Author Topic: Roger Ebert Tweets Chastisement After Drunk Driving Death  (Read 14063 times)

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PeasNCues

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Re: Roger Ebert Tweets Chastisement After Drunk Driving Death
« Reply #210 on: June 23, 2011, 05:52:08 PM »
I don't see why it has to be one or the other.

I can think Ryan Dunn did a stupid, reckless dangerous thing and think Roger Ebert was insensitive. Can't I?
Absolutely!  ;D Feel free to feel whatever you want!

I think, though, that Roger Ebert was not insensitive, etc independent from Ryan Dunn's stupidity and recklessness.
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gollymolly2

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Re: Roger Ebert Tweets Chastisement After Drunk Driving Death
« Reply #211 on: June 23, 2011, 06:16:42 PM »
P&C - I believe and respect that your view of the situation is not colored by Dunn's behavior. I think it's quite clear from other posts that some opinions are premised on the idea that Dunn's behavior was so bad that Ebert had carte blanche to comment on it. Retaliatory rudeness - even if the original behavior is way way way worse than the response - isn't okay. And like I said, I totally respect that reasonable people can disagree on whether ebert's response was rude. But so much of the focus here seems to be on how bad Dunn's behavior was.

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Re: Roger Ebert Tweets Chastisement After Drunk Driving Death
« Reply #212 on: June 23, 2011, 06:20:37 PM »
P&C - I believe and respect that your view of the situation is not colored by Dunn's behavior. I think it's quite clear from other posts that some opinions are premised on the idea that Dunn's behavior was so bad that Ebert had carte blanche to comment on it. Retaliatory rudeness - even if the original behavior is way way way worse than the response - isn't okay. And like I said, I totally respect that reasonable people can disagree on whether ebert's response was rude. But so much of the focus here seems to be on how bad Dunn's behavior was.
Awesome, I agree that the comment should be evaluated independently of other's stupidity  :)
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ydpubs

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Re: Roger Ebert Tweets Chastisement After Drunk Driving Death
« Reply #213 on: June 23, 2011, 06:22:10 PM »
No, I never said because Dunn was so awful that it would excuse someone else being rude. To me, it is not a case of A was so bad, it does not matter what B did. I in fact hate it when someone says, well A was a mass murderer so B can be excused for only killing one.

I am straight up saying I don't find what Ebert did rude at all.
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Sharnita

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Re: Roger Ebert Tweets Chastisement After Drunk Driving Death
« Reply #214 on: June 23, 2011, 06:34:03 PM »
I do think sometimes behavior is so heinous that it does need to be addressed publicly and immediately as a social issue.  If a gunman kills a random victim and then turns the gun on himself are we required to wait to talk about how terrible his actions were?  To ask why he wasn't provided with mental health assistance if that was a factor? 

When school shootings happen people are asking within minutes/hours why it happened, whether somebody should have noticed there was a problem and interevened, how security measures failed, etc.  This strikes me as being the same.  I reckless person with impaired judgement kills somebody as well as himself with a really big weapon.  Ebert seems to be asking whether somebody should have noticed and intervened.  Others are asking what was wrong with Ryan and why it happened.

ydpubs

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Re: Roger Ebert Tweets Chastisement After Drunk Driving Death
« Reply #215 on: June 23, 2011, 06:41:09 PM »
I do think sometimes behavior is so heinous that it does need to be addressed publicly and immediately as a social issue.  If a gunman kills a random victim and then turns the gun on himself are we required to wait to talk about how terrible his actions were?  To ask why he wasn't provided with mental health assistance if that was a factor? 

When school shootings happen people are asking within minutes/hours why it happened, whether somebody should have noticed there was a problem and interevened, how security measures failed, etc.  This strikes me as being the same.  I reckless person with impaired judgement kills somebody as well as himself with a really big weapon.  Ebert seems to be asking whether somebody should have noticed and intervened.  Others are asking what was wrong with Ryan and why it happened.

Agreed. It was timely and not a bad question to ask.

