Author Topic: Complete Silence worked for me :)  (Read 10895 times)

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RooRoo

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Re: Complete Silence worked for me :)
« Reply #30 on: April 22, 2009, 07:08:12 PM »
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[Stupid excuse that] "...She was just playing hard to get." And, unfortunately, a number of juries and judges who agree that, short of hitting him in the solar plexus and screaming, you're "going along with it".

This is why some colleges have been publicly emphasizing that "No means No." There are many men who actually believe that, unless you reply in a way that is clearly antagonistic, "no" means "maybe."

A polite "No, thank you," falls into this "maybe" category. We Ehellions need to find a way to be clearly antagonistic without being rude. It's a fine line. To say "I'm not in the habit of playing scrabble with strange men" sounds like you might feel like changing that habit. How about:

I never scrabble with strangers.
You do not meet my standards.
You are not my husband, and I scrabble only with him.

Or the silent, fish-like stare, meaning, "WHAT did you just ask me?"

What else, fellow Ehellions?
"Someday we must write a book of Etiquette for sensible people," said Mrs. Morland, "though apart from a few rules it really boils down to an educated mind and a kind heart." ~ Angela Thirkell, Never Too Late

YogaChick

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Re: Complete Silence worked for me :)
« Reply #31 on: April 22, 2009, 09:12:23 PM »
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[Stupid excuse that] "...She was just playing hard to get." And, unfortunately, a number of juries and judges who agree that, short of hitting him in the solar plexus and screaming, you're "going along with it".


Or the silent, fish-like stare, meaning, "WHAT did you just ask me?"




That's what I did.....and it didn't work.

GoldenGemini

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Re: Complete Silence worked for me :)
« Reply #32 on: April 22, 2009, 11:01:08 PM »
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[Stupid excuse that] "...She was just playing hard to get." And, unfortunately, a number of juries and judges who agree that, short of hitting him in the solar plexus and screaming, you're "going along with it".


Or the silent, fish-like stare, meaning, "WHAT did you just ask me?"




That's what I did.....and it didn't work.

Also, I think you'll find that really won't discourage them.  You did not say "No", and I am afraid a really good (creepy) lawyer will be able to spin that.


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Shortcake

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Re: Complete Silence worked for me :)
« Reply #33 on: April 23, 2009, 11:24:18 AM »
RooRoo do you think saying "No" in a firm voice (not yelling) with an angry facial expression would be enough to discourage creeps?

I don't think the OP did anything wrong. She tried ignoring him, and it didn't work.
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caranfin

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Re: Complete Silence worked for me :)
« Reply #34 on: April 23, 2009, 11:43:45 AM »
Giving an unfailingly polite response such as "I'm not interested" or "That won't be possible" tells the guy that he had every right to make his proposition. The OP managed to let him know that his proposition itself was inappropriate. I think she did well.
He was not at all afraid to be killed in nasty ways.

gollymolly2

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Re: Complete Silence worked for me :)
« Reply #35 on: April 23, 2009, 11:47:27 AM »
I think there are sometimes when etiquette is just not a primary concern. I worry about etiquette in dealing with normal people in everyday situations. Rudeness or odd situations definitely come up in those situations, and etiquette should not be abandoned then.

But honestly, if someone was coming on to me in a pushy and creepy way, they get a big "Get the F away from me" from me. I don't care about etiquette in that case, I care about making it extraordinarily clear to that person that I don't want them to have anything to do with me. That may be retaliatory rudeness - I don't think so - but I dont care either. I dont think getting rid of someone who has crossed certain lines requires you to be unfailingly polite and, frankly, from some of the suggestions here, passive.

Aeris

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Re: Complete Silence worked for me :)
« Reply #36 on: April 23, 2009, 11:59:38 AM »
I think there are sometimes when etiquette is just not a primary concern. I worry about etiquette in dealing with normal people in everyday situations. Rudeness or odd situations definitely come up in those situations, and etiquette should not be abandoned then.

But honestly, if someone was coming on to me in a pushy and creepy way, they get a big "Get the F away from me" from me. I don't care about etiquette in that case, I care about making it extraordinarily clear to that person that I don't want them to have anything to do with me. That may be retaliatory rudeness - I don't think so - but I dont care either. I dont think getting rid of someone who has crossed certain lines requires you to be unfailingly polite and, frankly, from some of the suggestions here, passive.

I have to agree.

And any comments of "but he wasn't actually a threat in this context" don't hold any water with me. As far as I'm concerned any man trying to pick me up in an inappropriate way, or after I've expressed any disinterest is a potential danger. DF did not understand for the longest time how the unspoken threat of sexual violence hangs hangs over these interactions. He does now, after years ago when he actually watched me handle someone who was (inebriated and) potentially dangerous.

