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Author Topic: Enough pizza?  (Read 9609 times)

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VorFemme

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Re: Enough pizza?
« Reply #45 on: August 07, 2009, 02:15:31 PM »
And if the hosts are known to serve very small amounts of food - then they may find that their invitations to dinner are being turned down or people treat their "dinner" invitations as if they were invitations to an appetizer and possibly dessert before leaving to eat an actual MEAL elsewhere.
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Jenzilla

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Re: Enough pizza?
« Reply #46 on: August 07, 2009, 02:22:07 PM »
The hosts do have the right to decide how much food to serve.  If the servings are skimpy for whatever reason, I'd accept it and be gracious.  But that doesn't mean I'd be happy about it.

I'll agree with you there. I guess what's getting me is that it seems a little ungracious to condemn grandparents for misjudging how much food was needed and actually label them rude for it. Plus it seems like a really shaky idea that the guests get to decide what's enough, I'm sure that's completely at odds with opinions I've seen around here previously. In fact, I recall a couple of threads where it was suggested by many posters that food could be plated in order to control the serving sizes. So why was that okay in those threads but not here?

Red1979

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Re: Enough pizza?
« Reply #47 on: August 07, 2009, 02:34:00 PM »
The hosts do have the right to decide how much food to serve.  If the servings are skimpy for whatever reason, I'd accept it and be gracious.  But that doesn't mean I'd be happy about it.

I'll agree with you there. I guess what's getting me is that it seems a little ungracious to condemn grandparents for misjudging how much food was needed and actually label them rude for it. Plus it seems like a really shaky idea that the guests get to decide what's enough, I'm sure that's completely at odds with opinions I've seen around here previously. In fact, I recall a couple of threads where it was suggested by many posters that food could be plated in order to control the serving sizes. So why was that okay in those threads but not here?

Because etiquette is all about context.  What is acceptable in one scenario is not in another. 

If the grandparents knowingly served less than adequate food--they were rude.  If they thought it was enough food and it wasn't, they are not rude, but still are poor hosts.

If all of your dinner party guests leave hungry--then it isn't an adequate amount of food.  And while we can give the grandparents leeway that they might not have realized this, they were rude for taking food away from their guests to put aside for another uninvited guest.

This isn't about guests being gluttons--there's a difference between a guest arbitrarily deciding that they wanted a second steak, versus all the guests leaving hungry because there simply wasn't enough food.

I strongly dislike the elevated status some people give hosts.  I host a lot of get-togethers, some big, some small.  It takes a lot of work.  That's the way it is.  It isn't okay for me to do the barest minimum, or not think about my guests needs.  I invited them--they didn't force themselves on me and I should be putting some thought and effort into accomodating them. 

The guests have the right to expect a meal when invited to dinner.  These guests weren't given enough food to constitute a full meal. 
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Jenzilla

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Re: Enough pizza?
« Reply #48 on: August 07, 2009, 03:28:17 PM »
The guests have the right to expect a meal when invited to dinner.  These guests weren't given enough food to constitute a full meal. 

It wasn't enough for them, but it was for the grandparents.

This isn't about guests being gluttons--there's a difference between a guest arbitrarily deciding that they wanted a second steak, versus all the guests leaving hungry because there simply wasn't enough food.

But that's my point, who gets to decide what's enough? If I invite over people who would be able to eat two steaks each, am I really expected to serve that much steak?

marcel

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Re: Enough pizza?
« Reply #49 on: August 07, 2009, 03:32:19 PM »
I'm in the 'not-quite-enough' camp.   (But I don't think the servings were unreasonably small, just not completely satisfying)

The pizza I have in my freezer has thinnish crust and is 18.75 oz (531g) and is 12 inches across. 

Wow, I looked at the supermarket they shop at's website, the cheese feast weighs 299 grammes, and the pepperoni (which I think is what the meat one was) is 372 grammes. A quick look through the site suggests not many thin base 12 in pizzas are over 400g.  I did find a Pizza Express Sloppy Guiseppe at 630g, but they tend to be bigger pizzas.

