Author Topic: Was Christina Aguilera rude?  (Read 15625 times)

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Bibliophile

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Re: Was Christina Aguilera rude?
« Reply #30 on: February 07, 2011, 02:17:12 PM »
Frankly, I'm a little bit insulted by incompetency of any kind. This is her profession. As a prfoessional singer, I would expect that forgetting the lyrics of the song indicates some level of incompetency. If she took the risk of making some changes to the song - that's fine. I've already stated that I've come to expect such things from performers nowadays. All I have to add to the conversation is that it's possible that her focus on the little changes she made might have distracted her form singing the lyrics correctly and I have to wonder if that didn't affect her performance.

Where do you draw the line as to what would be "incompetent"?  Is it just because she's a professional singer?  So, for instance, had it been a girl from a high school choir singing and she made a mistake, that would be ok?  A pro ball player misses an "easy" pass - is that insulting/rude?  A pro golfer misses an "easy" put - insulting/rude?

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Yvaine

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Re: Was Christina Aguilera rude?
« Reply #31 on: February 07, 2011, 02:22:44 PM »
Frankly, I'm a little bit insulted by incompetency of any kind. This is her profession. As a prfoessional singer, I would expect that forgetting the lyrics of the song indicates some level of incompetency. If she took the risk of making some changes to the song - that's fine. I've already stated that I've come to expect such things from performers nowadays. All I have to add to the conversation is that it's possible that her focus on the little changes she made might have distracted her form singing the lyrics correctly and I have to wonder if that didn't affect her performance.

Where do you draw the line as to what would be "incompetent"?  Is it just because she's a professional singer?  So, for instance, had it been a girl from a high school choir singing and she made a mistake, that would be ok?  A pro ball player misses an "easy" pass - is that insulting/rude?  A pro golfer misses an "easy" put - insulting/rude?

Pod. She messed up. Insulting/rude would be intentionally mocking it i.e. Roseanne. This was an honest mistake.

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Re: Was Christina Aguilera rude?
« Reply #32 on: February 07, 2011, 02:31:49 PM »

 Most people have enough sense to realize that sometimes, nerves just take over, even in the most polished performers, and mistakes happen. I would hate to think someone was so insulted by my mistake that they would call me rude.  


I get from this statement that you don't think I have enough sense to realize that she is human and she made a mistake.

I have already said several times that I have not been in her shoes and don't know how I would have handled it. I know it takes a great deal of courage to stand up in front of so many people and sing a song that's so difficult to sing.

She's supposed to be a professional. As a professional performer, she's supposed to be able to handle the pressure. It's a difficult song - yes. She was no doubt offered a significant amount of money to do the job right. She didn't do it right. In the process, she flubbed our National Anthem, which is a deeply personal song to some of us.

Frankly, I'm a little bit insulted by incompetency of any kind. This is her profession. As a prfoessional singer, I would expect that forgetting the lyrics of the song indicates some level of incompetency. If she took the risk of making some changes to the song - that's fine. I've already stated that I've come to expect such things from performers nowadays. All I have to add to the conversation is that it's possible that her focus on the little changes she made might have distracted her form singing the lyrics correctly and I have to wonder if that didn't affect her performance.

If that affected her performance, then, yes, I think she was rude. If it didn't, then obviously, I would have a hard time calling her rude. I think my original post deferred to other people on this board because I don't have the professional experience to back up my personal feelings.

It certainly doesn't mean I don't the sense to realize that people make mistakes.



I think 'incompetent' is much too strong a word to use in this context. She forgot one line, tried to minimize the damage by grabbing some other words to sing instead. She didn't start jumping up and down, run off stage and blame the drummer à la Simpson, SNL. The fact that she kept singing and got the rest of the song right speaks to her professionalism; show must go on.

Nurvingiel

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Re: Was Christina Aguilera rude?
« Reply #33 on: February 07, 2011, 02:34:44 PM »
She screwed up big-time, but she did it honestly. How she reacted was the best possible way to deal with the situation - carry on singing the best you can without pausing or restarting.

I really don't think this was rude.

And while I find it very annoying when people take liberties with anthems, adding silly trills and extra notes, extra long notes etc. all over the place, I don't find this rude or disrespectful. I don't think she added extra things out of disrespect.
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hyzenthlay

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Re: Was Christina Aguilera rude?
« Reply #34 on: February 07, 2011, 02:37:49 PM »
Where do you draw the line as to what would be "incompetent"?  Is it just because she's a professional singer?  So, for instance, had it been a girl from a high school choir singing and she made a mistake, that would be ok?  A pro ball player misses an "easy" pass - is that insulting/rude?  A pro golfer misses an "easy" put - insulting/rude?

