Author Topic: "I'm not your employee" - update (long)  (Read 4376 times)

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PoisonIvy

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"I'm not your employee" - update (long)
« on: January 13, 2007, 04:53:36 AM »
Some of you may remember a topic that I posted on the other forum.  To recap, I joined my business with Jane, and Laura (for a smaller share) was to invest some cash and provide us with space in the offices of her existing business.  To make a long story short, once Jane and I walked through the door, she began treating us like we were her subordinates.  I posted one incident in the original thread where she chucked a cardboard box in my direction, saying "Get this out of my way".

Well, although the situation has improved slightly, it's not enough as far as Jane and I are concerned.  I just can't abide the way she treats her own employees for starters.  In the five weeks since Jane and I moved into Laura's building, THREE of her employees have quit (two without any notice - one actually stormed out of the office Christmas lunch and never returned).  Carrie, Laura's fabulous employee and all-round lovely woman, has also told Jane and I that she is resigning as soon as the project she's managing is completed.  And last Monday, I turned up at work early, only to find Laura shouting at another employee, Danny, about a minor mistake he'd made on a project.  I feel terrible because I recommended Danny to Laura before I discovered what a nightmare she is to work for. I'd hired Danny at my last job, where I worked with him for five years.  He's a hardworking, honest and above all very clever employee who would give his eyeteeth to correct a mistake.  In fact, the mistake in question occured when he'd been working late on a Friday.  Both Laura and I know this, as we left at 7pm on Friday and he was STILL hard at work.  After staying 2.5 hours past closing, he decided that he'd exhausted all of his options and would have to ask for help on Monday morning.  Even if he had been a slacker, he didn't deserve to be chewed out in front of everyone in the building, particularly in front of people (me) who don't even work for the same company!

Laura's a bit more polite in her dealings with Jane and I, but only minorly so and I don't see it lasting.  She has a terrible habit of speaking to us in a condescending tone (ala the "You Need To..." thread in the Life forum), especially in front of her employees.  One trademark Laura antic:  Jane and I share the room with Carrie.  Jane and I are on a different phone system because our business has a separate number, and is therefore not on the internal phone system that Carrie and Laura use.  Laura will often ring Carrie - you can tell it's an internal call by the different ringtone - and ask to speak to Jane or I, usually to summon us to her office. (It's not like she doesn't know our number - she could ring us externally if she wants to ask something, but I think it's a control thing.)  It's always "You need to come up here now."  Not, "Would you have time to pop up here for a few minutes please?" or "Would you come see me when you get a chance?"  Or, if Carrie is not answering her phone because has gone out to get a sandwich or is in the restroom, Laura will let it ring about 30 times.  Jane once made the mistake of picking up the call because she got sick of the incessant ringing, and Laura demanded to know why she didn't pick up sooner.  Jane calmly explained that she did not answer sooner because it is not her phone, it's not on her desk, it's inconvenient to have to get up and walk across the room to answer a call which she has no reason to believe is for her, and most importantly, we do not work for her.  Laura's response?  "Whatever."

Laura is absolutely fine outside of work, but in the office, she blows her top without warning.  She always apologizes afterwards, but everyone walks on eggshells because no one knows what will set her off next.  A huge part of her stress is due (IMO) to the fact that she micro-manages down to the last paperclip, and just won't delegate.  This is a woman who is the MD/owner of a small but successful company with 6 full-time employees, 2 regular freelancers, and a host of interns, yet she orders the toilet paper and the tea and coffee.  If the coffee cups aren't washed thoroughly enough, she re-washes them herself.  This is stuff that could easily be delegated to her office juniors, but she just doesn't trust anyone else do do it properly, nor will she give anyone the opportunity to learn.  I have mentioned this to Laura in our heart-to-hearts during downtime, but she's always got an excuse as to why no one else can do these things properly.

Anyway, Jane and I have not yet signed the partnership deal, and we have decided to call the whole thing off and continue the business with just the two of us.  It's a difficult situation because there's friendships at stake here, but the way I see it is if we go through with the deal the friendship will be shot anyway.  Plus, there's no way I'd consider this deal if the relationship was purely professional.  Laura is an extremely smart woman, but she is incapable of behaving professionally with people she sees as her underlings, which is basically everyone.  The words "colleague" and "business associate" hold no meaning for her.

