News: IT'S THE 2ND ANNUAL GUATEMALA LIBRARY PROJECT BOOK DRIVE!    LOOKING FOR DONATIONS OF SCIENCE BOOKS THIS YEAR.    Check it out in the "Extending the Hand of Kindness" folder or here: http://www.etiquettehell.com/smf/index.php?topic=139832.msg3372084#msg3372084   

  • December 14, 2017, 07:04:55 PM

Login with username, password and session length

Author Topic: Honeymoon registry bait and switch  (Read 3063 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Fawkes

  • Member
  • Posts: 42
Re: Honeymoon registry bait and switch
« Reply #30 on: September 13, 2017, 08:47:29 AM »

I am going to be completely honest and say that my assessment of this particular situation is probably affected by the fact that the couple in question are part of my immediate close peer group, and, though I know we arenít supposed to allow things like this to be a factor, they are very well off. Additionally, the particular holiday that they are suggesting their wedding guests help to fund is exceptionally extravagant. When you know the financial status of people, you canít help but have feelings about situations like this, and honestly, from a social etiquette perspective isnít that one of the reasons you arenít supposed to do stuff like this in the first place?


I don't see what the "financial status" of the couple has to do with anything. A wedding is not a charity occasion where one decides whom to celebrate based on perceived need. If (general) you begrudge a couple their perceived wealth, and it upsets you to see them having or doing things you feel to be too extravagant, then that's your choice and you certainly don't have to give anyone anything. But to proclaim those who you perceive to be financially well off as somehow violating social etiquette  because of that perceived wealth comes across as jealous to me.

Gosh I didn't mean it to come across that way. It's really hard for me to actually articulate WHY it's such an off putting thing to do (and it's not just me, is caused a few ruffles elsewhere). The whole thing just gave me a massive internal cringe. Maybe it is due to other external factors now that I think about it - there have been other incidents with them to do with entitled behaviour and maybe I'm looking at this through that lens. And also the fact that personal preference-wise, I would not do something like this myself. Ever. Maybe I'm being a bit too harsh.

Opinions certainly seem mixed on the matter! I wonder if modern weddings have just got to the point where you can't apply usual accepted standards because there really aren't any, any more! Everyone holds a different view on what's acceptable and what's not, and people just have to do what sits right with them, regardless.

MagnesiumOxide

  • Member
  • Posts: 32
Re: Honeymoon registry bait and switch
« Reply #31 on: September 13, 2017, 09:00:30 AM »

I am going to be completely honest and say that my assessment of this particular situation is probably affected by the fact that the couple in question are part of my immediate close peer group, and, though I know we arenít supposed to allow things like this to be a factor, they are very well off. Additionally, the particular holiday that they are suggesting their wedding guests help to fund is exceptionally extravagant. When you know the financial status of people, you canít help but have feelings about situations like this, and honestly, from a social etiquette perspective isnít that one of the reasons you arenít supposed to do stuff like this in the first place?


I don't see what the "financial status" of the couple has to do with anything. A wedding is not a charity occasion where one decides whom to celebrate based on perceived need. If (general) you begrudge a couple their perceived wealth, and it upsets you to see them having or doing things you feel to be too extravagant, then that's your choice and you certainly don't have to give anyone anything. But to proclaim those who you perceive to be financially well off as somehow violating social etiquette  because of that perceived wealth comes across as jealous to me.

Gosh I didn't mean it to come across that way. It's really hard for me to actually articulate WHY it's such an off putting thing to do (and it's not just me, is caused a few ruffles elsewhere). The whole thing just gave me a massive internal cringe. Maybe it is due to other external factors now that I think about it - there have been other incidents with them to do with entitled behaviour and maybe I'm looking at this through that lens. And also the fact that personal preference-wise, I would not do something like this myself. Ever. Maybe I'm being a bit too harsh.

Opinions certainly seem mixed on the matter! I wonder if modern weddings have just got to the point where you can't apply usual accepted standards because there really aren't any, any more! Everyone holds a different view on what's acceptable and what's not, and people just have to do what sits right with them, regardless.