Pod. She messed up. Insulting/rude would be intentionally mocking it i.e. Roseanne. This was an honest mistake.
[/quote]

I think a better comparison would be that a pro-ball player misses a difficult pass when he had an easy one available. Or fails to make the pass and tries for a shot himself. And yes, I think you'd find a number of people would blame them if it happened frequently.

(And just to get the record straight I'm not emotionally damaged about her flub or anything. But I do think she was sloppy and too busy making the song hers to get the lyrics right.)

Lynnv

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Re: Was Christina Aguilera rude?
« Reply #35 on: February 07, 2011, 02:38:20 PM »
Frankly, I'm a little bit insulted by incompetency of any kind. This is her profession. As a prfoessional singer, I would expect that forgetting the lyrics of the song indicates some level of incompetency. If she took the risk of making some changes to the song - that's fine. I've already stated that I've come to expect such things from performers nowadays. All I have to add to the conversation is that it's possible that her focus on the little changes she made might have distracted her form singing the lyrics correctly and I have to wonder if that didn't affect her performance.

Where do you draw the line as to what would be "incompetent"?  Is it just because she's a professional singer?  So, for instance, had it been a girl from a high school choir singing and she made a mistake, that would be ok?  A pro ball player misses an "easy" pass - is that insulting/rude?  A pro golfer misses an "easy" put - insulting/rude?

Pod. She messed up. Insulting/rude would be intentionally mocking it i.e. Roseanne. This was an honest mistake.

Pod.  I am not a fan of changing the anthem (with a huge exception for Jimi's version), nor do I really care for Christina Aguilera's music in general.  

But making a mistake in a performance happens-regardless of how professional you are (or aren't).  It indicates an error, not incompetence.  I have made professional mistakes, despite being one of the best people in the company at what I did.  I was wrong, not incompetent.  Incompetence requires, IMO, more of a pattern than one error shows.  

Not that this wasn't a huge flub-it certainly was.  But it isn't rude to make an error, as long as you are willing to admit it (it sounds like she was) and are willing to apologize (it sounds like she did).  She didn't pull an Axl and run off stage in a huff, nor did she try to claim she didn't make a mistake at all.  She tried to carry on with the show-and isn't that one of the axioms of show biz?  That 'the show must go on.'  
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Yvaine

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Re: Was Christina Aguilera rude?
« Reply #36 on: February 07, 2011, 02:44:18 PM »
She screwed up big-time, but she did it honestly. How she reacted was the best possible way to deal with the situation - carry on singing the best you can without pausing or restarting.

I really don't think this was rude.

And while I find it very annoying when people take liberties with anthems, adding silly trills and extra notes, extra long notes etc. all over the place, I don't find this rude or disrespectful. I don't think she added extra things out of disrespect.

Pod. Aguilera is not the first to stylize the anthem; Whitney Houston's version from 1984 (edit: I had the date wrong) is stylized and is beloved by many. My little sister's best friend stylized the anthem at their graduation. It's not inherently disrespectful--and seeing as Aguilera usually sings with a lot of ornamentation anyway, I doubt it contributed to the mistake. That's the way she always sings. She just messed up this time.
« Last Edit: February 07, 2011, 02:50:53 PM by Yvaine »

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Re: Was Christina Aguilera rude?
« Reply #37 on: February 07, 2011, 02:46:59 PM »

 Most people have enough sense to realize that sometimes, nerves just take over, even in the most polished performers, and mistakes happen. I would hate to think someone was so insulted by my mistake that they would call me rude.  


She's supposed to be a professional. As a professional performer, she's supposed to be able to handle the pressure. It's a difficult song - yes. She was no doubt offered a significant amount of money to do the job right. She didn't do it right. In the process, she flubbed our National Anthem, which is a deeply personal song to some of us.


Actually, I think she handled the pressure quite well to be honest. Any amateur would have likely had a bit of a break down for making a mistake like that on national TV. She didn't. She realized her mistake, continued on while trying to correct it, and then immediatly apologized for it in a mature and graceful fashion.  
I realize the National Anthem is a very important and personal song for you, and it is for me also, but are you really going to judge her this harshly for it? Would you judge an amateur performer this harshly for making the same mistake?
 Just because she is a professional doesn't mean she isn't entitled to make a mistake occasionally. Professionals aren't robots. Why do we as a society put professional celebs up on these pedestals of perfection and then tear them down when they don't meet our unreasonable and demanding expectations of perfection?