This is not, of course, to imply or suggest that all men are dangerous or active threats in this way. But the reality is that it can go from 0 to 60 in the blink of an eye, and you never really know who you are dealing with.

When I was 19, sophmore in college, my dorm was in a bad neighborhood. As a freshman girl and I walked to the subway (at 9am no less) a 20 something yr old man made some explicit pick up comments to us as we passed. We said, politely, that we weren't interested. He got up and followed up. For 4 blocks. Stayed about a quarter block behind us and yelled about all the stuff he was going to do to us. Until I stopped, turned around and yelled back some explicit stuff of my own. He then slunk off.

Etiquette just didn't matter there. Our polite refusal simply intrigued him.

RooRoo

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Re: Complete Silence worked for me :)
« Reply #37 on: April 23, 2009, 04:59:43 PM »
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I dont think getting rid of someone who has crossed certain lines requires you to be unfailingly polite and, frankly, from some of the suggestions here, passive.

I completely agree; I'm sorry if I gave a false impression.

My body is mine, and I reserve the right to make anyone who threatens its integrity in any way to leave me alone, no matter what it takes. Sometimes you have to use language the other person understands.

I've seen this sentiment in threads about many different forms of rudeness: Etiquette does not require you to be a doormat.
"Someday we must write a book of Etiquette for sensible people," said Mrs. Morland, "though apart from a few rules it really boils down to an educated mind and a kind heart." ~ Angela Thirkell, Never Too Late

Ms_Cellany

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Re: Complete Silence worked for me :)
« Reply #38 on: April 25, 2009, 12:15:51 PM »
I think the OP's response falls well within etiquette standards, was effective, and as a bonus was very funny.

She wins the trifecta!
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Hanna

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Re: Complete Silence worked for me :)
« Reply #39 on: April 25, 2009, 12:48:21 PM »
I think the OP's response falls well within etiquette standards, was effective, and as a bonus was very funny.

She wins the trifecta!

I agree!  There is nothing in etiquette that suggests one must endure offensive blatantly sexual remarks from complete strangers.  Further, this guy wasn't even hitting on her, he was was attempting (even if only subconciously) to dominate and embarrass her by making sexual advances in front of another person.  There's no way he thought she would say "Sure, sounds like a great idea", so the purpose could not be to actually get a date with her.  She isn't rude for turning it back on him and thereby maintaing control. 

Raintree

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Re: Complete Silence worked for me :)
« Reply #40 on: April 29, 2009, 05:58:53 AM »
Is it really time to dig out the etiquette book when some creep is blatantly hitting on you and can't take the hint? I think YogaChick let the guy off easy....my response to his icky pick-up lines would be unprintable.

This. I can't believe people are suggesting the OP should have been polite to the stranger making suggestions about going to his house. And I don't think her response was particularly rude. Sounds as though she kept it light and humourous.

Warbaby

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Re: Complete Silence worked for me :)
« Reply #41 on: May 03, 2009, 06:09:51 PM »
Man's point of view:  Her silence should have been more than enough to tell a gentleman that she was not interested.  The clod she was dealing with would have never taken a hint or polite refusal.  OP handled the situation in what I would term a most ladylike manner under the circumstances.

There is a class of biological male (they're not men) who have the impression that all women should be grateful for their attentions and that all women should be considered as property.  Both of those attitudes should have died out with the dinosaurs, but they didn't.

For my money, a lady who is unfortunate enough to encounter one of these (insert favorite word that the eHell filter wouldn't pass here) is justified in dealing with him (it?) in any manner that she finds effective. 

My Father, God rest his soul, taught me when I was a young boy that "no" means just that; "No."  He did not understand any other way of thinking concerning interactions between men and women.
"May you live as long as you wish and love as long as you live." - R. Heinlein

Hanna

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Re: Complete Silence worked for me :)
« Reply #42 on: May 03, 2009, 06:16:20 PM »
Man's point of view:  Her silence should have been more than enough to tell a gentleman that she was not interested. 
I totally agree, but then a gentleman would never have presumed to ask a unknown lady home in this manner in the first place!

maryb

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Re: Complete Silence worked for me :)
« Reply #43 on: May 23, 2009, 09:22:37 AM »
I would have been far ruder, I'm afraid - you did well.  It's intimidating and frightening to have a man you don't know coming on that strong on the bus or train, and it's not appropriate of HIM.  You did nothing wrong.

mechtilde

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Re: Complete Silence worked for me :)
« Reply #44 on: May 23, 2009, 09:34:01 AM »
When the man propositioned her, the OP would have been entirely justified in telling him to go away and stop bothering her, or she would start to scream. Then carry out her threat and yell the place down. No-one should be expected to tolerate such harassment.
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