I don't know what's going on and I need some advice

[poundcake]

Guys like that are really good at making you doubt your own radar. 

We need that in big, bold font.

Guys like that are really good at making you doubt your own radar. 

[Gambitgirl]

OP...go with your gut. if he's creeping you out, esp wanting to talk to you after his GF is asleep and wants to hang out (presumably w/o your SOs), then go with that. i'd send him one polite email saying that you don't feel comfortable talking to him while is GF is asleep nor getting together w/o your SOs. then cut off communication...b/c it's likely he'll respond with some BS explanations as to how it's not creepy, which will probably feel more creepy.

i had a similar situation last year. i re-connectecdwith a high school BF through myspace and just sent him a polite "hey, i see you're married and living in X state. your sons are very cute. hope you are well, nice to run across you on the net" message after he contacted me. he responded to my message with multiple pushy suggestions we get together next time he was in town on business, along with some disparaginging comments about his wife. i ignored his messages after that. he eventually wrote me another one apologizing for "scaring me off" and him realizing "you didn't want to do anything except say hello online." i ignored that one too b/c i felt getting into any further emails would only encourage him to keep contacting me.

[Texas Mom]

I agree with all the other posters. Trust your gut.  Cut off all communication.

I just had to do that.  I'm 50 & a guy from my (distant) past surfaced a few weeks ago.  We've been talking on IM & e-mailing.   I told DH about it & he thought it was cool that I'd reconnected with a HS bud. We're BOTH married.  He made it clear last night that we need to take it to the next level.

Ya, right.

I'm shutting down the MySpace & e-mail account &  I'm mothballing the IM screen name.  Luckily, he never got my cell #, so I'm safe there.

[snowball's chance]

Is it creepy to to email 2-3 times a day?  Text?  Call after GF's asleep?  NOT NECESSARILY.  If GF knows about you, and he just doesn't want to disturb her sleep.  I'm a big believer that this kind of thing (straight man & woman being friends when they have S.O.s) is not a bad thing, but here's why I'm suspicious of this guy, Madmusician.

- he apologized for his behavior years later.  In my admittedly cyncical experience w/ some guys, and growing up w/ 2 bros close to my age, some guys don't apologize, even when they're wrong & know it, unless they are interested romantically.

- the fact that he's emailing & texting, MUCH easier to hide from the GF, then say, a phone call in front of her.  When I have a BF, I do not excuse myself from him to talk to my guy friends (unless he's watching TV, and I don't want to disturb, but you know what I mean), and I invite said BF to come along if I'm going to hang out w/ guy friend(s).  That way, BF knows *I'm* not hiding anything, and he knows my guy friends aren't trying to hit on me.

-  a guy friend you meet/get back into contact w/ while either one of you is in a relationship, will not try to see you alone, & purposely exclude his or your SO

I agree the situation is creepy.  Do not worry if you are being rude.  If one or both of you was single, & you felt like he was trying to hard to contact you, you'd still have the right to ignore his texts, emails, calls.

[Oscar1]

I know I sound like an old fuddy duddy but it's for this reason that I refuse to join Facebook, even though friends keep telling me to. I do not want random people from my past to be able to find me. I already speak to people I want to speak to!

The net is great for many things but it has its drawbacks too!

As for the OP, you should quickly wind down contact, without being rude (in case you make him angry) until you cease altogether.

[Chocolate Cake]

Once a creep, always a creep.  I'd taper off on the communication and distance yourself if I were in your shoes...

[Twik]

My neighbor and I just had this issue with the guy who lives round the corner.  Seemed like a nice guy, maybe a little lonely.  However, it isn't worth the risk to either of us to find out.

He showed up at her house after dark a few days ago with his girls (they have girls the same age) and ingredients for making smoothies.  She was really uncomfortable but didn't want to be rude so she let him in.  Guys like that are really good at making you doubt your own radar.  This one didn't do anything (the girls were playing in the same room for goodness sakes) but he kept asking about her schedule, when her boyfriend is around, if the boyfriend's dog is ever at the house with her etc.  We talked about it and she is just going to be straight with him.

"This may sound old-fashioned to you but I simply do not spend time with other men without my boyfriend at home.  Your intentions are irrelevant - the rule is mine and applies to me alone.  Therefore, I am the one who will insist that it be respected.  I am comfortable having the odd chat - but we will not be spending time together alone."

Oh, lord. Just reading this makes my skin crawl. Not good, not good at all. He's setting her up, and using his own kids as camouflage.

And for the OP, I don't call my female friends every day. Your Mr. Creepy is coming on WAY too strong for "just casual friends".

[Tabris]

I would definitely set limits with this guy.

Is it *possible* that he wants to talk when his girlfriend is asleep because he wants to do something nice for her, or because he wants to marry her and he wants to know how you and Jeff broached the subject? In other words, subjects that would be fine to talk to you about but something he might not want his girlfriend to hear in advance?

Because overall, I do agree it's creepy and I would not indulge him. But maybe don't totally cut off contact until you have a better grasp of what exactly this guy wants.