Don't be too hard on yourself.  Truth is, people do things all the time that are not technically wrong but will cause people to think differently about them.  Just as they don't have to justify their reasons for doing the not-technically-wrong thing, others aren't required to justify why that changes their opinion of them. 

There may be nothing technically wrong with having a registry of this sort for a wedding, but I would have feelings and opinions about it and may (or may not) respond by humoring the couple or giving a gift that aligns with both my values and their wishes combined.  It would be one factor in the sum of my knowledge and experience with the couple and, depending on the other factors, may change my opinion of them or their individual characters. 

Hmmmmm

  • Member
  • Posts: 8913
Re: Honeymoon registry bait and switch
« Reply #32 on: September 13, 2017, 09:20:40 AM »
Wow, this got lively!

To me, the reason this sort of website registry is so awful is because they come across asÖ.flashy and kind-of show off-y. As Iíve said previously in this thread, itís not actually the preference for cash thatís so off-putting. If they wanted to ask for cash I would have had far lesser issue to one simple line at end of the invitation saying ĎWe have a honeymoon fund, if you would like to contribute to it as your gift to us that would be wonderfulí. The website registry is just so completely unnecessary, and rather gauche in my opinion.

snip


So interesting how others feel respond of these situations. I would never see a honeymoon registry as flashy. To me they say "I want a great honeymoon but can't afford it"

But given your update on their financial status, I can actually see why they did one. If they are well established, it is hard for someone to come up with a gift for them, but everyone wants to give gifts when attending weddings. And giving cash to well off people would never occur to me. I only give cash gifts when I think there's a real need for financial support... like for graduations gifts, or young couple's who I know are wanting to buy a home. I'd never think to give cash to someone who is actually doing well financially. So having an easy way for friends to give "honeymoon experiences" seems like a nice thing to do. If I were attending this wedding, I would be having a conversation with my husband like "What can we give as a gift? They don't really need anymore crystal glasses and they aren't going to be strapped for cash. Do you have any ideas?"... Well, actually I had this conversation yesterday with my husband. We have a wedding for a couple who are in their 50's. They don't need money or more household items. They aren't registering anywhere because they really don't want wedding gifts. But I just feel very odd not doing anything.

HannahGrace

  • Member
  • Posts: 1291
Re: Honeymoon registry bait and switch
« Reply #33 on: September 13, 2017, 10:50:14 AM »
There is just no winning in these situations. If you don't have a traditional registry, people bug you about that. Ask me how I know. We had people suggest a honeymoon registry but that wasn't my thing either. There is no way to say "we don't need or want gifts, we just want you to come" (even if true) without sounding sanctimonious. So some people end up with a honeymoon registry. If you are that put off by their general lifestyle that pages of people telling you that this isn't out of the norm doesn't make you feel more understanding toward the couple, skip the wedding.

gellchom

  • Member
  • Posts: 3730
Re: Honeymoon registry bait and switch
« Reply #34 on: September 13, 2017, 01:59:44 PM »
Opinions certainly seem mixed on the matter! I wonder if modern weddings have just got to the point where you can't apply usual accepted standards because there really aren't any, any more! Everyone holds a different view on what's acceptable and what's not, and people just have to do what sits right with them, regardless.

That very range of opinions leads me to just the opposite conclusion, though.  Suppose I conclude that only 50% of people, or 25%, or 10%, find something to be a little off -- am I okay with that?  Maybe -- sometimes we don't care how something comes across, but sometimes we do. You don't have to care what anyone thinks -- but if you do, don't kid yourself that as long as something doesn't bother you or some other ehellions, it's going to come across just fine to everyone on your list.

It's rather extreme to say that if you find something like a honeymoon registry off-putting, you shouldn't attend the wedding, or that HCs should only invite people they are sure exactly share their preferences and values.  And anyway, the point isn't what guests should do when faced with a honeymoon registry, it's the pros and cons of HCs choosing to have them, and one of those "cons" is the impression it might give to people, whether we agree with them or not -- or even better, how to word things to minimize any negative impression. 

