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Author Topic: The "This Might Be A Stupid Question, But...." Thread  (Read 2560608 times)

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Carotte

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Re: The "This Might Be A Stupid Question, But...." Thread
« Reply #8955 on: January 31, 2014, 11:35:22 AM »
I have to admit my ignorance regarding something in english, all the Ms, Mrs and Mr used to call someone.
Can I have the full word for those please?

Mental Magpie

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Re: The "This Might Be A Stupid Question, But...." Thread
« Reply #8956 on: January 31, 2014, 11:37:02 AM »
I have to admit my ignorance regarding something in english, all the Ms, Mrs and Mr used to call someone.
Can I have the full word for those please?

Mister
Mistress (We says misses)
Miss (usually pronounced miz as in miserable)

blue2000

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Re: The "This Might Be A Stupid Question, But...." Thread
« Reply #8957 on: January 31, 2014, 11:50:26 AM »
I have to admit my ignorance regarding something in english, all the Ms, Mrs and Mr used to call someone.
Can I have the full word for those please?

Mr. - Mister. M/Monsieur in French.
Mrs. - Missus or Mistress. Mme/Madam in French.
Ms. - no long form that I know of in English. It is used instead of Miss or Mrs. as a title for an adult woman. I think in French you would just use Miss or Mademoiselle.
You are only young once. After that you have to think up some other excuse.

gramma dishes

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Re: The "This Might Be A Stupid Question, But...." Thread
« Reply #8958 on: January 31, 2014, 11:51:48 AM »
I have to admit my ignorance regarding something in english, all the Ms, Mrs and Mr used to call someone.
Can I have the full word for those please?

Ms is usually pronounced "miz" and indicates a woman who does not wish to be 'identified' by her marital status.
Mrs. is pronounced "misses" and indicates a married woman.
Miss (which you did not ask about) indicates an adult woman who is not married or a young girl.
Mr. always refers to a man whether he is married or not, and is pronounced "mister".

Vall

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Re: The "This Might Be A Stupid Question, But...." Thread
« Reply #8959 on: January 31, 2014, 12:01:38 PM »
I have to admit my ignorance regarding something in english, all the Ms, Mrs and Mr used to call someone.
Can I have the full word for those please?

Ms is usually pronounced "miz" and indicates a woman who does not wish to be 'identified' by her marital status.
Mrs. is pronounced "misses" and indicates a married woman.
Miss (which you did not ask about) indicates an adult woman who is not married or a young girl.
Mr. always refers to a man whether he is married or not, and is pronounced "mister".
And Miss is for an unmarried woman.  Miss is also used in the southern US with a woman's first name as a form of respect, whether or not she is married.  For example, "Miss Cynthia baked these cookies".  Or "Miss Lana invited us for dinner".

I live in an area where there are a lot of people who moved here from the south so I hear it frequently.

Ms_Cellany

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Re: The "This Might Be A Stupid Question, But...." Thread
« Reply #8960 on: January 31, 2014, 12:05:53 PM »
I have to admit my ignorance regarding something in english, all the Ms, Mrs and Mr used to call someone.
Can I have the full word for those please?

Mister
Mistress (We says misses)
Miss (usually pronounced miz as in miserable)

"Miss" varies by region. In some areas, it with "hiss," but in the South, it's "miz." Which is how "Ms." is also pronounced.

Bingle bongle dingle dangle yickity-do yickity-dah ping-pong lippy-toppy too tah.

Outdoor Girl

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Re: The "This Might Be A Stupid Question, But...." Thread
« Reply #8961 on: January 31, 2014, 12:09:30 PM »
I have to admit my ignorance regarding something in english, all the Ms, Mrs and Mr used to call someone.
Can I have the full word for those please?

Mister
Mistress (We says misses)
Miss (usually pronounced miz as in miserable)

And Ms (pronounced Miz) was developed so that you didn't have to identify if you were married or not.  Mistress (Mrs) means married, Miss means not.  As far as I know, it doesn't stand for anything.

I usually pronounce Miss the way it is spelled, as in missing the mark on something.
After cleaning out my Dad's house, I have this advice:  If you haven't used it in a year, throw it out!!!!.
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Ms_Cellany

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Re: The "This Might Be A Stupid Question, But...." Thread
« Reply #8962 on: January 31, 2014, 01:19:13 PM »
Mrs. is short for Mistress, which is just the feminine form of  "Master."

IIRC, a woman could become a Mrs. by heading a household, managing an inn, things like that. So "Mrs." did not necessarily mean "married" - it just meant "In charge."

It's just that the way things worked out, women eventually only became "in charge" of a household by getting married, so the two meanings became conflated.
Bingle bongle dingle dangle yickity-do yickity-dah ping-pong lippy-toppy too tah.

Slartibartfast

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Re: The "This Might Be A Stupid Question, But...." Thread
« Reply #8963 on: January 31, 2014, 02:05:50 PM »
Worth noting that "Ms." is the preferred form of address for business correspondence when you know you're addressing a woman but you don't know if she has a different preferred form of address.  It's also frequently used by divorced women (whether or not they use their maiden or former husband's name) to avoid the whole "I can't still be Mrs. Smith when my husband remarried and now there's a new one" thing.  Also useful for lesbians in committed relationships who don't have a good answer to the "are you married?" question (given the varying laws in different US states).