BTW, "judicious stupidity" is a good thing. I got rid of a guy who was pretty shamelessly pursuing me by simply being stupid:

Pursuer: Say, would you like to go camping with me next weekend? It would be over in Smileyville
Me: Wow--smileyville is right near where FutureMrTabris is going to school! And I know he loves to camp! We'd all have a great time!
Pursuer: Fine, BE THAT WAY!

Voila, end of contact. He's probably still talking about that stupid person he tried to date, and you know what? I don't care.

If this guy does try to take things up a notch, be totally stupid about it (except that in your heart, your actually being very very smart.)  If he says "Let's talk after my girlfriend is asleep," you can reply with, "Oh, are you planning a surprise birthday party for her! How exciting! Jeff planned a surprise party once for me, and he did it so well that I loved him more than ever!"

Insta-shutdown. But that's only if you want to keep contact and verify what he's actually doing. If your gut is telling you to cut contact completely, that's probably the way to go.

[madmusician]

Well, he sent me another email with a couple of lines like "I could make a dirty joke right now but I'll be a good boy and keep my mouth shut," etc. I sent a curt reply, along the lines of "That was uncalled for, ttyl" but in a gentler tone.

I think he got the message b/c he hasn't called, texted, or emailed since Thursday.

(Oh, and Tabris, he already broached the relationship subject on email and I told him frankly that I plan to marry Jeff and we are quite happy together. I think that if he actually wanted to talk about his relationship, he would have said something in his emails.)

Problem (hopefully) solved.

[SquishyMooMoo]

MadMusician, I just had this exact same issue!!!! Not trying to thread hijack, just sharing my experience:

Guy I dated for about three years (last 2 years of high school and the year after that) randomly IMs me one day and says he saw me at the grocery store. Okay, that's nice? I hadn't talked to him since last summer (this was earlier this summer, say mid-July). We talk, catch up, whatever. We both play WoW, we both are in long distance relationships (with people we met in WoW, ironically enough).

Then a couple of days later he calls me and asks if I want to go out to get some tea. Uh, ok? He still had my cell number memorized because "some things you just don't forget." Right.

So I go to tea (by the way, it was really really gross. Not the fault of the lady who made it, I just ordered something I didn't like. Ew.) We talk for an hour and a half or so, then go to leave. First he returns to me some blankets of mine that he has had since we broke up. 2 years ago. Okay? And gives me a hug. Awkward.

That night he makes a character in WoW on my server. So he can chat with me. Says he hasn't told his girlfriend that we hung out yet--because she was working all day and they just talked for a minute before she went to sleep. Sounds fishy to me. He asks questions about my relationship, and I gush lots about how wonderful it is. He indicates he's having problems with his GF, I give him lots of helpful tips on how to make things better.

A couple of days later he tells me he gets to go on a spur-of-the-moment trip to visit his GF. And he is COMPLAINING about it because "she'll be working some so I won't see her all the time and I'll be staying with her family and they ask all these questions because they want to get to know their daughter's boyfriend..." Basically I told him that I had zero sympathy, because I would be ecstatic just to spend an hour with my boyfriend, much less a week in his house, even if he wasn't going to be there the entire time.

He comes back and keeps hinting he wants us to hang out again, that he wants to come see my new apartment, etc. He was friends with my coworker in high school and uses that as an excuse--Oh, we could all hang out! It'd be great to see him. I tell him I could just pass along coworker's phone number. He fishes to see if I would be excited to see him again. I play dumb.

Finally I just decided to call him on it--I told him that maybe I was totally wrong, but it seemed like there was some underlying motive. I outlined the things I had noticed, and told him--"I know you. It takes no stretch of the imagination to think that you're sitting there dreaming of a fairy-tale reunion between us." He made some crack about how I must have thought he just wanted to get a little "somethin-somethin" to which I responded: "No, I thought you wanted to get together and start imagining that we would have a relationship again." He says he's a little offended that I'd think such things of him, blah blah, but he quit talking to me.

I think that in situations like that it's best to just be up front. If you sense underlying motives, call them on it. If it seems skeezy, it probably is on some level. Regardless, if YOU don't feel comfortable, the friendship he's wanting to build is automatically not going to work because you're always going to be worrying in the back of your mind.

Good job on making it clear that your relationship is very good, healthy, that you are happy and serious about your BF... if you even hint at unhappiness it gives the guy a chance to get his foot in the door, or at the very least makes him think he might have a chance.

Yeah... if he wants to hang out, make it a double date or a group event. Not just the two of you, not anywhere private, and preferably, not at all. Your instincts aren't just about this guy and his motives, but probably are alerting you to potential drama/sticky situations that could arise. Mixing old boyfriends and new is generally not a great plan. Even if you are 100% on the up-and-up, you never know when guys will start to feel insecure. Better just to avoid it altogether.

[thinkso]

My neighbor and I just had this issue with the guy who lives round the corner.  Seemed like a nice guy, maybe a little lonely.  However, it isn't worth the risk to either of us to find out.