 Most people have enough sense to realize that sometimes, nerves just take over, even in the most polished performers, and mistakes happen. I would hate to think someone was so insulted by my mistake that they would call me rude.  


I get from this statement that you don't think I have enough sense to realize that she is human and she made a mistake.

Frankly, I'm a little bit insulted by incompetency of any kind. This is her profession. As a professional singer, I would expect that forgetting the lyrics of the song indicates some level of incompetency.

1st bolded-
Sorry. It doesn't make sense to say you are reasonable enough to realize she is human and makes mistakes in one sentence then call her incompetent in the next for making that mistake.

2nd bolded-
By your own statement, I have to assume that you are also implying that *I* am incompetent because I flubbed our National Anthem as well.  
I am a professional theatre actor. I get paid quite a significant sum of money sometimes. But, I have made a mistake or two in my day. ON stage with a full house. So by your reasoning those mistakes wipe out my years of experience and makes me incompetent at theatre? I get paid to do my day job when not on stage and guess what, I make mistakes there too. I actually messed up a report that I have done every week for 4 years this morning. My boss didn't call me incompetent, he just asked me to fix it and be more careful next time.  

Now, if she had come on that field and blown the entire song by not getting any lyrics correct, flubbing up notes left and right, and basically making it an unrecognizable mess then I would agree it was an incompetent, or in the very least, an unrehearsed and lazy performance. In this case though, I think it was simply a performer getting caught up in the moment and losing their words and NOT incompetency that caused her flub and I think she's being judged a little harshly for it.  

All I have to add to the conversation is that it's possible that her focus on the little changes she made might have distracted her form singing the lyrics correctly and I have to wonder if that didn't affect her performance.

If that affected her performance, then, yes, I think she was rude. If it didn't, then obviously, I would have a hard time calling her rude. I think my original post deferred to other people on this board because I don't have the professional experience to back up my personal feelings.



Now that is very possible. But again, I don't think it's incompetance at play here, nor disrespect for what she was singing. At most I would call it "loss of focus".


And a few warbles wouldn't throw me, but she was all over the place with her rendition. That's not a extra she can't avoid, that's a stylistic choice.

Then lets talk about the "stylist choice" that was Jimi Hendrix's rendition of the National Anthem. It's almost unrecognizable as the National Anthem IMO. If we're gonna get all hot and bothered about people "changing" the anthem (that's very personal and important to some people) to stylize it, his rendition is the perfect case for that. CA's warbles are not the same thing. At least I could recognize what it was CA was singing as the National Anthem. And let's be real here, if she hadn't added those warbles, people would be complaining about how it was "boring" because that's what she's known for. She sorta can't win in this situation I'm afraid.
« Last Edit: February 07, 2011, 02:56:28 PM by Sabbyfrog2 »

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Re: Was Christina Aguilera rude?
« Reply #38 on: February 07, 2011, 02:47:41 PM »
[...] if you book Christina Aguilera, you know you're going to get that CA style of singing.

She screwed up big-time, but she did it honestly. How she reacted was the best possible way to deal with the situation - carry on singing the best you can without pausing or restarting.

POD to both the above, who put it very well.

Aguilera is not the first to stylize the anthem; Whitney Houston's version from 1984 is stylized and is beloved by many. My little sister's best friend stylized the anthem at their graduation. It's not inherently disrespectful--and seeing as Aguilera usually sings with a lot of ornamentation anyway, I doubt it contributed to the mistake. That's the way she always sings. She just messed up this time.

Exactly: a bit of warbling isn't exactly doing a Sex Pistols number on the anthem. ;)
« Last Edit: February 07, 2011, 02:49:27 PM by Ferrets »

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Re: Was Christina Aguilera rude?
« Reply #39 on: February 07, 2011, 02:48:40 PM »
Would it make a difference to you if she wasn't being paid?  I read this weekend that the half-time performers are not paid, I would assume the same is true of the pre-game performers.

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« Last Edit: February 07, 2011, 02:53:55 PM by Scout Finch »
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Re: Was Christina Aguilera rude?
« Reply #40 on: February 07, 2011, 03:00:50 PM »
I think I'd be sort of proud that a singer sort of lost themselves when singing the National Anthem.

