Etiquette School is in session! > "Have you tried the bean dip?"

Didn't really want to bean dip...

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Iris:
Reading the thread about ethical eating choices I was reminded of something that happened to me at a social gathering recently...

People were talking about food related issues - I can't even remember the specific details now, it was one of those nothing conversations that you have when you are at a gathering with people you don't know well. Someone started talking about the price of eggs (literally!) and I mentioned in passing that I tend to buy free range eggs which are a bit more expensive anyway.

Well, one of the other guests was clearly bothered by this and took it upon herself to educate me about the errors of my foolish, naive ways. Didn't I know that the farms weren't really as nice as they seem?! It's just dust and stuff anyway! And the eggs don't taste any better! And the chickens have loads of room in battery cages and they can roost! They don't get to roost on free range farms and it's really cruel! And so on. She was quite assertive about it.

I dealt with it by saying that since I have a couple of chickens in the backyard I rarely have to actually buy eggs, and changed the topic. Twice, before I was successful in fact.

But I really, really didn't want to. Much of what she said was errant nonsense and it troubles me that she's spouting such ridiculous things at people as 'facts' and possibly talking them into buying battery eggs. I don't care what her choices are, they're hers, but she was really trying to guilt me into changing my buying habits and I don't think she should be doing that. I WANTED to say [you can ignore this bit and still understand the story]

1. Of course there's no grass. Chickens kill grass when they scratch it up to get at the good stuff underneath. That's what they do. I have 2 hens in a 30 square metre yard and they killed every blade of grass in a month (luckily there are native grasses that they just pick the seeds off). There's no way a farm could maintain a grassy field for them. They do, under the regulations of our country have to (by law) have access to palatable vegetation at all times.
2. I don't buy the eggs because they taste better. I buy them because it's an ethical choice I have made. Fine if she has made a different one, but don't treat me like I'm a fool.
3. There is not 'loads' of room in a battery cage. There was a large chicken farm and processing plant near where I went to high school and many students worked there. It's not a pleasant environment for an animal by any means. If she chooses to buy the eggs, again, so be it. But this was a just plain wrong statement. Also, the hens at free range farms must have access to perches as well as dry nesting material (by law) in our country.

[/ignorable bit]

So, is there any way to politely correct blatantly incorrect facts without starting an argument? Or should I just stick to following the technique I used?

Shopaholic:
I think you could have pointed all of those facts out.
An argument isn't necessarily a fight. An argument could also be a perfectly polite and social discussion where two people do not agree, and discuss their points.

In this case, though, you do not know the people you were talking with very well and you did not know how they would react. Some people automatically get defensive and then the argument heats up very quickly. So maybe in this case you were right not to open a controversial subject, but in general I see no reason to just shut up about facts.

I do think that we all do it when we feel that a discussion could get out of hand, or we just don't have the strength to argue. I know that when my DH and his brothers start talking about the defense budget, I just talk to my SILs about shoes. I will never have the stamina and desire to argue a single point for two hours. (My ILs once argued over 45 minutes over what makes up a garden salad, in a perfectly polite and rational manner. Some people just like to argue.)

Outdoor Girl:
I think you have to weigh whether or not is is a 'Don't engage the crazy' situation or a situation where you can have a discussion with opposing views.

In your case, I think you did the right thing as I think it was more of the former than the latter.

mechtilde:
You have every right to stand up for what you believe in.

Iris:

--- Quote from: basodie on January 19, 2011, 02:52:18 PM ---I agree it would be fine to respond. It sounds like she escalated things by providing arguments against it, so she should expect a possible response. Conversely you should expect contrary opinions (meaning like "oh I never buy that kind," not like a tirade) when bringing up controversial topics.

--- End quote ---

I wasn't bringing it up, just continuing what had been a fairly friendly conversation. I would have been totally fine if she had said that she bought a different kind. I would even have been totally fine with a "Really?" and a raised eyebrow. Or even an "I think that's a bad idea, you should research the conditions". But not with a patronising lecture on why I should be making her choice. I really hate being patronised (doesn't everyone?) and to be patronised by someone who is making factual errors, not just having a different opinion is particularly galling.

She wasn't really 'crazy' as such although part of the reason I backed off was in case she might be. But a big part of it was because I couldn't think of a way to make my points without embarrassing her, because she had been so sure of her 'facts'. And of course if someone feels embarrassed it just makes them crazy much of the time...

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