Author Topic: Not sure if this is a silly question... (firearm related)  (Read 14092 times)

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Sirius

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Re: Not sure if this is a silly question... (firearm related)
« Reply #45 on: December 25, 2007, 11:11:12 PM »
I took a firearms class to learn how to handle guns.  I respect guns, and always assume they are loaded and can be fired unless I unload them myself. 

That said, if someone besides an officer of the law brought a gun into my house without clearing it with me first, they'd be asked to leave.  If they asked first, I'd request that they not bring a gun into my home. 

Kendo_Bunny

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Re: Not sure if this is a silly question... (firearm related)
« Reply #46 on: December 25, 2007, 11:20:44 PM »
I don't know if I can keep it non-political when talking about why I want to open carry, so here's my best shot.

A lot of people don't know that they can open carry. They don't know their state's gun laws, and they definitely don't know the history of gun laws (the most restrictive ones were usually for "race control"). The way I see it, my decision may get me a lot of questions, but it will also inform a lot of people. Children usually get into guns because it's something mysterious and forbidden- my sister and I grew up with over 20 guns in the house, and I never laid a finger on one until I was 17 and my Dad put one right in my hands. I was taught to respect guns, and I don't believe you can effectively teach respect without some exposure. I don't want to slip into Condition White- I was threatened with sexual violence quite frequently as a teenager, and I know several victims. Also, I want potential criminals to see my gun and keep on walking. If they know for sure I have a gun, it's incredibly unlikely that they'd attack me. I believe that if they know there is a person with a gun in the area, they'll think twice about committing a crime in that area- after all, I wouldn't rob a store if I had just seen a person with a gun strolling down the street. The odds of cops getting there in time to foil the robbery aren't great, but the odds of an armed citizen close by hearing commotion and coming to investigate...

Leather Lady

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Re: Not sure if this is a silly question... (firearm related)
« Reply #47 on: December 25, 2007, 11:29:16 PM »
I'm not afraid of guns.  I'm worried about some people, though.  If you can handle the responsibility of carrying a gun responsibly, I would welcome you into my home.  I have many times- some of a leatherworker's best customers carry firearms, whether law enforcement or "other".  I do not worry as much about madmen running amok killing people, like in that mall slaughter recently, when the population is armed.  If someone is too flaky to be trusted in your home with their gun, why would you invite them in the first place?  Guns don't kill people, people kill people.  I never felt safer than I did in Macon, Georgia with all those good-ole-boys and their guns.  People are much less likely to get out of hand when they have a legitimate consequence to fear.

That said, I'd buy a gunsafe for the car and get a concealed carry permit, especially if there is anything about you that could be misinterpereted by the law.  I know a few law-abiding bikers with leather and tattoos who have been subjected to extra hassles about their guns because of first impressions.
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kathrynne

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Re: Not sure if this is a silly question... (firearm related)
« Reply #48 on: December 25, 2007, 11:50:08 PM »
I believe that if they know there is a person with a gun in the area, they'll think twice about committing a crime in that area- after all, I wouldn't rob a store if I had just seen a person with a gun strolling down the street. The odds of cops getting there in time to foil the robbery aren't great, but the odds of an armed citizen close by hearing commotion and coming to investigate...
This is what nearly got me killed when we got robbed at the fast food place, though. Unbeknownst to anyone else in the store, our assistant manager on shift at the time had a gun with him that night. When he realized that a large man was holding a .44 at my belly as I stood at the register, he got this brilliant idea that he could run from just behind me to the back of the stockroom in the back of the store (about 20 yards?), retrieve his own gun from the bottom of his gym bag and return to the front of the store to fight the two robbers to save the cash for which the store was fully insured--before the bullet from the .44 was fired and blew a hole through my guts with an exit wound the size of a chicken bucket.

I realize that gun ownership and voting are seen as rights and responsibilities. I also realize that there's a large part of the population that just shouldn't be trusted to do either of them. That's not based on race or politics or anything other than sheer lack of common sense.