I was supposed to go to the movies with Laura this weekend (despite all the above, on a social level she is a lot of fun to be with) but I will probably cancel because I feel like a hypocrite knowing that Jane and I are going to Break The News to her next week. :'(

kckgirl

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Re: "I'm not your employee" - update (long)
« Reply #1 on: January 13, 2007, 05:21:52 AM »
Anyway, Jane and I have not yet signed the partnership deal, and we have decided to call the whole thing off and continue the business with just the two of us.  It's a difficult situation because there's friendships at stake here, but the way I see it is if we go through with the deal the friendship will be shot anyway.  Plus, there's no way I'd consider this deal if the relationship was purely professional.  Laura is an extremely smart woman, but she is incapable of behaving professionally with people she sees as her underlings, which is basically everyone.  The words "colleague" and "business associate" hold no meaning for her.

I was supposed to go to the movies with Laura this weekend (despite all the above, on a social level she is a lot of fun to be with) but I will probably cancel because I feel like a hypocrite knowing that Jane and I are going to Break The News to her next week. :'(

Good for you. I wondered why you stuck around there if she was treating everyone so badly. Have you found new office space?
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FoxPaws

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Re: "I'm not your employee" - update (long)
« Reply #2 on: January 13, 2007, 05:52:24 AM »
Micro managers and total control freaks are the most insecure people in the world. They live their lives in chronic fear that someone is going to figure out the world will run without them, and nobody will need them anymore. They lash out to prove to themselves and (they think) everybody else that they're more important than whoever they're yelling at.

From a distance, or as a friend, you can feel sympathy for these people. It really is terrible to never be able to relax and let go.

As a boss, parent, teacher, or colleague, they're pure poison. Kudos to you and your partner for realizing this and getting out while you can.

Good luck with your future business ventures. :)
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Lisbeth

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Re: "I'm not your employee" - update (long)
« Reply #3 on: January 13, 2007, 09:47:30 AM »
I once worked for a boss who behaved like Laura, and getting out was the best thing I ever did.  (It helped that I was expecting some money.  ;) )

I think you're doing the right thing by getting out of this deal with her.  Whatever she's like as a friend, being treated like that is unacceptable and unconscionable.
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sparksals

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Re: "I'm not your employee" - update (long)
« Reply #4 on: January 13, 2007, 01:21:10 PM »
I agree  you are making a very wise decision.  I hope Laura takes the news well and hopefully, it won't bruise your friendship since you said she's a decent person outside the office.  Please update us after you break the news to Laura! 

As an aside, I hope you hire Danny once you move to your new location!  ;)

PoisonIvy

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Re: "I'm not your employee" - update (long)
« Reply #5 on: January 13, 2007, 02:21:58 PM »
Thanks for the support :)

To answer a few questions...

kcgirl: We haven't started looking for office space yet, but as both Jane and I worked from our respective homes we could easily move back into the home offices until we find a new premises. We're in a large metropolitan area so it should be fairly easy to find something.  It'll be a bit of a drag being back at home though, as when I was working from home I had to try very hard not to work round the clock.

Kewpie:
Quote
Micro managers and total control freaks are the most insecure people in the world. They live their lives in chronic fear that someone is going to figure out the world will run without them, and nobody will need them anymore. They lash out to prove to themselves and (they think) everybody else that they're more important than whoever they're yelling at.

From a distance, or as a friend, you can feel sympathy for these people. It really is terrible to never be able to relax and let go.

I feel a lot of sympathy for Laura because I realize how easily I could fall into the same trap.  I know she's very lonely a lot of the time because she's devoted so much of her time and energy to building up her business.  I tend to be the agony aunt amongst my friends, but over the years I've found it too draining.  I couldn't handle it both as a friend and a colleague. 

KeenReader: Do you know what happened to your "Laura"?  Is s/he still in the same position?

Sparksals: 
Quote
As an aside, I hope you hire Danny once you move to your new location! 

Actually, the reason I put Danny forward for the job was because I wanted to hire him myself but wasn't yet ready to take on a full-time employee.  I actually (jokingly) told Laura at the time, "You have to hire Danny so I can steal him from you!"