Just because your friends and family love you and won't think less of you if you do something doesn't mean you want to do it.  I certainly wouldn't think less of someone who didn't get our names or honorifics right on an envelope, for example, much less refuse to attend their wedding over it.  But if they asked me if it matters to get names and honorifics right and it looks kind of bad if you don't, I'd tell them yes, it does -- not critically, but it does, a little.

FauxFoodist

  • Member
  • Posts: 4990
Re: Honeymoon registry bait and switch
« Reply #35 on: September 13, 2017, 05:11:13 PM »
Wow, this got lively!

To me, the reason this sort of website registry is so awful is because they come across asÖ.flashy and kind-of show off-y. As Iíve said previously in this thread, itís not actually the preference for cash thatís so off-putting. If they wanted to ask for cash I would have had far lesser issue to one simple line at end of the invitation saying ĎWe have a honeymoon fund, if you would like to contribute to it as your gift to us that would be wonderfulí. The website registry is just so completely unnecessary, and rather gauche in my opinion.

I am going to be completely honest and say that my assessment of this particular situation is probably affected by the fact that the couple in question are part of my immediate close peer group, and, though I know we arenít supposed to allow things like this to be a factor, they are very well off. Additionally, the particular holiday that they are suggesting their wedding guests help to fund is exceptionally extravagant. When you know the financial status of people, you canít help but have feelings about situations like this, and honestly, from a social etiquette perspective isnít that one of the reasons you arenít supposed to do stuff like this in the first place?

Letís face it, money is probably the most useful to many couples who have been living together already for years! Itís the unnecessarily brazen website in itself that Iím struggling with. It just comes across as in very poor taste. Does any of this makes sense? Iím not sure I am fully explaining myself properly. Itís just the moment that I realised what it was my internal squick-o-meter went Ďnopeí. I'm sure the couple just thought it was cute and perhaps didn't put too much thought into how it might come across. I really have never seen anything like it before and didn't realise it was common at all.

Your dilemma reminds me of me a few years ago.  I had set in my mind what kinds of things are acceptable on a wedding registry (a honeymoon fund wasn't even a consideration).  The HC registered for things *I* felt weren't appropriate and asked about it here.  I think responses were mostly kind and said those things were fine.  I look back on it now and realize my opinion was colored by the fact that 1) I knew my friend (the bride) was really well off and 2) I was PO'd at her for a throwaway remark (for her) regarding my and DH's faith so I think I was just finding fault with her and her DH where I could.  Nowadays, I don't know if I'd care about a honeymoon registry.  My cousin and her DH flatly stated they had everything they need but, as everyone knew, were in the middle of renovating their home, which they expected to take several more years, so they wanted gift cards from Home Depot.  I didn't want to give them that so I gave them something else.  Never did get a thank you note but, then again, didn't get one from the two weddings before that that DH and I attended (included the wedding where the HC had a station where the guests were to self-address the envelope for the TY note and either attach it to the gift if they'd brought it with them or note on the envelope what they gave).

I think you're fine to have your opinion regarding a honeymoon registry.  As others have pointed out, it's a suggestion, not a mandate.  You're totally free to give them something else or nothing at all (we have multiple guests give us nothing at all, which was fine; we had one guest give us something I already owned and which I hated -- her version -- but probably because I couldn't stand that guest as a result of something she did at our wedding reception so I admit my opinion was likely extremely biased).

It is a shame that some posters have such strong negative opinions about gifts they received that they didn't need or want.  The hated gift we received?  Since I already owned something similar, we returned it to the store for store credit and used that towards buying something we needed (flatware).

crazycatlady331

  • Member
  • Posts: 295
Re: Honeymoon registry bait and switch
« Reply #36 on: September 30, 2017, 07:44:05 PM »
I think there's a big generation gap here.  There's been a lot written about how nobody wants family herilooms anymore ( http://www.nextavenue.org/nobody-wants-parents-stuff/ ) and the changing lifestyle that the millennial generation (the ones at the stage of life where weddings happen) have.  If you are to believe journalists writing about them, they value experiences over stuff.

If you're going to spend $50 (I just threw that number out of nowhere) why not spend it on something that you know the couple will value.  It could be a piece of china or swimming with the dolphins. 