Nope. When you are being paid to perform the anthem that is not the time to lose yourself in emotion. I would feel the same about someone doing a performance of religious music if it wasn't part of a religious ceremony.

I see a big difference between a performance at a local event, and one on a national stage. And between a free performance by someone doing it because they love doing it, and a paid appearance based on your professional track record.

And a few warbles wouldn't throw me, but she was all over the place with her rendition. That's not a extra she can't avoid, that's a stylistic choice.

Well I didn't see the preformance so I'll take your word on the over stylisation.  ;) But I just don't see this as disrespectful. Sometimes people go blank, lyrics and sound are different. If she had stopped half way through, well then I'd agree that the 'extras' were too much for her and that it wasn't very professional but she only forgot some words and had the presence of mind to at least subsitute them. To me this suggests that the stylistic choice did not contribute to her forgetting the words.

Coming from a country where most people can only sing the first line of their National Anthem (because it's in Irish) I still find it moving that she lost herself while singing such a difficult song. I completely agree with you that it was not the time or the place but I still find it nice.
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Re: Was Christina Aguilera rude?
« Reply #41 on: February 07, 2011, 03:22:00 PM »

 Most people have enough sense to realize that sometimes, nerves just take over, even in the most polished performers, and mistakes happen. I would hate to think someone was so insulted by my mistake that they would call me rude.  


She's supposed to be a professional. As a professional performer, she's supposed to be able to handle the pressure. It's a difficult song - yes. She was no doubt offered a significant amount of money to do the job right. She didn't do it right. In the process, she flubbed our National Anthem, which is a deeply personal song to some of us.


Actually, I think she handled the pressure quite well to be honest. Any amateur would have likely had a bit of a break down for making a mistake like that on national TV. She didn't. She realized her mistake, continued on while trying to correct it, and then immediatly apologized for it in a mature and graceful fashion.  
I realize the National Anthem is a very important and personal song for you, and it is for me also, but are you really going to judge her this harshly for it? Would you judge an amateur performer this harshly for making the same mistake?
 Just because she is a professional doesn't mean she isn't entitled to make a mistake occasionally. Professionals aren't robots. Why do we as a society put professional celebs up on these pedestals of perfection and then tear them down when they don't meet our unreasonable and demanding expectations of perfection?

 Most people have enough sense to realize that sometimes, nerves just take over, even in the most polished performers, and mistakes happen. I would hate to think someone was so insulted by my mistake that they would call me rude.  


I get from this statement that you don't think I have enough sense to realize that she is human and she made a mistake.

Frankly, I'm a little bit insulted by incompetency of any kind. This is her profession. As a professional singer, I would expect that forgetting the lyrics of the song indicates some level of incompetency.

1st bolded-
Sorry. It doesn't make sense to say you are reasonable enough to realize she is human and makes mistakes in one sentence then call her incompetent in the next for making that mistake.

2nd bolded-
By your own statement, I have to assume that you are also implying that *I* am incompetent because I flubbed our National Anthem as well.  
I am a professional theatre actor. I get paid quite a significant sum of money sometimes. But, I have made a mistake or two in my day. ON stage with a full house. So by your reasoning those mistakes wipe out my years of experience and makes me incompetent at theatre? I get paid to do my day job when not on stage and guess what, I make mistakes there too. I actually messed up a report that I have done every week for 4 years this morning. My boss didn't call me incompetent, he just asked me to fix it and be more careful next time.  

Now, if she had come on that field and blown the entire song by not getting any lyrics correct, flubbing up notes left and right, and basically making it an unrecognizable mess then I would agree it was an incompetent, or in the very least, an unrehearsed and lazy performance. In this case though, I think it was simply a performer getting caught up in the moment and losing their words and NOT incompetency that caused her flub and I think she's being judged a little harshly for it.  

All I have to add to the conversation is that it's possible that her focus on the little changes she made might have distracted her form singing the lyrics correctly and I have to wonder if that didn't affect her performance.

If that affected her performance, then, yes, I think she was rude. If it didn't, then obviously, I would have a hard time calling her rude. I think my original post deferred to other people on this board because I don't have the professional experience to back up my personal feelings.



Now that is very possible. But again, I don't think it's incompetance at play here, nor disrespect for what she was singing. At most I would call it "loss of focus".


