Author Topic: "I'm amazed/would you really do that?"  (Read 17836 times)

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MDefarge

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Re: "I'm amazed/would you really do that?"
« Reply #30 on: September 02, 2010, 01:38:02 AM »
It's a phrase. Just about anything can potentially be snarky. I have been amazed at things I thought were clearcut only to find that there has been a split and it's not as clearcut as I thought. I love the dialog and the back and forth communication that goes on.

I think asking for clarification and giving the benefit of the doubt are more important than perhaps muzzling. Just because some words may be a bit "hot" or negative to you, doesn't make it true for others. If you want to take away amazed then what about flabbergasted, boggled......etc. These are all important words of communication.

It seems like you're trying to fix something that isn't broke. I know when I first came to this forum years ago I was a real newby at disagreeing with someone and the etiquette involved. The lesson I had to learn was disagreeing is not the same as disrespecting and keeping it respectful as I disagreed. We are so varied on this forum, with so many walks of life and the advice given runs the gamut. I see the most important benefit to be the different perspective's.

I couldn't agree more with this post....really( ;))

ETA - if you (general) think a poster is being snotty by using either phrase, its probably evident in the rest of their post if they are sincere or not.   I know I said "would you really do that" in a thread not that long ago when a poster said that in a particular situation they would call the police, something I honestly considered a really big over reaction based on what the OP had written.  So yeah, I was curious if that was something they would actually do, or if it was just hyperbole.
« Last Edit: September 02, 2010, 01:41:12 AM by MDefarge »

Granny Takes a Trip

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Re: "I'm amazed/would you really do that?"
« Reply #31 on: September 02, 2010, 03:55:14 AM »
It's a phrase. Just about anything can potentially be snarky. I have been amazed at things I thought were clearcut only to find that there has been a split and it's not as clearcut as I thought. I love the dialog and the back and forth communication that goes on.

I think asking for clarification and giving the benefit of the doubt are more important than perhaps muzzling. Just because some words may be a bit "hot" or negative to you, doesn't make it true for others. If you want to take away amazed then what about flabbergasted, boggled......etc. These are all important words of communication.

It seems like you're trying to fix something that isn't broke. I know when I first came to this forum years ago I was a real newby at disagreeing with someone and the etiquette involved. The lesson I had to learn was disagreeing is not the same as disrespecting and keeping it respectful as I disagreed. We are so varied on this forum, with so many walks of life and the advice given runs the gamut. I see the most important benefit to be the different perspective's.

I couldn't agree more with this post....really( ;))

ETA - if you (general) think a poster is being snotty by using either phrase, its probably evident in the rest of their post if they are sincere or not.   I know I said "would you really do that" in a thread not that long ago when a poster said that in a particular situation they would call the police, something I honestly considered a really big over reaction based on what the OP had written.  So yeah, I was curious if that was something they would actually do, or if it was just hyperbole.

I agree with both of you. Yes, the phrase can be used snarkily, but it is inappropriate to react badly to the phrase itself, and ignore the context.
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Hanna

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Re: "I'm amazed/would you really do that?"
« Reply #32 on: September 02, 2010, 05:00:58 PM »
I think people can find offensive wherever they look.
It would be a shame to try and create rules at that level of detail.
I trust the moderators to sort it out.

The moderators are not quick to get back to posters-and yes, while people can find offense wherever they look, these phrases can be used in ways that are inherently offensive.  I think rules are necessary to make sure that they are not used to be snarky rather than being dismissive about the impact they can have-this forum has split before and I'd hate to see that happen again because someone got too dismissive over someone else's feelings and shrugged it off as "people can find offense wherever they look."
That's not been my experience with moderation here.  Sure, they don't always do what each of us wants, but I find them fairly balanced and reasonable, and really quite on the ball.
Overly draconian rules about what words people can use are very likely to destroy the fabric of any forum.

I don't think a forum split is likely to happen because one person is feeling another poster was overly dismissive of their feelings.

Honestly, I'm confused about the purpose of this thread.

Lisbeth

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Re: "I'm amazed/would you really do that?"
« Reply #33 on: September 02, 2010, 10:00:01 PM »
I think people can find offensive wherever they look.
It would be a shame to try and create rules at that level of detail.
I trust the moderators to sort it out.

The moderators are not quick to get back to posters-and yes, while people can find offense wherever they look, these phrases can be used in ways that are inherently offensive.  I think rules are necessary to make sure that they are not used to be snarky rather than being dismissive about the impact they can have-this forum has split before and I'd hate to see that happen again because someone got too dismissive over someone else's feelings and shrugged it off as "people can find offense wherever they look."
That's not been my experience with moderation here.  Sure, they don't always do what each of us wants, but I find them fairly balanced and reasonable, and really quite on the ball.
Overly draconian rules about what words people can use are very likely to destroy the fabric of any forum.

I don't think a forum split is likely to happen because one person is feeling another poster was overly dismissive of their feelings.

Honestly, I'm confused about the purpose of this thread.