His friends with their death pools for their own group, and this attitude, direct quote from one of his friends via TMZ:
"Dunn had 3 Miller Lites and 3 "girly shots" between 10:30 PM and 2:10 AM -- nearly a 4 hour span -- but he was "not too drunk to drive" should be asking themselves the same one.
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hollasa

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Re: Roger Ebert Tweets Chastisement After Drunk Driving Death
« Reply #216 on: June 23, 2011, 06:45:10 PM »
I don't understand the denigrating of Ebert here.  If someone doesn't like his comment, fine...that's just opinion.  But the whole point of twitter (and I assume everyone on it sort of "accepts" this point) is it's all about immediacy, whether it's what you had for breakfast, or a famous person doing something stupid resulting in the deaths of two people. 

Even if he's considered a "hack" by some people, he was simply using twitter in the way it was designed to be used.  If his comments were too strong for Dunn's family and friends, this is a predictable end result when your fame and fortune is based on living life on the edge in a way that seems to glorify irresponsible behavior.  You can't accept the fame and fortune, and then whine when it brings scrutiny.  They're a package deal.

Bolding to extra emphasize the point.

It's not as if Ebert called a press conference to make this announcement, or went out of his way to comment on it - he just twittered some thoughts as a result of a news story, as he has an existing twitter account to do so.

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Re: Roger Ebert Tweets Chastisement After Drunk Driving Death
« Reply #217 on: June 23, 2011, 06:45:10 PM »
I don't see why it has to be one or the other.

I can think Ryan Dunn did a stupid, reckless dangerous thing and think Roger Ebert was insensitive. Can't I?

I agree whole heartedly. 
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Poirot

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Re: Roger Ebert Tweets Chastisement After Drunk Driving Death
« Reply #218 on: June 23, 2011, 07:46:28 PM »
I stated my grief and sadness over this much earlier in this thread, and stepped away briefly. I must admit that I have given serious thought to both sides of this issue, and I appreciate the wake up call many of you have given me. Ryan and zach's death was tragic. Ryan, Zachary, and the friends attending all bear differing degrees of blame in this. Obviously, Ryan the most, and he deserves very little sympathy, IMO. Zachary chose to get in the car, knowing his history.

As I said before, i believe that friends at a party/event have a serious responsibility to do their very best to have prevented this horrible tragedy. Take his keys, slug him, call a taxi or the cops if you have to, if you KWIM.

I don't think that the parents and family of any of the people involved in the accident deserved Ebert's casual quip. I believe he said it to be 'of the moment' and it certainly gave him the benefit of much publicity. I have little to no respect for him left.

I still believe that Ebert's comments were insensitive, I'll-timed and rude, but that is not what is truly bothering me right now.  ???

What is bothering me the most (I think) is the level of vitriol expressed by we e hellions in this thread. This board, as a group, is comprised of many people whose opinions I respect greatly. I wish that we could all find a way to disagree without being rude and hurtful to each other, in general. This seems to be happening quite frequently lately, and it worries me.

I wish you all love and peace.



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ydpubs

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Re: Roger Ebert Tweets Chastisement After Drunk Driving Death
« Reply #219 on: June 23, 2011, 07:53:47 PM »
I stated my grief and sadness over this much earlier in this thread, and stepped away briefly. I must admit that I have given serious thought to both sides of this issue, and I appreciate the wake up call many of you have given me. Ryan and zach's death was tragic. Ryan, Zachary, and the friends attending all bear differing degrees of blame in this. Obviously, Ryan the most, and he deserves very little sympathy, IMO. Zachary chose to get in the car, knowing his history.

As I said before, i believe that friends at a party/event have a serious responsibility to do their very best to have prevented this horrible tragedy. Take his keys, slug him, call a taxi or the cops if you have to, if you KWIM.

I don't think that the parents and family of any of the people involved in the accident deserved Ebert's casual quip. I believe he said it to be 'of the moment' and it certainly gave him the benefit of much publicity. I have little to no respect for him left.

I still believe that Ebert's comments were insensitive, I'll-timed and rude, but that is not what is truly bothering me right now.  ???

What is bothering me the most (I think) is the level of vitriol expressed by we e hellions in this thread. This board, as a group, is comprised of many people whose opinions I respect greatly. I wish that we could all find a way to disagree without being rude and hurtful to each other, in general. This seems to be happening quite frequently lately, and it worries me.

I wish you all love and peace.



