Author Topic: Professional Darwinism: Update to OP on p.74  (Read 1370464 times)

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gramma dishes

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Re: Professional Darwinism: Update to OP on p.74
« Reply #6420 on: October 16, 2014, 03:45:02 PM »
Sound like that particular pastor (and the parishioners who are backing him) misunderstood the saying "God helps those who help themselves."  It wasn't meant to apply to 'helping yourself' to church funds!   :)

Mergatroyd

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Re: Professional Darwinism: Update to OP on p.74
« Reply #6421 on: October 16, 2014, 04:11:19 PM »
Sound like that particular pastor (and the parishioners who are backing him) misunderstood the saying "God helps those who help themselves."  It wasn't meant to apply to 'helping yourself' to church funds!   :)

Ah, but money is inanimate. If he had been caught in a six month affair with a woman of questionable reputation from the next town over, he might have been forced to retire by  reason of crisis of faith. (True story)
I'm not sure what happened to the tax accountant who got arrested for tax fraud (by defrauding her clients no less) but I'm fairly certain she was still on the church board.

Twik

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Re: Professional Darwinism: Update to OP on p.74
« Reply #6422 on: October 16, 2014, 04:15:52 PM »
There is a minister in the area where I live who stole about $100,000 from a fund that was set up to administer a program that he started for the community.  He bought a lavish home, auto, etc with the funds over time.  When recently found out, he stated that he intended to continue as minister of his church.  And, don't you know, some of his church members agreed with him!  He has since pled guilty.

Con men flourish in communities where it's considered rude to doubt someone else's word, or to be "unforgiving". That means that religious communities are often rife with them.
My cousin's memoir of love and loneliness while raising a child with multiple disabilities will be out on Amazon soon! Know the Night, by Maria Mutch, has been called "full of hope, light, and companionship for surviving the small hours of the night."

MrTango

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Re: Professional Darwinism: Update to OP on p.74
« Reply #6423 on: October 16, 2014, 04:45:06 PM »
There is a minister in the area where I live who stole about $100,000 from a fund that was set up to administer a program that he started for the community.  He bought a lavish home, auto, etc with the funds over time.  When recently found out, he stated that he intended to continue as minister of his church.  And, don't you know, some of his church members agreed with him!  He has since pled guilty.

Con men flourish in communities where it's considered rude to doubt someone else's word, or to be "unforgiving". That means that religious communities are often rife with them.

I remember a sermon from the pastor at my church when I was a kid.  It was something along the lines of "God calls us to forgive others' sins, but that doesn't mean we should be giving them the opportunity to sin again."

Jocelyn

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Re: Professional Darwinism: Update to OP on p.74
« Reply #6424 on: October 16, 2014, 09:42:18 PM »
There is a minister in the area where I live who stole about $100,000 from a fund that was set up to administer a program that he started for the community.  He bought a lavish home, auto, etc with the funds over time.  When recently found out, he stated that he intended to continue as minister of his church.  And, don't you know, some of his church members agreed with him!  He has since pled guilty.
I know of a church where the minister not only had an affair with a member of the congregation who had come to him for counseling, he impregnated her. And then told her to get an abortion. (which is contrary to the teaching of the church) At that point, her idolization of this man sort of crumbled, and she outed him to the church. He tearfully told the congregation that he had confessed his sin to God and God had forgiven him...and they voted to retain him as their minister. When one of the deacons objected, saying that the minister had taken advantage of a woman in emotional distress, and would have been happy to have her have an abortion (which, as I said, is considered murder in their church) to cover it up, the deacon was told he was too unforgiving, and ejected from the church. Mrs. Minister tearfully stood by her man.

o_gal

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Re: Professional Darwinism: Update to OP on p.74
« Reply #6425 on: October 17, 2014, 07:36:04 AM »
There is a minister in the area where I live who stole about $100,000 from a fund that was set up to administer a program that he started for the community.  He bought a lavish home, auto, etc with the funds over time.  When recently found out, he stated that he intended to continue as minister of his church.  And, don't you know, some of his church members agreed with him!  He has since pled guilty.
I know of a church where the minister not only had an affair with a member of the congregation who had come to him for counseling, he impregnated her. And then told her to get an abortion. (which is contrary to the teaching of the church) At that point, her idolization of this man sort of crumbled, and she outed him to the church. He tearfully told the congregation that he had confessed his sin to God and God had forgiven him...and they voted to retain him as their minister. When one of the deacons objected, saying that the minister had taken advantage of a woman in emotional distress, and would have been happy to have her have an abortion (which, as I said, is considered murder in their church) to cover it up, the deacon was told he was too unforgiving, and ejected from the church. Mrs. Minister tearfully stood by her man.