The purpose of this thread is stated in the OP.  I'm sorry if it wasn't clear enough, but it is to debate the issue of whether or not etiquette and this forum condone the use of these phrases as you are using them.
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Giggity

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Re: "I'm amazed/would you really do that?"
« Reply #34 on: September 02, 2010, 10:05:56 PM »
The moderators are not quick to get back to posters

I dunno about that ... I reported the weird pr0n thread about 7 this morning, and it was gone in seconds.  ;D
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Peggy Gus

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Re: "I'm amazed/would you really do that?"
« Reply #35 on: September 02, 2010, 10:44:18 PM »
The moderators are not quick to get back to posters

I dunno about that ... I reported the weird pr0n thread about 7 this morning, and it was gone in seconds.  ;D

It actually took about 5 min, when I first saw it had 8 reads, and right about the time it was removed I think I saw 89 reads.  ;D

shhh its me

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Re: "I'm amazed/would you really do that?"
« Reply #36 on: September 03, 2010, 01:03:44 AM »
The moderators are not quick to get back to posters

I dunno about that ... I reported the weird pr0n thread about 7 this morning, and it was gone in seconds.  ;D

It actually took about 5 min, when I first saw it had 8 reads, and right about the time it was removed I think I saw 89 reads.  ;D

I am amazed .....................




I slept through a p0rn thread *faceplam*

In general I don't think it's rude "I'm amazed " not p0rn threads, I do think it on the overly combative side of productive debate.   It can be when a few posters say " I buy widgets" are answered with  " I am shocked and amazed you buy widgets . Widgets are evil things made by evil people for evil people"  .  "I don't think widgets are an appropriate topic" or "No, widgets are unacceptable by etiquette" would be acceptable to me, anyone else?

Lisbeth

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Re: "I'm amazed/would you really do that?"
« Reply #37 on: September 03, 2010, 07:21:37 AM »
The moderators are not quick to get back to posters

I dunno about that ... I reported the weird pr0n thread about 7 this morning, and it was gone in seconds.  ;D

It actually took about 5 min, when I first saw it had 8 reads, and right about the time it was removed I think I saw 89 reads.  ;D

The moderators will respond to those kinds of matters, and they do it by shutting down threads without explanation.

When it comes to matters that are more subtle, I think they are much slower to respond and sometimes don't do it at all.  They have expressed the preference that the forum be self-policing, and are not quick to step in about things like the question in the OP.
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MDefarge

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Re: "I'm amazed/would you really do that?"
« Reply #38 on: September 03, 2010, 08:26:29 AM »
The moderators are not quick to get back to posters

I dunno about that ... I reported the weird pr0n thread about 7 this morning, and it was gone in seconds.  ;D

It actually took about 5 min, when I first saw it had 8 reads, and right about the time it was removed I think I saw 89 reads.  ;D

The moderators will respond to those kinds of matters, and they do it by shutting down threads without explanation.

When it comes to matters that are more subtle, I think they are much slower to respond and sometimes don't do it at all.  They have expressed the preference that the forum be self-policing, and are not quick to step in about things like the question in the OP.

That tells me they don't think its that big of a deal then.

NOVA Lady

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Re: "I'm amazed/would you really do that?"
« Reply #39 on: September 03, 2010, 09:06:12 AM »
Unless there is something else in the context of a post that seems like the poster is being dismissive, snarky or whatever...I think its often a valid question.

Sometimes people on this board give advice or make a suggestion that has me sitting there gap mouthed scratching my head. I do not thin its wrong to express that feeling. If someone can express agreement, and someone else can express disagreement, why can someone not express surprise/shock/etc?

I can see where it would be rude:

OP: Do I need to say please after asking for something?
P: I CANNOT believe someone would think you wouldn't!!! Are you serious??? I am dumbfounded.

That to me is rude, and I think the right thing to do is to report it, as it comes off as a personal attack.

However this type of thing:

OP: My mom stays too long when visiting my new baby, how should I handle this?
P: You should cut her off right now. No more contact, she does not deserve to see her grandchild. She is toxic!!!
PP: Are you serious? I am amazed at that sentiment. I could never imagining cutting off your own mother for this!

I don't think thats rude. I think thats a legitimate reaction to an OTT suggestion.


The debate here in this thread makes it obvious that there is no agreement on whether this is rude or not, so I don't see how self-policing comes in here. I am not going to police something I don't think is rude, and honestly would resent someone else trying to police something on which there is much disagreement on the rudeness factor.

I think we all have peeves on the board, and need to realize that we cannot make others conform to our posting preferences as long as they are within the rules.

I wholly disagree with you regarding the moderation of this board. I think it is fantastic, and in areas where it actually IS an issue (as opposed to something like this, which seems more like context and personal preference) they are very quick about acting. Its just that not everything one doesn't like about the board does require moderation,.....so if a response is expected for a non-rule issue on the board I am not sure that its top priority of even really needed.

