What kind of parent does this to their kids?

[Squeaks]

My mother never had me believe in Santa - she did not see the point, but i still got pictures on his lap, i understood the fun and the tradition, but just always new it was more of a game that being told it was real.

[MameDennis]

I'm glad I believed that Santa existed, and I'm really glad that I didn't discover otherwise through an encounter with such a rude woman.  Sheesh, tell your kids whatever you want, but there's no need to broadcast it to the whole restaurant.

[Xallanthia]

A good friend of mine didn't have Santa either, because his parents didn't want to lie to him about Santa so that when they told him about Jesus, he would believe them.  I totally understand that and kind of lean in the same direction, though of course I will tell my children about St. Nicholas (the real saint) and Santa Claus and the history, fun, etc.

However, it certainly sounded like this woman was more on the page of "Why should Santa get the credit?"  What happened to the joy being in the giving, whether the recipient knows or not?

[blue2000]

It is fine for her to tell her kids who really got their gifts.

Not fine at all for her to go on a rant about it to a stranger!

And wanting the 'credit' for the gifts is a little weird. How much of a thank you does she expect from a small child? Do they have to be overflowing with gratitude and kissing her feet? Or do they have to make note of how much she spent so they can reciprocate??

[nliedel]

As long as the kids are loved, that is what matters.

I am bothered that the mom was indignant. There are ways to explain your position without making it about lying to children.

[Hawkwatcher]

Not that this excuses her behavior, but it is possible the mother has gotten a lot of grief for not teaching her children to believe in Santa.  Although Nancy obviously meant no harm, her innocent comments may have been the final straw for the mother.

[honeybuzzard]

Though I believe that parents have every right to raise their children with whatever beliefs and traditions they find most appropriate, I do feel a little sad for the kids that are that young and are being asked to understand on that sort of level that Santa isn't real and that they are excluded from things that they are probably seeing other kids their age being involved in because their parents don't want to foster a lie.  I don't see "believing" in Santa as a lie, per se; I see it as more of engendering a spirit of wonder and allowing children (of all ages--big kids too!  like me!)  to celebrate in the season of magic and possibility.  There's so much harsh reality in the world... why embrace that?  I'm not saying be unrealistic, but enjoy the whimsy and fun and let children have the imagination and beauty. 

hehe, I probably sound like some weirdo hippie, but I am just saying that I am so grateful for my childhood memories of Christmas, and all the magic and anticipation and wonder that came with that time of year.  Kids grow up so fast and learn all the ugly truth in the world... I don't think "lying" about Santa is unhealthy or shows a proclivity for lies about other things.  I guess I would be sad for the kids in this situation if she is so militant on her views that they are completely stripped of the opportunity to enjoy the world of imagination that kids are so natural with.  That, and if those kids are either a) witnessing the Santa fun happening for other kids their age and feeling left out or robbed in some way (which they could potentially hold against their parents when they are older... i.e. mom and dad didn't let us have santa! we didn't have a childhood!) and feel jealous or hurt by it, or b) they are not savvy enough to realize that it's not a good idea to spoil the fun for other kids and perhaps are repeating the things their mom says about Santa to them, thereby making other kids feel bad or ruin their family traditions, then I think that the kids who are not having Santa deserve a fair and honest talk about what is going on.  But I think it's hard for kids 4-5 to understand the whole "we don't believe in Santa, but other people do, so please don't spoil it for them."  That begs the question for that young mind to ask... "well, if Billy believes in Santa, but he's not real... Then Billy is silly!  or, if there's a Santa for other kids, why isn't there one for me?" 

Wow, this post got long!  so sorry!  But as far as the woman's behavior, I don't believe she acted appropriately, regardless of what she may believe.  Snapping at a stranger--never nice.  Especially in front of her children... that's just setting a bad example.  I think she could have used the situation as a further learning experience for her kids to reinforce their beliefs, like explaining in a more friendly manner that no, they didn't go visit Santa, that their family doesn't follow that tradition. 

[Sharnita]

I don't really have a problem with not doing the Santa thing if you don't want to but going off the way she did is over the top.  Calling it a "lie" makes her seem pretty judgemental of the people who do keep up the tradition of Santa.

[hermanne]

A bit off-topic...