And a few warbles wouldn't throw me, but she was all over the place with her rendition. That's not a extra she can't avoid, that's a stylistic choice.

Then lets talk about the "stylist choice" that was Jimi Hendrix's rendition of the National Anthem. It's almost unrecognizable as the National Anthem IMO. If we're gonna get all hot and bothered about people "changing" the anthem (that's very personal and important to some people) to stylize it, his rendition is the perfect case for that. CA's warbles are not the same thing. At least I could recognize what it was CA was singing as the National Anthem. And let's be real here, if she hadn't added those warbles, people would be complaining about how it was "boring" because that's what she's known for. She sorta can't win in this situation I'm afraid.

Bolded your response where I want to reply.

I don't think it is unreasonable to expect that a performer of her caliber should remember the lyrics to the song. That is my personal opinion. I have no professional experience, so maybe I am judging her too harshly (as, again, I have stated several times in my posts). I look at this in terms of components of what I view the performer's job to be. In my mind, you have to a) sing the right notes well and b) sing the lyrics correctly. I will say it again - I could be wrong. I'm sure someone will educate me if I am.

I didn't hire CA to sing at the Superbowl. From what one other poster said, she may not have been paid at all. It's not out of my pocket that she didn't do the job right. If I hired someone to sing at my wedding and they messed up the words to a song that was important to me, I'm sure this board would be blowing up telling me I should demand my money back. It's all a matter of perspective.

And I still think any degree of rudeness she could be accused of would be based on a degree of distraction caused by the extra stylizing. I can't speak to that level of distraction because I don't know what was going through her head. In the same vein that we say not all singers are self-serving and prioritize their self-promotion over integrity of the piece, there are some that do and I have no place to judge which category CA falls into. (That doesn't meant I'm accusing anyone of that - I'm simply pointing out the possibility.)

If the small likelihood of that scenario were true - that CA was more focused on promoting her style and gaining more noteriety for herself than in singing the right words, then yes, I would call her incompetent. And as I have said before, if it were an honest mistake, then I would have a hard time calling her rude. Just because she said she made an honest mistake doesn't mean it's true. Performers do occasionally lie about what happened to save face.

I will agree that Christina's explanation makes sense and that's probably what happened. It doesn't change my opinion that she should have paid attention to what she was doing.
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Yvaine

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Re: Was Christina Aguilera rude?
« Reply #42 on: February 07, 2011, 03:27:20 PM »
And as I have said before, if it were an honest mistake, then I would have a hard time calling her rude. Just because she said she made an honest mistake doesn't mean it's true. Performers do occasionally lie about what happened to save face.

I guess, from my point of view--what else would it have been, other than an honest mistake? If she were deliberately setting out to disrespect the anthem, she'd have done something much more blatant than flub a line (and wear unflattering makeup, but that's just me playing armchair fashion police). I just can't imagine it being anything other than an honest mistake.

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Re: Was Christina Aguilera rude?
« Reply #43 on: February 07, 2011, 03:35:25 PM »
And as I have said before, if it were an honest mistake, then I would have a hard time calling her rude. Just because she said she made an honest mistake doesn't mean it's true. Performers do occasionally lie about what happened to save face.

I guess, from my point of view--what else would it have been, other than an honest mistake? If she were deliberately setting out to disrespect the anthem, she'd have done something much more blatant than flub a line (and wear unflattering makeup, but that's just me playing armchair fashion police). I just can't imagine it being anything other than an honest mistake.

Sorry - I didn't mean to imply that she deliberately disresepcted the anthem. I don't think she set out to purposely make a disrespectful statement a la Roseanne Barr. All I'm saying is that it is possible that she was trying too hard to showcase her own talent and didn't pay attention to what she was doing.

*If that's the case*, then I think she was rude and incompetent. THAT is what I am trying to communicate here.
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Hushabye

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Re: Was Christina Aguilera rude?
« Reply #44 on: February 07, 2011, 03:39:48 PM »
I'm with Sabbyfrog.  No matter how many times you sing something and rehearse it, no matter how familiar you are with the material, the potential is there for your brain to go, "Haha, just kidding!" and the wrong thing entirely slips out.  It's not rude and it's not disrespectful.

I also think that her singing style is so much a part of how she just sings that throwing the extra trills and warbles in there comes automatically and doesn't require a lot of conscious effort on her part.  I don't like it, but it's the way she sings everything.  As such, I highly doubt that she was concentrating so much on the extras that she blanked on the words.