Lisbeth

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Re: "I'm amazed/would you really do that?"
« Reply #40 on: September 03, 2010, 10:14:11 AM »
That's just it...moderators are often not quick to get back to posters, so in that interim, it's not clear if they are trying to decide if something needs to be dealt with, have other things going on in their lives that they are giving higher priority to, or have already decided that it's no big deal.

So, the question here is, Are responses like that rude, especially when there is some degree of blur about the use of these phrases.  Your second example could be perceived as very similar to the first, in fact with no difference, and there could even be a question about what positive contribution stating one is "amazed, etc." makes to the discussion.
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NOVA Lady

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Re: "I'm amazed/would you really do that?"
« Reply #41 on: September 03, 2010, 10:18:06 AM »
That's just it...moderators are often not quick to get back to posters, so in that interim, it's not clear if they are trying to decide if something needs to be dealt with, have other things going on in their lives that they are giving higher priority to, or have already decided that it's no big deal.

So, the question here is, Are responses like that rude, especially when there is some degree of blur about the use of these phrases.  Your second example could be perceived as very similar to the first, in fact with no difference, and there could even be a question about what positive contribution stating one is "amazed, etc." makes to the discussion.

I think then you can send a message to a mod and wait for a reply.... if a reply never comes, I would take that as my answer.

As to the question in your second paragraph... no I do not think it is always rude. Like so many things, it can be rude but it is not automatically so. I also see a vast difference between my two examples...so perhaps this is the heart of the disagreement.

Are you suggesting that everyone stop using the phrase because you think it's rude?

Lisbeth

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Re: "I'm amazed/would you really do that?"
« Reply #42 on: September 03, 2010, 10:21:21 AM »
That's just it...moderators are often not quick to get back to posters, so in that interim, it's not clear if they are trying to decide if something needs to be dealt with, have other things going on in their lives that they are giving higher priority to, or have already decided that it's no big deal.

So, the question here is, Are responses like that rude, especially when there is some degree of blur about the use of these phrases.  Your second example could be perceived as very similar to the first, in fact with no difference, and there could even be a question about what positive contribution stating one is "amazed, etc." makes to the discussion.

I think then you can send a message to a mod and wait for a reply.... if a reply never comes, I would take that as my answer.

As to the question in your second paragraph... no I do not think it is always rude. Like so many things, it can be rude but it is not automatically so. I also see a vast difference between my two examples...so perhaps this is the heart of the disagreement.

Are you suggesting that everyone stop using the phrase because you think it's rude?

No, I'm not making that suggestion...just wondering about the use.  Sometimes it can seem self-righteous and rather b!tchy, other times not.
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Hanna

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Re: "I'm amazed/would you really do that?"
« Reply #43 on: September 03, 2010, 12:35:41 PM »
I think people can find offensive wherever they look.
It would be a shame to try and create rules at that level of detail.
I trust the moderators to sort it out.

The moderators are not quick to get back to posters-and yes, while people can find offense wherever they look, these phrases can be used in ways that are inherently offensive.  I think rules are necessary to make sure that they are not used to be snarky rather than being dismissive about the impact they can have-this forum has split before and I'd hate to see that happen again because someone got too dismissive over someone else's feelings and shrugged it off as "people can find offense wherever they look."
That's not been my experience with moderation here.  Sure, they don't always do what each of us wants, but I find them fairly balanced and reasonable, and really quite on the ball.
Overly draconian rules about what words people can use are very likely to destroy the fabric of any forum.

I don't think a forum split is likely to happen because one person is feeling another poster was overly dismissive of their feelings.

Honestly, I'm confused about the purpose of this thread.

The purpose of this thread is stated in the OP.  I'm sorry if it wasn't clear enough, but it is to debate the issue of whether or not etiquette and this forum condone the use of these phrases as you are using them.
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Hanna

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Re: "I'm amazed/would you really do that?"
« Reply #44 on: September 03, 2010, 12:37:59 PM »
That's just it...moderators are often not quick to get back to posters, so in that interim, it's not clear if they are trying to decide if something needs to be dealt with, have other things going on in their lives that they are giving higher priority to, or have already decided that it's no big deal.

So, the question here is, Are responses like that rude, especially when there is some degree of blur about the use of these phrases.  Your second example could be perceived as very similar to the first, in fact with no difference, and there could even be a question about what positive contribution stating one is "amazed, etc." makes to the discussion.

I think then you can send a message to a mod and wait for a reply.... if a reply never comes, I would take that as my answer.

As to the question in your second paragraph... no I do not think it is always rude. Like so many things, it can be rude but it is not automatically so. I also see a vast difference between my two examples...so perhaps this is the heart of the disagreement.

Are you suggesting that everyone stop using the phrase because you think it's rude?

No, I'm not making that suggestion...just wondering about the use.  Sometimes it can seem self-righteous and rather b!tchy, other times not.
So you want to police people posting in a way that you feel is uh, the word you used above to get around the filter?

I think the mods are ignoring reports of things that they don't feel are a problem.
If it bothers you that they don't agree with your assessment, that's unfortunate but it doesn't mean they are wrong.