The family I used to work for (nanny) was Jewish, and they took their 2-year-old to see Santa. As the mom said, they don't have anything like that and its all in good fun.

So Junior's sitting on Santa's lap and asked what he wanted for Christmas. Mom off to the side whispered "Hanukkah! Hanukkah!" Santa was a good sport, and changed it to Hanukkah.

Just before Junior hopped off Santa's lap, he jokingly asked Junior to leave milk and cookies out. Healthy Junior looked Santa straight in the eye and said, "Carrot sticks!" 

[bah12]

Though I believe that parents have every right to raise their children with whatever beliefs and traditions they find most appropriate, I do feel a little sad for the kids that are that young and are being asked to understand on that sort of level that Santa isn't real and that they are excluded from things that they are probably seeing other kids their age being involved in because their parents don't want to foster a lie.  I don't see "believing" in Santa as a lie, per se; I see it as more of engendering a spirit of wonder and allowing children (of all ages--big kids too!  like me!)  to celebrate in the season of magic and possibility.  There's so much harsh reality in the world... why embrace that?  I'm not saying be unrealistic, but enjoy the whimsy and fun and let children have the imagination and beauty. 

hehe, I probably sound like some weirdo hippie, but I am just saying that I am so grateful for my childhood memories of Christmas, and all the magic and anticipation and wonder that came with that time of year.  Kids grow up so fast and learn all the ugly truth in the world... I don't think "lying" about Santa is unhealthy or shows a proclivity for lies about other things.  I guess I would be sad for the kids in this situation if she is so militant on her views that they are completely stripped of the opportunity to enjoy the world of imagination that kids are so natural with.  That, and if those kids are either a) witnessing the Santa fun happening for other kids their age and feeling left out or robbed in some way (which they could potentially hold against their parents when they are older... i.e. mom and dad didn't let us have santa! we didn't have a childhood!) and feel jealous or hurt by it, or b) they are not savvy enough to realize that it's not a good idea to spoil the fun for other kids and perhaps are repeating the things their mom says about Santa to them, thereby making other kids feel bad or ruin their family traditions, then I think that the kids who are not having Santa deserve a fair and honest talk about what is going on.  But I think it's hard for kids 4-5 to understand the whole "we don't believe in Santa, but other people do, so please don't spoil it for them."  That begs the question for that young mind to ask... "well, if Billy believes in Santa, but he's not real... Then Billy is silly!  or, if there's a Santa for other kids, why isn't there one for me?" 

Wow, this post got long!  so sorry!  But as far as the woman's behavior, I don't believe she acted appropriately, regardless of what she may believe.  Snapping at a stranger--never nice.  Especially in front of her children... that's just setting a bad example.  I think she could have used the situation as a further learning experience for her kids to reinforce their beliefs, like explaining in a more friendly manner that no, they didn't go visit Santa, that their family doesn't follow that tradition. 

Children not believing in Santa doesn't necessarily diminish the holiday or mean that the kids are left out of the fun.  You can not believe in Santa and still appreciate getting presents, decorating a tree, getting your picture taken with him, etc.  There can still be the magic of Christmas without believing that the jolly fat man from the north pole is flying around with his 8 reindeer to deliver the presents. 

My parents allowed me and my brother and sister to believe in Santa, but I was always just a little skeptical.  I asked so many questions, that my parents finally, at the age of like 5, told me the truth.  But they also made sure that I knew not to ruin it for my Older brother and younger sister and not blab what I knew to the kids at school.  Christmas was still awesome for me.

I guess what I'm saying is that the mother was definitely rude to Nancy, but the issue is not if her kids believe in Santa, it is how she handled the situation.  Nancy was being nice and the mother should teach her children that although they may not believe in Santa to be polite and answer questions and speak to adults (and children) when addressed.

Sadly, she may deprive them of the "magic" of Christmas, but that can't be deciphered from the limited information we have.  It is very possible to have fun and participate in all Christmas events and not think of Santa as anything more than the commericialized symbol of the holiday.