Lisbeth

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Re: "I'm not your employee" - update (long)
« Reply #6 on: January 13, 2007, 02:28:04 PM »
KeenReader: Do you know what happened to your "Laura"?  Is s/he still in the same position?

So far as I know.  It's a he, and I've had no contact with him since leaving his firm.  (And may things stay that way.)
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Sophia

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Re: "I'm not your employee" - update (long)
« Reply #7 on: January 13, 2007, 02:38:51 PM »

I am just happy for you that you had not signed the partnership agreement already.  Getting out of that would be worse than a divorce with kids.  I wonder if there is any way to suggest counseling?  Since all she has in her life is the business, it would be sad to see her lose it. 

fluffy

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Re: "I'm not your employee" - update (long)
« Reply #8 on: January 13, 2007, 08:07:49 PM »
Good for you for doing what it takes to take care of yourselves and your business. Hopefully this will be a wake-up call and Laura will realize that she just can't keep treating people in this fashion. As hard as it might be, you will probably be doing her a favor if you let her know about some of her unacceptable behavior.

PoisonIvy

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Re: "I'm not your employee" - update (long)
« Reply #9 on: January 14, 2007, 07:07:35 AM »

I am just happy for you that you had not signed the partnership agreement already.  Getting out of that would be worse than a divorce with kids.  I wonder if there is any way to suggest counseling?  Since all she has in her life is the business, it would be sad to see her lose it. 


She does already have her own business which Jane and I are not a part of, so she's not losing any money if our agreement doesn't go through (apart from a percentage on Jane's and my company's potential profits, which we wouldn't see till our second or third year of trading anyway, provided we're successful of course).  In a way, it's a minor blessing in disguise, as an additional company is one less stress that Laura will have to deal with, though I know she won't see it that way.

As far as counselling, I believe Laura was going as one point but I'm not sure if she still is.  Jane and I wanted to bring that up separately, not only for her own happiness but for her financial and legal security.  A lot of her behavior towards her employees could easily be construed as workplace bullying.  If it continues, she'll have a hard time finding anyone who'll work for her.  At worst, she may find herself on the wrong side of a lawsuit.  I'd hate to see that happen to her.

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Chivewarrior

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Re: "I'm not your employee" - update (long)
« Reply #10 on: January 14, 2007, 11:20:33 AM »
Evil Chive can't wait for the next update to see what she does next.

Good Chive hopes there won't be any more updates necessary. *sends e-hugs*

Tabris

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Re: "I'm not your employee" - update (long)
« Reply #11 on: January 14, 2007, 01:23:43 PM »
It's a difficult situation because there's friendships at stake here, but the way I see it is if we go through with the deal the friendship will be shot anyway.

This is the thing to keep in mind. The friendship is definitely doomed if you continue with the business arrangement. You have a chance of salvaging it if you pull out now.

BTW, I would recommend you go to the movies with her anyhow because otherwise she might feel you're distancing yourself from her socially too.

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Sophia

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Re: "I'm not your employee" - update (long)
« Reply #12 on: January 14, 2007, 03:48:40 PM »
A lot of her behavior towards her employees could easily be construed as workplace bullying.  If it continues, she'll have a hard time finding anyone who'll work for her.  At worst, she may find herself on the wrong side of a lawsuit.  I'd hate to see that happen to her.

That was actually what I was referring to.  All it would take is one employee with a lawyer friend. Or, maybe one intern who seeks counseling at their college.   Also, what kind of employee could she get to work for her long-term?  Would she really want that person?  I wonder how she would respond to a printout of this thread? 

LadyJaneinMD

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Re: "I'm not your employee" - update (long)
« Reply #13 on: January 16, 2007, 02:52:12 PM »
Don't forget to apologize to Danny (privately) for getting him into this mess.  I'm sure he'll appreciate it.


Evil Duckie

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Re: "I'm not your employee" - update (long)
« Reply #14 on: January 16, 2007, 03:30:43 PM »
You are doing the right thing by ending the partnership before you sign anything. If you had stayed over time you and Jane would have by default become her employees.

While it will be rough now it would have been much worse it you had stayed in it.

You might lose your friendship with Jane over this, but it you had stayed you would have definitely lost the friendship.

It would be nice to let Danny know that you didn't know what Jane was like to work for before you recommended him.