While one of our past ministers didn't have an as egregious (or egg-re-goose :-) incident, his was more of a career-broadening plan. Ours was the 3rd church (at least, there may have been others) where he would start an affair with a member of the congregation. In our case, not only was this member married, but she headed up a committee that brought in a nationally known speaker to give 3 days of talks on strengthening your marriage (oh the irony).

At each church, when the affair had become known about, the minister and his co-minister wife would then put our their resumes to find another church. Back then (early 1980's) the Presbyterian church would not let a pastoral search committee ask why they were leaving, or even have the right to ask questions of the church they were leaving. After all this cr*p came to light, the rules were revised. What would usually happen is that they'd leave amidst tearful farewells about how great they were as a clergy team.

But not in our case. What happened is that minister wife decided to take an associate pastorship at a church in Texas. Minister philanderer decides to "retire". We give them a big banquet, many gifts, etc. That enrages husband of the woman having the affair and husband goes to local Presbytery and tells them everything. Minister philanderer is finally brought before an internal panel/court and is defrocked.

Took minister wife another 3 years before I think she finally divorced him, though.

ladyknight1

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Re: Professional Darwinism: Update to OP on p.74
« Reply #6426 on: October 17, 2014, 09:36:54 AM »
http://articles.orlandosentinel.com/2012-02-09/news/os-mildred-fernandez-sentencing-hearing-20120209_1_mildred-fern-ndez-arnold-state-prison

A county council member running for mayor was investigated and convicted for accepting illegal campaign contributions including office space, cash contributions in exchange for access to information, special treatment with planned developments and use of cars for her and her campaign staff. She served 22 months in prison. She plead no contest to 8 counts, including two felonies, which ended her political career.

Chipmunky

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Re: Professional Darwinism: Update to OP on p.74
« Reply #6427 on: Today at 02:03:54 PM »
I'd forgotten about this one...if it didn't end in professional darwinism, I'd be very surprised.

My line of work involves qui tam/whistleblower civil litigation. When a complaint is filed in federal court, the individual plaintiff or their attorney, on behalf of the named states and federal government, can request the case be filed "under seal" which means while the states and government get a copy of the complaint and motion for seal, and a case number is generated, the case cannot be found on any docket, anywhere. Kind of a super secret "let's investigate and see how accurate this is before the named Defendant knows what's going on and starts burning/shredding evidence/retaliating against the whistleblower" type of thing (often, the individual is still employed by the company they're accusing of bad behavior). 

However, the rule with seal orders is "this is under seal, until the judge says otherwise, you DO NOT BREAK THE SEAL FOR ANY CIRCUMSTANCES/PURPOSES" It's kinda like Fight Club.

A case was filed in a Northern state (I'm in a southern one) federal court. In the same state, the individual whistleblower had a case against the named Defendant for unlawful retaliation, harassment, and other grievences, along with firing the the person without cause. This case was filed in state court. As the state court action was proceeding, the Assistant US Attorney in the civil federal court matter noticed the judge was asking a lot of questions that the person couldn't answer without a seal violation. 

So, the AUSA asked the federal court's permission to "lift" the seal solely for the purposes of notifying the state court judge, in chambers, of this other ongoing matter (kind of a, we've got another case, please stop freaking out on the plaintiff, just want you to have a heads up for the whole picture of what's going on).  The letter explaining all of this to the judge is sent with bold lettering stating this is for the judge's eyes only, it is not to go on any docket, anywhere, so help you diety.

3 guesses what happened.

The Judge's Judicial Assistant scooped up the letter with a whole bunch of other stuff and took it to the Clerk's office for docketing. The letter appeared on the public webpage for the case 2 days later. Cue total freak out by plaintiff's attorney. Cue notice to states and federal government regarding breach of the seal. Last I heard, the judge was going to be reprimanded for this mess. Don't know if the JA was still employed.