[jimithing]

Though I believe that parents have every right to raise their children with whatever beliefs and traditions they find most appropriate, I do feel a little sad for the kids that are that young and are being asked to understand on that sort of level that Santa isn't real and that they are excluded from things that they are probably seeing other kids their age being involved in because their parents don't want to foster a lie.  I don't see "believing" in Santa as a lie, per se; I see it as more of engendering a spirit of wonder and allowing children (of all ages--big kids too!  like me!)  to celebrate in the season of magic and possibility.  There's so much harsh reality in the world... why embrace that?  I'm not saying be unrealistic, but enjoy the whimsy and fun and let children have the imagination and beauty. 

hehe, I probably sound like some weirdo hippie, but I am just saying that I am so grateful for my childhood memories of Christmas, and all the magic and anticipation and wonder that came with that time of year.  Kids grow up so fast and learn all the ugly truth in the world... I don't think "lying" about Santa is unhealthy or shows a proclivity for lies about other things.  I guess I would be sad for the kids in this situation if she is so militant on her views that they are completely stripped of the opportunity to enjoy the world of imagination that kids are so natural with.  That, and if those kids are either a) witnessing the Santa fun happening for other kids their age and feeling left out or robbed in some way (which they could potentially hold against their parents when they are older... i.e. mom and dad didn't let us have santa! we didn't have a childhood!) and feel jealous or hurt by it, or b) they are not savvy enough to realize that it's not a good idea to spoil the fun for other kids and perhaps are repeating the things their mom says about Santa to them, thereby making other kids feel bad or ruin their family traditions, then I think that the kids who are not having Santa deserve a fair and honest talk about what is going on.  But I think it's hard for kids 4-5 to understand the whole "we don't believe in Santa, but other people do, so please don't spoil it for them."  That begs the question for that young mind to ask... "well, if Billy believes in Santa, but he's not real... Then Billy is silly!  or, if there's a Santa for other kids, why isn't there one for me?" 

Wow, this post got long!  so sorry!  But as far as the woman's behavior, I don't believe she acted appropriately, regardless of what she may believe.  Snapping at a stranger--never nice.  Especially in front of her children... that's just setting a bad example.  I think she could have used the situation as a further learning experience for her kids to reinforce their beliefs, like explaining in a more friendly manner that no, they didn't go visit Santa, that their family doesn't follow that tradition. 

Children not believing in Santa doesn't necessarily diminish the holiday or mean that the kids are left out of the fun.  You can not believe in Santa and still appreciate getting presents, decorating a tree, getting your picture taken with him, etc.  There can still be the magic of Christmas without believing that the jolly fat man from the north pole is flying around with his 8 reindeer to deliver the presents. 

My parents allowed me and my brother and sister to believe in Santa, but I was always just a little skeptical.  I asked so many questions, that my parents finally, at the age of like 5, told me the truth.  But they also made sure that I knew not to ruin it for my Older brother and younger sister and not blab what I knew to the kids at school.  Christmas was still awesome for me.

I guess what I'm saying is that the mother was definitely rude to Nancy, but the issue is not if her kids believe in Santa, it is how she handled the situation.  Nancy was being nice and the mother should teach her children that although they may not believe in Santa to be polite and answer questions and speak to adults (and children) when addressed.

Sadly, she may deprive them of the "magic" of Christmas, but that can't be deciphered from the limited information we have.  It is very possible to have fun and participate in all Christmas events and not think of Santa as anything more than the commericialized symbol of the holiday.

Not to mention that Santa has become a commercialized and secular symbol of Christmas.  I will do the Santa thing when I have children, but I understand why some Christians don't, as I stated before.  For many Christians, Christmas is about the birth of Jesus, not about Santa Claus, reindeer, and candy canes.

[Gambitgirl]

i have no problem with parents deciding to not indulge in Santa with their kids...but i think portraying Santa in a negative light, like it's a lie or something unholy is not doing their child any favors and could only make their child cycnical from an early age.

plus their children could wind up repeating "Santa is a lie" to other children who do believe in him...and that's a problem. it could also make them the target of other kids for being "different" b/c kids will go after anything outside the norm sometimes.

my sister's ex-husband got remarried to a very conservative religious woman and adopted her beliefs. good for them...except they now tell my sister's children (when their father has them on visitation) that Santa is evil and anyone who believes in him or does Santa presents is going to the hot place! that is a very messed up message to be telling a 5 and 7 yo, who see Santa and his trapping everywhere and the entire rest of the their family believes in him and Santa brings them presents under their mom and grandparents' trees...the 7yo is a very smart little girl and says her stepmother is "mean and nuts" so she doesn't listen to anything she says about Santa or people going to heck...but her 5 yo brother gets very confused and upset when told by his father and stepmother his mother and her whole family are damned. 