He showed up at her house after dark a few days ago with his girls (they have girls the same age) and ingredients for making smoothies.  She was really uncomfortable but didn't want to be rude so she let him in.  Guys like that are really good at making you doubt your own radar.  This one didn't do anything (the girls were playing in the same room for goodness sakes) but he kept asking about her schedule, when her boyfriend is around, if the boyfriend's dog is ever at the house with her etc.  We talked about it and she is just going to be straight with him.

"This may sound old-fashioned to you but I simply do not spend time with other men without my boyfriend at home.  Your intentions are irrelevant - the rule is mine and applies to me alone.  Therefore, I am the one who will insist that it be respected.  I am comfortable having the odd chat - but we will not be spending time together alone."

The part where he wanted to know if the dog was going to be there is really disturbing.  You know--a dog that would presumably protect her if she were being attacked...

She should tell him that she's getting a Rottweiler and it will be in the house at all times.

[Hawkwatcher]

My neighbor and I just had this issue with the guy who lives round the corner.  Seemed like a nice guy, maybe a little lonely.  However, it isn't worth the risk to either of us to find out.

He showed up at her house after dark a few days ago with his girls (they have girls the same age) and ingredients for making smoothies.  She was really uncomfortable but didn't want to be rude so she let him in.  Guys like that are really good at making you doubt your own radar.  This one didn't do anything (the girls were playing in the same room for goodness sakes) but he kept asking about her schedule, when her boyfriend is around, if the boyfriend's dog is ever at the house with her etc.  We talked about it and she is just going to be straight with him.

"This may sound old-fashioned to you but I simply do not spend time with other men without my boyfriend at home.  Your intentions are irrelevant - the rule is mine and applies to me alone.  Therefore, I am the one who will insist that it be respected.  I am comfortable having the odd chat - but we will not be spending time together alone."

The nature of these questions demonstrate that he does not have her best interests at heart.  As wazzie pointed out, the question about the dog is especially disturbing.  Why would he need to know where the dog is?   

Considering that he does not have her best interests at heart, she does not need to worry about being "rude" to him.  She should never ever let him in her house ever again, even if he does have his daughters with him (some sexual offenders do use children to get close to their victims).  She should instruct her daughters to do the same.     

If she decides to have this little talk with him, she should do so only in the presence of her boyfriend. 

To madmusician, if I read your original post correctly, he wanted to have sexual relations with you when you were 14 and he was 18 years old.  If you are in the United States, the odds are he would have been committing a crime since the age of consent is usually 16 years old.  I think that you would be better off not having anything more to do with him.
 

[LifeOnPluto]

Ok, I very briefly dated a guy when I was 14 and he was 18, our families pushed us together. We found out pretty quick it wasn't working out, I thought he was a little creepy, and he wasn't interested in someone who wasn't interested in the birds and the bees.

I'm curious to know why your parents were pushing their 14 year old daughter to date a man of 18?!

[LJM]

But I don't know whether I'm being irrationally creeped out or my inner creepiness radar is going of. Sometimes I can't tell the difference.

That "Creeped Out" feeling is based on a survival instinct that has been evolving for millions of years. Listen to it.

Very, very often after crimes, the victim will say "well, something didn't *feel* right, but the feeling seemed irrational, and I didn't want to be rude..."

When someone creeps you out, do not worry about being rude.

He creeps you out. Therefore, there is no reason for you to spend time with him or chat with him. A perfectly safe, stable, nice person will leave you alone after you ask nicely once. Someone who persists after that does not respect your boundaries, which is bad news even when he doesn't creep you out. If he does creep you out, then the lack-of-boundary-respecting only confirms you may have reason to.

When someone does not respect your boundaries, you HAVE to behave toward them in a manner that would be considered "rude" if you acted that way to someone who does respect your boundaries. They have forfitted their right to politeness-- defending the boundaries of what you are comfortable with becomes more imporant. You are not comfortable interacting with him at all, so you need to cut off contact. The more he objects and pesters you, the more confirmation you have that he is not a healthy person for you to be around.

And POD on heartstar1's comment: what were you're parents doing PUSHING you to date any particular guy? Let alone when you were 14? Let alone an EIGHTEEN YEAR OLD? Let alone one who specifically creeped you out? It sounds like your parents, however well meaning they may be in other areas, do not respect your boundaries either, which can make it hard to learn to defend your boundaries yourself. But it's an important habit to learn. (they also seem to have very poor judgment-- so you should definitely trust your instincts about a situation before you trust theirs, hard as that may be.)

Please, please, please do not worry about being rude. Just cut off contact with him.

And keep in mind, this is the consensus you're getting from people on an etiquette forum! If WE'RE telling you to stop worrying about whether you're being rude, and to just cut off contact, that should tell you something.

[madmusician]

Ok, I very briefly dated a guy when I was 14 and he was 18, our families pushed us together. We found out pretty quick it wasn't working out, I thought he was a little creepy, and he wasn't interested in someone who wasn't interested in the birds and the bees.

I'm curious to know why your parents were pushing their 14 year old daughter to date a man of 18?!

He was A Very Nice Church Boy. *snort* Apparently some people think that if he's in the church, he's automatically a great catch.