Marcel, as Madzoy said, I am in the UK.  I don't know how much pizzas tend to weigh in the Netherlands, but hope the above gives you an idea!

Amanda, I only had 1 piece so the boys had more and thought about not having any, but if I hadn't had any, I'd have got a bad headache... next time we go there I'll remember to eat a couple of crackers or something first so I don't run that risk  ;)
That would be approximately the same size as frozen pizzas in the Netherlands, and you would have to count on half a pizza per person, As I stated I would have eaten one of those alone.
I have to get some clarification here - are those of you saying it wasn't enough food really saying that the guests are the ones who get to decide what qualifies as enough food? What about the concept of accepting what you're offered?

Sure, it'd be nice to have more than enough food, but this seems at odds with past opinions that the hosts get to make the decision of what to serve. I'm a little uncomfortable with the idea that the grandparents did something wrong here.
I think what the people here are missing is that good etiquette comes from 2 sides, there is hosting etiquette and there is guest etiquette. Every dinner there are both etiquette's working.

As several persons have said it is good etiquette to accept what you are offered. That is guest etiquette.  If you go back and read the OP you will see that she did accept and did not complain to the PIL about lack of food. So the guests etiquette was correct.

On the other hand the host needs to provide adequate food for the situation. That is host etiquette. In this case the host did not manage to comply to that rule of etiquette. I will assume this was cluelessness and not intentional, but cluelessness does not excuse bad etiquette, even if it does make it easier to forgive it.
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Red1979

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Re: Enough pizza?
« Reply #50 on: August 07, 2009, 03:39:16 PM »
The guests have the right to expect a meal when invited to dinner.  These guests weren't given enough food to constitute a full meal. 

It wasn't enough for them, but it was for the grandparents.

This isn't about guests being gluttons--there's a difference between a guest arbitrarily deciding that they wanted a second steak, versus all the guests leaving hungry because there simply wasn't enough food.

But that's my point, who gets to decide what's enough? If I invite over people who would be able to eat two steaks each, am I really expected to serve that much steak?

Again--its situational--so you have to describe a situation and then you'll get an answer.

In this case, all the invited guests were hungry and didn't have enough to eat.  Regardless of how much the hosts eat (and we don't know if they had a meal after or before) all of their guests were left hungry so that clearly shows a lack of food.  Most people wouldn't consider what was served as adequate for the guests in attendance.  Once you factor in the portion removed for the uninvited guest (which was inappropriate to do) it became even more sparse.

It's also stated that the grandmother was dieting.  Just because a host is on a restricted diet, does not mean they should be feeding their guests inadequate portions.  My boyfriend eats a startling amount--he's over 6 feet, works out all the time and eats so much more than I could ever.  If I'm making dinner for us, I don't give him the exact same amount I have.  And if he's still hungry I offer him more food.  These grandparents should at least be aware of the appetites of those they have invited over.  I think if they'd put a little thought into it they would have realized their error.

The grandparents were poor hosts--whether intentionally or unintentionally.  If they didn't realize they were shorting their guests than I'd give them a pass on being rude--however, the food put aside for the nephew was a rude gesture.   You don't take food away from invited guests (when you have such a tight menu) to accomodate an uninvited one who isn't even in attendance yet.
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VorFemme

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Re: Enough pizza?
« Reply #51 on: August 07, 2009, 03:44:18 PM »
There is a common issue with some older people, as their appetites shrink - they assume that everyone else is happy to eat the same amount of food that they are eating.  It sometimes happens with people on a diet due to medical issues (low protein, low fat, etc.) - they have become so accustomed to eating "their way" that they don't think about guests with different metabolic requirements.

Growing teenagers can and will rival locusts when going through a house looking for food - I think it was Erma Bombeck (might have been someone else) writing a column about coming home from the store with $300 worth of food (1980s not 2009), including chocolates and nuts for a bridge party the next day.  Her teenager and a couple of visiting friends (three or four teenagers) offered to "help" her empty the car and take things into the kitchen for her.