In this day and age, things like fine china are not as valuable (if you don't believe me, walk into a Goodwill store) as they once were as the way the younger generation entertains (if at all) is very different than previous generations.  Instead of having place setting for 12, I know (I'm not married but in my 30s) that I don't have the space to host a meal for 12 and suggest meeting at a restaurant instead.  People who live in smaller dwellings (apartments/condos as opposed to houses) are very aware of the space limitations.

Harriet Jones

  • Member
  • Posts: 8689
  • Yes, we know who you are.
Re: Honeymoon registry bait and switch
« Reply #37 on: September 30, 2017, 07:54:29 PM »
Or maybe they just don't want the traditional wedding registry stuff.  I'm way too old to be a millennial, but I didn't want china, etc., because I didn't think I'd ever use it.  And after 20 years, I still haven't needed it or wished I owned some.

Yvaine

  • Member
  • Posts: 10042
Re: Honeymoon registry bait and switch
« Reply #38 on: October 01, 2017, 05:51:26 PM »
I think there's a big generation gap here.  There's been a lot written about how nobody wants family herilooms anymore ( http://www.nextavenue.org/nobody-wants-parents-stuff/ ) and the changing lifestyle that the millennial generation (the ones at the stage of life where weddings happen) have.  If you are to believe journalists writing about them, they value experiences over stuff.

If you're going to spend $50 (I just threw that number out of nowhere) why not spend it on something that you know the couple will value.  It could be a piece of china or swimming with the dolphins. 

In this day and age, things like fine china are not as valuable (if you don't believe me, walk into a Goodwill store) as they once were as the way the younger generation entertains (if at all) is very different than previous generations.  Instead of having place setting for 12, I know (I'm not married but in my 30s) that I don't have the space to host a meal for 12 and suggest meeting at a restaurant instead.  People who live in smaller dwellings (apartments/condos as opposed to houses) are very aware of the space limitations.

And even if people do want to use fancy china to entertain, there was an interesting article I read a while back about how all the heirlooms have just piled up, especially with longer lifespans and smaller families. So Grandma had fine china, but lived a long life and kept using it, so Mom got her own, and now Daughter is an only child and has inherited Grandma's china and Mom's china and probably the other grandma's china too, not to even mention her spouse's family's heirlooms, and she definitely doesn't need a whole other set.

Huh

  • Member
  • Posts: 317
Re: Honeymoon registry bait and switch
« Reply #39 on: Today at 03:05:47 PM »
I think there's a big generation gap here.  There's been a lot written about how nobody wants family herilooms anymore ( http://www.nextavenue.org/nobody-wants-parents-stuff/ ) and the changing lifestyle that the millennial generation (the ones at the stage of life where weddings happen) have.  If you are to believe journalists writing about them, they value experiences over stuff.

If you're going to spend $50 (I just threw that number out of nowhere) why not spend it on something that you know the couple will value.  It could be a piece of china or swimming with the dolphins. 

In this day and age, things like fine china are not as valuable (if you don't believe me, walk into a Goodwill store) as they once were as the way the younger generation entertains (if at all) is very different than previous generations.  Instead of having place setting for 12, I know (I'm not married but in my 30s) that I don't have the space to host a meal for 12 and suggest meeting at a restaurant instead.  People who live in smaller dwellings (apartments/condos as opposed to houses) are very aware of the space limitations.

And even if people do want to use fancy china to entertain, there was an interesting article I read a while back about how all the heirlooms have just piled up, especially with longer lifespans and smaller families. So Grandma had fine china, but lived a long life and kept using it, so Mom got her own, and now Daughter is an only child and has inherited Grandma's china and Mom's china and probably the other grandma's china too, not to even mention her spouse's family's heirlooms, and she definitely doesn't need a whole other set.

Heh heh. I inherited my great-great-grandmother's fancy china at the ripe old age of 12 because neither my mother nor my grandmother had the space for it or the inclination to use it. I only recently got it out the box and used it when I finally bought a china cabinet.

Actually, come to think of it, I have inherited a lot of family "heirlooms" from my family and even DH's family, because no one wanted it and I liked how it looked.