Author Topic: How strong was DD's "no" for prom? update 102  (Read 19297 times)

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One Fish, Two Fish

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Re: How strong was DD's "no" for prom?
« Reply #15 on: April 20, 2014, 04:10:57 PM »
Jay needs to learn that no means no, not ask me again tomorrow.  He bought the tickets on his own accord, and they are his responsibility.  Your DD should by no means reimburse him for them.
I feel I have to say this....Jay's a big boy; His Mama shouldn't be fighting his battles for him.  I'd be tempted to tell her this (in as nice a way as possible). 
I'll get there.  Eventually.

LeveeWoman

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Re: How strong was DD's "no" for prom?
« Reply #16 on: April 20, 2014, 04:11:40 PM »
TBH the first time you daughter made it sound like these were the reasons she wasn't going, rather than saying 'no thanks, I'm babysitting etc' - if it was worded the way you have written I could see a, maybe slightly clueless, guy thinking the last line was a 'I wasn't planning on going so I agreed to this other thing' rather than a 'I don't want to go'

The second time (although very presumptious of him to buy tickets) she didn't say no, she said OK - someone who is hoping for a positive answer is going to take that as yes, even with inflection in her voice.

Look back on what you wrote, she never actually said 'no' - therefore to me, it wasn't strong (or clear) at all

I think she should speak to him, and explain she meant no all along (and in the future, when someone asks her something and she wants to say no, use the actual word, not to hedge around it)


"I have babysitting, and another activity (day of shooting with Scouts); I am not going."

That sounds completely negative to me, especially the bolded bit.

wonderfullyanonymous

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Re: How strong was DD's "no" for prom?
« Reply #17 on: April 20, 2014, 04:15:09 PM »
Your DD told Jay no, and he went and bought tickets anyway, and tried to guilt your DD into going anyway.  Jay then fabricates a wonderful story to his mother, who IMHO, hasn't been very proactive teaching Jay that no means no. Don't pay for the prom ticket, it was bought at a tool of manipulation, IMHO.


MariaE

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Re: How strong was DD's "no" for prom?
« Reply #18 on: April 20, 2014, 04:26:43 PM »
Your DD told Jay no, and he went and bought tickets anyway, and tried to guilt your DD into going anyway.  Jay then fabricates a wonderful story to his mother, who IMHO, hasn't been very proactive teaching Jay that no means no. Don't pay for the prom ticket, it was bought at a tool of manipulation, IMHO.

Agree 100%.
 
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Cherry91

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Re: How strong was DD's "no" for prom?
« Reply #19 on: April 20, 2014, 04:40:01 PM »
I'm having a premonition... this boy will in the future regularly declare himself to be a "Nice Guy" who is constantly "Friendzoned".

He said "hey, if you are going to prom, could you and I go together?  Let me know so I can decide which car you want me to drive." which in all honesty sounded like he already considered it a done deal, and as far as he's concerned, that's all that mattered.

Don't apologise, don't reimburse, basically don't do anything else that he can twist to make himself "in the right".

cicero

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Re: How strong was DD's "no" for prom?
« Reply #20 on: April 20, 2014, 04:48:35 PM »
I think:
A) your DDs no was clear
B) jay was manipulative in buying the tickets and presenting it as a fait acompli.
C) at that point your DD should have reiterated her no, and not said "okay?", but still I take her ok to mean " I'll let you know if things change" not " ok I'm going with you to the prom"

This is all on jay. At most your DD should apologize for any misunderstanding but not to reimburse him for anything.

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JenJay

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Re: How strong was DD's "no" for prom?
« Reply #21 on: April 20, 2014, 05:00:02 PM »
Jay reminds me of that creepy manipulative guy Lisa Whelchel married (and later divorced). You know, the older guy who was jealous she had a boyfriend, so he got up in church one day, announced they were getting married and Lisa got railroaded into marrying him instead of her boyfriend.

I'd never heard of this so I googled it and that's not how she describes it at all. She said it was an arranged marriage but she had a choice, she chose to marry him and never regretted it. She wrote that she had already broken up with her boyfriend and her husband wasn't the one who announced the engagement, that was their pastor. Her husband was just as surprised as she was (although he was thrilled and she wasn't, because she hadn't decided yet whether or not she was going to marry him).
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shhh its me

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Re: How strong was DD's "no" for prom?
« Reply #22 on: April 20, 2014, 05:29:46 PM »
While I think you're DD was clear the first time in general I suggest she lead with the "no" or "yes"  in the future.  "I'm sorry , I have other plans that evening.  I will not be at prom."  The "ok" could be confusing.   I do think it would be gracious to say "Sorry for the misunderstanding . I will not be attended prom."

BUT why on earth did you start offering recompense before speaking to her?  I think that was really rude and unfair to your daughter, if the mother had said yes would you have held your daughter to it?   

jedikaiti

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Re: How strong was DD's "no" for prom?
« Reply #23 on: April 20, 2014, 06:31:28 PM »
Your DD told Jay no, and he went and bought tickets anyway, and tried to guilt your DD into going anyway.  Jay then fabricates a wonderful story to his mother, who IMHO, hasn't been very proactive teaching Jay that no means no. Don't pay for the prom ticket, it was bought at a tool of manipulation, IMHO.