When she went to put up the food, ALL the bridge snacks and almost anything else that could be eaten without preparation (cookies, chips, apples & other things for school lunches) were GONE.  She had to run out and spend more money on snacks for the bridge party!   Possibly more food for school lunches, I don't recall.

THOSE she brought inside herself and put away without any "help" from the locusts in blue jeans.............
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GirlyGirl

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Re: Enough pizza?
« Reply #52 on: August 07, 2009, 03:55:03 PM »
My grandmother serves meals consisting of half of a lunchmeat sandwich per person (lettuce leaf, one slice meat, one slice cheese).  She expected my sister to then share that with her three children (ages 1, 3, and 4).  There may have also been salad with no dressing.  I don't eat there, so I haven't experienced this feast myself.

shhh its me

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Re: Enough pizza?
« Reply #53 on: August 07, 2009, 03:59:46 PM »
  I'd like to note that the portion size is often dictated not on how much an average person normally eats but on the amount of calories especially with preprepared "junk food " those portions can be ridiculously small "5 potato chips anyone?"

those frozen pizzas are not very filling even for 4 adults 1 teen 1 child  2 mediums salad and desert even on paper it sounds like the smallest possible amount of food to constitute a meal once . 2 slices of pizza cup of lite salad small dessert is a small meal. you add nephew its too little even on paper.

While you don't have to fill all your guest to busting if everyone needs a full meal right after you dinner you under-served by alot, if its intentional then its rude if you just forgot not everyone is on the diet your on then is clueless.

not pizza example if your serving cocktails and appetizers its 4-6 per person per hour for 4 hours if you decide on 4 lite appetizers per person per hour it may met the minimum on paper but you guests will probable be very hungry, not the best host.  If you drop it down to 2 lite appetizers per person per hour you  you have crossed into rude host territory.   If you plan 6 per person per hour 3 of them hearty  then your controlling the amount you serve well within good hosting.

« Last Edit: August 07, 2009, 04:02:59 PM by Merry Mrs Martin »

TeraNova15

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Re: Enough pizza?
« Reply #54 on: August 07, 2009, 04:03:40 PM »
There is a common issue with some older people, as their appetites shrink - they assume that everyone else is happy to eat the same amount of food that they are eating. It sometimes happens with people on a diet due to medical issues (low protein, low fat, etc.) - they have become so accustomed to eating "their way" that they don't think about guests with different metabolic requirements.

I think this is the most likely reason there wasn't enough food. The hosts made an honest mistake. I also think the reason they pulled aside some pizza for the nephew was because they thought that there was "more than enough" based on their eating habits.

Two slices of pizza may be enough to satiate PIL, but not enough to satiate a teenage boy. There is a distinct difference between guests being upset because there wasn't enough food to satisfy their gluttony and and guests being upset when there isn't enough food to actually satiate hunger. When hosting, its always better to error on the side of caution and get at least a little more food then you actually think you will need.

To answer Jenzilla's steak question...personally...if I **knew** I was hosting a party for people who could eat up to 2 steaks in a sitting I would buy 2 steaks for everyone if budget allowed. If I budget didn't allow I would be sure to provide ample side dishes, munchies, and other foodstuffs to make sure my guests don't leave hungry.

artk2002

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Re: Enough pizza?
« Reply #55 on: August 07, 2009, 04:04:45 PM »
The guests have the right to expect a meal when invited to dinner.  These guests weren't given enough food to constitute a full meal. 

It wasn't enough for them, but it was for the grandparents.

So?  If they only want to serve enough for themselves, then they're going to have people declining invitations.  Hosting isn't about what your needs are, it's about your guest's needs are.

Quote
This isn't about guests being gluttons--there's a difference between a guest arbitrarily deciding that they wanted a second steak, versus all the guests leaving hungry because there simply wasn't enough food.

But that's my point, who gets to decide what's enough? If I invite over people who would be able to eat two steaks each, am I really expected to serve that much steak?

