Author Topic: The Duchess of York on Being Excluded From Prince William's Wedding  (Read 13748 times)

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guihong

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Re: The Duchess of York on Being Excluded From Prince William's Wedding
« Reply #105 on: May 23, 2011, 10:24:53 PM »
Princess Anne remarried in Scotland, which I guess was the closest to eloping she could get.  Maybe that was because she was divorced, though.  All the royals not on the direct line for the throne seem to have small weddings, at least by royal standards.


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Wonderflonium

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Re: The Duchess of York on Being Excluded From Prince William's Wedding
« Reply #106 on: May 24, 2011, 08:42:39 AM »
The Obamas didn't get to go because the US isn't part of the Commonwealth.  As William is not yet king, his marriage is not technically a state affair, it's an internal matter.  Probably the biggest non-event of the century.

I keep reading that, but the Reagans were invited to the wedding of Charles and Diana (only Nancy attended). I understand that Charles and Diana had some 2000 more guests (can you even imagine? I'd be bloody terrified up there!) and so the cuts had to come from somewhere. I personally don't think the Obamas should have been invited, but I find it weird that this is the justification being used.
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Isisnin

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Re: The Duchess of York on Being Excluded From Prince William's Wedding
« Reply #107 on: May 24, 2011, 10:14:07 AM »
The Obamas didn't get to go because the US isn't part of the Commonwealth.  As William is not yet king, his marriage is not technically a state affair, it's an internal matter.  Probably the biggest non-event of the century.

I keep reading that, but the Reagans were invited to the wedding of Charles and Diana (only Nancy attended). I understand that Charles and Diana had some 2000 more guests (can you even imagine? I'd be bloody terrified up there!) and so the cuts had to come from somewhere. I personally don't think the Obamas should have been invited, but I find it weird that this is the justification being used.

There were many news reports that said that Charles and Diana's wedding was a state affair as Charles was the (direct) heir to the throne.  thus, the Reagans were invited as Reagen was the head of state for the United States.

William is not the (direct) heir to the throne (2nd in line after Charles) so his wedding was not a state affair and thus the Obamas weren't invited.

Wonderflonium

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Re: The Duchess of York on Being Excluded From Prince William's Wedding
« Reply #108 on: May 24, 2011, 10:18:48 AM »
Isisnin, that makes sense. I just keep hearing that it's because Wills isn't the monarch yet, and I keep thinking, but, but, Charles wasn't either! Of course, there's a whole mess of stuff I don't understand about the monarchy and the rules surrounding it.  :)
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Ceiling Fan

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Re: The Duchess of York on Being Excluded From Prince William's Wedding
« Reply #109 on: May 24, 2011, 12:00:22 PM »
Isisnin, that makes sense. I just keep hearing that it's because Wills isn't the monarch yet, and I keep thinking, but, but, Charles wasn't either! Of course, there's a whole mess of stuff I don't understand about the monarchy and the rules surrounding it.  :)

Yeah, neither the monarch nor the heir was the explanation I heard of why it wasn't considered a 'state' affair.

onikenbai

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Re: The Duchess of York on Being Excluded From Prince William's Wedding
« Reply #110 on: May 24, 2011, 09:58:43 PM »
Nobody really understands the monarchy.  I'm still tying to figure out how Charles is managing to stay first in line for the throne when he is divorced, and has married a divorced woman.  The Queen's father only got to be king because his brother abdicated to marry Wallace Simpson, a divorced woman, as he was not allowed to marry her and be king.  Ironic since the Anglican church exists pretty much only since Henry wanted a divorce.

All I know is that Canada is not thrilled with the idea of Charles on our coins.  How will the ears fit?  Aside from that, he is not popular here.  We all remember that 'I want to be your [hygiene product]' thing from a few years back and cringe at the thought of him as king.  If it weren't for a serious contender second in line, we would probably be batting around the idea of complete independence.  It's been a discussion in the news over the last few years but not yet a hot topic as the Queen is still quite popular.

The Obamas could have gone to the wedding since Harper declined to attend... they could have been on the most prestigious B list ever.