if they don't want to do Santa for Christmas that's fine...but telling children that anyone who does is corrupt and evil...well that's evil at worst and psychologically damaging at best.

p.s. no one in our family speak to the father or stepmother at all except sister...and only for custodial visitation purposes. despite all her flaws my sister NEVER bad mouths her ex or his new wife and their mean-spirited antics in front of the kids and always says "some people just want to focus on Jesus for Christmas and that's ok. people believe different things and i believe in Jesus and Santa."

**edited to fix the several places where i mispelled Santa as SATAN LMAO!**

[alecmari]

I grew up not believing in Santa and didn't feel deprived.  What I actually felt was superior to all the other kids for having knowledge they didn't!   

I've let DD believe in Santa but he only brings her one gift to be opened Christmas morning.  The rest are from BF and me and are opened on Christmas Eve in accordance with our own cultural traditions.  Knowing that we are the ones spending money to purchase gifts prevents her from asking for outrageously expensive gifts, gives her a sense of gratitude towards us for getting her gifts, provides us with an explanation if something comes up where we can't afford to do something as nice at the holidays (kind of hard to say Santa went broke), and IMO prevents a sense of being entitled to a pile of gifts from Santa every year.

Of course Christmas traditions are up to each family to choose every year.  But not believing in Santa isn't cruel or horrible and its really not that egoistical to want your children to realize that *you* are responsible for their holiday gifts.

[momto3daughters]

I see nothing wrong with family not having children belive in Santa.

For our family my husband was raised JW and did not do holidays, now he does with us. I also belive that kids need to realize santa's not end all and be all and can get anything they want.

For us our kids (well the baby of the family does the older two roll their eyes at me now lol) that Santa delivers and makes presents but MOM and DAD have to pay Santa for the things he makes. After all it costs him to buy supplies doesnt it. My husband works hard to give to our daughters and we wanted them to know it.

[bah12]

I grew up not believing in Santa and didn't feel deprived.  What I actually felt was superior to all the other kids for having knowledge they didn't!   

I've let DD believe in Santa but he only brings her one gift to be opened Christmas morning.  The rest are from BF and me and are opened on Christmas Eve in accordance with our own cultural traditions.  Knowing that we are the ones spending money to purchase gifts prevents her from asking for outrageously expensive gifts, gives her a sense of gratitude towards us for getting her gifts, provides us with an explanation if something comes up where we can't afford to do something as nice at the holidays (kind of hard to say Santa went broke), and IMO prevents a sense of being entitled to a pile of gifts from Santa every year.

Of course Christmas traditions are up to each family to choose every year.  But not believing in Santa isn't cruel or horrible and its really not that egoistical to want your children to realize that *you* are responsible for their holiday gifts.

I see your point.  Now that I'm thinking about it, I remember one incident from my childhood....I'm not sure if I still believed in Santa at this time, but I'm guessing not.  I know that my sister did, though and so we were all still getting presents from Santa.

In my family, we got one or two gifts from my parents that we opened on Christmas Eve.  Then we opened the presents from Santa on Christmas Day.  Usually, after we opened presents, we went outside and showed off what we got to all the neighborhood kids that we normally played with.

One Christmas, I remember my sister showing off some barbies to another little girl and then telling her about some of the other stuff she got.  This girl said something like "wow, Santa gave you all that?"  my sister said, "yeah" and then this girl asked another older child, a brother I think, why Santa brought my sister so much and she only got one present from him.

I can see how kids might, if they don't understand limits, feel like Santa is being unfair if they ask for things their parents can't afford or decide not to get them.  The problem is, you can instill traditions and beliefs in your children, but you can't control how another child is going to portray their traditions and what your child, in turn, will think of that.

I do think it's fun and fine for kids to believe in Santa, and plan on letting my kids believe in Santa, but there is always that danger that their not going to understand why some kids get more presents or more expensive items than they do and why some children get nothing at all.

To the parents who have children that believe in Santa, if your child asks you a question on fairness when it comes to Santa, what do you say to them?  I'm just curious.