Agree 100%.

Bingo. If he talks to her, she should reiterate that. "I told you when you asked that I had other plans and would not be going. I don't know why you would have bought tickets anyway, unless you had another date lined up."

I'm not sure about the italicized bit, but her first no was strong enough. After he said he bought tickets, perhaps she should have asked who he was going with, but on the spot like that, I suspect a confused "okay" is the best I could have done, too.
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Surianne

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Re: How strong was DD's "no" for prom?
« Reply #24 on: April 20, 2014, 06:42:29 PM »
"Okay" to me means yes, so I'm a bit confused as to why you and your daughter thought she said no.  I can't think of any way that "okay" could be interpreted as no.  Her original mention of other plans was a bit wishy-washy, and his buying the tickets did seem like a way to try to coerce her into a yes, but this whole situation seems like a miscommunication.  I'd suggest that you, as parent, stay out of it, and tell his mom that it was up to the kids to figure out.  It's a good idea for her to learn to say no in a clear manner as a teenager.  You can definitely coach her on that, of course.

Outdoor Girl

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Re: How strong was DD's "no" for prom?
« Reply #25 on: April 20, 2014, 06:51:48 PM »
She was completely, absolutely, clear when he first asked her.  Then Jay went ahead and bought tickets anyway.  It is completely on him that he is now out money for the tickets, tux rental, whatever.  This guy is extremely manipulative.

As to her 'Okay?' when he said he'd bought tickets anyway, to me, it depends on how she said it.  I can totally hear her saying 'Ooookaaay' in a voice that meant 'Are you out of your mind?  I already told you I'M NOT GOING.'

I think DD's only obligation at this point is to call Jay and tell him, 'I was perfectly clear when you asked me that I would not be going to prom.  Good luck finding someone to go with you.'  And hang up.  IMO, she shouldn't even apologize for 'the misunderstanding'.  There was no misunderstanding; Jay was trying to guilt her into going with him.  Nice guy, he is NOT.
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buvezdevin

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Re: How strong was DD's "no" for prom?
« Reply #26 on: April 20, 2014, 06:57:04 PM »
I don't see the "okay" as clouding the initial "I'm not going".

OP's DD initially said what reads as a polite "I have other plans" capped by "I'm not going."

Clueless boy later says "I bought tickets [even though you told me you have other plans and are not going] *let me know if you can go*"

In the place of OP's DD I am not sure my confusion at this communication would have allowed me the time to think through how to politely say "as I told you before, I am not going." But in any event, all she could fairly be assumed to have agreed to by her "okay" is that she would let the boy know if her plans changed.

Her plans did not change, he took a flyer on the tickets, his bad, his cost, great opportunity for OP to coach daughter regarding how to handle social situations where another does not just accept "no" and - if the boy's mother calls OP again - great opportunity to clue in the mother that her son seems to have made a couple of bad assumptions and read the situation as a "this is what I would like, so of course OP's daughter will as well if I just move ahead."
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purple

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Re: How strong was DD's "no" for prom?
« Reply #27 on: April 20, 2014, 06:57:17 PM »
I think she was very clear with her first answer.

I'm not sure why Jay would then go out and buy tickets anyway, but he did.  DD probably should have been clear once again by saying "no" rather than "okay".  I can see how he may have construed that as an acceptance.

I think your daughter could, if she wanted to, apologise for the misunderstanding when she said okay, but that's it.  She does not owe him an apology in any way, shape or form for not going to the prom.

Hopefully this will be a good lesson for Jay too.  He needs to learn that when a girl says no to a date, that means no and that she won't be going with him.  I'm not sure what his parents are teaching him where he decides after a girl says no that he will buy tickets anyway and try to guilt or manipulate her into dating him.  There's all kinds of wrong there, IMO.

bonyk

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Re: How strong was DD's "no" for prom?
« Reply #28 on: April 20, 2014, 07:19:06 PM »
I think she should tell Jay "I apologize if I gave you the impression that I accepted your invitation to prom on Wednesday. I was confused when you said you bought tickets and I didn't mean for my "Okay?" to come across as an acceptance. As I said on Monday, I'm not going to prom."

I like this, and I would be tempted to add on something like, "In the future, if you have something to address with me, let me know instead of having your mom call my mom, okay?". Of course, teenaged me would not have the nerve, and I'd probably walk away after mumbling the first part.

Carotte

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Re: How strong was DD's "no" for prom?
« Reply #29 on: April 20, 2014, 07:21:07 PM »
I can clearly see OP's daughter (and me) answering "okay?" in that puzzled, raised eyebrow, trailing and audible question mark that could translate as "why are you telling me this?".

Lovestruck and/or socially not there teenager could interpret this as an agreement, but for me the daughter is in the clear.
There could have been better communication all around, but it's on Jay to have jumped to hope/conclusion and bought the tickets, he probably spun a tale to his mom, maybe to explain why he already had bought, rented and made reservations, or he really believes it, or thought his mommy would make the DD go to the dance with him....
They're teenagers, knowing adults sometime have trouble navigating communication, I'm not surprised of the hiccups.