Sirius

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Re: Professional Darwinism: Update to OP on p.74
« Reply #6428 on: Today at 02:25:32 PM »
Something similar to Chipmunky's breach of the seal:

When I worked for the medical records department we would send sealed records to attorneys regarding litigation involving the hospital.  One Friday an attorney walked in carrying some unsealed records (that had been sealed when they'd received them) and wanted us to verify that the records had not been tampered with.  At 4:55 p.m. on a Friday.  The chart was 3 - 4 volumes.  The attorney tried to heap the blame on his paralegal.  My boss wasn't buying it; she (boss) let the attorney know that he was ultimately responsible for what his staff did, and if he refused to take that responsibility then he needed to get into another line of work (or something like that; it's been years).  Two of our military people stayed after for hours verifying those charts.


MrTango

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Re: Professional Darwinism: Update to OP on p.74
« Reply #6429 on: Today at 03:03:40 PM »
Something similar to Chipmunky's breach of the seal:

When I worked for the medical records department we would send sealed records to attorneys regarding litigation involving the hospital.  One Friday an attorney walked in carrying some unsealed records (that had been sealed when they'd received them) and wanted us to verify that the records had not been tampered with.  At 4:55 p.m. on a Friday.  The chart was 3 - 4 volumes.  The attorney tried to heap the blame on his paralegal.  My boss wasn't buying it; she (boss) let the attorney know that he was ultimately responsible for what his staff did, and if he refused to take that responsibility then he needed to get into another line of work (or something like that; it's been years).  Two of our military people stayed after for hours verifying those charts.

I'd have refused the request for verification outright.  The attorney would need to request another copy of the records (at the standard fee for that service).

Yarnspinner

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Re: Professional Darwinism: Update to OP on p.74
« Reply #6430 on: Today at 03:37:51 PM »
Happily, this didn't end in PD, but it could have.  Several years ago, I was purchasing the movies for the downtown library.  We bought new releases on DVD in multiples of three just for us.  The branches always bought just one copy.  Well, a new movie that EVERYONE wanted had come out and we had three copies.  Except, they had been checked out for weeks and no one had seen them return.  There was along list of holds on the title and no one had seen the movie yet.  Finally, we looked at the records at discovered that all three copies were charged out to three staff members who had had them for over a month.  A phone call to their supervisor resulted in the three DVDs being returned immediately.

And the problem still persists.  One staff member has been talked to repeatedly because she places holds on every new movie that is ordered.  You can only have five films out at a time, and honestly, in a week's time, how many of these things can you watch if you also work full time?  At one point she had close to twenty movies checked out and most of them had been renewed twice, returned and checked out again immediately and then renewed again.  She got caught up with when she had the face to complain that one of her holds had been given to a patron instead of being passed on, never mind that she hadn't yet watched the others that she had.

Because of this behavior and similar incidents with staff members manipulating the hold feature so they can put themselves at the top of the list, we may lose our biggest perk as librarians: we don't pay fines if we are a few days late with items.  And we have been told that continued abuse of the privilege of getting to see first run movies on DVD before they get destroyed (and they do get destroyed pretty quickly once the public gets them...some folks think it is delightful to carve pictures into the backs of DVDs) will result in dismissal.

Now it's a matter of time....

Piratelvr1121

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Re: Professional Darwinism: Update to OP on p.74
« Reply #6431 on: Today at 07:52:42 PM »
There is a minister in the area where I live who stole about $100,000 from a fund that was set up to administer a program that he started for the community.  He bought a lavish home, auto, etc with the funds over time.  When recently found out, he stated that he intended to continue as minister of his church.  And, don't you know, some of his church members agreed with him!  He has since pled guilty.

Con men flourish in communities where it's considered rude to doubt someone else's word, or to be "unforgiving". That means that religious communities are often rife with them.

I remember a sermon from the pastor at my church when I was a kid.  It was something along the lines of "God calls us to forgive others' sins, but that doesn't mean we should be giving them the opportunity to sin again."

Ours has said similar.  She even said in one sermon that nowhere in the bible does it say that we are to forgive and forget, simply that we are to forgive.   And that it is good to forgive but wise not to put ourselves into the position to be hurt again. 
Beyond a wholesome discipline, be gentle with yourself. You are a child of the universe, no less than the trees and the stars.  You have a right to be here. Be cheerful, strive to be happy. -Desiderata