Oh, and when we called the police after the robbery a car arrived within less than two minutes. They had been in the nearest lane of traffic at a red light right in front of the store while we were being robbed. They had absolutely no idea anything out of the ordinary was happening.

A year before this happened, I was given pepper spray as a birthday gift. During the three months prior to that birthday I had endured two muggings and two attempted rapes while walking to my home off campus. For years I would not walk alone or in a suspect situation without that canister in hand, safety off, and I asked a Syracuse police officer just where I stood legally. He said that while I was technically carrying a concealed weapon without a permit, anyone on whom I was likely to use it wasn't exactly in a position to insist I be prosecuted for doing so.

For a short while I considered upgrading that pepper spray to a gun, but that robbery sent that idea right out the window. I know that's a fear I don't care to deal with, and we now have a nice aluminum baseball bat near the bed--just in case. Colorado is a "make my day" state, so I'd be fully within my rights to shoot to kill an intruder in my home (and there've been efforts to expand that to our vehicles), but I already KNOW how to handle a bat, and that plus the adrenaline I'd be dealing with (Ambien or no Ambien) would be PLENTY to send the necessary message.

I freeze when I see a handgun, period. My IQ drops about 90 points that I really can't spare, I go into cold sweats, and I have about three minutes before I had better be in a bathroom.
 

hyzenthlay

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Re: Not sure if this is a silly question... (firearm related)
« Reply #49 on: December 26, 2007, 12:05:23 AM »

I wish I was as brave as you ladies. I love my firearm...but I refuse to let DH keep one loaded in the bedroom. I have this awful fear that it will be much more likely to be used against us in a home invasion/robbery then to our benefit because of the proximity of our bedroom to the doors to the home. Its one thing I just dont feel good about,

You don't keep a loaded gun unless it is on your person OR in a gun safe.  A gun kept for home safety should be loaded, within reach in a safe, and you should know how to open the safe in no time flat. You should fire the gun on a regular basis so you know it is working, and know how to strip and clean a jam.

Otherwise, the gun and the ammo are stored separately, both preferrably in a safe.

That's one big reason we don't own a gun. I take them seriously and will not have one in the house unless I know exactly how to use it. Until you do, it's a liability, when you do it's an asset.

Balletmom

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Re: Not sure if this is a silly question... (firearm related)
« Reply #50 on: December 26, 2007, 12:08:43 AM »
So, I'm a gun nut. I'm not militant or anything, but I love my gun (my 21st birthday present) and I got a holster for Christmas. I live in a state where open carrying a firearm is legal in all but government buildings, though of course I would leave private property if asked. Note: this gun will be loaded.

So, I plan on open carrying every chance I get. My close friends know this, and out of respect for the two who are uncomfortable with the presence of a firearm, I plan to leave my gun in my car. But for people I don't know as well, or who I haven't seen in awhile, should I inform them about my gun and my prediliction for open carrying it before visiting? Or would it be rude to walk in and wait to see if anyone comments? My sweetheart OC's almost everywhere he goes, and most people barely even notice it. I've just been wondering this since I unwrapped my holster this morning. 

If your gun is not a safety issue to others (children or child-mentalities) then it is not an etiquette issue. It's as legal as carrying your purse. Hopefully your friends have confidence in you to not feel threatened by this.

As for the safety issue:

I'm with Marina on this one, either on your person, or in a gun safe, but you make sure it's controlled. Period.


jimithing

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Re: Not sure if this is a silly question... (firearm related)
« Reply #51 on: December 26, 2007, 12:10:09 AM »
If someone is too flaky to be trusted in your home with their gun, why would you invite them in the first place?  Guns don't kill people, people kill people.  

But the opposite POV is why does someone feel that they need to bring a gun into my home?

The issue that I have is that people are not perfect, and accidents happen.  I'm sure everyone knows the gun statistics about it being more likely that the gun you own will hurt someone you know, than a stranger trying to do you harm. 

