Author Topic: Some things should be brought up in private.  (Read 8206 times)

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Cz. Burrito

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Some things should be brought up in private.
« on: December 13, 2006, 12:45:26 PM »
I was at a meeting last week with 5 men.  I am the only woman in my department.  We were discussing different solvents (I'm a chemist) and our boss had reservations about a particular one, stating "at the back of my mind, I'm concerned about [Czarina Burrito] working with [solvent]."  He went on to say that "women of childbearing age shouldn't be exposed to [solvent]."

A few points...
1) He singled me out by name in a meeting with 6 people to effectively speculate on my reproductive organs.  I wouldn't be bothered much if he had brought his concerns up to me privately.

2) He was concerned about a substance that may cause birth defects, but doesn't affect fertility, so pregnant women are the only ones at risk.  I am not pregnant and personally never want to be.  If this were anywhere other than work, I would have said as much, but I really don't need to alientate the 9 fathers I work with any more than I already have by virtue of being female.

3) Oh, and also... it destroys your liver.  Yes, there's that little detail.  I heard that men have livers as well.  I personally am quite fond of mine.  In fact, at the exposure that the fetus-mutating effects kick in, your liver is already begging you to secure a spot on the transplant waiting list.
« Last Edit: December 13, 2006, 01:02:51 PM by CzarinaBurrito »

kiero

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Re: Some thing should be brought up in private.
« Reply #1 on: December 13, 2006, 12:53:49 PM »
Are you a woman?  Are you of childbearing age?  If the answer to those is yes - and this is clearly apparent - then I don't think he did anything wrong.  He has no business asking about your reproductive wishes.  So it becomes completely imaterial if you ever want to have children.  That just doesn't matter. 

I guess I think he would have been out of line if he had mentioned something irrelavant to the situation or something private.  But you being a female isn't exactly private knowledge. 


audrey1962

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Re: Some thing should be brought up in private.
« Reply #2 on: December 13, 2006, 12:56:59 PM »
Is there anyone in HR you can discuss this with?

Cz. Burrito

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Re: Some thing should be brought up in private.
« Reply #3 on: December 13, 2006, 12:59:08 PM »
Are you a woman?  Are you of childbearing age?  If the answer to those is yes - and this is clearly apparent - then I don't think he did anything wrong.  He has no business asking about your reproductive wishes.  So it becomes completely imaterial if you ever want to have children.  That just doesn't matter. 

I guess I think he would have been out of line if he had mentioned something irrelavant to the situation or something private.  But you being a female isn't exactly private knowledge. 



The solvent is hazardous to everybody.  There was no reason to be specifically and publicly concerned about me above everybody else.

Cz. Burrito

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Re: Some thing should be brought up in private.
« Reply #4 on: December 13, 2006, 01:02:29 PM »
Is there anyone in HR you can discuss this with?

I probably should, especially after what happened at a meeting this week.  The short version is that in another all-male-except-me group somebody made a comparison between tooth pain and childbirth and then looked at me and smirked before saying "you don't know about that yet."  That one is much more of a sexual harassment issue than an etiquette issue.  :-\

avonlea29

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Re: Some thing should be brought up in private.
« Reply #5 on: December 13, 2006, 01:34:36 PM »
Wow, I think you are totally overreacting....


I probably should, especially after what happened at a meeting this week.  The short version is that in another all-male-except-me group somebody made a comparison between tooth pain and childbirth and then looked at me and smirked before saying "you don't know about that yet."  That one is much more of a sexual harassment issue than an etiquette issue.  :-\

On what planet is that sexual harassment? He didn't refer to you having HIS child, so it had nothing whatsoever to do with sex. @@ I would have just rolled my eyes and said "And you do?" Acknowledging that you are physically capable of giving birth does not equate to harassment, IMO.

Cz. Burrito

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Re: Some thing should be brought up in private.
« Reply #6 on: December 13, 2006, 01:37:46 PM »
Wow, I think you are totally overreacting....


I probably should, especially after what happened at a meeting this week.  The short version is that in another all-male-except-me group somebody made a comparison between tooth pain and childbirth and then looked at me and smirked before saying "you don't know about that yet."  That one is much more of a sexual harassment issue than an etiquette issue.  :-\

On what planet is that sexual harassment? He didn't refer to you having HIS child, so it had nothing whatsoever to do with sex. @@ I would have just rolled my eyes and said "And you do?" Acknowledging that you are physically capable of giving birth does not equate to harassment, IMO.

On the planet where it isn't okay to hypothesize about my sex life.

Sharnita

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Re: Some things should be brought up in private.
« Reply #7 on: December 13, 2006, 01:59:16 PM »
Holy overreaction Batman!!

He stated that it was a potential problem for women of childbearing years.

At another meeting someone stated you didn't have firsthand knowledge of the pain of childbirth, something that doesn't seem verboten because you've just told all of us childbirth is not a part of your past, present or future. I would think there are plenty of real issues for you being the only woman but in these cases it sounds like you are creating unwarrented stress. That in turn will make the ment more hypersensitive to the fact that you are "different", which will lead to you being unhappy that you're being trated differently, which will make them...

ShadesOfGrey

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Re: Some things should be brought up in private.
« Reply #8 on: December 13, 2006, 02:14:11 PM »
I respectfully disagree with the majority of posters here.