Larrabee

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Re: The Duchess of York on Being Excluded From Prince William's Wedding
« Reply #111 on: May 25, 2011, 05:35:56 AM »
Nobody really understands the monarchy.  I'm still tying to figure out how Charles is managing to stay first in line for the throne when he is divorced, and has married a divorced woman.  The Queen's father only got to be king because his brother abdicated to marry Wallace Simpson, a divorced woman, as he was not allowed to marry her and be king.  Ironic since the Anglican church exists pretty much only since Henry wanted a divorce.


The only real reason why Edward couldn't be king if he married Wallis Simpson was due to the social conventions of the time, no actual set in stone rule, it just would have been considered inappropriate.  We've moved on a bit in the last 70 years or so thankfully and divorce isn't quite the taboo it was!

Elfqueen13

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Re: The Duchess of York on Being Excluded From Prince William's Wedding
« Reply #112 on: May 25, 2011, 08:51:09 AM »
Nobody really understands the monarchy.  I'm still tying to figure out how Charles is managing to stay first in line for the throne when he is divorced, and has married a divorced woman.  The Queen's father only got to be king because his brother abdicated to marry Wallace Simpson, a divorced woman, as he was not allowed to marry her and be king.  Ironic since the Anglican church exists pretty much only since Henry wanted a divorce.

All I know is that Canada is not thrilled with the idea of Charles on our coins.  How will the ears fit?  Aside from that, he is not popular here.  We all remember that 'I want to be your [hygiene product]' thing from a few years back and cringe at the thought of him as king.  If it weren't for a serious contender second in line, we would probably be batting around the idea of complete independence.  It's been a discussion in the news over the last few years but not yet a hot topic as the Queen is still quite popular.

The Obamas could have gone to the wedding since Harper declined to attend... they could have been on the most prestigious B list ever.

After Princess Diana died, Charles became a de facto widower.  The fact that they had a civil divorce did not undo the religious marriage but her death freed him to marry again.  Camilla being divorced is a factor and probably part of the reasoning for her styling herself "Duchess of Cornwall" instead of "Princess of Wales" even though traditionally a wife takes the highest of her husband's titles.
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Wonderflonium

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Re: The Duchess of York on Being Excluded From Prince William's Wedding
« Reply #113 on: May 25, 2011, 08:53:53 AM »
Camilla being divorced is a factor and probably part of the reasoning for her styling herself "Duchess of Cornwall" instead of "Princess of Wales" even though traditionally a wife takes the highest of her husband's titles.

I thought it also had to do with the fact that Diana was much beloved (and Camilla, not so much, at least for a while) and Camilla and Charles knew what an uproar it would cause if Camilla took Diana's former title.
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Elfqueen13

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Re: The Duchess of York on Being Excluded From Prince William's Wedding
« Reply #114 on: May 25, 2011, 09:06:19 AM »
Camilla being divorced is a factor and probably part of the reasoning for her styling herself "Duchess of Cornwall" instead of "Princess of Wales" even though traditionally a wife takes the highest of her husband's titles.

I thought it also had to do with the fact that Diana was much beloved (and Camilla, not so much, at least for a while) and Camilla and Charles knew what an uproar it would cause if Camilla took Diana's former title.

Oh absolutely!  But that's the kind of decision that is seldom (in my experience) made for just one reason.  There are usually multiple reasonings.
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BB-VA

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Re: The Duchess of York on Being Excluded From Prince William's Wedding
« Reply #115 on: May 25, 2011, 11:07:26 AM »
Nobody really understands the monarchy.  I'm still tying to figure out how Charles is managing to stay first in line for the throne when he is divorced, and has married a divorced woman.  The Queen's father only got to be king because his brother abdicated to marry Wallace Simpson, a divorced woman, as he was not allowed to marry her and be king.  Ironic since the Anglican church exists pretty much only since Henry wanted a divorce.


The only real reason why Edward couldn't be king if he married Wallis Simpson was due to the social conventions of the time, no actual set in stone rule, it just would have been considered inappropriate.  We've moved on a bit in the last 70 years or so thankfully and divorce isn't quite the taboo it was!