DH works for an ambulance and got a call a while ago about a police officer who accidentally shot himself in the leg, while he was sitting at a desk at his police station.  It happens to very cautious, safe people. 

We had the Trolley Square shooting her in Salt Lake City, in April.  There was on off duty police officer who happened to be eating dinner at the mall, with his wife, and he played a crucial role in taking down the shooter.  But he's not Joe Schmo who took a CW class and decided that he was going to play a hero and prevent this from happening.  I just think that this kind of situation is highly unlikely, not saying not possible, and yet the numbers for CW permits spiked after the mall shooting. 

Kendo_Bunny

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Re: Not sure if this is a silly question... (firearm related)
« Reply #52 on: December 26, 2007, 12:12:04 AM »
I certainly don't advocate that everyone carry... and also, the crook didn't know that your manager had a gun until he had his gun out.

Also, I hate to say it, but I don't really trust my town's police force. They're kind of a running joke in the court, they're crass and rude (and obsessed with getting young women workers in the town to cuss at them), and they're considered such a low threat by criminals that a woman with 2 children was kidnapped and raped at knifepoint not 100 feet from their station (the criminal had heard some rumors about our local force and had driven all the way over here, convinced he'd get away with any crime he committed here. He would have, if County Police hadn't tracked him down). Also, our Chief of Police is forbidden from carrying a weapon, because he has a restraining order against him for threat of assault with a deadly weapon (a hatchet that he used to chop his ex-wife's door down when she wouldn't let him in. He didn't actually assault her, just shook the hatchet at his ex-wife and stepdaughter, but still.)

For the record, I have nothing but the highest respect for most police officers. In every other town, the police I've met have been friendly and helpful, and definitely make me feel safe. It's just my hometown police... I wouldn't trust them with a nickel, let alone my life. I live in an extremely low crime area... but even so. Rumors are spreading far and wide about our police force, and sadly, a lot of the rumors are true.  

johelenc1

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Re: Not sure if this is a silly question... (firearm related)
« Reply #53 on: December 26, 2007, 01:17:35 AM »
I think the best thing when entering someone's home, would be to state the obvious.

You: Hi, thanks for having me over.  Before I come in, I just wanted you to know that I carry a weapon.  Is that okay with you or WOULD YOU LIKE ME TO LEAVE IT IN THE CAR?"
(I think the CAPS is really important.  It gives the person an out in case they are so startled they don't know what to say or don't want to ask you to leave it in your car for fear of being a bad host.)
Me:  Oh!  Well, maybe you could leave it in your car, if you don't mind?"
Other: Seriously?  Can I see it?
Another: Oh! No, it's fine.  Come on in.  Good to see you.


fishy

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Re: Not sure if this is a silly question... (firearm related)
« Reply #54 on: December 26, 2007, 06:30:16 AM »
I would not allow someone into my home who was carrying a gun unless they were a police officer. If my guest brought a gun in without asking my permission, they would be asked to leave immediately. While I respect others right to carry guns, I personally don't want firearms around me.

I'd err on the side of caution and ask at every home you go to, you never can be certain on what opinions the host might have. And while you might think it's awkward to ask, it would be more awkward having your host noticing afterwards and not taking it too kindly.

I'm from Australia though, and apart from serious criminals and rifles on farms, guns aren't generally carried by average joe's.

Warbaby

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Re: Not sure if this is a silly question... (firearm related)
« Reply #55 on: December 26, 2007, 06:37:25 AM »
Personal safety and personal statement. It is my right to carry- especially since according to my state's law, as an able-bodied citizen over the age of 17, I am a member of the State Militia. I believe a right unexercised is a right lost, and that's something I am 100% unwilling to lose.
Plus, I determined long ago that my days of being a passive victim were over, and I was never going to let myself be caught in a position of weakness again. I know better than to carry in Condition White.

Not just the state militia.  As defined by Title X of the U.S. Code, you, and just about everyone else, are members of the "general" militia which covers the whole country.  Folks like myself are an exception.  We are members of the Retired Reserve (name may differ by branch).