My anger is solely directed at any and all who would endanger the lives of others with irresponsible behavior, no one else. That alone is at the core of my ire in this situation.

Disagreeing with others about the propriety of Mr. Ebert's comment does not mean I am angry at any eHellions that don't share my view.
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Re: Roger Ebert Tweets Chastisement After Drunk Driving Death
« Reply #220 on: June 23, 2011, 07:57:42 PM »
I don't think that the parents and family of any of the people involved in the accident deserved Ebert's casual quip. I believe he said it to be 'of the moment' and it certainly gave him the benefit of much publicity. I have little to no respect for him left.

You can believe that, but you don't know it for sure, and it doesn't seem fair to judge him on intentions that may or may not be there. I frankly don't think that was the case at all.

So many people in his life knew that he drove recklessly. April Margera said she told him to drive slower for a decade or more. Someone actually had him dying in an auto accident in a death pool. Other people had seen him drinking. If you know someone has been drinking and you know they drive recklessly even sober, yeah, you should try to stop them. That's what Ebert was trying to say. Too many people don't want to step in because they don't want to be a downer or a wuss or a priss or whatever. They don't want to seem uncool. In this case, being willing to be uncool could have saved 2 lives. I really don't see any way that's a bad message to get out there.
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Sharnita

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Re: Roger Ebert Tweets Chastisement After Drunk Driving Death
« Reply #221 on: June 23, 2011, 08:02:33 PM »
I also think it is an assumption that his family are more hurt/upset by Ebert's post.  They might be, they might fell that he has given voice to some of their anger and frustration.  Some might resent it and some might support it.  I don't think we can make sweeping generalizations about how it impacts his loved ones.

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Re: Roger Ebert Tweets Chastisement After Drunk Driving Death
« Reply #222 on: June 23, 2011, 08:07:51 PM »
Disagreeing with others about the propriety of Mr. Ebert's comment does not mean I am angry at any eHellions that don't share my view.

POD.  I'm not sure there's anything I can do if someone gets offended that I don't see Ebert's post as being horrible...  It's not an attack on any other eHellion.

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Re: Roger Ebert Tweets Chastisement After Drunk Driving Death
« Reply #223 on: June 23, 2011, 08:11:50 PM »
I don't think that the parents and family of any of the people involved in the accident deserved Ebert's casual quip. I believe he said it to be 'of the moment' and it certainly gave him the benefit of much publicity. I have little to no respect for him left.

You can believe that, but you don't know it for sure, and it doesn't seem fair to judge him on intentions that may or may not be there. I frankly don't think that was the case at all.

So many people in his life knew that he drove recklessly. April Margera said she told him to drive slower for a decade or more. Someone actually had him dying in an auto accident in a death pool. Other people had seen him drinking. If you know someone has been drinking and you know they drive recklessly even sober, yeah, you should try to stop them. That's what Ebert was trying to say. Too many people don't want to step in because they don't want to be a downer or a wuss or a priss or whatever. They don't want to seem uncool. In this case, being willing to be uncool could have saved 2 lives. I really don't see any way that's a bad message to get out there.

April made her concerns and comments about Ryan's driving PUBLIC. In my mind, I am sure she expressed them to Bam, Ryan, and anyone else who would listen. She BEGGED the crew to force him into treatment. I heard her discuss it quite clearly on the Preston & Steve show, long before this happened. I don't think this makes her a wuss, priss or uncool. I like and respect her, and believe her grief is very real, although she is not surprised.

The fact that she failed, despite her earnest PUBLIC efforts, makes her MORE worthy of care and sympathy in my opinion. I could make this argument for several people in the the friends/family group, but April is a good example.
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Poirot

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Re: Roger Ebert Tweets Chastisement After Drunk Driving Death
« Reply #224 on: June 23, 2011, 08:14:41 PM »
I also think it is an assumption that his family are more hurt/upset by Ebert's post.  They might be, they might fell that he has given voice to some of their anger and frustration.  Some might resent it and some might support it.  I don't think we can make sweeping generalizations about how it impacts his loved ones.

For one, April Margera expressed hurt and distress at the callousness of the post, in her perception. Bam did as well, but I feel MUCH less sympathy for him, for many reasons.
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