Talk to your Boss.  The comment was TOTALLY inappropriate. Let him know that, and that you dont want to be singled out publicly  .  IF he had concerns about your specific safety, he should have discussed them with you *in private.*
That being said, the fact that he said something in public means that he was comfortable enough to say it adn not think that you would take offense, meaning that perhaps you arent seen as so different, after all.  Or, he could just be really clueless as to what constitutes discrimination, like a lot of bosses out there.  OTOH, he ignored the liver issue, which makes me think he was subconsciously more concerned about you than your male counterparts (which, sometimes, I cant blame them for, but that's another issue). 

You dont want to make a big stink to him (DONT talk about it to anyone else at work either), but you do want to adress the fact that you were singled out for safety concerns in a manner that should have been addressed in private, and it put you in a bad position

If the behavior continues, talk to HR.
Words mean more than what is set down on paper. It takes the human voice to infuse them with shades of deeper meaning. - Maya Angelou

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Twik

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Re: Some things should be brought up in private.
« Reply #9 on: December 13, 2006, 02:17:36 PM »
It's not necessarily sexual harassment; what it may be, however, is sexual discrimination, if CB is prevented from any sort of job advantage because "we can't endanger your (currently non-existent) fetus, so Bob here will get to do the work - oh, and get the credit for the great discovery as well".

Unfortunately, the history of workplace health and safety is littered with cases where women were kept out of well-paying jobs or opportunites for advancement because "we want to keep the little ladies safe".
Courage is the magic that turns dreams into reality.

ShadesOfGrey

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Re: Some things should be brought up in private.
« Reply #10 on: December 13, 2006, 02:21:41 PM »
It's not necessarily sexual harassment; what it may be, however, is sexual discrimination, if CB is prevented from any sort of job advantage because "we can't endanger your (currently non-existent) fetus, so Bob here will get to do the work - oh, and get the credit for the great discovery as well".

Unfortunately, the history of workplace health and safety is littered with cases where women were kept out of well-paying jobs or opportunites for advancement because "we want to keep the little ladies safe".

yes yes, this is exactly it! I couldnt quite say it right in my post, but this type of mentality is what keeps/has kept women out of any kind of 'dangerous' job.

If this guy was like a mentor to her and had blurred the lines between personal and professional, that's one thing. Wrong, but understandable, IMO.  It's another thing completely to discriminate against her based on her sex. 
Words mean more than what is set down on paper. It takes the human voice to infuse them with shades of deeper meaning. - Maya Angelou

I've learned that people will forget what you said, people will forget what you did, but people will never forget how you made them feel. - Maya Angelou

sotadragon

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Re: Some things should be brought up in private.
« Reply #11 on: December 13, 2006, 02:23:00 PM »
I agree with rdge.  How is it okay to speculate about someone else's reproductive system?  I don't care if it isn't "technically" sexual harassment, it's VERY impolite!  And completely ignoring the fact that the solvent is hazardous to EVERYONE, not just women?  Terrible.  I wouldn't be very happy in this situation either.

Definitely talk to HR about it, it's unacceptable.
Sotadragon

Cz. Burrito

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Re: Some things should be brought up in private.
« Reply #12 on: December 13, 2006, 02:26:34 PM »
I respectfully disagree with the majority of posters here.

Talk to your Boss.  The comment was TOTALLY inappropriate. Let him know that, and that you dont want to be singled out publicly  .  IF he had concerns about your specific safety, he should have discussed them with you *in private.*
That being said, the fact that he said something in public means that he was comfortable enough to say it adn not think that you would take offense, meaning that perhaps you arent seen as so different, after all.  Or, he could just be really clueless as to what constitutes discrimination, like a lot of bosses out there.  OTOH, he ignored the liver issue, which makes me think he was subconsciously more concerned about you than your male counterparts (which, sometimes, I cant blame them for, but that's another issue). 

You dont want to make a big stink to him (DONT talk about it to anyone else at work either), but you do want to adress the fact that you were singled out for safety concerns in a manner that should have been addressed in private, and it put you in a bad position

If the behavior continues, talk to HR.

Thank you.  That sounds like a reasonable course of action.  I'd really hate to go to HR before speaking to my boss, because that would just make things more awkward.

Sharnita

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Re: Some things should be brought up in private.
« Reply #13 on: December 13, 2006, 02:29:00 PM »
I started to wonder if I misread the OP so I went back and reread. From what I can tell, they were discussing the solvents they could use and Boss stated he didn't want to use x solvent because of the possible birth defects that could result. He didn't in any way prevent Op from doing any job. He showed concern for her. OP feels the concern was misplaced. I can not see how saying "We won't use X chemical becasue I would hate to have Person affected" is discrimination.

I would love to have my school board as concerned for my safety and health as OPs boss seems to be. We have dirty air ducts, rampant rodents, multiple allergens, kids with a history of violence, occasional arson...

Cz. Burrito

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Re: Some things should be brought up in private.
« Reply #14 on: December 13, 2006, 02:40:00 PM »
I started to wonder if I misread the OP so I went back and reread. From what I can tell, they were discussing the solvents they could use and Boss stated he didn't want to use x solvent because of the possible birth defects that could result. He didn't in any way prevent Op from doing any job. He showed concern for her. OP feels the concern was misplaced. I can not see how saying "We won't use X chemical becasue I would hate to have Person affected" is discrimination.

I would love to have my school board as concerned for my safety and health as OPs boss seems to be. We have dirty air ducts, rampant rodents, multiple allergens, kids with a history of violence, occasional arson...

Because to be concerned for me over the other employees is patronizing.  I don't need to feel like they're showing special care for my delicate female organs.  A fellow coworker was also taken aback and questioned "But it's okay if...we're exposed to it?!"