Personally, I am ambivalent about open carry.  But it is your right and I applaud you not only for exercising it, but for being concerned enough about the feelings of others to ask the question you have asked.  You would be welcome in my home, but here in Alabama, it would have to be concealed carry.
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hyzenthlay

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Re: Not sure if this is a silly question... (firearm related)
« Reply #56 on: December 26, 2007, 08:35:33 AM »

We had the Trolley Square shooting her in Salt Lake City, in April.  There was on off duty police officer who happened to be eating dinner at the mall, with his wife, and he played a crucial role in taking down the shooter.  But he's not Joe Schmo who took a CW class and decided that he was going to play a hero and prevent this from happening.  I just think that this kind of situation is highly unlikely, not saying not possible, and yet the numbers for CW permits spiked after the mall shooting. 

Joe Shmoe probably does a lot more shooting with his gun then the average cop. Many officers carry a weapon they have never even fired and can't field strip. They qualify once a year, sometines with a different gun entirely, and never go practice on the range. 

If the individual has a concealed carry license they probably got far more training then the average officer.

I respect our police force, but many of them carry because they are expected too, and have little or no gun safety skills. (I don't think that means they should not carry, I think that means they need to be paid to hit the range once a month with their service weapon.)

JordanX

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Re: Not sure if this is a silly question... (firearm related)
« Reply #57 on: December 26, 2007, 09:35:30 AM »
Here's a thought:  The OP carries a gun because (in part) she wants to make a statement to the general public.

I'm trying to think of an analogous situation with another political statement to determine the etiquette here.  I mean, if someone walked into my house, and introduced themselves with, "Hi, I'm Sue and I'm a huge proponent of socialized medicine," or "Hi, I'm Mindy.  I want you to know I had an ab0rti0n because I believe in exercizing my Constitutional rights."  Regardless of how I feel on any of these controversial topics (and I think gun control is on par with the other two), it's the fact that someone feels the need to deliberately make sure that I know how they feel that I find a bit off-putting.

In fact, I don't like bumper stickers or slogan tees for the same reason.  I wonder if I'm reacting to the OP the same way because of being so unfamilliar with the concept of people walking around wearing guns.

Morty'sCleaningLady

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Re: Not sure if this is a silly question... (firearm related)
« Reply #58 on: December 26, 2007, 09:42:59 AM »
You definitely don't live in Massachusetts!  The laws up here are really restrictive.

I would be a little surprised to see someone walking down the street with a gun on their hip.  Most people who carry regularly tend to do so concealed.  Perhaps you could apply for that permit?  That way, you could keep the weapon in your purse or tote on occasions that might be a bit less friendly towards weapons (say, church).
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RegionMom

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Re: Not sure if this is a silly question... (firearm related)
« Reply #59 on: December 26, 2007, 09:55:10 AM »
Right after the Va Tech shootings, I drove by a school that had a huge sign, "This is a gun-free zone."
That sent chills in me.
That statement lets anyone know that you can steal, abuse, and rob without consequences other than being chased by a rent-a-cop with maybe pepper spray. 

My kids go to a private school in Texas, and I am VERY glad that we have no such signs posted. 

I do not carry a gun, but DH and I have dated at the shooting range.  And my kids know also that there is no such thing as an unloaded gun. 

Look at stories of shootings--you rarely read when a citizen stops a bad guy.  But it happens. 
That last church shooting felled the bad guy because a FEMALE had a gun and used it.  In church.  Quick and dirty in the press, but she saved potentially dozens of lives.

Years ago, there was a crazy guy at Luby's Cafeteria who shot and killed many.  An adult gun-toting DD lost both parents, because she kept her gun in the car, as per the sign posted. 

In order to obtain a gun permit, it is a bit more than a CPR class.  And guns are expensive.  It is not Joe Schmoe just looking cool and hunting down the bad guys. 

I invite the OP over for a plate of homemade sugar cookies!!  :)
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