Re: the "Miss" thing:

In the US Southeast, children generally call adult women "Miss Firstname" except for their schoolteachers, who are usually Miss/Mrs./Ms. Lastname.  In the rest of the US, children call all adult women Miss/Mrs./Ms. Lastname unless told otherwise (like "dad's girlfriend" or "very close family friend").  Some of that carries over - I'm 32, but there are still a few adults I'd call Miss/Mrs./Ms. Lastname, because that's what I called them when I was a kid and it would be weird to think of them by their give names  :)

Katana_Geldar

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Re: The "This Might Be A Stupid Question, But...." Thread
« Reply #8964 on: January 31, 2014, 04:14:21 PM »
Someone told me, not sure if it's true or not, that in Emgland it was common to call the first unmarried daughter Miss LastName until she married and her sisters were called Miss FirstName.

So, with the Bennet sisters, Jane was Miss Bennet, and the others were Miss Elizabeth, Miss Mary, Miss Kitty and Miss Lydia.

daen

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Re: The "This Might Be A Stupid Question, But...." Thread
« Reply #8965 on: January 31, 2014, 04:37:36 PM »
Someone told me, not sure if it's true or not, that in Emgland it was common to call the first unmarried daughter Miss LastName until she married and her sisters were called Miss FirstName.

So, with the Bennet sisters, Jane was Miss Bennet, and the others were Miss Elizabeth, Miss Mary, Miss Kitty and Miss Lydia.

I have also heard that, and that it would be similar on the male side as well. So in an alternate universe, James would be Master Bennet, and the others Master Edward, Master Mark, Master Charles, and Master Lysander. After reaching the age of majority, they would become Mr. Bennet, etc.

Katana_Geldar

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Re: The "This Might Be A Stupid Question, But...." Thread
« Reply #8966 on: January 31, 2014, 05:22:24 PM »
Someone told me, not sure if it's true or not, that in Emgland it was common to call the first unmarried daughter Miss LastName until she married and her sisters were called Miss FirstName.

So, with the Bennet sisters, Jane was Miss Bennet, and the others were Miss Elizabeth, Miss Mary, Miss Kitty and Miss Lydia.

I have also heard that, and that it would be similar on the male side as well. So in an alternate universe, James would be Master Bennet, and the others Master Edward, Master Mark, Master Charles, and Master Lysander. After reaching the age of majority, they would become Mr. Bennet, etc.
And we wouldn't have had the novel, as they're all boys.

MerryCat

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Re: The "This Might Be A Stupid Question, But...." Thread
« Reply #8967 on: January 31, 2014, 05:28:42 PM »
Someone told me, not sure if it's true or not, that in Emgland it was common to call the first unmarried daughter Miss LastName until she married and her sisters were called Miss FirstName.

So, with the Bennet sisters, Jane was Miss Bennet, and the others were Miss Elizabeth, Miss Mary, Miss Kitty and Miss Lydia.

I have also heard that, and that it would be similar on the male side as well. So in an alternate universe, James would be Master Bennet, and the others Master Edward, Master Mark, Master Charles, and Master Lysander. After reaching the age of majority, they would become Mr. Bennet, etc.
And we wouldn't have had the novel, as they're all boys.

You don't think that young Mr. Edward Bennet might have run into Miss Darcy? Of course, in her case, as a female, I'm not sure if she'd still be the sole heir of the estate or if she'd have to share with her sister (and, of course, if Georgiana were George, then there goes Pemberly alltogether)

I'm not sure it would have been as good a book, but I'd pay to read it :)

Slartibartfast

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Re: The "This Might Be A Stupid Question, But...." Thread
« Reply #8968 on: January 31, 2014, 05:54:07 PM »
Someone told me, not sure if it's true or not, that in Emgland it was common to call the first unmarried daughter Miss LastName until she married and her sisters were called Miss FirstName.

So, with the Bennet sisters, Jane was Miss Bennet, and the others were Miss Elizabeth, Miss Mary, Miss Kitty and Miss Lydia.

That was part of the rules about titled gentry.  It wasn't just to be difficult; the social etiquette helped you know the moment you were introduced to someone exactly what their social standing was, whether they'd inherit, etc.  It was kind of a bigger deal than now because for those from the upper classes, there were really a limited number of potential marriage partners - no point wasting time flirting with someone whom you won't be socially allowed to marry in the first place.

lady_disdain

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Re: The "This Might Be A Stupid Question, But...." Thread
« Reply #8969 on: January 31, 2014, 06:24:36 PM »
Someone told me, not sure if it's true or not, that in Emgland it was common to call the first unmarried daughter Miss LastName until she married and her sisters were called Miss FirstName.

So, with the Bennet sisters, Jane was Miss Bennet, and the others were Miss Elizabeth, Miss Mary, Miss Kitty and Miss Lydia.

The eldest present would be Miss Bennet and the others, Miss FirstName Bennet. So, if Jane and Elizabeth were together, Jane would be addressed as Miss Bennet and Elizabeth as Miss Elizabeth Bennet. But if it were Elizabeth and Mary, Elizabeth would be Miss Bennet and Mary, Miss Mary Bennet. Of course, this was quite formal and was probably waved in day to day conversation, specially with more intimate acquaintances.

An etiquette guide from a little latter (mid 19th century) specifically forbids the use of Miss FirstName alone, without a last name. Only family servants would address family members that way.