First off, there's a difference between serving extra and serving enough -- you're trying to merge those two ideas together.  A second steak (assuming that they are around 8-12oz) would be extra, even if that's what the guest wants.  What we're talking about in this thread is serving insufficient food.  Not enough to feed an average person.  The guest does get to decide what's enough.  They can't complain about it at the time, but they're more than free to make that decision and then use that information to decide not to be a guest again.

What I'm reading from your post is that guests should take what they're served and be happy about it.  That the guests are somehow wrong to feel under-nourished.  That they don't have a right to have an opinion about the quality or quantity of food they're served.
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Jenzilla

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Re: Enough pizza?
« Reply #56 on: August 07, 2009, 04:06:55 PM »
As several persons have said it is good etiquette to accept what you are offered. That is guest etiquette.  If you go back and read the OP you will see that she did accept and did not complain to the PIL about lack of food. So the guests etiquette was correct.

On the other hand the host needs to provide adequate food for the situation. That is host etiquette. In this case the host did not manage to comply to that rule of etiquette. I will assume this was cluelessness and not intentional, but cluelessness does not excuse bad etiquette, even if it does make it easier to forgive it.

Okay, that's a good summation.

I still think it's a little much for anyone to label the grandparents rude, like I said before, salad plus pizza plus dessert certainly sounds on paper like it should be enough. I guess I just think they should be cut some slack for making a mistake, I think they're being judged a little harshly here.

Jenzilla

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Re: Enough pizza?
« Reply #57 on: August 07, 2009, 04:08:52 PM »
The guests have the right to expect a meal when invited to dinner.  These guests weren't given enough food to constitute a full meal. 

It wasn't enough for them, but it was for the grandparents.

So?  If they only want to serve enough for themselves, then they're going to have people declining invitations.  Hosting isn't about what your needs are, it's about your guest's needs are.


See, this is what's getting me - you'd stop going to visit your grandparents because they don't feed you enough?
« Last Edit: August 07, 2009, 04:10:32 PM by Jenzilla »

RainhaDoTexugo

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Re: Enough pizza?
« Reply #58 on: August 07, 2009, 04:16:38 PM »
The guests have the right to expect a meal when invited to dinner.  These guests weren't given enough food to constitute a full meal. 

It wasn't enough for them, but it was for the grandparents.

So?  If they only want to serve enough for themselves, then they're going to have people declining invitations.  Hosting isn't about what your needs are, it's about your guest's needs are.


See, this is what's getting me - you'd stop going to visit your grandparents because they don't feed you enough?

You don't stop visiting your grandparents, but you might stop visiting them at mealtimes.  And I'd assume that if this is how they fed the OP, this is how they'd feed other guests.  And other guests may well stop visiting.

I agree, two slices of frozen pizza per person just isn't enough.  And even if it was, the OP only got one slice.  So, even if two slices is a full serving (which I don't think is true), the OP only got half a serving.  Part of being a host is making sure your guests are fed properly, or hosting at a time of day when a meal isn't required. 

If I had a friend who I knew could eat two steaks, I'd either provide two steaks (I can get a nice ribeye for $3.50, it won't break the bank), or I'd serve something other than steak, like pasta, that goes farther.  I'd much rather have leftovers than have someone leave my house hungry.  Either way, though, the pizza situation is more like inviting 2 people over and splitting a steak between them, and giving them some lettuce on the side.  It's just not enough.

drebay

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Re: Enough pizza?
« Reply #59 on: August 07, 2009, 04:17:39 PM »
The guests have the right to expect a meal when invited to dinner.  These guests weren't given enough food to constitute a full meal. 

It wasn't enough for them, but it was for the grandparents.

So?  If they only want to serve enough for themselves, then they're going to have people declining invitations.  Hosting isn't about what your needs are, it's about your guest's needs are.


See, this is what's getting me - you'd stop going to visit your grandparents because they don't feed you enough?

I took that people would stop acceptin invitation to dinner, not just for visits.