I can actually seat without rearranging my whole house. 
I like everyone to have the same plates and silverware if possible for no other reason than just because it looks nice. 
I don't want them to notice that I need a couple of minor repairs that family sees but doesn't care, where a stranger might see and make judgments. 
I like being able to include everyone in the same conversation at the same time. 
I like being able to discuss slightly more intimate subjects and reveal more genuine emotions than I could in front of a stranger. 
And so on ...

BarensMom

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Re: The SPECIFICALLY not-invited guest (who was brought along, nonetheless)
« Reply #144 on: December 14, 2013, 10:50:39 AM »
You know, people, those posters that think that an elderly lady does not have the right to determine who she hosts in her own home, under the circumstances recounted in the original post, are making me very angry.

As was mentioned in the original post, this is an 89-year-old woman who can no longer live independently and is having to give up her home and most of her possessions to live in an assisted living situation.  She wanted a family-only Thanksgiving, perhaps because she needed assistance and she didn't want a total stranger to see that. Perhaps she didn't want a total stranger in her house if she got emotional at the thought of its being the last family dinner in her home.  Her house may be in the process of packing up and she didn't want a total stranger to see its condition.  She may have wanted only family present because she was going to pass out family heirlooms and having a total stranger present would be inappropriate.

With the elderly people I have known (and there have been many), when they make a request like the above, they always have a good reason.  No one has any right to pass judgement on a woman, that barring any toxicity issues, deserves only our respect and admiration for attempting to make one last meal for her family under difficult circumstances.

Well said.

The mental energy that is required to interact with/host strangers can be very taxing for the best of us in normal circumstances, let alone when you're an elderly person having your last big shindig in your own home.

BarensMom, that is so sweet and understanding. I was thinking more of energy expenditure and wanting to spend her limited  time that day with special people. I hadn't thought about how she thinks she might appear to strangers - that is something I call maintaining dignity.

This beloved aunt sounds like she was giving and generous about guests all of her life and is making what amounts to a final request about her own entertaining. Sounds simple and something that should be respected, with or without considering the etiquette and family tradition aslpects.

Thanks for the kind words.

Indeed, one of the hardest things for the elderly is to be seen as helpless, dependent, and frail, especially by those who previously thought of them as strong and self-reliant. The loss of dignity and autonomy and the humiliation often signals the decline of a previously strong and independent individual.

Larry spoiled his aunt's desire for one last good memory of a happy Thanksgiving, because his desire to be seen with his girlfriend trumped any consideration he should given his elderly relative.

secretrebel

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Re: The SPECIFICALLY not-invited guest (who was brought along, nonetheless)
« Reply #145 on: December 15, 2013, 06:43:38 AM »
Larry spoiled his aunt's desire for one last good memory of a happy Thanksgiving, because his desire to be seen with his girlfriend trumped any consideration he should given his elderly relative.

Hmm. I think an occasion (holiday, dinner, wedding etc) is only ever spoiled if you let it be. People focus too much on having an occasion be 'perfect' and think it is 'ruined' if something goes awry.

I don't think Larry was right to bring his GF - although I'm not sure I agree that she shouldn't have been invited.  But I hope the aunt didn't let it 'spoil' the holiday for her. I think the last part of the story we got was "their aunt got very upset and angry…" I hope she got over it and was able to make her peace with the GF's presence.

perpetua

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Re: The SPECIFICALLY not-invited guest (who was brought along, nonetheless)
« Reply #146 on: December 15, 2013, 08:08:37 AM »
Late to the party: Larry was rude to bring an uninvited guest and the etiquettely-correct move would be to decline and spend the holiday with his girlfriend, but on the other hand I can see where this kind of situation gets sticky, because if he declines, he's probably going to get it in the head for 'not showing up to Auntie's last Thanksgiving'. There aren't any easy winners in this situation, really.

Hillia

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Re: The SPECIFICALLY not-invited guest (who was brought along, nonetheless)
« Reply #147 on: December 15, 2013, 10:11:36 AM »
I don't understand why Larry and his girlfriend absolutely, positively have to be together every second.  They can't stand to be out of each other's sight for a few hours on one day so Aunt can host her party the way she wants to?

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Winterlight

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Re: The SPECIFICALLY not-invited guest (who was brought along, nonetheless)
« Reply #148 on: December 15, 2013, 11:36:09 AM »
You know, people, those posters that think that an elderly lady does not have the right to determine who she hosts in her own home, under the circumstances recounted in the original post, are making me very angry.

As was mentioned in the original post, this is an 89-year-old woman who can no longer live independently and is having to give up her home and most of her possessions to live in an assisted living situation.  She wanted a family-only Thanksgiving, perhaps because she needed assistance and she didn't want a total stranger to see that. Perhaps she didn't want a total stranger in her house if she got emotional at the thought of its being the last family dinner in her home.  Her house may be in the process of packing up and she didn't want a total stranger to see its condition.  She may have wanted only family present because she was going to pass out family heirlooms and having a total stranger present would be inappropriate.

With the elderly people I have known (and there have been many), when they make a request like the above, they always have a good reason.  No one has any right to pass judgement on a woman, that barring any toxicity issues, deserves only our respect and admiration for attempting to make one last meal for her family under difficult circumstances.

Well said.

My father is facing this decision and the dead last thing he'd want would be a stranger there. His children seeing these intimate things would be painful enough. Someone he'd never met? Forget it.
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Of whom you speak,
And how, and when, and where.
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Sharnita

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Re: The SPECIFICALLY not-invited guest (who was brought along, nonetheless)
« Reply #149 on: December 15, 2013, 11:54:42 AM »
There is also the question of whether gf wants to be on this level.  Does she know it is family only and aunt's last chance to host? That can be a pretty intense situation to walk into if you aren't committed.