So much has come out recently about the Duke of Windsor's attitude about Hitler, I have to wonder if Wallis wasn't a convenient excuse.  Whatever, I think we all lucked out there.

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kareng57

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Re: The Duchess of York on Being Excluded From Prince William's Wedding
« Reply #116 on: May 25, 2011, 09:35:27 PM »
Nobody really understands the monarchy.  I'm still tying to figure out how Charles is managing to stay first in line for the throne when he is divorced, and has married a divorced woman.  The Queen's father only got to be king because his brother abdicated to marry Wallace Simpson, a divorced woman, as he was not allowed to marry her and be king.  Ironic since the Anglican church exists pretty much only since Henry wanted a divorce.


The only real reason why Edward couldn't be king if he married Wallis Simpson was due to the social conventions of the time, no actual set in stone rule, it just would have been considered inappropriate.  We've moved on a bit in the last 70 years or so thankfully and divorce isn't quite the taboo it was!


And it's also true that she was divorced twice, not just once.  She was still married to Ernest Simpson when she and Edward started seeing each other - even though she was the one in the adulterous relationship, the divorce was granted on the grounds or Ernest's adultery.  It was considered the honourable thing to do at the time....

Even 20 years later many MPs declared their intention to resign if Princess Margaret was allowed to marry divorced Group Captain Peter Townsend (the "innocent party" in the divorce).  Even if she renounced her place in line to the throne - didn't matter.

kareng57

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Re: The Duchess of York on Being Excluded From Prince William's Wedding
« Reply #117 on: May 25, 2011, 11:54:22 PM »
Princess Anne remarried in Scotland, which I guess was the closest to eloping she could get.  Maybe that was because she was divorced, though.  All the royals not on the direct line for the throne seem to have small weddings, at least by royal standards.


gui


I believe that it was because the Church of Scotland (Presbyterian) allows divorced people to marry, where as the Church of England does not.  Charles and Camilla (Duke and Duchess or Cornwall)  had only a blessing ceremony in the Church of England.

kareng57

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Re: The Duchess of York on Being Excluded From Prince William's Wedding
« Reply #118 on: May 26, 2011, 12:00:26 AM »
And look at Princess Anne.  For a long time she was considered the most unpopular Royal - probably because she didn't give a fig about what journalists/photographers wanted to see.  Even when she wasn't being a champion equestrienne, she was mucking about doing work for charities such as the Save The Children Fund, rather than appearing in formal gowns at charity balls.

And. I. Love. Her. for it.  She's always been my favorite, for the very reasons you state.  Go Anne, get it girl!!


Plus, she's always gotten her share of speeding tickets.  I imagine it's because she insists on driving herself, rather than depending on equerries or chauffeurs.

I do remember of hearing of an instance a few years ago, when she was late to her next engagement.  She was speeding but at first ignored the police-lights.  She thought that they were a special-escort to her next engagment...

Lisbeth

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Re: The Duchess of York on Being Excluded From Prince William's Wedding
« Reply #119 on: May 26, 2011, 05:36:02 PM »
Nobody really understands the monarchy.  I'm still tying to figure out how Charles is managing to stay first in line for the throne when he is divorced, and has married a divorced woman.  The Queen's father only got to be king because his brother abdicated to marry Wallace Simpson, a divorced woman, as he was not allowed to marry her and be king.  Ironic since the Anglican church exists pretty much only since Henry wanted a divorce.


The only real reason why Edward couldn't be king if he married Wallis Simpson was due to the social conventions of the time, no actual set in stone rule, it just would have been considered inappropriate.  We've moved on a bit in the last 70 years or so thankfully and divorce isn't quite the taboo it was!

The way I understand it, he couldn't be king if he married Wallis Simpson because one of the roles of the monarch is Supreme Governor of the Church of England, and back then, in any case, it didn't support divorce.  She had been divorced twice before their marriage-and was married to her second husband when their relationship began.

So it wouldn't have been right for the Supreme Governor to go against the rules of the church he's supposed to be the head of.
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